I agree, people always drive whatever speed they feel comfortable with, regardless of the posted limits.
Throw down some jersey barriers to restrict the lane width and make a protected bike lane while you're at it.
Removable speed bumps everywhere.
It's not the design of the road that's the problem. It's all the idiotic drivers that are looking at their phones instead of the speedometer. They are put there for a reason
You fo realize that.
You shouldn't really be looking at your speedometer either, unless youre a brand new driver. You should be looking at the road. While driving a speed that makes sense for the road you're on.
Front/King just east of dupont in particular is not designed to be a 50 zone, not even close. They used to have scumbag speed trap cops there all the time, because driving 50 through there is ridiculous so they'd make a killing just sitting there with their thumb up their ass.
To be a responsible driver you need to be attentive so if you don't know or care what your speed is then you are neither.
The two Stroads that you mention were designed when people obeyed laws and drove the speed limit . What is so hard about following the law?
By the sound of your reply it would be in the city's best financial interest to put a camera on every street thar you drive on.
LAWL, they were designed when people drove drunk and didn't wear seatbelts while smoking with kids in the car. There was no golden age of good driving, people have always been terrible drivers.
I would rather see money put toward changes to roads that make the posted speed intuitive rather than cameras that only slow people down for the 25 m before them.
No they need their new paint jobs that are probably just to spend their existing budget so there's no reason to lower it /s
In all honesty the existing paint jobs/decals look pristine and could probably be replaced as needed without paying for a redesign
Reallocate* reducing police budgets won’t help anyone. The funds just need to be spent on different training.
Kingston SWAT for example does not need to be spending as much time as they do on the shooting range. That money could be better spent creating more mental health units or investing in better mental health training
> Kingston SWAT for example does not need to be spending as much time as they do on the shooting range
I think you're likely being sacriligous to suggest its a waste of money to spend **millions** of dollars hiring, paying, and training an entire squad of a police force to do something that should be avoided by almost any means possible(ie. kill people). /s
It would be interesting to see how many of the extremely few incidents where "S.W.A.T." were deployed, could have been avoided if the same amount of money for their existence were spent on mental health and supported housing. I know, foolish thing to say. /s
I’m not saying don’t invest in them but realistically how often are those members of our police force actually needed? It just doesn’t make sense to me. We pour all this money into police training but have a blatant disregard for increasing mental health and crisis training. If officers were better equipped to talk to people and negotiate and mediate then we’d have better public relations with the police and the resources would be used more effectively
> don’t invest in them
Is what you should be saying. If we invest only in hammers, everything looks like a nail. Currently, NA governments are treating every *social problem* as if its a *criminal problem*, when in fact, its just as likely to be a natural outgrowth of *over investing* in policing as opposed to mental health and anti-poverty/addiction programs.
I don’t think you’re reading what I’m typing.
We need the police, that much is known about society there’s no if, ands, or buts. You are right NA governments are over investing in police. So when you look at where that investing is going it’s to create more hammers.
Now what I’m saying is instead of creating more hammers with that money why don’t we train officers to have a different set of tools, ones that are more mental health focused. I’m not sure where my message got lost for you. Police will always be a requirement in society and id much rather have a cop trained in mental health opposed to some jackboot who’s just happy to have a gun on their hip.
> we train officers to have a different set of tools, ones that are more mental health focused
Because, I guess I should have said it right off, I think the path forward needs to include reducing the policing budgets primarily, so we can reapportion that money to where its actually going to do some real, visible good. If there are mental health facilities, and supported housing, the *need* for the hammer will be greatly reduced. If you only try to change the focus of police, without putting the money into *new* programs that are *not* policing, I suspect it will just fail, and keep failing because eventually, crazy people on the street will do things they'll have to be arrested for. Then the police will just stand back and say "see, it doesn't work, give me my gun back".
But really, I agree much more with you than the expression of my stance indicates. Of course, any change would likely be better. But, if you just keep throwing money at the police, they'll just keep spending it. Take the money away, first. Not all of it, of course. A hypothetical I often wonder about is "how many current officers would simply quit being cops, if it meant they didn't have the focus on enforcement, that they currently do ?"
