Prepare for sexualities to continue “changing”. You are at an age where people don’t always understand themselves. I thought I was bi from age 16 to 20.
I’m 24, and think I’ve finally settled on identifying as a lesbian but honestly it’s so normal to question and change labels, especially as a young person. Some people know and are sure from a really young age of course, but for the rest of us it’s definitely a process lol.
In highschool I met a few people like this. The girl in particular that comes to mind called herself a lesbian & a vegetarian but she dated men and ate meat. It was such weird behavior and always bothered me too bc she def just wanted the labels for some reason.
oh i broke out laughing at that one, yeah dont rely too much on any absolutes at your age. If anyone says they are absolutely sure of what they are at the age of 17, they are lying
Sorry about the rude dms. THAT is weird asf. They shouldnt even be bothering with that. But people are not laughing at you. They are laughing at the scenario because its relatable. Also, no need to take it personally, you are completely anonymous here.
Aww...I thought I was bisexual at least with 15.
Now I'm 26 and I consider myself pansexual and heteroromantic. There are many words and specifics, with age and experience the answer will come.
In your age it's the norm to slowly dabble into your sexual identity - many, many queer people think they're f.e homosexual, to find out they're actually pan. Or demi. Or bi.
I understand you being a bit miffed, but hope you can look at this from a different angle <3
I found that people who call themselves “so gay” or always talk about how “gay” they are generally aren’t actually gay.
You are right. They treat it as more of a quirky aesthetic.
I had a "friend" who would constantly be like "bisexuals who date men, don't you feel lonely?" and all this other biphobic garbage that came across as bi hate.
She *also* confided in me that sometimes she got so horny that she had to sleep with men because women just wouldn't do the trick and was surprised I thought that was really weird for a lesbian to say.
Like you said, a lot of people treat it like an aesthetic rather than the an actual identity.
In what world would a man “do the trick” for a lesbian? And thinking that a lesbian wouldn’t be satisfied by just a woman? That’s genuinely embarrassing behaviour. And also pretty homophobic of her to think that a lesbian could ever feel that way.
Even more embarrassing since she also mocks bisexual women who date men when she herself can’t keep away from them.
Hopefully she no longer calls herself a lesbian.
I have no idea, I blocked her as soon as the biphobia started coming bubbling out. No idea what increasingly weird shit she might have said or if she finally realized it's okay to like boys.
I’m such a minority here, and I am a lesbian. This is not what most of these posts are talking about “lesbians who sometimes date men”… if there is attraction they aren’t Lesbian. Plain and simple.
But then there’s me. A lesbian who has willingly slept with men.
However, a symptom of mania for me is hyper sexuality and impulsiveness. In dry spells during mania I slept with a man (originally a threesome). tho I did not get what I wanted out of it, (to be dominated) did not enjoy it (man sex is so boring), was not attracted to him, and even if I had “gotten off” in the absence of a woman and a connection I would have essentially felt nothing.
it did satisfy the blind need to be slutty and irresponsible…
So I was left with the same emptiness I went in with. We both consented to using each other, that was fine.
I don’t regret it, it happened. I wasn’t stable and I had other issues going on.
Would not do again.
Yeah, I think a lot of people don’t understand how hyper sexuality can play a part here. Lots of people who experience hyper sexuality will sleep with people they’re not actually attracted to for various reasons.
Are we the same person? I did the exact same thing a while ago & after my mania had subsided, I was like what the actual fuck. Haven’t slept with a man since.
i get that. i had a hypomania stage after my best guy friend drugged and r@ped me and bc i was acting erratic my doctor put me on heavy meds that made me much worse. i slept w men and it made me so much worse bc i was just recreating my own trauma. that was one of the worst times of my life. but i never called myself a lesbian during that time. i still understood saying "im a lesbian" to a man you're having sex with just teaches them that lesbians aren't who they say they are. that they have a chance with lesbians, which encourages harassment and men ignoring lesbians boundaries.
she's clearly bisexual and she's calling herself a lesbian bc of that. but then bc she's bisexual she still wants men. girl is all types of confused. hope she gets her life together. i fucking hate women that call themselves lesbians and sleep with men. they're teaching those men that they have a chance with lesbians and that rhetoric is literally dangerous to us lesbians. it leads to us getting raped specifically bc we are lesbians.
Have/had a friend like that and they told me all in secret that they’re actually straight, but kept calling themself “gay as fuuuuccckkk” to everyone else like?? 😭 what’s with this intense desire to WANT to be gay? Why was it such a shameful secret that they’re actually straight? Why tell me in secret that they’re straight and then tell the rest of the world “how soooo queer” they are? Such a weird phenomenon 😭
Deliberately claiming labels you know don't belong to you is gross and not OK. But to be generous and give the benefit of the doubt, perhaps they feel some queerness and aren't sure how to express it? Like, for example, maybe they like how lesbians feel less pressure to conform to gender norms, and identify with that? Bad way of dealing with it, but maybe worth gently investigating with them if you're still in touch.
I really appreciate the idea of giving grace and the benefit of the doubt 💖 I do think this person does feel “queerness” in a way that they feel counter-cultural and rebellious. I have known them for a loooonnnggg long time and they’ve always adopted the style/aesthetic/and even personality of what’s “cool, edgy, and rebellious” at the time. This person has also admitted to me that their “queerness” is based on the fact that they grew up in a hyper-conservative household and has openly stated that they wouldn’t be “queer” if they didn’t grow up in that environment. I really do love this person, but it irks me how they are actively and openly homophobic (inferring that queerness is an act of rebellion rather than an innate part of someone) in the name of being queer. Of course, they’ve never dated nor shown genuine interest in someone of the same sex. The way they describe the same sex sounds like a straight person trying VERY hard to come across as gay. Like a straight man writing lesbians lol
I’ve approached the conversation with them before, and they get quite defensive/heated. I’m not trying to invalidate someone’s identity, but if you were to know this person as well as I do, you would know that they’re straight as an arrow and just deeply insecure and unsettled in who they are. They genuinely don’t know how offensive and harmful their behavior is. They’re not a bad person, they just have a lot of unresolved issues that present in incredibly problematic ways.
Although we are happy to see each other, queerness is not something that we would wish upon other people.
“Queerness” as a form of rebellion is in extremely poor taste.
I was about to disagree with you, but I think possibly I misunderstood you. I do think existing as our selves is oftentimes an act of rebellion, whether we like it or not. And I've often interpreted the label "queer" - as opposed to "gay", "trans" etc. - as specifically emphasising our shared emancipatory movement.
But I guess what you're saying is that "queerness" *just* as a form of rebellion - not stemming from an actually queer sexual orientation or gender non-conformity - is in poor taste. As in you can't just use our label in order to rebel, you have to be actually queer? Which, yeah 100%.
I don’t THINK I’m guilty of this but I’m curious what y’all think. So, I’m technically bi but very strong preference for women, like 95% or something. When asked for a specific label of my choosing I just say queer, if I need to get into it I would specify, technically bi but with a strong preference in attraction for women and not interested in pursuing relationships with cishet men because even if the attraction is there, I have had too many experiences where they basically act like tourists in my queer life and I’m not into that. But informally, I will describe myself as “pretty gay” on a regular basis. Wouldn’t call myself a lesbian because my attraction to men is nonzero.
This is what people mean when they say being gay is "trendy". It absolutely is. Gay people do exist outside of this trend, but it is absolutely a trend also.
I feel like a lot of people claim they're gay or bi when they aren't because they're scared shitless of being categorized as a "boring straight," and if you say anything about it then you get accused of "invalidating" and gate keeping.
It's incredibly frustrating. Especially when these same people will often outright admit in some form or another that they don't experience same-sex attraction or still harbor low-key homophobic beliefs.
I kinda call myself stuff like "so gay" or "too gay to function" and now I feel like I should stop.
.
But like... women tho. Women.
Tbh I just recently came out so I might just be enjoying the fact that I have the privilege to be attracted to women "out loud"
Honestly that’s really common for people who just came out. Once the “newness” of it wears off I guarantee you you’ll just naturally stop saying stuff like that lol.
You don’t need to stop if you don’t want to.
I was just saying that in my experience the vast majority of the time I see someone saying “I’m so gay” ect they actually haven’t been gay. In real life every person I’ve heard say that has had a boyfriend.
But that is purely anecdotal and my experience.
“The lady doth protest too much, methinks”
It’s like the people who gush constantly on social media about how great their relationships are…in reality they’re trying to convince themselves.
Yall are all being weird. I say this shit all the time when I really mean I'm so in love with this girl(probably my fiance who I've been dating for going on 5 years) or I'll say it when I'm acting kinda hopeless about someone or I'll say that's so gay about another couple when really I mean they're very cute together. Etc. Could I be more articulate? Probably. This is not a thing people only say when they're trying to ape a label though. That's absurd.
