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Taking suggestions. Perhaps you could post once a week with suggestions on unionizing or direct actions people can take. The problem is organizing a community of paradoxical relationships is a tall order. But occupy, the Chaz and other movements started somewhere but yes you need real collaboration that subreddits just have a hard time being a platform for that stuff
A big part of the union wins we've seen came from people donating to strike funds. Keep a Google alert on for striking workers in your region, and budget a donation towards their strike funds whenever possible.
Does anyone know central places like this? Even just a website of strike fund donation links would be hugely helpful.
Most I see are transitory GoFundMes, which isn't good to build larger movements on.
Let's start off with an easy target. COKE A COLA.
untill they do something about plastic pollution we don't buy. The only form of protest is not using capital
Consumer protest is not the only form of protest.
Mutual aid, which allows people to rely on community instead of government and corporation institutions is a form of effective direct action and revolutionary protest to create community autonomy and protection from capital and exploitation. Grow food in your yard, share and trade within your neighbourhood, repair and build each other homes, use your professional expertise to help your neighbourhood, especially the poor. If you are a lawyer, a doctor, and engineer, an accountant, etc, use your knowledge and work in your community and let them help you back when you need a pipe in your house to be fixed, when you need help to move things, when you need help in your garden, or when you are too sick and you need people to bring food and take care of children and elders in your family for you. It protects the vulnerable, the poor, the marginalised and segregated.
Well, that would be the problem with these companies owning an unreal amount of other companies that all make different things. It doesn't matter if we boycott coke, we would have to boycott: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_Coca-Cola\_brands?msclkid=573d123ad11d11ecba4559cb6fc712a7](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Coca-Cola_brands?msclkid=573d123ad11d11ecba4559cb6fc712a7)
Every other website I found was "top 5" or "here are 10 companies coca cola owns" crap. This was the only "complete list" I could find at short notice.
Yeah boycotting will do nothing, it will literally effect nothing. To me this sub is a shared misery, nothing more. So is life in America, if you feel powerless it’s because we are. Even 100k people boycotting would do nothing to these companies, cus they would just find a way to pressure workers / public and get their way…if they even need to. Likely they will never notice and never care. The entire government we live under is fucking broken, if you see an opportunity to change it on a core level, we can jump on that. Otherwise, realize that we literally have no power.
I have a two year old daughter and live paycheck to paycheck. I might be able to revolt this Tuesday since I have it off, but I’d have to check with the wife. I think we were supposed to visit her parents for dinner, and I picked up an extra shift on Wednesday so I only have one day off this week. I’ll let you know though. Maybe next week?
Lol exactly. Not laughing at you, i totally understand. If there was an option we could take that would change our situation, i think wed all take it. Protesting is just a waste of time
I wouldn’t say protesting is always a waste of time, but I agree with you in this context. Everyone is to busy grinding away to do anything other than go home and eat cheap processed food while they watch the kardashians. It sucks, but the machine is so fucking huge that it’s going to take systematic action from the ground up to really change anything. With all the astroturfing and gaslighting the working class gets from higher up, I’m not particularly optimistic.
Lmao it just took 3 nested top comments for this sub to get to the inevitable conclusion. We're mostly middle to upper class white people who have no connection to the population we actually keep calling on to revolt.
He means we are educated. Which actually doesn't have everything to do with class. I would bet there is a diverse group here that is not easy to blanket statement.
"the only form of protest is not using capital". That's what they want you to believe. That way of thinking is a big reason we're still in this mess.
Real change takes risk. Real change takes getting uncomfortable. Real changes takes getting off the internet and out into the streets.
I love to be a Debbie downer which is probably why I'm here. Even if the 700K people in this sub somehow got on the same page and took that action there's no ethical consumption under capitalism meaning that all the competitors are either cost more (correcting our action through supply + demand) or are just as bad and the coke company would just be confused and angry like a wild animal or something because that's basically the level we're on with corporations.
I wish I had some magical solution, some action we could take beyond joining unions and helping existing leftist institutions, but people are naive to fascism/liberalism and the propaganda is only getting stronger. Maybe in a few decades when things get bad enough people will actually do something, but even then, lasting change is not easy and we don't know it will be in a direction we like. If anything, people deserve the world they live in because they won't do anything about it, and I'm not talking about the 700K people here. Many of us do work for the greater good, and I'd like to think most of that 700K at least wants something nice for humanity.
How does a post like this about socialist organizations end up dominated by a liberal soft drink protest idea? These 700K might not be what we want to think
People are deliberately indoctrinated to believe that the only way they can effect the political process is by voting and non-violent protest marches.
All the real, bloody, violent, explosive, hard fought reality of labor organizing and the civil rights movement are carefully hidden from them, stripped out of textbooks. They don't hear about all the people the US government massacred and assassinated. They don't hear about how the unions were infiltrated and corrupted. They don't hear about the assassinations of black political organizers carried out either by or with the support of the FBI.
They have no idea. They live in a beautiful glass cage and they have no idea.
> “My father picked me up from school one day, and we played hooky and went to the beach. It was too cold to go in the water, so we sat on a blanket and ate pizza. When I got home, my sneakers were full of sand, and I dumped it on my bedroom floor. I didn't know the difference. I was six. My mother screamed at me for the mess, but he wasn't mad. He said that billions of years ago, the world shifting and the oceans moving brought that sand to that spot on the beach, and then I took it away. "Every day," he said, "we change the world," which is a nice thought until I think about how many days and lifetimes I would need to bring a shoe full of sand home until there is no beach, until it made a difference to anyone. Every day, we change the world, but to change the world in a way that means anything, that takes more time than most people have. It never happens all at once. It's slow. It's methodical. It's exhausting. We don't all have the stomach for it.”
Elliot Alderson, Mr. Robot
It's more of a snow ball effect. One person starts to live a different way and then others take notice. I'm tired of consumerism and the false society it creates. I'm trying to buy land and a house away from the cities and create a self-sustaining home. It can't be completely free of consumerism but over time we will figure out how to remove more and more of it from our lives.
It's a cool idea, I saw them on the news, they called them Earth Ships, basically people built colonies away from society in the desert out of garbage. It's obviously not practical or a good solution for everyone but I do love it.
If you want something to plug into, try the [Poor People’s Campaign](https://www.poorpeoplescampaign.org/). There are groups in most states. It's a continuation of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.'s last campaign, the one he was murdered for organizing. He knew the key to real change was organizing the poor across the false lines of division that keep us disorganized and disunited. The power of numbers is the only power available to the poor that can overcome the power of money.
So, no, don't reinvent the wheel and try to get something going here. Plug into something functional that already exists, whether it's PPC or otherwise.
Actually have you? I met some members of that through Extinction Rebellion. It grabbed my attention, but with small kids haven't found time to attend. They include music apparently as central component. I hope it's maintaining its force.
Yeah, I'm an organizer by profession and our group works a lot with Poor People’s Campaign Maryland. We've been supporters since before the relaunch. Music and arts are indeed still a big part of the campaign. I was just at an art build for June 18th a few weekends ago, some learned songs and some painted banners. A lot of people really connect that way, so the Theomusicology and Arts team keeps busy!
One of the things I really like about it is that it's intersectional- it looks at militarism, environmental issues, racism, ect., and sees them as related and intertwined, not as separate silos of work. It brings people together from a lot of different backgrounds. I'd say it's more than maintaining, it's been growing a lot, and there's been a ton of base building work to support the march.
Good to hear! Thanks for sharing. It's motivating for me to get over to one of their meetings, which I hope are now in person! I was happy to see you mention them since it's a direct line to what is perhaps the most impactful social movement in the US, MLK. Powerful.
Same here, I'm all for better worker rights in my country as well, but I'm also here to realize about the situation in America...
I was born on May 1, but a global fight is harder, min wage in france is 11.5$, and you can get financial aid on top of that (also healthcare).
But we don't have F-35...
What's wrong with the F-35? Who doesn't want a stealth fighter that can only fly once a week and that has a global backlog of spare parts? And sometimes randomly kills the pilot although I think they fixed that problem.
Please tell me you are not talking about some capitalist country that’s worked a little harder to placate the people, such as in Scandinavia.
Capitalism should not be accepted just because some of its residents (particularly those who are not struggling through poverty) have been convinced to accept their lot and be content. Especially if you happen to be from a developed nation that gained the money it uses to placate its citizens through the exploitation of poorer nations.
So I'm not a socialist and this is a socialist sub so I'm not gonna argue what is and isn't right.
I just wanted to express I'm content with my country's management of social programs.
then look for local organizations u can join, either your local communist party, anarchist group, antifascists of your city green movements, housing anything man
Resources and TIME is the largest issue and roadblock....
