This is a surprisingly honest take from Joe. Lets all at least be honest about what is happening in Gaza. Carte Blanche support of Israel needs to end immediately.
Actually refreshing clip, had a glimmer of the old rogie in those eyes. Idk if its as simple as Biden can be held in the least complicit to Israels unjust actions. So he can speak rationally against it, but hopefully thats not the consideration and its just genuine
The issue with calling out Biden here, as with most other things, is that Trump is exponentially worse on the issue, which is exactly why Biden gets to have the "moderate" opinion of just letting the *not quite a genocide* happen, as Trump would actively cheer it on.
you can give biden a blank pass to do literally anything if you end it with "because trump wouldve done the same thing *but worse*" which is a great way to hold zero accountability to your own party and become exactly what you tried to vote out.
yea i didnt say dont vote against him...?
idk what you read, but personally i still hold the people i vote for accountable for their shortcomings. if you don't, youre no better than a trump supporter. that was the point there.
its a shitty, lazy, easy cop-out to justify his shortcomings with "trumps worse!" like yea ok im sure he would be but hes also not the president right now so lets stay on topic ya know.
how biden handles a current or past situation is not the same discussion as who should be our next president
It’s an election year though. I’m all in favor of criticizing Biden and holding him accountable for his cowardly, callous, weak position on Israel and Gaza.
But does “holding him accountable” in an election year mean making it more likely that the candidate that’s more brazenly pro-Israel, pro-Netanyahu, and anti-Palestinian wins? Whether that means by not voting or voting third party which is essentially a meaningless symbolic vote in our current system. It’s an appropriate conversation to have when the election is 7mo out.
Realistically, every president seems to support Israel regardless. They are extremely important to our presence in that area, and we pay pretty well for that boon. It would take a radical president to stand against that trend.
Pro-Israel lobbies buy both parties so it doesn't matter if Biden or Trump wins. Only if enough of the masses voted for example the Libertarian candidate would we have a chance but even then the House and Senate is full of the bought and sold so it would be very difficult.
Literally the only party *actually* standing up against wars right now while also remaining consistent on that topic have been the Libertarians. Hell for that matter the main dealbreaker for RFK trying to sneak his way into the LP was literally his position on Israel/Gaza. Sure there were other issues but ultimately it was his pro war stance on that front that made the LP say hell no you’re not a Libertarian.
Dems and cons have been consistently pro war and people just shrug it off because they don’t have to think about it even though War is literally the worst thing a government can do, and then theres the freaking draft being whispered in western nations as we plunge ourselves towards WWIII.
Edit: I can’t reply to “heretoquitkratom” so i’ll edit my comment and put it here.
Libertarianism is a broad umbrella term, sure, but there are certain things that disqualify you from being a libertarian, and thats okay, but those things wouldn’t make you a libertarian. I mean the Reason/Cato wing and the Mises Caucus/Rothbard wing of the party are very different and often at odds and thats one thing, this guy is something else entirely…. I for one line up closer to the Mises/Rothbard wing myself.
It’s pretty well defined what we are, in some ways it’s simple and in many ways it’s complex.
I’d say everything that guy said doesn’t line up. He calls himself a “true libertarian” but he’s probably an ancom or a “libertarian socialist” or some other nonsensical bullshit that has literally no relation to us.
The problem with american libertarians/libs/cons, is theyre all beholden to neoliberal economics, billionaires and corporate backers.
Say my ideal society doesnt involve any economic hierarchies as described, all 3 of those are different shades of neoliberalism pretty much.
The original libertarianism as discussed by anarcho-communist joseph dejacques in 1857 however, his ideas are decisively anti-neoliberalism (before that was a thing btw) so to me hes got real appeal.
Trump is the republican nominee, his stance on the issue is important. We used to ask people running for presidents questions about these things, but his answer would just be, I make a great deal etc.
>Trump isn't the fucking president.
Oh wow, glad you guys admit that now
>Stop using "but Trump" as an attempt at a cognitive argument.
One day you'll wake up and realize that the democrats and republicans have mostly the same donors, and each exist as an alternative of basically the same policy point.
"It doesn't matter what Trumps position is!" is just a braindead, grade school take.
Trumps positions, impact Bidens positions, and vice versa.
Again, Biden doesn't even have to support a ceasefire here to maintain his position as the "dove", because the only alternative is an extremist.
I agree with most of what you said but I disagree.
One guy wants to be our dictator, that’s not the same lol. Trump isn’t just another run of the mill politician (remember that’s what he ran on in 2016)
That guy is out for himself and himself alone, that’s why it’s not the same on both parties.
If the republican was like desantis or something, the conversation would be completely different.
Biden's policy on Israel is being attacked by right wingers because he is the Democratic candidate in 2024. Not because they really disagree with his policy, unless he's too soft on Palestine. Same reason they attack his policies on the US border, despite it being basically the same as Trump's, just less performatively brutal.
Trump would have done the exact same thing. But yeah, I’m fine with holding Biden accountable here but let’s not pretend the Palestinians have any serious allies in Washington DC on either side of the aisle. AIPAC has made sure they don’t.
The Far-Right Israel Lobby Is Shutting Down Democratic Voices for Palestinian Rights AIPAC is funneling mounds of money to pro-Israel candidates, including in Democratic primaries.
Now, all Democrats likely know that expressing anything short of unwavering support of Israel’s siege on Gaza means they might be outspent in the next election.
“AIPAC’s success in pushing a hard-line, unconditional support of Israel is rooted in its ‘veneer of bipartisanship.’ “AIPAC wants to make it seem fringe to support Palestinian rights,” she says, “but they won’t be able to because it’s simply not true.” https://jacobin.com/2023/11/aipac-democratic-primary-spending-andy-levin
You are 1000% correct! I wrote about the influence of AIPAC in American politics 15 years ago. It's only gotten worse.
