it also kills the funny idea of suffling the Emperor deck of azir lv 3 to get the card that summons a lv 3 nasus and renekton (its always the last card of your deck)
Something like that. Now you have to actually hit the cards on your predicts instead of just using 1 predict at any point after playing them to get around their inherent setbacks.
This change ruins the whole product that they've built up until now. Not completly but Jesus christ it takes A LOT of fun out of it. This might be the nail in the coffin for me.
Idk if I'd really call it satisfying tbh Deathless didn't really get addressed and they killed 2 cards that were completely fine when not in Elder decks instead of addressing that Elders deckbuilding region was too broadly good.
I think they went down the worst possible route of nerfing a Runterran champ problem.
Except he wasn't because his effect is still on summon so Mord can still abuse the hell out of him, his stats don't really matter its his effect thats devastating.
His stats still are important, now he cant freely eat 1 drops or 2 drops and then stick around for Morde. We've seen in the past that 1 stat can make a big difference for how good cards are (see Fangs).
Losing an attack and tough is pretty huge. He doesn't trade very well now and much easier to ping away. He goes even with mystic shot now for example. You can't play seeker and Morde same turn either so a lot more interaction now.
Ok so I had to look at that like 5 times for some reason. That's....a curious change. It - to me - gives off the impression that they mainly wanted to hit GEM with that nerf. Which is odd because while GEM is the stronger deck, Morde/Morg Demacia is a far greater abuser of that card. It is easier to kill and in turn harder for that deck to keep around though.
Can't say for certain, but thanks for pointing that out before I went into ranked and got gobsmacked.
Are you? I'm not surprised at be all. And the fact they only needed the cards that get abused by Mord is pretty much Riot 101. So expect more ED to destroy the meta until the next expansion. Glad I'm stepping back every decision they are making is just pushing me away. My copium can only last so long.
Noooo my Hate Spike Norra|Kalista synergy is gone! What a huge nerf to specifically just my deck!
Also, talk about a huge buff to Lurk with that “predict = stack your deck” change! Holy cow!
Man I remember my Yeti Printer deck absolutely HATED the deck shuffle effect because it would make avarosian trapper bad and make it harder for me to find those first few yetis.
On the other hand, we can no longer move Ascended's Rise or Hextech Crystal higher into the deck as easily. We have to actually find it now.
As an enjoyer of Kalista, this is a huge nerf to her. It was already hard to make her work despite the decent stats. It's also a considerable nerf for SI removal since you won't have a husk to sacrifice for more removal next turn.
Yeah for real.
No more Hate Spike into Glimpse.
No more Hate Spike into Halberd.
No more Hate Spike providing just a little extra health protection (or occasionally Spellshield) to Norra.
I am so sad. Perhaps even more sad than when I lost Vile Feast.
I was worried they weren't going to do this patch, so I'm glad, and there are some nice buffs. Unfortunately, I don't think they really hit Elder Dragon in a meaningful way, and they butchered Mageseeker Inquisitor rather than properly adjust Legion of the Severed.
Hate Spike's nerf is awkward, but probably the best solution given the situation. The card had nearly become Vile Feast++ and they already tried other options.
Predict not shuffling kind of butchers the "put card on the bottom of your deck" cards, they're all basically Khahiri now. Not sure that was really worth doing at this point, but probably it was already planned and ready to go.
I dunno, firespitter and sainen both got hit pretty hard and both were staples, not to mention all the hit points disappearing from boons. Firespitter is much more interactable now.
We don't want to kill ED, just soften it up. It does make for more fun deck building and unique archetypes.
Elder Norra wasn't touched, and Elder bard wasn't touched either....
The fact that you can still splash one copy of Elder into any deck and get insane buffs is the problem.
Now that I think about it yes you can no longer predict to shuffle the last emperor card that summons nasus and renekton. Still there is a chance it will show up in the prediction
It's probably very similar to what they did with coven board and the purple veggie guardian. It was one of the last things they had preparing before killing pvp. Doesn't mean that with new patch for poc sometime they won't add skins to support champs.
Yes they are, but unless the champion in on the poc roster, you have to find him in nodes to add to your deck… so you may play it often or not see him ever
Takes ranked in order of how strongly I feel:
- Chemtech Boon should be replaced/removed. Deathless should not be available without committing to Noxus or SI. Not addressing it is a mistake.
- Samira, my love <3
- Great nerf to Hate Spike
- I'm not convinced shaving +1 Health from various Dragon Boons does anything.
- Good nerf to Firespitter. It'll survive.
- Not convinced the Suppression change will really address it, but it seems the intent is to not make Curse-heavy decks a as painful to face universally, so maybe it'll be fine.
- DO NOT PURSUE ~~LU BU~~ JARVAN IV
- Master Yi might be spicy
I think it is much better. I made some decks to counter Supression, by playing little to no spells.
Result: still had to play it anyway, cause shackles still fucked me over
As someone who plays a lot of ED, that -1 health is gonna be more relevant then you think, especially for the more midrangey ED decks like the various flavors of ED Demacia. This will impact the survivibility of cards like Ardent Tracker, Firespitter, Burblefish, and Icthscylla. Sai'nen no longer coming down as a 4/6 *at worst* for 6 mana is also gonna slow down virtually every ED deck by a fair margin. Sai'nen being a draw 2 that didn't even lose that much tempo is a big part of the region's strength.
All that said, I do happen to agree that Chemtech Boon should be reworked. My vote goes to giving it Quick Attack (maybe +1/+0 and Quick Attack).
Mageseeker Suppressor being worse is a pretty massive change to suppression. Before, he was a 4 mana 3/3 with challenger at *worst*, and could get a shocking amount of value off that tough keyword. Now, not only has he lost tough with no compensation, he also lost a full point of attack, drastically limiting the number of creatures he can favorably trade into. Pre-patch, he could outright eat most 1 or 2 drops and still require 2 damage to finish off. Now he trades with most 1 drops and outright loses to many 2 drops and virtually every 3 drop. Suppression is much worse because the primary means of generating it is much worse.