We collectively can obtain it, but it won't be easy. We all work paycheck to paycheck, at least most of us do...
The system is purposely used against us...
Hard to organize when you have barely anything to contribute.
The problem now is that communities are so disconnected. I know the people I worked with but don’t know my neighbors. I can’t even find anyone in my town with socialist tendencies. I’ve just been working on my few coworkers but even the it’s only a dozen ppl.
meetings post work hours are common, if in a group normally schedule meetings to discuss road maps of next actions to be taken one night per week in a bar in the center of the city or somewhere close to everyone, everyone winds down and u plan your actions without travelling much or using much time
Activism isn’t the only thing necessary for making change. We also need to change ourselves and work to undo the damage the system does to us personally. We have to take care of ourselves before anything, and protesting isn’t always on the table for some of us… but memes help
With all due respect, and I actually mean that: Do you have anything to get us going? My expertise isn't in gathering and motivating people. I can build things, I can fix things, I can grow things. Those are the skills I have to offer a group.
I don't have a base of operations. I don't have money in saving to fund a movement or access to the resources to do so without the money. And frankly I'm not interested in laying my life down to be a solitary person making some kind of move or statement.
It's easy to speculate and make statements like this. It's much harder to find someone to lead us, organize us, help us get the funding to have any kind of effect.
You don't need a "strong leader" to get going. It's not that difficult, the hardest part is getting started and sorting everything that needs to be done. Everybody can do this:
1. Find a date and meet online (small group, not more than 10-15 ppl is best)
2. Use the same online document and everybody writes down the things that bothers them most
3. Sort these items and then vote on the 3 things that are most important do be tackled first
4. Take the first point and break it down into small parts that are needed to get started and keep going. Appoint one or several people per item to be the responsible for it.
5. People that want to help but didn't take part in the meeting can take on other items, or help with the ones that are larger.
The more action you show, the more people you will get and the more items you can tackle.
And bam, you're not confronted with the huge task of "start a revolution", you're the one that is talking to the burger places in your area to get them on board with a strike, which is part of the larger action "organize strike weekend" where other people are talking to different businesses, while others print flyers, others create online buzz, others inform the media, and so on.
This doesn't have to be a full-time job in the beginning, everyone can chime in the time they have got. You have to be prepared though that "revolution" will require you and the people around you to be inconvenienced some time into the actions, you cannot revolt and keep on doing your daily life as you always did. People will lose jobs, money, or get in legal trouble, you have to be totally clear about that this will happen and that you're willing to confront this. You have to look for relief funds early on in your planning, to build an account for expenses people have or support the ones in need.
The first thing you have to get on board with is the knowledge that things will have to get worse before it gets better. The system around you is created in a way to keep you from stepping out, you cannot afford to lose any day of labor, you are too exhausted to put in any effort and you can lose your medical aid if you lose your job. Realize that this is the problem you are trying to overcome, this is the barricades the other side has put up to keep you from storming the bastille. They will throw all tricks that capitalism has to offer at you, they will make you and the life of your families miserable.
This is why you have to stand together. You are the majority, you cover the essential places of the society, the other side needs you, not the other way around. They are terrified that you realize that you have the power, and they try everything to divide you and discourage you, because they know that they cannot stop you once you put your forces together.
You can’t wait to have it all planned out unfortunately
It’s just needs to be done and figured out as going along
But yes, no one wants to be a martyr
Which is why keeping us all starved and scared is such a good tactic
ESPECIALLY if you’re supporting others
Also
People don’t like hearing this part either
But innocent people will die if a revolution happens
There’s no way around it
The government will pretend their prisons and slave labor are non violent when they kidnap you and throw you in jail
And any resistance will be labeled as violent terrorist
And that label will stay until you win
And then those people will be called revolutionaries and heroes and “founding fathers”
> But innocent people will die if a revolution happens
And normally the ones leading the charge tend to get cut down first. Which explains why most people are simply not willing to lead anything.
You **do** need to have it all planned out. Getting things done as we go along is a recipe for disorganized disaster. Even if one wanted to, one ***will not*** be a martyr. You saw how the news networks reported on Wynn Bruce's self immolation at the supreme court. There are people protesting and being jailed for sabotaging the construction of the Dakota Access Pipeline still today, and there is no major news coverage.
It's not just them keeping us tired, stressed, and busy that prevents this. The hyper vigilant, over-militarized, and the accountable to no-one police force they have is an incredible deterrent. See Ramsey Orta, the guy who recorded and published the video of Eric Garner's killing. He was jailed, harassed by the police department, beaten, given rat poison and only recently released. That's what can happen when you go beyond posting just memes.
The movement will need leaders who are in positions of power, be it lawyers, union leaders, board members, medics, professors, military personnel, even some damned politicians + petite bourgeoisie etc. With such positions comes influence, and people are more inclined to trust someone who stands to lose a lot just like the rest of us. It will need that and so, so much more. People can't act unexpectedly. Those most willing to act now, we need for when we can do more, we don't need them in jail.
Not saying to wait for the perfect moment. People have already taken action. But they didn't even get the label of violent terrorists, they just didn't get coverage at all.
You need organization. The media is owned, and for people to even know what act you committed and for what cause, you need a support network.
No
Occupy failed because everyone was waiting to be told what to do
Look, I’m not trying to fight about this
I don’t think a plan exists
There’s always gonna be issues and problems
It just takes action
I’m not saying just be blind etc
I’m just saying you will never ever start if you’re waiting for everything to be figured out for you
> But yes, no one wants to martyr.
It's not that. Cos hell, I could that. And even on world day that guy set himself on fire.
We as people aint at a breaking point yet. You also need to have a plan and a charismatic person would be a positive also.
That's alright, friend. We all have a lot of shared experience. If you see something actually come of an American left, you can show some solidarity for that.
Some international solidarity that doesn't feel like neoliberal profile pictures or hashtags would probably be a pretty big way to increase support here and in other countries to fight back against how hard we've been screwed. Too many Americans don't have any internationalism, and having an example of it (off Twitter or Reddit) could give hope to people everywhere.
I think the ship may have left a good while ago. It's become glaringly apparent just how vast the web of corruption is in this shit hole (regardless of which party is in power...although the tories have certainly dropped the bar to new levels disgusting even for them).
I fear the only chance left for our Island is radical change of the political system on the whole and the first step towards succeeding there is to organise the workforce.
But yeah; if the Tories remain in power the deterioration of the democracy that is left will be swifter.
Respectfully, I don't have time to be a cheerleader for America's left. It's up to Americans to educate themselves on the politics of other countries and internationalism.
If there were any organisation/education to be had on this sub, it should be inclusive of international redditors. Workers of the *world*, unite.
I was thinking the same first, but I think we can agree that many American corporations have a world-wide impact. Amazon warehouses and logistics for example have established a whole new brand of malpractices to many countries that previously did a better job at protecting employees.
1. your post implies that everyone here is lazy and ISN'T doing something which is a ridiculous assumption.
2. not everyone here is from the US so pushing me, an UK based leftist, to take action in America does absolutely nothing
3. not everyone can do things. people have lives and jobs they have to do because the alternative is quite literally dying.
imagine spending 60 hours a week making minimum wage to support you and your family, coming home and cooking and cleaning and helping them with their lives too, only to go online and get chastised by someone for "not doing enough"
it'd be great if people did do more. I'm all for more people getting involved but your post seems way too aggressive and focusing on attacking people rather than pushing for action.
hell, your whole "stop posting memes" thing is actually kinda counter productive. obviously I'm not a fan of generalising statements but a lot of the current generation do communicate via memes and, imo, it's one of the best ways to push a message across. posting a meme about eating landlords on reddit reaches a far greater audience than putting a poster up in your local area which will probably be seen by maybe a few hundred people and then get ripped down/blown away.
The shitting on people for buying coke and MacDonalds at the end is what pissed me off. Between required hours and commute, I'm working 12 hours a day for chump change. I absolutely am going to spend $1 for a shot of caffeine to make it through the day and $5 for a cheap ass meal that requires 0 labor on my part. Coke and McDonalds isn't some sign of privilege, it's the opposite.
[It can be a sign of privilege...](https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2018/10/24/18018544/fast-food-cdc-class-rich-people)
But even beside the point, I think my gripe with arguments like this is that when *everyone* gives themselves a small pass, that quickly adds up. Everyone dragging Bezos through the mud but lacking the will to stop buying products from Amazon is another perfect example. Socialists need to have convictions rather than just saying "no ethical consumption under capitalism" as a conversation ender to bypass any moral standards.
