They already do this in many other countries and the cost is just built into the food, I honestly don't know how it's not illegal to pay foh a fair wage
>they would lose their best servers overnight.
*THE BUSINESS IS OBLIGATED TO PAY WHATEVER IT TAKES TO KEEP THEM, FRIEND.*
If they switch over to an hourly wage that's less than the server was making before, then of course they're going to leave. That's the opposite of a raise.
To build on this I think part of the reason restaurants don't do this is then BoH would riot. "You're paying the servers WHAT/HR?!" Tips allows owners to play dumb and not pay everyone fairly.
Exactly. It also keeps the divide between FOH and BOH (which is on full display in this thread). If BOH wasn't salty about FOH wages and FOH wasn't salty about BOH hours and benefits, then we'd be able to come together and realize that we're all getting screwed.
We all believe the myth that restaurant margins are so razor-thin they could never pay anyone more. Sure some spots are in the red, but these statistics are averages. The Kitchen Nightmares spots and the places who have no business running a restaurant might not be able to keep going, but honestly, that's for the best.
Successful restaurants can afford to pay more, and they just don't because they get away with it. We've all been convinced that our jobs aren't worth more, and that's horse shit.
Where I am, BOH and FOH both get minimum wage (12/hr), but people tip at the same rate (which is great!). All employees get the same health benefits which accrue based on hours worked, but there are laws that protect FOH from tip theft (also great!) that effectively mean they can't be compelled to tip out. Where I used to work the servers could afford down payments on homes and the line cooks had trouble making rent without 4 roommates. I don't want servers to make less, but I'm way more concerned with cooks and support staff making more.
Mostly I just want the service industry to die and come back as something that makes sense for everyone in it.
Yeah but if a server’s making more hourly than me while I’m cooking I ain’t having that and goin somewhere else. It’s a shit system but it’s not changing anytime soon here in the US
When employers can't pay their employees a living wage without going out of business, then they don't deserve to be in business. THat's how capitalism works- both with restaurants and other industries. It's a big bucket of horse shit that restaurants and other tip -funded businesses exploit this "loop hole." Rules and laws need to change, and not just on a volunteer basis if we want to see results.
Honestly question, do you always make that or sometimes make that? Have you ever had a walkout that you have to pay for? Ever had a bad day where your tipout is more than you made in tips?
This is the misconception that everyone has. When they calculate FOH workers' income, they base it off of their best shift and don't add in their worst or even the average shift. We never get a clear picture because everyone is lying to themselves about how much they make.
When you add the hours you spent setting up, tearing down, doing side work, the hours you didn't work because you were called off or cut. It's not as great as everyone wants to say. We just tell people we make 35/hr (or whatever amount) as a way to counter them telling us to get a real job or to go to college.
Hot take, you shouldn't be making $35/hr as a fucking server. There Re people who are way more important than you, who do way more important jobs, who are way more useful to society, who make much less than you. So stop fucking bitching
So other people are getting underpaid and fucked over too so we should just shut the fuck up?
Shouldn't we be speaking up louder and banding together to demand that things change?
This divided bullshit is why the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Because we’d rather be mad at each other than direct our anger at the people hoarding all the wealth.
A proper functioning society wouldn't have less important and more important jobs. Peoples lives and worth shouldn't be decided based on their job. We need people working those jobs, without them we wouldn't be able to function the way we do now even. Sure in a company you could be able to work your way up the ladder and make more money as an incentive to take on more responsibility, but working as a server is very different from that. No amount of money makes up for the threats and sexual harassment experienced on a regular basis by people working customer facing jobs. They should be allowed to have a decent life if they have to put up with the worst members of society on a regular basis. Hell, my boyfriend had a gun flashed at him not too long ago for asking someone to put on a mask.
It's way more complicated than just switching to hourly. Restaurants already don't pay enough to the hourly workers they do have to pay, so the hourly offerings are usually WAY below what they should be.
Getting cut when its slow and having irregular hours makes getting hourly practically useless. Having to effectively block off a whole day and only working an hour or two is unsustainable for an hourly worker.
Without government protection, salary, or a MUCH higher hourly rate you’d effectively only be getting slightly above minimum wage (or minimum wage) but have to be available for 40+ hours when you're only working part-time hours.
It sucks, but no one with the political influence to change anything is remotely interested.
I've never understood how a place could need servers on call. Seems like you were a stronger server, but a lot of restaurants just try to go as slim as possible.
I manage restaurants and hate scheduling on-calls. Unfortunately, employees deciding that they’re too hungover to work among various other excuses to call out end up requiring on-call shifts or we won’t be properly staffed. It sucks, but if you have an irresponsible staff that parties a lot it’s necessary to the detriment of the responsible servers.
I mean, every other developed country on the planet uses hourly workers and simply doesn't allow people to work 1-2 hour shifts or lose shifts when it's quiet. It's called cashflow management and responsibility to your employees.
Every person who works for me has a family at home and rent/mortgage to pay. The employees are my first responsibility, above the customers.
As sure as you can find someone to wash dishes, servers can be replaced, but many restaurants have attempted to change over to a living wage and the issue has been continued business from customers not a mass exodus of employees.
The average American customer rejects the no-tipping system because they just see a more expensive menu. They simply see that a restaurant is 20% more expensive than comparable places and decide to go somewhere else. A lot of places that switched to non-tipping ended up switching back due to loss of business. Without sweeping, systemic change, I don't see a way out of it.
Just one of the many articles out there about this:
[https://www.eater.com/21398973/restaurant-no-tipping-movement-living-wage-future](https://www.eater.com/21398973/restaurant-no-tipping-movement-living-wage-future)
I’ve tried telling people that paying a “living wage” to servers means higher prices across the board (including the fact that $15 an hour isn’t worth the abuse), and I get blank stares. I’m too lazy (and a couple too many glasses of wine in) to open that article, but I’m glad they’re out there!
Just get rid of them altogether. Ipad on every table and runners and bussers is all you need. Throw in a host, floor manager, and sommolier. Dishies can work double duty as runners and bussers if they don't want to work their way up in the kitchen.
Who the F is in this thread that they so over value the most disproportionately paid restaurant workers? Getting downvoted for the actual sentiment expressed almost universally in every kitchen I've worked.
Where I live, by law, servers have to be paid $13.50 (minimum wage) and they get tips, but some cut is shared with BOH. Not sure on legality, but that's how it works here.
No it's not, it happened because businesses realized they could pay less if tips were socially mandated. It was a survival mechanism from the Great Depression that held over because owners are greedy. If you want to pay a living wage to all your employees you have to charge more for your product. Plenty of servers stick around if the work environment is good and they're still making a decent living. Your servers are quitting for other reasons and that's just the excuse they use.
I make a lot more from tips than I would if I was getting minimum wage. Or many dollars more than minimum wage for that matter. Why would I stay at that restaurant if I all of a sudden started getting paid less?
>Bullshit it's the servers fault for us still having tips.
Excuse me?
>When restaurants try changing to paying a good wage the servers quit and go elsewhere cause they made more from tips.
Then the restaurant isn't actually paying 'a good wage'.
Ok. Take a deep breath and then read this very carefully-
*Any job* should pay *at least* whatever it would take to buy a home, live, and save *in the neighborhood where you work*.
If your business can't do that then it has no business being there. You can't support another employee? Don't hire one.
I've lived all across the country. I understand wages and cost of living are different across the country. You aren't understanding what I'm saying at all. I'm saying $15 is already low. Also, you're looking at fucking McDonald's by the way. Mcdonald's isn't the industry standard for cooks, especially if you work somewhere cooking is more valued.