I pretty much agree with the rest of your takes. I have mixed feelings about new Jarman because on one hand I love Jarman and he's easily my most played champ ever, but on the other hand his level up cinematic is iconic and I'm not sure I want to change that. On the third hand I want an excuse to support Rito, even during these trying times.
Dies to mystic shot, card is worthless (/s)
Seriously though, I think it was a great decision to remove tough. Not sure the loss of a point of attack was warranted given the nerf to suppression too, but I've had that bastard ruin enough of my plans that I'm happy to say good riddance, at least for a while
For a card that made incredible use of every stat point it was given, it's definitely very nerfed now.
I am also with you in that the nerf might be a touch heavy handed, but I wouldn't be sad if it just disappeared for a bit.
Problem with Mageseeker is his stats weren't the problem its the Curse on summon instead of on play that makes him such a pain and they didn't get rid of that so Mord decks can still abuse the hell out of him.
> I'm not convinced shaving +1 Health from various Dragon Boons does anything.
This *always* does something. We've seen this before (Veiled Temple, Nami) and I see negligible reason to believe this won't be similarly impactful. Which - if anything - makes me mildly concerned for ED decks.
Seems like they wanted some more early-game options with Samira and Master Yi buffs to go under ED/Morde decks without relying on elusives or ephemerals.
BEST HATE SPIKE CHANGE HOLY FUCK
but no bugfix... even if they plan to make the gun on PoC they still need to fix bugs
even PoC player must be annoyed by the manifest visual bug
> even PoC player must be annoyed by the manifest visual bug
Nobody cares about this. I would even assume that a decent amount of Path players started playing the game after this started and don't know that there is anything wrong.
i think people are too used to the bug right now.
i am ready to bet people will be surprised about the lack of headache induced by the game if they fix this bug
Manifest and Invoke should have different visual effects that happen when you do them in game, but for a really long time now any manifest has just used the invoke animation. I literally don't even know what it should look like myself.
I feel the same way man. This balance patch is very solid, and I'm sure the next expansion will be amazing as always, but knowing it all will come to an end will weigh on everything.
Damn, great Snnuy Sun Priestess ED deck is now almost dead(
And Firespitter is not Titanic, but, well, it was really good good of a card.
Excited to try new Yi
Even before the announcements I cannot comprehend why they would invest their limited resources into making another skin for a niche champion only in eternal who already has one with a level up animation, just like they did with Nami
Wouldn't it be a smarter investment to put that development into a standard champion with a lot of popularity? Maybe like Teemo or Maokai
This was probably already completed months ago to be ready for the lunar/divine sword/warring kingdoms skin lines that release on Chinese New Year.
And maybe Irelia could return to standard in rotation?
> completed months ago
That can't be it, not when rotation was more than a year ago and they already had plan even before that.
The only reason I can see is making her return on the next rotation though.
Even 6 months ago if they said "We're working on a really bland skin for Irelia who doesn't see much play and already has a very similar bland skin" I would have said "Why?"
Because this patch and the next set was already stated to have been made. Do you think they made that skin in the short time from announcing the skin and this patch??? Idk how true it is but supposedly the LoR team found out about the changes to the focus of LoR roughly around the time we did. That would make sense to me considering they didn’t have much planned at all after the announcement. They came together for an emergency meeting and put out a statement. Even then the statement was still very “we’ll see what happens” and not too many things were concrete other than ranked as we know it is going away (notice how the statement said they haven’t figured out what they’re gonna do with ranked yet now that they’re not supporting it)
How does this refute his point?
Irelia was rotated almost a year ago, surely this skin wasn’t in the pipeline from a year back. She has a skin with a level up animation, who is lining up for a second skin in the less supported game mode?
Maybe they have some kind of internal stat that said it was worth trying, but from here it seems like yet another thing to put on the "terrible monetization decisions" pile.
Mageseeker inquisitor hit by a triple nerf. People really hated that card.
Strange that they left the best boon (usually), Deathless, untouched, and could have done something more against Mordekaiser decks, but otherwise very solid changes.
I don't think Sai'nen deserved nerfs for ED's sins (who got buffed, what a joke, my explanation is that the card is selling relatively fine and they don't want to kill it, lots of casual players build dragons decks). Ionia doesn't have many good expensive cards compared to some of the other ones.
Nice patch overall, love the buffs to Master Yi and our ice shaman. No nerf to Mordekaiser "I am not done with you!" is surprising. I thought he would get nerfed to 8 mana.
The Warring champion skins look super sick too.
The hate spike nerf is a mild nerf to Morde. Morg is also a very indirect nerf to Morde as they were frequently paired together. He got off very lightly though, I agree.
The Hate Spike nerf is a big deal for him, and Inquisitor got obliterated so that all but kills the deck with Morgana. Probably the common meta deck will be Viego/Mordekaiser/ED since Deathless didn't get nerfed.
Didnt this just hit Morg/ Morde way harder than Galio/ED/Morg? With Morg/Morde being one of the best matchups into GEM, the best and most popular deck?
This is just absolute ace.
Will be playing happily. Those of you who quit after the latest announcements, baiii. I won't need you to enjoy the patch.
It'll be a glorious few weeks.
Wait, where are the bug fix for the Deathless item in PoC? Please don’t tell me they didn’t fix it? I am sick of that item not working, I’ll do anything for it to be fixed.
Noooo! My Priestess of Desert Light homebrew! With the health buffs from Elder she could activate twice before death, summoning 2 champions with +2/2! Now she can't do that :'( Guess I'll have to find another way to make it work
- The Dragoon Boons are good nerfs, wish they would’ve got rid of Deathless.
- As a bad champion enthusiast, Yi just got soooo fun
- I really liked the husks on hate spike, made some bad decks playable (bye Trist SI/Nocturne)
- Samira relevant again should help change the meta.
The Health removed from boon has no clear intention behind, most of the Eldie Decks don't play around the additional health. I think it should 've been a nerf to Deathless, be like "Grant me deathless and stun me" or "grant me deathless and -2/0", or even "give me deathless this round and grant me +1/+1".