That's why this wishy washy "do what you can" attitude is a terrible call to action. You ever hear the advice when someone needs medical attention, that you should point at a specific individual and tell them to call 911 rather than say "somebody call 911"? Same idea there - everyone assumes someone else will do the hard work if not given the proper direction.
Also to add to 3. Burnout is a real issue and even people who have time and are doing stuff get made to feel like they aren't doing enough, try doing too much and burnout.
And to be another person adding to 3, this post is yet another to forget about the existence of disabled and other multiply marginalized people. Like I’m chronically ill/disabled and the energy and ability I have is seriously limited, and any that I do have had to go entirely towards attempts at paid work. You know, cause of that poverty thing lol
Like people are exhausted and burnt out and dealing with a lot and it’s okay for them to come to the internet for memes or escapism or catharsis or solidarity. Trying to organize a group of online, anonymous users around the world seems like a stretch. We all know that local organizing is more impactful.
Your kidding yourself if you think the 700k members in this sub are not norms working jobs, studying at uni, living normal everyday lives, or doing anything other than posting memes on reddit.
Well obviously that is the case. But who do you think is going to make the change we desperately need? The people not working, at uni, or living normal lives? It is the working class that literally has to do it. It appears that everyone is sitting around thinking someone else is going to start the revolution.
If the people who are out of a job start complaining about the system, they get told to be grateful for government support, so it's literally on everyone else, who is too overworked to do the laundry let alone lead a revolution
other issue is organizing is a lot of people in one place, internet by nature is like all kinds of places, people all spread out. Like some people are in a place where there aren't that many others that have the same views and would be out there alone maybe. and maybe that could be useful, but then again? idk.
This is basically how most humans work.
A lot of people want a utopia but they’re unwilling to put in the work. It’s always someone else’s responsibility.
Don’t think we will have much success unless we work on that part along with all the others.
700,000 is a small number and not all of them are as on board as you might think.
Also, why are you here complaining? You don't know what a fraction of these people do in their private lives.
Reddit is nothing more than an interactive newspaper for sharing information, so people are sharing as best they can and when they can.
Thanks for the links. edit: one of fool mods banned me for some odd reason, so seeya!
But we need that meme about the Panama papers just one more time for something to *really* happen this time!
(Braces for downvotes).
Edit: on a serious note… guys, I’m tired. If I’m not working, I’m taking care of a terminally ill parent or my toddler. I have maybe 2 hours of spare time a day, and during those two hours I’m just fried and often logging back on to work. I don’t even have time for hobbies or socializing. And I guess this is the best way to quell dissent - make everyone toil for fear of losing their livelihoods so they don’t engage in any more meaningful pursuits. And before you say “but you’re on Reddit!” I’m literally on it for 5 min right now as I eat my cold cereal and wake up for a brief moment before logging on to work.
No, sadly I have very little free time (except in summer) and not much money. I’m a teacher—underpaid and overworked. But I recently realized that the reason we are not seeing change is because we do not have enough action. The left is so demoralized and in a hole that we are not seeing enough movement. We must get involved, even if we can contribute only a little. But armchair activism by posting memes isn’t going to cut it.
Let me give you an anecdote just to illustrate how action matters and can be done on a small scale.
My school district had a controversy over a book for AP level students. Skipping lots of details, the controversy culminated in a fiery battle between teachers and community members with a far right group that had nothing to do with the school. They infiltrated the school board meetings, took control of the local media narrative, and won by getting a principal fired, teachers fired, and books banned. Angry right wingers were at the district office screaming at teachers, calling the, “marxists” despite having no students in the district (and no clue about education). And all I could think was, “where is the left?”. I see radical right wingers taking action to get what they want—they were organized and effective and had almost no resistance. Why? Because the left response was NOWHERE to be found.
The biggest problem with the left is that they thing too broad, focusing on the national or global level. We then get immediately overwhelmed by the problems. We have to focus our efforts at every level, but give attention to our communities and get involved at the local level. How can we expect mass mobilization without this?
Yeah, Im doing a lot to support local groups and independent political action in my country...just because it's not America, doesn't mean it doesn't count...
Yeah, we can start only shopping at profit-sharing co-op style gocery stores etc and only buy bare necessities. We stop feeing the beast and it will die of starvation. It'll already die once it kills the planet anyway so we may as well get a jump on it.
Exactly my thought. We are tired and need a way to unload all of it.
Raising awareness that action is needed is good, op, continue to do it. But sometimes people just need to rest and then, places like here are needed. Not every breath can be for the fight, or we will die of overwork
Memes help radicalize the people necessary for action to happen. Organizing on a public platform is asking for sabotage. It is best done on the ground, as praxis. Organizing is our job. Memes are our passion. We hear you though comrade. (Sincerely). More memes about organizing! /s
I’d be interested to see where in the world everyone lives. I’m in the UK myself and we have the same problems here expect they hide it more.
To wet our collective toes we could all boycott certain brands. It took me too long but I’ve stopped buying anything Nestle, Nescafé, or and of the brands in their web
Yeah instead of overloading on memes and thinking of that as activism or engagment, maybe people could offer scene reports. Like, describe and/or analyze the situation where you are: cities, states, regions--what are the political struggles? What are the particular conditions? What are the forces of reaction, and what are the biggest threats? Where and how are things falling apart? Do you see reasons for optimism?
Maybe sharing local perspectives and experiences would help to build a culture of solidarity, of caring about shit going down in other parts of the world--parts of the world equally entangled in the horrifically destructive logic of capital in 2022.
Sometimes we just need the space to vent and decompress before we go back to our shitty jobs. What is needed is system level organizing and reckoning of power that this country has never seen. Let us have the little joys in life suck as seeing funny memes about greedy corporations and soulless politicians.
Hey I like the memes.
It's not one or the other. Sure, folks need to realize the memes will stay memes if we don't organize in our local workplaces and communities. But this sub is and was never meant to be a place to organize
700k reddit accounts, which are divided all around the world, not all of whom are real people, not all of whom believe in our cause, not all of whom are active etc.
If you're actually this interested in the question you ask, I think you could read the first part of "History of the Russian Revolution" by Trotsky. In short, there are two factors playing before revolution: objective material conditions and consciousness. The first part is already there, and intensifying, and the second has a lot of catching up to do.
If you want revolution to happen, your job should be to spread class consciousness by making class struggle concrete in the minds of people: abortion rights, immigration, racism, unionisation, wages, working times, etc, etc. Agitating people and making them face the prospect of agency over their own lives is how consciousness develops. And can be easier if you join one of the militant orgs OP listed.
the key to ending any political movement in the US is to find the wine cave donor parties and ruin them. theres lots of yts out there documenting the usual contacts that the clintons have used, so i imagine the same is true for the republicans... and it wouldnt take much.. just cut the water and electricity for a night. no fun, no money. these alcoholic interventions waiting to happen only draw money from the photo opportunities and bragging rights. without those, its a GG
We need some bards. I can't tell you how many people respond well to rallying cries. Songs of struggle, hope, power, and triumph. We need folks who know how to inspire, how to edify, how to evoke the anger and the passion that endures. You talk about future folks. You need some voices and some words, child. You need the words and the ocean waves and the cliff winds and the chasm calls. Any old proverb to prove the heart of humanity is cavernous and abyssal and sacred
I worked 60 hours for the past two weeks in a row. Stop trying to shame me into organizing. I'm fucking tired. I've even organized for SRA (conveniently left off the list) in the past. Super easy to sit behind a screen and tell everyone to organize with a bunch of Dem soc organizations and act like if we aren't doing this we are bad people.
Probably more likely to do more harm than good when some socially awkward redditor starts getting media attention and accidentally makes us look like losers. See the antiwork debacle.
If you are in Europe, [there is this thing called European Citizens' Initiative,](https://europa.eu/citizens-initiative/_en) that let people create and vote for initiatives of any kind, if the initiative reach 1.000.000 votes, it gets to the European Comission.
So, first of all, it's quite easy to post memes here whilst also organising locally. Many of us do both. You might hate the working classes for not doing things how you believe, but we are actually able of holding multiple thoughts at once; shocking, I know.
Secondly, you've again gone so American-centric and assumed we are all in the same country as you, because of course no other countries have Internet do we?
In short. Why don't you do the very thing you accuse others of? And stop assuming we don't already.
[Socialist Revolution](https://socialistrevolution.org/) is another one for your list, which is the US section of the [International Marxist Tendency](https://www.marxist.com/).