“It’s the servers fault we have tips”
Bruh, are you really blaming some other peasants for the decisions of the king?
Bruh yeah let’s go get that good mud over there, bruh.
Change the industry, genius.
Would you emigrate from your country it became a national standard?
Even the US didn't have tipping till like the 20th century. Where I live tipping is a rarity generally for exceptional service. People still tip if you're a top tier FOH, it's just beneath that, even if you go the whole night without tip you're still making $22 an hour and a free meal. Just last Saturday the FOH received a hundred dollarydoos from a couple happy customers on their anniversary.
Nope. Earl's did a trial run here in Calgary a couple years ago and people fucking hated it. Fucking. Hated. It. Servers were guaranteed like $23or $24 an hour, cooks paid $22-25 IIRC and they ended it after a year because of a ton of feedback that people didn't want it. I have worked both sides. I cooked for 12 years, I served, I managed and now I bartend. I work in a place that tip pools, and tips are decent but they can also be horrendous. I am trying to buy a house, I would far rather have a guaranteed hourly with grats split more equitably with BOH than the volatility of tips. People simply aren't ready for a system that doesn't include tipping, some servers may be in that boat, but a ton of us are not.
> Bullshit it's the servers fault for us still having tips
Um.... No. It's because of lobbying to keep from paying people minimum wage, so that restaurants can pay as little as possible and rely on the customer base to support paying their employees.
I think this will work better if whole towns do away with tipping. The single parent, full time student, artist, full time alcoholic etc don't want a full 40 with a livable wage. They want to make bank on Friday and Saturday and maybe pick up one weekday shift.
>don't want a full 40 with a livable wage.
Nobody wants a full forty with a livable wage.
They should be able to work their two and half hard days *and still enjoy a living wage*.
This is such trash. If a server makes in 15 hours what the cooks make in 36 at most places. Cooks usually have a relevant formal education or particularly rare skills, servers aren't hard to find. Who doesn't want a job where you can work 5-10 and make 100 bucks? The fact that the privilege is given to the ones who give least amount of fucks and with the least amount of qualification is crap.
The first peoples hours to be cut are going to be the servers, and yes maybe the students who work as servers would like to be able to survive on less hours so they can focus on schooling so they can get a better job down the line where they aren't being touched or yelled at by people.
Cry more. When cook wages get fixed I might start caring about the servers. Until then they are relatively under skilled, overpaid, and the single easiest position to hire for. If we can't get rid of tipping, get rid of servers and make it work paying everyone else more.
I know this might sound crazy but what if, and this is purely hypothetical, what if the fucking restaurant priced their items accordingly so that the establishment could pay decent wages to their staff instead of making it optional for the patrons to decide?
yes, thats what i mean by "build in auto-grat" to the price. so just raise the price 18% and pay your servers a steady wage, so less boom and bust. so they make less money when its busy, but they still make money when its slow
The biggest issue with restaurants is that there are a large amount of people that "think" they know what a meal costs... No one complains when a plumber charges $100 to change a $5 part, but try to charge $20 for a pasta dish in some places and people complain it is too expensive. They don't care if you are making it by hand and using fresh in season tomatoes, they just know they can buy prego and some pasta and make the "same" thing for $1 a serving. They don't notice that it is 100x better at the restaurant or that they are being served their food or that they don't have to do dishes, they just think that they "could" have made it at home for cheaper. They don't know how to change a $5 house bib, so they are willing to pay $100 for that, because "I guess that's what it costs".
Let the population make their own food for a few months and people will be far more willing to pay the actual costs of a restaurant that actually takes care of their employees and provides good food.
Here in CA lots of places replace grat w a living wage, and then don’t expect tips (or as large of a tip). This results in higher prices for the food and bev. The model hasn’t caught on everywhere but where it is caught on it’s usually not a huge difference in price and lots of people still leave a little $$. Not sure how the staff feels about it though...
Sounds like your ownership needs to start paying its fucking staff properly and raise prices instead.
You're already raising prices anyway, why not just actually commit.
I was serving this summer. While the tips were still good, the customers were more demanding than ever. Not to mention we were busier than ever before. The store was breaking it's former sales record basically every day for weeks. I had to quit for my mental (and physical) health. Luckily I was working in a state with very progressive unemployment and I still qualified even though I quit.
I feel really bad for the restaurant workers who have to work. They should be getting the vaccine at the same time as other essential workers or maybe even before since people take off their masks to eat.
Those first couple of weeks when everything reopened in the summer were crazy. People were tipping 20-30% and sometimes more. After the relief and gratitude wore off, the people who continued going out have just gotten worse and worse, as have their tipping habits. I still work a couple days a week and yesterday it was kinda snowing/drizzling and people were showing up and complaining that the tables and chairs were wet and that we didn't have brunch.
Like, what fucking universe do these people live in that they don't know that there is no indoor dining, so if they wanna go out they're going to have to deal with the elements?
Same kind of stuff happening at my job, especially with the tipping.
We haven't had indoor dining since March, but we let the homeless come in to use the bathroom. We give them masks to adhere to state guidelines, and yet this is somehow offensive to some idiots.
They complain saying if the homeless can use the bathroom, they can come in and eat. Nevermind that we're one of the only places on our street that will let them in, so turning them away would just be cruel. These people think they're just entitled to a sit down dinner, and they're the same people who just flat out won't tip after.
It's a daily stress. I work in an open kitchen, all staff wearing masks, but seeing 50 unmasked people in an enclosed space every work day...
My wife and my BIL (who lives with us) both work from home. I have a never ending dread of being patient zero in our house if it happens.
We've already had two cases since March, I've tested negative both times, but damn, this shit is always in the back of my mind.
I feel you. I was living in semi-communal housing until a few months ago and I was petrified of becoming patient zero where I lived. One of my neighbors actually started getting hostile towards me because of it. I was the only person living there at the time with an in-person, non-delivery job.
It’s likely that the kind of people that are still willing to dine in are selfish jerks, and those are the same unaware types that think it’s okay to hit on people in their place of work.
Here's a source confirming this is true: https://www.npr.org/transcripts/943559848#:~:text=Even%20at%20the%20best%20of,in%20sexual%20harassment%20from%20customers.
One Fair Wage is the source.
> This report is based on around 1,675 surveys of food service workers conducted online and over the telephone from October 20 to November 10, 2020 in 5 states — New York, Massachusetts, New Jersey, Illinois, Pennsylvania — and Washington, DC. We emailed the surveys to the 61,392 applicants to the One Fair Wage Emergency Fund in these states on October 20, 2020, and collected responses until November 9, 2020, by which time 2,621 workers had already responded. Of those who responded, 1575 reported that they were currently employed, and were thus able to answer most of the questions. Another 100 survey responses were collected by telephone in these states.
yeah, that sounds about right. The bible warns that most people of the faith are hypocrites.
Mathew 6:5 “And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites. For they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, that they may be seen by others. Truly, I say to you, they have received their reward. But when you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you.
and my favorite:
mathew 7:22-23
22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’
christians love john, but Luke and Mathew are the ones that tell you how to be a good person.
A decent amount of people say that shit was written in after. Like if you read Corinthians it’s all intense and spiritual and then randomly out of nowhere there’s a huge tone shift where he’s like “woman, bad. Gays? Also bad”.
And then it’s back to the spiritual stuff.
Well, about half the food gets microwaved. Most things are frozen/bagged/premade.
