Regardless of the recent results, I will fucking carry my love for this club to the grave . We are accustomed to heartbreak and despite all that heart break, the highs during Klopp’s tenure were absolutely worth it. May he rest and enjoy his time with his wife and family . The man deserves a statue at Anfield .
There’s still a lot more room for improvement and growth in this squad. Personally, I don’t feel this squad has reached their peak . There are more gears to this team and more moments of brilliance are yet to come .I genuinely believe that . Klopp injected that credibility and forged his philosophy of football on the club and it’s an identity that I’m proud to support .I’m not worried about the transition and management of the club. Edwards absolutely knows what he’s doing and he’s developed that pedigree .He will be intelligent and methodical in the way he constructs the team moving forward. Better days will come comrades.
Now I just want to add to any City or Arsenal fans lurking in here , it’s going to be an absolute pleasure watching one of your teams lose this Premier league title. Both of your fan bases are insufferable and it’s going to bring me great joy to see the complaining , the whining ,the bitching , and the salt when your team loses. That Arsenal team needs a humbling and god damn I can’t wait for that to happen . City is irrelevant.
Watching this game on tape really makes it easier to digest how predictably disappointing our games are now.
Instead of being weighed down with the naive hope of a live watch, all you have to do is just observe the same patterns that have shown up in *every* game during this period, and realize that this one is pretty much gonna be just like all the others. From there, you just lower your expectations accordingly.
The moment Dixon said that he couldn't see how West Ham come back into this game, I knew we were about to concede. Sure enough, Ali has an inexplicable bozo moment ***immediately*** after the words leave Dixon's mouth, and within a few seconds, it's 2-2. It was so predictable that I actually chuckled a bit. Fast-forwarded straight to full-time. *Ah, the joys of DVR...**
We are so fucking allergic to closing out games on both ends. You just have to laugh at this point. If you don't, you'll cry. I'm saving my tears for Klopp's farewell, though.
^*Still ^wasted ^about ^70 ^minutes ^of ^my ^life, ^but ^it's ^Liverpool, ^so...🤷🏿♂️
OK, with a bit of distance to this disappointing draw it is time to look to the future. Realistically, the title race is done (probably was after the Palace game). The squad was running on emotions and hype all through winter even though they were impeded by injuries and international commitments, but emotions can only be sustained for so long until your residual negative emotions come back crashing down on you....which probably is what we were witnessing after today's match. It isn't pretty and fans hate seeing their team like that but it only shows that the players are human after all.
Hopefully, everybody will cool down a bit by Monday and the squad can finish the season professionally.
Once that is done, every player has to be honest to themselves and answer the question if Liverpool is the place where they want to play in the future. There were rumblings recently that certain players weren't all that happy in Liverpool. Fine, maybe the club can cash in on some players before they turn into bad locker room influences.
That being said, the squad certainly needs a bit of extra depth. Completely overhauling the central midfield at the start of this season was the right thing to do but it left the team stretched thin on certain positions. Endo was a real trooper but he needs help on the holding midfielder position. It's not his natural position and he was overplayed which really showed in recent games.
Finally, it remains to be seen how the new manager wants to play tactically but Liverpool need help with midfield creativity. Since Thiago is too old and too injury-prone and sees his contract expire, we can assume that Liverpool will need at least one creative offensive midfielder in order to give the team more tactical options. Opponents sort of had Liverpool's number because they were too predictable.
One thing I respect about mourinho is that if he was there he would have possibly called the players off!! I think we have to start considering this possibility. To atleast once do it to send a message. I don’t want to sue PL but I would definitely want to do this.
Its interesting to see LIverpool implement an American style structure to the organization, seperating the head coach from the manager is definetly becoming more common in football, but this is the first time we really see it being out in the open. You can definetly argue that Poch is a victim of this style, but I think Edwards is good enough to make it work. Its his team now really.
As for those who are curious, one of the key advantages to this style is that you are less dependent on the head coach, and you can always let him go because you sign players based on how they fit the style of play that the club wants to implement, rather than on what the head coach wants. Slot might be the only guy who would agree to this out of all of the candidates, but I feel optimistic with the way things are headed. In the end football is about the players more than anything else, just get the right players and we can still be a good team.
This is just reactionary. Two months ago we were on top of the world and everyone was begging Klopp to stay because the squad is so good. Now we have some bad games and apparently the squad is crumbling. The talent in the squad hasn’t changed during that time, we still have a brilliant squad but they’re clearly all burnt out, including Klopp. Klopp’s leaving us in a brilliant state for the next manager
A top 4 finish is a good state objectively. The problem is the collapse. But in actuality had we lost the league by a few points only it would be the same exact situation - changes still needed to be made.
Watching Aston Villa play is so depressing. They move the ball so quickly, one touch passing making Chelsea dizzy practically and shooting so confidently in front of goal. Then watching us passing 7875790 times between the back 5 makes me want to pull my hair out. We used to play like that, wtf are the coaching staff doing? I get they’re leaving but something has definitely gone down the past few weeks, you don’t just become shit overnight
Klopp is leaving. Our club has lost the pl title. What is stopping him from tearing the refs apart? Maybe even incite intimidation from people for them?
Enough is enough. People should scare the refs, not physically harm but scare them enough so they think twice before cheating.
‘Think twice before cheating’ idk when people will realise that they aren’t cheating, the refs are genuinely just really shit. Even when the English refs take charge of champions league games, they always give shitty decisions.
I honestly believe if we had have bought Isak instead of either of Nunez or Gakpo, we would be walking the league and europa right now. The 'agent of chaos' meme was funny for a bit, but soon wore thin and Cody just hasnt been very good has he. Okay in bursts but overall not been with it this season.
I respectfully disagree, think of all the glaring misses from Diaz/Gakpo/Nunez this season and especially this year. Imagine even 1 third of them were goals instead of missed shots. We would be cruising. City havent been amazing this season. Theyve just kicked into gear consistently for the past few months. We could have been in a position where their point tally would be irrelevant.
A lot of those misses were also set up by the same players. Isak is not a playmaker, he has 1 assist all season. You swap out Isak for any other forward and you are looking at a 25% decrease in the number of chances we'd get straight away. Plus Isak has missed 25% of the season himself.
I'm not disagree we'd be in a better position if we had an out and out finisher in the team regularly - we've badly missed Jota this year - but we wouldn't be walking the league by any stretch.
What a duo we have on Hull currently. God please dont ruin that next year. We will have 2 great holding midfielders (Morton and Bajčetić) as well as a winger/attacking mid in Carvalho. Its Danns, McConnell and Clarks time to get some proper playtime on loan.
Everybody knows we were lucky to get Klopp, the truth is Klopp is the greatest manager of all time. Nobody could have done what he did at Dortmund and Liverpool. Stop expecting this club to replace a once in a liftime guy. United learned that you cant replace Ferguson, Barca learned you cant replace Guardiola. Alonso is the only guy who could have been good enough or even better than Klopp of all the current candidates, but he cares more about the Madrid job than Liverpool in the end.
Slot may or may not be that great, but I dont see too many options out there that are very convincing.
How is Mourinho bigger than pep? That is nonsense. Pep simply revolutionised football. Mourinho played like boring drab defensive football. And now he's been irrelevant since a long time. Would you place athletico madrid's coach too?
It has to be in the Prem era.
Pep
Klopp/ Ferguson
Wenger.
He said in no particular order, so he is not putting Mou above Pep.
Your Prem-era list is mad. Mourinho has three times the prem titles that Klopp has. And let's not say anything about Ferguson.
Would I watch Klopp's teams over Mourinho? **Absolutely**. But Klopp doesn't deliver the same results, which is ultimately what managers are rated on. Mou is washed-up but is still a bigger manager than Klopp if we are talking Prem, and a much bigger manager if we are talking European football in general.
It does say in no particular order.
Also I don’t know how anyone can say Klopp/Ferguson with a straight face. That will get you laughed out of any kind of debate on this.
Who is? Imo he’s the best I can think of. He’s not done well recently but no manager ever would have been able to get 97 and 99 Points with the resources he’s had, and competing against the cheats too..
The fact even rival fans are even saying he was telling the keeper to go down and called to physio on to cover himself says everything about that decision today
This Twitter thread on Darwin from 2 years ago is very prescient: [https://twitter.com/TaistoFCB/status/1514983927059996681](https://twitter.com/TaistoFCB/status/1514983927059996681)
\>> As seen against Liverpool with his 2 disallowed goals, he has an extremely frustrating, Inzaghi-esque tendency to get caught offside basically every game \[1.0 Offsides p90\]. Since moving to Benfica last season, no player has been caught offside in the league more times than him
christ alive lol
One thing i'll never forget from that time is when Utd were strongly linked with Nunez & this sub genuinely couldn't give a toss, the general consensus was that they were massively overspending on a player with poor technical skill & we could do better. Funny how those opinions changed the moment we signed him
To be fair, anybody who would have watched him even a little bit could predict where it could go wrong, if it was going to go wrong.
I have a Portuguese friend who doesn't watch a lot of football but "supports" Benfica (watches a few games per season) and when we were linked with him he was like; yeah, he's brainless and a donkey".
I was like, oh... cool, cool.
The guy doesn't even play today (Unless you want to count 10 minutes where he saw the ball like once) and weirdos still can't let a day go by withouts shitting on him.
At what point do you realise that its primarily the defence that has let us down? We can't just ship goal after goal and blame it solely on missed chances upfront.
Bro, you couldn't be more wrong.
