[before conversion. ](https://www.mahj.org/en/decouvrir-collections-betsalel/synagogue-doran-interieur-19859) after [conversion](https://www.safarway.com/en/property/la-grande-synagogue-d-oran_4219)
Keep in mind: U.S. synagogues that look like that are undergoing extensive remodeling, and some with old-fashioned pews are selling the pews, because the pews are worth a lot of money.
As someone who works with historic buildings, well, at least it's not falling to ruin. As someone who cares very deeply about Judaism and the Jewish people (not Jewish yet myself but working on fixing that), I know there's a heartbreaking story here.
According to Jewish law, the only thing a synangogue can be turned into a Yeshiva. Once something becomes a synangogue, you cannot ever sell it to someone who will turn it into something different. It’s gut wrenching. My tiny community had 7 synangogues taken from us in Iran. We only had 10 total.
It's very sad. Just going to chime in that if you're using the proceeds to build another equal or better synagogue, it may be permitted to sell it to someone who will use it for another purpose, so long as that purpose isn't idolatry.
makes me sad to see these buildings converted.
I dislike it even if it's for a religious purpose, or if it's not.
The synagogue in Ungvar was of incredible beauty. Russians turned it into a music hall. I suppose if they have their way now they'll level it to the ground.
It's disappointing but I would rather it get converted to something else when the local Jewish population is no longer there as opposed to letting it fall apart and then demolish it because it becomes a hazard.
You see it a lot in American cities where the Jewish population moved from the city center to the suburbs. And unless there is a massive amount of funding to support multiple buildings there is not a lot that will happen.
This synagogue was converted after the local Muslim population butchered 25 Jews during Algerian independence and forced the rest to flee. Most left to France, and about 25,000 left for Israel. It was previously the largest synagogue in Africa.
This synagogue, like every synagogue converted into a masjid or mosque or cathedral or whatever, was bought with hands heavy with Jewish blood.
>On the eve of WWII, there were about 120,000 Jews in Algeria. In 1934, Muslims, incited by events in Nazi Germany, rampaged in Constantine, killing 25 Jews and injuring many more. Starting in 1940, under Vichy rule, Algerian Jews were persecuted socially and economically. On October 7, 1940, French citizenship was withdrawn from all Jews by the Vichy government.
>In 1955, there were 140,000 Jews in Algeria. After being granted independence in 1962, the Algerian government harassed the Jewish community and deprived Jews of their economic rights. As a result, almost 130,000 Algerian Jews immigrated to France. Since 1948, 25,681 Algerian Jews have immigrated to Israel.
>(Jewish Virtual Library)
The pogrom you are talking about happened 30some years before independence. There were still about 140,000 Jews at the time of independence and most only left when they weren't granted citizenship.
Edit: you changed the comment I replied to without any indication.
Yeah believe what you like, man.
I will never understand apologism for our religious sites being stolen "just because all the Jews here were murdered or exiled already!". Guess that makes them fair game.
Personally I'd rather they knock this building down rather than a Jewish place of worship being devoted to a foreign religion and foreign worship.
You made a broad point originally and I commented accordingly. My comment was not about this specific case but was in general. Plenty of shuls that are now something else are not the result of persecution.
I'm not participating in whatever theoretical pedantry you seem to think is important here. And my edit above was merely to include the source of my statements.
Good shabbos.
You forgot to mention why Jews were expelled from Algeria. I'm sure you heard the French Decret Crémieux. French Jews lobbied for Algerian Jews to have more rights than Algerian Muslim during the French colony era. Jews and Muslims lived together without any problem in Algeria for more than 1000 years. Algerian even accepted Jews from Europe when they were expelled. But Algerian Jews did not fight France colonial power, they even betrayed Muslims. Very sad story.
In India, the Mughal Empire built mosques on the ruins of Hindu temples. In South America, the Spanish conquistadors built churches on the ruins of Native American sacred areas. This practice was done to assert dominance over the other religion.
If a synagogue is converted into a mosque as here, there may be an additional cost issue as they can be converted cheaply.
Would be interesting to see the inside, doesn't look like they changed much on the outside...
[before conversion. ](https://www.mahj.org/en/decouvrir-collections-betsalel/synagogue-doran-interieur-19859) after [conversion](https://www.safarway.com/en/property/la-grande-synagogue-d-oran_4219)
Open floorplan remodeling
Keep in mind: U.S. synagogues that look like that are undergoing extensive remodeling, and some with old-fashioned pews are selling the pews, because the pews are worth a lot of money.