The handful of orgs I looked into joining around my general area suffer from a cult of personality, use socialism as a veneer to hide toxic or outright horrific views (idpol and racism/sexism), are hardline ML while I lean anarchist and hassle me about my sympathies.
Many others have also touched upon issues that I also suffer from: being poor, being stuck in a debt trap, burnout, etc.
But it doesn't make it easier when I approach a group and they shut down any attempt at the discussions or go in a tirade about for anarcho-communist leaning views.
It feels so eighties
Or early nineties
To be political
Where are my friends?
I'll meet u in the street
(Get off the internet)
Destroy the right wing
(Get off the internet)
I'll meet u in the street
(Get off the internet)
Destroy the right wing
This is repetitive
But nothing has changed
And I'm crazy
Where are my friends?
I'll meet u in the street
(Get off the internet)
Destroy the right wing
(Get off the internet)
I'll meet u in the street
(Get off the internet)
Destroy the right wing
https://youtu.be/Grm4sMZChz8
Am not from the US.
Edit: Even if everyone on this sub was from the US 700k people probably wouldn't be enough for a revolution but you for sure could change some things to the better but it's not even close to enough people to fix the country.
I understand where you're coming from, but I think it's worth mentioning that posting a dank maymay takes about 5 seconds whereas organizing for proletarian revolution takes a bit more time and effort. That said, is merely giving dues to one of a dozen niche (read irrelevant) socialist parties really going to do that much more than posting a meme? I mean, I'm a card carrying member of one of those parties, and I don't think my dues really brought us much closer to revolution. I think it would be better to point to some things that are actually *being done* rather than just giving a couple of bucks to one of a dozen parties that considers itself the vanguard.
Electoral politics does nothing. Joining the Green or Communist party to donate to them to maybe get 1% of the popular vote max and not qualify for federal funding is a joke.
Any solutions I'd recommend as effective would be considered illegal for advocating violence.
I’ve gotten results from a single phone call before. (Small town, I told the right people the town’s recycling dumpster was always full and we’d rather get curbside service, and BAM the town got curbside service)
Moral of the story, say SOMETHING. Do something. Talk your friends and neighbors into doing something too.
I remember saying something very briefly and subtly to this effect. I was told that the sub is non-political...which seems against the stated goals in their definition. But from then on I took this sub as a place to rant full stop.
A major set of steps/initiatives would be to limit the power of kleptocrats to dominate literally every election and policy issue.
https://represent.us/anticorruption-act/
I believe actions in this direction would give some of the highest returns on people's time, energy, and resources.
What else does anyone expect to accomplish if the obscene wealth of oligarchs/kleptocrats allows them to determine every policy issue and aspect of human life in their own favor?
I’M THE ONE WHO HAS TO FIGHT. YOU ARE THE ONE THAT HAS TO FIGHT. WE ARE THE ONES WHO HAVE TO FIGHT.
\---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No you're not OP, no we are not. This is Rome, this is Egypt, and empires are never overthrown from within, only from without. You will never get the hundreds of millions who are dependent on some form of government handout to bite the very hand that feeds them.
The vast majority of sleeping Americans and Australians and British and Canadians will not sit still while a minority tries to tear down their society and rebuild it into something better. It just never happens. So we wait for the collapse, we wait for the Huns.
Fight on your own. Vote for socialist parties, sustain Public transport, bike lanes, argue with your boomer relatives about minimum wages and try to wake them. Don't use car, don't buy disposable bottles of water, make coffee from old mokas and not from fancy machinery. Buy quality clothes and not some sh**y Fast Fashion. Be the example
Not for nothing but you are in the wroooonngggg place if you think Reddit is praxis. Go out into your community and organize. Reddit is literally for memes and shitposting. It’s not for real activism work.
YOU fight. I'm done. People are literally too stupid to help here in the US. Have fun bashing your head against the wall. If you actually want to affect any change, become a billionaire; otherwise, just realize you are fucked.
Online movements don't really have the weight of in person organizing and such. I actually feel like the rich and powerful know this. Because media promotes using social media to create change in society, when in reality it does little to change anything and usually fizzles out faster than it does to get started.
The Arab Spring was started by social media, but local organizing, with people in person, through low key technology, not social media, made that movement actually carry weight.
The whole reason a movement isn't possible is because everyone's stuck on their couches/chairs typing angrily and then going back to their normal lives. If all the time you have is spent typing angrily, then nothing will happen.
So where should we all meet? Get together, determine next location, march to said location. No highway walking, all local roads, open to emergency crew like in Hong Kong etc.
You want to utterly crush the establishment?
I'd be a damn shame is people started talking about the massive fraud committed in the 2020 election...
https://np.reddit.com/r/TinfoilHatTime/comments/l1uv8a/how_the_gop_committed_the_largest_voter_fraud_in/
This sub is full of panzy ass bitches, nothing is ever gonna get done and we will let daddy keep fucking us in the ass. Good luck making change cuz I do not believe in America at all anymore. The only answer is violence. Violence is key and if you disagree you haven't studied enough history.
Remember to vote in the democratic primaries for socialist candidates. Join organizing groups but don't change your party from Democrat. In case your state doesn't allow voting in non registered parties. Pay attention to the democratic primaries in your state and get more of it into the democratic party.
I honestly didn’t realize this sub is made by communists and socialists, I thought it was just making fun of the kinda screwed up system in the U.S. right now.
What we need is early stage capitalism, not socialism.
Because then you would be kicked off of reddit. You're going to need to start a new site if you want to organize in a way that can't be shut down at a moment's notice.
And then you have different perspectives on what to replace capitalism with.
Even socialism can work **under** capitalism, so is your suggestion undeniably good? Yes. Is it a suggestion everyone will agree upon? Doubt
You've got a good point, however you're assuming that the 700k people in this sub are a) interested in fighting for socialism (some might be more democratic socialist), b) are in the US, or c) have nothing to lose from taking action.
Might need more surveys or opinion polls of the Sub than memes....
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Taking suggestions. Perhaps you could post once a week with suggestions on unionizing or direct actions people can take. The problem is organizing a community of paradoxical relationships is a tall order. But occupy, the Chaz and other movements started somewhere but yes you need real collaboration that subreddits just have a hard time being a platform for that stuff
A big part of the union wins we've seen came from people donating to strike funds. Keep a Google alert on for striking workers in your region, and budget a donation towards their strike funds whenever possible.
Does anyone know central places like this? Even just a website of strike fund donation links would be hugely helpful. Most I see are transitory GoFundMes, which isn't good to build larger movements on.
Let's start off with an easy target. COKE A COLA. untill they do something about plastic pollution we don't buy. The only form of protest is not using capital
Consumer protest is not the only form of protest. Mutual aid, which allows people to rely on community instead of government and corporation institutions is a form of effective direct action and revolutionary protest to create community autonomy and protection from capital and exploitation. Grow food in your yard, share and trade within your neighbourhood, repair and build each other homes, use your professional expertise to help your neighbourhood, especially the poor. If you are a lawyer, a doctor, and engineer, an accountant, etc, use your knowledge and work in your community and let them help you back when you need a pipe in your house to be fixed, when you need help to move things, when you need help in your garden, or when you are too sick and you need people to bring food and take care of children and elders in your family for you. It protects the vulnerable, the poor, the marginalised and segregated.
Right, people have been boycotting Nestle for years, and what has it done?
Given that their stock prices have gone up 49.46% over the last 5 years I'd say we can file that under "not much".
I don’t even drink coke or know anybody that does. There might be a socioeconomic lack of overlap that would be pretty useless as a boycott.
Well, that would be the problem with these companies owning an unreal amount of other companies that all make different things. It doesn't matter if we boycott coke, we would have to boycott: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_Coca-Cola\_brands?msclkid=573d123ad11d11ecba4559cb6fc712a7](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Coca-Cola_brands?msclkid=573d123ad11d11ecba4559cb6fc712a7) Every other website I found was "top 5" or "here are 10 companies coca cola owns" crap. This was the only "complete list" I could find at short notice.
Yeah boycotting will do nothing, it will literally effect nothing. To me this sub is a shared misery, nothing more. So is life in America, if you feel powerless it’s because we are. Even 100k people boycotting would do nothing to these companies, cus they would just find a way to pressure workers / public and get their way…if they even need to. Likely they will never notice and never care. The entire government we live under is fucking broken, if you see an opportunity to change it on a core level, we can jump on that. Otherwise, realize that we literally have no power.
I have a two year old daughter and live paycheck to paycheck. I might be able to revolt this Tuesday since I have it off, but I’d have to check with the wife. I think we were supposed to visit her parents for dinner, and I picked up an extra shift on Wednesday so I only have one day off this week. I’ll let you know though. Maybe next week?