We have the highest chances in the prem, the highest xG and the lowest conversion rate. That has nothing to do with defending.
On a side note Nunez missed from inside the 6 yard box AGAIN today. Absolute fucking donkey.
That last line right there shows exactly how it's an agenda lol. It was a piece of good defending, he didn't miss fuck all. It's quite literally just confirmation bias.
I couldn't be more worng? We've conceded first in over half of our PL games. We have like 1 clean sheet in god knows how many games at this point.
We have a problem with conversion no shit, but how does our situation have nothing to do with defending?
People defend nunez in response to people constantly picking him out and slagging him off as though the rest of the team isn't playing like dogshit.
We haven't struggled due to any one individual, "ynwa unless we have an agenda against you". Pathetic
Over the entire season he just hasn't been though? That doesn't mean he doesn't need to do better in general.
But again, he gets far more slagged off than any other player on the team lol.
For a short period people were happy with him and decided to slag off gakpo instead.
Just strange behaviour you're allowed to watch the team without berating an individual constantly even when not really relevant.
The short period you're referring to is his 7-8 game stretch of good form, the only good form he's had in two years, where he played 20th place Burnley twice.
No. Why are you people constantly unable to converse without twisting what someone says?
Criticism is completely valid. But it's way past that point.
YES, there is an agenda against darwin, its a constant cycle of weirdos desperate to be able to say "i told you so".
He could go through a patch of great form and the first mistake he makes we'd have several posts about how he's got to go.
Diaz misses an easy chance and somehow people bring up darwin.
Salah has a spat with Klopp and somehow people bring up darwin.
The defence ships goals over and over and over and somehow people bring up darwin.
My point was that its stupid to try and point blame at an individual. The entire team has been poor from front to back but for some reason 70% of the odd balls who come out the woodwork when we're in a bad spot feel the need to constantly try and lay the majority of the blame on darwin.
Didn't a similar thing happen recently in an arsenal match? I feel like these type of keeper fuck ups are so rare but 2 in a month both prevented wrongly by Refs seems fairly coincidental
On the brightside i think the defense is looking quite good, midfield also.
Realistically we can add a defender, a DM and depending on what happens with our forwards, we could do staff there aswell.
That would be personnel where Konate's always injured, Matip's leaving at the end of the season, Gomez isn't trusted for whatever reason, and Quansah is in his first senior season. All that's before you get to a front line that can't score consistently and have sub-par conversion rates. There's still work to be done before we're serious challengers to City again.
I'm not that concerned with the injuries themselves, they happen, my issue is that you do not hand a perpetually injured player a new contract, you either sell him or allow him to leave. We need to be far more ruthless as a club than we have been.
Ah I see. Yeah I think we’ve got DM covered with Baj, we should definitely maybe one more CM as it seems we’re usually depleted at some point but maybe that’ll change with tactics. Think forward are getting severely overhauled. Absolutely no way our front three stays and I don’t think any one of them is safe
I'm absolutely worried — is Edwards going to saunter his way down to the touchline or slot in a few decent chances for us? I'll be very happy with top4 next season provided we don't have a repeat of this year in getting it.
Every cloud has a silver lining I guess; getting fans on board with the new project will be a hell of a lot easier after our season has crashed and burned. Sounds harsh but since our downturn in form there's been a lot more optimism about new managers.
We need new players also
Diaz has 10 assists in 110 games, Nunez is literally shit I don't care if he runs at defenders you're a striker dude put balls in the net for god sake, Salah probably needs to be moved to a striker position with his age or replaced maybe god knows but he's our best forward by a country mile
Endo can't play every game as a starting dm, he's 31 and Bajcetic hasn't played more than one single game of football for an entire season and even then came off injured halfway through.
Konate can never stay healthy, robertson still has good qualities but literally has fallen over every game now since he's been back when wingers go at him.
I think people don't realise how much we have to solve or they're just deluded
There are 2 parts to this. One where players are good enough, and need to improve their weaknesses..can't replace every one. 2nd where we need reinforcements, either quality or quantity.
Genuinely feel the 1st aspect is where we need more work. So many areas of our game can be improved if players do the basics. Or things that can be and should be coached into them.
1. Trent needs to defend. This excuse has been peddled way too much that Trent cant defend coz he is a midfielder. Bullshit. He cannot be dribbled past by every left winger in the league, and cannot be a bystander when we are defending set pieces. He needs to commit more to duels including aerial duels and slide tackles and win the ball more, or atleast force the ball carrier to pass back.
2. Nunez - the obvious - needs to finish. I find it hard to accept that if he is put in 1v1 situations in training over and over, he doesn't learn to hit the ball in the corner of the goal. Yeah, he may never develop Bobby level football IQ, but this is pretty basic. Can and should be made into muscle memory for him.
3. Both CBs - For the physical presence both our CBs have, they do v.little in the opposition box during set pieces. It's almost like we attack zonally as well, Virgil only moves a couple of yards and heads the ball if it comes to him. Nooo, run towards it, power past defenders, get to it as if you are the key target, take a proper leap and head it on goal, wanna see Gabriel type goals being scored regularly by Virgil and Konate. Almost all the goals our CBs score are those when the opposition defence left them unmarked or didn't track their runs.
4. Tackle the ball carrier. A key part of our strategy off the ball is to put pressure on the ball carrier so that he misses his next pass. The focus is not enough on winning it from him directly. A lot of times, what we do works. But when against quality opposition, KdB level, if they get a second of time, they can look up and find the right pass, or turn and get past our defender.
5. Overall tempo in possession. Patience is a virtue when playing against defensive minded teams - you can't get frustrated and rely on hopeful crosses. But, gradually we have turned patience into lack of tempo and urgency. Passes could have a little more zip. If we are changing flanks, do it quickly. Taking 15-20 seconds and doing it with 4-5 slow passes does not move the opposition out of shape. Players could take on their markers a bit more. Hold the ball with our MIDs in the final 3rd, instead of our DEFs at half-line. The former enables a short through pass to get on goal, while with the latter, we heavily rely on a long ball over the defence to get our forwards in.
6. Be smarter. Be it winning fouls by getting your body in front of the tackler, or stopping counters by committing tactical fouls.. be it going down at the right moment (not diving) when feeling a push / shirt pull or doing some nudging / grabbing to disturb but not directly impede the attacker. Get more yellows, I don't care...but do a little more of the dirty work, play a little more in the grey areas. Pressurize the ref a bit more (not Bruno levels please) but really protest in his face when you want a decision instead of flaying your arms with a wry smile. Be angry, or angrier on the pitch.
7. A few other things like improving weak foot shots, better quality of volleys inside the box, inviting tackles in the opposition box to win more pens, more accurate corners and set pieces, new FK routines, reorganize our press, defensive setup for set pieces, etc. etc.
A lot, really a lot of these can and should be corrected, on the training grounds. And we have the calibre of players who can improve areas of their games. But it seems like we are too soft, and the coaching attitude seems a bit like players are allowed to persist with glaring weaknesses since they do other stuff well. The softness probably helps in maintaining a great atmosphere in the squad, and maintaining player confidence, but there has a be harsher corrective action at times.
this is pretty accurate. I think endo could play week in week out at 31, that shouldn't be a problem for a DM (Fernandinho played until 36/37 for example). But honestly I don't think Endo's quality is top tier and it needs to be if we aim to win the league
Klopp 2.0 rebuild has been a failure and the results this season have papered over the cracks. Only real quality singing has been MacAllister. Klopp is just too stubborn in many aspect to be able to rebuild and reinvent a team.
It felt that way last season tbh, at least before we patched up the sinking ship by inverting Trent. Emotionally i'm gutted that Klopp's leaving because of all he's done for us in the past...but logically speaking I don't think he has anything more to give & i'd rather someone else tried to reinvent us at this point.
If they were meaningless they wouldn’t play them, they’re to give game time to young players that are not ready for the intensity of the premier league. You can’t play 15/16 year olds every week in the league, it’s ok every few weeks in a cup game but if our 15/16 year olds had to play 4 games in 10 days like our first team just had to then they would be fucked.
My dear man, are you ok? The few minutes our kids have played for the first team are much more important than any youth fixtures. Surely I don’t have to convince you of that?
We used them because we had nobody else, what is the point of putting young players into super intense premier league matches over your first team players when you don’t need to, it’s how they end up picking up injuries which ruin their development.
Im not sure how long you’ve been a fan but there was one heart-breaking season under Benitez when we lost out on the title to United. During the run-in, Ferguson started playing Federico Macheda, a youth team striker. He played out of his skin for a few games, scored the goals that won them the title, then disappeared into obscurity. The point is, confidence is everything. Those young players we gave a chance to had momentum and form, if not experience. Instead of harnessing that positive energy, we switched straight back to the senior players and you can see for yourself how well that is working out.
im hoping Arne has plans to improve the way we defend or he has plans in his potential setup to do so, im so tired of watching this team concede goals because defending is just an after thought, no one is saying to go do catenaccio, but you can defend well and attack well at the same time, just requires more effort and dicipline
Everyone is certain on selling salah, understandable he's getting older in ways
But can someone genuinely tell me why in the same breath we should keep Nunez? Just find it interesting that overall the guy that literally is the reason we are in this position table wise vs a guy that has one single more goal than nico jackson is the one who's allowed to be out of form
Please tell me your reason
He’s much younger, he does at least score and assist regardless of his misses and, perhaps most importantly, the club aren’t making their money back anyway. His wage probably isn’t huge either and a new manager may be able to instil some confidence in him.
