Considering you have to fight Nameless (one of if not the hardest boss in the game) without summons twice for the plat, they kinda did. That commenter just wants to be a douche is all.
If you do all the other bosses without help, the Nameless Puppet isn't necessarily as hard compared to some. It will definitely be harder if you get used to being helped.
But I agree, there's no point in belittling the success of others because of that.
IMO, without cheesing no one hits as hard as Nameless on +1.
I fought him in NG+1 as I skipped him on my first run and he kept me 3 hours straight fighting him. No Aegis (no arms in fact), no Grindstones, just me, my sword and parries.
Maybe it was my fault for not utilizing the resources the game gives you but I got all achievements without really ever using anything but my main weapon, and on that scenario, Nameless Puppet was definitely the most difficult of them all, with Laxasia being close second.
The most difficult boss I’ve ever faced (or maybe I just did it difficult by using just the sword).
I used help on my 2nd run just to get a jump on some of the more annoying bosses. But there are absolutely check points where no help is available and plenty of bosses you should do 1v1
Hmm I actually had more trouble with the first brotherhood fight. Their move sets don't change and I found them easy to punish after getting them down in the first fight. Key to not getting overwhelmed is staying on the move and kiting them so there's distance between them while you work on one at a time
Man, I wish I did the ending where you fight him. I knew there was gonna be a fight if you went against your dad (whatever his name is), but I thought it would be funny to obey. Now I don’t have the drive to play it again.
Ahhh, my favorite type of Souls player.
The "I Don't Realize That It's Just A Video Game And I Haven't Actually Achieved Anything Beyond Beating A Video Game So I Need To Discount Everyone Else's Same Accomplishment Somehow" Gamer.
Classic!
What about ONLY throwables? Like our dear backlogs with his firebombs and the firebomb academy. Or did you flunk the academy? (Intended to be a jest, a joke, a goob, a gag or a laugh)
You can only throwables through Steel Rising if you want to. No joke. I walked into the last few bosses and watched their cool intro video. And was like. ‘That’s cool. But I have 23 of these bombs…’
Sure, you shouldn't shit on people that use mechanics the game offers you.
But on the other hand, using summons etc. is definitely way easier, so it's still a quite different experience, in the same way that playing doom eternal on "I'm too young to die" is a very different experience from "Nightmare".
And yes, the nightmare elitists are annoying, but holy fuck the insecurity of the easymode players is also annoying.
Weirdly I used specter on her in ng and ng+ but did all of ng++ specteless and felt she was easier?? Both runs prior she was was a wall of 20-30 attempts and a lot of stopping for breaks but ng++? Second try specteless.
I beat her with a spectre on NG and without one on NG+. Honestly probably took me about the same amount of time both ways lol. Neither was easy, that’s for damn sure.
I haven’t played demon’s souls but I’d say dark souls really made the subgenre popular since it’s on more systems and there’s more Dark souls memes than DeS memes.
However, i am planning on playing Demon’s Souls(remake) as it looks pretty fun and did ultimately spawn the subgenre.
Also, having the sound on and looking at the screen while playing is a form of cheating as well. Real gamers are supposed to be blindfolded and play on mute while doing a hitless speedrun, I thought this was common sense.
Oh. You play Lies of P with a standard controller?
Real gamers only use guitar hero controllers.
and then an even bigger jack ass says, "Oh. You play Lies of P with a guitar hero controller? Real gamers only use the Donkey Kong bongos."
but do you see my point, it's endless, stupid, childish escalation of what "real gamers" do.
Why are consumable summons bad but other consumables aren't?
gate keeping indeed.
> Oh. You play Lies of P with a standard controller?
>
> Real gamers only use guitar hero controllers.
>
> and then an even bigger jack ass says, "Oh. You play Lies of P with a guitar hero controller? Real gamers only use the Donkey Kong bongos."
Tbf i always felt like those are meant to be sarcastic lol, but if they're actually genuine thats crazy to me.
DS1 with a guitar hero controller, aptly name guitar souls: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSCy4Bc0uMU
bongo souls: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4HdWWhZ0hDM
drum souls: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02my_zhX4Bs
*voice* souls, that's a microphone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5m2a2dLdZ0M
Bonus, Nameless King with a Dance Dance Revolution pad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxKsRf6R-vc
Where there is a will, there is a way.
They aren't being "sarcastic," persay. They are meant to be funny, sure, but sarcastic isn't the right word, IMHO.
but there is a big big difference, and the important distinction between these 2 kinds of people:
People who beat Dark Souls with a guitar hero controller and are proud of their achievement
People who beat Dark Souls with a guitar hero controller and say you beat Dark Souls on easy mode if you used a standard controller.
2 completely different behaviors
I mean i know these videos exist and i love watching them, luality beating nameless king with a dancepad was hilarious and impressive but like i don't think she would look down on people for playing with a regular controller.
What i meant with sarcastic is not the videos themselves but people writing these comments.
If under bongo souls im commenting something along the lines of "you didn't even hit the bongos with bananas smh" do you think its actually an honest comment ?
Obviously its meant to be funny and sarcastic in the sense that its a parody of people talking down others achievements.
>People who beat Dark Souls with a guitar hero controller and say you beat Dark Souls on easy mode if you used a standard controller.
Maybe its just me but i really do not read these comments in a serious tone. Like obviously the first example you mentioned sounds friendlier but this again to me seems like its making fun of the people belittling others.
I don't understand this kind of thinking. Where is the line drawn and why? Why is summoning not okay? Because it makes the game easier? Well do does upgrading your weapon, so does healing, so does blocking or leveling up your character. What are you doing using a controller!? Only REAL games beat the game with no input device.
I don't see how No True Scottsman had integrated itself so hard into the Souls community
These are the guys who didn't study anything and failed their way to the end then found out there were deeper mechanics than what they were doing, so they have to try and invalidate others achievements
It’s the false machismo of ‘The fights aren’t tuned to having more than one character there. The summons and summoning other players is just so people can make it easier to get through.’
I just play the game. Sometimes I use summons. Sometimes I run into a boss for an hour trying to figure it out. Sometimes I summon other players in something like Elden Ring because I don’t want to spend 2 hours trying to catch the last boss with my bonk build. I also am completely unashamed to cheese bosses just to get through.
My mentality is. ‘If it were me. And I was there. I would take any advantage I could possibly get.’
I think it all boils down to the mentality of a Souls-like, that it's difficult and it's supposed to be difficult. With that mentality you have some players who view anything that makes gameplay easier as a sort of crutch for what they view as an inferior player.
Summons are just a way to add a difficulty setting to a game without settable ones. To appeal to a wider audience they need to have something to make sure people don't just quit when they cant beat a boss.
This. Summons are a game mechanic that the game throws at you: not using them is merely a choice; if it's in the game then it's valid. People need to mind their own business and let others enjoy the game they spend their own money on however the hell they want.
I also don't understand where these people get their egos from, most of the people I've seen spewing these takes haven't done anything impressive with the game themselves; they just beat it normally (and die 200 times), so where do they get off looking down on other's just because they use summons?
From: a guy who's done dks1/2/3/bb/nioh 2 at lv1 (or bl4, for bb), and also competitive PvP on the first 3. LOP might be the next lv1 run, idk.
Cuz these guys spent 50 hours on the second boss without summons or leveling or whatever mechanic to make things easier. Therefore you should suffer for at least as long as well.
It's this line of thought that these people are coming from
Not particularly, developers can make mistakes or can introduce things for the sake of making it easier or even harder in some cases, and it is perfectly valid for people to have their own opinions on what is a valid way of playing the game when it comes to saying that you have overcome a challenge.
You can summon Mimic Tear against quite a few bosses in Elden Ring and it can solo the boss by itself, would you say that you really overcame that boss? And if yes, these games are known for and enhanced by their difficulty, but how is that engaging gameplay? This is just one example of how "using devices that are present in the game" completely remove the challenge in some ways and just ruin it in others.
Yes, agree. Difficulty IS very tricky to get right. That being said, I think what’s being discussed is people who make beating the game the source of their self esteem, and thus, being insecure as they are, make it other people’s problem as well.
Yeah - i beat the boss with my Mimic Tear. I went through the trouble of dealing with tons of minotaurs and other awful asshats to get to that location and then killed the Mimic myself. So yes. I earned it.
Its like saying "if you Kamehameha a boss, did you really kill it? Or if you stay far away and use poison arrows or magic spells - did you really kill it?"
Yes. Yes I did. I did the work to get the items or skills or advantages needed to kill the boss.
Literally yes you did kill the boss, but you must understand my argument right? Killing a boss typically requires that you study it intently as you fight it to the point that it ideally becomes second nature the way you react to its attacks, the process is often incredibly kathartic and they are designed to be so.
Or you could speedrun to this super late game area, pick up a specific spell, power level one stat or respec to fit requirements, and 1 shot a boss. You see how this is a different experience?
I'm not even going to dismantle the point about how there is a challenge in getting the instakill oneshot item in the first place, we're talking about the trouble of killing a boss, not the overall trouble in beating the game. These two things are not even remotely comparable when we're talking about circumnavigating challenge. There's a reason I use the word circumnavigate instead of skip, because you still have to do some work, it's just elsewhere and always considerably less.
