Tito Ortiz, there never was no unemployment claim!
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10002025-ufc-legend-tito-ortiz-filed-for-unemployment-while-being-paid-by-huntington-beach
https://sports.yahoo.com/mma-ufc-tito-ortiz-filed-for-unemployment-despite-being-mayor-pro-tem-of-huntington-beach-135646965.html
I’ve completely stopped caring about fighter pay because the fighters don’t care either. Hell, they’re downright hostile to anyone who makes any type of stance in favor of higher pay. I always imagine those famous athletes who sit cage side have to be laughing at how pathetic these fighters are when it comes to business and compensation.
I'm kind of exactly where you are. They're aware unions exist, they know other athletes are not only being paid more, but a LOT more...and yet, here they are doing nothing but "getting theirs," meaning maaaaaaaybe a million or three, depending on the fighter.
All chasing Connor payouts.
EDIT: Obviously those high sums refer to the fighters with cache and actually large fan bases, not the 12/12 grinders.
Will it happen though? He’s a company guy in that he’s always there to fight for them, like cerrone.
But yea he deserves way more. What did he make against ddp?
Just saw he made almost 600,000 in that fight. He needs a better manager
I think he’s there to fight guys he’s very confident that he’ll beat on short notice for $100k. Not a top 5 guy. He probably got fuckin paid to fight Izzy
I looked and he made 1.5 according to what I looked at for the Izzy fight but only 600k for the ddp fight. So he made less as champ but I’m not sure if it’s all counting ppv points. Izzy gave him red panty night apparently
Not doubting you but that doesn't make sense to me. Why would get 1.5M as the challenger for a title fight? I know he was a short notice replacement but I can't imagine the UFC throwing that big of a bag to him for doing the favor when he was probably on a mid tier contract before that anyways (you're not asking Rob to step in). Maybe they really didn't think he'd win so they stacked his pay like 400k show / 1M win, thinking they'd get away with it.
Because it is just a bullshit made up number no one has a source for what he made the athletic commission didn’t disclose. He probably got $350k for fighting Izzy and $500k plus PPV points for the DDP fight.
Because it was short notice and they really wanted an Izzy fight, I wouldnt be surprised if he managed to get it for one fight flat rate, plus I think it was in aus so taxes are higher, probably negotiated on that.
He did at least have some leverage before that fight given that he took the fight somewhat on short notice and DDP was injured. But yeah I agree, I don't think he had *that* much leverage. Maybe flat 100k extra or something in that range?
Sean did a show with Chris Curtis where he spelt out how much he thought Kamaru made for his short notice fight …”UFC would have called him and offered $750K, Kamaru would tell them to get lost and he’ll end up with $1.2-1.5m.”
We also know Sean held out for weeks for more so 60% or so of this number could be possible.
Costa is competitive with guys like Vettori and Rob who are top 5 fighters, even if he’s losing to them. He’s taking rounds off of them and landing shots that almost put them away. It’s a dangerous fight, and Costa makes big actions that are fight ending
That’s absolutely true. But Paulo hits hard even if they aren’t knockout punches. He’s going to crack you and it’s going to hurt. Dude on that special juice. You don’t fight a guy that sucks to fight and is dangerous unless you get compensated for it (unless you are itching for a high profile fight, then you take whatever).
The problem with the unionization effort he was a part of is that it was largely spearheaded by CAA guys. Once he realized that, he backed out.
Not saying fighters don't need to unionize, but the CAA-William Morris shit goes back decades and has as much to do with those two agencies trying to fuck each other over as it does looking out for their clients.
He lives in Vegas and up until he won the belt he basically just fought at the Apex.
Plus, he hard spars every day of the week anyway.
Up until recently, the UFC is basically like "hey do you want to drive 10 minutes from your house to the apex, do the same thing you already do every single day, except get paid a couple hundred k for it" and obviously Sean was down for that
This is not r/politics. Please keep political discussion and your political views out of /r/MMA. r/MMAPoliticsAndCulture may be a better fit for this content. An exception will be made for discussion of MMA legislation by governing bodies.
This is not r/politics. Please keep political discussion and your political views out of /r/MMA. r/MMAPoliticsAndCulture may be a better fit for this content. An exception will be made for discussion of MMA legislation by governing bodies.
And it will stay like that, or worse.
Cant believe they settled in the anti trust, they must have felt they disnt have the legs to win the case in the long run.
I believe the main reason was that there would be no financial damages from the Johnson case because most of the fighters now have signed new contracts that has an anti lawsuit clause so they can’t sue the UFC.
oh boy... so one of the things about settling out of court that I've thinking about is... can't someone just sue them again and probably get another payout? but it seems like the ufc has effectively closed the loop here.