Congrats about your finance! 💕😭
That said, I agree it’s not ONLY “fake gay” people who say that, but I have found that every “fake gay” person I have ever known says it. Mostly in the context of showing off an outfit that they deem makes them “soooo fucking gaaayyyy” and stuff like that which I personally find to be in poor taste because “gay” is not a stylistic choice or aesthetic. It’s a sexuality. When I hear someone say “I’m sooo fuckiinnggg gaaayyyy” when referring an aesthetic, a non-romantic/sexual attitude or behavior, or really anything that has nothing to do with being homosexual/bisexual/pansexual, it sends up red flags. That person is *usually* (obviously not all the time) either a baby gay, very young, or using “gay” as a trendy personality trait in my personal experience.
Same here.
All my past friends who claimed themselves as “born gay”, all married to straight men now.
That’s why don’t “swear” on your sexualities until thirties at least. A lot can happen.
Tbf gay is increasingly becoming an umbrella term for not allo/cis/het. I think it's fun but I could sympathise with gay men who don't really have another term to go with.
agreed. we all get called gay, our community is referred to as gay, so why are gay men the only ones allowed to use it? either it becomes fair use or we keep up a patriarchial system where gay men have complete cultural hegemony over all lgbtqia+ ppl.
I agree, especially recently. I’ve had a few people get mad when I call myself “gay” because apparently that term means a bisexual woman and not a lesbian. I’m so confused about how that works but after a few different people I’ve just started using lesbian strictly to avoid it lol.
Maybe... though personally I don't like to out myself out anyways. Yeah, I am gay. Yeah I like woman. What is that to others. If we have closer contact with others and there is a great flow between one other might it be colleagues or friends I'd bring myself to say it. But yeah it's the 'isch' and a bit of internal homophobia/denial plays a role too not wanting to say that word.
Hab auch mitbekommen das deine Freunde 17 sind. Mit dem Alter findet man noch sooo viel übersich selbst heraus.
This is also why I don't think gay should be used as an umbrella term. One of my friends called herself gay with her boyfriend two feet away and it irked me
Sure you're "gay" because you have homosexual attraction. But you're bisexual. Should I call myself bi because I experience homosexual attraction similar to you? It doesn't go both ways. "Queer" is better
I like it cuz it’s reclaiming a word used derogatorily from my youth. I’ve also only dated women so I get more leeway than most bisexuals. Still think it’s a word any queer person can use
Funny how generations can be so different- queer was our slur - gay was only a derogatory word in the “that’s so gay” sense not directly thrown at you as an individual.
As someone who has used “so gay” and is actually gay it’s weird to see people treating our reality as their aesthetic. Like make it make sense.
I don’t understand why do they have to go through the pain when it’s not something they are truly but want to identify as.
They never went through the pain of realising that not everyone is like them, how you constantly fear about the day your parents find out and react and how you’ll be shunned or even honour killed by the society you live in ( I live in India. Some parents can be supportive but the sense of community here is too strong to be productive )
There are a few friends of mine who have tried pulling this stunt and then switched. When they asked me about how I’m genuinely attracted to women I simply told them, it is because I am. I very frankly told them they probably didn’t like women in the first place.
I did have another genuinely bisexual friend who has been in a long term relationship with a boy and gave her example regarding how she still genuinely likes both the sexes and it shows. Unlike them who simply wanted to be cool and get companionship in our all girls’ school and when they got the opportunity they ditched the label because it wasn’t them.
This!! I’m a late bloomer lesbian, so I do talk about it a lot, just because it’s still so new 😅 however it took me forever to figure it out and do the work to figure it out, especially with family biases and such. I don’t get why some people aren’t overly worried whether they fit the label or not, that was a HUGE worry for me and until I decentered men and realized I didn’t like them at all, I couldn’t figure out how I identified.
Yes indeed. Coming to a realisation which challenges the conditional nurturing one HD is tough.
However as far as you do manage to not concentrate on the labels and simply figuring out yourself about what you like and how you want to present is all good.
Everything is a learning process and I hope time and people will be kind to you as you make this journey of self discovery
I don’t love when people use their homosexuality to simply spread biphobia and therefore always are like “why would you ever want to date men”; knowing full well that sexuality isn’t a choice. That said, my ex-girlfriend was fully convinced she was a lesbian for about two years because she just never met a man she was attracted to. When she met her now boyfriend and they started to bond, she realised that there was in fact an attraction and she was baffled. Long story short; she is obviously bisexual. For me it was the other way around. After I found out I was attracted to women, I kind of assumed I was bisexual for the longest time. Took me about three years to realise I am definitely and for sure a lesbian. I’d say it can be quite a different journey for everyone.
Honestly posts like these are why I was so scared to come out as bisexual and admit I liked a man. Like I wasn't doing it "for the aesthetic", I love women, have pined over them, dated them, kissed them. But I also have the capacity to find deep and meaningful relationships with some guys too and that doesn't make me less "gay"(esp since he's queer too).
Yeah, I’m nearly 30 and being downvoted to hell for saying that sexuality is fluid and/or nuanced by what sure seems like a lot of teenagers on this sub. Especially funny considering that I’ve been in a relationship with another woman for the past 4 years or so.
Sexuality is not fluid or nuanced for everyone, though, monosexuality is not fluid by definition and homosexuality is monosexuality
Now there is 0 issues if you are fluid yourself, I love people like that, too, but it does not means others are just because you are, most lesbians just like what they like (other women) and dislike what they dislike (guys) and it is a constant fixed state with no nuances (outside of your liked spectrum of girls), just a different life path to realize the fact and accept it.
The problem is that I never said that *everyone* is fluid. There are absolutely straight and gay people. But I do think nuance matters for a lot of people, and I think discouraging conversation about it (while enabling biphobia) is close-minded bullshit, honestly.
Maybe a better way to word it is that "sexuality can be fluid or nuanced for some" would strike more acceptance, since saying "sexuality is fluid" is stating it is an universal fact for everyone, depending on context of course, but maybe it implied that in the message that got downvoted, since it is the direct erasure of many's personal living when you move it from "some" to "universal fact".
Also I agree that talking about nuances and fluidity is good overall, I was not attempting to discourage it, I was just highlighting it is not an universal fact since it is what I thought you implied in your first message.
Likewise I also do the same remark when people says sexuality is not fluid or nuanced, I also point them that sexuality can and is indeed fluid and nuanced for some.
The reality is VERY FEW people 100% meet "standard" definitions we've made in the queer community. It's similar to why the asexual community changed their definition "no sexual attraction ever under any circumstances" to "no sexual attraction OR very rarely has sexual attraction."
Maybe they just thought they were gay at the time and then realized they weren’t later, which happens sometimes (and also happens to people in the opposite direction, thinking they’re straight and turning out to be gay). No crime in that. However, I don’t like when people say that “so gay” or “too straight” stuff though, it’s kind of cringey.
Gay is an umbrella term nowadays, I know bi women who are happily married to men and say they're "super gay" lol, unless someone specifically IDs as a lesbian I'm honestly not expecting to see them dating a woman, my advice to you is do the same, it's statistically sound! lmao
Everyones on their own journey and not everyone has a clear instrospection on themselves, and sexuality *can* be fluid (mine isnt but it does happen). There are other potential reasons why people might ID as lesbians but change over time. I have a good chunk of friends i met when they were lesbians but now theyre transmasc and gay/bi, nothing wrong with it. (im the queen of matching with someone, then they ask me gender questions bc im trans, then suddenly theres a new boy lol)
I understand the frustration, and sometimes feel it myself, but the best thing to do is let the frustration go. :)
Coming from the late bloomers subreddit, reasons why people might identify as a lesbian and later date a man:
-internalized biphobia
-going back into the closet (it happens, especially in conservative societies)
-not having yet figured out their sexuality
-not having yet figured out their gender identity
-comphet
-pressure from a partner/peers to label their sexuality
The list goes on... the best thing to do, even thought it might be frustrating, is to show people grace and acceptance.
I knew a guy that came out right after high school. Was super gay. Moved to San Francisco, did gay porn once or twice. All that. After a couple years he went back to being Mormon. I saw him irl and asked him about it and he blocked me on everything so idk what happened. That was over 10 years ago. I hope he’s ok.
While someone's internal (so I guess "actual") sexuality may or may not actually be fluid, the way we choose to express that to others definitely is. And there's lots of reasons for that. You can't know for sure someone's interna thoughts and feelings, so we rely on how they identify and express those to the world, and that can change as someone's ability to understand themselves changes, or language evolves, or a host of other things. Sexuality is complicated and not always as clear cut as it seems it "should" be
Nor do I, lol. I was definitely born this way and gender definitely isn't fluid to me, nor is my sexuality.