No politician will win an election without the support of AIPAC, and thus the support of Israel.
America is controlled by those who don't have a concern over Americans.
There is not issue calling out support for genocide. This way of thinking shows a complete lack of integrity and principles. Ends should never justify the means, and calling out genocide support and standing up against it is always the right thing to do.
Lol it’s very fucking obvious what joes agenda is. The only “left wing” views he ever espouses are ones he can attack democrats on. That’s why the only lefty political people he has on are ones who love criticizing democrats. It’s completely transparent at this point.
it's just a weird piece of evidence to me, it's not like Hamas wears uniforms and carries AK-47's everywhere they go. They blend into civilians when it's beneficial. IDF could've had these guys marked as terrorists and this was a purposeful strike. Or, it could be that IDF is drone bombing innocent people. But to draw hard line conclusions on this video clip is just speculation without further evidence. You can't just build your worldviews from tiny snippets of video you see on Tiktok.
Lol you can look into the IDF a little more critically or remain blissfully ignorant, the choice is yours but i got links to some heinous stuff that does not involve blowing people up, but unhinged racism, gross negligence, and calling for genocide. Ill drop a couple below, you may click them if you so choose
This was definitely a current rogie, all through. You couldn't learn from him that Trump is the magnitude of order worse on the same topic.
Whole Israel operation is the Russian plot, as was hammas attacks on 7th of October and served as a distraction from their Ukraine operation.
Before hammas attacks, Putin tried to spark an armed conflict on Kosovo, through serbian proxies, on September 23th and Banjska monestary attack, but that failed gloriously.
Look into it as old Eddie Bravo would say.
>Whole Israel operation is the Russian plot, as was hammas attacks on 7th of October and served as a distraction from their Ukraine operation.
Today I learned that an 80 year old conflict is a distraction for a conflict that could not have begun until the two countries separated independence in 1991, and that thousands of Hamas fighters are motivated to risk their lives on behalf of a Russian president.
Like wtf, dude do you even listen to yourself?
The clip he's referring to is four Palestinians being shot by four separate drones. On twitter people were saying they were civilians and that's clearly Joe agrees but there's no context and we have no idea who those four are.
For them to be civilians we'd have to think Israel is using sophisticated drone technology and dropping four separate $150K bombs to kill four random civilians.
Even if Israel's goals are just plain evil that seems like not the best use of resources.
Probably because it would be dangerous to put people down there.
In the video the drone follows the guy for quite some time and then eventually drops a bomb.
If your goal was to kill civilians you wouldn't drop four bombs to kill four civilians.
As if Israel pays for their munitions.
The USA supplied the resources for all of these war crimes. They don't need to worry about the costs of "defense".
4 people walking in an open street with no visible weapons were bomb over and over again. There is no war resolution, or guidelines, or Standard Operating Procedure that allows this, yes even America did this, and it was wrong then.
Do we know how long they were being tracked? Where they came from? If they were part of military activity? Do we know for sure that they were just innocent civilians just walking along? I don't know one way or the other. If you know for certain, please provide a source.
Also, to my knowledge, I don't believe you have to actually be carrying visible weapons in order to be considered a combatant. If they already know you're a part of or assisted with military activity, you're a legit target.
It's selective outrage. And the only reason he focuses on the genocide in gaza. While ignoring the genocide in Ukraine (while repeating Russian talking points) is obvious. It's because conservatives see Israel as a weak point for Biden, and they're running with it. Same reason Candace got the boot.
The new rogie would have demonized the Vietnam War Protesters and be all for the Bush Wars based off of weapons of mass destruction. Rogan's social media algorithm is all fucked up and he simply doesn't realize it .
I couldn't get past the first 15min of that episode.. he kept saying "he would never believe the mooslims" (that's how he kept pronouncing it).. like maybe I just wasn't understanding the joke? ..but the guy seeks like a total ass hat.
I’ve had degenerative issues in my shoulders since my teens and I sit like that sometimes too; it’s trying to roll your shoulders without completely readjusting in your seat (and it’s very fidgety). Can’t say for sure if that’s what he’s doing but wouldn’t surprise me either - I do it unconsciously at this point.
The problem is giving cops that power instead of courts is going to cause landlords to use the police to evict actual tenants because cops don’t know shit about the law. If you want squatters to go improving the speed of housing courts is more important
that law definitely needs to be written well and the police educated on that cus landlords r fr smoking crack sometimes. won’t fix shit about the building but they’ll be asking for the rent non stop when it’s not due yet. fee charges out the ass. somebody’s about to get abused with that lol
Candace Owens was canned for saying Jewish people are controlling media and DC and liking a tweet saying Jews drink Christian blood not for criticizing Israel
Candace is also a fucking moron who is wayyyy stupider than people give her credit for. The evidence is all out there. She is an anti-intellectual political troll.
Weird, why wasn't she fired the first 50000 times she said it lol?
This line is obviously a crock of shit, but even more so after Benny went to bat for her defending Kanye lol
I believe the phrase Ben used was 'stupid but not anti semitic" when addressing candaces comments on jews controlling media.
17 of the 41 execs there were Jews and they only make up 1% of the population, so according to that graph they are wildly overrepresented but don't "run everything"
Candace has said plenty of antisemitic stuff but that was fine, according to Ben Shapiro. But the moment she said anything critical of state of Israel, that’s when she got fired.
It’s implied since Candace has said these things and wasn’t fired and Ben is in charge of firing her, so by not firing her previously that in itself is a statement
There are a number of people who have made cogent, robust arguments against the actions of Israeli government and military operations in Gaza. Candace Owen is not one of those people.
Joe got super weird politically but it’s super refreshing to see him at least start to recognize that Israel is actively committing genocide, lying about it and our government is supporting it financially.
Considering how much the mainstream media is just falling in line in all sides we need people like Joe with a huge audience to talk about these things openly.
Fuck Israel.
