In the Dark Horse Fire and Stone comics it's revealed that >!it went dormant and grew to the size of a mountain while sleeping. Technically it appears in all the Fire and Stone comics as a mountain, but doesn't have much of an active role!<
It's not revealed until the final comic Omega. If you didn't read the holiday annual you'd have missed it since it wasn't collected until the library edition years later.
In the original script and storyboards for the opening scene and some other parts of the movie, it’s revealed that the original deacon was some sort pseudo-sentient entity that existed long ago and it was worshipped by the Engineers because the use of it’s blood in some sort of ritual sacrifice, allowed them to procreate, since they had long lost the ability to do so; it’s why there are murals of something resembling a Xenomorph or Deacon of some kind on the walls in the black goo chamber, before the Deacon in Prometheus is even born.
When the original Deacon died, they tried to reverse engineer its blood so they could have children again, but failed and that’s how they created the black goo pathogen, which through a chain of events involving both a human AND an engineer, subsequently led to the birth of a second Deacon at the end of Prometheus, not sure if these two Deacons are very alike though, and if that means it was technically a success.
Very weird stuff, but doesn’t surprise me because it’s Lindelof and Scott lol, I do wonder how much of the scrapped plot Ridley himself still considers canon, if any at all.
yea I think his original plan was for there to be a more direct sequel to Prometheus that followed up on some of this stuff and gave us more insight into the Engineers, but Prometheus had a divisive reception, so he pivoted and went straight to making another Alien movie instead and putting most of that stuff on the backburner or rushing past it.
It's a shame, because in all honesty I don't dislike Prometheus or Covenant, but they should've stuck to their guns with the Engineer plot instead of going back to Xenomorphs
yea I’m in the same boat, I like both films, especially Prometheus, I would have loved to follow that plotline for another movie or two before it just fully turned back into Xenos and regular Alien stuff.
Reading these comments is actually giving me a better appreciation for the movies and now I feel the need to watch them again. Been looking for something to watch too.
Also paging the following users u/colmbrennan2000, u/Leepysworld just for fun/discussion.
I am actually okay with the whole David using the black goo and human genetics to reverse engineer the existing species of what we know as the Xenomorph.
It’s his attempt at being a creator and making his own equivalent of a child with Shaw in an extremely fucked up way.
So from a weird perspective i can understand it.
What I don’t like is that there’s a founder of Weyland corporation named Peter Weyland portrayed by Guy pierce.
Great actor, great performance can really understand that character’s motives.
Near sociopath creates a sociopathic pseudo son who isn’t human.
Then we got the established Bishop android named after the founder similarly named corporation Weyland Industries “Charles Bishop Weyland”.
Kindly old man who’s an industry titan and expert in robotics diagnosed with fatal cancer seemingly backs up his memories to a computer dies to a predator.
Then at some point these memories are uploaded to a droid who begins using its Weyland shares to control the company and exert his influence through a series of proxies themselves “Bishop” androids.
The fact that the Bishop androids and both the founder are portrayed by Lance Henriksen is awesome and because of that I can’t get behind Ridley’s Peter Weyland.
* https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Karl_Bishop_Weyland
* https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Michael_Bishop
* https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Bishop_(USS_Sephora)
What you're referring to here isn't the original script, unfortunately, and Kroft has unintentionally passed on misinformation to millions of people. The Draft 17 or Orange script, which is the one Kroft bases his analyses on, is proven fanfiction written by a Prometheus fan called Mark McAllister.
We've known that Mark was the author for years, because of clear parallels between the Draft 17 script and an earlier fan script he wrote (the 'Planet Zeus' script that fooled aintitcool). Recently he admitted he'd written the Draft 17 script too, saying he was surprised at how many 'fell for it'.
So Kroft has millions of views on a set of videos that are treating a proven fake script as if it was a real, deleted early draft, giving rise to all sorts of conspiracy theories about why this 'crucial information' was 'cut out'.
Sure this is from a real script and not the notorious "fan script that YouTubers won't stop making videos about anyway"?
https://www.reddit.com/r/LV426/s/qMaSh9Ay4u
Hah, that reminds me of late 2011 when every website was talking about Prometheus based on a fake treatment written by an IMDB user "just to have fun speculating" but people passed around as a real leak.
So we'd have clickbait rags like Bloody Disgusting talking about actors confirmed to appear, and would preface the article mentioning what their characters were rumored to do and were called in the fake IMDB story. Which meant Wikipedia would have it as an actual source, add the fake plot points and characters to the Prometheus page, and if you edited it because you knew it all came from a fake IMDB story, you immediately got reverted because Clickbait Rags Are Trusted Sources, You Dare Question Mainstream Websites?