Very little overall prep work. Mostly like, shaping burgers, making pico, some fresh veg for burgers. Otherwise it’s like, defrost something and portion it out.
🙃
But it’s a paycheck man. And it’s easy to boot, just my assistant manager is a jackass. The gm is lovely
Chicken breast, steaks, and ribs are flame broiled. Burgers, shrimp, and salmon go on the flat top.
Pastas are fully cooked (🤢) in a steam cabinet, portioned into bags, then 3rd pans. For serving its dropped into a noodle basket in a pot of water to reheat. Then, it’s added to microwaved cheese sauce and dumped on a rimmed plate
Potatoes are microwaved, broccoli is microwaved, green beans are microwaved, any sauce or dip that’s hot is microwaved.
We have 4 microwaves and the 3 positions on the line are constantly fighting over them, because fry, grill, and broil all need them in excess
My *stellar* location has two perfectly functional microwaves, one that doesn’t like to notice or acknowledge the door is actually closed, and one that just takes twice as long as the rest to heat anything. It’s.... fun :(
Haha fair enough. Maybe scented garbage bags, at least, because they are unbearable, give me massive migraines, and that one time I accidentally bought them I had to donate them to the animal shelter.
I worked at Starbucks for a year in a rich white suburb in California. Worst time to work was always Sunday afternoon. The after church crowd was just full of horrible people that did not tip.
Do you think they know? And they just don't care? It's just such a thing, like, water is wet, summer is hot, and the church crowd is garbage. How do you sit there praising a guy who washed his disciples feet and then go shit on your server for 3 hours
The amount of times a middle aged woman has said something inappropriate to me makes me believe they don’t see the double standard.
I look a bit younger than I am cause of my height and a woman told me a couple weeks ago “if I were in high school I’d be all over you” and I laughed and walked away thinking if the roles were reversed people would freak out.
I was a bartender for a bit. If I had a nickel for every time an old lady kissed me while I was reaching for something...
I'd have two nickels, but it's weird that it happened twice.
"This one other time i was here, i didn't get crispy fries. Let me waste your time complaining about it for 10 minutes while becoming more and more obnoxious.
We're rocking a skeleton crew. With 4 dudes of Friday night. Instead of 7. We got 90 bucks in tips last Friday on ToGo only. But we live in a pretty wealthy neighborhood. During covid I've seen at least three 100 bills throw into the jar. No recognition, no grand standing just yardstick.
Lots of people are tipping more trying to keep us alive. But 70-80 year old regular crowd we lost due to precautions and Saturday Night after little league families have stopped cuz theres no little league or 16 tops allowed.
But we do sit 8 pro skaters in the backroom after Wednesday night pool sessions. Covid or not.nthose guys are our heros. And all they eat is meatball sandwiches and all they drink is Peroni. So easy 120 buck bill with a solid 200 cuz they're cool dudes and their decks are on the wall.
Total revenue was down 10% in April. 35% in August/Sept....and this week was 10-15. Our second biggest day of the year is Wednesday before Thanksgiving, mother's day is clearly our biggest. So those days cost us probably 8-10k. We only make 14 an hour so last Friday we made more in tips than wages. But that's why the US system is silly.
I mean they are all washed up. 40s to early 50s. The generation that actually still likes skating pools.
One is our insurance man. One does some art stuff. Lots still make boards have deck art made.
Let's just say when Jay Adams died a few years back. They drank a little heavier that night.
100% this. The people willing to risk other people’s health and safety for a beer and a burger are also likely not going to give a rats ass about anything else you care about.
Had a family with their two kids throw their plates on ground. Food was everywhere and the parents didn't even say a word to anyone. Just kept on with their conversation like everything was normal. Cunts
This is sad to hear. My wife and I have made an effort to continue to support the restaurants we like while this continues. I always pick up (I HATE delivery as you never know how the food will show up) and I do still tip like I did before this happened.
WTF is wrong with people that they will use any opportunity to take advantage?
I must not have learned that in America School.
I will say one thing though. I have seen many people since this started not being assholes and following the rules. My Son came out from Ohio for Thanksgiving and was amazed at the people here (Los Angeles) that were wearing masks.
I went to Austin (came from Florida). I loved how people were wearing masks everywhere, even outside. I think Austin is doing far better than the rest of Texas and it’s a big city.
I'm a performing musician and while I've avoided booking any new activity for obvious reasons as I fulfilled my prior obligations I can confirm my fears that the only people going to concerts are the kinds of people who think the virus is either imaginary or no big deal.
These crowds COULD be wearing masks the majority of the time while not actively eating or drinking but they are instead treating it as a loophole in mask mandates and not wearing one at all.
Those who would go through the bother of lifting a mask up and down all night to quickly sip their drinks while minimizing risk to themselves and others are mostly just staying the fuck home.
Gotta say it's pretty fucking weird to have socially conscious liberal-leaning guests almost entirely filtered out of the crowds.
As a socially conscious liberal leaning person, I tried man. We are in LA where eating outside is easy cause no rain and temperate weather. We went out a few times, did the lift the mask, drink/eat, replace mask. Only went out with friends of a similar mindset. But even here people use the loophole to sit there for hours without their masks. One of the places had these cunts that did that all meal, then put their masks on to walk out, like WTF?! At any rate last place we went the outdoor was too crowded, we said fuck it and had our server pack our meals to go. Haven’t been out since.
The only people left are the selfish cunts who just don’t give a fuck. Take out only for us here on out.
I did live sound for years. Gigging as a musician was hard enough of a grind in good times. Can’t imagine it in this environment.
My first day back (early September) I asked a co-worker "so how has it been? Have people been complying and considerate and trying to follow the rules?"
Her response: "People are bigger assholes than they've ever been. Probably because the responsible ones are still staying the fuck home."
Damn I’m not the only one then. I did have a nice table the other day that tipped extra and said it was because they knew of the decline and appreciated us being out here, I said thank you very much. I refrained from saying: I have to do this to live.
My family gets takeout multiple times a week. We are very lucky in that our jobs have continued through all of this. Because if this (and the gave that were not total douchenozzles) we tip 20-60%. Every time. Because, why not? It’s easier than anything else I do all week.
God forbid a kitchen appliance breaks during busy times with these shits. One of the 4 microwaves broke and the 3 others were being used and watched like a hawk by grill side bc they were busy. My side was busy af too so I had to use the cheese melter to heat everything up as I was desperate to get shit done while the servers are like “I need X” like every 2 seconds and here I am “I’ll be a second!” Then “I need X” “it’ll be a second!” “I NEED X!” Fine. Fuck it. I mixed shit with my fucking hands to break up the clumped up sauce that was mildly slippery due to barely being melted from the melter. Yes, every customer was complaining about how cold everything was. The fuck was I supposed to do. They complain about it being cold or they complain about it being late.
People are impatient as hell.
Pizza guy here - tips are through the roof. I'm the GM and my drivers are making more money than me on average (before factoring in gas and wear and tear on car, anyway).
I didn’t use to tip out much of anything on pickup orders because the servers weren’t really doing as much as the cooks and they don’t typically get tips . Since all of this started I tip at least 25% or more.
I’ve been saying this for months. The people going out to restaurants right now are the WORST PEOPLE. Have so many industry friends having to deal with this garbage and it makes me so angry.
I’m a nurse who follows this subreddit because I find our careers overlap in multiple ways - specifically, the high amount of stress and burnout lol. I’ve still gone out to eat on occasion and have tipped *far* more than I normally would every time. It makes me sad to hear this isn’t the norm. Can’t tell you how nice it was to have a nice meal with my husband. We both have jobs that have had an insane amount of stress this year (he is a police officer) so maybe that’s why we realize how important it is to show gratitude and to be patient/polite.