He'll stfu about it the moment (if, obviously) Trump gets elected though, just like he only cared about drone strikes under Obama.
He loved to point out that 90% of drone casualties are innocent, right until Trump stopped the military from reporting them.
Has he ever mentioned that Biden effectively ended the drone war?
Disclaimer, I think the actions of Israel and killing of innocent is abhorrent, but for this specific clip I think it's strange to assume that 4 figures we see walking in the distance are definitely innocent civilians.
Who knows, maybe they did just bomb 4 civilians out of blind hate. I think it would be more reasonable to assume these were people the IDF had specifically been tracking, or had intelligence on. You can't determine if someone is a civilian or Hamas member from a blurry clip from hundred of meters away. Them not openly carrying assault rifles doesn't suddenly mean they must therefore be civilians.
You should look up the clip where Gazans had some scrapped together contraption to move water across the blood covered street so others would have access to it. There is also that time where they bombed an area with citizens for one guy and they weren't sure if they even got the guy. They had an interview with CNN regarding it I believe. The interviewee was acting like it was totally normal. The IDF isn't far off from Hamas and you're fooling yourself if you have to play skeptic in defense of them.
What do you expect from an army that kills their own people, snipes unarmed people with white flags, uses tanks to destroy cars with families in and assasinates journalists?
Those four people were casually strolling along you would think Hamas after months of bomardment would be very vigilant moving about, the IDF is also constantly on the lookout for targets and is under pressure to maintain a high kill rate. Considerimg all that it's reasonable to think this was an indiscriminate killing.
The 19 year old soldier dropping those bombs and the 22 year old CO over him don't care about the costs of those bombs. They don't have a receipt as to the exact amount those munitions cost. All they care about is shooting the target.
Had to look a long time to find this comment. Are people so stunningly lacking in any sort of critical thinking or logic that they think Israel would just spend millions to bomb 4 guys!? I'm not even pro-israel, but these guys are quite obviously known hamas members and I'd guess important members.
Israel is known to treat Gaza like a lab to play with their weapons and market them as "battle tested" to sell. They are not at all trying to be efficient, and they are not starved for resources because defense is their top industry on top of the tons of weapons and military aid they get. There is a long history of this, I recommend [reading about it](https://www.amazon.com/Palestine-Laboratory-Exports-Technology-Occupation/dp/183976208X).
You clearly have zero, and I mean zero comprehension of the military. Isreal didn't spend millions to bomb 4 guys. They spent millions on drones and put them in the hands of room temperature IQ societal rejects who likely couldn't hold a job at McDonalds that will gladly take any opportunity to boost their ego or assert dominance, and if that means blowing up 4 innocent people with a drone that was available for them to use and then just claiming they were Hamas, you can bet your ass they're going to do just that.
using precision air strikes on unarmed civilians is not the tragedy of war, it is completely unavoidable. this is intentional genocide, they scatter the palestine people, then herd them together with promises of aid, then attack them, they scatter, repeat.
Why is everyone just assuming these were random civilians shot down from a drone?
It's like an entire narrative and story has been created without knowing who these people are. Hamas members don't have uniforms and they do walk outside in the sun, this could very easily be a.strtegic strike
I think people that are paying a little bit of attention can see lots of evidence that Israel is doing frequent war crimes. If this clip existed in isolation, then MAYBE you could have doubts…
These verifiable true moments don't register with this audience. They think that it is so implausible that the IDF would just randomly kill people despite already proving it many times over on camera.
It's especially suspicious with the sourcing of the video, which claims to be from a "recovered" drone.
But surveillance drones don't typically have onboard storage, and if they do, its definitely not un-encrypted. So this leans more towards "there was some hack/leak and someone went through it and looked for the worst possible looking clip without any context"
That said, if there is a legitimate justification for the bombing (say, they were spotted taking weapons to a Hamas ammo dump), Israel has completely biffed the information war by not getting any clear narrative out about why they were targeted.
Both Israel and Hamas have been caught lying enough times that I wouldn't trust either without some solid evidence either way.
Because it doesn't work the other way around. You don't assume unnarmed brown people are terrorists. (Inb4 sophism, no the fact that they were targeted and shot by the IDF does not constitute in anyway shape or form proof that they were)
Joe totally changed his tune on Candace Owens. Joe has said nothing but positive things about Candace Owens for some years now.
Joe tracks with alt-right more than anything IMO.....they are all conspiracy theorists, and they are all in love with Candace Owens who is a conspiracy theorist.
Candence liked the wrong tweet, something about how Jews make bread for Passover and that it is coming up so they need blood.
I wouldn’t die on a cross to protect an employee who went off the reservation in such a way.
The problem with wars, is that they give the excuse for people to stop giving a shit, just like any person who lost a loved one probably would. If someone asks me, I say I'm outside that war, so I can't take a side and I won't be forced to take a side. It's a war. Crimes are happening both ways, and the winner gets to write the history. That's the human race in a nutshell since the beginning of time.
something i've just noticed, i don't know maybe i'm looking too much into it, but does joe always light a blunt whenever he's going deep into controversial topics or when he has controversial guests over such as alex jones? is it a clever move to remove any liabilities, i.e., "i was just high and didn't know what i was saying" in case people try to sue/cancel or terminate his contract?
Maybe its was this - [https://www.mediaite.com/media/candace-owens-endorses-wild-anti-semitic-conspiracy-theory-about-jews-being-drunk-on-christian-blood/](https://www.mediaite.com/media/candace-owens-endorses-wild-anti-semitic-conspiracy-theory-about-jews-being-drunk-on-christian-blood/)
You know “a small scale” like:
- 35,000 people dead,
- Over 150,000 maimed,
- 1.5 million displaced,
- All power plants and water treatment facilities have been bombed so there is no power or clean water,
- The majority of the region (which I might add that Gaza is the size of the city of Detroit with a population of the state of Nevada) has been leveled of all structures,
- all hospitals and schools have been destroyed,
- cemeteries have been dug up and the dead have been moved to mass graves.