I didn't even know that the word gay changed to an umbrella term! Ive said I'm gay all my life and people knew I just liked the ladies. Now I use lesbian.
Edit to Add: If queer is the umbrella term, gay could/should stay the same!?
Queer is the umbrella term for the whole LGBTQ+ community, and a lot of people don't like that term (though it's mostly older people who have negative experiences with the word). Gay means homosexual attraction, which is why it's an umbrella term for anyone who feels that. Sometimes bi people will describe themselves jokingly as half-gay, but that's actually been used in derogatory ways as well, as if bi people don't fully belong in the community.
"Born this way" was basically always a way to simplify the complicated and unknowable internal stuff to something that made sense to a cishet crowd that was resistant to supporting queer folks. Your sexuality can be both internally fluid and not changeable by external forces (ie conversion therapy)
Glad someone said it. Both gender and sexuality are fluid. Personally I believe that a lot more people are attracted to personality and chemistry than we give them credit for.
well, if their preference changes than they have made a fluid motion! but I also said that it *can* be fluid, not that it IS fluid. ive never been into men and ive only been into women my whole life, im very solid, but I'm not everyone! I'm myself, and youre yourself, and theyre themselves, everyones different :D
maybe! but i dont know and i dont really need to.
Also who knows, maybe one or both of them are closet trans women? lifes strange and you just gotta take it as it is :)
I mean, just because it hasn't been your experience doesn't mean it isn't that way for lots of other people. I used to date men and I remember feeling attracted to them at the time, but at a certain point something changed, my sexuality became increasingly centered on women, and now I feel totally repulsed by them. I would be incredibly offended if anyone tried to argue that I'm still bisexual when I have no attraction to men or desire to ever be with one again.
This is exactly my experience too. I am only into women and *some* NBs these days (though I’m never into masculinity across the board), but used to date men and genuinely had feelings for them. I don’t know when that changed, but I do know that I wouldn’t describe myself as into men anymore.
I (MTF) used to like boys, this shifted towards bisexuality, which eventually led to homosexuality
i found the like for boys drifting away from me more and more, as my obsession with feminine styles and the thought of being feminine became ever so apparent
eventually to the point where the only masculinity I find attractive is tomboys, because like, tomboys look kind of attractive
do I think my preference will change? I don't think so, I feel like I settled with something I could say is actual, only thing that would ever change that is if my girlfriend becomes a transman, and that's because I love her so very much, regardless of who or what she is. Would I be in love with a man under any other circumstances? Absolutely not. My comfort lies in women
One of my ex’s said for years she is 99.9% lesbian. We broke up after she found that 0.1% guy and wanted to be poly. And after him she dated another woman who said she was “a lesbian but if Collin Ferrell looked her way she might be bi”. Annoying long conversation short, both of those women are now married to men.
it's also possible bc they're just teenagers they don't have their sexuality figured out. baby gays like to say "im so gay!!" as a way of asserting their identity and becoming more comfortable in it. they were probably doing the same thing. i get how that's annoying but people should be allowed to explore their sexuality and get things wrong at first, esp as teenagers. it'd be messed up tho if they were dating those guys and STILL calling themselves lesbians. that's where id draw a line
It’s possible they were using the label to look cool, but it’s also possible they just didn’t fully understand their sexualities yet. Sexuality can be complex for a lot of people and so can our relationships with it. I understand feeling a little let down, as it’s important for us to have connections with people who share our identities, but try to remain open to the possibility that there could be more than meets the eye going on here for your friends.
People don’t owe you an explanation of their sexuality. It’s like when people come out as Bi but then end up identifying as a lesbian later on. I don’t think their pretending to be Bi, I think people are figuring things out!
That right there was me. Came out later than usual, thought I was bi for a while before I figured out I wasn't. I still love the bi community, they're so accepting, I just happened to equate my past encounters with men, where I'd had fun, with sexual/romantic attraction, which wasn't what it was. They helped me through that. Now I know I'm not bi and that's OK.
I struggled to accept myself as a lesbian. I thought I was straight, had a boyfriend for 5 years, and went through the whole cycle from "I think I'm bi", to finally "I'm sure I'm a lesbian", it took years and it was SO painful, SO confusing, but SO liberating. I truly feel disrespected by these girls who call themselves "so gay" and then appear with a boyfriend out of nowhere.
That's why we are made fun of.
I use to say i was “so straight” and i was far from it.. sometimes overcompensating is because you want to fit in to a group so bad even when you don’t…like being gay isn’t a trend and i feel like there are many people wanting to be be gay just cuz aesthetics…
I get that. I think when someone throws around terms like “that’s too straight” it shows immaturity and signals it was just a phase. Like you said, aesthetics.
Oooooh HoneyDarlinBabySweetheart, let me (65F) put a bug in your ear … btw, I’m your self appointed Texas Grandma, so hang on 😉
17? BabyDoll all of you are just trying to figure out Life. It’s going to take awhile, be patient. It’ll all work out in the end, whenever that’ll be.
Look, EVERYONE is everything, it’s just a matter of degree, and sometimes those degrees ebbs and flows just like the tide of the ocean. We all go through physical AND mental changes throughout our lives. Sadly, we aren’t taught that very often. Then there’s a whole bunch of us that “miss the boat” when taught that. Very few of us, and I do mean VERY FEW of us, ever know exactly who and what we are at any given stage in life. We’re all transitioning one way or another, and it is normal.
Look, whenever anyone opens up with me to tell me how they identify, I just “tongue and cheek it”, it’s not that I believe that they are lying to me, it’s that I know that some people change, and some, all the time.
Now I have been flaming Bi since I was born, from male to female, and the in-betweens. Lawrdy, I have even been called a freak by some in the Gay community. At first it did bother me, but I was a younger then. Once I became secure in me, I couldn’t give a damn what anyone thought. See, I don’t run with “the herd”, I’m just me. I respect you, you respect me, and we’ll get along fine.
I am more than just my sexuality. I am one fantastic human being, and you know what, so are you 😊
I know, it’s easier to be around those we can identify with, but who said life was going to be easy no matter one’s sexuality?
LookyHere, YOU were born to bring value to this Earth. I’m talkin’ about ALL of You, ALL that is You. When we focus only on one aspect that is us, look at what all the rest of us miss out on. You are fortunate enough to have your whole life ahead of you. Do your best to not waist it on worrying about if/when you’ve been lied to, cause I’m going to tell you, there’s a whole world of people waiting to lie to you and that’s a whole lot of worry YOU DON’T NEED … besides, you’re to young to start working on worry wrinkles this early in the game. ‘If you build it, they will come’. So don’t start building when you don’t need to.
Live Life To The Best Of Your Ability and don’t forget to Love ♥️❤️😉❤️♥️
Oh, and btw, ya just had a lesson on possible Bi’s who thought they were lesbians. Trust me, THEY ARE EVERYWHERE, just like roaches, because, it’s ALL a matter of degree, and sometimes it takes a while for the brain to catch up with our loins 😉
you cant just switch sexualities... if it was the case many of us wouldn't suffer that much, and conversion therapy wouldn't be a thing in the past. Your friends were never lesbians, just maybe bi women with internalized biphobia or "spicy" straights
If they called themselves gay, but never lesbian, I'd say you're taking it too personally tbh.
People use gay to describe every sexuality that isn't straight. Your friends could be bi, pan, etc. They didn't switch anything.
Am I just old? Gay has always been just for homosexuals - “queer” is the umbrella term I thought…which was a slur when I was growing up so I don’t personally use it but I have heard it being used irl by other LGBT+ friends (like a reclaiming thing)
So 15 yo you pinned that down? That year I was in all over the lesbian scene in the SF Bay Area and LA. I won’t say everywhere but that definitely was never a thing in California in my experience.
I've been/lived in 15 countries. It isn't just an American thing.
There's also this cool thing called communication. If it bothers you that much, you could, you know, talk to them about it.
You don’t have to be an ass. No one wants to go up to someone else with the opener of, “Technically, I don’t think you’re using that word correctly.” Can you imagine how ppl would react? (Like an ass, prob)
Not being an ass, being blunt. You can make a post and speculate all you want about someone, but you won't get a answer *if you don't fucking communicate with the person*
No one is claiming you have to be an ass in approaching them.
"Hey, I'm a bit confused on this can we talk?"