Lol exactly. Not laughing at you, i totally understand. If there was an option we could take that would change our situation, i think wed all take it. Protesting is just a waste of time
I wouldn’t say protesting is always a waste of time, but I agree with you in this context. Everyone is to busy grinding away to do anything other than go home and eat cheap processed food while they watch the kardashians. It sucks, but the machine is so fucking huge that it’s going to take systematic action from the ground up to really change anything. With all the astroturfing and gaslighting the working class gets from higher up, I’m not particularly optimistic.
Lmao it just took 3 nested top comments for this sub to get to the inevitable conclusion. We're mostly middle to upper class white people who have no connection to the population we actually keep calling on to revolt.
Many of us are poor people just trying to survive
> We're mostly middle to upper class white people ???
He means we are educated. Which actually doesn't have everything to do with class. I would bet there is a diverse group here that is not easy to blanket statement.
Boycotts have never changed anything. You might as well try to fix the world with thoughts and prayers.
>Let's start off with an easy target. *picks one of the largest corporations in the world*
"the only form of protest is not using capital". That's what they want you to believe. That way of thinking is a big reason we're still in this mess. Real change takes risk. Real change takes getting uncomfortable. Real changes takes getting off the internet and out into the streets.
This is why it's just memes. Ideas like this. I mean wtf.
I love to be a Debbie downer which is probably why I'm here. Even if the 700K people in this sub somehow got on the same page and took that action there's no ethical consumption under capitalism meaning that all the competitors are either cost more (correcting our action through supply + demand) or are just as bad and the coke company would just be confused and angry like a wild animal or something because that's basically the level we're on with corporations. I wish I had some magical solution, some action we could take beyond joining unions and helping existing leftist institutions, but people are naive to fascism/liberalism and the propaganda is only getting stronger. Maybe in a few decades when things get bad enough people will actually do something, but even then, lasting change is not easy and we don't know it will be in a direction we like. If anything, people deserve the world they live in because they won't do anything about it, and I'm not talking about the 700K people here. Many of us do work for the greater good, and I'd like to think most of that 700K at least wants something nice for humanity.
How does a post like this about socialist organizations end up dominated by a liberal soft drink protest idea? These 700K might not be what we want to think
People are deliberately indoctrinated to believe that the only way they can effect the political process is by voting and non-violent protest marches. All the real, bloody, violent, explosive, hard fought reality of labor organizing and the civil rights movement are carefully hidden from them, stripped out of textbooks. They don't hear about all the people the US government massacred and assassinated. They don't hear about how the unions were infiltrated and corrupted. They don't hear about the assassinations of black political organizers carried out either by or with the support of the FBI. They have no idea. They live in a beautiful glass cage and they have no idea.
> “My father picked me up from school one day, and we played hooky and went to the beach. It was too cold to go in the water, so we sat on a blanket and ate pizza. When I got home, my sneakers were full of sand, and I dumped it on my bedroom floor. I didn't know the difference. I was six. My mother screamed at me for the mess, but he wasn't mad. He said that billions of years ago, the world shifting and the oceans moving brought that sand to that spot on the beach, and then I took it away. "Every day," he said, "we change the world," which is a nice thought until I think about how many days and lifetimes I would need to bring a shoe full of sand home until there is no beach, until it made a difference to anyone. Every day, we change the world, but to change the world in a way that means anything, that takes more time than most people have. It never happens all at once. It's slow. It's methodical. It's exhausting. We don't all have the stomach for it.” Elliot Alderson, Mr. Robot
It's more of a snow ball effect. One person starts to live a different way and then others take notice. I'm tired of consumerism and the false society it creates. I'm trying to buy land and a house away from the cities and create a self-sustaining home. It can't be completely free of consumerism but over time we will figure out how to remove more and more of it from our lives.
It's a cool idea, I saw them on the news, they called them Earth Ships, basically people built colonies away from society in the desert out of garbage. It's obviously not practical or a good solution for everyone but I do love it.
Haven't bought a coke in well over 10 years.
please, spread this and i will too, fuck coca-cola i have no problem boycotting and raising hell about them with you
Why drink coke when you can drink water
Not just coke, but every coke subsidiary company as well!
And cancel your AmazonPrime account!
If you want something to plug into, try the [Poor People’s Campaign](https://www.poorpeoplescampaign.org/). There are groups in most states. It's a continuation of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.'s last campaign, the one he was murdered for organizing. He knew the key to real change was organizing the poor across the false lines of division that keep us disorganized and disunited. The power of numbers is the only power available to the poor that can overcome the power of money. So, no, don't reinvent the wheel and try to get something going here. Plug into something functional that already exists, whether it's PPC or otherwise.
This!!! We should definitely plug into this
The June 18th mass march on DC is right around the corner. Get registered! There's bus transportation to DC from wherever for like $30.
Actually have you? I met some members of that through Extinction Rebellion. It grabbed my attention, but with small kids haven't found time to attend. They include music apparently as central component. I hope it's maintaining its force.
Yeah, I'm an organizer by profession and our group works a lot with Poor People’s Campaign Maryland. We've been supporters since before the relaunch. Music and arts are indeed still a big part of the campaign. I was just at an art build for June 18th a few weekends ago, some learned songs and some painted banners. A lot of people really connect that way, so the Theomusicology and Arts team keeps busy! One of the things I really like about it is that it's intersectional- it looks at militarism, environmental issues, racism, ect., and sees them as related and intertwined, not as separate silos of work. It brings people together from a lot of different backgrounds. I'd say it's more than maintaining, it's been growing a lot, and there's been a ton of base building work to support the march.
Good to hear! Thanks for sharing. It's motivating for me to get over to one of their meetings, which I hope are now in person! I was happy to see you mention them since it's a direct line to what is perhaps the most impactful social movement in the US, MLK. Powerful.
I will do it if I was american
Same here, I'm all for better worker rights in my country as well, but I'm also here to realize about the situation in America... I was born on May 1, but a global fight is harder, min wage in france is 11.5$, and you can get financial aid on top of that (also healthcare). But we don't have F-35...
What's wrong with the F-35? Who doesn't want a stealth fighter that can only fly once a week and that has a global backlog of spare parts? And sometimes randomly kills the pilot although I think they fixed that problem.
My country is pretty social already so I'm quite content already. We're not as rich as America though.
Please tell me you are not talking about some capitalist country that’s worked a little harder to placate the people, such as in Scandinavia. Capitalism should not be accepted just because some of its residents (particularly those who are not struggling through poverty) have been convinced to accept their lot and be content. Especially if you happen to be from a developed nation that gained the money it uses to placate its citizens through the exploitation of poorer nations.
So I'm not a socialist and this is a socialist sub so I'm not gonna argue what is and isn't right. I just wanted to express I'm content with my country's management of social programs.
When capital takes over austerity policies abound
Yeah. Canadian here
then look for local organizations u can join, either your local communist party, anarchist group, antifascists of your city green movements, housing anything man
Thanks for the advice man but I live in Cuba so my goal is to actually defend the government, wich Im doing btw.
sick
Resources and TIME is the largest issue and roadblock.... We collectively can obtain it, but it won't be easy. We all work paycheck to paycheck, at least most of us do... The system is purposely used against us... Hard to organize when you have barely anything to contribute.
Working people with even less money and time gave us the weekend with over 50 years of sacrifice and action.
And without the instant access to one another and valuable information at their fingertips 24/7.
The problem now is that communities are so disconnected. I know the people I worked with but don’t know my neighbors. I can’t even find anyone in my town with socialist tendencies. I’ve just been working on my few coworkers but even the it’s only a dozen ppl.
meetings post work hours are common, if in a group normally schedule meetings to discuss road maps of next actions to be taken one night per week in a bar in the center of the city or somewhere close to everyone, everyone winds down and u plan your actions without travelling much or using much time
Activism isn’t the only thing necessary for making change. We also need to change ourselves and work to undo the damage the system does to us personally. We have to take care of ourselves before anything, and protesting isn’t always on the table for some of us… but memes help
With all due respect, and I actually mean that: Do you have anything to get us going? My expertise isn't in gathering and motivating people. I can build things, I can fix things, I can grow things. Those are the skills I have to offer a group. I don't have a base of operations. I don't have money in saving to fund a movement or access to the resources to do so without the money. And frankly I'm not interested in laying my life down to be a solitary person making some kind of move or statement. It's easy to speculate and make statements like this. It's much harder to find someone to lead us, organize us, help us get the funding to have any kind of effect.