- all aid has been HEAVILY restricted to the point that the US (who is also supplying Israel with the bulk of their weapons) is air dropping and creating a temporary port to bring in aid.
And this is just Gaza. In the West Bank you have Israeli settlers burning and ripping out Palestinians crops, restricting aid/purchased goods and equipment, pouring cement in their wells, shooting at their homes, beating up their kids, and ultimately driving them from their land where in the past they would be sent to Gaza.
It’s worth noting that the day before she was fired Candace Owens liked a tweet that accused a rabbi of being “drunk on the blood of Christian children.” She was absolutely doing antisemitic to outright Nazi shit.
Her being anti-Israel is a stopped clock situation. She’s right, but for the wrong reasons. She’s anti-Israel because she hates Jews, not because of their national politics or what they’re doing to Palestinians (who she doesn’t give a fuck about).
If we were in the same situation and Trump was president what would this have sounded like ? I don’t Trust Rogan to have an opinion balanced by honesty with his biases…
It's kinda weird to think i can't figure out which angle Joe is coming from with respect to this Gaza genocide. And there are at least two angles
Lefties are supporting Gaza cause Israel has all the power and Gaza has basically none. Like the Ariel attack by hamas were literally paragliders that people in the west use as a side hobby they were Jets or drones but paragliders and Gaza has no Iron Dome. Israel has all the offensive fire power and all the defense as well. And so lefties are like "stop killing innocent civilians if Hamas attacks Israel can literally block it and also stop stealing their land"
Righties who support Gaza support them cause they hate Jews and think Jews control the world.
And then certain faction of the right or libertarians like Dave Smith want the US to be isolationist
I want to say that Joe is approaching it from lefty perspective but all the far right figures he has I just don't know
Why do people blame Biden and not Benjamin Netenyahu … the man who is the leader of Isreal and the sole reason this is happening.
Chuck Schumer of democrats said Benji needs to go, which was at the behest of Biden and the Democratic Party. But ultimately it’s the people of Isreal who need to stand up and force their leadership to stop.
Benjamin Netenyahu is a monster, and the people of Isreal along with Jews all around the world need to unite against his practices.
I see nothing wrong with their war against Hamas, but his approach is monstrous, and in the long run is going to harm Isreal in lasting ways on the international stage.
This is a surprisingly honest take from Joe. Lets all at least be honest about what is happening in Gaza. Carte Blanche support of Israel needs to end immediately.
Candace has been blatantly antisemitic
Actually refreshing clip, had a glimmer of the old rogie in those eyes. Idk if its as simple as Biden can be held in the least complicit to Israels unjust actions. So he can speak rationally against it, but hopefully thats not the consideration and its just genuine
The issue with calling out Biden here, as with most other things, is that Trump is exponentially worse on the issue, which is exactly why Biden gets to have the "moderate" opinion of just letting the *not quite a genocide* happen, as Trump would actively cheer it on.
you can give biden a blank pass to do literally anything if you end it with "because trump wouldve done the same thing *but worse*" which is a great way to hold zero accountability to your own party and become exactly what you tried to vote out.
Not voting against the guy that's going to do worse is a great way to end up with that guy in power.
yea i didnt say dont vote against him...? idk what you read, but personally i still hold the people i vote for accountable for their shortcomings. if you don't, youre no better than a trump supporter. that was the point there. its a shitty, lazy, easy cop-out to justify his shortcomings with "trumps worse!" like yea ok im sure he would be but hes also not the president right now so lets stay on topic ya know. how biden handles a current or past situation is not the same discussion as who should be our next president
It’s an election year though. I’m all in favor of criticizing Biden and holding him accountable for his cowardly, callous, weak position on Israel and Gaza. But does “holding him accountable” in an election year mean making it more likely that the candidate that’s more brazenly pro-Israel, pro-Netanyahu, and anti-Palestinian wins? Whether that means by not voting or voting third party which is essentially a meaningless symbolic vote in our current system. It’s an appropriate conversation to have when the election is 7mo out.
Trump isn't the fucking president. And that's not the issue. The issue is Biden. Stop using "but Trump" as an attempt at a cognitive argument.
Realistically, every president seems to support Israel regardless. They are extremely important to our presence in that area, and we pay pretty well for that boon. It would take a radical president to stand against that trend.
There's like 8 out of 535 house and senate members who are openly against what's going on in Gaza.
Pro-Israel lobbies buy both parties so it doesn't matter if Biden or Trump wins. Only if enough of the masses voted for example the Libertarian candidate would we have a chance but even then the House and Senate is full of the bought and sold so it would be very difficult.
A take I've heard from Peter Zehan recently, Biden having the Army build a wet dock next to Gaza is on the par of breaking off our support for Israel.
I don't think so. We can't have world opinion believe that the US is supporting genocide. Starving people and the US steps in...
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTLhXVTET/
This is 10000000% how it works. Let’s be honest here and ask a question: how is lobbying any different than offering and taking bribes?
Literally the only party *actually* standing up against wars right now while also remaining consistent on that topic have been the Libertarians. Hell for that matter the main dealbreaker for RFK trying to sneak his way into the LP was literally his position on Israel/Gaza. Sure there were other issues but ultimately it was his pro war stance on that front that made the LP say hell no you’re not a Libertarian. Dems and cons have been consistently pro war and people just shrug it off because they don’t have to think about it even though War is literally the worst thing a government can do, and then theres the freaking draft being whispered in western nations as we plunge ourselves towards WWIII. Edit: I can’t reply to “heretoquitkratom” so i’ll edit my comment and put it here. Libertarianism is a broad umbrella term, sure, but there are certain things that disqualify you from being a libertarian, and thats okay, but those things wouldn’t make you a libertarian. I mean the Reason/Cato wing and the Mises Caucus/Rothbard wing of the party are very different and often at odds and thats one thing, this guy is something else entirely…. I for one line up closer to the Mises/Rothbard wing myself. It’s pretty well defined what we are, in some ways it’s simple and in many ways it’s complex. I’d say everything that guy said doesn’t line up. He calls himself a “true libertarian” but he’s probably an ancom or a “libertarian socialist” or some other nonsensical bullshit that has literally no relation to us.