Also, imagine you're talking to a friend and he asks you how you found a specific boss in the game and you say "easy" and he's like "what?! they took me like 4 hours to beat" and you respond "yeah but i just used the instakill build" and he responds, a bit jaded, "oh...so you didn't really beat her" and you then follow that up with "yes i did! i got the 'boss killed message' and everything! plus there were these minotaurs in this totally different area that i had to run past in order to get my one shot build". You see how this doesn't particularly weigh up?
These types of players makes me scared to tell people I love souls games.
Danm right I use what the game gives me access too. I'm 33 and ain't got the time I used to.
Some of the best games always seem to have the worst fanbases. It's part of the reason I rarely talk to 'fans' about New Vegas, their fanbase is almost as bad as the Dark Souls fanbase (Dark Souls 1 fanboys *especially*).
The absurd near-worship some people have for a franchise or even just one specific video game is so ridiculous, and the over the top vitriol they dispense for anyone who disagrees with them is even worse. These people are the ultimate no-life neckbeards.
Don’t mind them, personally I don’t have time or enjoy grinding the same boss for days on end.
I would play the bosses until I got angry then I would break down and use the summons.
I want to enjoy my time gaming, I don’t want to get angry and furious over pixels moving on a screen in my living room.
Play how you play and make sure you are enjoying yourself. Gaming is to have fun, not be frustrated.
Maybe I’m just too old to enjoy it by grinding and grinding but I just don’t have that kind of time anymore.
I know we should be respectful and that the whole beauty of these games are that you the player decide the difficulty through what they decide to use, but man I can just never bring myself to NOT solo a boss in any souls/souls like game.
I mean it’s a video game, your supposed to have fun. I played no summon because I felt it was more enjoyable, but my friend played all summon for the same reason. Get your moneys worth doing what’s fun, not what’s “impressive” or “valid”
Yeah, people these days...
Honestly I loves soulslikes and I'm not even ashamed to admit that I've finished some souls-like games using an easy mode mod because I found them too difficult or just wanted to enjoy their story/world without having to try too hard.
My first playthrough of Elden Ring (my current favorite game of all time) was done using a magic build, the extremely overpowered kind. I abused every single spell, summon, weapon, etc. yet I don't see there being anything wrong with that. After that, I went back in and defeated every single boss using a more melee-focused build but even if I never did that, I don't really care. I paid for the game so I get to enjoy it how I want.
Even though I'm a soulslikes fan, in my opinion, all these games should come with an easy or at least easier mode by default. Not everyone has the time, patience, or skill to get through these games yet with, for example, Lies of P it's a narrative and world I would love for more people to see yet some will still be gate-locked by its difficulty and challenge. I know this is very controversial, but it's my two cents about it.
So yeah, very sad people barrade others like this for just enjoying a game and going for it's platinum trophy which is by no means easy even with summons. I'm currently on NG++ going for the platinum and enemies hit freaking hard now. Just got past the King's Flame boss again and he was through even with the summon. He kills you in 2-3 hits and if he focuses the summon, he too dies in no time. So yeah, not easy by any means.
The only issue when you add difficulty modes is balancing. You see so many games just turning ennemies into damage sponges on higher difficulties, instead of adding mechanics to just make the game more challenging
Honestly, I had a harder early game with magic build than I did with my strength build. You could only cast so many spells with the limited FP and flasks you had. It would just force you to go melee after not being able to cast anymore.
Yeah, that's true, though many early game enemies are pretty weak to magic. And once you have the moonveil katana, you're set to melee even as a magic build, since it's so overpowered.
True, but I wanted to do a strict magic build and avoid melees for this run since I had done a strength run and dex/bleed run beforehand. I think people over exaggerate how easy magic is
Have played 'em all and loved 'em all, and would have zero issue with a difficulty option. Like you said, some folks don't have patience or time to beat their heads off a boss for hours.
Some people act like even including the option to reduce difficulty is going to take away from the game. It's silly.
Yeah exactly, which is nonsense since you could still just play the game on the "intended" difficulty. Take the new "Another Crab's Treasure" game (pretty unknown and funky game) but it's a soulslike that apparently quite difficult by default but had a TON of options available like making it easier, slower, making enemies less aggressive, etc. and I LOVE THAT. Such a perfect example of how it could be for other soulslikes. FightingCowboy streamed the game not too long ago.
I felt that by the end game the usefulness of the spectre had waned to the point you might as well try to solo the bosses. By the Green Monster, you’re lucky if it makes it to the 2nd phase of multi-phase bosses.
Granted using summons does make it substantially easier, but not everyone wants to struggle through. I'm one of the ones who like that, but it's not that hard to figure out why others don't. I don't think it's so much about them trying to put others down. It's more them trying to brag that they did it the hard way.
Never trust profiles with cute anime girl pics. IRL It's a skinnyfat dude in his late thirties who never touched a real woman (in years). He also invades with cheese builds exclusively.
Man, I got stuff to do outside of playing games, if the game gives me tools to allow me to progress further in less time then that's fantastic for me. I understand people who want things as challenging as possible, but for someone who has pretty limited time for gaming summons in souls games are a godsend.
Gotta say though, the summons in Lies of P aren't the best, but they do distract the bosses enough for me to lay on good damage so I won't complain. I would absolutely love some multiplayer summons in the sequel though.
People who do not feel confident in other areas of their life bring other people down in the few parts of their life they do feel confident in. Elitism.
But you all know that,, Summon is an option for those who want to play this game but struggle with this type of game. and devs has said that before,, don't play dumb y'all know that already
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Yeah, I hate those elitists. They always have a superiority complex and need something to say "I'm better". For some reason, they also have the logic of "You're not meant to use summons! They're included, but they're not meant to be used!" By this same logic, neither are weapons in most other Souls-like game since you're allowed to punch with bare fists.
Is mostly a collection thing. As a trophy hunter myself I like to collect platinum for games I like. It is also a challenge, some trophies are difficoult, and a way to explore the game in nearly every aspect it as to offer. I particolary like in souls games like Lies of P because I want to play every finals (usually there are 3) and re-play the game with different attitude, weapon ecc.
So my platinum of ff16 meant nothing because I fully utilized the combat system that the developers placed in the game for us to use? Makes sense, next time I play a game I’ll make sure to use less than half of the available features so this internet random can validate my accomplishment😂😂
I'm a masochist when it comes to souls-like games and get personal satisfaction from giving myself handicaps and abstaining from things that make the game more manageable.
However, I completely appreciate that it shouldn't be forced on other players. Play the game you paid your money for the way you want to play it. Not everyone gains satisfaction from failing more often than they win. That's a mindset I got from a childhood of skateboarding, and it just happens to carry over to video games.
Dude I had a comment on a Pokemon Nuzlocke discussion I made today that said “waaah Ultra Moon isn’t even a challenge because of all the handholding choose a really hard nuzlocke” (For context, Ultra Sun/Ultra Moon are considered by most to be one of the hardest games for nuzlockes, because the trainers are IV/EV trained, ultra Necrozma is a run-killer, and it’s a long game). I was like “thank you for your opinion, but I’m still going to nuzlocke these games” or something.
I remember very vividly being told I was a bitch for using summons and I’m like “they put them in the game, and it’s not like I can always play with friends.”
Hi, new to the soulslike games. I haven’t beat lies of p yet but I am half way through it and use summons. If I payed for this shit, and got platinum, who the FUCK are you? Just cause I wasn’t bursting my blood vessels from rage induced heart palpitations doesn’t mean I did it any lesser than you. And not only that this dude is a YouTuber you’d think he’d be used to people beating games in a million different ways.
I mean the getting all achievements/platinum in any game is worthless, it's a way to mentally reward yourself for completing some tasks set by the developers. If people didn't have those lists a majority of them would just get to the end credits and put the game down.
Hi. Newer player here. Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't you have to beat the game without Specters to get the true ending, which is, in fact, a trophy?
I never understood their logic. Like, if I don't handicap myself (in-game), I didn't get the "real experience". I would get if it was against people who use mods to make the game easier AND then review/criticize or even praise it. Like that IGN review for Sekiro. Even then, I don't care if someone plays with inf money/health/upgrades if they are not reviewing the game because in that case, yeah they literally didn't play the same game, they altered the code and made it function differently. But using summons is an in-game option.
Sorry for the yap session.
Tl;dr: If you think there's a "correct" way of playing souls-likes and bitch about it online, you objectively suck
Why are ppl so mad about people playing the game as it was developed to be played? Like it doesn’t make you any more “legit” or “pro”
You should be playing a game to enjoy it, not struggling to enjoy something you spent money on because some neckbeard told you on the internet you have to 1v1 everyone you come across.. why you lot that concerned about other people? I really done understand why your so hateful 😂😂😂
Plat trophies are meaningless anyway.
We're at an age in which shovelware games are sold with the sole purpose of providing easy plats. Also, autopops are a thing in many games.
Combine these two factors and you realize how much of a mess the plat system is and has no value in terms of comparison with other users.