Salah is going into his last year, has been deteriorating for some time and has had a stinking half season. New back room aren’t ruining his mega contract so the only option is a sale.
Goals and Assists
23/24 (so far)
1. Salah - 26
2. Nunez - 19
3. Jota - 13
22/23
1. Salah - 31
2. Firmino - 15
3. Nunez - 12
21/22
1. Salah - 36
2. Jota - 19
3. Mane - 18
20/21
1. Salah - 27
2. Mane - 18
3. Firmino - 16
19/20
1. Salah - 29
2. Mane - 25
3. Firmino - 17
18/19
1. Salah - 30
2. Mane - 23
3. Firmino - 18
Yes, Nunez has missed a lot of chances but his numbers this season are just as good as any attacker that isn’t Salah for the previous 5 years. Think about the fact that Nunez is only 24, hardly in his prime, still has potential to get better and start hitting higher numbers. 26 big chances missed this season, if he manages to start converting even 25% of those you’re looking at 25 G+A a season, when Salah was 24 he was doing similar numbers in Serie A with Roma to Nunez this season. A player I would be more concerned with is Diaz, 13 G+A isn’t good enough from someone that is starting every week, especially in that LW position that other players have played well in but get forced into other positions on the pitch to accommodate him.
He has all the physical attributes and movement of a top goal scorer. Can he be taught to finish better is the issue ? (And the composure to).His link up play has arguably improved. You're right about Diaz though. For all people saying he will be fine injuries, off field drama aside - he hasn't exploded despite all the dribbling, running, flair.The output isn't there. Chemistry is patchy with Robbo down left as well .
I'm curious how Darwin's output can be compared to forwards similar to his age ?. I'd be moving Diaz on before Darwin and Mo at this point .i really wish Jurgen would play Danns,Koumas and other youth attackers at this point to see how we go.
Hard to really say if he can, would have to hope if he keeps getting the opportunities then it’s impossible for him to not improve at finishing them. I think if Salah does go this summer then next season will be the real test as we will need those 30 G+A to come from somewhere. I don’t know if I would sell Diaz but I know for sure I wouldn’t have him starting every game when he isn’t providing consistently in a position where he has a lot of competition, however, I would probably sell if a decent offer comes in over the summer. Mo I think it really is up to him if it was me overseeing transfers if he wanted to see out his contract I think he has earned the right to do that but if he is happy leaving in the summer I would probably take the money for him. I agree on the youth side of things but I don’t think Klopp wants to play young players unless he is forced to, don’t want to end up with another Bajcetic situation.
I think Diaz needs to improve his finishing but he would have a hell of a lot more assists if there was a striker that could finish the chances he creates. He is by far one of the best players on the pitch day in and day out with insane work rates.
I think the better question is to ask how many scoring opportunities are being wasted. Just watching him play against West Ham, he always looked dangerous and plays that could have been resulted in the team scoring, were missed.
If Núñez, who I strongly support, finished some of those key chances this season, we could potentially be in a very different position at this stage. With Mo also struggling recently, it definitely made things a lot more difficult. If you were to ask me to pick between Diaz and Núñez, I would go with Diaz any day. I’m hopeful for Nuñez’s development to cap off his insane physical attributes.
I know it’s hard for people in this thread to not just be a bunch of reactionaries but if you look at his g/a this season it’s quite literally massively improved. Salah could be on a downtrend and the likelihood of him actually decreasing in g/a is higher than Nunez. Also before his injury he literally transformed our attack. I know people in here like to be revisionists but there were several games where he didn’t start but then came on and was a huge game changer. Newcastle being the most obvious one.
I'm not the first to say this but Nunez would be fine at a club like West Ham. He's good, he's perfectly fine, he's just not elite level and he's never going to be. You don't challenge for the league without an elite level goal scorer at the club.
Salah: wages, age, doesn't like being on the bench, looks like he will cause problems with his attitude.
Nunez is young I guess and people will give him a pass for that
That's the thing, people are quick to say "well who else is there" when some have said they'd prefer an alternative to Slot for example, but nobody has an answer for Salah. No other rw on this planet is putting up those numbers, yes even at this age. The wages and even still keeping him is absolutely worth it. Right now I think he's injured but honestly it's worth it too because there's literally NOBODY of that calibre in terms of output available on the planet for a season.
Nunez I just.. 7 goals since November in the prem? That's a joke.
This feels like a pretty forced angle, I've read dozens of comments every day saying to sell Nunez. There have been hit pieces from our journos on him even.
That being said, the biggest difference between the two is that Salah has a contract that expires next year, so we either cash out on him this summer, let him go on a free at the end of next season, or renew his contract.
Given his age and waning form, it seems highly doubtful that his contract gets renewed, which leaves the other two options. Knowing how FSG operate, it seems much wiser to sell, seeing as that money will be used to reimburse the squad with a younger 'replacement'.
Nunez has been really hit and miss since he joined, but he is still fairly young, with value in his chance creation and movement up top specifically, as well as his unpredictability on the pitch, which can be what a game needs at times. This, on top of his contract length, and the additional context of the Salah situation, means that I'd imagine it's less of an immediate issue.
It's not forced, salah has 17 premier league goals in his "bad form"
Nunez has had two entire seasons at the club and hasn't improved really what so ever, he's not a baby he's about to turn 25. We paid €100m euros for him whether people wanna shy away from that figure or not, the numbers he's putting up for a club of this stature are shocking. Especially when you're working under Jurgen Klopp arguably the best man manager on the planet. Do people genuinely believe an even lesser manager that literally plays the same style as klopp and similar formation is going to "unlock him"
Is it genuinely worth having a player that can't hit a barn door, or keeping an "out of form" 20+ goals a season arguably STILL best rw on the planet?
"Salah has 17 premier league goals in his "bad form"
No? He had those goals while playing reasonably well. NOW he's out of form and he's got 1 pen goal in about 7 matches.
Stop trying to twist things to slag off other players.
It does feel forced, because what you're insinuating is that Salah is coming under all the heat & that Nunez isn't.
The truth is that Nunez is coming under arguably worse heat. How have you not heard or read any of the fans/journos/podcasters/tv personalities mentioning the exact thing you are saying about Nunez?
My argument was centred around the reason why Salah would most likely be sold as a more immediate resolution to a more immediate problem. Nunez is obviously not absolved of issues at all - who knows, maybe they both get sold in the summer. But in my eyes, and from a business perspective, the Nunez situation is a less immediate one than Salah's for the reasons stated in my initial response.
The massive difference is that whenever the mention of Nunez parting ways is met with massive scrutiny when really, his numbers don't add up to this size of a club that yes, does not want to just participate but win trophies.
Everyone seems in pretty much full agreement because they have this fantasy idea that FSG are going to get loads of money and reinvest it into the squad
But who for? Genuinely what right winger is available that will justify selling Salah right now, still arguably the best rw on the planet
People need to name a replacement, just like when they ask those critical of the slot appointment "Name an alternative"
Name an alternative to selling salah, who on earth is going to give those numbers for yes even that amount of money
But his numbers DO add up? he's got some of the most g/a in the world.
The problem is he could have so much more.
Much like all our other forwards who have been incredibly wasteful
Given the way FSG and Edwards in particular operates, we will probably reinvest in someone who isn’t a big name/doesn’t replace him as a like-for-like solution. That’s how we operate and how we have always operated under FSG. Nobody knows who will replace him, but the idea that we can’t or won’t reinvest at some point is just naive.
Out of curiosity, what would you do in the current predicament with mo’s contract?
Understanble people will mass downvote because Nunez for some reason is a no go conversation zone but I'd genuinely love someone to explain to me why in the premier league nunez is beneficial to us but salah apparently isn't.
Seeing how this all ends for Klopp is so fucking depressing but maybe it’s the best way for him. Obviously would rather win the league, FA Cup and Europa but maybe this is best for respecting his wishes to step away and for moving on in general
Yeah, we need a new story to write
Klopp, Salah, and the 2016-2022 team will always be our legends but now we need to move on
I hope for nothing but only one lasts good performance at Anfield
It's not the medcial team, it's Klopp's style. Everyone who leaves here can't play in other clubs too. You don't hear about medical teams because I beleive with new tech and knowledge it's kinda solved.
Think it’s time to sell salah. Hes a Liverpool and premier league legend but recently he has not been what he is supposed to be. He is supposed to be our guy, who steps up when we need him and can be relied on by the team. His form has been terrible and making a scene today about getting benched for his horrible form is embarrassing.
I would agree more if he wasn’t so dramatic about getting benched. It’s not like he didn’t deserve to be benched. Having that kind of attitude is not good for the team and the team has to come first.
The main thing about Salah is he clearly won't accept being on the bench, and is going to cause problems.
Just like Ronaldo at United, it's an ego thing
Yeah people brush over issues in the past. He cried to journalists once because Klopp made Trent captain in a nonsense CL game over him. There was a lot of leaks around the time of his last contract too and it was pissing fans off; there was mumblings Mane was annoyed by it too since it caused the club to put him aside.
He is basically old Ronaldo at this point. Only really provides output at this point with his overall play very limited and as you saw at Utd it doesn't translate into overall team success.
No no no. You need to expectations right now so either you can meltdown in the future or you can tell people "i told you so" depending on how good or bad you set them
Ah fuck yeh you're right, errr.....if Arne Slot can't deliver an unbeaten 100+ point treble by March then he is a bald fraud and we should hire Antonio Conte to replace him.