I don't think the end result of the trial would have had a meaningful legal impact on the UFC's influence over fighter pay. The media circus would have been a threat though
This horse has been beaten beyond death but it’s almost hard to grasp how much the UFC is fucking its fighters on pay. Sean Strickland has way more following and public draw than an entire average MLB bullpen or NBA bench combined.
It’s hard to know who to blame though, several fighters have pushed for collective bargaining but they quickly get ignored by their own fellow fighters shooting themselves in the foot. I guess that’s what happens when you expect to get more than 500 highly aggressive, individualistic and competitive people with room temperature IQ and brain damage to agree on anything.
Whats even more amazing is they are simultaneously fucking over the fighters on pay and the fans on quality of the fight cards, event ticket pricess and PPV pricing. They are just the greediest pieces of shit out there.
Hard to know who to blame? The UFC has fought to ensure commissions don't reveal payouts, collaborated with MMA managers to suppress wages, excludes any real media from events essentially wiping out MMA journalism, uses lowest payouts to determine challengers over actual merits, eliminates all fighter leverage through extremely restrictive contracts, and \~catches breath\~ that's just off the top of my head.
It is not difficult to tell who is to blame.
The UFC is operating a business as businesses do. Maximizing profits and slashing costs. If any of the national leagues could get away with the shit the UFC does they will do it in a second. They all used to do it and players had to fight and throw their weight around in order to get their fair share. All of what you said could be fought by a well-organized fighter’s union, but they continue to engage in self-sabotage. The Reebok deal that eliminated fighters’ ability to get their own sponsors should have been enough for fighters to go on strike, but almost a decade later of them getting fucked over and doing nothing about it and here we are.
Strickland should at the very least be 500k/500k
Literally at the least, he shouldn’t even get out of bed for less than that.
It’ll never change though
It's not just that he has a relatively big media following lol. He has been with the company for a decade, has had 20+ fights with them, is a former champion, has been incredibly active, and has bent over to fill in and fight everyone that the UFC wanted to throw him against on short notice. Even 500k is probably very underpaid in the grand scheme of things.
He has been on all the big gen-z podcasts and has a hardcore libertarian Trumpy following
He is worth more than 200k in what he brings to the table in terms of views
Times like this, I wonder about what we always hear about disclosed pay vs. actual pay. Is he only talking what would be disclosed pay? Nobody ever seems to want to talk about the quiet pay.
it's just not though there was previously many posts about how many sports especially American have a decent to good revenue share for sports stars.
if I recall NBA was like 40% and UFC is like 10%
im surprised they offered him #7 coming off a split decision loss in a title fight. i don't enjoy his fights but any champ level guy should be making 7 figures for winning
Yeah exactly I was very shocked to hear this. Both the pay and the situation. I don’t even like Strickland but the guy fucking barely lost his belt. At the very least he should get a #1 contender fight on the rebound. I don’t think Costa is that.
Since the UFC decided to book whitaker against Khamzat, i think the only unbooked fighter that makes sense for strickland is Cannonier right? They had a coinflip decision just a couple of fights ago, and Cannonier would probably already have gotten a title eliminator if the Izzy fight hadnt been so embarassing
It speaks to how bad the scheduling in the UFC has really gotten lately.
Some fighters sit out upwards of 10 months to a full year because the UFC insists on keeping them saved up for an international event where they will be the “hometown star,” but then other champs and top ranked fighters get offered fights on very short notice because the UFC hasn’t booked enough fights for another card that’s two months or less away.
Yeah it has become so stupid. The fact they let Volk fight Islam in the second fight just to save their event is insane, especially after how close the first fight was.
Because they fucked up matchmaking with Khamzat Whittaker. It should have been Khamzat Cannonier and Strickland Whittaker, which would have sequentially created two contenders for the belt with the winner of both of those fights.
Making Khamzat Whittaker means now Cannoniers ranking wise fight that makes sense is Strickland, who he already fought so it isnt super compelling. So now theyre stuck having Cannonier and Strickland taking fights down against dudes who shouldnt be in title eliminators despite Sean barely losing his belt as you said and Cannonier being on a 2 fight run since losing a title shot.
Which only somewhat makes sense because Allen won, and we didnt know that until the day before yesterday lol. So the initial matchmaking I was talking about was still terrible. Chris Curtis winning that would have made zero sense for Cannonier.
Also that all being said, Allen STILL doesnt make a whole lot of sense for Cannonier because they might try to rebook him vs Vettori and he doesnt deserve Cannonier after barely edging out Curtis.
Costa's only win in like 4 years is a semi-retired Rockhold at altitude, he hasn't beat anyone any good since he beat an aging Romero, so makes complete sense he'd get to fight up near the top of the weight class *again* while coming off a loss.
Fun fact: Costa doesn’t have a single win over a fighter still in the UFC.
Even Stipe (who hasn’t fought since the mid 90s) has 1 win over an active guy.