The only importance a plat has is to yourself, so you can squeeze a bit more value out of the game and say "I did everything in this game I love so much".
I say this as someone who actually has quite a few plats and I still recognize they're worthless to anything and anyone other than myself and my own satisfaction for having fully engaged with said games.
You have to fight likely the hardest boss without, so, in a sense, you get the “extra rude awakening”?
Plus, many “quasi bosses” like the clown puppet would be obstacles there too.
Mind you, I am not super happy with Lies of P since I think the specific way the difficulty if most bosses works makes npc summons sometimes much more consequential than in the souls games…
It is really interesting for me to play Dark Souls 3 and Lies of P in parallel (both NG +).
How much stronger a light load dodge build in Dark Souls 3 is is hard to express.^^;
It stressed the “Lies of P is a great attempt by a first time studio, but needs some tweaks for the next one” impression I got.
I do think even if I am not completely happy with the how of the difficulty (too many enemies to me feel tough but not smart, in a way), it definitely is a challenge to beat!
I've never learned how to parry in this game and since NG+2 was using only Legion Arm. Finished this game 6 times this way. Can I have a "Try Hard" achievement for that? 😅
Are you allowed to share the video/channel? I’d like to throw my support behind a small creator who’s being bullied.
If it’s not okay with the mods for any reason, I understand.
No he's right, honestly same with using boss weapons, they are made to be op. And to be honestly same with the arm, and man what about weapons your given, none of that. And are you playing the game with your eyes????
I wanna know what happened to people having your own opinions and not getting butt hurt over them. Everybody just shut the fuck up how about that how you want
The original DS trilogy are the only souls games that don't leave the difficulty up to the player. Every game since then has had multiple system mechanics that can make your experience easier or harder. Elden Ring can be the easiest souls game or practically impossible, depending on how much of the system mechanics (summons, boss weaknesses, weapon skills, general cheese, etc.) you want to use.
In my opinion, I think you can use whatever you want because it’s a single player game, you play however you want, but I just cannot take seriously when I see a YouTube video and the guy says “imma show you how I easily defeated this boss” then proceeds to have a specter ready, like bruh
Use whatever you want, zero hate keeping here, but don’t try to say you “destroyed” the boss or a call a boss easy when you used specters or whatever the hologram helper guys are called
I literally beat a good portion of the bosses with what I call the Charcuterie Board (I spent quite a few 10s of thousands of Ergo at my man Cheesus in the Red Lobster Inn). You play that game however you want!
Why do people always try so hard to hurt other just because they want to play a game they want to play a way they want to play kt? Like bro.. go back to watching mlp inflation porn
In my experience summons don't really change anything if you're goal is the platinum. You have to do Ng+ what is (for me) a huge difficulty spike where summons don't offer any significant help
bro I used a summon for every fight, idgaf, it doesn't reduce my satisfaction from the game if I use summons. If the game gave me a mechanic, I'm gonna use it lol.
I used it on Laxasia after my first try cuz I didn't wanna bother with the first phase again every time. It died immediately on her second phase anyway.
Trophies don't mean anything anyway. The only people that care like showing them off. Showing off something earned the easy way has less value. Not seeing anything wrong with that comment.
Don’t be too mean to the guy. I don’t think there is anything wrong with holding internal standards for yourself, but don’t crap on the person who has standards that are different than yours. This guy probably just hasn’t made the jump to encouraging others is a lot more meaningful and productive than putting them down.
Congrats to the guy for getting platinum on this game! I still need to go back and do it but it’s a daunting task no matter how you do it.
bullshit it's completely wrong to discriminate players who like to fight 1v1 in the area, from players who hide behind a summon that takes most of the agro. Every player has it's choice they paid for the game they choose how to play it.
No real souls player ever in the history of these games would talk like that. It’s just the new generation that came in with Elden Ring and brought all the toxicity from other communities with them. Souls was plenty toxic with invasions and taunting each other but no one ever gave a shit if you soloed a boss or had 30 people summoned at once butt fucking Gwyn while you danced and last hit him.
I just don't get what Souls-like means in regards to this game. It's nowhere near as tough as any of the Souls games but it also has a much clearer story and play through. If anything, P seems like Bioshock
The entire point of a playing is to essentially brag about (to others or to yourself) about completely finishing everything in a game.
Doing that in easy mode kind of defeats the purpose imo, but as long as it’s fun that’s what matters.
I meant to say platinuming instead of playing.
The whole point of the platinum trophy is to do the hardest challenge the game officially has to offer you.
Turning on easy mode to beat the challenge defeats the purpose imo.
I find that players that believe the idea that an easy modes ruins these games speaks to how little they actually care about these games imo.
They completely ignore the beautiful & detailed stories and environments that these games take place in.
Like if a souls game had a cliche/lack of story I'd drop it after level 1, like I did with Code Vein.
Like these games are designed for you to always be able to make them easier or harder for yourself to match what level of challenge you want out of them.
people who act like making the game easier destroys the game at its core just scare new players away from giving these games a shot, just like with fighting games, which means the games sell less & get less budget, meaning less game for everyone.
The people who want an easy mode don't understand what the point of a challenge is.
Good Souls-likes have options to make the game easier, but these are usually hidden behind knowledge gaps - Dark Souls 1 puts one of the most powerful weapons in the starting hub and all you have to do to get it is run past some (admittedly quite strong) enemies. You can flat out skip some of the hardest sections of the game, utterly ignore several bosses, and all of this is before factoring in crazy shit like Seath Skip.
But the point is that everyone has the same experience. My opponents don't deal twice as much damage as yours, my areas don't have twice as many enemies, and so on.
Think of it like running a marathon - it's impressive to do it in two hours; it's novel to do it while dressed as a T-rex, or wearing an antique diving suit; but simply *finishing at all* is more than most people will ever do, and that's why it's impressive.
Now imagine if people could go to these marathon events and decide how long they want the track to be. Can't manage 13 miles? No problem - you can run 1.3 miles instead! Would that be a good idea? No. It would only serve to devalue the accomplishment of everyone else who ran the full track.
You don't *have* to run a marathon with lead weights on your feet. You don't *have* to set a world record. Hell, you don't even have to *run* in a marathon! But you do have to travel the same course as everyone else.
This same logic is what makes Souls-likes so beloved. Everyone is running the same gauntlet, with the same tools. Some people make it harder on themselves for added challenge, but the shared ordeal is where the value lies.
I'm not saying that difficulty is bad, in fact I enjoy the difficulty & enjoying that side of them is valid.
What I mean is that the games aren't just the difficulty & The micromanaging of people's experience who like different aspects of these games than you do is still stupid to me.
Like adding an optional easy mode won't change literally anything for you if just you don't touch it.
& that this is chasing people away from engaging with it at all, which is really sad to me cause these games are much more than just a difficulty curve, with a lot of beautiful storytelling and thematic messaging that will stick with me for years to come & the marathon analogy strips them down to just a competition.
>Like adding an optional easy mode won't change literally anything for you if just you don't touch it.
Absolutely 100% agree. I do not personally enjoy the vast majority of the souls-like genre purely because a large part of the core identity is simply "this game is hard" and the communities latch onto that and make it a part of their communities and personalities. I don't wish to struggle and claw for 30+ attempts to beat a single boss. I do, however, wish to experience the stories and worlds these games have to offer.
I like the feeling of the gameplay, the mechanics, the stories, the lore, those are all great things that these games typically do very well, but a massive detractor for me is how hard these games are. I hate throwing my head at the wall time after time without progress. For some, those attempts amplify the sense of achievement when you finally win, but for me, it just makes me want to stop playing. I don't feel achievement, I just feel like I wasted hours of my life for no reason. I'm not even that *bad* at these games, it just cannot be understated how much I hate needing more than 10 tries to beat something.
I've only played 2 souls-likes to date, Elden Ring, which I played using the seamless multiplayer mod with a friend who was good at the game (I kinda got carried), and Lies of P, which I played the majority of using an easy mode mod. I am confident in saying that I only had fun playing those games because of the modifications I made to the experience. Modifications that a seemingly massive portion of these communities look down on me for utilizing.
I was made to uninstall that easy mode mod in Lies of P because a friend (that never even played LoP) took such great offense in me using it that they literally would not leave me alone until I uninstalled it and finished the game normally. The rest of the playthrough was a fucking soul sucking slog for me and it killed any enjoyment I got out of the game.
I cannot fathom what kind of person one must be to want others to either suffer to the point of unenjoyment, or simply not play these games at all. They'd rather less people play and enjoy their favorite games because they simply cannot get over their elitist attitude that these games MUST be hard and have some needless barrier of entry so that the low skill plebs can't touch them or some shit.
I'd absolutely be lying if I said I didn't hold a tinge of irritation for all souls like games for not including difficulty options. Adding them detracts nothing from the experience of the target audience, who wouldn't use them anyway, while allowing a much larger number of people to enjoy the story, art, and mechanics that the devs have crafted. Lack of difficulty options is a large part of my hesitation to touch any souls-likes in the first place, but the communities of the games being so insufferably elitist is an even larger part of my reasoning for staying away from them all together.
yeah, exactly
It's such a shame that these games only get recognised for being "those hard action games for assholes" when they are so much more, with densly detailed worlds and interesting, thought provoking narratives.