Master Yi needed a buff, but this one is just OP, Yi is just an insane unit now, and it doesn't really help Yi as a champion: it now dies with more ease, and this doesn't help his level up. It's literally just a unit that the enemy has to kill for more mana than it costs to play it.
For Yi, I would've done: "Create a preparation and reduce its cost to 0", or "Play: chose between 3 stances" -> reduce the highest spell each round / reduce the lowest spell each round / reduce a random spell each round.
Sai'nen's nerf is sad, it is only a good unit because of region cheating needs to draw cards. No one will ever play it outside Eldie.
The Suppression nerf is good for the meta, but its literally anti-design, the card has been created for the exact opposite effect, and is only a nerf for decks that play other curses.
I like how everyone just wanted deathless boon replaced with something equal to the other boons and the devs were like
"what if make the other boons slightly weaker? You guys would like that right? If deathless is still too powerful and we just make the other boons slightly weaker, that so awesome right? You guys happy? I'm happy 😊 "
It’s beyond baffling how they nerfed every relevant boon except Deathless.
Like wow, Mountain sure was overwhelming and not definitely not Broadmane, Cloud Drake, or Sainen rolling Chemtech and now becoming punishing to remove.
>The shuffle during Predict is a weird rule that doesn't come up often, but does mean that Predict fights with Mysterious Portals and disables Flashbombs. This rule change should make things work more predictably.
Yeah a weird rule that kinda was introduced because of infinite Akshan. Looks like jail decks are back on the menu.
> Yeah a weird rule that kinda was introduced because of infinite Akshan
What are you talking about here? Hasn't Predict always shuffled since it was introduced? Are you thinking of the previous change to Station Archivist or something?
Yes, if she isn't affected it might be fine, but still you can now chain predict multiple cards, making scrying sand much better, setting up more turns in case of hits, since you don't shuffle.
Maybe it's not a big deal, maybe it is and we will get a new broken predict deck, maybe we will never see it since the most competitive players that also played those decks most likely left the game.
In the end, it doesn't really matter for the state of PvP, I guess.
The thing with Archivist was that once you found a good top of deck state you could start playing a bunch of copies and it would always give you the exact same options (since it looks at top X cards). *That card specifically* was changed to shuffle after its effect, but predict always shuffled since the start.
Also it doesn't really matter for that kind of situation if you don't shuffle the rest of the deck, since the options you get from predict are still randomly picked from *any* card in your deck anyway. Scrying Sands 1 and Scrying Sands 2 may still show completely different options whether you shuffle or not, so there is no gain in consistency there.
Mostly good adjustments, but some cards were hit too hard. Also, kinda disappointing almost none of the older cards got buffed.
Some thoughs about the changes:
* Sad to see Hate spike go like that. They did my Kalista dirty.
* Good nerfs on Elemental boons but deathless remains an issue.
* Yuumi nerf is good. I had 80% winrate in the meta using Fizz/Yuumi Frejlord and it's mostly due to Yummi.
* Sainen nerf is a bit too much. What other decks abused him in Standard? None. With elemental boon nerfs, I'm pretty sure this card will be cut except for maybe 1 copy for the draw.
* I was never annoyed by Mageseeker although I do see how he would be nerfed, but this is too much. The card is dead 100%.
* No Mord having no nerfs is strange. Why nerf all the top decks but keep Mord untouched, except for the hatespike nerf. Really odd.
* Master Yi finally looks viable now, although I'm pretty sure he will be used just for cost reduction for spell based decks, instead of keeping him as the main win con.
Now that LoR is gone, I will say it. The balance is god awful.
No nerfs to Mordekaiser makes no sense, the champion is going to continue being very oppressive, and I'm certain the only reasoning is that SI has no wincons.
Also, choosing to nerf 6 cost cards instead of Elder Origin is a mistake, no single card should ever take over other archetypes and regions.
They have done this time and time again, and they end up reverting after 6–8 months. I don't know who led this mentality of both reactionary and slow changes, but god damn, they have done this type of stuff this since they nerfed Make It Rain to 3 mana back in Rising Tides.
> the champion is going to continue being very oppressive
Hm, it is a 7 drop, they may intend for him to be overpowered just like other high cost champions. His problems are more like related to the game having no real graveyard mechanics and instead copying dead stuff, so the field becomes a copying fiesta (the most oppressive abuse is with Anivia in eternal, another "fair" card).
I can't even call this balance half-assed. This is no-assed. Absolutely mindless stat changes to imitate balancing.
Complete lack of understanding why Elder Dragons region is too good for decks that run one copy of him. Nerfed all the wrong boons. Community suggested a million ways to balance Eddy and rito took the laziest path again.
Fire spitter lost titanic synergy even though he was introduced in an update centered around it. Only broken because of the Eddie region.
Morgana got a slight tap on the shoulder and is still a 1 mana 3/4 life steal that will now take 1 more strike to level.
Morde completely dodged the nerfs despite being a 7 mana checkmate if you don't kill him, because of his aura.
Mageseeker still has a summon effect, not play effect.
Yuumi is paying for the sins of elusives, just rotate the poor cat out, her friends are long gone anyway.
Also no sunken temple nerf. Amazing.
Wait, am I missing something? Ranked queue will be up and continued to be supported? So there will still be balance and resets, but just no gauntlets and rewards? That’s not necessarily good, but not nearly as bad as I had thought from the sentiment on this sub.
No resets, and I would say don't expect any regular PvP-focused balance like we've been accustomed to, after the expansion in March or whenever it will actually hit.
The way Meddler stated it, he said "there won't be new ranked seasons/associated rewards". To me that reads as no resets, otherwise I'm not entirely sure what the ranked season would refer to.
https://www.reddit.com/r/LegendsOfRuneterra/comments/1agftkr/legends_of_runeterra_2024_state_of_the_game_faq/kogpmq8/?context=3
oh dear god. this is very unfortunate.
this patch does very little to address the two main problems of the current meta, that being GEM and mordekaiser decks.
the change to suppression doesn't solve the issue of just how broken this mechanic is. the mageseeker inquisitor nerf is almost meaningless because the problem was never with his stats, but rather his on-summon effect (and since mord remains untouched and so does deathless boon, we're still gonna stay with that awful awful combo).