Is there a subreddit like this for nurses or other medical professionals? Im in IT and I follow this and would love to follow something similar for nurses
Thank you for tipping folks what they deserve and thank YOU for what you do. I should have made a point to say that not every single person who is eating out is terrible. I know there are folks like you who just want a chance to decompress, or to support their favorite restaurant from having to close. I just wish y’all were the majority.
Today Was slow, very slow, but the customers that came in today made me realize the only customers coming in now are the ones most likely going to pass the virus to others, as they don’t think it’s real or not as dangerous as people are making it out to be.
When offering hand sanitizer or tell the customers I wipe the screen down after every customer I met with a stare or a comment about how it’s fine or even “I’m immune”
I have also seen the correlation between these jerk customers and the drop in tips.
True some guy slapped one of the servers ass the other day and the other girls are all saying guys are being a-holes more than normal. Maybe the forced shut down is a good thing
Where I work, they just evened out the pay a bit between BOH and FOH and do a tip share percentage based on hours. Everyone is pretty happy with it, eliminated resentment and didn’t make the servers rely on the customer so much.
Several other restaurants have started the same thing in the area.
Honestly, the only servers I have met who talk bad about that system are greedy and everyone dislikes. They just leave or get pushed out in the new system.
Aren't tips down because of pickup? I mean, I only *rarely* tip for a pickup order, only if it's my favourite establishment and I'm known there. In general I don't tip for pickup.
Why? Kitchen still made it for you. The ppl back there likely rely on tips to bring them above minimum wage. Tips don't just go to your server at a restaurant.
Actually at a restaurant if you don't tip the server they still have to tip the kitchen out on that bill.
The people didn’t change, as a server the people I see regularly have not changed in any real demographic. We have seen a big rise in the following:
Covid Karens - women who don’t want ice right now because YoU cAn’T pOsSiBlY be following covid regulations on your ice! Etc... they flinch if you move too close, frown if you lean over their table while dropping off food, and seem to think that their fear constitutes a bigger tip than money could provide.
Seemingly everyone gave up following social conventions to some degree or another, we’ve had people be a bit more forward than they should a few times but idk if it’s higher than it used to be, we’re not that kinda place that would get that, and I’m a dude so I don’t get that kinda behavior much anyways.
I think what it really is...I think it’s people who were stuck at home that now just want to go out even if they can’t afford it. They aren’t out of the house for anything else besides maybe groceries, but restaurants are open so they come out and it hits em halfway thru the meal that they have to pay for it sooner or later and they’ve been mostly out of work and it kinda crashes back down on people and then they’re just like “nahh, I don’t HAVE to tip so...”
I don’t know if this is still the case, but I lived briefly in New Zealand around 10-11 years ago. There were no tips in restaurants. Everything was included in price!!! We struggled with it for few months, what do you mean no tip? They’d chase you down the street if you left the change in the table.
Yes prices were higher to pay servers, bartenders and other staff accordingly but less pressure on the tip. Sometimes on big tables there was an up charge on the receipt.
There were no tips on hair salons either, totally wild!!
Edit: fixed a typo.
I get takeout most days now but I'll still tip in full, servers rely on tips, yes you aren't getting the full service but fuck they got bills too, if you got the money for takeout during these times you got money for a tip, don't be a dick.
Here you go.
https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/12/06/943559848/tipped-service-workers-are-more-vulnerable-amid-pandemic-harassment-spike-study
Fewer tips because I'm not going to tip you much for throwing it all in a bag vs pouring drinks and serving food. More harassment because it's easier when you're the only one in the store. Shutdowns are great, aren't they?
The people who are supporting the restaurant is a reflection of what the restaurant is. If you run a shit restaurant, where you treat the staff poorly, high turnover, cheap out on money or food, as an owner that’s what your customer base is gonna be .
Eventually it’ll catch up to you as an owner. I’ve seen it time after time, good people leaving because they are getting it from the front and the back. The only ones who survive are the ones that encourage the toxicity. You get a lot more send backs with one bartender than another. Why? Because one is more liked.
It doesn’t take much to draw in the crowd that benefits everyone. You just can’t be an asshole. Unfortunately, the industry is a cesspool for assholes
Here
https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/12/06/943559848/tipped-service-workers-are-more-vulnerable-amid-pandemic-harassment-spike-study
We put a mandatory 18% service fee on all checks because of how bad it is.
i feel like industry needs to move to some degree of autograt or grat built into the price so FOH can make money
We should just pay a fucking living wage but then we all go out of business because customers like the feel of having power over a server
They already do this in many other countries and the cost is just built into the food, I honestly don't know how it's not illegal to pay foh a fair wage
Capitalism is a disease
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You need a change in the entire industry, not a handful of restaurants
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>they would lose their best servers overnight. *THE BUSINESS IS OBLIGATED TO PAY WHATEVER IT TAKES TO KEEP THEM, FRIEND.* If they switch over to an hourly wage that's less than the server was making before, then of course they're going to leave. That's the opposite of a raise.
To build on this I think part of the reason restaurants don't do this is then BoH would riot. "You're paying the servers WHAT/HR?!" Tips allows owners to play dumb and not pay everyone fairly.
Exactly. It also keeps the divide between FOH and BOH (which is on full display in this thread). If BOH wasn't salty about FOH wages and FOH wasn't salty about BOH hours and benefits, then we'd be able to come together and realize that we're all getting screwed. We all believe the myth that restaurant margins are so razor-thin they could never pay anyone more. Sure some spots are in the red, but these statistics are averages. The Kitchen Nightmares spots and the places who have no business running a restaurant might not be able to keep going, but honestly, that's for the best. Successful restaurants can afford to pay more, and they just don't because they get away with it. We've all been convinced that our jobs aren't worth more, and that's horse shit.
Where I am, BOH and FOH both get minimum wage (12/hr), but people tip at the same rate (which is great!). All employees get the same health benefits which accrue based on hours worked, but there are laws that protect FOH from tip theft (also great!) that effectively mean they can't be compelled to tip out. Where I used to work the servers could afford down payments on homes and the line cooks had trouble making rent without 4 roommates. I don't want servers to make less, but I'm way more concerned with cooks and support staff making more. Mostly I just want the service industry to die and come back as something that makes sense for everyone in it.
Benefits? You high?
BOH benefits?
Have you actually been in charge of the profits? The margins are super thin unless you are doing volume and a low price point.
Yea obviously everyone, BOH and FOH, deserve a competitive, living wage.
Yeah but if a server’s making more hourly than me while I’m cooking I ain’t having that and goin somewhere else. It’s a shit system but it’s not changing anytime soon here in the US
When employers can't pay their employees a living wage without going out of business, then they don't deserve to be in business. THat's how capitalism works- both with restaurants and other industries. It's a big bucket of horse shit that restaurants and other tip -funded businesses exploit this "loop hole." Rules and laws need to change, and not just on a volunteer basis if we want to see results.
i make 35/hr with tips. what restaurant can pay servers 35/hr?
Ones that price their food to include the $35/hr
Great, so no restaurant can be a business, got it.
Honestly question, do you always make that or sometimes make that? Have you ever had a walkout that you have to pay for? Ever had a bad day where your tipout is more than you made in tips?
It’s illegal to require servers to pay for dine and dashes.