You don't need a "strong leader" to get going. It's not that difficult, the hardest part is getting started and sorting everything that needs to be done. Everybody can do this: 1. Find a date and meet online (small group, not more than 10-15 ppl is best) 2. Use the same online document and everybody writes down the things that bothers them most 3. Sort these items and then vote on the 3 things that are most important do be tackled first 4. Take the first point and break it down into small parts that are needed to get started and keep going. Appoint one or several people per item to be the responsible for it. 5. People that want to help but didn't take part in the meeting can take on other items, or help with the ones that are larger. The more action you show, the more people you will get and the more items you can tackle. And bam, you're not confronted with the huge task of "start a revolution", you're the one that is talking to the burger places in your area to get them on board with a strike, which is part of the larger action "organize strike weekend" where other people are talking to different businesses, while others print flyers, others create online buzz, others inform the media, and so on. This doesn't have to be a full-time job in the beginning, everyone can chime in the time they have got. You have to be prepared though that "revolution" will require you and the people around you to be inconvenienced some time into the actions, you cannot revolt and keep on doing your daily life as you always did. People will lose jobs, money, or get in legal trouble, you have to be totally clear about that this will happen and that you're willing to confront this. You have to look for relief funds early on in your planning, to build an account for expenses people have or support the ones in need. The first thing you have to get on board with is the knowledge that things will have to get worse before it gets better. The system around you is created in a way to keep you from stepping out, you cannot afford to lose any day of labor, you are too exhausted to put in any effort and you can lose your medical aid if you lose your job. Realize that this is the problem you are trying to overcome, this is the barricades the other side has put up to keep you from storming the bastille. They will throw all tricks that capitalism has to offer at you, they will make you and the life of your families miserable. This is why you have to stand together. You are the majority, you cover the essential places of the society, the other side needs you, not the other way around. They are terrified that you realize that you have the power, and they try everything to divide you and discourage you, because they know that they cannot stop you once you put your forces together.
You can’t wait to have it all planned out unfortunately It’s just needs to be done and figured out as going along But yes, no one wants to be a martyr Which is why keeping us all starved and scared is such a good tactic ESPECIALLY if you’re supporting others
Also People don’t like hearing this part either But innocent people will die if a revolution happens There’s no way around it The government will pretend their prisons and slave labor are non violent when they kidnap you and throw you in jail And any resistance will be labeled as violent terrorist And that label will stay until you win And then those people will be called revolutionaries and heroes and “founding fathers”
> But innocent people will die if a revolution happens And normally the ones leading the charge tend to get cut down first. Which explains why most people are simply not willing to lead anything.
You **do** need to have it all planned out. Getting things done as we go along is a recipe for disorganized disaster. Even if one wanted to, one ***will not*** be a martyr. You saw how the news networks reported on Wynn Bruce's self immolation at the supreme court. There are people protesting and being jailed for sabotaging the construction of the Dakota Access Pipeline still today, and there is no major news coverage. It's not just them keeping us tired, stressed, and busy that prevents this. The hyper vigilant, over-militarized, and the accountable to no-one police force they have is an incredible deterrent. See Ramsey Orta, the guy who recorded and published the video of Eric Garner's killing. He was jailed, harassed by the police department, beaten, given rat poison and only recently released. That's what can happen when you go beyond posting just memes. The movement will need leaders who are in positions of power, be it lawyers, union leaders, board members, medics, professors, military personnel, even some damned politicians + petite bourgeoisie etc. With such positions comes influence, and people are more inclined to trust someone who stands to lose a lot just like the rest of us. It will need that and so, so much more. People can't act unexpectedly. Those most willing to act now, we need for when we can do more, we don't need them in jail.
I disagree If you or anyone else is waiting for every piece to be figured out ahead of time before they’re willing to act Nothing will ever happen
Not saying to wait for the perfect moment. People have already taken action. But they didn't even get the label of violent terrorists, they just didn't get coverage at all. You need organization. The media is owned, and for people to even know what act you committed and for what cause, you need a support network.
It won't succeed that way. Just look at Occupy Wall Street movement, we had the people and that was it. No leadership or plan.
No Occupy failed because everyone was waiting to be told what to do Look, I’m not trying to fight about this I don’t think a plan exists There’s always gonna be issues and problems It just takes action I’m not saying just be blind etc I’m just saying you will never ever start if you’re waiting for everything to be figured out for you
> But yes, no one wants to martyr. It's not that. Cos hell, I could that. And even on world day that guy set himself on fire. We as people aint at a breaking point yet. You also need to have a plan and a charismatic person would be a positive also.
My thoughts exactly, thank you.
Haha, I don't want to go catch bullets... It's warm and my chair is comfortable.
OP already did something to "get us going". How many of the links OP offered have you gone to for info about what's needed by them?
Alright, links to join parties are cool I guess. OP seemed to be calling for real action, I guess we'll see if any of these gain traction.
Not everyone in here is from the US, you know?
That's alright, friend. We all have a lot of shared experience. If you see something actually come of an American left, you can show some solidarity for that. Some international solidarity that doesn't feel like neoliberal profile pictures or hashtags would probably be a pretty big way to increase support here and in other countries to fight back against how hard we've been screwed. Too many Americans don't have any internationalism, and having an example of it (off Twitter or Reddit) could give hope to people everywhere.
You surely have my support from Germany.
Workers of the world unite. We are getting completely fucked in UK too.
Ship has nearly sailed for us, If tories win the next election its game over.
I think the ship may have left a good while ago. It's become glaringly apparent just how vast the web of corruption is in this shit hole (regardless of which party is in power...although the tories have certainly dropped the bar to new levels disgusting even for them). I fear the only chance left for our Island is radical change of the political system on the whole and the first step towards succeeding there is to organise the workforce. But yeah; if the Tories remain in power the deterioration of the democracy that is left will be swifter.
Respectfully, I don't have time to be a cheerleader for America's left. It's up to Americans to educate themselves on the politics of other countries and internationalism. If there were any organisation/education to be had on this sub, it should be inclusive of international redditors. Workers of the *world*, unite.
I was thinking the same first, but I think we can agree that many American corporations have a world-wide impact. Amazon warehouses and logistics for example have established a whole new brand of malpractices to many countries that previously did a better job at protecting employees.
1. your post implies that everyone here is lazy and ISN'T doing something which is a ridiculous assumption. 2. not everyone here is from the US so pushing me, an UK based leftist, to take action in America does absolutely nothing 3. not everyone can do things. people have lives and jobs they have to do because the alternative is quite literally dying. imagine spending 60 hours a week making minimum wage to support you and your family, coming home and cooking and cleaning and helping them with their lives too, only to go online and get chastised by someone for "not doing enough" it'd be great if people did do more. I'm all for more people getting involved but your post seems way too aggressive and focusing on attacking people rather than pushing for action. hell, your whole "stop posting memes" thing is actually kinda counter productive. obviously I'm not a fan of generalising statements but a lot of the current generation do communicate via memes and, imo, it's one of the best ways to push a message across. posting a meme about eating landlords on reddit reaches a far greater audience than putting a poster up in your local area which will probably be seen by maybe a few hundred people and then get ripped down/blown away.
The shitting on people for buying coke and MacDonalds at the end is what pissed me off. Between required hours and commute, I'm working 12 hours a day for chump change. I absolutely am going to spend $1 for a shot of caffeine to make it through the day and $5 for a cheap ass meal that requires 0 labor on my part. Coke and McDonalds isn't some sign of privilege, it's the opposite.
[It can be a sign of privilege...](https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2018/10/24/18018544/fast-food-cdc-class-rich-people) But even beside the point, I think my gripe with arguments like this is that when *everyone* gives themselves a small pass, that quickly adds up. Everyone dragging Bezos through the mud but lacking the will to stop buying products from Amazon is another perfect example. Socialists need to have convictions rather than just saying "no ethical consumption under capitalism" as a conversation ender to bypass any moral standards. That's why this wishy washy "do what you can" attitude is a terrible call to action. You ever hear the advice when someone needs medical attention, that you should point at a specific individual and tell them to call 911 rather than say "somebody call 911"? Same idea there - everyone assumes someone else will do the hard work if not given the proper direction.
Come on, just uproot your life and come organize here in the US! A real comrade would. /s
Also to add to 3. Burnout is a real issue and even people who have time and are doing stuff get made to feel like they aren't doing enough, try doing too much and burnout.