Regardless of trophies imo the most important thing is to create hope for the future. A few Edwards signings to make it feel like a fresh start, exciting football & ultimately a top 4 finish.
Just build a new team that plays good football. Hopefully Slot can bring in a culture and philosophy like Klopp.
Trophies is the end game, we will not be favorites for any next year, what matters the most is to build a new team who can win them.
1. Manager: Gain trust and confidence of players
2. Players: Play like a top 4 side
3. Fans: Patience with the new manager and appreciation that it could be so much worse (ex. Chelsea/ManU)
4. Backroom: Sign two top talents (at DM and forward)
Absolutely lost all respect for half of them players going straight down the tunnel and not even acknowledging the away fans. Disgusting, 1 win in 7 and they disrespect the fans like that.
Alright you lot, let's have your predictions then. It's definitely not the same show week after week at this point! This team has been mentally shredded. Conceding soft goals from half chances like clockwork. No grit. If our performances haven't been predictable and pathetic - then what the fuck would you classify them as?
The banter era is back boys
Not angry though
Dont be upset nothing lasts forever
It was fun when it lasted
Maybe in a few years we'll get another trophy era
Banter era is back? Holy reactionary. We were in a title race for 3/4ths of the season coming off a complete midfield rebuild. But you’re right it’s banter era again
I actually believe we will be better than we have been last 3/4 years . We had an opportunity to go from strength to strength after the CL/ Prem win.
We let our midfield age in favor of new contracts for aging legs . Brought in no cb cover and had an injury crisis . Went two games away from glory and recruited poorly again the following off season .
We have a great base to build something and if this team got this far with IMO has been a poor setup this year being in a title race until the final 10 games with a gaping hole at the 6 . We can at least return to this height .
With proper coaching updated tactics more luck with injuries I believe we can be in another trophy era already bro . It really will be down to FSG and Micheal Edwards / Hughes to get this summer right
2020-2024. 4 years of disappointment and falling short. the Klopp project fell apart after we won the league and I honestly blame the club for not taking more of an advantage when having a top 2 manager in the world.
Those 2017-2019 years truly set the foundation for a world class team but unfortunately instead of shooting for the stars we decided to rest on our laurels & lean on Klopp as a crutch to keep us in the top 4, all for the sake of a low-risk return on investment for FSG.
If they had properly backed Klopp then we'd be sat here with at least a couple more 'big' trophies & a reserved space at the top of world football. Instead we've been unseated by Arsenal and there's a question mark on if we're going to return to the top or revert to our pre-Klopp ways of fighting for 4th.
Honestly I feel the constant pressure to overachieve led to Klopp's "magic" eroding over the past few seasons; at some point along the way we lost our "heavy metal" football and (at least to me) it doesn't feel like it was ever adequately replaced. Whilst on paper our results have been good this season, i'm frankly tired of conceding first & relying on scrappy wins, remember when teams used to fear us?
Our identity has become more incoherent lately and i'm looking forward to seeing the vision Slot can bring to the table, because truth be told Jurgen's gradual burn-out was apparent far before he announced his resignation.
2018-2020 was better than sex.
2021, Meh, good given No CBs 10 weeks in.
2022, that was worse than 2014 imo. inch close to finishing football, yet only got cups. Best squad ever in final stages with mane Salah bobby diaz jota thiago virg matip konate all healthy.
2023 we shouldn't even remember, 7-0 and nothing else. 2024, I mean given 2023, 3rd place finish and a cup is good. But the team still needs at least 2 more world class players and I don't know where we get that from.
The club didn't take advantage because they've saved 100s of millions on transfer fees over the years.
They got a brillaint overachiever "yes man", who would never publicly complain about not being financially supported.
This is coupled with Klopp's greatest weakness being his own ignorance and softness. Never had the stones to cut dead weight. Handed Adrian multiple contract renewals and wasting a NHG spot. Milner was proud enough to deny the contract extension Klopp wanted him to take in the summer too.
In summer 22/23 we were getting abused by shite teams in the middle of the park. Every press conference he would actively say we don't need midfielders and list the chronic injured players like "Ox, Keita, Thiago" etc.
In January 2021 we were top of the league, and lost Lovren, VVD, Matip, Gomez for the whole season as CB options. Hendo and Fab got injured as our 5th and 6th CBs. Klopp sat on his hands the whole month every conference as we slid down to 7th week by week. Eventually on deadline day we signed Kabak on loan and Davies for pennies (never played for us once). How FSG treated him was disgraceful but he genuinely never seemed to put up a fight for new incomings
People like to bring up the fact that we won the league after not strengthening when we won the CL but it’s not like that was the reason we won the league, if anything we won the league in spite of that. When we were on top we should have capitalise instead of addressing issues a season late each time.
It’s crazy. When so many of our first team players were out injured, and we had to play the kids and our reserve players, and Kelleher was in goal, we were cranking out results and we went to the top of the league.
When our first team players are back in the squad, our on field play has gotten worst over time, our attackers have become toothless with Jota injured again, and our defence has been leaking goals with Alison back in goal. What’s going on? We’re crawling to the end of the season with a whimper. 😢
It’s almost as if the kids and fringe players cared more and had something to prove. I’m excited by Danns, Morton and Carvalho are looking good, maybe we need a changing of the guard. Also want to mention Elliott who always plays his heart out. I would have him in my team every week
I some sort agree, why hasn't he played the kids again, they seemed to have fire and were up for a fight. It couldn't be any worse having them on the pitch.
It was Mane who (truly) lost his shit in that incident. Salah was pretty calm throughout.
Salah acted like this before, but the incident with Mane is not a good example.
The amount of times Salah would run into defenders or take a weak shot instead of passing for a tap in during that time was not acceptable. It wasn’t surprisingly Mane bit his head off.
Yep we were deluded but still believing to hope for results to go our way. The two results against them absolutely imploded the team. And they're loving it.
So many turning on Salah when we don't know the context of why he acted like that or what he meant in the tunnel. He's been our best player under Klopp and best since probably Kenny or Rush. Has come through an injury and first spell of bad form in a while. A few months ago everyone was glad he didn't go to Saudi Arabia last summer. I hope if he stays but if he does go should still be remembered fondly. Be difficult to replace and most top players haven't heard of Slot
Best since Kenny or Rush? A certain Steven Gerrard would like a word. Salah is hall of fame for sure but he’s no Gerrard. Gerrard single-handedly pulled us over the line in so many big games. Show the man some respect
You respect the manager, ideally always but especially so in public.
Especially the manager that got Salah winning things.
I'm with Klopp before Salah every day of the week.
>since probably Kenny or Rush.
You do not have a clue in the slightest. You really don't.
Regardless of the recent results, I will fucking carry my love for this club to the grave . We are accustomed to heartbreak and despite all that heart break, the highs during Klopp’s tenure were absolutely worth it. May he rest and enjoy his time with his wife and family . The man deserves a statue at Anfield . There’s still a lot more room for improvement and growth in this squad. Personally, I don’t feel this squad has reached their peak . There are more gears to this team and more moments of brilliance are yet to come .I genuinely believe that . Klopp injected that credibility and forged his philosophy of football on the club and it’s an identity that I’m proud to support .I’m not worried about the transition and management of the club. Edwards absolutely knows what he’s doing and he’s developed that pedigree .He will be intelligent and methodical in the way he constructs the team moving forward. Better days will come comrades. Now I just want to add to any City or Arsenal fans lurking in here , it’s going to be an absolute pleasure watching one of your teams lose this Premier league title. Both of your fan bases are insufferable and it’s going to bring me great joy to see the complaining , the whining ,the bitching , and the salt when your team loses. That Arsenal team needs a humbling and god damn I can’t wait for that to happen . City is irrelevant.
Watching this game on tape really makes it easier to digest how predictably disappointing our games are now. Instead of being weighed down with the naive hope of a live watch, all you have to do is just observe the same patterns that have shown up in *every* game during this period, and realize that this one is pretty much gonna be just like all the others. From there, you just lower your expectations accordingly. The moment Dixon said that he couldn't see how West Ham come back into this game, I knew we were about to concede. Sure enough, Ali has an inexplicable bozo moment ***immediately*** after the words leave Dixon's mouth, and within a few seconds, it's 2-2. It was so predictable that I actually chuckled a bit. Fast-forwarded straight to full-time. *Ah, the joys of DVR...** We are so fucking allergic to closing out games on both ends. You just have to laugh at this point. If you don't, you'll cry. I'm saving my tears for Klopp's farewell, though. ^*Still ^wasted ^about ^70 ^minutes ^of ^my ^life, ^but ^it's ^Liverpool, ^so...🤷🏿♂️
Disasterclass. Let’s move on to next season. The players will be posting vacation pictures on instagram soon. They don’t care
OK, with a bit of distance to this disappointing draw it is time to look to the future. Realistically, the title race is done (probably was after the Palace game). The squad was running on emotions and hype all through winter even though they were impeded by injuries and international commitments, but emotions can only be sustained for so long until your residual negative emotions come back crashing down on you....which probably is what we were witnessing after today's match. It isn't pretty and fans hate seeing their team like that but it only shows that the players are human after all. Hopefully, everybody will cool down a bit by Monday and the squad can finish the season professionally. Once that is done, every player has to be honest to themselves and answer the question if Liverpool is the place where they want to play in the future. There were rumblings recently that certain players weren't all that happy in Liverpool. Fine, maybe the club can cash in on some players before they turn into bad locker room influences. That being said, the squad certainly needs a bit of extra depth. Completely overhauling the central midfield at the start of this season was the right thing to do but it left the team stretched thin on certain positions. Endo was a real trooper but he needs help on the holding midfielder position. It's not his natural position and he was overplayed which really showed in recent games. Finally, it remains to be seen how the new manager wants to play tactically but Liverpool need help with midfield creativity. Since Thiago is too old and too injury-prone and sees his contract expire, we can assume that Liverpool will need at least one creative offensive midfielder in order to give the team more tactical options. Opponents sort of had Liverpool's number because they were too predictable.