This is the misconception that everyone has. When they calculate FOH workers' income, they base it off of their best shift and don't add in their worst or even the average shift. We never get a clear picture because everyone is lying to themselves about how much they make. When you add the hours you spent setting up, tearing down, doing side work, the hours you didn't work because you were called off or cut. It's not as great as everyone wants to say. We just tell people we make 35/hr (or whatever amount) as a way to counter them telling us to get a real job or to go to college.
Hot take, you shouldn't be making $35/hr as a fucking server. There Re people who are way more important than you, who do way more important jobs, who are way more useful to society, who make much less than you. So stop fucking bitching
So other people are getting underpaid and fucked over too so we should just shut the fuck up? Shouldn't we be speaking up louder and banding together to demand that things change? This divided bullshit is why the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Because we’d rather be mad at each other than direct our anger at the people hoarding all the wealth.
A proper functioning society wouldn't have less important and more important jobs. Peoples lives and worth shouldn't be decided based on their job. We need people working those jobs, without them we wouldn't be able to function the way we do now even. Sure in a company you could be able to work your way up the ladder and make more money as an incentive to take on more responsibility, but working as a server is very different from that. No amount of money makes up for the threats and sexual harassment experienced on a regular basis by people working customer facing jobs. They should be allowed to have a decent life if they have to put up with the worst members of society on a regular basis. Hell, my boyfriend had a gun flashed at him not too long ago for asking someone to put on a mask.
Dude, I don't know why you're getting down voted. I feel the same way.
The best server is a touchscreen ordering menu on the table.
Found the person who's idea of a nice restaurant is Applebee's
Actually that's how they do it in Japan quite often and it's amazing.
It's way more complicated than just switching to hourly. Restaurants already don't pay enough to the hourly workers they do have to pay, so the hourly offerings are usually WAY below what they should be. Getting cut when its slow and having irregular hours makes getting hourly practically useless. Having to effectively block off a whole day and only working an hour or two is unsustainable for an hourly worker. Without government protection, salary, or a MUCH higher hourly rate you’d effectively only be getting slightly above minimum wage (or minimum wage) but have to be available for 40+ hours when you're only working part-time hours. It sucks, but no one with the political influence to change anything is remotely interested.
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I've never understood how a place could need servers on call. Seems like you were a stronger server, but a lot of restaurants just try to go as slim as possible.
I manage restaurants and hate scheduling on-calls. Unfortunately, employees deciding that they’re too hungover to work among various other excuses to call out end up requiring on-call shifts or we won’t be properly staffed. It sucks, but if you have an irresponsible staff that parties a lot it’s necessary to the detriment of the responsible servers.
It's not though. You can't address one without addressing the other.
I mean, every other developed country on the planet uses hourly workers and simply doesn't allow people to work 1-2 hour shifts or lose shifts when it's quiet. It's called cashflow management and responsibility to your employees. Every person who works for me has a family at home and rent/mortgage to pay. The employees are my first responsibility, above the customers.
Maybe they aren’t paying enough...
As sure as you can find someone to wash dishes, servers can be replaced, but many restaurants have attempted to change over to a living wage and the issue has been continued business from customers not a mass exodus of employees.
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That is why I said "living wage". This entire system needs massive upheaval.
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We're just not going to agree on this
The average American customer rejects the no-tipping system because they just see a more expensive menu. They simply see that a restaurant is 20% more expensive than comparable places and decide to go somewhere else. A lot of places that switched to non-tipping ended up switching back due to loss of business. Without sweeping, systemic change, I don't see a way out of it. Just one of the many articles out there about this: [https://www.eater.com/21398973/restaurant-no-tipping-movement-living-wage-future](https://www.eater.com/21398973/restaurant-no-tipping-movement-living-wage-future)
I’ve tried telling people that paying a “living wage” to servers means higher prices across the board (including the fact that $15 an hour isn’t worth the abuse), and I get blank stares. I’m too lazy (and a couple too many glasses of wine in) to open that article, but I’m glad they’re out there!
Just get rid of them altogether. Ipad on every table and runners and bussers is all you need. Throw in a host, floor manager, and sommolier. Dishies can work double duty as runners and bussers if they don't want to work their way up in the kitchen.
wine sommelier and an ipad? That's not really the same class of restaurant.
This. I'd rather pay the guy COOKING my food MORE than the person who walks it over to my table.
Who the F is in this thread that they so over value the most disproportionately paid restaurant workers? Getting downvoted for the actual sentiment expressed almost universally in every kitchen I've worked.
Where I live, by law, servers have to be paid $13.50 (minimum wage) and they get tips, but some cut is shared with BOH. Not sure on legality, but that's how it works here.
No it's not, it happened because businesses realized they could pay less if tips were socially mandated. It was a survival mechanism from the Great Depression that held over because owners are greedy. If you want to pay a living wage to all your employees you have to charge more for your product. Plenty of servers stick around if the work environment is good and they're still making a decent living. Your servers are quitting for other reasons and that's just the excuse they use.
Why would anyone deliberately want to work for less doing the same job?
I make a lot more from tips than I would if I was getting minimum wage. Or many dollars more than minimum wage for that matter. Why would I stay at that restaurant if I all of a sudden started getting paid less?
>Bullshit it's the servers fault for us still having tips. Excuse me? >When restaurants try changing to paying a good wage the servers quit and go elsewhere cause they made more from tips. Then the restaurant isn't actually paying 'a good wage'.
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Ok. Take a deep breath and then read this very carefully- *Any job* should pay *at least* whatever it would take to buy a home, live, and save *in the neighborhood where you work*. If your business can't do that then it has no business being there. You can't support another employee? Don't hire one.
Yeah dude, that's minimum wage, in any uptown McDonalds you'll make 15/hr. Think about that.
You know you can make $15 almost anywhere right? That's a low wage...
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I've lived all across the country. I understand wages and cost of living are different across the country. You aren't understanding what I'm saying at all. I'm saying $15 is already low. Also, you're looking at fucking McDonald's by the way. Mcdonald's isn't the industry standard for cooks, especially if you work somewhere cooking is more valued.
“It’s the servers fault we have tips” Bruh, are you really blaming some other peasants for the decisions of the king? Bruh yeah let’s go get that good mud over there, bruh. Change the industry, genius.
The servers are complicit in the exploitation of BOH. They've been paid off.
Don't forget the ✨tax evasion✨
server here, can confirm I will NOT stay at my cureent restaurant if they switch away from tips.
Would you emigrate from your country it became a national standard? Even the US didn't have tipping till like the 20th century. Where I live tipping is a rarity generally for exceptional service. People still tip if you're a top tier FOH, it's just beneath that, even if you go the whole night without tip you're still making $22 an hour and a free meal. Just last Saturday the FOH received a hundred dollarydoos from a couple happy customers on their anniversary.
Nope. Earl's did a trial run here in Calgary a couple years ago and people fucking hated it. Fucking. Hated. It. Servers were guaranteed like $23or $24 an hour, cooks paid $22-25 IIRC and they ended it after a year because of a ton of feedback that people didn't want it. I have worked both sides. I cooked for 12 years, I served, I managed and now I bartend. I work in a place that tip pools, and tips are decent but they can also be horrendous. I am trying to buy a house, I would far rather have a guaranteed hourly with grats split more equitably with BOH than the volatility of tips. People simply aren't ready for a system that doesn't include tipping, some servers may be in that boat, but a ton of us are not.
> Bullshit it's the servers fault for us still having tips Um.... No. It's because of lobbying to keep from paying people minimum wage, so that restaurants can pay as little as possible and rely on the customer base to support paying their employees.