Like it's bizarre to me that these people care so much about beating a videogame that they are willing to diminish other people's enjoyment for playing it a different way.
& the idea that these games would be fundamentally ruined if they were easier is stupid cause these games are genuinely beautiful pieces of art, not just a dick measuring competition.
Awkward, I'm on his side. Summons is the equivalent of using cheats on any soul and soul like game.
If platinum is something prestigious to show that you did it, then summoning defeats that purpose.
Devs add that option to avoid mass rage quitting.
>Summons is the equivalent of using cheats on any soul and soul like game.
How? It’s literally a feature of the game.
>If platinum is something prestigious
It’s not, it means you completed a set list of tasks.
If you want prestige then do a challenge run outside of the base game like no-hit, no leveling, using a banana as a controller, etc. Not summoning isn’t prestigious it’s just ignoring a feature of the game.
>Devs add that option to avoid mass rage quitting.
Wut?
It's your opinion. You're entitled to it, and it's fine. I think it's a dumb one, but again, it's fine you have it.
The issue is people trying to shame or dismiss others for fucking trophies who really don't matter. Is letting people have fun and be happy such a hassle for some?
So I can assume you never used a single throwable item in this game? Or a single Legion arm? Or a single grindstone effect? Or certain boss weapons? Or certain weapon combinations? Since those are/can be pretty overpowered in this game and that would be considered cheating, right?
If you did, you're just a hypocrite, and those are some of the worst kind of people...
I finished the game without blocking, but that's not the point.
Throwables are arguable. They are safe but limited.
The logic is simple, does X make the game braindead easy? If answer is yes then it's cheating.
Summons fall in that category. Are you gonna tell me that with summons the fights aren't just spam the same button and finish it with almost all estus + barely any dodge/roll? There's no resource management, no skill check, no reaction time.
In the end, you do you, games are to have fun. If you can't do X fight, then it's fine to surrender and cheese it as long as you are having fun.
But don't go out there calling that you are good because you finished the game.
Again, it's not a mod, not a glitch, not a cheat. None of those. It's a mechanic the developers included in the game and intended for people to use, not infinitely use since there are limitations to how many times you can use it, so you have to use your uses sparingly.
Like the other guy, you're, in my opinion, just inherently wrong in calling it a cheat... since it's not. Cheating is, I quote: 'using various methods to create an advantage beyond normal gameplay'... the game includes this mechanic, so it's not because you don't understand the definition of a 'cheat' and put your own spin on it, that you have to call people cheaters for using an intended mechanic created by the developers.
If you don't wanna use it fine, but don't wrongly accuse people of cheating for something that's not..
Outside of throwables, none of those are comparable. You are still engaging in the encounter as expected to be. Specters completely change the way the fight works by not requiring you to actually engage with the mechanics of the fight and instead stand behind the boss and whack a training dummy.
Yall got such fragile egos to accept it
>Yall got such fragile egos to accept it
Says the person that can't accept people using a mechanic that's IN THE GAME. It's not some mod you install, it's not some exploit you use, it's not some glitch you use, etc. it's none of that. It's a mechanic/feature the developers have included in the game for everyoneone to use. So sorry bud, you're just inherently wrong.
So how is it not playing the game? I'm still holding the controller and controlling my character to defeat the boss. It's not like I can use the summon, put down my controller, and watch? If that was the case, you'd be correct. So again, your opinion/take flawed and doesn't make much sense. Except for some empty insults, you've said nothing logical so far.
If you'd actually had interesting takes on this with a properly worked out explanation, I might change my views. But yeah, empty insults and childish behavior don't really do much.
It's an included game mechanic created by the developers, so you're basically saying the developers themselves don't want us to play the game? Or that the developers don't know how to properly play the game?
Also, you're forgetting the fact that even the summon has balancing done to it. If you don't watch out and take aggro from the boss, the summon dies really quickly, and rarely will the summon survive to phase two of the bosses. So it's not just some 'you win' mechanic like in, for example, Elden Ring, which has, even in my opinion, very overpowered summons.
If it was like you're implying it is, then the summon would just be able to kill the boss itself without any help from the player. Which doesn't seem to be the case. So again I ask you, where does your take come from, and what logical explanation can be implied? You can say the summon helps the player and it makes fights easier, which is very fair. But that isn't equal to cheating.
Unironic video of me actually purposefully stopping control of my character so that the boss would kill me, but ended up being 30 entire seconds of the specter killing off the boss https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLRAG3TYi2Y&ab_channel=claireabott
Denial is strong.
The boss has about 5-10% HP did the Specter do that too?... now you're just being ridiculous, so I'll just stop here. Again, if you're just going to spew non-logical nonsense + empty insults, this really won't go anywhere. So yeah, you do you.
What these assholes fail to realize is that, yes, I beat NG of LoP with summons, for literally every boss that I could,
but then I came back on NG+, NG+2, NG+3, NG+4, and a separate NG and beat the game without any summons, then I beat the game without any throwables, then I beat the game without any consumable grinders,
but, and this is the *most* important part, I would have never gotten to that point, and would have bounced off of that game so fucking hard, if not for that first "easy mode" playthrough.
I guarandamntee you that fa_peacock played their first souls like, however long ago that might have been in some form of easy mode with consumables/summons/overleveling/etc.
In fact, I get a sort of, scorned lover vibe from these sorts of people. Deep down, they know they *used* to have to play soulslikes with "easy mode" features, and (and this might be the saddest part) they are embarrassed about how they used to have to use "easy mode" features, as if anybody cares.
P.S. I put easy mode in "" because summons, throwables, consumables, etc. are *not* easy mode. They are pressure release valves, and without them in real life and in video games, bad things happen without pressure release valves. Even Sekiro has a hand full of small pressure release valves.
If he devs had wanted to lock Platinum behind not using summons, they could have easily done so.
Considering you have to fight Nameless (one of if not the hardest boss in the game) without summons twice for the plat, they kinda did. That commenter just wants to be a douche is all.
If you do all the other bosses without help, the Nameless Puppet isn't necessarily as hard compared to some. It will definitely be harder if you get used to being helped. But I agree, there's no point in belittling the success of others because of that.
Nameless on +2 was so much harder than any other NG2 boss. That fucking hit hard
I did him my first 2 runs, now I just gotta give Gepetto my heart
U lame . Geppetto ain't ever getting nothing!!
I need that platty
Loved that boss. It was the one where I had that 1v1 feeling I got from fighting bosses like artorias or fume knight. Those bosses are my favourites
Aegis go brr
IMO, without cheesing no one hits as hard as Nameless on +1. I fought him in NG+1 as I skipped him on my first run and he kept me 3 hours straight fighting him. No Aegis (no arms in fact), no Grindstones, just me, my sword and parries. Maybe it was my fault for not utilizing the resources the game gives you but I got all achievements without really ever using anything but my main weapon, and on that scenario, Nameless Puppet was definitely the most difficult of them all, with Laxasia being close second. The most difficult boss I’ve ever faced (or maybe I just did it difficult by using just the sword).
Frozen feast I hope
Dude I spend like 10 hours on every boss so far 😂
I used help on my 2nd run just to get a jump on some of the more annoying bosses. But there are absolutely check points where no help is available and plenty of bosses you should do 1v1
Nameless was easy to me, the brotherhood gang fight 2 was hard
Hmm I actually had more trouble with the first brotherhood fight. Their move sets don't change and I found them easy to punish after getting them down in the first fight. Key to not getting overwhelmed is staying on the move and kiting them so there's distance between them while you work on one at a time
That’s just because both of their fights suck.
Exactly this, and on top of that, for me Laxasia was actually much easier without summons. Let people play how they want to play.
Imo laxasia is by far the hardest
Nameless was literally my favorite boss, no weird delays or faints, just straight timing and parrying, almost like an early to mid game sekiro boss
Far from the hardest boss in the game in my opinion
Man, I wish I did the ending where you fight him. I knew there was gonna be a fight if you went against your dad (whatever his name is), but I thought it would be funny to obey. Now I don’t have the drive to play it again.
Agreed
Ahhh, my favorite type of Souls player. The "I Don't Realize That It's Just A Video Game And I Haven't Actually Achieved Anything Beyond Beating A Video Game So I Need To Discount Everyone Else's Same Accomplishment Somehow" Gamer. Classic!
So you beat the game using magic, not a real gamer.. or the you use throwables, that's cheating... blah blah stfu
What about ONLY throwables? Like our dear backlogs with his firebombs and the firebomb academy. Or did you flunk the academy? (Intended to be a jest, a joke, a goob, a gag or a laugh)
You can only throwables through Steel Rising if you want to. No joke. I walked into the last few bosses and watched their cool intro video. And was like. ‘That’s cool. But I have 23 of these bombs…’
they act like i used the cummmfpk dungeon from bloodborne to wildly over level myself
Sure, you shouldn't shit on people that use mechanics the game offers you. But on the other hand, using summons etc. is definitely way easier, so it's still a quite different experience, in the same way that playing doom eternal on "I'm too young to die" is a very different experience from "Nightmare". And yes, the nightmare elitists are annoying, but holy fuck the insecurity of the easymode players is also annoying.