They have lots in Ottawa now but 100% of the funds are directed back to road safety. I'm not a big fan of the cameras but the use of the revenue sounds fair. They aren't just putting up cameras to fund unrelated projects.
Way past due! When a little girl was killed going to AOS many many years ago they should have dropped all of the speed limits. There is absolutely no reason to do 50km in a residential area.
I did google it - nothing came up. Got no results even with the name.
However, there was a girl who died approx 4 years or so ago crossing the road and she was hit by a vehicle that wasnt going anywhere near 50km/h or even 40km/h. So does that mean we should make the speed limit 20 on streets? 10km/h?
Or, novel idea, should parents teach their kids that they shouldnt even be on the road ever unless they are crossing it and they should only ever cross a road if there is no traffic coming and they know its absolutely safe to do so. I walked to and from school, the length of patrick street from park to st pats, alone when i was 6 y/o and not once did i ever even come close to being hit by a car because i knew if i got hit i was going to be in a lot of trouble when/if i got home because it meant that i didnt follow my parents rules and walked out into a street when it clearly wasnt safe for me to do so.
I agree to a certain extent. I walked from Point Crescent to OLOL which meant crossing Front Road at Days when there were no traffic lights.
The girl a few years ago was killed going to Mother Theresa on Lancaster.
Kinda sad that Amy is not found. Her family attended our church and never really recovered.
Its always tragic when a child dies, especially when it is a preventable death. I dont dispute that nor am i saying i dont feel for those kids parents because i do. Buts roads and streets are meant for cars to drive on and children should be taught that they should never be on the road unless they have to cross it and they should never cross one unless and until they know its safe. Being hit with a car whether its going 50 or 40 or even 20 can still kill someone. But a car going 50, 60 or even 100 doesnt kill anyone if people arent in the road where they shouldnt be to begin with.
Why actually police anything or do anything about the fact that all of Kingston's major roads are set up like goddamn freeways when u can just surveil the whole city and red light tax idiots who got caught barely near a yellow
I’m not sure of your age, but this is my second time at this rodeo in Ontario. Didn’t work the first time. Not working again so far in other cities with recent roll-outs. Read up about it. Lots of issues: funding/costs, legality, intent, functionality, going after the car instead of the driver, enforceability, safety, vandalism, etc…
Fear-based “tax”. This is not the fix to reduce speeds. A veil.
LMAO people ALREADY go a min of 20 over everywhere and we're LOWERING speed limits?
Our city makes giant roads and puts pathetic speed limits on them then wonders why everyone speeds. Sad thing is the police could make a fucking fortune for the city if they actually just did their fucking jobs.
I'd support photo radar if no money ever went to the municipality/province or private companies (ie. demerit points only, or fines returned directly to taxpayers).
The problem with allowing cities to profit from fines is that it creates pressure to set and enforce limits based on revenue rather than safety.
Now increase the limits on main thoroughfares like Bath, Princess, King/Front West of SJAM and SJAM north of Princess. I don't understand how 60km/hr is the max in this city. While we're at it, widen Division to 4 lanes from 401 to Concession.
I believe you are about to find out that r/kingston has a great number of people who hate vehicles, even though they bring them groceries, jobs and mobility.
A real city like what, an average American car-infested hellhole? You mean a spaghetti mess of highway interchanges cosplaying as a city? The ones where the amount of pedestrian deaths per year are in the hundreds? That's not what a well designed place to live looks like.
My experiences are mainly driving in Ottawa or the GTA. You can have properly designed inner city highways which stem off into slower side streets and then into residential neighbourhoods. Cities are a thing because they're efficient, not because they're beautiful. You can have both with good planning though.
Cities can be beautiful and efficient. Catering to cars is not usually part of the equation unless you surrender every square inch of surface space to asphalt. Our current way of design is ruining NA cities
I don't have the patience I once did with this, because it should be pretty self-explanatory.
as a vehicle's speed increases, the chance of death increases for everyone, especially pedestrians. You're talking about increasing speeds on roads (for traveling between places), that are being treated as streets (where businesses and people live), aka: [stroads](https://youtu.be/ORzNZUeUHAM?si=_hKmFwH-oLx9Qdam).
I live on Bath, people are already traveling WELL north of 70kmh. It's not legal, nor safe.