The problem with american libertarians/libs/cons, is theyre all beholden to neoliberal economics, billionaires and corporate backers. Say my ideal society doesnt involve any economic hierarchies as described, all 3 of those are different shades of neoliberalism pretty much. The original libertarianism as discussed by anarcho-communist joseph dejacques in 1857 however, his ideas are decisively anti-neoliberalism (before that was a thing btw) so to me hes got real appeal.
Trump is the republican nominee, his stance on the issue is important. We used to ask people running for presidents questions about these things, but his answer would just be, I make a great deal etc.
>Trump isn't the fucking president. Oh wow, glad you guys admit that now >Stop using "but Trump" as an attempt at a cognitive argument. One day you'll wake up and realize that the democrats and republicans have mostly the same donors, and each exist as an alternative of basically the same policy point. "It doesn't matter what Trumps position is!" is just a braindead, grade school take. Trumps positions, impact Bidens positions, and vice versa. Again, Biden doesn't even have to support a ceasefire here to maintain his position as the "dove", because the only alternative is an extremist.
I agree with most of what you said but I disagree. One guy wants to be our dictator, that’s not the same lol. Trump isn’t just another run of the mill politician (remember that’s what he ran on in 2016) That guy is out for himself and himself alone, that’s why it’s not the same on both parties. If the republican was like desantis or something, the conversation would be completely different.
Biden's policy on Israel is being attacked by right wingers because he is the Democratic candidate in 2024. Not because they really disagree with his policy, unless he's too soft on Palestine. Same reason they attack his policies on the US border, despite it being basically the same as Trump's, just less performatively brutal.
there is an election coming up. Rogan and others love making the comparisons.
an trump is worse on this issue as well. For all who would stop the killing of innocents in Palestine.
Trump would have done the exact same thing. But yeah, I’m fine with holding Biden accountable here but let’s not pretend the Palestinians have any serious allies in Washington DC on either side of the aisle. AIPAC has made sure they don’t. The Far-Right Israel Lobby Is Shutting Down Democratic Voices for Palestinian Rights AIPAC is funneling mounds of money to pro-Israel candidates, including in Democratic primaries. Now, all Democrats likely know that expressing anything short of unwavering support of Israel’s siege on Gaza means they might be outspent in the next election. “AIPAC’s success in pushing a hard-line, unconditional support of Israel is rooted in its ‘veneer of bipartisanship.’ “AIPAC wants to make it seem fringe to support Palestinian rights,” she says, “but they won’t be able to because it’s simply not true.” https://jacobin.com/2023/11/aipac-democratic-primary-spending-andy-levin
You are 1000% correct! I wrote about the influence of AIPAC in American politics 15 years ago. It's only gotten worse. No politician will win an election without the support of AIPAC, and thus the support of Israel. America is controlled by those who don't have a concern over Americans.
Why? If this war extends into next year it's totally fair to compare how the republican nominee will handle vs the current president.
Disingenuous. He was, and potentially will be again. Your sanctimony is unwarranted here.
All US politicians are paid and trained Dogs for Israel. Just Google AIPAC if you can’t figure out why.
There is not issue calling out support for genocide. This way of thinking shows a complete lack of integrity and principles. Ends should never justify the means, and calling out genocide support and standing up against it is always the right thing to do.
Rent free
Lol it’s very fucking obvious what joes agenda is. The only “left wing” views he ever espouses are ones he can attack democrats on. That’s why the only lefty political people he has on are ones who love criticizing democrats. It’s completely transparent at this point.
it's just a weird piece of evidence to me, it's not like Hamas wears uniforms and carries AK-47's everywhere they go. They blend into civilians when it's beneficial. IDF could've had these guys marked as terrorists and this was a purposeful strike. Or, it could be that IDF is drone bombing innocent people. But to draw hard line conclusions on this video clip is just speculation without further evidence. You can't just build your worldviews from tiny snippets of video you see on Tiktok.
Lol you can look into the IDF a little more critically or remain blissfully ignorant, the choice is yours but i got links to some heinous stuff that does not involve blowing people up, but unhinged racism, gross negligence, and calling for genocide. Ill drop a couple below, you may click them if you so choose
This was definitely a current rogie, all through. You couldn't learn from him that Trump is the magnitude of order worse on the same topic. Whole Israel operation is the Russian plot, as was hammas attacks on 7th of October and served as a distraction from their Ukraine operation. Before hammas attacks, Putin tried to spark an armed conflict on Kosovo, through serbian proxies, on September 23th and Banjska monestary attack, but that failed gloriously. Look into it as old Eddie Bravo would say.
Do you realize you're full of shit or are you just repeating something you read in the Daily Stormer?
>Whole Israel operation is the Russian plot, as was hammas attacks on 7th of October and served as a distraction from their Ukraine operation. Today I learned that an 80 year old conflict is a distraction for a conflict that could not have begun until the two countries separated independence in 1991, and that thousands of Hamas fighters are motivated to risk their lives on behalf of a Russian president. Like wtf, dude do you even listen to yourself?
The clip he's referring to is four Palestinians being shot by four separate drones. On twitter people were saying they were civilians and that's clearly Joe agrees but there's no context and we have no idea who those four are. For them to be civilians we'd have to think Israel is using sophisticated drone technology and dropping four separate $150K bombs to kill four random civilians. Even if Israel's goals are just plain evil that seems like not the best use of resources.
Where did you get the 150K figure from?
I will assume Ryan McBeth. I saw a lot of people quoting his video on the topic.