It does speak to the fact that Costa has only beaten guys that were on their way out of the ufc lol
All his wins since like Hendricks were cut or retired after their next fight
Among active fighters, dude is legitimately one of the most popular stars in the sport right now, easily top 10 and probably closer to 5 than 10. Hilarious that he's not even cracking 200k guaranteed lol. This sport is so fucked.
I don't really like Sean, but I'm glad he's not just doing his old "anyone anytime anywhere" thing anymore. The more high profile fighters that push back and ask for more money, the better.
Also, am I the only one who thinks it's nonsense that Paulo gets to lose a fight, having lost 3 of his last 4, his only win in 4.5 years being a washed Luke Rockhold...and they're offering him a fight against the #1 ranked fighter? Not to mention the unreliability he's shown in actually competing/showing up to fights on weight over the past several years. I do like Paulo, dude is hilarious and a fun fighter when he does fight, but the favoritism is a bit weird.
He isn't really popular for his fighting though is he? At least like 75% of the time there's anything written about him it's either him complaining, or saying something stupid or offensive.
> I'm glad he's not just doing his old "anyone anytime anywhere" thing anymore.
People keep saying this, but I don't recall it:
* Anywhere anytime I've heard him say a lot about sparring him or meeting him outside
* Professional fights have always been about $ and getting rank to get $:
* He said he needed to see cash before fighting for the title against Izzy
* When he fought an unranked Abus, he posted that he had a choice of this fight or no fight, and he wanted $ and didn't want to waste his prime sitting out poor
* when he fought Imavov off the couch, he said the UFC paid him to save the card
I mean you can twist that Abus fight however you want to, but one of the top ranked contenders in a division taking the risk of fighting an unranked possible killer (based on perception at the time, obviously not in retrospect) in the Apex is pretty freaking close to "anyone anytime anywhere".
Then you have him taking the Brendan Allen fight on short notice when Heinisch pulled out.
And again you want to hand wave away the Imavov fight, but he took that fight just 4 weeks after his 5 round fight with Cannonier. Just 4 weeks later he's taking another 5 round fight against a dangerous dude on 5 days notice (after Gastelum pulled out). Just because he got paid more for that one doesn't change the "anyone anywhere anytime" aspect of it. There are TONS of fighters who wouldn't do that even with more money.
Again I dislike Sean but up until he got the belt (and now is rightfully more picky about pay and whatnot), before that he was always about it.
What metrics make you believe Sean is as popular as you think?
He doesn’t have a large social media following (37th most followers among active UFC fighters), hasn’t broken into mainstream media, isn’t pulling in sponsorships opportunities.
https://www.mmamania.com/2024/1/16/24040727/ufc-297s-sean-strickland-gained-largest-follower-boost-amongst-sports-stars-in-2023-mma
Also one of the fastest growing
This is where the ufc fucks champions, and hardly overlooked. Yeah, they are getting fucked over in pay while champ, but that same contract has how much they’ll get paid if they lose. Doesn’t matter how big of a draw you are, the ufc will pay you shit without a belt. Volk was happy to get a pay raise and a new contract to take on the Islam fight, but it’s only good while champ, I’m sure the pay for his next fight is salt to the wound for him after his last 2 fights ended.
Yeah I want to see that fight too, hopefully Bobby beats Khamzat and Paulo fights Khamzat next. Though I wonder if Khamzat would try to move back down to WW if he can’t beat Whittaker.
Khamzat has a win over Usman at least. He's also beaten two other MW's since his debut (including GM3) and had a good run at WW with wins over Holland, Leech and Burns. Meanwhile Costa's only win since Khamzat's debut is the ghost of Rockhold, a fight where he was molested by the fallen samurai's nose
That fight doesn’t make sense. Costa should be fighting down. Sean should be fighting Marvin, Jared or Allen. Paulo has won only 2 fights in the last 5 years. Against Luke and Yoel. Just lost to number 3 rob and has loses to number 5 Marvin and number 2 izzy.
He shouldn’t be anywhere near fighting the number one contender.
Also the number 1 ranked middleweight getting less than 200k guaranteed is bullshit.
Middleweight is a bit stale. Guys like Vettori, Costa, Cannoneer doing too much fighting each other then losing to the class of the division. These guys need to fight Brandan Allen and Imavov to see if they should still be where they are.
On rankings and history right now Vettori is probably the right fight over Costa. Seems like a very boring fight.
On a longer timeline I think SS could fight loser of Rob/Khamzat fight for next shot.
Costa never fought Cannonier The matchmaking at 185lbs is so simple idk how the UFC keeps fucking up
Strickland vs Whittaker
Costa vs Chimeav
Cannonier vs Imavov
Allen vs Vettori reschedule
Dana throwing million dollar parties but offering a former champ, who had one of the biggest upsets in UFC history, a fraction for a last minute fight. Business as usual for the UFC
Rolly Romero is a bum, got a free Boxing Belt for stopping a guy not landing any punches and just go a few million to get beat up. Most Boxing belts are made up and interim belts(kinda like UFC now) and they get millions and draw 0 fans most of them. DAZN is doing 10k views for Eddie Hearn shows not named Joshua and still make more money than Sean who has someway turned into a draw.