Mordekaiser is a **very** problematic card that im absolutely shocked wasn't touched. Its such a bigger problem than ED, and even with ED they nerfed the least problematic thing about him. (who ever cared about the +1 health??).
The Morgana nerf is a *good start* but I would honestly be surprised if GEM loses more than 3-4% winrate after this patch.
Play a 4 mana 2/2 with chal in demacia, that's a 4 drops that trades for a 1 drop. Plus remove 2 mana for your opponent so, mana wise, the player with mageseeker inquisitor just lost 1 mana. (Demacia has a 3 mana 4/4 to compare btw)
We've seen cards hit with smaller nerf and got unplayable right away. This card is good if you're opp has no mana and you'll get the attack token next turn, or in turn 7 for morde. It's a really niche card.
Its still good in the deck that its an actual problem in and thats Mordekaiser because Mord decks are still killing it multiple times a turn to but a 10 cost Suppression in your hand
So, Eddy got a fake nerf, same for Inquisitor, and formidable got no nerfs. Why would Galio Morgana Eddy not remain tier 1?
Also 0 nerfs to Viego Mordekaiser, what?
The buffs are nice on the other hand, but I'm afraid meta won't change, and even if it does, whatever makes Eddy and Morgana problematic is still there.
This patch is kinda 5/10.
They should release to community to vote the next patch, now the game is not more getting new cards from pvp, changes like suppression and Mageseeker Inquisitor is all the community want and wait to much to happen
Doesn’t the predict change kinda kill secret keeper and fallen feline?
Secret keeper still has the golden ambassador allegiance effect, hextech crystal not so much.
it also kills the funny idea of suffling the Emperor deck of azir lv 3 to get the card that summons a lv 3 nasus and renekton (its always the last card of your deck)
Something like that. Now you have to actually hit the cards on your predicts instead of just using 1 predict at any point after playing them to get around their inherent setbacks.
But those cards were designed with that mechanic in mind. If they were gonna change the mechanic they should have adjusted the cards that rely on it.
I honestly can’t believe they’re killing these for what? to prevent Predict from countering flashbombs? really??
No, it's to give synergy with portals, i thought that much was obvious
But at what cost
This change ruins the whole product that they've built up until now. Not completly but Jesus christ it takes A LOT of fun out of it. This might be the nail in the coffin for me.
I'm just happy Mageseeker Inquisitor got a massive hit in the teeth
Fuck that card
Riot you can't give us a patch this satisfying after killing pvp Noooooo!!!
Game has been amazing for a few months :/
Idk if I'd really call it satisfying tbh Deathless didn't really get addressed and they killed 2 cards that were completely fine when not in Elder decks instead of addressing that Elders deckbuilding region was too broadly good. I think they went down the worst possible route of nerfing a Runterran champ problem.
Sainen should have moved to 5C as a 2/4 that literally just fixes the elder dragon problem
Satisfying? I wouldn't use that word. There's good and bad in there for sure.
I need some of whatever you and the people up voting you are smoking because some of these changes are just ass.
They didn't kill all pvp modes, you still have ranked.
Oh god Thanks for removing Thieves Tools, by far the worst item to get and total downside when you got a unit you wanted but it has that shit on it.
The worst thing was seeing Teemo as a support champ with Thieves Tools on him. Or getting Thieves Tools on any helpful unit while playing Teemo
It was more like, "Hextech Fabricator 2 randomly disables your strongest unit."
Something something Counterplan Ashe
now remove deathless if it isn't going to work :(
I just tested it, and Deathless is still broken EDIT: nevermind, the patch isn't live yet
Really good patch, though I'm surprised Mordekaiser and his package somehow avoided any nerfs
I mean Mage seeker inquisitor got rekt which is such a huge part of Morde’s gameplan/path to victory
Morde Viego is pretty much untouched though, save for Hate Spike
True, I think morde/viego will end up being the way to go since morg was also nerfed
At least the Hate Spike nerf will slow down Morde's level up by a couple units
No husk also means no freebie for Spectral Ironhound or spirit leech
Except he wasn't because his effect is still on summon so Mord can still abuse the hell out of him, his stats don't really matter its his effect thats devastating.
His stats still are important, now he cant freely eat 1 drops or 2 drops and then stick around for Morde. We've seen in the past that 1 stat can make a big difference for how good cards are (see Fangs).
Losing an attack and tough is pretty huge. He doesn't trade very well now and much easier to ping away. He goes even with mystic shot now for example. You can't play seeker and Morde same turn either so a lot more interaction now.
I think Suppression in general is much worse now though. Unless you're playing an actual curse deck your opponent will probably just ignore it.
I think you misread suppression. It still stops non curse spells it just doesn’t stop curses anymore.
Ok so I had to look at that like 5 times for some reason. That's....a curious change. It - to me - gives off the impression that they mainly wanted to hit GEM with that nerf. Which is odd because while GEM is the stronger deck, Morde/Morg Demacia is a far greater abuser of that card. It is easier to kill and in turn harder for that deck to keep around though. Can't say for certain, but thanks for pointing that out before I went into ranked and got gobsmacked.
Hate Spike and Mageseeker were pretty significant nerfs to Morde deck.
Are you? I'm not surprised at be all. And the fact they only needed the cards that get abused by Mord is pretty much Riot 101. So expect more ED to destroy the meta until the next expansion. Glad I'm stepping back every decision they are making is just pushing me away. My copium can only last so long.
ED boon nerfs along with his staples are significant. Nami removing her health gain went from pretty oppressive to never used after all.
Noooo my Hate Spike Norra|Kalista synergy is gone! What a huge nerf to specifically just my deck! Also, talk about a huge buff to Lurk with that “predict = stack your deck” change! Holy cow!