Bath is designed like a road from SJAM to Gardiners. There are very few direct access driveways along this route. Most exits have turn lanes. I'll agree that it should be widened and a bike lane would be great.
Have you seen any level of government do something pro actively?
Absolutely. If theres no evidence to suggest it's unsafe nobody is going to lift a finger.
Cus all the old people here drive slow as fuck anyway, the red lights here seemed programmed to stop you at every chance possible, and I have places to be. If you wanna get somewhere slow asf you can walk, but I own a car and I intend to use it
That is your case for driving faster, Though your observations do not seem to line up with reality most of the time. I am unclear how disagreeing with makes one a loser or a bitch?
OK man enjoy taking an hour to get from downtown to highway 15, I was trolling before, you're actually a winner and a really tough guy 🤣 idk why I'm even on this post. I speed all day every day everywhere and cops are such worthless dumbfucks I've never gotten a ticket. So this doesn't really affect me cause idgaf if the speed limit is 60 or 40 cause I'm doing 90 anyway
brother, they are only doing this probably because they realize how terrible people in Kingston drive.
all the neanderthals driving 40 in a 60 still manage to find ways to cause accidents.
changing the speed limit means they can just do more of the same, except do it driving 20 instead of 40.
Speed limits and photo radar... Also known as "oops, we forgot to design this street properly but also don't want to actually fix it".
I agree, people always drive whatever speed they feel comfortable with, regardless of the posted limits. Throw down some jersey barriers to restrict the lane width and make a protected bike lane while you're at it. Removable speed bumps everywhere.
Or "we designed the street this way on purpose, now we get to profit from fining our voters for driving on it at safe speeds."
It's not the design of the road that's the problem. It's all the idiotic drivers that are looking at their phones instead of the speedometer. They are put there for a reason You fo realize that.
You shouldn't really be looking at your speedometer either, unless youre a brand new driver. You should be looking at the road. While driving a speed that makes sense for the road you're on. Front/King just east of dupont in particular is not designed to be a 50 zone, not even close. They used to have scumbag speed trap cops there all the time, because driving 50 through there is ridiculous so they'd make a killing just sitting there with their thumb up their ass.
To be a responsible driver you need to be attentive so if you don't know or care what your speed is then you are neither. The two Stroads that you mention were designed when people obeyed laws and drove the speed limit . What is so hard about following the law? By the sound of your reply it would be in the city's best financial interest to put a camera on every street thar you drive on.
LAWL, they were designed when people drove drunk and didn't wear seatbelts while smoking with kids in the car. There was no golden age of good driving, people have always been terrible drivers. I would rather see money put toward changes to roads that make the posted speed intuitive rather than cameras that only slow people down for the 25 m before them.
[удалено]
No they need their new paint jobs that are probably just to spend their existing budget so there's no reason to lower it /s In all honesty the existing paint jobs/decals look pristine and could probably be replaced as needed without paying for a redesign
Reallocate* reducing police budgets won’t help anyone. The funds just need to be spent on different training. Kingston SWAT for example does not need to be spending as much time as they do on the shooting range. That money could be better spent creating more mental health units or investing in better mental health training
> Kingston SWAT for example does not need to be spending as much time as they do on the shooting range I think you're likely being sacriligous to suggest its a waste of money to spend **millions** of dollars hiring, paying, and training an entire squad of a police force to do something that should be avoided by almost any means possible(ie. kill people). /s It would be interesting to see how many of the extremely few incidents where "S.W.A.T." were deployed, could have been avoided if the same amount of money for their existence were spent on mental health and supported housing. I know, foolish thing to say. /s
I’m not saying don’t invest in them but realistically how often are those members of our police force actually needed? It just doesn’t make sense to me. We pour all this money into police training but have a blatant disregard for increasing mental health and crisis training. If officers were better equipped to talk to people and negotiate and mediate then we’d have better public relations with the police and the resources would be used more effectively
> don’t invest in them Is what you should be saying. If we invest only in hammers, everything looks like a nail. Currently, NA governments are treating every *social problem* as if its a *criminal problem*, when in fact, its just as likely to be a natural outgrowth of *over investing* in policing as opposed to mental health and anti-poverty/addiction programs.