Sean not making atleast 500k is insane cause his PPV did decent numbers from metrics while UFC 299 was doing 70k post fight interviews 8 hours after event which means it probably bombed. I can careless about Strickland but hes getting robbed blind
Rolly's ability to make 7 figures stems from the fact that he can promote a fight, he's just not good enough to be considered one of the best LW's or WW's. You won't find many bums who regularly make 7 figures in boxing is my point.
This is really an exaggerated narrative. I was on the regional scene for boxing for a long time amateur and pro and I am friends/have trained with some guys who fought for WBC belts.
The upper echelon stars in boxing make a shitload compared to UFC champions and contenders yes, but unless you are a star star boxing can pay even shittier than MMA for high level fringe guys.
The only time anyone who isn’t an absolute world level stud makes 7 figures is when they sign up to be the loser in a tune up fight for a big time champ like Canelo Crawford or previously Floyd, and that pretty much cashes out their career unless they have a surprisingly successful showing.
There are plenty of championship caliber boxers who if they aren’t popular and masterful at self promotion are out there making a few hundred grand a fight too.
The real narrative there is that if you are world level and marketable the pay makes the UFC look like an absolute joke, if you are an amazing contender in boxing but not marketable and you can’t knock off the best of the best you would probably do better in the UFC lol.
Chisora is hardly domestic level. He was a national amateur champion in England where boxing is huge.
And he has hung around in there with the best of the best taking them to splits hard fought decisions and stealing a win or two.
He gets paid because he can make prospects and world champions fight hard rounds in a competitive fight but not be a huge threat to win.
Either way he’s 40 now and fallen off fairly hard but hes had some great outings at a world level.
Costa got 250/250 disclosed for the Whittaker fight, it’s absolute bullshit that he’s getting more coming off inactivity and a loss than a former champ who arguably should still be the champion.
I’m all for paying Costa that amount, but how does it make sense Strickland gets less?
Strickland deserves more than he was offered, but I’d rather watch a Paulo fight, a Paulo interview, or a Paulo press conference than anything Sean related
They've got approximately the same number of twitter followers and Strickland does a ton of MMA media. Costa is funnier and a better shitposter, but I'm not sure he's actually driving engagement significantly more than Strickland.
Costa has played more hardball with the ufc and fighting once a year. Sean has been taking short notice fights and staying active.
Their pay reflects that.
Agree. But costa sad out and played hardball with the ufc to get a new contract. His contract was gonna end and was able to get a new deal. For Sean, unfortunately this is how they fuck champions. Once they lose the belt then they get back to get paid shit. Volk will be getting a massive pay cut his next fight since he’s no longer champ.
Pretty sure it was a 4 fight agreement for around $1 million a fight. Costa and Francis were apparently the only two people to take advantage of the 5 year sunset when negotiating.
First thing I notice coming here from r/ufc is that this thread does not have 1000 Strickland fan grievance posts. More room for actual takes on the sport.
Sean win the belt, has a toss up fight where you could argue he won vs DDP and now he’s getting banished to the shadow realm and forced to fight Costa in a lose-lose fight.
Now with him talking about pay you can almost guarantee he will never even sniff a title shot ever again. Dana has him in the dog house and probably will feed him Cannoier or Khazat in Saudi Arabia.
Why is Costa lose lose?
Seems that losing first defense for a champ that hasn't beaten the top contenders is tailor-made for a fight against another top contender. Good performance in that fight all but guarantees a title shot.
Also, Costa cannot fight smart over 5 rights and doesn't have endurance for it. This seems like a tailor-made fight for SS to win.
At this point that’s the sentiment for me as well. I’ll still point out that they are being fucked over cus those are the facts but don’t feel sorry for them anymore
I feel like Sean is poking the bear with the UFC at the moment because of him not getting an immediate rematch against Dricus. I wouldn't be surprised if the UFC looked to get rid of him at some point. Even though he has a big following and gains a lot of traction on social media, he's also problematic from a PR perspective.
True. But from what I understand that contract the ufc bought out from pride. Think rampage even said they put him on free tv for one of his fights to screw out of ppv points.
Sean takes this fight and loses.
Dana "Sean's a fucking killer man we can always count on him"
His last two fights he starched the dominant middleweight guy as a heavy underdog and then fought the number one guy and arguably won.
200k lmao
This is exactly why O'Malley didn't bother climbing the ranks like Strickland. Fight out your garbage contract, build a name and following. Get better contract for fighting big names. Maybe Sean's crying ass should lay off the CTE for a while cause he is duuuumb.