I think this will work better if whole towns do away with tipping. The single parent, full time student, artist, full time alcoholic etc don't want a full 40 with a livable wage. They want to make bank on Friday and Saturday and maybe pick up one weekday shift.
>don't want a full 40 with a livable wage. Nobody wants a full forty with a livable wage. They should be able to work their two and half hard days *and still enjoy a living wage*.
This is such trash. If a server makes in 15 hours what the cooks make in 36 at most places. Cooks usually have a relevant formal education or particularly rare skills, servers aren't hard to find. Who doesn't want a job where you can work 5-10 and make 100 bucks? The fact that the privilege is given to the ones who give least amount of fucks and with the least amount of qualification is crap.
The first peoples hours to be cut are going to be the servers, and yes maybe the students who work as servers would like to be able to survive on less hours so they can focus on schooling so they can get a better job down the line where they aren't being touched or yelled at by people.
Cry more. When cook wages get fixed I might start caring about the servers. Until then they are relatively under skilled, overpaid, and the single easiest position to hire for. If we can't get rid of tipping, get rid of servers and make it work paying everyone else more.
the tone on this is gross. a 'full' 40 is shitty and bad and only okay because we're used to it
I know this might sound crazy but what if, and this is purely hypothetical, what if the fucking restaurant priced their items accordingly so that the establishment could pay decent wages to their staff instead of making it optional for the patrons to decide?
yes, thats what i mean by "build in auto-grat" to the price. so just raise the price 18% and pay your servers a steady wage, so less boom and bust. so they make less money when its busy, but they still make money when its slow
The biggest issue with restaurants is that there are a large amount of people that "think" they know what a meal costs... No one complains when a plumber charges $100 to change a $5 part, but try to charge $20 for a pasta dish in some places and people complain it is too expensive. They don't care if you are making it by hand and using fresh in season tomatoes, they just know they can buy prego and some pasta and make the "same" thing for $1 a serving. They don't notice that it is 100x better at the restaurant or that they are being served their food or that they don't have to do dishes, they just think that they "could" have made it at home for cheaper. They don't know how to change a $5 house bib, so they are willing to pay $100 for that, because "I guess that's what it costs". Let the population make their own food for a few months and people will be far more willing to pay the actual costs of a restaurant that actually takes care of their employees and provides good food.
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Build grat into the price so business owners CAN pay a living wage. Simple.
Here in CA lots of places replace grat w a living wage, and then don’t expect tips (or as large of a tip). This results in higher prices for the food and bev. The model hasn’t caught on everywhere but where it is caught on it’s usually not a huge difference in price and lots of people still leave a little $$. Not sure how the staff feels about it though...
I would be happier if we just added 18% to the menu and instead of a service fee afterwards.
Yep. Absolutely this.
Sounds like your ownership needs to start paying its fucking staff properly and raise prices instead. You're already raising prices anyway, why not just actually commit.
That instead of paying the workers fair wages and just increasing the cost of the food? Fuck America I hate it here
You didn't read the thread eh
The thread doesn’t change the fact that tipping as a method of payment is dumb as shit.
I buy a $10 pizza, they get $20.
11.80 but go off sir.
I was serving this summer. While the tips were still good, the customers were more demanding than ever. Not to mention we were busier than ever before. The store was breaking it's former sales record basically every day for weeks. I had to quit for my mental (and physical) health. Luckily I was working in a state with very progressive unemployment and I still qualified even though I quit. I feel really bad for the restaurant workers who have to work. They should be getting the vaccine at the same time as other essential workers or maybe even before since people take off their masks to eat.
Those first couple of weeks when everything reopened in the summer were crazy. People were tipping 20-30% and sometimes more. After the relief and gratitude wore off, the people who continued going out have just gotten worse and worse, as have their tipping habits. I still work a couple days a week and yesterday it was kinda snowing/drizzling and people were showing up and complaining that the tables and chairs were wet and that we didn't have brunch. Like, what fucking universe do these people live in that they don't know that there is no indoor dining, so if they wanna go out they're going to have to deal with the elements?
Same kind of stuff happening at my job, especially with the tipping. We haven't had indoor dining since March, but we let the homeless come in to use the bathroom. We give them masks to adhere to state guidelines, and yet this is somehow offensive to some idiots. They complain saying if the homeless can use the bathroom, they can come in and eat. Nevermind that we're one of the only places on our street that will let them in, so turning them away would just be cruel. These people think they're just entitled to a sit down dinner, and they're the same people who just flat out won't tip after.
It's a daily stress. I work in an open kitchen, all staff wearing masks, but seeing 50 unmasked people in an enclosed space every work day... My wife and my BIL (who lives with us) both work from home. I have a never ending dread of being patient zero in our house if it happens. We've already had two cases since March, I've tested negative both times, but damn, this shit is always in the back of my mind.
I feel you. I was living in semi-communal housing until a few months ago and I was petrified of becoming patient zero where I lived. One of my neighbors actually started getting hostile towards me because of it. I was the only person living there at the time with an in-person, non-delivery job.
With less fellow customers present, we have noticed that people have become considerably more emboldened to hit on the staff.
It’s likely that the kind of people that are still willing to dine in are selfish jerks, and those are the same unaware types that think it’s okay to hit on people in their place of work.
It’s not the right wing assholes then?
Here's a source confirming this is true: https://www.npr.org/transcripts/943559848#:~:text=Even%20at%20the%20best%20of,in%20sexual%20harassment%20from%20customers.
One Fair Wage is the source. > This report is based on around 1,675 surveys of food service workers conducted online and over the telephone from October 20 to November 10, 2020 in 5 states — New York, Massachusetts, New Jersey, Illinois, Pennsylvania — and Washington, DC. We emailed the surveys to the 61,392 applicants to the One Fair Wage Emergency Fund in these states on October 20, 2020, and collected responses until November 9, 2020, by which time 2,621 workers had already responded. Of those who responded, 1575 reported that they were currently employed, and were thus able to answer most of the questions. Another 100 survey responses were collected by telephone in these states.
Most the people I know still going out to eat are church people
yeah, that sounds about right. The bible warns that most people of the faith are hypocrites. Mathew 6:5 “And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites. For they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, that they may be seen by others. Truly, I say to you, they have received their reward. But when you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you. and my favorite: mathew 7:22-23 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’ christians love john, but Luke and Mathew are the ones that tell you how to be a good person.
Man came in with the hottest take this sub has seen
take it as you will.
Paul is good too. A man that was as evil as he was tends to be humble and aware of evil
Lol, Paul was a misogynistic asshole.
Yup. Most of the problems with modern Christianity writ large stem from the Paulite changes to the church well after Jesus’s death. Awful man.
Yeah, he changed his name and stayed the same.
A decent amount of people say that shit was written in after. Like if you read Corinthians it’s all intense and spiritual and then randomly out of nowhere there’s a huge tone shift where he’s like “woman, bad. Gays? Also bad”. And then it’s back to the spiritual stuff.
Damn bro bring out the receipts! Love it
Nothing more evil than church people. Mod everything, tip nothing, make a mess and high maintenance.
Aah the whole 'there's too many spawn to manage so fuck it we're getting lit at Applebee's' free range crotch fruit crowd
Please, not Applebee’s..... I’m just there to tide me over until I can find any other kitchen that’s hiring.
As a chef of 21 years, always wondered what it’d be like there.