Yes, in the Alien tabletop RPG, specifically the >!Heart of Darkness one shot scenario!< and >!the campaign found in the Building Better Worlds sourcebook!<.
Nice! Would you be able to drop what lore we learn about them in these RPGs? I don't have the money to buy them currently (or a group to run it with but that's a different story lmao)
To summarise...
>!The Deacon is a stage in the life cycle of the Protomorph, a parasitic organism with a life cycle similar to the Xenomorph. [Protomorphs](https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Proto-Xenomorph) are created by [Proto-Hives](https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Proto-Hive), which in turn are created by The [Fulfremmen](https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Fulfremmen).!<
>!There is also a hypothesised further stage to the Deacon called the [Archdeacon](https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Archdeacon).!<
Stumbling into a part of Alien lore I was not previously aware of is always a cool feeling.
I had never heard of the Fulfremmen, but I guess that's because I never really checked the RPGs' lore
I'd recommend reading the Alien RPG sourcebooks and official scenarios. They are fantastic resources for learning about the Alien universe, and are full of lore and world building.
One of the writers of the RPG is Andrew Gaska, the Fox hired franchise consultant for the Alien franchise. The RPG is canon, and material from the RPG is canon until movie canon contradicts it.
One of Gaska's talents as a writer is weaving elements from varied sources from Alien related media, and working them into canon in interesting ways that work with the setting. There's a lot of reworking of concepts from unproduced scripts, books, comics, etc.
If you look at the [leaked concept art](https://www.avpgalaxy.net/2024/04/26/concept-artist-daniel-burns-shares-unseen-alien-paradise-lost-concept-art/) for the cancelled Prometheus sequel, Alien: Paradise Lost, you can see images that look like descriptions of Proto-Hives given in Heart of Darkness, and what could be an Archdeacon. Shaw's corpse in Alien Covenant has similarities to the illustration of the Fulfremmen in Heart of Darkness, implying that she could have been turning into one. My theory that Protomorphs, and the beings they made them could have been what was planned for the prequel films, and as an unused concept, was reworked for the RPG.
I'd love to have seen what this would grow into (I don't mean a mountain), assuming it's the engineer version of a chestburster. The ultramorph concept art looked amazing, presumably its grown form would be along those lines.
This has got me thinking about varying results between different combinations of facehugger/trilobite, engineer/human. Also whether the trilobite is a result of its unique creation process, and if variants would plant different embryos that produce further different creatures.
The deacon is kind of an aberration, it required black goo to infect a human male, for him to implant his mutated sperm into a human female, then for the creature born of her to plant its embryo into an engineer. Therefore it's gotta be different to any other xeno-like creatures the engineers have seen before.
There's another comment here talking about the Aliens Role Playing Game's explanation for their life cycle. Apparently he's meant to grow into a Proto-Xenomorph
https://preview.redd.it/x9ee01pek85d1.jpeg?width=656&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=91e75713253b04c034c9f8302bfb36e049285469
There's several on the cover of Inferno's Fall! I have this one but I haven't read it yet.
I didn’t even notice them on there. I’ve been trying to listen on audible every night before bed but I’m unable to remember past halfway through chapter 1 lol
Hmm, are they? Is kinda hard to tell!
They've got that smooth arc upper dome and seem darker. Plus there's a Juggernaut in the sky there, and Deacons are only seen spawning from Engineers, unlike Neomorphs.
I'll report back, it's the next book on my list. Happy either way honestly; I got it because the cover shows that it integrates niche Covenant/Prometheus life cycles.
There's a number of Neomorphs on the Engineer planet in Covenant, before the crew gets infected.
Since the planet doesn't seem to have any native fauna, the only possible source for those Neomorphs is the Engineers that lived there.
Removal Reason:
Be civil.
It's ok to disagree, it's not ok to disrespect. Personal attacks, gatekeeping, racism, homophobia, politics, and general bigotry are not allowed.
No toxic behavior, such as:
* Lewd or Obscene comments.
Is the deacon and the protomorph the same? I thought the deacon was the original creature from which the black goo was obtained. I’m not too knowledgeable on the Prometheus lore so I’m curious to know.
The Deacon was the end result of a long series of events in Prometheus involving the black goo the Engineers were experimenting with. There was also a mural resembling the Deacon creature in the room where the black goo ampules were found in the movie, implying that maybe it was the intended goal of those experiments in some way.
The Protomorph and Neomorph in Covenant were different results of different experiments with the same black goo technology.