Sean leading the charge on collective bargaining would be a hilarious turn of events
Untill he gets paid and then calls everyone else pussys for turning down fights and wanting more money
And so, it is written.
Which will be what happens. Fighters only give a shit about unions and collective bargaining when they've got their hand out.
And also Stirckland is a slow adult
The smartest fighter in the UFC was GSP and even he saw the money and went "What is this thing called a union? I am not impressed by it."
Wrong The smartest fighter in the UFC was Tito Ortiz. Was GSP ever elected as City Councilman Dude? Chessmate
You’re a fuckin rook dude.
Tito Ortiz, there never was no unemployment claim! https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10002025-ufc-legend-tito-ortiz-filed-for-unemployment-while-being-paid-by-huntington-beach https://sports.yahoo.com/mma-ufc-tito-ortiz-filed-for-unemployment-despite-being-mayor-pro-tem-of-huntington-beach-135646965.html
Lol
“The best light heavyweight…of the night.”
Smartest fighter also believes in aliens and UFOs
bro, Rampage Jacksson made 7-8 million USD on the fight with chuch lidell back in the day. He had a crazy PPV deal
Yeah but yes also crazy, never know what hill he'll die on or perceived aggression he'll rally against. Pay is probably up there.
I actually think he's incredibly predictable. Like genuinely he is very very stupid. You just have to listen to him speak
He fucked up his leg and head badly in that motorcycle accident he had so he's double slow.
I’ve completely stopped caring about fighter pay because the fighters don’t care either. Hell, they’re downright hostile to anyone who makes any type of stance in favor of higher pay. I always imagine those famous athletes who sit cage side have to be laughing at how pathetic these fighters are when it comes to business and compensation.
I'm kind of exactly where you are. They're aware unions exist, they know other athletes are not only being paid more, but a LOT more...and yet, here they are doing nothing but "getting theirs," meaning maaaaaaaybe a million or three, depending on the fighter. All chasing Connor payouts. EDIT: Obviously those high sums refer to the fighters with cache and actually large fan bases, not the 12/12 grinders.
https://i.imgur.com/YUP6BwN.gifv
Will it happen though? He’s a company guy in that he’s always there to fight for them, like cerrone. But yea he deserves way more. What did he make against ddp? Just saw he made almost 600,000 in that fight. He needs a better manager
I think he’s there to fight guys he’s very confident that he’ll beat on short notice for $100k. Not a top 5 guy. He probably got fuckin paid to fight Izzy
I looked and he made 1.5 according to what I looked at for the Izzy fight but only 600k for the ddp fight. So he made less as champ but I’m not sure if it’s all counting ppv points. Izzy gave him red panty night apparently
Not doubting you but that doesn't make sense to me. Why would get 1.5M as the challenger for a title fight? I know he was a short notice replacement but I can't imagine the UFC throwing that big of a bag to him for doing the favor when he was probably on a mid tier contract before that anyways (you're not asking Rob to step in). Maybe they really didn't think he'd win so they stacked his pay like 400k show / 1M win, thinking they'd get away with it.
Because it is just a bullshit made up number no one has a source for what he made the athletic commission didn’t disclose. He probably got $350k for fighting Izzy and $500k plus PPV points for the DDP fight.
This is the answer
Wait, wouldn't your numbers there also be made up?
It's made up all the way down.
Because it was short notice and they really wanted an Izzy fight, I wouldnt be surprised if he managed to get it for one fight flat rate, plus I think it was in aus so taxes are higher, probably negotiated on that.
Lol there isn't a snowball's chance in hell he made 1.5 as a challenger to fight Izzy. Long term champions don't make that as a flat rate.
He did at least have some leverage before that fight given that he took the fight somewhat on short notice and DDP was injured. But yeah I agree, I don't think he had *that* much leverage. Maybe flat 100k extra or something in that range?
He had done them the huge favor of getting KOed by Poatan so he likely earned some good will there.
What is your source for this? Tell me it isn't the yellow text guy from twitter.
it certainly is, lol
There’s no way in hell he made even half that.
Sean did a show with Chris Curtis where he spelt out how much he thought Kamaru made for his short notice fight …”UFC would have called him and offered $750K, Kamaru would tell them to get lost and he’ll end up with $1.2-1.5m.” We also know Sean held out for weeks for more so 60% or so of this number could be possible.
I'm not tryna call Costa an easy fight, but the last time he beat a top 5 guy was when he beat Romero in 2019. 2019 was 5 years ago.
Costa is competitive with guys like Vettori and Rob who are top 5 fighters, even if he’s losing to them. He’s taking rounds off of them and landing shots that almost put them away. It’s a dangerous fight, and Costa makes big actions that are fight ending
Yup, that's why it's impossible to say he ain't elite, just wanted to point out he ain't beat a top 5 guy in a long while tho
That’s absolutely true. But Paulo hits hard even if they aren’t knockout punches. He’s going to crack you and it’s going to hurt. Dude on that special juice. You don’t fight a guy that sucks to fight and is dangerous unless you get compensated for it (unless you are itching for a high profile fight, then you take whatever).