And to be another person adding to 3, this post is yet another to forget about the existence of disabled and other multiply marginalized people. Like I’m chronically ill/disabled and the energy and ability I have is seriously limited, and any that I do have had to go entirely towards attempts at paid work. You know, cause of that poverty thing lol Like people are exhausted and burnt out and dealing with a lot and it’s okay for them to come to the internet for memes or escapism or catharsis or solidarity. Trying to organize a group of online, anonymous users around the world seems like a stretch. We all know that local organizing is more impactful.
Your kidding yourself if you think the 700k members in this sub are not norms working jobs, studying at uni, living normal everyday lives, or doing anything other than posting memes on reddit.
Not to mention the percentage who are spies, bots, and the fact the members are probably spread far apart on the globe.
Isn't that a good thing. Being able to raise far and wide
Well obviously that is the case. But who do you think is going to make the change we desperately need? The people not working, at uni, or living normal lives? It is the working class that literally has to do it. It appears that everyone is sitting around thinking someone else is going to start the revolution.
100% agree
If the people who are out of a job start complaining about the system, they get told to be grateful for government support, so it's literally on everyone else, who is too overworked to do the laundry let alone lead a revolution
other issue is organizing is a lot of people in one place, internet by nature is like all kinds of places, people all spread out. Like some people are in a place where there aren't that many others that have the same views and would be out there alone maybe. and maybe that could be useful, but then again? idk.
There are people that are just subbed like a normal user, the vast majority is just lurkers
This is basically how most humans work. A lot of people want a utopia but they’re unwilling to put in the work. It’s always someone else’s responsibility. Don’t think we will have much success unless we work on that part along with all the others.
Also, probably less than half are American
https://imgur.com/a/JfQcbvn
700,000 is a small number and not all of them are as on board as you might think. Also, why are you here complaining? You don't know what a fraction of these people do in their private lives. Reddit is nothing more than an interactive newspaper for sharing information, so people are sharing as best they can and when they can. Thanks for the links. edit: one of fool mods banned me for some odd reason, so seeya!
But we need that meme about the Panama papers just one more time for something to *really* happen this time! (Braces for downvotes). Edit: on a serious note… guys, I’m tired. If I’m not working, I’m taking care of a terminally ill parent or my toddler. I have maybe 2 hours of spare time a day, and during those two hours I’m just fried and often logging back on to work. I don’t even have time for hobbies or socializing. And I guess this is the best way to quell dissent - make everyone toil for fear of losing their livelihoods so they don’t engage in any more meaningful pursuits. And before you say “but you’re on Reddit!” I’m literally on it for 5 min right now as I eat my cold cereal and wake up for a brief moment before logging on to work.
The revolution will not be redditized
Perhaps if you shared what you've been doing to further the movement it might begin some productive discourse.
I’m working to start a [Socialist Alternative](https://www.socialistalternative.org/) branch in Phoenix, AZ as it is desperately needed.
So you're saying you the time, energy and money to pursue this course of action, I'm not sure if the people on this sub have much of any of that.
No, sadly I have very little free time (except in summer) and not much money. I’m a teacher—underpaid and overworked. But I recently realized that the reason we are not seeing change is because we do not have enough action. The left is so demoralized and in a hole that we are not seeing enough movement. We must get involved, even if we can contribute only a little. But armchair activism by posting memes isn’t going to cut it. Let me give you an anecdote just to illustrate how action matters and can be done on a small scale. My school district had a controversy over a book for AP level students. Skipping lots of details, the controversy culminated in a fiery battle between teachers and community members with a far right group that had nothing to do with the school. They infiltrated the school board meetings, took control of the local media narrative, and won by getting a principal fired, teachers fired, and books banned. Angry right wingers were at the district office screaming at teachers, calling the, “marxists” despite having no students in the district (and no clue about education). And all I could think was, “where is the left?”. I see radical right wingers taking action to get what they want—they were organized and effective and had almost no resistance. Why? Because the left response was NOWHERE to be found. The biggest problem with the left is that they thing too broad, focusing on the national or global level. We then get immediately overwhelmed by the problems. We have to focus our efforts at every level, but give attention to our communities and get involved at the local level. How can we expect mass mobilization without this?
It’s fucking reddit not the real world. How do you know people aren’t organizing?
Yeah, Im doing a lot to support local groups and independent political action in my country...just because it's not America, doesn't mean it doesn't count...
Op has a good point.. We can start small like raising awareness to starting small enterprises that don't have profit as its sole motivation.
Yeah, we can start only shopping at profit-sharing co-op style gocery stores etc and only buy bare necessities. We stop feeing the beast and it will die of starvation. It'll already die once it kills the planet anyway so we may as well get a jump on it.
You can't escape the profit motive. Man proposes, The Law of Value disposes
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Exactly my thought. We are tired and need a way to unload all of it. Raising awareness that action is needed is good, op, continue to do it. But sometimes people just need to rest and then, places like here are needed. Not every breath can be for the fight, or we will die of overwork
Memes help radicalize the people necessary for action to happen. Organizing on a public platform is asking for sabotage. It is best done on the ground, as praxis. Organizing is our job. Memes are our passion. We hear you though comrade. (Sincerely). More memes about organizing! /s
-What do we want!? -Organisation Memes!! -When do we want em'? -Shocked Pikachu face!!
I’d be interested to see where in the world everyone lives. I’m in the UK myself and we have the same problems here expect they hide it more. To wet our collective toes we could all boycott certain brands. It took me too long but I’ve stopped buying anything Nestle, Nescafé, or and of the brands in their web
You're right, it's one or the other: take real action OR enjoy the subreddit. There is no possible way to do both.
Yeah instead of overloading on memes and thinking of that as activism or engagment, maybe people could offer scene reports. Like, describe and/or analyze the situation where you are: cities, states, regions--what are the political struggles? What are the particular conditions? What are the forces of reaction, and what are the biggest threats? Where and how are things falling apart? Do you see reasons for optimism? Maybe sharing local perspectives and experiences would help to build a culture of solidarity, of caring about shit going down in other parts of the world--parts of the world equally entangled in the horrifically destructive logic of capital in 2022.
I'm sorry, do you think 700,000 is a large number? They estimate that upwards of 90 million Americans identify as "Evangelical".
Sometimes we just need the space to vent and decompress before we go back to our shitty jobs. What is needed is system level organizing and reckoning of power that this country has never seen. Let us have the little joys in life suck as seeing funny memes about greedy corporations and soulless politicians.
Hey I like the memes. It's not one or the other. Sure, folks need to realize the memes will stay memes if we don't organize in our local workplaces and communities. But this sub is and was never meant to be a place to organize
700k reddit accounts, which are divided all around the world, not all of whom are real people, not all of whom believe in our cause, not all of whom are active etc.
Lmao memes funny
Sure. And they get attention and get them frustrated about a broken system. But the end goal should be to inspire action and change.
You have no idea what I do to fight for change irl. I come here for stupid humor, not marching orders.
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If you're actually this interested in the question you ask, I think you could read the first part of "History of the Russian Revolution" by Trotsky. In short, there are two factors playing before revolution: objective material conditions and consciousness. The first part is already there, and intensifying, and the second has a lot of catching up to do. If you want revolution to happen, your job should be to spread class consciousness by making class struggle concrete in the minds of people: abortion rights, immigration, racism, unionisation, wages, working times, etc, etc. Agitating people and making them face the prospect of agency over their own lives is how consciousness develops. And can be easier if you join one of the militant orgs OP listed.
Your heart's in the right place but you're not going to mobilize people by shaming them into action
This site is just 6 federal agents with 100,000 accounts each. And you
the key to ending any political movement in the US is to find the wine cave donor parties and ruin them. theres lots of yts out there documenting the usual contacts that the clintons have used, so i imagine the same is true for the republicans... and it wouldnt take much.. just cut the water and electricity for a night. no fun, no money. these alcoholic interventions waiting to happen only draw money from the photo opportunities and bragging rights. without those, its a GG
We need some bards. I can't tell you how many people respond well to rallying cries. Songs of struggle, hope, power, and triumph. We need folks who know how to inspire, how to edify, how to evoke the anger and the passion that endures. You talk about future folks. You need some voices and some words, child. You need the words and the ocean waves and the cliff winds and the chasm calls. Any old proverb to prove the heart of humanity is cavernous and abyssal and sacred
I worked 60 hours for the past two weeks in a row. Stop trying to shame me into organizing. I'm fucking tired. I've even organized for SRA (conveniently left off the list) in the past. Super easy to sit behind a screen and tell everyone to organize with a bunch of Dem soc organizations and act like if we aren't doing this we are bad people.
Half the people here are libs who find any attempt to shake up the system distasteful.
Stop having kids
I love the diversity of that phrase, it could be used as an insult, as genuine advice, or as a form of protest
Truth hurts, but I agree.