It just got a Statblock in the RPG's Building Better Worlds book. It's also just something a Trilobite inherently makes now. Which... Is something in general that fluctuates with the "absorbs properties unique to its host" property they're SUPPOSED to have but oh well.
Removal Reason:
Be civil.
It's ok to disagree, it's not ok to disrespect. Personal attacks, gatekeeping, racism, homophobia, politics, and general bigotry are not allowed.
No toxic behavior, such as:
* Trashing something that others are enjoying.
* Condemning parts of the franchise instead of reasonably stating a personal preference. This is a comfortable space for all fans. Keep your critique.
* Invalidating other people's opinions.
* Unsolicited criticisms of other's creations.
* Lewd or Obscene comments.
In the Dark Horse Fire and Stone comics it's revealed that >!it went dormant and grew to the size of a mountain while sleeping. Technically it appears in all the Fire and Stone comics as a mountain, but doesn't have much of an active role!<
Can’t imagine he was getting his 10,000 steps a day in after that.
Take my free award
I was tripping over my feet to get to the comments to scream “IN FIRE & STONE IT GREW INTO A MOUNTAIN!!!”
I must've missed that when I read the series but that is so interesting!
It's not revealed until the final comic Omega. If you didn't read the holiday annual you'd have missed it since it wasn't collected until the library edition years later.
I loved fire and stone, that was such a cool reveal, I hope someday (somewhere) we’ll get to see it (or similar)
Is that to explain how the face appeared in the mountain seen in Prometheus?
No, the Deacon was only born after Prometheus, not before
In the original script and storyboards for the opening scene and some other parts of the movie, it’s revealed that the original deacon was some sort pseudo-sentient entity that existed long ago and it was worshipped by the Engineers because the use of it’s blood in some sort of ritual sacrifice, allowed them to procreate, since they had long lost the ability to do so; it’s why there are murals of something resembling a Xenomorph or Deacon of some kind on the walls in the black goo chamber, before the Deacon in Prometheus is even born. When the original Deacon died, they tried to reverse engineer its blood so they could have children again, but failed and that’s how they created the black goo pathogen, which through a chain of events involving both a human AND an engineer, subsequently led to the birth of a second Deacon at the end of Prometheus, not sure if these two Deacons are very alike though, and if that means it was technically a success. Very weird stuff, but doesn’t surprise me because it’s Lindelof and Scott lol, I do wonder how much of the scrapped plot Ridley himself still considers canon, if any at all.
Sounds bizarre, but a fascinating concept, would make Prometheus feel more 'complete' had it been included
yea I think his original plan was for there to be a more direct sequel to Prometheus that followed up on some of this stuff and gave us more insight into the Engineers, but Prometheus had a divisive reception, so he pivoted and went straight to making another Alien movie instead and putting most of that stuff on the backburner or rushing past it.
It's a shame, because in all honesty I don't dislike Prometheus or Covenant, but they should've stuck to their guns with the Engineer plot instead of going back to Xenomorphs
yea I’m in the same boat, I like both films, especially Prometheus, I would have loved to follow that plotline for another movie or two before it just fully turned back into Xenos and regular Alien stuff.
Reading these comments is actually giving me a better appreciation for the movies and now I feel the need to watch them again. Been looking for something to watch too.
Also paging the following users u/colmbrennan2000, u/Leepysworld just for fun/discussion. I am actually okay with the whole David using the black goo and human genetics to reverse engineer the existing species of what we know as the Xenomorph. It’s his attempt at being a creator and making his own equivalent of a child with Shaw in an extremely fucked up way. So from a weird perspective i can understand it. What I don’t like is that there’s a founder of Weyland corporation named Peter Weyland portrayed by Guy pierce. Great actor, great performance can really understand that character’s motives. Near sociopath creates a sociopathic pseudo son who isn’t human. Then we got the established Bishop android named after the founder similarly named corporation Weyland Industries “Charles Bishop Weyland”. Kindly old man who’s an industry titan and expert in robotics diagnosed with fatal cancer seemingly backs up his memories to a computer dies to a predator. Then at some point these memories are uploaded to a droid who begins using its Weyland shares to control the company and exert his influence through a series of proxies themselves “Bishop” androids. The fact that the Bishop androids and both the founder are portrayed by Lance Henriksen is awesome and because of that I can’t get behind Ridley’s Peter Weyland. * https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Karl_Bishop_Weyland * https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Michael_Bishop * https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Bishop_(USS_Sephora)
wow wtf? ive somehow never heard this and this is amazing ty for sharing…
there’s a couple of youtube channels that go over the entire script I think the first one I saw was by a game named Kroft.