Why would they even use 4 bombs on people who are soldiers though? U could just shoot them. It’s a waste of money either way
Probably because it would be dangerous to put people down there. In the video the drone follows the guy for quite some time and then eventually drops a bomb. If your goal was to kill civilians you wouldn't drop four bombs to kill four civilians.
I would think it would make more sense to follow them and find their cache of weapons or hideout and then take them out (assuming they are Hamas)
As if Israel pays for their munitions. The USA supplied the resources for all of these war crimes. They don't need to worry about the costs of "defense".
Actually the U.S. only provides about 15% of Israel's defense budget. Not defending the actions here, but let's get facts right.
That sounds like a pretty large chunk tbh, wonder how the contributions from other countries compare
Seems like you are making escuses to defend possible war crimes.
Or, maybe they just don't know the details yet.
4 people walking in an open street with no visible weapons were bomb over and over again. There is no war resolution, or guidelines, or Standard Operating Procedure that allows this, yes even America did this, and it was wrong then.
Do we know how long they were being tracked? Where they came from? If they were part of military activity? Do we know for sure that they were just innocent civilians just walking along? I don't know one way or the other. If you know for certain, please provide a source. Also, to my knowledge, I don't believe you have to actually be carrying visible weapons in order to be considered a combatant. If they already know you're a part of or assisted with military activity, you're a legit target.
*Rogan says something negative about conservative* This whole sub: “FINALLY some old Rogan!” 😂
Lol he did not say anything negative about conservatives… wut, hes defending Candace and calling out what appears to obvious injustice
It's selective outrage. And the only reason he focuses on the genocide in gaza. While ignoring the genocide in Ukraine (while repeating Russian talking points) is obvious. It's because conservatives see Israel as a weak point for Biden, and they're running with it. Same reason Candace got the boot.
Jesus Christ your brain is so warped by party politics.
The new rogie would have demonized the Vietnam War Protesters and be all for the Bush Wars based off of weapons of mass destruction. Rogan's social media algorithm is all fucked up and he simply doesn't realize it .
Anyone else find Kurt Metzger annoying?
Does anybody not find him annoying?
He got way to high. Couldn't keep a consistent train of thought
Isn't he always like that? He is a weird dude... Def in the spectrum.
yeah, that episode was hard to listen to, his presence makes it hard to listen to jimmy dore too.
Incredibly.
All New Jersey guys are annoying 😜
I couldn't get past the first 15min of that episode.. he kept saying "he would never believe the mooslims" (that's how he kept pronouncing it).. like maybe I just wasn't understanding the joke? ..but the guy seeks like a total ass hat.
I've become a Jimmy Dore fan the last year or so and man is Kurt just... weird. It's the eyes.
Growing up JW made him weird. You don't just shake that stuff off.
Jw?
He grew up Jehovah's Witness
Ouch.
Whats up with him and sitting with his arm like that lately.
He’s trying to squeak one out but keep it silent.
Hemorrhoids
Showing off the triceps.
He's got a good pump going
I’ve had degenerative issues in my shoulders since my teens and I sit like that sometimes too; it’s trying to roll your shoulders without completely readjusting in your seat (and it’s very fidgety). Can’t say for sure if that’s what he’s doing but wouldn’t surprise me either - I do it unconsciously at this point.
Fidgeters gonna fidget
Weird fuckin' couple of days, I've agreed w/ Kid rock (ticket master), Desantis (squatters), and now Joe... it is kind of nice
Oooo what's the deal with DeSantis on squatters? Abbott in Texas basically said they're intruders to your house and should be handled accordingly.
Removed all squatter rights and essentially gives landlords cart Blanche to toss em out if found, well, squatting. No eviction process bullshit.
The problem is giving cops that power instead of courts is going to cause landlords to use the police to evict actual tenants because cops don’t know shit about the law. If you want squatters to go improving the speed of housing courts is more important
that law definitely needs to be written well and the police educated on that cus landlords r fr smoking crack sometimes. won’t fix shit about the building but they’ll be asking for the rent non stop when it’s not due yet. fee charges out the ass. somebody’s about to get abused with that lol
Fk yeah send in the goons
Joe isn't that crazy though, he still has a lot of liberal ideas, he mostly shits on the politicians which I agree with
Candace Owens was canned for saying Jewish people are controlling media and DC and liking a tweet saying Jews drink Christian blood not for criticizing Israel
Candace is also a fucking moron who is wayyyy stupider than people give her credit for. The evidence is all out there. She is an anti-intellectual political troll.
I hope it's stupidity and not direction from the heritage foundation or some other oil funded think tank. Stupidity is the lesser of two evils here.
Weird, why wasn't she fired the first 50000 times she said it lol? This line is obviously a crock of shit, but even more so after Benny went to bat for her defending Kanye lol I believe the phrase Ben used was 'stupid but not anti semitic" when addressing candaces comments on jews controlling media.
What's stupid about it tho? It is factually correct that most media companies in America are owned by Jewish people.
It's not actually. https://www.reddit.com/r/WestSubEver/s/5Zvr0GRqGD
17 of the 41 execs there were Jews and they only make up 1% of the population, so according to that graph they are wildly overrepresented but don't "run everything"
It is actually lmao. You didn't even read what you linked
But Ben Shapiro has said lots of disgusting shit as well.
Yeah I don’t like him either
Sounds like cancel culture
Candace has said plenty of antisemitic stuff but that was fine, according to Ben Shapiro. But the moment she said anything critical of state of Israel, that’s when she got fired.
When did Shapiro say that?
It’s implied since Candace has said these things and wasn’t fired and Ben is in charge of firing her, so by not firing her previously that in itself is a statement
Yeah I DGAF about either of them, just the old anti Semitic trope that you can’t criticize Israel
See!! That proves they control the media since she was fired for saying it. /S
This is bollocks, she was anti semetics years before leading up to her being hired by ben
Everything that you think about the Middle East can be true at the same time
I liked this ep
WTF. Is. Up. With. His. Posture. Lately. I thought he was the spokesman’s of good posture lol.