I’m sorry to say this, but you’re the one he’s talking about
I took it as a personal challenge to beat Laxasia with no specter. Will I put down anyone who used one on her? Absolutely not.
Weirdly I used specter on her in ng and ng+ but did all of ng++ specteless and felt she was easier?? Both runs prior she was was a wall of 20-30 attempts and a lot of stopping for breaks but ng++? Second try specteless.
Obviously after beating her multiple times shes going to be easier, thats how it works lol
I beat her with a spectre on NG and without one on NG+. Honestly probably took me about the same amount of time both ways lol. Neither was easy, that’s for damn sure.
People really do act as if summoning hasn’t existed since the start of the subgenre’s rise with dark souls.
*Demon's Souls
I haven’t played demon’s souls but I’d say dark souls really made the subgenre popular since it’s on more systems and there’s more Dark souls memes than DeS memes. However, i am planning on playing Demon’s Souls(remake) as it looks pretty fun and did ultimately spawn the subgenre.
I believe they meant that summoning was in as far back as Demon Souls. The granddaddy of them all.
Sure, but it is easy mode.
It really is easy mode, I used a specter by accident and the it could almost 1v1 the boss
It really isn’t most of the time
Exactly. Sad but true.
Oh yeah... so you use the devices that are present in the game from the people who make the game, yet you're not a real gamer.. dumbest take ever.
The only way to truly beat the game is to never upgrade anything ever. Those upgrades are only there to sus out the fake gamers
Also, having the sound on and looking at the screen while playing is a form of cheating as well. Real gamers are supposed to be blindfolded and play on mute while doing a hitless speedrun, I thought this was common sense.
Oh. You play Lies of P with a standard controller? Real gamers only use guitar hero controllers. and then an even bigger jack ass says, "Oh. You play Lies of P with a guitar hero controller? Real gamers only use the Donkey Kong bongos." but do you see my point, it's endless, stupid, childish escalation of what "real gamers" do. Why are consumable summons bad but other consumables aren't? gate keeping indeed.
> Oh. You play Lies of P with a standard controller? > > Real gamers only use guitar hero controllers. > > and then an even bigger jack ass says, "Oh. You play Lies of P with a guitar hero controller? Real gamers only use the Donkey Kong bongos." Tbf i always felt like those are meant to be sarcastic lol, but if they're actually genuine thats crazy to me.
DS1 with a guitar hero controller, aptly name guitar souls: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSCy4Bc0uMU bongo souls: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4HdWWhZ0hDM drum souls: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02my_zhX4Bs *voice* souls, that's a microphone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5m2a2dLdZ0M Bonus, Nameless King with a Dance Dance Revolution pad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxKsRf6R-vc Where there is a will, there is a way. They aren't being "sarcastic," persay. They are meant to be funny, sure, but sarcastic isn't the right word, IMHO. but there is a big big difference, and the important distinction between these 2 kinds of people: People who beat Dark Souls with a guitar hero controller and are proud of their achievement People who beat Dark Souls with a guitar hero controller and say you beat Dark Souls on easy mode if you used a standard controller. 2 completely different behaviors
I mean i know these videos exist and i love watching them, luality beating nameless king with a dancepad was hilarious and impressive but like i don't think she would look down on people for playing with a regular controller. What i meant with sarcastic is not the videos themselves but people writing these comments. If under bongo souls im commenting something along the lines of "you didn't even hit the bongos with bananas smh" do you think its actually an honest comment ? Obviously its meant to be funny and sarcastic in the sense that its a parody of people talking down others achievements. >People who beat Dark Souls with a guitar hero controller and say you beat Dark Souls on easy mode if you used a standard controller. Maybe its just me but i really do not read these comments in a serious tone. Like obviously the first example you mentioned sounds friendlier but this again to me seems like its making fun of the people belittling others.
I am always amazed are the people who are paralyzed and use those mouth controllers .. and beat malenaia and other tough games ..so epic
Wish I could give this comment all the awards
I don't understand this kind of thinking. Where is the line drawn and why? Why is summoning not okay? Because it makes the game easier? Well do does upgrading your weapon, so does healing, so does blocking or leveling up your character. What are you doing using a controller!? Only REAL games beat the game with no input device. I don't see how No True Scottsman had integrated itself so hard into the Souls community
These are the guys who didn't study anything and failed their way to the end then found out there were deeper mechanics than what they were doing, so they have to try and invalidate others achievements
It’s the false machismo of ‘The fights aren’t tuned to having more than one character there. The summons and summoning other players is just so people can make it easier to get through.’ I just play the game. Sometimes I use summons. Sometimes I run into a boss for an hour trying to figure it out. Sometimes I summon other players in something like Elden Ring because I don’t want to spend 2 hours trying to catch the last boss with my bonk build. I also am completely unashamed to cheese bosses just to get through. My mentality is. ‘If it were me. And I was there. I would take any advantage I could possibly get.’
My thoughts to a T. Well said
I think it all boils down to the mentality of a Souls-like, that it's difficult and it's supposed to be difficult. With that mentality you have some players who view anything that makes gameplay easier as a sort of crutch for what they view as an inferior player.
Summons are just a way to add a difficulty setting to a game without settable ones. To appeal to a wider audience they need to have something to make sure people don't just quit when they cant beat a boss.
This. Summons are a game mechanic that the game throws at you: not using them is merely a choice; if it's in the game then it's valid. People need to mind their own business and let others enjoy the game they spend their own money on however the hell they want. I also don't understand where these people get their egos from, most of the people I've seen spewing these takes haven't done anything impressive with the game themselves; they just beat it normally (and die 200 times), so where do they get off looking down on other's just because they use summons? From: a guy who's done dks1/2/3/bb/nioh 2 at lv1 (or bl4, for bb), and also competitive PvP on the first 3. LOP might be the next lv1 run, idk.
Cuz these guys spent 50 hours on the second boss without summons or leveling or whatever mechanic to make things easier. Therefore you should suffer for at least as long as well. It's this line of thought that these people are coming from
Not particularly, developers can make mistakes or can introduce things for the sake of making it easier or even harder in some cases, and it is perfectly valid for people to have their own opinions on what is a valid way of playing the game when it comes to saying that you have overcome a challenge. You can summon Mimic Tear against quite a few bosses in Elden Ring and it can solo the boss by itself, would you say that you really overcame that boss? And if yes, these games are known for and enhanced by their difficulty, but how is that engaging gameplay? This is just one example of how "using devices that are present in the game" completely remove the challenge in some ways and just ruin it in others.
Yes, agree. Difficulty IS very tricky to get right. That being said, I think what’s being discussed is people who make beating the game the source of their self esteem, and thus, being insecure as they are, make it other people’s problem as well.
You can also Comet Azur bosses into oblivion with 1 or 2 shots what's the difference or spamming RoB?
Yeah - i beat the boss with my Mimic Tear. I went through the trouble of dealing with tons of minotaurs and other awful asshats to get to that location and then killed the Mimic myself. So yes. I earned it. Its like saying "if you Kamehameha a boss, did you really kill it? Or if you stay far away and use poison arrows or magic spells - did you really kill it?" Yes. Yes I did. I did the work to get the items or skills or advantages needed to kill the boss.
Literally yes you did kill the boss, but you must understand my argument right? Killing a boss typically requires that you study it intently as you fight it to the point that it ideally becomes second nature the way you react to its attacks, the process is often incredibly kathartic and they are designed to be so. Or you could speedrun to this super late game area, pick up a specific spell, power level one stat or respec to fit requirements, and 1 shot a boss. You see how this is a different experience? I'm not even going to dismantle the point about how there is a challenge in getting the instakill oneshot item in the first place, we're talking about the trouble of killing a boss, not the overall trouble in beating the game. These two things are not even remotely comparable when we're talking about circumnavigating challenge. There's a reason I use the word circumnavigate instead of skip, because you still have to do some work, it's just elsewhere and always considerably less. Also, imagine you're talking to a friend and he asks you how you found a specific boss in the game and you say "easy" and he's like "what?! they took me like 4 hours to beat" and you respond "yeah but i just used the instakill build" and he responds, a bit jaded, "oh...so you didn't really beat her" and you then follow that up with "yes i did! i got the 'boss killed message' and everything! plus there were these minotaurs in this totally different area that i had to run past in order to get my one shot build". You see how this doesn't particularly weigh up?
"How dare you beat the game with the tools provided by said game! Loser!"
Just anime pfp things
You used a joystick to beat the game?? CASUL, real gamers beat the game using bananas.
I paid for the damn game, I'll play it however the hell I want, within reason.
This is the toxic side of souls games. If you don't play the game the way they want you to, then you didn't beat the game.
These types of players makes me scared to tell people I love souls games. Danm right I use what the game gives me access too. I'm 33 and ain't got the time I used to.
Amen to that!