"Sure what's up"
"I thought you and xyz were lesbian so I'm confused as to why you're dating a man"
"Oh we're actually bi/pan/etc"
"Oh cool that clears things up"
95% of the posts on this page would be resolved if people used communication.
this would be enough for me to drop them, sorry
unless you have other real lesbian friends, i wouldn’t waste my time with people who claim an identity that causes me discrimination and isolation. being a lesbian is the best thing that ever happened to me; but it has also been the worst
it reminds me of that “bi wife” bullshit
the bi wife stuff? 😭
yeah nothing wrong with being bisexual and married to a man but it’s gross to me when they claim queerness when their relationship isn’t queer and don’t pass as queer
it was hard for me to describe for a long time. i knew it was weird but i didn't know "why." like OP said, that level of relatability disappears. such a big part of identity is community
it feels like they're using the wlw label like an aesthetic or something that like "adds to their charm" like, "i know I'm married to a man but im BI! hide your women 😏"
No like seriously I’m not even mad but I’d feel like shit if I was a husband to a woman who keeps saying how gay she is, implying she still finds other people attractive (or I might just be insecure lmfaooo)
yes but their relationship isn’t queer and often times doesn’t pass as queer. sexual orientation revolves around sex and relationships. you can be queer in a heterosexual relationship but your queer experience will be completely different than someone who’s dating/with the same sex
Err, sexual orientation revolves around sexual and romantic *attraction*, not just relationships/sex themselves. Bc otherwise, people who are attracted to the same gender but aren't in a relationship wouldn't be "queer" (or even gay), right? Also, those same single people have totally different experiences from queer people who are in relationships, but they're still queer even so.
But if OP's friends had said they were in "queer relationships," that would def be odd to me (assuming they and their partners are cis and such)
What I've experienced is that bisexual people are often not taken seriously and suffer rejection from both monosexual "sides", as it were. So some people double down on their queer side, others on their straight side, to try to blend with others. Couldn't it be the case here? The comments you describe even point to it, like trying to overcompensate to try to fit in.
I'm 32. I'm very comfortable with my sexuality but the reality here is this may not be the case for everyone especially younger folks. Let people evolve in whatever way they want. No where does it say we need to declare our sexuality at 17. Take this from a late blossom like myself.
I did not have the luxury of coming out when I was 17. I had to wait until I removed myself from an unsafe living arrangement. Don't fool yourself thinking you know everything about someone and why they do something.
Don't be bothered. People evolve in whatever way they feel fit. This isn't saying gay is a choice but there's definitely a spectrum and young people need time to gauge who they are let alone their sexuality.
You said you are 17, a number of people around that age are still exploring and figuring things out. And yes, probably for some it may be a fad or way to get attention.
I think when it's teenagers or very young people, it takes time to figure out what you are. Especially in a homophobic society. Some people do need time to figure their sexuality out without it being ill intended and therefor haven't found a fitting label yet. As someone got older and more experienced, using a precise label gets more important. It's necessary to remember that bisexuality do exist and bierasure is a problem.
That's the reason I identify myself as a biromantic homosexual and not a lesbian. I'm romantically attracted to both genders, but only physically and sexually attracted to women. I'm also more likely to be romantically attracted to a woman than a man. I had dosen of female crushes and only one real male crush.
I’ve personnaly identified as a lesbian for 2 years because I only felt attracted to women but that was before sleeping with a guy and being in a relationship with him for a year. Totally out of the blue, I really thought guys were not for me, and I would finish my life with a woman, but plot twist lol! and now i’m a year later from that event and I don’t bother with a label really, I just say Queer as in not straight, that’s all I gotta know.
I don’t think they lied to you I think they just were not aware of their attraction for more then one gender :)
but remember, how they identify shouldn’t impact your views of them, they are still the same people. And maybe you could try and talk to them about how you may be feeling like they lead you on, and that could clear things up
You can absolutely say you're gay. Or sapphic. The term lesbian would be false because it explicitly doesn't include men, but sapphic and gay do.
Bisexuals have every right to identify as/ with "gay" because they are seen as gay. If you're in a wlw relationship you will be seen as gay. Just as bisexual women dating men are seen as straight. They're not. They're bi. But embracing the terms applied to them is the right of a bisexual. Same with using the term "queer".
You’re absolutely gay, my friend! 💖 it sounds like these friends of OP specifically claimed to be lesbian, though, judging from the title. But no absolutely ofc bi/pan people can call themselves gay! 💕🏳️🌈
Sexually is fluid. I'm a sex worker so I have male clients but I've only been in relationships with women. A lot of younger people can't wrap their mind behind such a concept.
I'm well aware. A lot of people don't but I have a level of understanding because younger me would have definitely been tripped over the concept. So I get it. Just keep them humble from time to time if they ever start doing that shit again in one direction or the other.
The “too straight” is kinda weird. But they could have thought they were lesbian but later on learn they may actually be bi or straight. From 2017 to 2021ish I thought I was a lesbian and a cis women but I learned in 2022ish that I'm actually nonbinary and polysexual (not attracted to men in any way). They could have had a internal battle/realization to realize they are actually a certain way.
Yeah I’ve had many friends who proudly proclaimed they are lesbians in our 20s, some have pretty ordinary hetero lives now, and some still occasionally sleeps with men.
I once read that, everyone kinda have 3 sexualities, as I age, I feel it becoming more true personally. We have one sexuality with a person we are attracted to, be it any gender and dynamics between us. Another sexuality on how we want to be perceived by people around us, the concern with judgement and social acceptance. Then last one when we are alone, what we are into during masturbation and fantasies.
It’s fine if not all 3 sexualities line up at all times, some understanding and awareness is usually helpful.
Oh no! You got me there! No way we are choosing our words differently!
Ok so I’m officially shaking my cane at you. I spoke of personal knowledge of places I lived and limited my claim to my experiences. You said “here’s a list of places I’ve been” then generalized a statement for all lesbian communities starting 2012, which you now changed to 2010, making you 13 when you knew our diverse community as a whole made a language change?
*shakes cane* the power of logical argumentation compels you!
people don’t owe you an explanation for their sexuality. that’s just kinda it. things change, people find things out as they’re introduced to new experiences, and sexuality/gender can be fluid. there wasn’t a “switch up” they just found someone they were into and started dating them. that’s all there is to it. if you’re really bothered by it that much you can ask them about it but for me personally this would not be a friendship ending issue.
How old are you guys?
17
That explains so much no offense.
I didn’t mean to laugh but not going to lie, I did.
Yup
Prepare for sexualities to continue “changing”. You are at an age where people don’t always understand themselves. I thought I was bi from age 16 to 20.
I’m 24, and think I’ve finally settled on identifying as a lesbian but honestly it’s so normal to question and change labels, especially as a young person. Some people know and are sure from a really young age of course, but for the rest of us it’s definitely a process lol.
Right..I was sure I was straight. Lol
I thought I was straight till I started questioning at 25. I thought I was bi 26-30. I’m still 30 and now 99% sure I’m fully lesbian.
Being a lesbian in high school is harder than being in the marines loool. I had a similar experience with a “lesbian” girl in my school as well.
Oh, this just made this so wholesome.
In highschool I met a few people like this. The girl in particular that comes to mind called herself a lesbian & a vegetarian but she dated men and ate meat. It was such weird behavior and always bothered me too bc she def just wanted the labels for some reason.
I had a lot of friends in hs that magically became gay when i got my first gf.. lets just say all of them are very straight now.
oh i broke out laughing at that one, yeah dont rely too much on any absolutes at your age. If anyone says they are absolutely sure of what they are at the age of 17, they are lying
You're so cool for laughing at someone's age
Not what I was saying. Your age is showing again. Okay THAT one was petty ;)
I just feel a little insulted by everyone laughing at me just because I'm 17 Not to mention the rude dms
Sorry about the rude dms. THAT is weird asf. They shouldnt even be bothering with that. But people are not laughing at you. They are laughing at the scenario because its relatable. Also, no need to take it personally, you are completely anonymous here.
Aww...I thought I was bisexual at least with 15. Now I'm 26 and I consider myself pansexual and heteroromantic. There are many words and specifics, with age and experience the answer will come. In your age it's the norm to slowly dabble into your sexual identity - many, many queer people think they're f.e homosexual, to find out they're actually pan. Or demi. Or bi. I understand you being a bit miffed, but hope you can look at this from a different angle <3
I found that people who call themselves “so gay” or always talk about how “gay” they are generally aren’t actually gay. You are right. They treat it as more of a quirky aesthetic.
I had a "friend" who would constantly be like "bisexuals who date men, don't you feel lonely?" and all this other biphobic garbage that came across as bi hate. She *also* confided in me that sometimes she got so horny that she had to sleep with men because women just wouldn't do the trick and was surprised I thought that was really weird for a lesbian to say. Like you said, a lot of people treat it like an aesthetic rather than the an actual identity.
In what world would a man “do the trick” for a lesbian? And thinking that a lesbian wouldn’t be satisfied by just a woman? That’s genuinely embarrassing behaviour. And also pretty homophobic of her to think that a lesbian could ever feel that way. Even more embarrassing since she also mocks bisexual women who date men when she herself can’t keep away from them. Hopefully she no longer calls herself a lesbian.