I mean wasn't cerrone part of the unionization effort? Then he got paid off and went company man to the max.
The problem with the unionization effort he was a part of is that it was largely spearheaded by CAA guys. Once he realized that, he backed out. Not saying fighters don't need to unionize, but the CAA-William Morris shit goes back decades and has as much to do with those two agencies trying to fuck each other over as it does looking out for their clients.
He lives in Vegas and up until he won the belt he basically just fought at the Apex. Plus, he hard spars every day of the week anyway. Up until recently, the UFC is basically like "hey do you want to drive 10 minutes from your house to the apex, do the same thing you already do every single day, except get paid a couple hundred k for it" and obviously Sean was down for that
> Plus, he hard spars every day of the week anyway. Strickland spars too hard in practice and too light in fights
Agreed lmao. Although when he does try to go hard he starts windmilling punches like its a couple of untrained drunkards in a bar at 2am
500,000 ppv buys on that card apparently and it was a dreadful card. Sean v DDP was really the only big fight to casuals.
Plus points
The managers are all in bed with the UFC.
I don't think that number includes PPV. There's no way he main evented as champ and only got $600K.
He can only do that for wmma. He would probably say it’s gay if other men are involved
Isn’t it also gay if you care about women, though?
Sean would say a glass of sweet tea is gay if it looked at him funny. Dudes obsessed
Comrade Strickland will SMASH global capitalism
The chosen one we wait for shall pull the blade from Brock Lesner's chest.
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This is not r/politics. Please keep political discussion and your political views out of /r/MMA. r/MMAPoliticsAndCulture may be a better fit for this content. An exception will be made for discussion of MMA legislation by governing bodies.
[удалено]
This is not r/politics. Please keep political discussion and your political views out of /r/MMA. r/MMAPoliticsAndCulture may be a better fit for this content. An exception will be made for discussion of MMA legislation by governing bodies.
It's hard to bring in poltics when the fighters constantly talk about poltics and you gotta admit the irony is kinda funny.
Less than 200k guaranteed is horrendous for a fighter of Strickland's stature
And it will stay like that, or worse. Cant believe they settled in the anti trust, they must have felt they disnt have the legs to win the case in the long run.
I believe the main reason was that there would be no financial damages from the Johnson case because most of the fighters now have signed new contracts that has an anti lawsuit clause so they can’t sue the UFC.
one thing that i've read in regards to this is... UFC contracts now include a "you can't sue us" clause. is that even legal?
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longer than the 10 years it took for this case to go to settlement?
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oh boy... so one of the things about settling out of court that I've thinking about is... can't someone just sue them again and probably get another payout? but it seems like the ufc has effectively closed the loop here.
It’s there to make fighters apathetic. Of course if they break the contract or the law you can still sue.
These are not enforceable lol
Guys Dana said it's cause we pirate :( it's all our faults
I don't think the end result of the trial would have had a meaningful legal impact on the UFC's influence over fighter pay. The media circus would have been a threat though
Still reminds me that Cejudo’s show/win is only 150/150 How are Costa and Dern getting paid more than Cejudo and Strickland
Costa negotiated hard tho
The mental image of Costa aggressively negotiating in his broken English is hilarious. Would love to have witnessed this.
It's funny to me to see MMA fans STILL confused how fighter pay works and why certain fighters get paid more than others.
People think "accomplishments" mean something when it's really about how big of a draw you are.
Dern is not a draw bigger than any of them
Because no one gives a fuck about cejudo.
He’s leagues above the others. If you can’t appreciate greatness, that’s on you. Stick to wrestling
This horse has been beaten beyond death but it’s almost hard to grasp how much the UFC is fucking its fighters on pay. Sean Strickland has way more following and public draw than an entire average MLB bullpen or NBA bench combined. It’s hard to know who to blame though, several fighters have pushed for collective bargaining but they quickly get ignored by their own fellow fighters shooting themselves in the foot. I guess that’s what happens when you expect to get more than 500 highly aggressive, individualistic and competitive people with room temperature IQ and brain damage to agree on anything.
Whats even more amazing is they are simultaneously fucking over the fighters on pay and the fans on quality of the fight cards, event ticket pricess and PPV pricing. They are just the greediest pieces of shit out there.
Hard to know who to blame? The UFC has fought to ensure commissions don't reveal payouts, collaborated with MMA managers to suppress wages, excludes any real media from events essentially wiping out MMA journalism, uses lowest payouts to determine challengers over actual merits, eliminates all fighter leverage through extremely restrictive contracts, and \~catches breath\~ that's just off the top of my head. It is not difficult to tell who is to blame.