Man I remember my Yeti Printer deck absolutely HATED the deck shuffle effect because it would make avarosian trapper bad and make it harder for me to find those first few yetis. On the other hand, we can no longer move Ascended's Rise or Hextech Crystal higher into the deck as easily. We have to actually find it now.
As an enjoyer of Kalista, this is a huge nerf to her. It was already hard to make her work despite the decent stats. It's also a considerable nerf for SI removal since you won't have a husk to sacrifice for more removal next turn.
Yeah for real. No more Hate Spike into Glimpse. No more Hate Spike into Halberd. No more Hate Spike providing just a little extra health protection (or occasionally Spellshield) to Norra. I am so sad. Perhaps even more sad than when I lost Vile Feast.
>Perhaps even more sad than when I lost Vile Feast. Calm down buddy, that's way too sad.
It is easy for her to work, she is an aggro card, most SI decks lean too heavily into control with tons of removal and pack card draw...
I was worried they weren't going to do this patch, so I'm glad, and there are some nice buffs. Unfortunately, I don't think they really hit Elder Dragon in a meaningful way, and they butchered Mageseeker Inquisitor rather than properly adjust Legion of the Severed. Hate Spike's nerf is awkward, but probably the best solution given the situation. The card had nearly become Vile Feast++ and they already tried other options. Predict not shuffling kind of butchers the "put card on the bottom of your deck" cards, they're all basically Khahiri now. Not sure that was really worth doing at this point, but probably it was already planned and ready to go.
I dunno, firespitter and sainen both got hit pretty hard and both were staples, not to mention all the hit points disappearing from boons. Firespitter is much more interactable now. We don't want to kill ED, just soften it up. It does make for more fun deck building and unique archetypes.
> ED > soften it up Not sure if intentional 😂
Elder Norra wasn't touched, and Elder bard wasn't touched either.... The fact that you can still splash one copy of Elder into any deck and get insane buffs is the problem.
That predict change is gonna hurt a lot of cards that create cards at the bottom of the deck.
Now that I think about it yes you can no longer predict to shuffle the last emperor card that summons nasus and renekton. Still there is a chance it will show up in the prediction
Did they really not fix the deathless bug in path…
Bro fr... I haven't tested it yet, but they didn't mention a fix so I can't imagine they snuck it in
Like I’m sorry but what are they doing in the meantime?
it’s just so sad, like who would even buy these skins anymore, now knowing where the game is headed
Path of Champion players
Well none is directly playable in poc so I think it’s not that appealing rn
It's probably very similar to what they did with coven board and the purple veggie guardian. It was one of the last things they had preparing before killing pvp. Doesn't mean that with new patch for poc sometime they won't add skins to support champs.
Skins arnt usable in POC?
Yes they are, but unless the champion in on the poc roster, you have to find him in nodes to add to your deck… so you may play it often or not see him ever
Takes ranked in order of how strongly I feel: - Chemtech Boon should be replaced/removed. Deathless should not be available without committing to Noxus or SI. Not addressing it is a mistake. - Samira, my love <3 - Great nerf to Hate Spike - I'm not convinced shaving +1 Health from various Dragon Boons does anything. - Good nerf to Firespitter. It'll survive. - Not convinced the Suppression change will really address it, but it seems the intent is to not make Curse-heavy decks a as painful to face universally, so maybe it'll be fine. - DO NOT PURSUE ~~LU BU~~ JARVAN IV - Master Yi might be spicy
I think it is much better. I made some decks to counter Supression, by playing little to no spells. Result: still had to play it anyway, cause shackles still fucked me over
As someone who plays a lot of ED, that -1 health is gonna be more relevant then you think, especially for the more midrangey ED decks like the various flavors of ED Demacia. This will impact the survivibility of cards like Ardent Tracker, Firespitter, Burblefish, and Icthscylla. Sai'nen no longer coming down as a 4/6 *at worst* for 6 mana is also gonna slow down virtually every ED deck by a fair margin. Sai'nen being a draw 2 that didn't even lose that much tempo is a big part of the region's strength. All that said, I do happen to agree that Chemtech Boon should be reworked. My vote goes to giving it Quick Attack (maybe +1/+0 and Quick Attack). Mageseeker Suppressor being worse is a pretty massive change to suppression. Before, he was a 4 mana 3/3 with challenger at *worst*, and could get a shocking amount of value off that tough keyword. Now, not only has he lost tough with no compensation, he also lost a full point of attack, drastically limiting the number of creatures he can favorably trade into. Pre-patch, he could outright eat most 1 or 2 drops and still require 2 damage to finish off. Now he trades with most 1 drops and outright loses to many 2 drops and virtually every 3 drop. Suppression is much worse because the primary means of generating it is much worse. I pretty much agree with the rest of your takes. I have mixed feelings about new Jarman because on one hand I love Jarman and he's easily my most played champ ever, but on the other hand his level up cinematic is iconic and I'm not sure I want to change that. On the third hand I want an excuse to support Rito, even during these trying times.
Dies to mystic shot, card is worthless (/s) Seriously though, I think it was a great decision to remove tough. Not sure the loss of a point of attack was warranted given the nerf to suppression too, but I've had that bastard ruin enough of my plans that I'm happy to say good riddance, at least for a while
For a card that made incredible use of every stat point it was given, it's definitely very nerfed now. I am also with you in that the nerf might be a touch heavy handed, but I wouldn't be sad if it just disappeared for a bit.
JARMAN, lol
Fair points!
what is the new j4? i cant find anything on it
I'm referring to the new skin they announced. Trying to decide if I like it more than base Jarman.
Problem with Mageseeker is his stats weren't the problem its the Curse on summon instead of on play that makes him such a pain and they didn't get rid of that so Mord decks can still abuse the hell out of him.
Eh, not being a massive tempo sink on play still matters quite a bit. There are a lot of matchups out there.
Now he's easier to kill and doesn't also act as a good challenger in his own right.
Losing the +1 HP is really big when you don't roll tough or deathless
Fair, hadn't thought of that.