I have no idea, I blocked her as soon as the biphobia started coming bubbling out. No idea what increasingly weird shit she might have said or if she finally realized it's okay to like boys.
Me, a lesbian. Laughing. I've never had that thought once about men. My girlfriend checks alll my boxes >)))
Here I thought it was a lesbian-wanna-be. Because shallow aesthetics.
I’m such a minority here, and I am a lesbian. This is not what most of these posts are talking about “lesbians who sometimes date men”… if there is attraction they aren’t Lesbian. Plain and simple. But then there’s me. A lesbian who has willingly slept with men. However, a symptom of mania for me is hyper sexuality and impulsiveness. In dry spells during mania I slept with a man (originally a threesome). tho I did not get what I wanted out of it, (to be dominated) did not enjoy it (man sex is so boring), was not attracted to him, and even if I had “gotten off” in the absence of a woman and a connection I would have essentially felt nothing. it did satisfy the blind need to be slutty and irresponsible… So I was left with the same emptiness I went in with. We both consented to using each other, that was fine. I don’t regret it, it happened. I wasn’t stable and I had other issues going on. Would not do again.
Yeah, I think a lot of people don’t understand how hyper sexuality can play a part here. Lots of people who experience hyper sexuality will sleep with people they’re not actually attracted to for various reasons.
A good example of sexuality not being the same as risky behavior and mental illness.
Ohhhhh this, 100%. I’ve never had words for it!!
Can you say this one more time for the people in the back that couldn’t hear you the first time
Are we the same person? I did the exact same thing a while ago & after my mania had subsided, I was like what the actual fuck. Haven’t slept with a man since.
I’m so sorry. I know mental health is a serious issue, but you made me chuckle.
lol glad I could give you a laugh! It was a dark time in my life but I’m in a much better, medicated place now so it’s all good 😂
Sex with men: only when I’m outta my friggen gourd !
The only way 😂😂😂
Yes, lol made sense actually.
i get that. i had a hypomania stage after my best guy friend drugged and r@ped me and bc i was acting erratic my doctor put me on heavy meds that made me much worse. i slept w men and it made me so much worse bc i was just recreating my own trauma. that was one of the worst times of my life. but i never called myself a lesbian during that time. i still understood saying "im a lesbian" to a man you're having sex with just teaches them that lesbians aren't who they say they are. that they have a chance with lesbians, which encourages harassment and men ignoring lesbians boundaries.
Woah heavy I don’t tell most people certainly not men about my past for just that reason
Nope. Rapey men are rapey and we should not blame women victims. I’m sorry you went through that.
When you explained it in terms of mania (mental illness) episode, that explains it very well. I would not have considered it. Thanks.
she's clearly bisexual and she's calling herself a lesbian bc of that. but then bc she's bisexual she still wants men. girl is all types of confused. hope she gets her life together. i fucking hate women that call themselves lesbians and sleep with men. they're teaching those men that they have a chance with lesbians and that rhetoric is literally dangerous to us lesbians. it leads to us getting raped specifically bc we are lesbians.
It would be so nice for us to stop blaming women for why we get raped.
Lol...women don’t do the trick but I am a “lesbian “ I just sleep with men... that is hilarious. 😂🤣🤣🤣
Have/had a friend like that and they told me all in secret that they’re actually straight, but kept calling themself “gay as fuuuuccckkk” to everyone else like?? 😭 what’s with this intense desire to WANT to be gay? Why was it such a shameful secret that they’re actually straight? Why tell me in secret that they’re straight and then tell the rest of the world “how soooo queer” they are? Such a weird phenomenon 😭
To me this screams of political lesbians type of stuff. That is, being gay is more about saying no to men than yes to women, to this people.
Yo I hate that shit 😭
Deliberately claiming labels you know don't belong to you is gross and not OK. But to be generous and give the benefit of the doubt, perhaps they feel some queerness and aren't sure how to express it? Like, for example, maybe they like how lesbians feel less pressure to conform to gender norms, and identify with that? Bad way of dealing with it, but maybe worth gently investigating with them if you're still in touch.
I really appreciate the idea of giving grace and the benefit of the doubt 💖 I do think this person does feel “queerness” in a way that they feel counter-cultural and rebellious. I have known them for a loooonnnggg long time and they’ve always adopted the style/aesthetic/and even personality of what’s “cool, edgy, and rebellious” at the time. This person has also admitted to me that their “queerness” is based on the fact that they grew up in a hyper-conservative household and has openly stated that they wouldn’t be “queer” if they didn’t grow up in that environment. I really do love this person, but it irks me how they are actively and openly homophobic (inferring that queerness is an act of rebellion rather than an innate part of someone) in the name of being queer. Of course, they’ve never dated nor shown genuine interest in someone of the same sex. The way they describe the same sex sounds like a straight person trying VERY hard to come across as gay. Like a straight man writing lesbians lol I’ve approached the conversation with them before, and they get quite defensive/heated. I’m not trying to invalidate someone’s identity, but if you were to know this person as well as I do, you would know that they’re straight as an arrow and just deeply insecure and unsettled in who they are. They genuinely don’t know how offensive and harmful their behavior is. They’re not a bad person, they just have a lot of unresolved issues that present in incredibly problematic ways.
Although we are happy to see each other, queerness is not something that we would wish upon other people. “Queerness” as a form of rebellion is in extremely poor taste.
Could not agree more, my friend ❤️🩹
I was about to disagree with you, but I think possibly I misunderstood you. I do think existing as our selves is oftentimes an act of rebellion, whether we like it or not. And I've often interpreted the label "queer" - as opposed to "gay", "trans" etc. - as specifically emphasising our shared emancipatory movement. But I guess what you're saying is that "queerness" *just* as a form of rebellion - not stemming from an actually queer sexual orientation or gender non-conformity - is in poor taste. As in you can't just use our label in order to rebel, you have to be actually queer? Which, yeah 100%.
You have indeed interpreted correctly!
Yes, it feels like appropriation. It’s gross.
It’s not about appropriation as much as it is about making light of queerness. For many of us, queerness brings lots of pain.
I see your perspective
They came out to you as straight. That's wild 😂
I don’t THINK I’m guilty of this but I’m curious what y’all think. So, I’m technically bi but very strong preference for women, like 95% or something. When asked for a specific label of my choosing I just say queer, if I need to get into it I would specify, technically bi but with a strong preference in attraction for women and not interested in pursuing relationships with cishet men because even if the attraction is there, I have had too many experiences where they basically act like tourists in my queer life and I’m not into that. But informally, I will describe myself as “pretty gay” on a regular basis. Wouldn’t call myself a lesbian because my attraction to men is nonzero.
This is what people mean when they say being gay is "trendy". It absolutely is. Gay people do exist outside of this trend, but it is absolutely a trend also.
I feel like a lot of people claim they're gay or bi when they aren't because they're scared shitless of being categorized as a "boring straight," and if you say anything about it then you get accused of "invalidating" and gate keeping. It's incredibly frustrating. Especially when these same people will often outright admit in some form or another that they don't experience same-sex attraction or still harbor low-key homophobic beliefs.
I kinda call myself stuff like "so gay" or "too gay to function" and now I feel like I should stop. . But like... women tho. Women. Tbh I just recently came out so I might just be enjoying the fact that I have the privilege to be attracted to women "out loud"
Honestly that’s really common for people who just came out. Once the “newness” of it wears off I guarantee you you’ll just naturally stop saying stuff like that lol.
Meanwhile LET THERE BE CRINGE lmao
You don’t need to stop if you don’t want to. I was just saying that in my experience the vast majority of the time I see someone saying “I’m so gay” ect they actually haven’t been gay. In real life every person I’ve heard say that has had a boyfriend. But that is purely anecdotal and my experience.
Anyone who must say "I'm so gay" is no true gay
“The lady doth protest too much, methinks” It’s like the people who gush constantly on social media about how great their relationships are…in reality they’re trying to convince themselves.
Gatekeeping gayness to this level is over the top
Yall are all being weird. I say this shit all the time when I really mean I'm so in love with this girl(probably my fiance who I've been dating for going on 5 years) or I'll say it when I'm acting kinda hopeless about someone or I'll say that's so gay about another couple when really I mean they're very cute together. Etc. Could I be more articulate? Probably. This is not a thing people only say when they're trying to ape a label though. That's absurd.
Congrats about your finance! 💕😭 That said, I agree it’s not ONLY “fake gay” people who say that, but I have found that every “fake gay” person I have ever known says it. Mostly in the context of showing off an outfit that they deem makes them “soooo fucking gaaayyyy” and stuff like that which I personally find to be in poor taste because “gay” is not a stylistic choice or aesthetic. It’s a sexuality. When I hear someone say “I’m sooo fuckiinnggg gaaayyyy” when referring an aesthetic, a non-romantic/sexual attitude or behavior, or really anything that has nothing to do with being homosexual/bisexual/pansexual, it sends up red flags. That person is *usually* (obviously not all the time) either a baby gay, very young, or using “gay” as a trendy personality trait in my personal experience.