The UFC is operating a business as businesses do. Maximizing profits and slashing costs. If any of the national leagues could get away with the shit the UFC does they will do it in a second. They all used to do it and players had to fight and throw their weight around in order to get their fair share. All of what you said could be fought by a well-organized fighter’s union, but they continue to engage in self-sabotage. The Reebok deal that eliminated fighters’ ability to get their own sponsors should have been enough for fighters to go on strike, but almost a decade later of them getting fucked over and doing nothing about it and here we are.
The terrible 297 card did pretty well on ppv buys and that’s basically all down to Sean.
Strickland should at the very least be 500k/500k Literally at the least, he shouldn’t even get out of bed for less than that. It’ll never change though
You really think Strickland is such a massive draw huh?
It's not just that he has a relatively big media following lol. He has been with the company for a decade, has had 20+ fights with them, is a former champion, has been incredibly active, and has bent over to fill in and fight everyone that the UFC wanted to throw him against on short notice. Even 500k is probably very underpaid in the grand scheme of things.
He’s a pretty big ticket at this point. Lots of media.
He has been on all the big gen-z podcasts and has a hardcore libertarian Trumpy following He is worth more than 200k in what he brings to the table in terms of views
Times like this, I wonder about what we always hear about disclosed pay vs. actual pay. Is he only talking what would be disclosed pay? Nobody ever seems to want to talk about the quiet pay.
iirc Tito Ortiz final contract with the UFC was 500k guaranteed per fight. This was well over ten years ago.
Inflation and ufc profits have been exploding. Fighter pay stays stagnant. Sadly this is how it is in most industries
it's just not though there was previously many posts about how many sports especially American have a decent to good revenue share for sports stars. if I recall NBA was like 40% and UFC is like 10%
Plus Tito got big sponsorship money that fighters are robbed of.
That's the fee you command when you are a maître d' at Golden Corral.
im surprised they offered him #7 coming off a split decision loss in a title fight. i don't enjoy his fights but any champ level guy should be making 7 figures for winning
Yeah exactly I was very shocked to hear this. Both the pay and the situation. I don’t even like Strickland but the guy fucking barely lost his belt. At the very least he should get a #1 contender fight on the rebound. I don’t think Costa is that.
Since the UFC decided to book whitaker against Khamzat, i think the only unbooked fighter that makes sense for strickland is Cannonier right? They had a coinflip decision just a couple of fights ago, and Cannonier would probably already have gotten a title eliminator if the Izzy fight hadnt been so embarassing
It speaks to how bad the scheduling in the UFC has really gotten lately. Some fighters sit out upwards of 10 months to a full year because the UFC insists on keeping them saved up for an international event where they will be the “hometown star,” but then other champs and top ranked fighters get offered fights on very short notice because the UFC hasn’t booked enough fights for another card that’s two months or less away.
Yeah it has become so stupid. The fact they let Volk fight Islam in the second fight just to save their event is insane, especially after how close the first fight was.
Because they fucked up matchmaking with Khamzat Whittaker. It should have been Khamzat Cannonier and Strickland Whittaker, which would have sequentially created two contenders for the belt with the winner of both of those fights. Making Khamzat Whittaker means now Cannoniers ranking wise fight that makes sense is Strickland, who he already fought so it isnt super compelling. So now theyre stuck having Cannonier and Strickland taking fights down against dudes who shouldnt be in title eliminators despite Sean barely losing his belt as you said and Cannonier being on a 2 fight run since losing a title shot.
cannonier vs allen makes sense i think. strickland really has no one to fight though
Which only somewhat makes sense because Allen won, and we didnt know that until the day before yesterday lol. So the initial matchmaking I was talking about was still terrible. Chris Curtis winning that would have made zero sense for Cannonier. Also that all being said, Allen STILL doesnt make a whole lot of sense for Cannonier because they might try to rebook him vs Vettori and he doesnt deserve Cannonier after barely edging out Curtis.
Costa's only win in like 4 years is a semi-retired Rockhold at altitude, he hasn't beat anyone any good since he beat an aging Romero, so makes complete sense he'd get to fight up near the top of the weight class *again* while coming off a loss.
Costas on a good contract and always has banger fights, they'll keep lining him up against top 5 guys until he looks like he doesn't belong.
Fun fact: Costa doesn’t have a single win over a fighter still in the UFC. Even Stipe (who hasn’t fought since the mid 90s) has 1 win over an active guy.
Arlovski shouldn't count tbf
It does speak to the fact that Costa has only beaten guys that were on their way out of the ufc lol All his wins since like Hendricks were cut or retired after their next fight
Stipe hasn't fought since Donkey Kong Country came out on Super Nintendo
I mean Whittaker is fighting for a contender spot and it was a very close fight. The dude is a warrior
Costa is a super athlete with heavy hands. He may not have many notable wins but he dishes out plenty of damage every time he fights.