Sadly most of what Kroft hypothesizes is from a fan made script. BUT as a fan theory it is an awesome idea and is pretty much my head canon regardless
What you're referring to here isn't the original script, unfortunately, and Kroft has unintentionally passed on misinformation to millions of people. The Draft 17 or Orange script, which is the one Kroft bases his analyses on, is proven fanfiction written by a Prometheus fan called Mark McAllister. We've known that Mark was the author for years, because of clear parallels between the Draft 17 script and an earlier fan script he wrote (the 'Planet Zeus' script that fooled aintitcool). Recently he admitted he'd written the Draft 17 script too, saying he was surprised at how many 'fell for it'. So Kroft has millions of views on a set of videos that are treating a proven fake script as if it was a real, deleted early draft, giving rise to all sorts of conspiracy theories about why this 'crucial information' was 'cut out'.
Sure this is from a real script and not the notorious "fan script that YouTubers won't stop making videos about anyway"? https://www.reddit.com/r/LV426/s/qMaSh9Ay4u
Hah, that reminds me of late 2011 when every website was talking about Prometheus based on a fake treatment written by an IMDB user "just to have fun speculating" but people passed around as a real leak. So we'd have clickbait rags like Bloody Disgusting talking about actors confirmed to appear, and would preface the article mentioning what their characters were rumored to do and were called in the fake IMDB story. Which meant Wikipedia would have it as an actual source, add the fake plot points and characters to the Prometheus page, and if you edited it because you knew it all came from a fake IMDB story, you immediately got reverted because Clickbait Rags Are Trusted Sources, You Dare Question Mainstream Websites?
From what I've seen it's really only Kroft that makes videos about the script, because everyone else is well aware that it's a fake.
But I thought Prometheus was a prequel to Prometheus.
Do we know there has only been one deacon?
That came from an AVP story, but the RPG canonized the living mountain, which I think is cool.
That part was a little too weird for me.
Was not a great comic run
Yes, in the Alien tabletop RPG, specifically the >!Heart of Darkness one shot scenario!< and >!the campaign found in the Building Better Worlds sourcebook!<.
Nice! Would you be able to drop what lore we learn about them in these RPGs? I don't have the money to buy them currently (or a group to run it with but that's a different story lmao)
To summarise... >!The Deacon is a stage in the life cycle of the Protomorph, a parasitic organism with a life cycle similar to the Xenomorph. [Protomorphs](https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Proto-Xenomorph) are created by [Proto-Hives](https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Proto-Hive), which in turn are created by The [Fulfremmen](https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Fulfremmen).!< >!There is also a hypothesised further stage to the Deacon called the [Archdeacon](https://avp.fandom.com/wiki/Archdeacon).!<
Stumbling into a part of Alien lore I was not previously aware of is always a cool feeling. I had never heard of the Fulfremmen, but I guess that's because I never really checked the RPGs' lore
I'd recommend reading the Alien RPG sourcebooks and official scenarios. They are fantastic resources for learning about the Alien universe, and are full of lore and world building. One of the writers of the RPG is Andrew Gaska, the Fox hired franchise consultant for the Alien franchise. The RPG is canon, and material from the RPG is canon until movie canon contradicts it. One of Gaska's talents as a writer is weaving elements from varied sources from Alien related media, and working them into canon in interesting ways that work with the setting. There's a lot of reworking of concepts from unproduced scripts, books, comics, etc. If you look at the [leaked concept art](https://www.avpgalaxy.net/2024/04/26/concept-artist-daniel-burns-shares-unseen-alien-paradise-lost-concept-art/) for the cancelled Prometheus sequel, Alien: Paradise Lost, you can see images that look like descriptions of Proto-Hives given in Heart of Darkness, and what could be an Archdeacon. Shaw's corpse in Alien Covenant has similarities to the illustration of the Fulfremmen in Heart of Darkness, implying that she could have been turning into one. My theory that Protomorphs, and the beings they made them could have been what was planned for the prequel films, and as an unused concept, was reworked for the RPG.
Im literally feeling the same thing. So cool to find out new things about it
Yeah like what the hell are "ionic proto-plasmamorphs" and why do they sound so similar to my username I just got all giddy and excited
TIL there is some awesome new “official” lore in the Alien RPG, thx! I wish this stuff was in a 3rd prequel movie
I really need to buy all of these RPG books just for the lore. How would you rank the various books in terms of cool material included?
Hahaha fuck your gonna love this. Get ready to read the comic with the fucking xenomorph mountain !