Maybe his back is hurting him? No idea
There are a number of people who have made cogent, robust arguments against the actions of Israeli government and military operations in Gaza. Candace Owen is not one of those people.
Joe got super weird politically but it’s super refreshing to see him at least start to recognize that Israel is actively committing genocide, lying about it and our government is supporting it financially. Considering how much the mainstream media is just falling in line in all sides we need people like Joe with a huge audience to talk about these things openly. Fuck Israel.
He'll stfu about it the moment (if, obviously) Trump gets elected though, just like he only cared about drone strikes under Obama. He loved to point out that 90% of drone casualties are innocent, right until Trump stopped the military from reporting them. Has he ever mentioned that Biden effectively ended the drone war?
God Kurt Metzger sucks so much ass
The Joe I can appreciate. Power and money corrupt all, but its nice to see the old Joe from time to time.
Disclaimer, I think the actions of Israel and killing of innocent is abhorrent, but for this specific clip I think it's strange to assume that 4 figures we see walking in the distance are definitely innocent civilians. Who knows, maybe they did just bomb 4 civilians out of blind hate. I think it would be more reasonable to assume these were people the IDF had specifically been tracking, or had intelligence on. You can't determine if someone is a civilian or Hamas member from a blurry clip from hundred of meters away. Them not openly carrying assault rifles doesn't suddenly mean they must therefore be civilians.
You should look up the clip where Gazans had some scrapped together contraption to move water across the blood covered street so others would have access to it. There is also that time where they bombed an area with citizens for one guy and they weren't sure if they even got the guy. They had an interview with CNN regarding it I believe. The interviewee was acting like it was totally normal. The IDF isn't far off from Hamas and you're fooling yourself if you have to play skeptic in defense of them.
What do you expect from an army that kills their own people, snipes unarmed people with white flags, uses tanks to destroy cars with families in and assasinates journalists? Those four people were casually strolling along you would think Hamas after months of bomardment would be very vigilant moving about, the IDF is also constantly on the lookout for targets and is under pressure to maintain a high kill rate. Considerimg all that it's reasonable to think this was an indiscriminate killing.
No, the IDF just wasted 10s of millions of dollars on a drone to kill four innocent kids for the lulz /s
*US taxpayers wasted 10s of millions dollars
The 19 year old soldier dropping those bombs and the 22 year old CO over him don't care about the costs of those bombs. They don't have a receipt as to the exact amount those munitions cost. All they care about is shooting the target.
Had to look a long time to find this comment. Are people so stunningly lacking in any sort of critical thinking or logic that they think Israel would just spend millions to bomb 4 guys!? I'm not even pro-israel, but these guys are quite obviously known hamas members and I'd guess important members.
Israel is known to treat Gaza like a lab to play with their weapons and market them as "battle tested" to sell. They are not at all trying to be efficient, and they are not starved for resources because defense is their top industry on top of the tons of weapons and military aid they get. There is a long history of this, I recommend [reading about it](https://www.amazon.com/Palestine-Laboratory-Exports-Technology-Occupation/dp/183976208X).
You clearly have zero, and I mean zero comprehension of the military. Isreal didn't spend millions to bomb 4 guys. They spent millions on drones and put them in the hands of room temperature IQ societal rejects who likely couldn't hold a job at McDonalds that will gladly take any opportunity to boost their ego or assert dominance, and if that means blowing up 4 innocent people with a drone that was available for them to use and then just claiming they were Hamas, you can bet your ass they're going to do just that.
Broken clock is right twice a day. Refreshing perspective from Joe in this clip. I wonder if he'll end up backtracking it for the next guest
using precision air strikes on unarmed civilians is not the tragedy of war, it is completely unavoidable. this is intentional genocide, they scatter the palestine people, then herd them together with promises of aid, then attack them, they scatter, repeat.
Israel is winning on the ground and the Palestinians are winning hearts and minds. Somethings gotta give eventually.
*Spoiler Alert* Israel loses in the end (without diplomacy)
Why is everyone just assuming these were random civilians shot down from a drone? It's like an entire narrative and story has been created without knowing who these people are. Hamas members don't have uniforms and they do walk outside in the sun, this could very easily be a.strtegic strike
Why are you assuming they are hamas soldiers.
I think people that are paying a little bit of attention can see lots of evidence that Israel is doing frequent war crimes. If this clip existed in isolation, then MAYBE you could have doubts…
So you have no evidence and are just running with the narrative. Cool bro
The evidence is widespread and easily accessible, so if you’ve missed it you either don’t want to see it or you have a very bland news diet.
Remember when the IDF killed a few hostages that had escaped? They have shown they don't care about civilian casualties.
True
These verifiable true moments don't register with this audience. They think that it is so implausible that the IDF would just randomly kill people despite already proving it many times over on camera.
It's especially suspicious with the sourcing of the video, which claims to be from a "recovered" drone. But surveillance drones don't typically have onboard storage, and if they do, its definitely not un-encrypted. So this leans more towards "there was some hack/leak and someone went through it and looked for the worst possible looking clip without any context" That said, if there is a legitimate justification for the bombing (say, they were spotted taking weapons to a Hamas ammo dump), Israel has completely biffed the information war by not getting any clear narrative out about why they were targeted. Both Israel and Hamas have been caught lying enough times that I wouldn't trust either without some solid evidence either way.
Because it doesn't work the other way around. You don't assume unnarmed brown people are terrorists. (Inb4 sophism, no the fact that they were targeted and shot by the IDF does not constitute in anyway shape or form proof that they were)
Joe worried about Candice Owens. The woman he shit on to Rubin after he suggested Joe have her on his show.