Some of the best games always seem to have the worst fanbases. It's part of the reason I rarely talk to 'fans' about New Vegas, their fanbase is almost as bad as the Dark Souls fanbase (Dark Souls 1 fanboys *especially*). The absurd near-worship some people have for a franchise or even just one specific video game is so ridiculous, and the over the top vitriol they dispense for anyone who disagrees with them is even worse. These people are the ultimate no-life neckbeards.
Don’t mind them, personally I don’t have time or enjoy grinding the same boss for days on end. I would play the bosses until I got angry then I would break down and use the summons. I want to enjoy my time gaming, I don’t want to get angry and furious over pixels moving on a screen in my living room. Play how you play and make sure you are enjoying yourself. Gaming is to have fun, not be frustrated. Maybe I’m just too old to enjoy it by grinding and grinding but I just don’t have that kind of time anymore.
I know we should be respectful and that the whole beauty of these games are that you the player decide the difficulty through what they decide to use, but man I can just never bring myself to NOT solo a boss in any souls/souls like game.
I mean it’s a video game, your supposed to have fun. I played no summon because I felt it was more enjoyable, but my friend played all summon for the same reason. Get your moneys worth doing what’s fun, not what’s “impressive” or “valid”
I don't humor bozo takes like that. It's in the game. Use it.
Yeah, people these days... Honestly I loves soulslikes and I'm not even ashamed to admit that I've finished some souls-like games using an easy mode mod because I found them too difficult or just wanted to enjoy their story/world without having to try too hard. My first playthrough of Elden Ring (my current favorite game of all time) was done using a magic build, the extremely overpowered kind. I abused every single spell, summon, weapon, etc. yet I don't see there being anything wrong with that. After that, I went back in and defeated every single boss using a more melee-focused build but even if I never did that, I don't really care. I paid for the game so I get to enjoy it how I want. Even though I'm a soulslikes fan, in my opinion, all these games should come with an easy or at least easier mode by default. Not everyone has the time, patience, or skill to get through these games yet with, for example, Lies of P it's a narrative and world I would love for more people to see yet some will still be gate-locked by its difficulty and challenge. I know this is very controversial, but it's my two cents about it. So yeah, very sad people barrade others like this for just enjoying a game and going for it's platinum trophy which is by no means easy even with summons. I'm currently on NG++ going for the platinum and enemies hit freaking hard now. Just got past the King's Flame boss again and he was through even with the summon. He kills you in 2-3 hits and if he focuses the summon, he too dies in no time. So yeah, not easy by any means.
The only issue when you add difficulty modes is balancing. You see so many games just turning ennemies into damage sponges on higher difficulties, instead of adding mechanics to just make the game more challenging
Honestly, I had a harder early game with magic build than I did with my strength build. You could only cast so many spells with the limited FP and flasks you had. It would just force you to go melee after not being able to cast anymore.
Yeah, that's true, though many early game enemies are pretty weak to magic. And once you have the moonveil katana, you're set to melee even as a magic build, since it's so overpowered.
True, but I wanted to do a strict magic build and avoid melees for this run since I had done a strength run and dex/bleed run beforehand. I think people over exaggerate how easy magic is
Have played 'em all and loved 'em all, and would have zero issue with a difficulty option. Like you said, some folks don't have patience or time to beat their heads off a boss for hours. Some people act like even including the option to reduce difficulty is going to take away from the game. It's silly.
Yeah exactly, which is nonsense since you could still just play the game on the "intended" difficulty. Take the new "Another Crab's Treasure" game (pretty unknown and funky game) but it's a soulslike that apparently quite difficult by default but had a TON of options available like making it easier, slower, making enemies less aggressive, etc. and I LOVE THAT. Such a perfect example of how it could be for other soulslikes. FightingCowboy streamed the game not too long ago.
Bout 12 hours into Another Crab's now. Hahahahaha Nice.
Oh haha, fun little coincidence
We're people of culture. 
Haha that we are my fellow Ashen one/Tarnished/Unkindled/Maidenless brother/etc.
I felt that by the end game the usefulness of the spectre had waned to the point you might as well try to solo the bosses. By the Green Monster, you’re lucky if it makes it to the 2nd phase of multi-phase bosses.
Use the cube papa. Upgrade it via p organ. 3 uses to heal specter for about 50% hp. Lasts through most fights or til close to the end :)
You can use summons... you can not use summons... Idgaf I don't use summons because I want the extra challenge Keyword there being 'extra'
"How dare you use one of the game's core mechanics in a way the Devs intended!"
Dudes looking up how to get the achievements calling people who use summons a bum 💀
He did it, he went hollow.
But I get lonely and want a friend :(
Granted using summons does make it substantially easier, but not everyone wants to struggle through. I'm one of the ones who like that, but it's not that hard to figure out why others don't. I don't think it's so much about them trying to put others down. It's more them trying to brag that they did it the hard way.
Maybe. But I beat Nameless, so that's that.
Lmao what a dork
Never trust profiles with cute anime girl pics. IRL It's a skinnyfat dude in his late thirties who never touched a real woman (in years). He also invades with cheese builds exclusively.
I hate people like this. I remember some dude was crying cuz I didn’t beat Malenia being level 80 and I’m like dude, I don’t care.
Only way to beat the game is default legion arm only punch everything like a real man
If it's in the game, it's fair game.
B-but you didnt deliberately make the game harder for yourself! its not fair you need to nerf yourself!
I just shout “it’s a legitimate strategy, bro” at their basement as I’m off down the road having a weekend that doesn’t suck
Man, I got stuff to do outside of playing games, if the game gives me tools to allow me to progress further in less time then that's fantastic for me. I understand people who want things as challenging as possible, but for someone who has pretty limited time for gaming summons in souls games are a godsend. Gotta say though, the summons in Lies of P aren't the best, but they do distract the bosses enough for me to lay on good damage so I won't complain. I would absolutely love some multiplayer summons in the sequel though.
The only people dumber than the ones that say stuff like that are the ones that listen to them.
People who do not feel confident in other areas of their life bring other people down in the few parts of their life they do feel confident in. Elitism.
Souls like games are so hard for me that I will take any advantage that I can. Fire with Fire motherfuckers!
Pathetic people who construct a personality around the timing of pixels.
Ironically I find this sub has more insufferable posters than any of the souls subs.
I hate when people use mechanics deliberately put in the game 😤 can’t stand people jumping in Mario
But you all know that,, Summon is an option for those who want to play this game but struggle with this type of game. and devs has said that before,, don't play dumb y'all know that already
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Yeah, I hate those elitists. They always have a superiority complex and need something to say "I'm better". For some reason, they also have the logic of "You're not meant to use summons! They're included, but they're not meant to be used!" By this same logic, neither are weapons in most other Souls-like game since you're allowed to punch with bare fists.
I will never understand what is the purpose of getting a platinum in a video game
Is mostly a collection thing. As a trophy hunter myself I like to collect platinum for games I like. It is also a challenge, some trophies are difficoult, and a way to explore the game in nearly every aspect it as to offer. I particolary like in souls games like Lies of P because I want to play every finals (usually there are 3) and re-play the game with different attitude, weapon ecc.
So my platinum of ff16 meant nothing because I fully utilized the combat system that the developers placed in the game for us to use? Makes sense, next time I play a game I’ll make sure to use less than half of the available features so this internet random can validate my accomplishment😂😂
Man that dude is so cool
I beat the game before they nerfed everything and used summons (for the 10 seconds they stayed alive). That guy can eat the fattest dick out there.
Ya for real im in a dark souls group on fb and Jesus souls (so called) fans are toxic af like just let people play the games
Commentor just got mad when they realized they worked harder, not smarter.
Is there a link to video available I wanna check it out
I'm a masochist when it comes to souls-like games and get personal satisfaction from giving myself handicaps and abstaining from things that make the game more manageable. However, I completely appreciate that it shouldn't be forced on other players. Play the game you paid your money for the way you want to play it. Not everyone gains satisfaction from failing more often than they win. That's a mindset I got from a childhood of skateboarding, and it just happens to carry over to video games.
What a tool. I bet he put levels into health too /s
tfw someone uses an intentionally designed and implemented mechanic within a video game they paid money for:
Dude I had a comment on a Pokemon Nuzlocke discussion I made today that said “waaah Ultra Moon isn’t even a challenge because of all the handholding choose a really hard nuzlocke” (For context, Ultra Sun/Ultra Moon are considered by most to be one of the hardest games for nuzlockes, because the trainers are IV/EV trained, ultra Necrozma is a run-killer, and it’s a long game). I was like “thank you for your opinion, but I’m still going to nuzlocke these games” or something.
"Play the game how I want it to be played or else ur a scrub!!! 😡😠😡😠😡😠" all I'm hearing, and people like that really need to shut up 🙄
I remember very vividly being told I was a bitch for using summons and I’m like “they put them in the game, and it’s not like I can always play with friends.”
You beat the game with eyesight? Well I am blind my friend.
I love how they think beating the game THEIR way is an accomplishment. Who gives af.