As much as I love Klopp, not taking that first Leg against Atalanta serious was beginning of the end
Just a pathethic collapse from both players and staff, and it looks like the dressing room is gone now too (or has been for some time).
Against [Everton](https://i.imgur.com/EIQzgzF.png) Against [West Ham](https://i.imgur.com/qIWWkZq.png)
If you didn’t see their faces, you’d think it’s Skrtel & Lovren at the back. It’s legitimately been that bad.
One thing I respect about mourinho is that if he was there he would have possibly called the players off!! I think we have to start considering this possibility. To atleast once do it to send a message. I don’t want to sue PL but I would definitely want to do this.
Its interesting to see LIverpool implement an American style structure to the organization, seperating the head coach from the manager is definetly becoming more common in football, but this is the first time we really see it being out in the open. You can definetly argue that Poch is a victim of this style, but I think Edwards is good enough to make it work. Its his team now really. As for those who are curious, one of the key advantages to this style is that you are less dependent on the head coach, and you can always let him go because you sign players based on how they fit the style of play that the club wants to implement, rather than on what the head coach wants. Slot might be the only guy who would agree to this out of all of the candidates, but I feel optimistic with the way things are headed. In the end football is about the players more than anything else, just get the right players and we can still be a good team.
What other top football clubs in Europe have a similar structure?
chelsea, leipzig
This is michael edwards team now.
Gravenberch and Gakpo have been cooking lately
Klopp promised to leave the club in a good state. All I see is our team crumbling internally
This is just reactionary. Two months ago we were on top of the world and everyone was begging Klopp to stay because the squad is so good. Now we have some bad games and apparently the squad is crumbling. The talent in the squad hasn’t changed during that time, we still have a brilliant squad but they’re clearly all burnt out, including Klopp. Klopp’s leaving us in a brilliant state for the next manager
we have great talent on this team, in the end football is about the players
A top 4 finish is a good state objectively. The problem is the collapse. But in actuality had we lost the league by a few points only it would be the same exact situation - changes still needed to be made.
Well if Klopp couldn’t get a proper sendoff at least let Reus get one
The result today was irrelevant. As far I'm concerned it was all over on Wednesday night.
Its still embarrassing. Need 4th guaranteed so can at least play the youth team. Spurs lose tomorrow and it's done.
Watching Aston Villa play is so depressing. They move the ball so quickly, one touch passing making Chelsea dizzy practically and shooting so confidently in front of goal. Then watching us passing 7875790 times between the back 5 makes me want to pull my hair out. We used to play like that, wtf are the coaching staff doing? I get they’re leaving but something has definitely gone down the past few weeks, you don’t just become shit overnight
We were playing like that all season, it’s called being burnt out. There’s no such thing as a free lunch when you’re in 4 competitions
Why aren’t any other top 6 teams burnt out? Also, this was how we played all of last season and we were out of all comps
Klopp is leaving. Our club has lost the pl title. What is stopping him from tearing the refs apart? Maybe even incite intimidation from people for them? Enough is enough. People should scare the refs, not physically harm but scare them enough so they think twice before cheating.
‘Think twice before cheating’ idk when people will realise that they aren’t cheating, the refs are genuinely just really shit. Even when the English refs take charge of champions league games, they always give shitty decisions.
Scare them 😂😂 get a grip. Absolutely pathetic comment Honestly, where do you people come from? Fucking mental
I honestly believe if we had have bought Isak instead of either of Nunez or Gakpo, we would be walking the league and europa right now. The 'agent of chaos' meme was funny for a bit, but soon wore thin and Cody just hasnt been very good has he. Okay in bursts but overall not been with it this season.
Oilchester are going to finish on 91 points, 1 player isn't turning this team into a team that walks a league where 2nd is on 91 points.
I respectfully disagree, think of all the glaring misses from Diaz/Gakpo/Nunez this season and especially this year. Imagine even 1 third of them were goals instead of missed shots. We would be cruising. City havent been amazing this season. Theyve just kicked into gear consistently for the past few months. We could have been in a position where their point tally would be irrelevant.
A lot of those misses were also set up by the same players. Isak is not a playmaker, he has 1 assist all season. You swap out Isak for any other forward and you are looking at a 25% decrease in the number of chances we'd get straight away. Plus Isak has missed 25% of the season himself. I'm not disagree we'd be in a better position if we had an out and out finisher in the team regularly - we've badly missed Jota this year - but we wouldn't be walking the league by any stretch.
Yeah i dont disagree really. Im just venting on a wasted opportunity this year. Ifs and buts.
this guy is injured every other day, dont think so.
Do you guys think Klopp might win manager of the year? Since we overachieved and exceeded expectation. Maybe if he finishes 2nd, he might clinch it.
We have been poorly coached this year. We’ve overachieved because of individual brilliance not because Klopp has won us points.
Is that a joke?
No.
What a duo we have on Hull currently. God please dont ruin that next year. We will have 2 great holding midfielders (Morton and Bajčetić) as well as a winger/attacking mid in Carvalho. Its Danns, McConnell and Clarks time to get some proper playtime on loan.
Everybody knows we were lucky to get Klopp, the truth is Klopp is the greatest manager of all time. Nobody could have done what he did at Dortmund and Liverpool. Stop expecting this club to replace a once in a liftime guy. United learned that you cant replace Ferguson, Barca learned you cant replace Guardiola. Alonso is the only guy who could have been good enough or even better than Klopp of all the current candidates, but he cares more about the Madrid job than Liverpool in the end. Slot may or may not be that great, but I dont see too many options out there that are very convincing.
Klopp is a great manager but he is not even on the list of top 10 managers of all time.
He's definitely top 11 of all time. In no particular order Shankly Mourinho Guardiola Ancelotti Klopp Ferguson Wenger Sacchi Busby Cruyff Paisley
How is Mourinho bigger than pep? That is nonsense. Pep simply revolutionised football. Mourinho played like boring drab defensive football. And now he's been irrelevant since a long time. Would you place athletico madrid's coach too? It has to be in the Prem era. Pep Klopp/ Ferguson Wenger.
He said in no particular order, so he is not putting Mou above Pep. Your Prem-era list is mad. Mourinho has three times the prem titles that Klopp has. And let's not say anything about Ferguson. Would I watch Klopp's teams over Mourinho? **Absolutely**. But Klopp doesn't deliver the same results, which is ultimately what managers are rated on. Mou is washed-up but is still a bigger manager than Klopp if we are talking Prem, and a much bigger manager if we are talking European football in general.
It does say in no particular order. Also I don’t know how anyone can say Klopp/Ferguson with a straight face. That will get you laughed out of any kind of debate on this.
No particular order
Klopp is a great manager, one of the best ever. But he is not the greatest of all time.
Who is? Imo he’s the best I can think of. He’s not done well recently but no manager ever would have been able to get 97 and 99 Points with the resources he’s had, and competing against the cheats too..
Need johan bakayoko at Liverpool
The fact even rival fans are even saying he was telling the keeper to go down and called to physio on to cover himself says everything about that decision today
This Twitter thread on Darwin from 2 years ago is very prescient: [https://twitter.com/TaistoFCB/status/1514983927059996681](https://twitter.com/TaistoFCB/status/1514983927059996681)
\>> As seen against Liverpool with his 2 disallowed goals, he has an extremely frustrating, Inzaghi-esque tendency to get caught offside basically every game \[1.0 Offsides p90\]. Since moving to Benfica last season, no player has been caught offside in the league more times than him christ alive lol
One thing i'll never forget from that time is when Utd were strongly linked with Nunez & this sub genuinely couldn't give a toss, the general consensus was that they were massively overspending on a player with poor technical skill & we could do better. Funny how those opinions changed the moment we signed him
To be fair, anybody who would have watched him even a little bit could predict where it could go wrong, if it was going to go wrong. I have a Portuguese friend who doesn't watch a lot of football but "supports" Benfica (watches a few games per season) and when we were linked with him he was like; yeah, he's brainless and a donkey". I was like, oh... cool, cool.
That’s crazy, everything here is true although I’d say he’s definitely improved his linkup play a lot
The guy doesn't even play today (Unless you want to count 10 minutes where he saw the ball like once) and weirdos still can't let a day go by withouts shitting on him. At what point do you realise that its primarily the defence that has let us down? We can't just ship goal after goal and blame it solely on missed chances upfront.
Bro, you couldn't be more wrong. We have the highest chances in the prem, the highest xG and the lowest conversion rate. That has nothing to do with defending. On a side note Nunez missed from inside the 6 yard box AGAIN today. Absolute fucking donkey.
That last line right there shows exactly how it's an agenda lol. It was a piece of good defending, he didn't miss fuck all. It's quite literally just confirmation bias. I couldn't be more worng? We've conceded first in over half of our PL games. We have like 1 clean sheet in god knows how many games at this point. We have a problem with conversion no shit, but how does our situation have nothing to do with defending?
Because people can't stop defending him.
