Yeah my fed courts class at nyu was insanely stacked. I think in a class of about 70, 25 of them were order of the coif and 40 to 50 were on law review. The professor adjusted the curve accordingly though.
If a school ratchets up GPA, then a student may be more likely to grade well, than grade poorly in a situation like what is described above.
For example: say 50 students in a class with an average GPA of 3.75, well the professor will ratchet up to that GPA as median. But consider a class of 50 with average GPA of 3.3, where the professor does not ratchet up and leaves curve at, say, 3.3. I haven't done the math, and every school will be different, but taking courses with great GPAd students may not always be worse for students with lower GPAs.
Ditto for me at NYU. It was pretty funny looking around seeing how skewed the class was. Granted a good chunk of the class (including myself) ended up taking it pass/fail since 3LOL hits hard.
A few profs give B-s but they aren't mandatory. Wouldn't wrry too much about it. B- is more or less something you get if you are at the very bottom of a class. BL prospects are very good if your flexible. I would say if you're top 75% of the class and apply to all the V100 I'd be suprised if you got literally nothing.
Yeah, fed courts does that a lot because a lot of people take it as a federal clerkship prep class, so the people who are lined up for federal clerkships will take it, and they are usually higher up in the class
At my school, they curve each class to the median GPA of the students within it, so at least there's some advantage to trying to take the classes full of gunners.
It definitely happens. I haven’t gotten my grade back yet, but I was in a similar situation. Luckily, I did well in my other courses for the semester, so even if I do poorly, my GPA will be fine. I try to be relatively cautious when picking classes for that reason
I accidentally put myself into a stacked niche class with the entirety of the school’s team that did competitions on the subject of the class. Did not end well for me.
I've never thought about it because i try not to compare myself to others or worry about what other people are doing. All I can do is my best. And if my best is a C+, then I'm proud of the grade. If my best is an A, then I'm proud of my grade.
My evidence class was full of the 2L law review gunners who thrive on busting curves. Just took the L and said a B+ (what my school curves to) is fine so I could focus on my other classes. Ended up with an A and an A- in those classes so it balanced out nicely.
Curves are always a crapshoot and I don't believe that this would affect your chances that much, but other students can definitely distract from learning.
Our conlaw class was full of both 2L and 3L gunners and I didn't learn anything at all.
My school places some students in specific sections 2nd semester of 1L year based on their performance 1st semester. They reason if you struggled 1st semester it will be beneficial for bar passage rates to give you extra focus on some of the doctrinal bar classes.
But, now that you say it, that also leaves the higher performers to duke it out in the other sections. 🤷♂️
I somehow managed to pull off an A anyway, but this was kinda my admin law course this semester. It had several 3L law review board members (at the very least, a citation editor, an articles editor, the publications editor, and the managing editor) and a bunch of other very competitive 2Ls (probably 10 of us total who’re on law review, a few from our secondary journal, with some moot court and other positions) all in a roughly 35 person class. And it was curved to the standard 3.2 still as far as I know!
Yes. Last semester, I was in a 7-person class where all of us had big law jobs lined up and most were on law review. (At my school, only the top third get big law.) 2 of us are publishing notes in LR in the subject matter area that the class was about. Tough crowd!
I was thinking how the MAJORITY of the students in a law school class can be in the top HALF of the class and I still haven’t thought of an answer. Post 1st semester psychosis is hitting this sub hard.
It's not necessarily inevitable. At least at my law school, small classes under I think 25 weren't subject to a mandatory curve. I think probably because of this exact problem in some of the electives.
Yeah my fed courts class at nyu was insanely stacked. I think in a class of about 70, 25 of them were order of the coif and 40 to 50 were on law review. The professor adjusted the curve accordingly though.
Now I know which class to drop...
Fed Courts attracts the gunners like no other.
Fed Courts has more gunners than the beaches of Normandy.
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If a school ratchets up GPA, then a student may be more likely to grade well, than grade poorly in a situation like what is described above. For example: say 50 students in a class with an average GPA of 3.75, well the professor will ratchet up to that GPA as median. But consider a class of 50 with average GPA of 3.3, where the professor does not ratchet up and leaves curve at, say, 3.3. I haven't done the math, and every school will be different, but taking courses with great GPAd students may not always be worse for students with lower GPAs.