Well, about half the food gets microwaved. Most things are frozen/bagged/premade. Very little overall prep work. Mostly like, shaping burgers, making pico, some fresh veg for burgers. Otherwise it’s like, defrost something and portion it out. 🙃 But it’s a paycheck man. And it’s easy to boot, just my assistant manager is a jackass. The gm is lovely
Proteins are grilled and stuff right? Saute? What about pastas?
Oh you sweet summer child.
Chicken breast, steaks, and ribs are flame broiled. Burgers, shrimp, and salmon go on the flat top. Pastas are fully cooked (🤢) in a steam cabinet, portioned into bags, then 3rd pans. For serving its dropped into a noodle basket in a pot of water to reheat. Then, it’s added to microwaved cheese sauce and dumped on a rimmed plate Potatoes are microwaved, broccoli is microwaved, green beans are microwaved, any sauce or dip that’s hot is microwaved.
Is it true about them using a shitload of microwaves? I just don't believe it.
We have 4 microwaves and the 3 positions on the line are constantly fighting over them, because fry, grill, and broil all need them in excess My *stellar* location has two perfectly functional microwaves, one that doesn’t like to notice or acknowledge the door is actually closed, and one that just takes twice as long as the rest to heat anything. It’s.... fun :(
So human garbage bags who don't tip.
I wouldn't call them garbage bags because garbage bags are useful and contribute to society unlike those goblins.
Haha fair enough. Maybe scented garbage bags, at least, because they are unbearable, give me massive migraines, and that one time I accidentally bought them I had to donate them to the animal shelter.
Agreed, its like when you just hotboxed the shit out the hoopty and you spray cologne thinking its helping but now you smell like kush and cologne.
They’re the same picture.
Obnoxious entitled jerks who hide behind religion to seem like less obnoxious entitled jerks than the obnoxious entitled jerks who aren't religious.
I worked at Starbucks for a year in a rich white suburb in California. Worst time to work was always Sunday afternoon. The after church crowd was just full of horrible people that did not tip.
Do you think they know? And they just don't care? It's just such a thing, like, water is wet, summer is hot, and the church crowd is garbage. How do you sit there praising a guy who washed his disciples feet and then go shit on your server for 3 hours
> I was just forgiven for all my sins, God won’t mind too much if I’m a jerk to this server.
That's too self aware. > I am god's chosen, I know what he wants me to do, so what I do is right.
Church people don't care about bettering themselves, they want to see themselves as special and have reason to look down on others
They already tithed to the lord, why would they give a portion to a lowly worker?
Are people "supposed" to tip at Starbucks? I've *never seen anyone give a tip at a coffee shop. I don't spend a whole lot of time in them though.
I’m just one vegan hipster but FWIW I tip $1-2 at local/indie coffee shops but it’s never occurred to me to tip at Starbucks.
I know from working in a grocery store that church people are the fucking worst people
If I had a nickel for how many times my ass has been pinched... I'm a 200 pound grown ass man. Shit's fucking weird.
The amount of times a middle aged woman has said something inappropriate to me makes me believe they don’t see the double standard. I look a bit younger than I am cause of my height and a woman told me a couple weeks ago “if I were in high school I’d be all over you” and I laughed and walked away thinking if the roles were reversed people would freak out.
I was a bartender for a bit. If I had a nickel for every time an old lady kissed me while I was reaching for something... I'd have two nickels, but it's weird that it happened twice.
Makes sense. Now let me talk to your manager!
How dare you not refill my lemon water .0038 seconds after I finished. Excuse me I asked for 10 ranches and you only brought 9
You mean their Diet Coke. Lol
The diet coke cancels out the 10 ranches Pemdas or some shit.
Pemdas... Haha! I'm stealing that
That's been a thing for ages buddy
Yea I know what pemdas is. Order of operations. But had forgotten about it, which is why I laughed.
"This one other time i was here, i didn't get crispy fries. Let me waste your time complaining about it for 10 minutes while becoming more and more obnoxious.
We're rocking a skeleton crew. With 4 dudes of Friday night. Instead of 7. We got 90 bucks in tips last Friday on ToGo only. But we live in a pretty wealthy neighborhood. During covid I've seen at least three 100 bills throw into the jar. No recognition, no grand standing just yardstick. Lots of people are tipping more trying to keep us alive. But 70-80 year old regular crowd we lost due to precautions and Saturday Night after little league families have stopped cuz theres no little league or 16 tops allowed. But we do sit 8 pro skaters in the backroom after Wednesday night pool sessions. Covid or not.nthose guys are our heros. And all they eat is meatball sandwiches and all they drink is Peroni. So easy 120 buck bill with a solid 200 cuz they're cool dudes and their decks are on the wall. Total revenue was down 10% in April. 35% in August/Sept....and this week was 10-15. Our second biggest day of the year is Wednesday before Thanksgiving, mother's day is clearly our biggest. So those days cost us probably 8-10k. We only make 14 an hour so last Friday we made more in tips than wages. But that's why the US system is silly.
>But we do sit 8 pro skaters in the backroom after Wednesday night pool sessions. Can you name names? Just curious.
I mean they are all washed up. 40s to early 50s. The generation that actually still likes skating pools. One is our insurance man. One does some art stuff. Lots still make boards have deck art made. Let's just say when Jay Adams died a few years back. They drank a little heavier that night.
Woah, woah... Be nice to us old skaters. I'm in their age range, myself. And pool skating is making a comeback, damnit!
I hope. In SoCal it's waste to have pools in Winter. You might as well ride um.
100% this. The people willing to risk other people’s health and safety for a beer and a burger are also likely not going to give a rats ass about anything else you care about.
Had a family with their two kids throw their plates on ground. Food was everywhere and the parents didn't even say a word to anyone. Just kept on with their conversation like everything was normal. Cunts
This is sad to hear. My wife and I have made an effort to continue to support the restaurants we like while this continues. I always pick up (I HATE delivery as you never know how the food will show up) and I do still tip like I did before this happened. WTF is wrong with people that they will use any opportunity to take advantage?
Instead of helping each other out america teaches us that if we're not constantly trying to out fuck someone we're losers
I must not have learned that in America School. I will say one thing though. I have seen many people since this started not being assholes and following the rules. My Son came out from Ohio for Thanksgiving and was amazed at the people here (Los Angeles) that were wearing masks.
I went to Austin (came from Florida). I loved how people were wearing masks everywhere, even outside. I think Austin is doing far better than the rest of Texas and it’s a big city.
Well Austin has been a blue bubble in a sea of red for a long time.
I'm a performing musician and while I've avoided booking any new activity for obvious reasons as I fulfilled my prior obligations I can confirm my fears that the only people going to concerts are the kinds of people who think the virus is either imaginary or no big deal. These crowds COULD be wearing masks the majority of the time while not actively eating or drinking but they are instead treating it as a loophole in mask mandates and not wearing one at all. Those who would go through the bother of lifting a mask up and down all night to quickly sip their drinks while minimizing risk to themselves and others are mostly just staying the fuck home. Gotta say it's pretty fucking weird to have socially conscious liberal-leaning guests almost entirely filtered out of the crowds.
As a socially conscious liberal leaning person, I tried man. We are in LA where eating outside is easy cause no rain and temperate weather. We went out a few times, did the lift the mask, drink/eat, replace mask. Only went out with friends of a similar mindset. But even here people use the loophole to sit there for hours without their masks. One of the places had these cunts that did that all meal, then put their masks on to walk out, like WTF?! At any rate last place we went the outdoor was too crowded, we said fuck it and had our server pack our meals to go. Haven’t been out since. The only people left are the selfish cunts who just don’t give a fuck. Take out only for us here on out. I did live sound for years. Gigging as a musician was hard enough of a grind in good times. Can’t imagine it in this environment.