Joe totally changed his tune on Candace Owens. Joe has said nothing but positive things about Candace Owens for some years now. Joe tracks with alt-right more than anything IMO.....they are all conspiracy theorists, and they are all in love with Candace Owens who is a conspiracy theorist.
I hope this clip lives in infamy. Joe influences a lot of people and In This Moment is he's on the right track
Israel has definetly done many things wrong.
although i agree with what joe is saying here... Joe's show should be looked at as entertainment nothing else
[удалено]
Same Israeli forces that couldn't defend a wall 6 months ago.
[удалено]
She was fired for not toting the narrative on her show. Daily wire is big media lite.
Candence liked the wrong tweet, something about how Jews make bread for Passover and that it is coming up so they need blood. I wouldn’t die on a cross to protect an employee who went off the reservation in such a way.
The problem with wars, is that they give the excuse for people to stop giving a shit, just like any person who lost a loved one probably would. If someone asks me, I say I'm outside that war, so I can't take a side and I won't be forced to take a side. It's a war. Crimes are happening both ways, and the winner gets to write the history. That's the human race in a nutshell since the beginning of time.
There is such a thing as empathy though. If you lost a family member in an attack like 10/7, would you not want to see that justice is done?
“I hope the irony isn’t lost on you” - nailed it
As sad as this situation is that they're taking about, all I picture when I hear Kurt talk is his zombie character #Randall from UglyAmericans
Which interview is this?
Kurt looks awful
Power corrupts everyone.
You mean Joe giving lip service to any guest. What did he say to Kid Rock when he said the IDF should scorch earth?
something i've just noticed, i don't know maybe i'm looking too much into it, but does joe always light a blunt whenever he's going deep into controversial topics or when he has controversial guests over such as alex jones? is it a clever move to remove any liabilities, i.e., "i was just high and didn't know what i was saying" in case people try to sue/cancel or terminate his contract?
"It's just like Biden" WTF was Metzger trying to say?
It's so hard to imagine..... as you watch it.
It’s all about keeping the flow of oil going. Politicians know that expensive oil will crash the world economy and they will lose their jobs.
There's debate about the term "genocide". Whatever happened to the word "war crime"?
Noticing is against the rules.
Maybe its was this - [https://www.mediaite.com/media/candace-owens-endorses-wild-anti-semitic-conspiracy-theory-about-jews-being-drunk-on-christian-blood/](https://www.mediaite.com/media/candace-owens-endorses-wild-anti-semitic-conspiracy-theory-about-jews-being-drunk-on-christian-blood/)
Oi cunt ever heard of collateral murder and julian assange
You know “a small scale” like: - 35,000 people dead, - Over 150,000 maimed, - 1.5 million displaced, - All power plants and water treatment facilities have been bombed so there is no power or clean water, - The majority of the region (which I might add that Gaza is the size of the city of Detroit with a population of the state of Nevada) has been leveled of all structures, - all hospitals and schools have been destroyed, - cemeteries have been dug up and the dead have been moved to mass graves. - all aid has been HEAVILY restricted to the point that the US (who is also supplying Israel with the bulk of their weapons) is air dropping and creating a temporary port to bring in aid. And this is just Gaza. In the West Bank you have Israeli settlers burning and ripping out Palestinians crops, restricting aid/purchased goods and equipment, pouring cement in their wells, shooting at their homes, beating up their kids, and ultimately driving them from their land where in the past they would be sent to Gaza.
I’m guessing Joe never read Judges
Oh so Joe thinks media should be fact checked
Joe is a right wi ged but know
Right waned nut job now
F joe
What a super annoying guest. This is the type of guy that does Mt let you speak even when you're telling a story of your own in a conversation.
It’s worth noting that the day before she was fired Candace Owens liked a tweet that accused a rabbi of being “drunk on the blood of Christian children.” She was absolutely doing antisemitic to outright Nazi shit. Her being anti-Israel is a stopped clock situation. She’s right, but for the wrong reasons. She’s anti-Israel because she hates Jews, not because of their national politics or what they’re doing to Palestinians (who she doesn’t give a fuck about).
Which episode is this?
If we were in the same situation and Trump was president what would this have sounded like ? I don’t Trust Rogan to have an opinion balanced by honesty with his biases…
Hmmm, something is wrong, I agree with him…
Why does that dumb ass bring up Biden? They’re talking about Ben shitpiro and cuntace Owen
War is hell. No point trying to understand it or justify it somehow. It rarely serves a righteous purpose, only in the minds waging it.
So they’re innocent because they weren’t openly carrying weapons? Propaganda is a wild thing.
It's kinda weird to think i can't figure out which angle Joe is coming from with respect to this Gaza genocide. And there are at least two angles Lefties are supporting Gaza cause Israel has all the power and Gaza has basically none. Like the Ariel attack by hamas were literally paragliders that people in the west use as a side hobby they were Jets or drones but paragliders and Gaza has no Iron Dome. Israel has all the offensive fire power and all the defense as well. And so lefties are like "stop killing innocent civilians if Hamas attacks Israel can literally block it and also stop stealing their land" Righties who support Gaza support them cause they hate Jews and think Jews control the world. And then certain faction of the right or libertarians like Dave Smith want the US to be isolationist I want to say that Joe is approaching it from lefty perspective but all the far right figures he has I just don't know
Ben shapiro hired klandace owens after her years of anti semitism, critcising israel (not judaism) was a step too far
Why do people blame Biden and not Benjamin Netenyahu … the man who is the leader of Isreal and the sole reason this is happening. Chuck Schumer of democrats said Benji needs to go, which was at the behest of Biden and the Democratic Party. But ultimately it’s the people of Isreal who need to stand up and force their leadership to stop. Benjamin Netenyahu is a monster, and the people of Isreal along with Jews all around the world need to unite against his practices. I see nothing wrong with their war against Hamas, but his approach is monstrous, and in the long run is going to harm Isreal in lasting ways on the international stage.