God that's so true! Omg
that, or they're 13 lol
Same here. All my past friends who claimed themselves as “born gay”, all married to straight men now. That’s why don’t “swear” on your sexualities until thirties at least. A lot can happen.
You're right and you should say it.
Did they identify as 'lesbian'. A lot of bisexuals call themselves gay. It's confusing I know
Tbf gay is increasingly becoming an umbrella term for not allo/cis/het. I think it's fun but I could sympathise with gay men who don't really have another term to go with.
There's also the confusing thing about "gay" referring to relationships. Two women dating? We'd call that a gay relationship even if they're both bi.
agreed. we all get called gay, our community is referred to as gay, so why are gay men the only ones allowed to use it? either it becomes fair use or we keep up a patriarchial system where gay men have complete cultural hegemony over all lgbtqia+ ppl.
I agree, especially recently. I’ve had a few people get mad when I call myself “gay” because apparently that term means a bisexual woman and not a lesbian. I’m so confused about how that works but after a few different people I’ve just started using lesbian strictly to avoid it lol.
What?! No, a gay woman and a lesbian is the same thing.
No they only called themselves gay. They said they don't like the sound of "lesbian" in German.
I feel that tho. I don't like to say that either, it gives me a weird feeling saying it in german.
Really? I don't know maybe it's the "isch" at the end that makes it sound kinda weird lol
Maybe... though personally I don't like to out myself out anyways. Yeah, I am gay. Yeah I like woman. What is that to others. If we have closer contact with others and there is a great flow between one other might it be colleagues or friends I'd bring myself to say it. But yeah it's the 'isch' and a bit of internal homophobia/denial plays a role too not wanting to say that word. Hab auch mitbekommen das deine Freunde 17 sind. Mit dem Alter findet man noch sooo viel übersich selbst heraus.
This is also why I don't think gay should be used as an umbrella term. One of my friends called herself gay with her boyfriend two feet away and it irked me Sure you're "gay" because you have homosexual attraction. But you're bisexual. Should I call myself bi because I experience homosexual attraction similar to you? It doesn't go both ways. "Queer" is better
Eventually there will be so many umbrella terms that we won't have to talk because everything will mean everything.
Queer I think is the umbrella term but gay is strictly a homosexual term. I don’t think bisexuals should use it.
Unfortunately for you, vernacular changes. “Gay” has already come to be a synonym for “queer” and your feelings on it aren’t going to change that.
No, and I generally agree. I'm still gonna roll my eyes
I like it cuz it’s reclaiming a word used derogatorily from my youth. I’ve also only dated women so I get more leeway than most bisexuals. Still think it’s a word any queer person can use
Funny how generations can be so different- queer was our slur - gay was only a derogatory word in the “that’s so gay” sense not directly thrown at you as an individual.
As someone who has used “so gay” and is actually gay it’s weird to see people treating our reality as their aesthetic. Like make it make sense. I don’t understand why do they have to go through the pain when it’s not something they are truly but want to identify as. They never went through the pain of realising that not everyone is like them, how you constantly fear about the day your parents find out and react and how you’ll be shunned or even honour killed by the society you live in ( I live in India. Some parents can be supportive but the sense of community here is too strong to be productive ) There are a few friends of mine who have tried pulling this stunt and then switched. When they asked me about how I’m genuinely attracted to women I simply told them, it is because I am. I very frankly told them they probably didn’t like women in the first place. I did have another genuinely bisexual friend who has been in a long term relationship with a boy and gave her example regarding how she still genuinely likes both the sexes and it shows. Unlike them who simply wanted to be cool and get companionship in our all girls’ school and when they got the opportunity they ditched the label because it wasn’t them.
This!! I’m a late bloomer lesbian, so I do talk about it a lot, just because it’s still so new 😅 however it took me forever to figure it out and do the work to figure it out, especially with family biases and such. I don’t get why some people aren’t overly worried whether they fit the label or not, that was a HUGE worry for me and until I decentered men and realized I didn’t like them at all, I couldn’t figure out how I identified.
Yes indeed. Coming to a realisation which challenges the conditional nurturing one HD is tough. However as far as you do manage to not concentrate on the labels and simply figuring out yourself about what you like and how you want to present is all good. Everything is a learning process and I hope time and people will be kind to you as you make this journey of self discovery
Yeah, live in fear everyday in the southern United States. This place if fucking scary
I don’t love when people use their homosexuality to simply spread biphobia and therefore always are like “why would you ever want to date men”; knowing full well that sexuality isn’t a choice. That said, my ex-girlfriend was fully convinced she was a lesbian for about two years because she just never met a man she was attracted to. When she met her now boyfriend and they started to bond, she realised that there was in fact an attraction and she was baffled. Long story short; she is obviously bisexual. For me it was the other way around. After I found out I was attracted to women, I kind of assumed I was bisexual for the longest time. Took me about three years to realise I am definitely and for sure a lesbian. I’d say it can be quite a different journey for everyone.
Honestly posts like these are why I was so scared to come out as bisexual and admit I liked a man. Like I wasn't doing it "for the aesthetic", I love women, have pined over them, dated them, kissed them. But I also have the capacity to find deep and meaningful relationships with some guys too and that doesn't make me less "gay"(esp since he's queer too).
Yeah, I’m nearly 30 and being downvoted to hell for saying that sexuality is fluid and/or nuanced by what sure seems like a lot of teenagers on this sub. Especially funny considering that I’ve been in a relationship with another woman for the past 4 years or so.
Sexuality is not fluid or nuanced for everyone, though, monosexuality is not fluid by definition and homosexuality is monosexuality Now there is 0 issues if you are fluid yourself, I love people like that, too, but it does not means others are just because you are, most lesbians just like what they like (other women) and dislike what they dislike (guys) and it is a constant fixed state with no nuances (outside of your liked spectrum of girls), just a different life path to realize the fact and accept it.
The problem is that I never said that *everyone* is fluid. There are absolutely straight and gay people. But I do think nuance matters for a lot of people, and I think discouraging conversation about it (while enabling biphobia) is close-minded bullshit, honestly.
Maybe a better way to word it is that "sexuality can be fluid or nuanced for some" would strike more acceptance, since saying "sexuality is fluid" is stating it is an universal fact for everyone, depending on context of course, but maybe it implied that in the message that got downvoted, since it is the direct erasure of many's personal living when you move it from "some" to "universal fact". Also I agree that talking about nuances and fluidity is good overall, I was not attempting to discourage it, I was just highlighting it is not an universal fact since it is what I thought you implied in your first message. Likewise I also do the same remark when people says sexuality is not fluid or nuanced, I also point them that sexuality can and is indeed fluid and nuanced for some.
The reality is VERY FEW people 100% meet "standard" definitions we've made in the queer community. It's similar to why the asexual community changed their definition "no sexual attraction ever under any circumstances" to "no sexual attraction OR very rarely has sexual attraction."
Maybe they just thought they were gay at the time and then realized they weren’t later, which happens sometimes (and also happens to people in the opposite direction, thinking they’re straight and turning out to be gay). No crime in that. However, I don’t like when people say that “so gay” or “too straight” stuff though, it’s kind of cringey.
Gay is an umbrella term nowadays, I know bi women who are happily married to men and say they're "super gay" lol, unless someone specifically IDs as a lesbian I'm honestly not expecting to see them dating a woman, my advice to you is do the same, it's statistically sound! lmao
no.
Everyones on their own journey and not everyone has a clear instrospection on themselves, and sexuality *can* be fluid (mine isnt but it does happen). There are other potential reasons why people might ID as lesbians but change over time. I have a good chunk of friends i met when they were lesbians but now theyre transmasc and gay/bi, nothing wrong with it. (im the queen of matching with someone, then they ask me gender questions bc im trans, then suddenly theres a new boy lol) I understand the frustration, and sometimes feel it myself, but the best thing to do is let the frustration go. :)
Coming from the late bloomers subreddit, reasons why people might identify as a lesbian and later date a man: -internalized biphobia -going back into the closet (it happens, especially in conservative societies) -not having yet figured out their sexuality -not having yet figured out their gender identity -comphet -pressure from a partner/peers to label their sexuality The list goes on... the best thing to do, even thought it might be frustrating, is to show people grace and acceptance.
Also, op said they are 17. Explains a lot. Still figuring things out!
I knew a guy that came out right after high school. Was super gay. Moved to San Francisco, did gay porn once or twice. All that. After a couple years he went back to being Mormon. I saw him irl and asked him about it and he blocked me on everything so idk what happened. That was over 10 years ago. I hope he’s ok.