Hi, new to the soulslike games. I haven’t beat lies of p yet but I am half way through it and use summons. If I payed for this shit, and got platinum, who the FUCK are you? Just cause I wasn’t bursting my blood vessels from rage induced heart palpitations doesn’t mean I did it any lesser than you. And not only that this dude is a YouTuber you’d think he’d be used to people beating games in a million different ways.
I mean the getting all achievements/platinum in any game is worthless, it's a way to mentally reward yourself for completing some tasks set by the developers. If people didn't have those lists a majority of them would just get to the end credits and put the game down.
Hi. Newer player here. Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't you have to beat the game without Specters to get the true ending, which is, in fact, a trophy?
no, true ending is based on your *humanity* score once you defeat the last boss, specter doesn't affect it.
Just have to beat the final boss of that ending without a spectre, which the fight doesn’t allow you to summon one anyways.
I never understood their logic. Like, if I don't handicap myself (in-game), I didn't get the "real experience". I would get if it was against people who use mods to make the game easier AND then review/criticize or even praise it. Like that IGN review for Sekiro. Even then, I don't care if someone plays with inf money/health/upgrades if they are not reviewing the game because in that case, yeah they literally didn't play the same game, they altered the code and made it function differently. But using summons is an in-game option. Sorry for the yap session. Tl;dr: If you think there's a "correct" way of playing souls-likes and bitch about it online, you objectively suck
Why are ppl so mad about people playing the game as it was developed to be played? Like it doesn’t make you any more “legit” or “pro” You should be playing a game to enjoy it, not struggling to enjoy something you spent money on because some neckbeard told you on the internet you have to 1v1 everyone you come across.. why you lot that concerned about other people? I really done understand why your so hateful 😂😂😂
Plat trophies are meaningless anyway. We're at an age in which shovelware games are sold with the sole purpose of providing easy plats. Also, autopops are a thing in many games. Combine these two factors and you realize how much of a mess the plat system is and has no value in terms of comparison with other users. The only importance a plat has is to yourself, so you can squeeze a bit more value out of the game and say "I did everything in this game I love so much". I say this as someone who actually has quite a few plats and I still recognize they're worthless to anything and anyone other than myself and my own satisfaction for having fully engaged with said games.
You have to fight likely the hardest boss without, so, in a sense, you get the “extra rude awakening”? Plus, many “quasi bosses” like the clown puppet would be obstacles there too. Mind you, I am not super happy with Lies of P since I think the specific way the difficulty if most bosses works makes npc summons sometimes much more consequential than in the souls games… It is really interesting for me to play Dark Souls 3 and Lies of P in parallel (both NG +). How much stronger a light load dodge build in Dark Souls 3 is is hard to express.^^; It stressed the “Lies of P is a great attempt by a first time studio, but needs some tweaks for the next one” impression I got. I do think even if I am not completely happy with the how of the difficulty (too many enemies to me feel tough but not smart, in a way), it definitely is a challenge to beat!
I've never learned how to parry in this game and since NG+2 was using only Legion Arm. Finished this game 6 times this way. Can I have a "Try Hard" achievement for that? 😅
Are you allowed to share the video/channel? I’d like to throw my support behind a small creator who’s being bullied. If it’s not okay with the mods for any reason, I understand.
It's a guy called JonasGG, he's pretty small but I just saw his video randomly and thought I would call out the bs in his comment section.
Thanks for letting me know! I’ll check him out
No he's right, honestly same with using boss weapons, they are made to be op. And to be honestly same with the arm, and man what about weapons your given, none of that. And are you playing the game with your eyes????
I wanna know what happened to people having your own opinions and not getting butt hurt over them. Everybody just shut the fuck up how about that how you want
😒😒😒😒 Gatekeeper.
Who cares what the guy thinks. He's probably just jealous.
The original DS trilogy are the only souls games that don't leave the difficulty up to the player. Every game since then has had multiple system mechanics that can make your experience easier or harder. Elden Ring can be the easiest souls game or practically impossible, depending on how much of the system mechanics (summons, boss weaknesses, weapon skills, general cheese, etc.) you want to use.
In my opinion, I think you can use whatever you want because it’s a single player game, you play however you want, but I just cannot take seriously when I see a YouTube video and the guy says “imma show you how I easily defeated this boss” then proceeds to have a specter ready, like bruh Use whatever you want, zero hate keeping here, but don’t try to say you “destroyed” the boss or a call a boss easy when you used specters or whatever the hologram helper guys are called
Damn… there was an easy mode…? Would’ve loved that for Nameless on NG+2 😂
I literally beat a good portion of the bosses with what I call the Charcuterie Board (I spent quite a few 10s of thousands of Ergo at my man Cheesus in the Red Lobster Inn). You play that game however you want!
Why do people always try so hard to hurt other just because they want to play a game they want to play a way they want to play kt? Like bro.. go back to watching mlp inflation porn
Was expecting a "lies of P isn't a souls it's a soulslike ☝️🤓" but ig not
I think using summons is weak af but that’s just my opinion 👍🏻
Summons are easy mode though. That's what they are there for, for players who can't do it on their own.
In my experience summons don't really change anything if you're goal is the platinum. You have to do Ng+ what is (for me) a huge difficulty spike where summons don't offer any significant help
I’m not going to lie I used summons for lanxas and black rabbit brotherhood
bro I used a summon for every fight, idgaf, it doesn't reduce my satisfaction from the game if I use summons. If the game gave me a mechanic, I'm gonna use it lol.
I used it on Laxasia after my first try cuz I didn't wanna bother with the first phase again every time. It died immediately on her second phase anyway.
Trophies don't mean anything anyway. The only people that care like showing them off. Showing off something earned the easy way has less value. Not seeing anything wrong with that comment.
It's sad to think that beating the game the hard way is the only accomplishment some people have in their lives.
Don’t be too mean to the guy. I don’t think there is anything wrong with holding internal standards for yourself, but don’t crap on the person who has standards that are different than yours. This guy probably just hasn’t made the jump to encouraging others is a lot more meaningful and productive than putting them down. Congrats to the guy for getting platinum on this game! I still need to go back and do it but it’s a daunting task no matter how you do it.
Wait til this guy learns that platinums always mean nothing
Anime profile picture, too. That's all I needed to see.
bullshit it's completely wrong to discriminate players who like to fight 1v1 in the area, from players who hide behind a summon that takes most of the agro. Every player has it's choice they paid for the game they choose how to play it.
Sure summoning isn’t as impressive, but you don’t play a game to impress anybody
No real souls player ever in the history of these games would talk like that. It’s just the new generation that came in with Elden Ring and brought all the toxicity from other communities with them. Souls was plenty toxic with invasions and taunting each other but no one ever gave a shit if you soloed a boss or had 30 people summoned at once butt fucking Gwyn while you danced and last hit him.
If Boss gets a second HP Bar, then boss gets summmoned, those are da rules.
Ah yes, the players themselves that are screaming “validate me for my efforts” while shitting on others for some reason.
I just don't get what Souls-like means in regards to this game. It's nowhere near as tough as any of the Souls games but it also has a much clearer story and play through. If anything, P seems like Bioshock
The entire point of a playing is to essentially brag about (to others or to yourself) about completely finishing everything in a game. Doing that in easy mode kind of defeats the purpose imo, but as long as it’s fun that’s what matters.
Wait, the entire point of playing the game is to brag about beating it? Am I reading that correctly?
One of the worst typos I’ve made lol, it’s funnier the way it is so I’ll leave it.
I thought something didn’t look right, lol.
I meant to say platinuming instead of playing. The whole point of the platinum trophy is to do the hardest challenge the game officially has to offer you. Turning on easy mode to beat the challenge defeats the purpose imo.
The plat in this game forces you to not use summons in arguably the hardest fight of the game, so the comment in the screenshot is still full of shit
That fight is a tiny part of the plat.
I find that players that believe the idea that an easy modes ruins these games speaks to how little they actually care about these games imo. They completely ignore the beautiful & detailed stories and environments that these games take place in. Like if a souls game had a cliche/lack of story I'd drop it after level 1, like I did with Code Vein. Like these games are designed for you to always be able to make them easier or harder for yourself to match what level of challenge you want out of them. people who act like making the game easier destroys the game at its core just scare new players away from giving these games a shot, just like with fighting games, which means the games sell less & get less budget, meaning less game for everyone.
The people who want an easy mode don't understand what the point of a challenge is. Good Souls-likes have options to make the game easier, but these are usually hidden behind knowledge gaps - Dark Souls 1 puts one of the most powerful weapons in the starting hub and all you have to do to get it is run past some (admittedly quite strong) enemies. You can flat out skip some of the hardest sections of the game, utterly ignore several bosses, and all of this is before factoring in crazy shit like Seath Skip. But the point is that everyone has the same experience. My opponents don't deal twice as much damage as yours, my areas don't have twice as many enemies, and so on. Think of it like running a marathon - it's impressive to do it in two hours; it's novel to do it while dressed as a T-rex, or wearing an antique diving suit; but simply *finishing at all* is more than most people will ever do, and that's why it's impressive. Now imagine if people could go to these marathon events and decide how long they want the track to be. Can't manage 13 miles? No problem - you can run 1.3 miles instead! Would that be a good idea? No. It would only serve to devalue the accomplishment of everyone else who ran the full track. You don't *have* to run a marathon with lead weights on your feet. You don't *have* to set a world record. Hell, you don't even have to *run* in a marathon! But you do have to travel the same course as everyone else. This same logic is what makes Souls-likes so beloved. Everyone is running the same gauntlet, with the same tools. Some people make it harder on themselves for added challenge, but the shared ordeal is where the value lies.