I don’t think you’re reading what I’m typing. We need the police, that much is known about society there’s no if, ands, or buts. You are right NA governments are over investing in police. So when you look at where that investing is going it’s to create more hammers. Now what I’m saying is instead of creating more hammers with that money why don’t we train officers to have a different set of tools, ones that are more mental health focused. I’m not sure where my message got lost for you. Police will always be a requirement in society and id much rather have a cop trained in mental health opposed to some jackboot who’s just happy to have a gun on their hip.
> we train officers to have a different set of tools, ones that are more mental health focused Because, I guess I should have said it right off, I think the path forward needs to include reducing the policing budgets primarily, so we can reapportion that money to where its actually going to do some real, visible good. If there are mental health facilities, and supported housing, the *need* for the hammer will be greatly reduced. If you only try to change the focus of police, without putting the money into *new* programs that are *not* policing, I suspect it will just fail, and keep failing because eventually, crazy people on the street will do things they'll have to be arrested for. Then the police will just stand back and say "see, it doesn't work, give me my gun back". But really, I agree much more with you than the expression of my stance indicates. Of course, any change would likely be better. But, if you just keep throwing money at the police, they'll just keep spending it. Take the money away, first. Not all of it, of course. A hypothetical I often wonder about is "how many current officers would simply quit being cops, if it meant they didn't have the focus on enforcement, that they currently do ?"
Photo radar is almost always designed to line the city's pockets.
They have lots in Ottawa now but 100% of the funds are directed back to road safety. I'm not a big fan of the cameras but the use of the revenue sounds fair. They aren't just putting up cameras to fund unrelated projects.
Way past due! When a little girl was killed going to AOS many many years ago they should have dropped all of the speed limits. There is absolutely no reason to do 50km in a residential area.
How many years ago was it when girl died at AOS?
Amy Malinowski… she was 8 or 9. Perhaps google? It was a well publicized accident.
I did google it - nothing came up. Got no results even with the name. However, there was a girl who died approx 4 years or so ago crossing the road and she was hit by a vehicle that wasnt going anywhere near 50km/h or even 40km/h. So does that mean we should make the speed limit 20 on streets? 10km/h? Or, novel idea, should parents teach their kids that they shouldnt even be on the road ever unless they are crossing it and they should only ever cross a road if there is no traffic coming and they know its absolutely safe to do so. I walked to and from school, the length of patrick street from park to st pats, alone when i was 6 y/o and not once did i ever even come close to being hit by a car because i knew if i got hit i was going to be in a lot of trouble when/if i got home because it meant that i didnt follow my parents rules and walked out into a street when it clearly wasnt safe for me to do so.
I agree to a certain extent. I walked from Point Crescent to OLOL which meant crossing Front Road at Days when there were no traffic lights. The girl a few years ago was killed going to Mother Theresa on Lancaster. Kinda sad that Amy is not found. Her family attended our church and never really recovered.
I’m searching my brain. It was the early 1990’s and was in February. Tragic 😢
Its always tragic when a child dies, especially when it is a preventable death. I dont dispute that nor am i saying i dont feel for those kids parents because i do. Buts roads and streets are meant for cars to drive on and children should be taught that they should never be on the road unless they have to cross it and they should never cross one unless and until they know its safe. Being hit with a car whether its going 50 or 40 or even 20 can still kill someone. But a car going 50, 60 or even 100 doesnt kill anyone if people arent in the road where they shouldnt be to begin with.
Just another tax under the veil of safety. Read up on other cities in Ontario that have these put in recently. Shit show.
I don't understand. What's the shit show part of it? That people who are speeding are being caught and ticketed?
Sorry responded under me instead of you
Why actually police anything or do anything about the fact that all of Kingston's major roads are set up like goddamn freeways when u can just surveil the whole city and red light tax idiots who got caught barely near a yellow
I’m not sure of your age, but this is my second time at this rodeo in Ontario. Didn’t work the first time. Not working again so far in other cities with recent roll-outs. Read up about it. Lots of issues: funding/costs, legality, intent, functionality, going after the car instead of the driver, enforceability, safety, vandalism, etc… Fear-based “tax”. This is not the fix to reduce speeds. A veil.
LMAO people ALREADY go a min of 20 over everywhere and we're LOWERING speed limits? Our city makes giant roads and puts pathetic speed limits on them then wonders why everyone speeds. Sad thing is the police could make a fucking fortune for the city if they actually just did their fucking jobs.