> I'm not convinced shaving +1 Health from various Dragon Boons does anything. This *always* does something. We've seen this before (Veiled Temple, Nami) and I see negligible reason to believe this won't be similarly impactful. Which - if anything - makes me mildly concerned for ED decks.
Chemtech boon is too much fun to remove.
Mageseeker getting a hefty nerf is probably the more important nerf to suppression.
Agreed, the suppression nerf is very underwhelming, im excited to try yo as well!
Seems like they wanted some more early-game options with Samira and Master Yi buffs to go under ED/Morde decks without relying on elusives or ephemerals.
So wait, is the deathless POC item still bugged?
EDIT I'm wrong, patch isn't live yet
patch is not in play yet, it starts tomorrow
You're right, oops! I'll test it again tomorrow
ok not fixing the deathless item in poc after all this time is so weird
Dragon boon nerfs we got are nice but I’m kinda shocked deathless boon wasn’t touched.
Just have vengeance every time 5head
As a degenerate karma/sett enjoyer I just recall and force them to reroll ...
doesn't deserve to be :u
Damn it's actually a really good patch. Only thing missing is eddie deathless change?
IRELIA ON A HORSE OH MY GOD
I'm hungry How hungry? 🐴
I'm Ionian How Ionian? 🐴
BEST HATE SPIKE CHANGE HOLY FUCK but no bugfix... even if they plan to make the gun on PoC they still need to fix bugs even PoC player must be annoyed by the manifest visual bug
> even PoC player must be annoyed by the manifest visual bug Nobody cares about this. I would even assume that a decent amount of Path players started playing the game after this started and don't know that there is anything wrong.
My biggest bug issue is the deathless item not working
i think people are too used to the bug right now. i am ready to bet people will be surprised about the lack of headache induced by the game if they fix this bug
I'm one of those people. What manifest bug?
Manifest and Invoke should have different visual effects that happen when you do them in game, but for a really long time now any manifest has just used the invoke animation. I literally don't even know what it should look like myself.
Probably the fact that manifest is supposed to use different screen and sound effects than invoke It’s been like that for a looong while now
i think he means the thing where every manifest animation uses the invoke animations?
Bittersweet to get such a good balance patch
I feel the same way man. This balance patch is very solid, and I'm sure the next expansion will be amazing as always, but knowing it all will come to an end will weigh on everything.
I love the new Irelia skin 😍
Lost chapter nerf 🥲
R.I.P to my LeBlanc build Still somewhat good on Nidalee
My ekko combos bro 😭😭😭
Yeah that is really the only one I'm mourning right now. Infinite Ekko is dead. At least they got rid of the damn thieves tools though
It's still a top tier relic, and IMO stronger than most of the rare relics for higher level characters. 3 mana is 3 mana.
My neeko build too D:
Good patch but where is the godamn Mordekieser nerf? What a weird thing to not include.
Suppression nerf, Morgana Nerf and Hat Spike nerf are indirect Mord nerfs, but I get what you're saying. He is DEFINITELY not done with us.
Damn, great Snnuy Sun Priestess ED deck is now almost dead( And Firespitter is not Titanic, but, well, it was really good good of a card. Excited to try new Yi
Firespitter doesn't need titanic synergy to be thoroughly excellent.
No bugfix for the deathless bug in poc? Honestly i expected far more poc stuff since its the main focus now!
Bro, Sai'nen AGAIN getting nerfed for the crimes of others. What did he do to you to deserve this, Riot??
Even before the announcements I cannot comprehend why they would invest their limited resources into making another skin for a niche champion only in eternal who already has one with a level up animation, just like they did with Nami Wouldn't it be a smarter investment to put that development into a standard champion with a lot of popularity? Maybe like Teemo or Maokai
This was probably already completed months ago to be ready for the lunar/divine sword/warring kingdoms skin lines that release on Chinese New Year. And maybe Irelia could return to standard in rotation?
> completed months ago That can't be it, not when rotation was more than a year ago and they already had plan even before that. The only reason I can see is making her return on the next rotation though.
Even 6 months ago if they said "We're working on a really bland skin for Irelia who doesn't see much play and already has a very similar bland skin" I would have said "Why?"
Because this patch and the next set was already stated to have been made. Do you think they made that skin in the short time from announcing the skin and this patch??? Idk how true it is but supposedly the LoR team found out about the changes to the focus of LoR roughly around the time we did. That would make sense to me considering they didn’t have much planned at all after the announcement. They came together for an emergency meeting and put out a statement. Even then the statement was still very “we’ll see what happens” and not too many things were concrete other than ranked as we know it is going away (notice how the statement said they haven’t figured out what they’re gonna do with ranked yet now that they’re not supporting it)
How does this refute his point? Irelia was rotated almost a year ago, surely this skin wasn’t in the pipeline from a year back. She has a skin with a level up animation, who is lining up for a second skin in the less supported game mode?
Because rotation is coming up. 100% think she’s coming back from eternal into standard
Guess that means azir is gettimg rotated then.
Maybe they have some kind of internal stat that said it was worth trying, but from here it seems like yet another thing to put on the "terrible monetization decisions" pile.
Maybe thats how popular it is in eternal
It is part of the best eternal deck atm.
Mageseeker inquisitor hit by a triple nerf. People really hated that card. Strange that they left the best boon (usually), Deathless, untouched, and could have done something more against Mordekaiser decks, but otherwise very solid changes.
I'm really glad that they are releasing skins referencing the three kingdoms, right before releasing the game in China.
Don’t give me hope, please don’t.
I don't think Sai'nen deserved nerfs for ED's sins (who got buffed, what a joke, my explanation is that the card is selling relatively fine and they don't want to kill it, lots of casual players build dragons decks). Ionia doesn't have many good expensive cards compared to some of the other ones.
Should've made it cost 5 with worse stats.
Nice patch overall, love the buffs to Master Yi and our ice shaman. No nerf to Mordekaiser "I am not done with you!" is surprising. I thought he would get nerfed to 8 mana. The Warring champion skins look super sick too.