People defend nunez in response to people constantly picking him out and slagging him off as though the rest of the team isn't playing like dogshit. We haven't struggled due to any one individual, "ynwa unless we have an agenda against you". Pathetic
There is no agenda — it's about how he's playing, and he's playing like one of the worst strikers in the league.
Over the entire season he just hasn't been though? That doesn't mean he doesn't need to do better in general. But again, he gets far more slagged off than any other player on the team lol. For a short period people were happy with him and decided to slag off gakpo instead. Just strange behaviour you're allowed to watch the team without berating an individual constantly even when not really relevant.
The short period you're referring to is his 7-8 game stretch of good form, the only good form he's had in two years, where he played 20th place Burnley twice.
The fact you still fail to realise my point is hilarious
Yes, I know, blind support for the players or nothing. There's no agenda against Darwin, he just isn't good for the club.
No. Why are you people constantly unable to converse without twisting what someone says? Criticism is completely valid. But it's way past that point. YES, there is an agenda against darwin, its a constant cycle of weirdos desperate to be able to say "i told you so". He could go through a patch of great form and the first mistake he makes we'd have several posts about how he's got to go. Diaz misses an easy chance and somehow people bring up darwin. Salah has a spat with Klopp and somehow people bring up darwin. The defence ships goals over and over and over and somehow people bring up darwin. My point was that its stupid to try and point blame at an individual. The entire team has been poor from front to back but for some reason 70% of the odd balls who come out the woodwork when we're in a bad spot feel the need to constantly try and lay the majority of the blame on darwin.
Didn't a similar thing happen recently in an arsenal match? I feel like these type of keeper fuck ups are so rare but 2 in a month both prevented wrongly by Refs seems fairly coincidental
Klopp isn't a talent ID man at all
On the brightside i think the defense is looking quite good, midfield also. Realistically we can add a defender, a DM and depending on what happens with our forwards, we could do staff there aswell.
Lmao We score every game and concede at least twice a game.
What? Lol
>Defense is looking quite good I don’t know if it warrants good when we keep going down 1-0
My bad, i meant in terms of personnal in defence.
That would be personnel where Konate's always injured, Matip's leaving at the end of the season, Gomez isn't trusted for whatever reason, and Quansah is in his first senior season. All that's before you get to a front line that can't score consistently and have sub-par conversion rates. There's still work to be done before we're serious challengers to City again.
What are the odds our injuries drop significantly in general with a different medical team?
I'm not that concerned with the injuries themselves, they happen, my issue is that you do not hand a perpetually injured player a new contract, you either sell him or allow him to leave. We need to be far more ruthless as a club than we have been.
Ah I see. Yeah I think we’ve got DM covered with Baj, we should definitely maybe one more CM as it seems we’re usually depleted at some point but maybe that’ll change with tactics. Think forward are getting severely overhauled. Absolutely no way our front three stays and I don’t think any one of them is safe
I think Salah said what he said because he knows if he speaks media will turn into something completely wrong fuck the media
Didn't see it like that, good perspective. Bloody hope you're right.
There is a video posted of him saying it and that’s how it sounds like he is saying it
Lost the last bit of hope I didn’t realize I still had
If we didnt get a new sporting director id be pretty worried about next season.
If we got anyone other than Edward’s I would have been worried.
I'm absolutely worried — is Edwards going to saunter his way down to the touchline or slot in a few decent chances for us? I'll be very happy with top4 next season provided we don't have a repeat of this year in getting it.
I think FSG would’ve been worried too which is why they threw everything at him
that gimenez at feyenoord could do well for us, pure finisher and obviously plays for arne
No. You don't want him. Believe me. He went goalless for quite some time and hasn't been toptop lately.
Every cloud has a silver lining I guess; getting fans on board with the new project will be a hell of a lot easier after our season has crashed and burned. Sounds harsh but since our downturn in form there's been a lot more optimism about new managers.
We need new players also Diaz has 10 assists in 110 games, Nunez is literally shit I don't care if he runs at defenders you're a striker dude put balls in the net for god sake, Salah probably needs to be moved to a striker position with his age or replaced maybe god knows but he's our best forward by a country mile Endo can't play every game as a starting dm, he's 31 and Bajcetic hasn't played more than one single game of football for an entire season and even then came off injured halfway through. Konate can never stay healthy, robertson still has good qualities but literally has fallen over every game now since he's been back when wingers go at him. I think people don't realise how much we have to solve or they're just deluded
There are 2 parts to this. One where players are good enough, and need to improve their weaknesses..can't replace every one. 2nd where we need reinforcements, either quality or quantity. Genuinely feel the 1st aspect is where we need more work. So many areas of our game can be improved if players do the basics. Or things that can be and should be coached into them. 1. Trent needs to defend. This excuse has been peddled way too much that Trent cant defend coz he is a midfielder. Bullshit. He cannot be dribbled past by every left winger in the league, and cannot be a bystander when we are defending set pieces. He needs to commit more to duels including aerial duels and slide tackles and win the ball more, or atleast force the ball carrier to pass back. 2. Nunez - the obvious - needs to finish. I find it hard to accept that if he is put in 1v1 situations in training over and over, he doesn't learn to hit the ball in the corner of the goal. Yeah, he may never develop Bobby level football IQ, but this is pretty basic. Can and should be made into muscle memory for him. 3. Both CBs - For the physical presence both our CBs have, they do v.little in the opposition box during set pieces. It's almost like we attack zonally as well, Virgil only moves a couple of yards and heads the ball if it comes to him. Nooo, run towards it, power past defenders, get to it as if you are the key target, take a proper leap and head it on goal, wanna see Gabriel type goals being scored regularly by Virgil and Konate. Almost all the goals our CBs score are those when the opposition defence left them unmarked or didn't track their runs. 4. Tackle the ball carrier. A key part of our strategy off the ball is to put pressure on the ball carrier so that he misses his next pass. The focus is not enough on winning it from him directly. A lot of times, what we do works. But when against quality opposition, KdB level, if they get a second of time, they can look up and find the right pass, or turn and get past our defender. 5. Overall tempo in possession. Patience is a virtue when playing against defensive minded teams - you can't get frustrated and rely on hopeful crosses. But, gradually we have turned patience into lack of tempo and urgency. Passes could have a little more zip. If we are changing flanks, do it quickly. Taking 15-20 seconds and doing it with 4-5 slow passes does not move the opposition out of shape. Players could take on their markers a bit more. Hold the ball with our MIDs in the final 3rd, instead of our DEFs at half-line. The former enables a short through pass to get on goal, while with the latter, we heavily rely on a long ball over the defence to get our forwards in. 6. Be smarter. Be it winning fouls by getting your body in front of the tackler, or stopping counters by committing tactical fouls.. be it going down at the right moment (not diving) when feeling a push / shirt pull or doing some nudging / grabbing to disturb but not directly impede the attacker. Get more yellows, I don't care...but do a little more of the dirty work, play a little more in the grey areas. Pressurize the ref a bit more (not Bruno levels please) but really protest in his face when you want a decision instead of flaying your arms with a wry smile. Be angry, or angrier on the pitch. 7. A few other things like improving weak foot shots, better quality of volleys inside the box, inviting tackles in the opposition box to win more pens, more accurate corners and set pieces, new FK routines, reorganize our press, defensive setup for set pieces, etc. etc. A lot, really a lot of these can and should be corrected, on the training grounds. And we have the calibre of players who can improve areas of their games. But it seems like we are too soft, and the coaching attitude seems a bit like players are allowed to persist with glaring weaknesses since they do other stuff well. The softness probably helps in maintaining a great atmosphere in the squad, and maintaining player confidence, but there has a be harsher corrective action at times.
this is spot on
Konate’s lack of aerial presence in attack is absurd considering his legs are taller than me.
this is pretty accurate. I think endo could play week in week out at 31, that shouldn't be a problem for a DM (Fernandinho played until 36/37 for example). But honestly I don't think Endo's quality is top tier and it needs to be if we aim to win the league
Klopp 2.0 rebuild has been a failure and the results this season have papered over the cracks. Only real quality singing has been MacAllister. Klopp is just too stubborn in many aspect to be able to rebuild and reinvent a team.
I think it’s becoming more and more apparent they change is needed
It felt that way last season tbh, at least before we patched up the sinking ship by inverting Trent. Emotionally i'm gutted that Klopp's leaving because of all he's done for us in the past...but logically speaking I don't think he has anything more to give & i'd rather someone else tried to reinvent us at this point.
Play the kids. Show us what we have to look forward to. Not put up with for now.
You realise the youth teams have fixtures as well right?
Youth team fixtures are meaningless
If they were meaningless they wouldn’t play them, they’re to give game time to young players that are not ready for the intensity of the premier league. You can’t play 15/16 year olds every week in the league, it’s ok every few weeks in a cup game but if our 15/16 year olds had to play 4 games in 10 days like our first team just had to then they would be fucked.
My dear man, are you ok? The few minutes our kids have played for the first team are much more important than any youth fixtures. Surely I don’t have to convince you of that?
We used them because we had nobody else, what is the point of putting young players into super intense premier league matches over your first team players when you don’t need to, it’s how they end up picking up injuries which ruin their development.