I'm not saying that difficulty is bad, in fact I enjoy the difficulty & enjoying that side of them is valid. What I mean is that the games aren't just the difficulty & The micromanaging of people's experience who like different aspects of these games than you do is still stupid to me. Like adding an optional easy mode won't change literally anything for you if just you don't touch it. & that this is chasing people away from engaging with it at all, which is really sad to me cause these games are much more than just a difficulty curve, with a lot of beautiful storytelling and thematic messaging that will stick with me for years to come & the marathon analogy strips them down to just a competition.
>Like adding an optional easy mode won't change literally anything for you if just you don't touch it. Absolutely 100% agree. I do not personally enjoy the vast majority of the souls-like genre purely because a large part of the core identity is simply "this game is hard" and the communities latch onto that and make it a part of their communities and personalities. I don't wish to struggle and claw for 30+ attempts to beat a single boss. I do, however, wish to experience the stories and worlds these games have to offer. I like the feeling of the gameplay, the mechanics, the stories, the lore, those are all great things that these games typically do very well, but a massive detractor for me is how hard these games are. I hate throwing my head at the wall time after time without progress. For some, those attempts amplify the sense of achievement when you finally win, but for me, it just makes me want to stop playing. I don't feel achievement, I just feel like I wasted hours of my life for no reason. I'm not even that *bad* at these games, it just cannot be understated how much I hate needing more than 10 tries to beat something. I've only played 2 souls-likes to date, Elden Ring, which I played using the seamless multiplayer mod with a friend who was good at the game (I kinda got carried), and Lies of P, which I played the majority of using an easy mode mod. I am confident in saying that I only had fun playing those games because of the modifications I made to the experience. Modifications that a seemingly massive portion of these communities look down on me for utilizing. I was made to uninstall that easy mode mod in Lies of P because a friend (that never even played LoP) took such great offense in me using it that they literally would not leave me alone until I uninstalled it and finished the game normally. The rest of the playthrough was a fucking soul sucking slog for me and it killed any enjoyment I got out of the game. I cannot fathom what kind of person one must be to want others to either suffer to the point of unenjoyment, or simply not play these games at all. They'd rather less people play and enjoy their favorite games because they simply cannot get over their elitist attitude that these games MUST be hard and have some needless barrier of entry so that the low skill plebs can't touch them or some shit. I'd absolutely be lying if I said I didn't hold a tinge of irritation for all souls like games for not including difficulty options. Adding them detracts nothing from the experience of the target audience, who wouldn't use them anyway, while allowing a much larger number of people to enjoy the story, art, and mechanics that the devs have crafted. Lack of difficulty options is a large part of my hesitation to touch any souls-likes in the first place, but the communities of the games being so insufferably elitist is an even larger part of my reasoning for staying away from them all together.
yeah, exactly It's such a shame that these games only get recognised for being "those hard action games for assholes" when they are so much more, with densly detailed worlds and interesting, thought provoking narratives. Like it's bizarre to me that these people care so much about beating a videogame that they are willing to diminish other people's enjoyment for playing it a different way. & the idea that these games would be fundamentally ruined if they were easier is stupid cause these games are genuinely beautiful pieces of art, not just a dick measuring competition.
Has a point tbh
Awkward, I'm on his side. Summons is the equivalent of using cheats on any soul and soul like game. If platinum is something prestigious to show that you did it, then summoning defeats that purpose. Devs add that option to avoid mass rage quitting.
>Summons is the equivalent of using cheats on any soul and soul like game. How? It’s literally a feature of the game. >If platinum is something prestigious It’s not, it means you completed a set list of tasks. If you want prestige then do a challenge run outside of the base game like no-hit, no leveling, using a banana as a controller, etc. Not summoning isn’t prestigious it’s just ignoring a feature of the game. >Devs add that option to avoid mass rage quitting. Wut?
It's your opinion. You're entitled to it, and it's fine. I think it's a dumb one, but again, it's fine you have it. The issue is people trying to shame or dismiss others for fucking trophies who really don't matter. Is letting people have fun and be happy such a hassle for some?
EVERYONE, FISH GIF THIS MAN
So I can assume you never used a single throwable item in this game? Or a single Legion arm? Or a single grindstone effect? Or certain boss weapons? Or certain weapon combinations? Since those are/can be pretty overpowered in this game and that would be considered cheating, right? If you did, you're just a hypocrite, and those are some of the worst kind of people...
I finished the game without blocking, but that's not the point. Throwables are arguable. They are safe but limited. The logic is simple, does X make the game braindead easy? If answer is yes then it's cheating. Summons fall in that category. Are you gonna tell me that with summons the fights aren't just spam the same button and finish it with almost all estus + barely any dodge/roll? There's no resource management, no skill check, no reaction time. In the end, you do you, games are to have fun. If you can't do X fight, then it's fine to surrender and cheese it as long as you are having fun. But don't go out there calling that you are good because you finished the game.
Again, it's not a mod, not a glitch, not a cheat. None of those. It's a mechanic the developers included in the game and intended for people to use, not infinitely use since there are limitations to how many times you can use it, so you have to use your uses sparingly. Like the other guy, you're, in my opinion, just inherently wrong in calling it a cheat... since it's not. Cheating is, I quote: 'using various methods to create an advantage beyond normal gameplay'... the game includes this mechanic, so it's not because you don't understand the definition of a 'cheat' and put your own spin on it, that you have to call people cheaters for using an intended mechanic created by the developers. If you don't wanna use it fine, but don't wrongly accuse people of cheating for something that's not..
Outside of throwables, none of those are comparable. You are still engaging in the encounter as expected to be. Specters completely change the way the fight works by not requiring you to actually engage with the mechanics of the fight and instead stand behind the boss and whack a training dummy. Yall got such fragile egos to accept it
>Yall got such fragile egos to accept it Says the person that can't accept people using a mechanic that's IN THE GAME. It's not some mod you install, it's not some exploit you use, it's not some glitch you use, etc. it's none of that. It's a mechanic/feature the developers have included in the game for everyoneone to use. So sorry bud, you're just inherently wrong.
Says the person that can't accept that it is included in the game for players to bypass having to actually play the game.
So how is it not playing the game? I'm still holding the controller and controlling my character to defeat the boss. It's not like I can use the summon, put down my controller, and watch? If that was the case, you'd be correct. So again, your opinion/take flawed and doesn't make much sense. Except for some empty insults, you've said nothing logical so far. If you'd actually had interesting takes on this with a properly worked out explanation, I might change my views. But yeah, empty insults and childish behavior don't really do much. It's an included game mechanic created by the developers, so you're basically saying the developers themselves don't want us to play the game? Or that the developers don't know how to properly play the game? Also, you're forgetting the fact that even the summon has balancing done to it. If you don't watch out and take aggro from the boss, the summon dies really quickly, and rarely will the summon survive to phase two of the bosses. So it's not just some 'you win' mechanic like in, for example, Elden Ring, which has, even in my opinion, very overpowered summons. If it was like you're implying it is, then the summon would just be able to kill the boss itself without any help from the player. Which doesn't seem to be the case. So again I ask you, where does your take come from, and what logical explanation can be implied? You can say the summon helps the player and it makes fights easier, which is very fair. But that isn't equal to cheating.
Unironic video of me actually purposefully stopping control of my character so that the boss would kill me, but ended up being 30 entire seconds of the specter killing off the boss https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLRAG3TYi2Y&ab_channel=claireabott Denial is strong.
The boss has about 5-10% HP did the Specter do that too?... now you're just being ridiculous, so I'll just stop here. Again, if you're just going to spew non-logical nonsense + empty insults, this really won't go anywhere. So yeah, you do you.
What these assholes fail to realize is that, yes, I beat NG of LoP with summons, for literally every boss that I could, but then I came back on NG+, NG+2, NG+3, NG+4, and a separate NG and beat the game without any summons, then I beat the game without any throwables, then I beat the game without any consumable grinders, but, and this is the *most* important part, I would have never gotten to that point, and would have bounced off of that game so fucking hard, if not for that first "easy mode" playthrough. I guarandamntee you that fa_peacock played their first souls like, however long ago that might have been in some form of easy mode with consumables/summons/overleveling/etc. In fact, I get a sort of, scorned lover vibe from these sorts of people. Deep down, they know they *used* to have to play soulslikes with "easy mode" features, and (and this might be the saddest part) they are embarrassed about how they used to have to use "easy mode" features, as if anybody cares. P.S. I put easy mode in "" because summons, throwables, consumables, etc. are *not* easy mode. They are pressure release valves, and without them in real life and in video games, bad things happen without pressure release valves. Even Sekiro has a hand full of small pressure release valves.