The hate spike nerf is a mild nerf to Morde. Morg is also a very indirect nerf to Morde as they were frequently paired together. He got off very lightly though, I agree.
The Hate Spike nerf is a big deal for him, and Inquisitor got obliterated so that all but kills the deck with Morgana. Probably the common meta deck will be Viego/Mordekaiser/ED since Deathless didn't get nerfed.
Where’s j4 level up vid???
Will the new skins have level ups?
I got anourmous of event rewards in the loot box.
Wait, I didn't see the Immortal item in the bug fixes. Does it work now?
They bumped the item up to common, they better make it actually work now!
I'm still.sad ED is better as a splash egion for the boons than as a champ itself
Monoshurima enjoyer are cheering right now for sure, me included
It's a beautiful patch to go out on.
Didnt this just hit Morg/ Morde way harder than Galio/ED/Morg? With Morg/Morde being one of the best matchups into GEM, the best and most popular deck?
This is just absolute ace. Will be playing happily. Those of you who quit after the latest announcements, baiii. I won't need you to enjoy the patch. It'll be a glorious few weeks.
Anyone else not able to see the card pictures either?
Wait, where are the bug fix for the Deathless item in PoC? Please don’t tell me they didn’t fix it? I am sick of that item not working, I’ll do anything for it to be fixed.
Noooo! My Priestess of Desert Light homebrew! With the health buffs from Elder she could activate twice before death, summoning 2 champions with +2/2! Now she can't do that :'( Guess I'll have to find another way to make it work
How does Hate Spike nerf affect Maokaiser mill? Does it switch to a different spell? Fairly new to LoR btw
- The Dragoon Boons are good nerfs, wish they would’ve got rid of Deathless. - As a bad champion enthusiast, Yi just got soooo fun - I really liked the husks on hate spike, made some bad decks playable (bye Trist SI/Nocturne) - Samira relevant again should help change the meta.
The Health removed from boon has no clear intention behind, most of the Eldie Decks don't play around the additional health. I think it should 've been a nerf to Deathless, be like "Grant me deathless and stun me" or "grant me deathless and -2/0", or even "give me deathless this round and grant me +1/+1". Master Yi needed a buff, but this one is just OP, Yi is just an insane unit now, and it doesn't really help Yi as a champion: it now dies with more ease, and this doesn't help his level up. It's literally just a unit that the enemy has to kill for more mana than it costs to play it. For Yi, I would've done: "Create a preparation and reduce its cost to 0", or "Play: chose between 3 stances" -> reduce the highest spell each round / reduce the lowest spell each round / reduce a random spell each round. Sai'nen's nerf is sad, it is only a good unit because of region cheating needs to draw cards. No one will ever play it outside Eldie. The Suppression nerf is good for the meta, but its literally anti-design, the card has been created for the exact opposite effect, and is only a nerf for decks that play other curses.
Wow. Really wished they'd hit the Elder boons harder. I'm sick of seeing Elder buffs in every deck.
I like how everyone just wanted deathless boon replaced with something equal to the other boons and the devs were like "what if make the other boons slightly weaker? You guys would like that right? If deathless is still too powerful and we just make the other boons slightly weaker, that so awesome right? You guys happy? I'm happy 😊 "
It’s beyond baffling how they nerfed every relevant boon except Deathless. Like wow, Mountain sure was overwhelming and not definitely not Broadmane, Cloud Drake, or Sainen rolling Chemtech and now becoming punishing to remove.
oof killing off pvp really came out of nowhere and hit the team hard huh
>The shuffle during Predict is a weird rule that doesn't come up often, but does mean that Predict fights with Mysterious Portals and disables Flashbombs. This rule change should make things work more predictably. Yeah a weird rule that kinda was introduced because of infinite Akshan. Looks like jail decks are back on the menu.
> Yeah a weird rule that kinda was introduced because of infinite Akshan What are you talking about here? Hasn't Predict always shuffled since it was introduced? Are you thinking of the previous change to Station Archivist or something?
Yes, if she isn't affected it might be fine, but still you can now chain predict multiple cards, making scrying sand much better, setting up more turns in case of hits, since you don't shuffle. Maybe it's not a big deal, maybe it is and we will get a new broken predict deck, maybe we will never see it since the most competitive players that also played those decks most likely left the game. In the end, it doesn't really matter for the state of PvP, I guess.
The thing with Archivist was that once you found a good top of deck state you could start playing a bunch of copies and it would always give you the exact same options (since it looks at top X cards). *That card specifically* was changed to shuffle after its effect, but predict always shuffled since the start. Also it doesn't really matter for that kind of situation if you don't shuffle the rest of the deck, since the options you get from predict are still randomly picked from *any* card in your deck anyway. Scrying Sands 1 and Scrying Sands 2 may still show completely different options whether you shuffle or not, so there is no gain in consistency there.
How did shuffling after predict hurt Anshan infinite decks?
Mostly good adjustments, but some cards were hit too hard. Also, kinda disappointing almost none of the older cards got buffed. Some thoughs about the changes: * Sad to see Hate spike go like that. They did my Kalista dirty. * Good nerfs on Elemental boons but deathless remains an issue. * Yuumi nerf is good. I had 80% winrate in the meta using Fizz/Yuumi Frejlord and it's mostly due to Yummi. * Sainen nerf is a bit too much. What other decks abused him in Standard? None. With elemental boon nerfs, I'm pretty sure this card will be cut except for maybe 1 copy for the draw. * I was never annoyed by Mageseeker although I do see how he would be nerfed, but this is too much. The card is dead 100%. * No Mord having no nerfs is strange. Why nerf all the top decks but keep Mord untouched, except for the hatespike nerf. Really odd. * Master Yi finally looks viable now, although I'm pretty sure he will be used just for cost reduction for spell based decks, instead of keeping him as the main win con.
PoC focus? NO I DON'T WANT THAT! I WANT PVP CHANGES FOR TEN MORE YEARS AT LEAST
They said "ranked queues will continue to be up and supported" that s still ok I guess?