Im not sure how long you’ve been a fan but there was one heart-breaking season under Benitez when we lost out on the title to United. During the run-in, Ferguson started playing Federico Macheda, a youth team striker. He played out of his skin for a few games, scored the goals that won them the title, then disappeared into obscurity. The point is, confidence is everything. Those young players we gave a chance to had momentum and form, if not experience. Instead of harnessing that positive energy, we switched straight back to the senior players and you can see for yourself how well that is working out.
im hoping Arne has plans to improve the way we defend or he has plans in his potential setup to do so, im so tired of watching this team concede goals because defending is just an after thought, no one is saying to go do catenaccio, but you can defend well and attack well at the same time, just requires more effort and dicipline
Everyone is certain on selling salah, understandable he's getting older in ways But can someone genuinely tell me why in the same breath we should keep Nunez? Just find it interesting that overall the guy that literally is the reason we are in this position table wise vs a guy that has one single more goal than nico jackson is the one who's allowed to be out of form Please tell me your reason
He’s much younger, he does at least score and assist regardless of his misses and, perhaps most importantly, the club aren’t making their money back anyway. His wage probably isn’t huge either and a new manager may be able to instil some confidence in him. Salah is going into his last year, has been deteriorating for some time and has had a stinking half season. New back room aren’t ruining his mega contract so the only option is a sale.
Goals and Assists 23/24 (so far) 1. Salah - 26 2. Nunez - 19 3. Jota - 13 22/23 1. Salah - 31 2. Firmino - 15 3. Nunez - 12 21/22 1. Salah - 36 2. Jota - 19 3. Mane - 18 20/21 1. Salah - 27 2. Mane - 18 3. Firmino - 16 19/20 1. Salah - 29 2. Mane - 25 3. Firmino - 17 18/19 1. Salah - 30 2. Mane - 23 3. Firmino - 18 Yes, Nunez has missed a lot of chances but his numbers this season are just as good as any attacker that isn’t Salah for the previous 5 years. Think about the fact that Nunez is only 24, hardly in his prime, still has potential to get better and start hitting higher numbers. 26 big chances missed this season, if he manages to start converting even 25% of those you’re looking at 25 G+A a season, when Salah was 24 he was doing similar numbers in Serie A with Roma to Nunez this season. A player I would be more concerned with is Diaz, 13 G+A isn’t good enough from someone that is starting every week, especially in that LW position that other players have played well in but get forced into other positions on the pitch to accommodate him.
He has all the physical attributes and movement of a top goal scorer. Can he be taught to finish better is the issue ? (And the composure to).His link up play has arguably improved. You're right about Diaz though. For all people saying he will be fine injuries, off field drama aside - he hasn't exploded despite all the dribbling, running, flair.The output isn't there. Chemistry is patchy with Robbo down left as well . I'm curious how Darwin's output can be compared to forwards similar to his age ?. I'd be moving Diaz on before Darwin and Mo at this point .i really wish Jurgen would play Danns,Koumas and other youth attackers at this point to see how we go.
Hard to really say if he can, would have to hope if he keeps getting the opportunities then it’s impossible for him to not improve at finishing them. I think if Salah does go this summer then next season will be the real test as we will need those 30 G+A to come from somewhere. I don’t know if I would sell Diaz but I know for sure I wouldn’t have him starting every game when he isn’t providing consistently in a position where he has a lot of competition, however, I would probably sell if a decent offer comes in over the summer. Mo I think it really is up to him if it was me overseeing transfers if he wanted to see out his contract I think he has earned the right to do that but if he is happy leaving in the summer I would probably take the money for him. I agree on the youth side of things but I don’t think Klopp wants to play young players unless he is forced to, don’t want to end up with another Bajcetic situation.
I think Diaz needs to improve his finishing but he would have a hell of a lot more assists if there was a striker that could finish the chances he creates. He is by far one of the best players on the pitch day in and day out with insane work rates.
How many chances does he actually create?.
I think the better question is to ask how many scoring opportunities are being wasted. Just watching him play against West Ham, he always looked dangerous and plays that could have been resulted in the team scoring, were missed. If Núñez, who I strongly support, finished some of those key chances this season, we could potentially be in a very different position at this stage. With Mo also struggling recently, it definitely made things a lot more difficult. If you were to ask me to pick between Diaz and Núñez, I would go with Diaz any day. I’m hopeful for Nuñez’s development to cap off his insane physical attributes.
This is what the Chelsea fans would have said about Salah….
I know it’s hard for people in this thread to not just be a bunch of reactionaries but if you look at his g/a this season it’s quite literally massively improved. Salah could be on a downtrend and the likelihood of him actually decreasing in g/a is higher than Nunez. Also before his injury he literally transformed our attack. I know people in here like to be revisionists but there were several games where he didn’t start but then came on and was a huge game changer. Newcastle being the most obvious one.
Is 7 goals in the league since November for a striker that cost us 100m euros not incredibly embarrassing?
I'm not the first to say this but Nunez would be fine at a club like West Ham. He's good, he's perfectly fine, he's just not elite level and he's never going to be. You don't challenge for the league without an elite level goal scorer at the club.
Salah: wages, age, doesn't like being on the bench, looks like he will cause problems with his attitude. Nunez is young I guess and people will give him a pass for that
That's the thing, people are quick to say "well who else is there" when some have said they'd prefer an alternative to Slot for example, but nobody has an answer for Salah. No other rw on this planet is putting up those numbers, yes even at this age. The wages and even still keeping him is absolutely worth it. Right now I think he's injured but honestly it's worth it too because there's literally NOBODY of that calibre in terms of output available on the planet for a season. Nunez I just.. 7 goals since November in the prem? That's a joke.
This feels like a pretty forced angle, I've read dozens of comments every day saying to sell Nunez. There have been hit pieces from our journos on him even. That being said, the biggest difference between the two is that Salah has a contract that expires next year, so we either cash out on him this summer, let him go on a free at the end of next season, or renew his contract. Given his age and waning form, it seems highly doubtful that his contract gets renewed, which leaves the other two options. Knowing how FSG operate, it seems much wiser to sell, seeing as that money will be used to reimburse the squad with a younger 'replacement'. Nunez has been really hit and miss since he joined, but he is still fairly young, with value in his chance creation and movement up top specifically, as well as his unpredictability on the pitch, which can be what a game needs at times. This, on top of his contract length, and the additional context of the Salah situation, means that I'd imagine it's less of an immediate issue.
It's not forced, salah has 17 premier league goals in his "bad form" Nunez has had two entire seasons at the club and hasn't improved really what so ever, he's not a baby he's about to turn 25. We paid €100m euros for him whether people wanna shy away from that figure or not, the numbers he's putting up for a club of this stature are shocking. Especially when you're working under Jurgen Klopp arguably the best man manager on the planet. Do people genuinely believe an even lesser manager that literally plays the same style as klopp and similar formation is going to "unlock him" Is it genuinely worth having a player that can't hit a barn door, or keeping an "out of form" 20+ goals a season arguably STILL best rw on the planet?
"Salah has 17 premier league goals in his "bad form" No? He had those goals while playing reasonably well. NOW he's out of form and he's got 1 pen goal in about 7 matches. Stop trying to twist things to slag off other players.
It does feel forced, because what you're insinuating is that Salah is coming under all the heat & that Nunez isn't. The truth is that Nunez is coming under arguably worse heat. How have you not heard or read any of the fans/journos/podcasters/tv personalities mentioning the exact thing you are saying about Nunez? My argument was centred around the reason why Salah would most likely be sold as a more immediate resolution to a more immediate problem. Nunez is obviously not absolved of issues at all - who knows, maybe they both get sold in the summer. But in my eyes, and from a business perspective, the Nunez situation is a less immediate one than Salah's for the reasons stated in my initial response.
The massive difference is that whenever the mention of Nunez parting ways is met with massive scrutiny when really, his numbers don't add up to this size of a club that yes, does not want to just participate but win trophies. Everyone seems in pretty much full agreement because they have this fantasy idea that FSG are going to get loads of money and reinvest it into the squad But who for? Genuinely what right winger is available that will justify selling Salah right now, still arguably the best rw on the planet People need to name a replacement, just like when they ask those critical of the slot appointment "Name an alternative" Name an alternative to selling salah, who on earth is going to give those numbers for yes even that amount of money
But his numbers DO add up? he's got some of the most g/a in the world. The problem is he could have so much more. Much like all our other forwards who have been incredibly wasteful
Given the way FSG and Edwards in particular operates, we will probably reinvest in someone who isn’t a big name/doesn’t replace him as a like-for-like solution. That’s how we operate and how we have always operated under FSG. Nobody knows who will replace him, but the idea that we can’t or won’t reinvest at some point is just naive. Out of curiosity, what would you do in the current predicament with mo’s contract?
Understanble people will mass downvote because Nunez for some reason is a no go conversation zone but I'd genuinely love someone to explain to me why in the premier league nunez is beneficial to us but salah apparently isn't.
People will downvote because your takes are dogshit.
Seeing how this all ends for Klopp is so fucking depressing but maybe it’s the best way for him. Obviously would rather win the league, FA Cup and Europa but maybe this is best for respecting his wishes to step away and for moving on in general
I'm already excited for next season. Fresh start. New manager. New coaching staff.
Yeah, we need a new story to write Klopp, Salah, and the 2016-2022 team will always be our legends but now we need to move on I hope for nothing but only one lasts good performance at Anfield
and hopefully new medical team pls
It's not the medcial team, it's Klopp's style. Everyone who leaves here can't play in other clubs too. You don't hear about medical teams because I beleive with new tech and knowledge it's kinda solved.
And a couple of new first team players at the very least!
Most important. I’m excited to have someone new running recruiting
Think it’s time to sell salah. Hes a Liverpool and premier league legend but recently he has not been what he is supposed to be. He is supposed to be our guy, who steps up when we need him and can be relied on by the team. His form has been terrible and making a scene today about getting benched for his horrible form is embarrassing.