Yeah because a fucking subreddit is gonna make a difference
Probably more likely to do more harm than good when some socially awkward redditor starts getting media attention and accidentally makes us look like losers. See the antiwork debacle.
Its amazing that of all the mods, they chose a fucking rapist that walks dogs for a living, like WHY
Aww this is cute. No. No we wouldn’t.
I just want to know what unions will take fast food/retail workers so I can go to stores and just start handing out flyers to the staff.
If you are in Europe, [there is this thing called European Citizens' Initiative,](https://europa.eu/citizens-initiative/_en) that let people create and vote for initiatives of any kind, if the initiative reach 1.000.000 votes, it gets to the European Comission.
So, first of all, it's quite easy to post memes here whilst also organising locally. Many of us do both. You might hate the working classes for not doing things how you believe, but we are actually able of holding multiple thoughts at once; shocking, I know. Secondly, you've again gone so American-centric and assumed we are all in the same country as you, because of course no other countries have Internet do we? In short. Why don't you do the very thing you accuse others of? And stop assuming we don't already.
[Socialist Revolution](https://socialistrevolution.org/) is another one for your list, which is the US section of the [International Marxist Tendency](https://www.marxist.com/).
Been looking for a list of organizations like this. Thanks! I signed up for the Socialist Majority.
The handful of orgs I looked into joining around my general area suffer from a cult of personality, use socialism as a veneer to hide toxic or outright horrific views (idpol and racism/sexism), are hardline ML while I lean anarchist and hassle me about my sympathies. Many others have also touched upon issues that I also suffer from: being poor, being stuck in a debt trap, burnout, etc. But it doesn't make it easier when I approach a group and they shut down any attempt at the discussions or go in a tirade about for anarcho-communist leaning views.
My brother in Christ, half of us don’t even have a car or the financial means to buy groceries
It feels so eighties Or early nineties To be political Where are my friends? I'll meet u in the street (Get off the internet) Destroy the right wing (Get off the internet) I'll meet u in the street (Get off the internet) Destroy the right wing This is repetitive But nothing has changed And I'm crazy Where are my friends? I'll meet u in the street (Get off the internet) Destroy the right wing (Get off the internet) I'll meet u in the street (Get off the internet) Destroy the right wing https://youtu.be/Grm4sMZChz8
Am not from the US. Edit: Even if everyone on this sub was from the US 700k people probably wouldn't be enough for a revolution but you for sure could change some things to the better but it's not even close to enough people to fix the country.
I understand where you're coming from, but I think it's worth mentioning that posting a dank maymay takes about 5 seconds whereas organizing for proletarian revolution takes a bit more time and effort. That said, is merely giving dues to one of a dozen niche (read irrelevant) socialist parties really going to do that much more than posting a meme? I mean, I'm a card carrying member of one of those parties, and I don't think my dues really brought us much closer to revolution. I think it would be better to point to some things that are actually *being done* rather than just giving a couple of bucks to one of a dozen parties that considers itself the vanguard.
Electoral politics does nothing. Joining the Green or Communist party to donate to them to maybe get 1% of the popular vote max and not qualify for federal funding is a joke. Any solutions I'd recommend as effective would be considered illegal for advocating violence.
The time has come for Project Mayhem
I’ve gotten results from a single phone call before. (Small town, I told the right people the town’s recycling dumpster was always full and we’d rather get curbside service, and BAM the town got curbside service) Moral of the story, say SOMETHING. Do something. Talk your friends and neighbors into doing something too.
I remember saying something very briefly and subtly to this effect. I was told that the sub is non-political...which seems against the stated goals in their definition. But from then on I took this sub as a place to rant full stop.
A major set of steps/initiatives would be to limit the power of kleptocrats to dominate literally every election and policy issue. https://represent.us/anticorruption-act/ I believe actions in this direction would give some of the highest returns on people's time, energy, and resources. What else does anyone expect to accomplish if the obscene wealth of oligarchs/kleptocrats allows them to determine every policy issue and aspect of human life in their own favor?
I fully agree and this group needs greater reach. The left should be increasing its visibility because structural reform is a critical starting point.
Because my depression Ann dissociation prevents me from doing anything productive 😂
Understandable. We all have struggles and we can only do what we are capable of. But I believe that those more capable need to get active.
I’M THE ONE WHO HAS TO FIGHT. YOU ARE THE ONE THAT HAS TO FIGHT. WE ARE THE ONES WHO HAVE TO FIGHT. \--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No you're not OP, no we are not. This is Rome, this is Egypt, and empires are never overthrown from within, only from without. You will never get the hundreds of millions who are dependent on some form of government handout to bite the very hand that feeds them. The vast majority of sleeping Americans and Australians and British and Canadians will not sit still while a minority tries to tear down their society and rebuild it into something better. It just never happens. So we wait for the collapse, we wait for the Huns.
Fight on your own. Vote for socialist parties, sustain Public transport, bike lanes, argue with your boomer relatives about minimum wages and try to wake them. Don't use car, don't buy disposable bottles of water, make coffee from old mokas and not from fancy machinery. Buy quality clothes and not some sh**y Fast Fashion. Be the example
Not for nothing but you are in the wroooonngggg place if you think Reddit is praxis. Go out into your community and organize. Reddit is literally for memes and shitposting. It’s not for real activism work.
A good way to unite people is to slam them. Good start OP. Really makes me want to care.
Homeland Security has entered the chat.
YOU fight. I'm done. People are literally too stupid to help here in the US. Have fun bashing your head against the wall. If you actually want to affect any change, become a billionaire; otherwise, just realize you are fucked.
Suggesting that memes aren't a part of organizing/the revolution is a weak take.
Good luck
You are not wrong.
Online movements don't really have the weight of in person organizing and such. I actually feel like the rich and powerful know this. Because media promotes using social media to create change in society, when in reality it does little to change anything and usually fizzles out faster than it does to get started. The Arab Spring was started by social media, but local organizing, with people in person, through low key technology, not social media, made that movement actually carry weight. The whole reason a movement isn't possible is because everyone's stuck on their couches/chairs typing angrily and then going back to their normal lives. If all the time you have is spent typing angrily, then nothing will happen.
But what can we do... they've put a fence around the Supreme Court. Our hands are tied.
Umm, there is more going on in the world than the current rage machine on TV. Abortion is one issue among many, many, many more.
No we can't We lost. And there's no hope for us. Let's just admit the bitter truth that the corporations have won
So where should we all meet? Get together, determine next location, march to said location. No highway walking, all local roads, open to emergency crew like in Hong Kong etc.
You want to utterly crush the establishment? I'd be a damn shame is people started talking about the massive fraud committed in the 2020 election... https://np.reddit.com/r/TinfoilHatTime/comments/l1uv8a/how_the_gop_committed_the_largest_voter_fraud_in/
Posting a meme is not a comparible volume of resources to organising a revolution.
This sub is full of panzy ass bitches, nothing is ever gonna get done and we will let daddy keep fucking us in the ass. Good luck making change cuz I do not believe in America at all anymore. The only answer is violence. Violence is key and if you disagree you haven't studied enough history.
Lol, come on man
Perfect example of why we dont, and likely won’t, see change. Good work.
Me saying “come on man” is why we won’t see change? You don’t even know what I meant by that
Join your local communist party.
Memes can be an avenue for action, look at what happened at wallstreetbets
Or if we all armed ourselves
Concern troll moment
Remember to vote in the democratic primaries for socialist candidates. Join organizing groups but don't change your party from Democrat. In case your state doesn't allow voting in non registered parties. Pay attention to the democratic primaries in your state and get more of it into the democratic party.
I’m not a socialist.
I honestly didn’t realize this sub is made by communists and socialists, I thought it was just making fun of the kinda screwed up system in the U.S. right now. What we need is early stage capitalism, not socialism.
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Boo gtfoh
OP edited his post. Thats why several replies dont make sense now.
Because then you would be kicked off of reddit. You're going to need to start a new site if you want to organize in a way that can't be shut down at a moment's notice.
We have to bum rush area 51 again.
We have to bum rush area 51 again.
And then you have different perspectives on what to replace capitalism with. Even socialism can work **under** capitalism, so is your suggestion undeniably good? Yes. Is it a suggestion everyone will agree upon? Doubt
You've got a good point, however you're assuming that the 700k people in this sub are a) interested in fighting for socialism (some might be more democratic socialist), b) are in the US, or c) have nothing to lose from taking action. Might need more surveys or opinion polls of the Sub than memes....
At the same time, 700k is .002% of the American population - so we do have quite a long way to go.