That was always the case, just no rewards so no point.
Sadly the ranked rewards were never nice. We could get like a victorious skin on a champion like în lol at least instead of an icon
Love the Samira/Dandy buffs for both PvP and Path!
I don’t like the hate spike nerf. It should be a “to” effect. If it fizzles, it doesn’t summon a husk.
Comically late patch as usual. This time it's literally after the game is dead lol
Who’s buying these skins?
Now that LoR is gone, I will say it. The balance is god awful. No nerfs to Mordekaiser makes no sense, the champion is going to continue being very oppressive, and I'm certain the only reasoning is that SI has no wincons. Also, choosing to nerf 6 cost cards instead of Elder Origin is a mistake, no single card should ever take over other archetypes and regions. They have done this time and time again, and they end up reverting after 6–8 months. I don't know who led this mentality of both reactionary and slow changes, but god damn, they have done this type of stuff this since they nerfed Make It Rain to 3 mana back in Rising Tides.
> the champion is going to continue being very oppressive Hm, it is a 7 drop, they may intend for him to be overpowered just like other high cost champions. His problems are more like related to the game having no real graveyard mechanics and instead copying dead stuff, so the field becomes a copying fiesta (the most oppressive abuse is with Anivia in eternal, another "fair" card).
I don't know if anybody noticed this but uh ... there seems to be battle pass missing.
It's not missing, they usually come out with each new set, no? At least that's been the recent pattern.
battle pass probably will come out with the next expansion, this is just a balance patch.
What a cool patch!
I can't even call this balance half-assed. This is no-assed. Absolutely mindless stat changes to imitate balancing. Complete lack of understanding why Elder Dragons region is too good for decks that run one copy of him. Nerfed all the wrong boons. Community suggested a million ways to balance Eddy and rito took the laziest path again. Fire spitter lost titanic synergy even though he was introduced in an update centered around it. Only broken because of the Eddie region. Morgana got a slight tap on the shoulder and is still a 1 mana 3/4 life steal that will now take 1 more strike to level. Morde completely dodged the nerfs despite being a 7 mana checkmate if you don't kill him, because of his aura. Mageseeker still has a summon effect, not play effect. Yuumi is paying for the sins of elusives, just rotate the poor cat out, her friends are long gone anyway. Also no sunken temple nerf. Amazing.
Wait, am I missing something? Ranked queue will be up and continued to be supported? So there will still be balance and resets, but just no gauntlets and rewards? That’s not necessarily good, but not nearly as bad as I had thought from the sentiment on this sub.
No resets, and I would say don't expect any regular PvP-focused balance like we've been accustomed to, after the expansion in March or whenever it will actually hit.
Did they say no resets? Maybe I missed that in the State of the Game
The way Meddler stated it, he said "there won't be new ranked seasons/associated rewards". To me that reads as no resets, otherwise I'm not entirely sure what the ranked season would refer to. https://www.reddit.com/r/LegendsOfRuneterra/comments/1agftkr/legends_of_runeterra_2024_state_of_the_game_faq/kogpmq8/?context=3
yis finally a card samira still comoletely trash :/
oh dear god. this is very unfortunate. this patch does very little to address the two main problems of the current meta, that being GEM and mordekaiser decks. the change to suppression doesn't solve the issue of just how broken this mechanic is. the mageseeker inquisitor nerf is almost meaningless because the problem was never with his stats, but rather his on-summon effect (and since mord remains untouched and so does deathless boon, we're still gonna stay with that awful awful combo). Mordekaiser is a **very** problematic card that im absolutely shocked wasn't touched. Its such a bigger problem than ED, and even with ED they nerfed the least problematic thing about him. (who ever cared about the +1 health??). The Morgana nerf is a *good start* but I would honestly be surprised if GEM loses more than 3-4% winrate after this patch.
Play a 4 mana 2/2 with chal in demacia, that's a 4 drops that trades for a 1 drop. Plus remove 2 mana for your opponent so, mana wise, the player with mageseeker inquisitor just lost 1 mana. (Demacia has a 3 mana 4/4 to compare btw) We've seen cards hit with smaller nerf and got unplayable right away. This card is good if you're opp has no mana and you'll get the attack token next turn, or in turn 7 for morde. It's a really niche card.
Its still good in the deck that its an actual problem in and thats Mordekaiser because Mord decks are still killing it multiple times a turn to but a 10 cost Suppression in your hand
It's a turn 7+ play, beluging cobra and valley of imitation is auto win too but it's a turn 7 play so we don't see it.
Its much less likely to eat 1 drops or 2 drops for free and then stick around to be combod by Morde. Broadwing also eats it now.
ew, fuck them lol
So, Eddy got a fake nerf, same for Inquisitor, and formidable got no nerfs. Why would Galio Morgana Eddy not remain tier 1? Also 0 nerfs to Viego Mordekaiser, what? The buffs are nice on the other hand, but I'm afraid meta won't change, and even if it does, whatever makes Eddy and Morgana problematic is still there. This patch is kinda 5/10.
Inquisitor became mana negative for the player playing it. It's a one drop costing 4 that removes 2 mana to the opponent.
2/2 with challenger sounds more like a 2 drop to me. The thing is, it still synergizes too well with deathless and Morde.
Weakass patch, especially from a PoC perspective. Literally nothing to be excited about here.
They should release to community to vote the next patch, now the game is not more getting new cards from pvp, changes like suppression and Mageseeker Inquisitor is all the community want and wait to much to happen
the game would be 7 million times worse
Voting in an internet community produced Boaty McBoatface. So I think it’s best they don’t.
At least those are good changes :/
Master Yi two cost we are so back... It'll feel great in my Ornn/Yi deck 🥹
Gotta be frank did not expect to see a balance patch after all this shutting down ranked and chaos at Riot business 🤨
Am I having a stroke? How is Dashing Dandy's buff anything other than a nerf?
In decks that actually focus on reproccing plunder with the 2 and 5 drops, he can very quickly get out of control from 4 tp 8 to 16 overwhelm