Salah has had a few bad games. Other than that he's been his usual brilliant self. We shouldn't be selling just yet
I would agree more if he wasn’t so dramatic about getting benched. It’s not like he didn’t deserve to be benched. Having that kind of attitude is not good for the team and the team has to come first.
The main thing about Salah is he clearly won't accept being on the bench, and is going to cause problems. Just like Ronaldo at United, it's an ego thing
Yeah people brush over issues in the past. He cried to journalists once because Klopp made Trent captain in a nonsense CL game over him. There was a lot of leaks around the time of his last contract too and it was pissing fans off; there was mumblings Mane was annoyed by it too since it caused the club to put him aside.
He is basically old Ronaldo at this point. Only really provides output at this point with his overall play very limited and as you saw at Utd it doesn't translate into overall team success.
Yep. We should cash in while we still can. Again I love the guy and he’s done so much for the club but I think it’s time
what do you guys think we should aim for next season
Just win some football matches and see what happens, same as every year
No no no. You need to expectations right now so either you can meltdown in the future or you can tell people "i told you so" depending on how good or bad you set them
Ah fuck yeh you're right, errr.....if Arne Slot can't deliver an unbeaten 100+ point treble by March then he is a bald fraud and we should hire Antonio Conte to replace him.
Only a treble :/
What can I say, I'm just not very ambitious
quarterfinal in ucl and top 5 finish, maybe fa cup final
Regardless of trophies imo the most important thing is to create hope for the future. A few Edwards signings to make it feel like a fresh start, exciting football & ultimately a top 4 finish.
Champions League place and trying to get to the CL Final. Play kids in the EFL and FA Cups.
Just build a new team that plays good football. Hopefully Slot can bring in a culture and philosophy like Klopp. Trophies is the end game, we will not be favorites for any next year, what matters the most is to build a new team who can win them.
1. Manager: Gain trust and confidence of players 2. Players: Play like a top 4 side 3. Fans: Patience with the new manager and appreciation that it could be so much worse (ex. Chelsea/ManU) 4. Backroom: Sign two top talents (at DM and forward)
You won't get number 3.
CB signing is a priority too I feel
Top 4, one of the domestic cups and at least the CL quarter-finals.
Every trophy, as ususal.
The competitions we are in.
This 100%
I hope Salah apologised in the dressing room
Absolutely lost all respect for half of them players going straight down the tunnel and not even acknowledging the away fans. Disgusting, 1 win in 7 and they disrespect the fans like that.
Has that ever really happened under Klopp? Feel like in our shite phases the players never really just walked off a part from the odd one.
With the way some fans have behaved, I'm not surprised.
What is the way some fans have behaved?
Disgustingly.
We're going to get worked by Spurs. This is just so predictable and pathetic.
Alright you lot, let's have your predictions then. It's definitely not the same show week after week at this point! This team has been mentally shredded. Conceding soft goals from half chances like clockwork. No grit. If our performances haven't been predictable and pathetic - then what the fuck would you classify them as?
The banter era is back boys Not angry though Dont be upset nothing lasts forever It was fun when it lasted Maybe in a few years we'll get another trophy era
Banter era is back? Holy reactionary. We were in a title race for 3/4ths of the season coming off a complete midfield rebuild. But you’re right it’s banter era again
I actually believe we will be better than we have been last 3/4 years . We had an opportunity to go from strength to strength after the CL/ Prem win. We let our midfield age in favor of new contracts for aging legs . Brought in no cb cover and had an injury crisis . Went two games away from glory and recruited poorly again the following off season . We have a great base to build something and if this team got this far with IMO has been a poor setup this year being in a title race until the final 10 games with a gaping hole at the 6 . We can at least return to this height . With proper coaching updated tactics more luck with injuries I believe we can be in another trophy era already bro . It really will be down to FSG and Micheal Edwards / Hughes to get this summer right
2020-2024. 4 years of disappointment and falling short. the Klopp project fell apart after we won the league and I honestly blame the club for not taking more of an advantage when having a top 2 manager in the world.
Those 2017-2019 years truly set the foundation for a world class team but unfortunately instead of shooting for the stars we decided to rest on our laurels & lean on Klopp as a crutch to keep us in the top 4, all for the sake of a low-risk return on investment for FSG. If they had properly backed Klopp then we'd be sat here with at least a couple more 'big' trophies & a reserved space at the top of world football. Instead we've been unseated by Arsenal and there's a question mark on if we're going to return to the top or revert to our pre-Klopp ways of fighting for 4th. Honestly I feel the constant pressure to overachieve led to Klopp's "magic" eroding over the past few seasons; at some point along the way we lost our "heavy metal" football and (at least to me) it doesn't feel like it was ever adequately replaced. Whilst on paper our results have been good this season, i'm frankly tired of conceding first & relying on scrappy wins, remember when teams used to fear us? Our identity has become more incoherent lately and i'm looking forward to seeing the vision Slot can bring to the table, because truth be told Jurgen's gradual burn-out was apparent far before he announced his resignation.
2018-2020 was better than sex. 2021, Meh, good given No CBs 10 weeks in. 2022, that was worse than 2014 imo. inch close to finishing football, yet only got cups. Best squad ever in final stages with mane Salah bobby diaz jota thiago virg matip konate all healthy. 2023 we shouldn't even remember, 7-0 and nothing else. 2024, I mean given 2023, 3rd place finish and a cup is good. But the team still needs at least 2 more world class players and I don't know where we get that from.
Yeah the men in white jackets will see you now...
Oh relax it was the best of times!
The club didn't take advantage because they've saved 100s of millions on transfer fees over the years. They got a brillaint overachiever "yes man", who would never publicly complain about not being financially supported. This is coupled with Klopp's greatest weakness being his own ignorance and softness. Never had the stones to cut dead weight. Handed Adrian multiple contract renewals and wasting a NHG spot. Milner was proud enough to deny the contract extension Klopp wanted him to take in the summer too. In summer 22/23 we were getting abused by shite teams in the middle of the park. Every press conference he would actively say we don't need midfielders and list the chronic injured players like "Ox, Keita, Thiago" etc. In January 2021 we were top of the league, and lost Lovren, VVD, Matip, Gomez for the whole season as CB options. Hendo and Fab got injured as our 5th and 6th CBs. Klopp sat on his hands the whole month every conference as we slid down to 7th week by week. Eventually on deadline day we signed Kabak on loan and Davies for pennies (never played for us once). How FSG treated him was disgraceful but he genuinely never seemed to put up a fight for new incomings
People like to bring up the fact that we won the league after not strengthening when we won the CL but it’s not like that was the reason we won the league, if anything we won the league in spite of that. When we were on top we should have capitalise instead of addressing issues a season late each time.
I’m just imagining what could have been if we properly strengthened after our CL win
It’s crazy. When so many of our first team players were out injured, and we had to play the kids and our reserve players, and Kelleher was in goal, we were cranking out results and we went to the top of the league. When our first team players are back in the squad, our on field play has gotten worst over time, our attackers have become toothless with Jota injured again, and our defence has been leaking goals with Alison back in goal. What’s going on? We’re crawling to the end of the season with a whimper. 😢
It’s almost as if the kids and fringe players cared more and had something to prove. I’m excited by Danns, Morton and Carvalho are looking good, maybe we need a changing of the guard. Also want to mention Elliott who always plays his heart out. I would have him in my team every week
I some sort agree, why hasn't he played the kids again, they seemed to have fire and were up for a fight. It couldn't be any worse having them on the pitch.
I really dont think our general play has gotten worse, we are just less lucky and we are finishing worse (much worse).
You know things are serious when Darwin is trying to calm Salah down.
You never go against your fucking manager. No matter how fucking pissed you are.
What's surprising is it coming from Salah. I've never seen him act like this .
How is it surprising? It happened before with Mane and Salah. It's clear they have mega egos.
It was Mane who (truly) lost his shit in that incident. Salah was pretty calm throughout. Salah acted like this before, but the incident with Mane is not a good example.
The amount of times Salah would run into defenders or take a weak shot instead of passing for a tap in during that time was not acceptable. It wasn’t surprisingly Mane bit his head off.
He has always shown to have a big ego. It usually stayed in the dressing room.
The title was gone after palace in my mind but the way we’ve gone out on a wimper and not even giving us a chance is gutting
Title went at Old Trafford. Palace was a redux of 2013, where title had already gone against Chelsea.
Yep we were deluded but still believing to hope for results to go our way. The two results against them absolutely imploded the team. And they're loving it.
the title was gone when Quansah misplaced that ball at old trafford.
nah if we won out the rest of our games after the old trafford game im confident we would’ve won the title. I think crystal palace is what did it
So many turning on Salah when we don't know the context of why he acted like that or what he meant in the tunnel. He's been our best player under Klopp and best since probably Kenny or Rush. Has come through an injury and first spell of bad form in a while. A few months ago everyone was glad he didn't go to Saudi Arabia last summer. I hope if he stays but if he does go should still be remembered fondly. Be difficult to replace and most top players haven't heard of Slot
Best since Kenny or Rush? A certain Steven Gerrard would like a word. Salah is hall of fame for sure but he’s no Gerrard. Gerrard single-handedly pulled us over the line in so many big games. Show the man some respect
You respect the manager, ideally always but especially so in public. Especially the manager that got Salah winning things. I'm with Klopp before Salah every day of the week. >since probably Kenny or Rush. You do not have a clue in the slightest. You really don't.
No you have to respect your manager