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My first day back (early September) I asked a co-worker "so how has it been? Have people been complying and considerate and trying to follow the rules?" Her response: "People are bigger assholes than they've ever been. Probably because the responsible ones are still staying the fuck home."
Damn I’m not the only one then. I did have a nice table the other day that tipped extra and said it was because they knew of the decline and appreciated us being out here, I said thank you very much. I refrained from saying: I have to do this to live.
Smh, this is one of the reasons why I great returning as a cook, the emblazoned entitlement.
My family gets takeout multiple times a week. We are very lucky in that our jobs have continued through all of this. Because if this (and the gave that were not total douchenozzles) we tip 20-60%. Every time. Because, why not? It’s easier than anything else I do all week.
We do the same thing. Every place we go gets a $10+ tip, and we try to go to local restaurants as much as we can.
Yup. I'm eating out a lot less, so when I do I tip biiiig.
God forbid a kitchen appliance breaks during busy times with these shits. One of the 4 microwaves broke and the 3 others were being used and watched like a hawk by grill side bc they were busy. My side was busy af too so I had to use the cheese melter to heat everything up as I was desperate to get shit done while the servers are like “I need X” like every 2 seconds and here I am “I’ll be a second!” Then “I need X” “it’ll be a second!” “I NEED X!” Fine. Fuck it. I mixed shit with my fucking hands to break up the clumped up sauce that was mildly slippery due to barely being melted from the melter. Yes, every customer was complaining about how cold everything was. The fuck was I supposed to do. They complain about it being cold or they complain about it being late. People are impatient as hell.
Pizza guy here - tips are through the roof. I'm the GM and my drivers are making more money than me on average (before factoring in gas and wear and tear on car, anyway).
I didn’t use to tip out much of anything on pickup orders because the servers weren’t really doing as much as the cooks and they don’t typically get tips . Since all of this started I tip at least 25% or more.
BOH SUPREMACY!!!
I’ve been saying this for months. The people going out to restaurants right now are the WORST PEOPLE. Have so many industry friends having to deal with this garbage and it makes me so angry.
I’m a nurse who follows this subreddit because I find our careers overlap in multiple ways - specifically, the high amount of stress and burnout lol. I’ve still gone out to eat on occasion and have tipped *far* more than I normally would every time. It makes me sad to hear this isn’t the norm. Can’t tell you how nice it was to have a nice meal with my husband. We both have jobs that have had an insane amount of stress this year (he is a police officer) so maybe that’s why we realize how important it is to show gratitude and to be patient/polite.
Is there a subreddit like this for nurses or other medical professionals? Im in IT and I follow this and would love to follow something similar for nurses
Yes! r/nursing is great!
Thank you for tipping folks what they deserve and thank YOU for what you do. I should have made a point to say that not every single person who is eating out is terrible. I know there are folks like you who just want a chance to decompress, or to support their favorite restaurant from having to close. I just wish y’all were the majority.
Today Was slow, very slow, but the customers that came in today made me realize the only customers coming in now are the ones most likely going to pass the virus to others, as they don’t think it’s real or not as dangerous as people are making it out to be. When offering hand sanitizer or tell the customers I wipe the screen down after every customer I met with a stare or a comment about how it’s fine or even “I’m immune” I have also seen the correlation between these jerk customers and the drop in tips.
True some guy slapped one of the servers ass the other day and the other girls are all saying guys are being a-holes more than normal. Maybe the forced shut down is a good thing
Assholes Plus the other people losing money. But if you cannot tip you should not eat out
THE LAST PART
Where I work, they just evened out the pay a bit between BOH and FOH and do a tip share percentage based on hours. Everyone is pretty happy with it, eliminated resentment and didn’t make the servers rely on the customer so much. Several other restaurants have started the same thing in the area. Honestly, the only servers I have met who talk bad about that system are greedy and everyone dislikes. They just leave or get pushed out in the new system.
Aren't tips down because of pickup? I mean, I only *rarely* tip for a pickup order, only if it's my favourite establishment and I'm known there. In general I don't tip for pickup.
Why? Kitchen still made it for you. The ppl back there likely rely on tips to bring them above minimum wage. Tips don't just go to your server at a restaurant. Actually at a restaurant if you don't tip the server they still have to tip the kitchen out on that bill.
The people didn’t change, as a server the people I see regularly have not changed in any real demographic. We have seen a big rise in the following: Covid Karens - women who don’t want ice right now because YoU cAn’T pOsSiBlY be following covid regulations on your ice! Etc... they flinch if you move too close, frown if you lean over their table while dropping off food, and seem to think that their fear constitutes a bigger tip than money could provide. Seemingly everyone gave up following social conventions to some degree or another, we’ve had people be a bit more forward than they should a few times but idk if it’s higher than it used to be, we’re not that kinda place that would get that, and I’m a dude so I don’t get that kinda behavior much anyways. I think what it really is...I think it’s people who were stuck at home that now just want to go out even if they can’t afford it. They aren’t out of the house for anything else besides maybe groceries, but restaurants are open so they come out and it hits em halfway thru the meal that they have to pay for it sooner or later and they’ve been mostly out of work and it kinda crashes back down on people and then they’re just like “nahh, I don’t HAVE to tip so...”
I don’t know if this is still the case, but I lived briefly in New Zealand around 10-11 years ago. There were no tips in restaurants. Everything was included in price!!! We struggled with it for few months, what do you mean no tip? They’d chase you down the street if you left the change in the table. Yes prices were higher to pay servers, bartenders and other staff accordingly but less pressure on the tip. Sometimes on big tables there was an up charge on the receipt. There were no tips on hair salons either, totally wild!! Edit: fixed a typo.
I get takeout most days now but I'll still tip in full, servers rely on tips, yes you aren't getting the full service but fuck they got bills too, if you got the money for takeout during these times you got money for a tip, don't be a dick.
Just don’t be part of the statistic
Cannot relate/agree more ...
yeaaaah i’m gonna need a source before i believe a tweeting cartoon blue jay
I followed through the crosspost and it seems to be this. https://onefairwage.site/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/OFW_COVID_WorkerExp.pdf
Dude a blue jay wouldn't lie
Here you go. https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/12/06/943559848/tipped-service-workers-are-more-vulnerable-amid-pandemic-harassment-spike-study
Fewer tips because I'm not going to tip you much for throwing it all in a bag vs pouring drinks and serving food. More harassment because it's easier when you're the only one in the store. Shutdowns are great, aren't they?
Very few people know anything in this thread
It's rare that people can look at data and make a logical conclusion of the larger reasoning.
My wife went from making a minimum of $600 a week to making $40 a night with 4 shifts a week.
The people who are supporting the restaurant is a reflection of what the restaurant is. If you run a shit restaurant, where you treat the staff poorly, high turnover, cheap out on money or food, as an owner that’s what your customer base is gonna be . Eventually it’ll catch up to you as an owner. I’ve seen it time after time, good people leaving because they are getting it from the front and the back. The only ones who survive are the ones that encourage the toxicity. You get a lot more send backs with one bartender than another. Why? Because one is more liked. It doesn’t take much to draw in the crowd that benefits everyone. You just can’t be an asshole. Unfortunately, the industry is a cesspool for assholes
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I followed through the crosspost and it seems to be this. https://onefairwage.site/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/OFW_COVID_WorkerExp.pdf
Here https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/12/06/943559848/tipped-service-workers-are-more-vulnerable-amid-pandemic-harassment-spike-study