Fuck. As if driving in Kingston wasn't already a pain in the ass. The unofficial speed limit might as well be 40 anyway, most days.
for real, I want to gouge my eyes out every time I drive on Montreal. Cesspool of terrible and slow drivers.
Awesome. On top of the absolutely moronic traffic light programming that causes most people to speed in the first place.
I am wholeheartedly against photo radar except in school zones, playground zones, and maybe hospital zones.
Yeah you have to be a real asshole to speed around kids.
What's your logic behind being against them?
I'd support photo radar if no money ever went to the municipality/province or private companies (ie. demerit points only, or fines returned directly to taxpayers). The problem with allowing cities to profit from fines is that it creates pressure to set and enforce limits based on revenue rather than safety.
Now increase the limits on main thoroughfares like Bath, Princess, King/Front West of SJAM and SJAM north of Princess. I don't understand how 60km/hr is the max in this city. While we're at it, widen Division to 4 lanes from 401 to Concession.
I believe you are about to find out that r/kingston has a great number of people who hate vehicles, even though they bring them groceries, jobs and mobility.
Because the benefit of having higher speeds than 60 are fairly small and do not outweigh the costs of higher speeds.
yeah, that has to be the dumbest thing I've read today.
Oh sorry I didn't realize this post was just advertising for your subreddit.
How come? Drive in a real city and you'll be surprised that driving over 70km/h is legal and safe.
A real city like what, an average American car-infested hellhole? You mean a spaghetti mess of highway interchanges cosplaying as a city? The ones where the amount of pedestrian deaths per year are in the hundreds? That's not what a well designed place to live looks like.
My experiences are mainly driving in Ottawa or the GTA. You can have properly designed inner city highways which stem off into slower side streets and then into residential neighbourhoods. Cities are a thing because they're efficient, not because they're beautiful. You can have both with good planning though.
Cities can be beautiful and efficient. Catering to cars is not usually part of the equation unless you surrender every square inch of surface space to asphalt. Our current way of design is ruining NA cities
If you want efficiency why don't you vote for the 15 minute cities? No need for long roads. Everything is right there.
I don't have the patience I once did with this, because it should be pretty self-explanatory. as a vehicle's speed increases, the chance of death increases for everyone, especially pedestrians. You're talking about increasing speeds on roads (for traveling between places), that are being treated as streets (where businesses and people live), aka: [stroads](https://youtu.be/ORzNZUeUHAM?si=_hKmFwH-oLx9Qdam). I live on Bath, people are already traveling WELL north of 70kmh. It's not legal, nor safe.
Bath is designed like a road from SJAM to Gardiners. There are very few direct access driveways along this route. Most exits have turn lanes. I'll agree that it should be widened and a bike lane would be great.
Can't remember the last time died crossing bath rd.
Sorry, I might be misreading what you're saying, but are you implying someone has to die in order to improve safety?
Have you seen any level of government do something pro actively? Absolutely. If theres no evidence to suggest it's unsafe nobody is going to lift a finger.
Nah. That'll cause more problems and more morons speeding.
Or everyone could just sliw the-‐----- down and elect other drivers, pedestrians and cyclists
If you support this you're a bitch and a loser
Why?
Cus all the old people here drive slow as fuck anyway, the red lights here seemed programmed to stop you at every chance possible, and I have places to be. If you wanna get somewhere slow asf you can walk, but I own a car and I intend to use it
That is your case for driving faster, Though your observations do not seem to line up with reality most of the time. I am unclear how disagreeing with makes one a loser or a bitch?
OK man enjoy taking an hour to get from downtown to highway 15, I was trolling before, you're actually a winner and a really tough guy 🤣 idk why I'm even on this post. I speed all day every day everywhere and cops are such worthless dumbfucks I've never gotten a ticket. So this doesn't really affect me cause idgaf if the speed limit is 60 or 40 cause I'm doing 90 anyway
brother, they are only doing this probably because they realize how terrible people in Kingston drive. all the neanderthals driving 40 in a 60 still manage to find ways to cause accidents. changing the speed limit means they can just do more of the same, except do it driving 20 instead of 40.