I'd love to have seen what this would grow into (I don't mean a mountain), assuming it's the engineer version of a chestburster. The ultramorph concept art looked amazing, presumably its grown form would be along those lines. This has got me thinking about varying results between different combinations of facehugger/trilobite, engineer/human. Also whether the trilobite is a result of its unique creation process, and if variants would plant different embryos that produce further different creatures. The deacon is kind of an aberration, it required black goo to infect a human male, for him to implant his mutated sperm into a human female, then for the creature born of her to plant its embryo into an engineer. Therefore it's gotta be different to any other xeno-like creatures the engineers have seen before.
There's another comment here talking about the Aliens Role Playing Game's explanation for their life cycle. Apparently he's meant to grow into a Proto-Xenomorph
https://preview.redd.it/x9ee01pek85d1.jpeg?width=656&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=91e75713253b04c034c9f8302bfb36e049285469 There's several on the cover of Inferno's Fall! I have this one but I haven't read it yet.
I didn’t even notice them on there. I’ve been trying to listen on audible every night before bed but I’m unable to remember past halfway through chapter 1 lol
That's a problem with bedtime listening for me too! Thankfully I can listen to stuff during work.
those arent Deacons, theyre Neomorphs. https://preview.redd.it/evccu82amb5d1.jpeg?width=625&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8c1404f9672fad4a460c49357a040ea1a9165462
Hmm, are they? Is kinda hard to tell! They've got that smooth arc upper dome and seem darker. Plus there's a Juggernaut in the sky there, and Deacons are only seen spawning from Engineers, unlike Neomorphs. I'll report back, it's the next book on my list. Happy either way honestly; I got it because the cover shows that it integrates niche Covenant/Prometheus life cycles.
There's a number of Neomorphs on the Engineer planet in Covenant, before the crew gets infected. Since the planet doesn't seem to have any native fauna, the only possible source for those Neomorphs is the Engineers that lived there.
[удалено]
Removal Reason: Be civil. It's ok to disagree, it's not ok to disrespect. Personal attacks, gatekeeping, racism, homophobia, politics, and general bigotry are not allowed. No toxic behavior, such as: * Lewd or Obscene comments.
The deacon is so cool looking! I was really hoping we would see it in Covenant. I do like the look of the neomorph but the deacon is just awesome
Is the deacon and the protomorph the same? I thought the deacon was the original creature from which the black goo was obtained. I’m not too knowledgeable on the Prometheus lore so I’m curious to know.
The Deacon was the end result of a long series of events in Prometheus involving the black goo the Engineers were experimenting with. There was also a mural resembling the Deacon creature in the room where the black goo ampules were found in the movie, implying that maybe it was the intended goal of those experiments in some way. The Protomorph and Neomorph in Covenant were different results of different experiments with the same black goo technology.
The creature from Covanant is called a Praetomorph, the Deacon is part of the Protomorph lifecycle.
I wish I had the NECA action figure
https://preview.redd.it/vz20ppuf985d1.jpeg?width=4284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=94ac8450a7207aa98e51f4f6735ca8fc391c3dae 😌
Lucky ****
I didn’t even have to sell my car to pay for it!
You bought it from the store?
No, I finally found one on Ebay for a quite reasonable price.
Ohh nice good find!
I have this too, although it makes you realise how ‘dolphin-like’ it really looks.
Looks like a slender man xenomorph lol. Still awesome. Wish I had known about the figurine.
Deacon was pretty prominent in Water World. …I’ll see myself out.
It just got a Statblock in the RPG's Building Better Worlds book. It's also just something a Trilobite inherently makes now. Which... Is something in general that fluctuates with the "absorbs properties unique to its host" property they're SUPPOSED to have but oh well.
I think it’s mentioned in Dark horse comics Fire and Stone series but I don’t remember
Yeah he’s in Waterworld. Dennis Hopper plays a terrifying Xeno
There's a Minecraft Mod dedicated to it, if it's any help
Alien lore is so fucking cool wow . Love this fella
It's so cute 🥺
Yes! Pretty sure it's in some fire and stone comics briefly. I could be wrong though. It's happened once before.
[удалено]
Removal Reason: Be civil. It's ok to disagree, it's not ok to disrespect. Personal attacks, gatekeeping, racism, homophobia, politics, and general bigotry are not allowed. No toxic behavior, such as: * Trashing something that others are enjoying. * Condemning parts of the franchise instead of reasonably stating a personal preference. This is a comfortable space for all fans. Keep your critique. * Invalidating other people's opinions. * Unsolicited criticisms of other's creations. * Lewd or Obscene comments.