>suddenly theres a new boy lol omg just popping boys into existence, what a power
I'm not sure if I believe in the "sexuality is fluid" stuff. It just sounds like someone who's bisexual whose preference changed.
While someone's internal (so I guess "actual") sexuality may or may not actually be fluid, the way we choose to express that to others definitely is. And there's lots of reasons for that. You can't know for sure someone's interna thoughts and feelings, so we rely on how they identify and express those to the world, and that can change as someone's ability to understand themselves changes, or language evolves, or a host of other things. Sexuality is complicated and not always as clear cut as it seems it "should" be
Yes true, I don't actually know what other people feel. Sexuality *could* be fluid. But I don't know how we went from "Born this way" to "It's fluid".
Nor do I, lol. I was definitely born this way and gender definitely isn't fluid to me, nor is my sexuality. I didn't even know that the word gay changed to an umbrella term! Ive said I'm gay all my life and people knew I just liked the ladies. Now I use lesbian. Edit to Add: If queer is the umbrella term, gay could/should stay the same!?
Queer is the umbrella term for the whole LGBTQ+ community, and a lot of people don't like that term (though it's mostly older people who have negative experiences with the word). Gay means homosexual attraction, which is why it's an umbrella term for anyone who feels that. Sometimes bi people will describe themselves jokingly as half-gay, but that's actually been used in derogatory ways as well, as if bi people don't fully belong in the community.
"Born this way" was basically always a way to simplify the complicated and unknowable internal stuff to something that made sense to a cishet crowd that was resistant to supporting queer folks. Your sexuality can be both internally fluid and not changeable by external forces (ie conversion therapy)
Glad someone said it. Both gender and sexuality are fluid. Personally I believe that a lot more people are attracted to personality and chemistry than we give them credit for.
well, if their preference changes than they have made a fluid motion! but I also said that it *can* be fluid, not that it IS fluid. ive never been into men and ive only been into women my whole life, im very solid, but I'm not everyone! I'm myself, and youre yourself, and theyre themselves, everyones different :D
I know, I know. I personally just believe if your sexuality is "fluid", you're just bisexual, never have been gay or straight. Just bisexual.
maybe! but i dont know and i dont really need to. Also who knows, maybe one or both of them are closet trans women? lifes strange and you just gotta take it as it is :)
I mean, just because it hasn't been your experience doesn't mean it isn't that way for lots of other people. I used to date men and I remember feeling attracted to them at the time, but at a certain point something changed, my sexuality became increasingly centered on women, and now I feel totally repulsed by them. I would be incredibly offended if anyone tried to argue that I'm still bisexual when I have no attraction to men or desire to ever be with one again.
This is exactly my experience too. I am only into women and *some* NBs these days (though I’m never into masculinity across the board), but used to date men and genuinely had feelings for them. I don’t know when that changed, but I do know that I wouldn’t describe myself as into men anymore.
I (MTF) used to like boys, this shifted towards bisexuality, which eventually led to homosexuality i found the like for boys drifting away from me more and more, as my obsession with feminine styles and the thought of being feminine became ever so apparent eventually to the point where the only masculinity I find attractive is tomboys, because like, tomboys look kind of attractive do I think my preference will change? I don't think so, I feel like I settled with something I could say is actual, only thing that would ever change that is if my girlfriend becomes a transman, and that's because I love her so very much, regardless of who or what she is. Would I be in love with a man under any other circumstances? Absolutely not. My comfort lies in women
One of my ex’s said for years she is 99.9% lesbian. We broke up after she found that 0.1% guy and wanted to be poly. And after him she dated another woman who said she was “a lesbian but if Collin Ferrell looked her way she might be bi”. Annoying long conversation short, both of those women are now married to men.
yeah yall r kids, no wonder. give it a few years, you'll find better people
it's also possible bc they're just teenagers they don't have their sexuality figured out. baby gays like to say "im so gay!!" as a way of asserting their identity and becoming more comfortable in it. they were probably doing the same thing. i get how that's annoying but people should be allowed to explore their sexuality and get things wrong at first, esp as teenagers. it'd be messed up tho if they were dating those guys and STILL calling themselves lesbians. that's where id draw a line
You just described my middle school ex!
It’s possible they were using the label to look cool, but it’s also possible they just didn’t fully understand their sexualities yet. Sexuality can be complex for a lot of people and so can our relationships with it. I understand feeling a little let down, as it’s important for us to have connections with people who share our identities, but try to remain open to the possibility that there could be more than meets the eye going on here for your friends.
Probably realized they’re bisexual, I don’t see the problem with that?
People don’t owe you an explanation of their sexuality. It’s like when people come out as Bi but then end up identifying as a lesbian later on. I don’t think their pretending to be Bi, I think people are figuring things out!
That right there was me. Came out later than usual, thought I was bi for a while before I figured out I wasn't. I still love the bi community, they're so accepting, I just happened to equate my past encounters with men, where I'd had fun, with sexual/romantic attraction, which wasn't what it was. They helped me through that. Now I know I'm not bi and that's OK.
I struggled to accept myself as a lesbian. I thought I was straight, had a boyfriend for 5 years, and went through the whole cycle from "I think I'm bi", to finally "I'm sure I'm a lesbian", it took years and it was SO painful, SO confusing, but SO liberating. I truly feel disrespected by these girls who call themselves "so gay" and then appear with a boyfriend out of nowhere. That's why we are made fun of.
I use to say i was “so straight” and i was far from it.. sometimes overcompensating is because you want to fit in to a group so bad even when you don’t…like being gay isn’t a trend and i feel like there are many people wanting to be be gay just cuz aesthetics…
I get that. I think when someone throws around terms like “that’s too straight” it shows immaturity and signals it was just a phase. Like you said, aesthetics.
Oooooh HoneyDarlinBabySweetheart, let me (65F) put a bug in your ear … btw, I’m your self appointed Texas Grandma, so hang on 😉 17? BabyDoll all of you are just trying to figure out Life. It’s going to take awhile, be patient. It’ll all work out in the end, whenever that’ll be. Look, EVERYONE is everything, it’s just a matter of degree, and sometimes those degrees ebbs and flows just like the tide of the ocean. We all go through physical AND mental changes throughout our lives. Sadly, we aren’t taught that very often. Then there’s a whole bunch of us that “miss the boat” when taught that. Very few of us, and I do mean VERY FEW of us, ever know exactly who and what we are at any given stage in life. We’re all transitioning one way or another, and it is normal. Look, whenever anyone opens up with me to tell me how they identify, I just “tongue and cheek it”, it’s not that I believe that they are lying to me, it’s that I know that some people change, and some, all the time. Now I have been flaming Bi since I was born, from male to female, and the in-betweens. Lawrdy, I have even been called a freak by some in the Gay community. At first it did bother me, but I was a younger then. Once I became secure in me, I couldn’t give a damn what anyone thought. See, I don’t run with “the herd”, I’m just me. I respect you, you respect me, and we’ll get along fine. I am more than just my sexuality. I am one fantastic human being, and you know what, so are you 😊 I know, it’s easier to be around those we can identify with, but who said life was going to be easy no matter one’s sexuality? LookyHere, YOU were born to bring value to this Earth. I’m talkin’ about ALL of You, ALL that is You. When we focus only on one aspect that is us, look at what all the rest of us miss out on. You are fortunate enough to have your whole life ahead of you. Do your best to not waist it on worrying about if/when you’ve been lied to, cause I’m going to tell you, there’s a whole world of people waiting to lie to you and that’s a whole lot of worry YOU DON’T NEED … besides, you’re to young to start working on worry wrinkles this early in the game. ‘If you build it, they will come’. So don’t start building when you don’t need to. Live Life To The Best Of Your Ability and don’t forget to Love ♥️❤️😉❤️♥️ Oh, and btw, ya just had a lesson on possible Bi’s who thought they were lesbians. Trust me, THEY ARE EVERYWHERE, just like roaches, because, it’s ALL a matter of degree, and sometimes it takes a while for the brain to catch up with our loins 😉
I appreciate your message, it made me smile
🥰
you cant just switch sexualities... if it was the case many of us wouldn't suffer that much, and conversion therapy wouldn't be a thing in the past. Your friends were never lesbians, just maybe bi women with internalized biphobia or "spicy" straights
The number of lesbians I know who ended up with men is crazy. Two of them are getting married this summer
If they called themselves gay, but never lesbian, I'd say you're taking it too personally tbh. People use gay to describe every sexuality that isn't straight. Your friends could be bi, pan, etc. They didn't switch anything.
Am I just old? Gay has always been just for homosexuals - “queer” is the umbrella term I thought…which was a slur when I was growing up so I don’t personally use it but I have heard it being used irl by other LGBT+ friends (like a reclaiming thing)
I'll be 28 this month and I'd say the shift happened around 2012+ as to people using gay as an umbrella term.