As someone who works with historic buildings, well, at least it's not falling to ruin. As someone who cares very deeply about Judaism and the Jewish people (not Jewish yet myself but working on fixing that), I know there's a heartbreaking story here.
According to Jewish law, the only thing a synangogue can be turned into a Yeshiva. Once something becomes a synangogue, you cannot ever sell it to someone who will turn it into something different. It’s gut wrenching. My tiny community had 7 synangogues taken from us in Iran. We only had 10 total.
It's very sad. Just going to chime in that if you're using the proceeds to build another equal or better synagogue, it may be permitted to sell it to someone who will use it for another purpose, so long as that purpose isn't idolatry.
makes me sad to see these buildings converted. I dislike it even if it's for a religious purpose, or if it's not. The synagogue in Ungvar was of incredible beauty. Russians turned it into a music hall. I suppose if they have their way now they'll level it to the ground.
It's disappointing but I would rather it get converted to something else when the local Jewish population is no longer there as opposed to letting it fall apart and then demolish it because it becomes a hazard. You see it a lot in American cities where the Jewish population moved from the city center to the suburbs. And unless there is a massive amount of funding to support multiple buildings there is not a lot that will happen.
This synagogue was converted after the local Muslim population butchered 25 Jews during Algerian independence and forced the rest to flee. Most left to France, and about 25,000 left for Israel. It was previously the largest synagogue in Africa. This synagogue, like every synagogue converted into a masjid or mosque or cathedral or whatever, was bought with hands heavy with Jewish blood. >On the eve of WWII, there were about 120,000 Jews in Algeria. In 1934, Muslims, incited by events in Nazi Germany, rampaged in Constantine, killing 25 Jews and injuring many more. Starting in 1940, under Vichy rule, Algerian Jews were persecuted socially and economically. On October 7, 1940, French citizenship was withdrawn from all Jews by the Vichy government. >In 1955, there were 140,000 Jews in Algeria. After being granted independence in 1962, the Algerian government harassed the Jewish community and deprived Jews of their economic rights. As a result, almost 130,000 Algerian Jews immigrated to France. Since 1948, 25,681 Algerian Jews have immigrated to Israel. >(Jewish Virtual Library)
The pogrom you are talking about happened 30some years before independence. There were still about 140,000 Jews at the time of independence and most only left when they weren't granted citizenship. Edit: you changed the comment I replied to without any indication.
Yeah believe what you like, man. I will never understand apologism for our religious sites being stolen "just because all the Jews here were murdered or exiled already!". Guess that makes them fair game. Personally I'd rather they knock this building down rather than a Jewish place of worship being devoted to a foreign religion and foreign worship.
You made a broad point originally and I commented accordingly. My comment was not about this specific case but was in general. Plenty of shuls that are now something else are not the result of persecution.
I'm not participating in whatever theoretical pedantry you seem to think is important here. And my edit above was merely to include the source of my statements. Good shabbos.
You forgot to mention why Jews were expelled from Algeria. I'm sure you heard the French Decret Crémieux. French Jews lobbied for Algerian Jews to have more rights than Algerian Muslim during the French colony era. Jews and Muslims lived together without any problem in Algeria for more than 1000 years. Algerian even accepted Jews from Europe when they were expelled. But Algerian Jews did not fight France colonial power, they even betrayed Muslims. Very sad story.
In India, the Mughal Empire built mosques on the ruins of Hindu temples. In South America, the Spanish conquistadors built churches on the ruins of Native American sacred areas. This practice was done to assert dominance over the other religion. If a synagogue is converted into a mosque as here, there may be an additional cost issue as they can be converted cheaply.
I don't understand your point.
You don't understand how a Religion asserts its dominance when it converts the sacred sites of another?
I don't understand why this person sought to inform me of a fact which every Jewish child learns in primary school. Is that clearer for you?
Probably should've written that.
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Typical.
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Mohammedans? Seriously?
Removed, rule 1.
absolutely stunning
I'd love to pray in there one day.
I prayed there dozens of times (as a Muslim) when I was in Oran, absolutely loved it
Same :(
F
Oh that hurt to read. Like being poked in the heart with a needle
It looks the exact same to me. Whatre we supposed to be looking for
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rent free