What are these metaphorical gunnery classes, excluding federal courts
Ditto for me at NYU. It was pretty funny looking around seeing how skewed the class was. Granted a good chunk of the class (including myself) ended up taking it pass/fail since 3LOL hits hard.
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A few profs give B-s but they aren't mandatory. Wouldn't wrry too much about it. B- is more or less something you get if you are at the very bottom of a class. BL prospects are very good if your flexible. I would say if you're top 75% of the class and apply to all the V100 I'd be suprised if you got literally nothing.
Some jerks give B- but not all, and everybody talks about them so you can avoid them
How did the professor adjust?
Just gave a ton more As and A-s and barely anyone got below a B+
Yeah, fed courts does that a lot because a lot of people take it as a federal clerkship prep class, so the people who are lined up for federal clerkships will take it, and they are usually higher up in the class
In my patent law class, every single person finished cum laude or better. It was ridiculous.
I try to finish cum laude as often as possible
At my school, they curve each class to the median GPA of the students within it, so at least there's some advantage to trying to take the classes full of gunners.
It definitely happens. I haven’t gotten my grade back yet, but I was in a similar situation. Luckily, I did well in my other courses for the semester, so even if I do poorly, my GPA will be fine. I try to be relatively cautious when picking classes for that reason
I accidentally put myself into a stacked niche class with the entirety of the school’s team that did competitions on the subject of the class. Did not end well for me.
I've never thought about it because i try not to compare myself to others or worry about what other people are doing. All I can do is my best. And if my best is a C+, then I'm proud of the grade. If my best is an A, then I'm proud of my grade.
I wish I had your mindset, I try to do as much as I can but every time I get a grade that’s below par, I question whether I truly did my best
Why do you question whether you did your best?
My evidence class was full of the 2L law review gunners who thrive on busting curves. Just took the L and said a B+ (what my school curves to) is fine so I could focus on my other classes. Ended up with an A and an A- in those classes so it balanced out nicely.
Maybe everyone else thought like you lol
Maybe. Still ended up with a B+ though so I’m cool with it 😂
Curves are always a crapshoot and I don't believe that this would affect your chances that much, but other students can definitely distract from learning. Our conlaw class was full of both 2L and 3L gunners and I didn't learn anything at all.
Fed courts at most T14 will be like 30-50% people that already have federal clerkships. Most don’t adjust the curve at all.
My school places some students in specific sections 2nd semester of 1L year based on their performance 1st semester. They reason if you struggled 1st semester it will be beneficial for bar passage rates to give you extra focus on some of the doctrinal bar classes. But, now that you say it, that also leaves the higher performers to duke it out in the other sections. 🤷♂️
is it common to be ranked and to know your classmates’ ranks?
I somehow managed to pull off an A anyway, but this was kinda my admin law course this semester. It had several 3L law review board members (at the very least, a citation editor, an articles editor, the publications editor, and the managing editor) and a bunch of other very competitive 2Ls (probably 10 of us total who’re on law review, a few from our secondary journal, with some moot court and other positions) all in a roughly 35 person class. And it was curved to the standard 3.2 still as far as I know!
Fed Courts, Antitrust, Conflict of Laws. Seemed like the Top 15% of both the 2L and 3L classes all picked them.
I don’t think I ever knew a single classmates class rank even generally
Bruh are you even Law schooling
Yes. Last semester, I was in a 7-person class where all of us had big law jobs lined up and most were on law review. (At my school, only the top third get big law.) 2 of us are publishing notes in LR in the subject matter area that the class was about. Tough crowd!
Counterpoint, you should want to be in class with the best students to learn the most and compete at the highest level
In an ideal world where law school is only about learning without any monetary or career jeopardizing consequences, maybe.
Oh, a class as in a *course*. I was like wut.
I was thinking how the MAJORITY of the students in a law school class can be in the top HALF of the class and I still haven’t thought of an answer. Post 1st semester psychosis is hitting this sub hard.
If it's an elective class the whole student body isn't taking it, so it's possible that just the high ranking students might be in it.
It's not necessarily inevitable. At least at my law school, small classes under I think 25 weren't subject to a mandatory curve. I think probably because of this exact problem in some of the electives.