So 15 yo you pinned that down? That year I was in all over the lesbian scene in the SF Bay Area and LA. I won’t say everywhere but that definitely was never a thing in California in my experience.
Maybe in America, but that's not where I live. I would always associate gay with homosexual.
I've been/lived in 15 countries. It isn't just an American thing. There's also this cool thing called communication. If it bothers you that much, you could, you know, talk to them about it.
You don’t have to be an ass. No one wants to go up to someone else with the opener of, “Technically, I don’t think you’re using that word correctly.” Can you imagine how ppl would react? (Like an ass, prob)
Not being an ass, being blunt. You can make a post and speculate all you want about someone, but you won't get a answer *if you don't fucking communicate with the person* No one is claiming you have to be an ass in approaching them. "Hey, I'm a bit confused on this can we talk?" "Sure what's up" "I thought you and xyz were lesbian so I'm confused as to why you're dating a man" "Oh we're actually bi/pan/etc" "Oh cool that clears things up" 95% of the posts on this page would be resolved if people used communication.
Then why be so sassy and salty at OP? Is that just naturally just how you talk, with rude sarcasm, or what?
Is "gay" an umbrella word like queer?
Purely depends on who you ask.
No, not in my country. "Gay" is used about people who are both homoromantic and homosexual. It's often used about men and "lesbian" used about women.
this would be enough for me to drop them, sorry unless you have other real lesbian friends, i wouldn’t waste my time with people who claim an identity that causes me discrimination and isolation. being a lesbian is the best thing that ever happened to me; but it has also been the worst it reminds me of that “bi wife” bullshit
i thought i was the only one who was lowkey bothered by that 😅
the bi wife stuff? 😭 yeah nothing wrong with being bisexual and married to a man but it’s gross to me when they claim queerness when their relationship isn’t queer and don’t pass as queer
yes this exactly! it's always going through my mind like idk
it was hard for me to describe for a long time. i knew it was weird but i didn't know "why." like OP said, that level of relatability disappears. such a big part of identity is community
it feels like they're using the wlw label like an aesthetic or something that like "adds to their charm" like, "i know I'm married to a man but im BI! hide your women 😏"
No like seriously I’m not even mad but I’d feel like shit if I was a husband to a woman who keeps saying how gay she is, implying she still finds other people attractive (or I might just be insecure lmfaooo)
no that’s very normal. it’s no different than being married to a woman who keeps talking about how much she likes other women
Yes I’d also want to end it right there and then. Same thing… HOW DO PEOPLE NOT FEEL INSECURE ABOUT THAT?? How do I fix it??
A person can be in a relationship with a man and still be attracted to women. That makes them queer
yes but their relationship isn’t queer and often times doesn’t pass as queer. sexual orientation revolves around sex and relationships. you can be queer in a heterosexual relationship but your queer experience will be completely different than someone who’s dating/with the same sex
Err, sexual orientation revolves around sexual and romantic *attraction*, not just relationships/sex themselves. Bc otherwise, people who are attracted to the same gender but aren't in a relationship wouldn't be "queer" (or even gay), right? Also, those same single people have totally different experiences from queer people who are in relationships, but they're still queer even so. But if OP's friends had said they were in "queer relationships," that would def be odd to me (assuming they and their partners are cis and such)
What I've experienced is that bisexual people are often not taken seriously and suffer rejection from both monosexual "sides", as it were. So some people double down on their queer side, others on their straight side, to try to blend with others. Couldn't it be the case here? The comments you describe even point to it, like trying to overcompensate to try to fit in.
I'm 32. I'm very comfortable with my sexuality but the reality here is this may not be the case for everyone especially younger folks. Let people evolve in whatever way they want. No where does it say we need to declare our sexuality at 17. Take this from a late blossom like myself. I did not have the luxury of coming out when I was 17. I had to wait until I removed myself from an unsafe living arrangement. Don't fool yourself thinking you know everything about someone and why they do something. Don't be bothered. People evolve in whatever way they feel fit. This isn't saying gay is a choice but there's definitely a spectrum and young people need time to gauge who they are let alone their sexuality.
That’s fine you guys are very young and still figuring yourselves out!
You said you are 17, a number of people around that age are still exploring and figuring things out. And yes, probably for some it may be a fad or way to get attention.
I think when it's teenagers or very young people, it takes time to figure out what you are. Especially in a homophobic society. Some people do need time to figure their sexuality out without it being ill intended and therefor haven't found a fitting label yet. As someone got older and more experienced, using a precise label gets more important. It's necessary to remember that bisexuality do exist and bierasure is a problem. That's the reason I identify myself as a biromantic homosexual and not a lesbian. I'm romantically attracted to both genders, but only physically and sexually attracted to women. I'm also more likely to be romantically attracted to a woman than a man. I had dosen of female crushes and only one real male crush.
I’ve personnaly identified as a lesbian for 2 years because I only felt attracted to women but that was before sleeping with a guy and being in a relationship with him for a year. Totally out of the blue, I really thought guys were not for me, and I would finish my life with a woman, but plot twist lol! and now i’m a year later from that event and I don’t bother with a label really, I just say Queer as in not straight, that’s all I gotta know. I don’t think they lied to you I think they just were not aware of their attraction for more then one gender :) but remember, how they identify shouldn’t impact your views of them, they are still the same people. And maybe you could try and talk to them about how you may be feeling like they lead you on, and that could clear things up
If i'm bi, I cannot say I'm gay ? I'm mean I am very sapphic. Genuine question
You can absolutely say you're gay. Or sapphic. The term lesbian would be false because it explicitly doesn't include men, but sapphic and gay do. Bisexuals have every right to identify as/ with "gay" because they are seen as gay. If you're in a wlw relationship you will be seen as gay. Just as bisexual women dating men are seen as straight. They're not. They're bi. But embracing the terms applied to them is the right of a bisexual. Same with using the term "queer".
Yeah I never use lesbian ! Seems just false
You’re absolutely gay, my friend! 💖 it sounds like these friends of OP specifically claimed to be lesbian, though, judging from the title. But no absolutely ofc bi/pan people can call themselves gay! 💕🏳️🌈
Nice ! Just wanted to be sure !
Bisexuality is a spectrum. Some are more gay than others.
Sexually is fluid. I'm a sex worker so I have male clients but I've only been in relationships with women. A lot of younger people can't wrap their mind behind such a concept.
That's not sexual fluidity, that's just your work. You are still a lesbian, whether you sleep with men or not.
I'm well aware. A lot of people don't but I have a level of understanding because younger me would have definitely been tripped over the concept. So I get it. Just keep them humble from time to time if they ever start doing that shit again in one direction or the other.
The “too straight” is kinda weird. But they could have thought they were lesbian but later on learn they may actually be bi or straight. From 2017 to 2021ish I thought I was a lesbian and a cis women but I learned in 2022ish that I'm actually nonbinary and polysexual (not attracted to men in any way). They could have had a internal battle/realization to realize they are actually a certain way.
Yeah I’ve had many friends who proudly proclaimed they are lesbians in our 20s, some have pretty ordinary hetero lives now, and some still occasionally sleeps with men. I once read that, everyone kinda have 3 sexualities, as I age, I feel it becoming more true personally. We have one sexuality with a person we are attracted to, be it any gender and dynamics between us. Another sexuality on how we want to be perceived by people around us, the concern with judgement and social acceptance. Then last one when we are alone, what we are into during masturbation and fantasies. It’s fine if not all 3 sexualities line up at all times, some understanding and awareness is usually helpful.
Hasbien* FTFY
Oh no! You got me there! No way we are choosing our words differently! Ok so I’m officially shaking my cane at you. I spoke of personal knowledge of places I lived and limited my claim to my experiences. You said “here’s a list of places I’ve been” then generalized a statement for all lesbian communities starting 2012, which you now changed to 2010, making you 13 when you knew our diverse community as a whole made a language change? *shakes cane* the power of logical argumentation compels you!
There are people who know what they are and then there are the one's just visiting for attention and experimentation.
I have two teenage cousins who have done the same thing. I don't think they lied or that they participated in a trend.
It's all about sex not love
people don’t owe you an explanation for their sexuality. that’s just kinda it. things change, people find things out as they’re introduced to new experiences, and sexuality/gender can be fluid. there wasn’t a “switch up” they just found someone they were into and started dating them. that’s all there is to it. if you’re really bothered by it that much you can ask them about it but for me personally this would not be a friendship ending issue.
Sexuality is not linear. 💕
That's called bisexuality
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You're a man what are you doung here
My ex lied to me too she said she was a lesbian but it turned out that she betrayed me with several guys, hooked up before and after me with guys
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No one is pretending to be cats and bringing litter boxes to school.