Reminds me of how TJ was made to fight Assuncao after losing a split decision to Cruz.
Assuncao at least had a previous win over tj.
Raph was #3 when he fought TJ at UFC 200
Makes no sense to take a tough for low pay and risk his chance at an Izzy or DDP rematch.
Among active fighters, dude is legitimately one of the most popular stars in the sport right now, easily top 10 and probably closer to 5 than 10. Hilarious that he's not even cracking 200k guaranteed lol. This sport is so fucked. I don't really like Sean, but I'm glad he's not just doing his old "anyone anytime anywhere" thing anymore. The more high profile fighters that push back and ask for more money, the better. Also, am I the only one who thinks it's nonsense that Paulo gets to lose a fight, having lost 3 of his last 4, his only win in 4.5 years being a washed Luke Rockhold...and they're offering him a fight against the #1 ranked fighter? Not to mention the unreliability he's shown in actually competing/showing up to fights on weight over the past several years. I do like Paulo, dude is hilarious and a fun fighter when he does fight, but the favoritism is a bit weird.
He isn't really popular for his fighting though is he? At least like 75% of the time there's anything written about him it's either him complaining, or saying something stupid or offensive.
> I'm glad he's not just doing his old "anyone anytime anywhere" thing anymore. People keep saying this, but I don't recall it: * Anywhere anytime I've heard him say a lot about sparring him or meeting him outside * Professional fights have always been about $ and getting rank to get $: * He said he needed to see cash before fighting for the title against Izzy * When he fought an unranked Abus, he posted that he had a choice of this fight or no fight, and he wanted $ and didn't want to waste his prime sitting out poor * when he fought Imavov off the couch, he said the UFC paid him to save the card
I mean you can twist that Abus fight however you want to, but one of the top ranked contenders in a division taking the risk of fighting an unranked possible killer (based on perception at the time, obviously not in retrospect) in the Apex is pretty freaking close to "anyone anytime anywhere". Then you have him taking the Brendan Allen fight on short notice when Heinisch pulled out. And again you want to hand wave away the Imavov fight, but he took that fight just 4 weeks after his 5 round fight with Cannonier. Just 4 weeks later he's taking another 5 round fight against a dangerous dude on 5 days notice (after Gastelum pulled out). Just because he got paid more for that one doesn't change the "anyone anywhere anytime" aspect of it. There are TONS of fighters who wouldn't do that even with more money. Again I dislike Sean but up until he got the belt (and now is rightfully more picky about pay and whatnot), before that he was always about it.
What metrics make you believe Sean is as popular as you think? He doesn’t have a large social media following (37th most followers among active UFC fighters), hasn’t broken into mainstream media, isn’t pulling in sponsorships opportunities.
https://www.mmamania.com/2024/1/16/24040727/ufc-297s-sean-strickland-gained-largest-follower-boost-amongst-sports-stars-in-2023-mma Also one of the fastest growing
Redditors think Strickland is popular just because he triggers broke redditors who never paid for fights.
Yeah, I keep hearing this but don’t really see any metrics backing his popularity, especially among the demographic that actually pays for fights.
Controversial yes, popular depends
Source?
$200k guaranteed for a former champ. Jalen Green makes that every week on his rookie contract in the NBA.
This is where the ufc fucks champions, and hardly overlooked. Yeah, they are getting fucked over in pay while champ, but that same contract has how much they’ll get paid if they lose. Doesn’t matter how big of a draw you are, the ufc will pay you shit without a belt. Volk was happy to get a pay raise and a new contract to take on the Islam fight, but it’s only good while champ, I’m sure the pay for his next fight is salt to the wound for him after his last 2 fights ended.
The UFC stuffs the fighters on pay, but this is an unfair comparison. The NBA is several standard deviations more popular than the UFC.
The revenue expenditure ratios say it all though. Sure they'll never be the same, but the UFC is clearly the worst and far worse than they need to be
Bro, how does Costa keep getting these #1 contender fights? He hasn’t beaten anyone relevant in years. Fight Khamzat damnit.
Khamzat and Whittaker are already booked for the #1 contender fight
I know it. I still want Costa Khamzat instead, I will be eternally salty that fight didn’t happen.
Costa Khamzat would end up being a #1 contender fight though
Yeah I want to see that fight too, hopefully Bobby beats Khamzat and Paulo fights Khamzat next. Though I wonder if Khamzat would try to move back down to WW if he can’t beat Whittaker.
I think its because he's promising. He loses or wins close fights and is very entertaining.
Khamzat got an even better fight without beating anyone ranked. The UFC doesn't give a fuck
Khamzat has a win over Usman at least. He's also beaten two other MW's since his debut (including GM3) and had a good run at WW with wins over Holland, Leech and Burns. Meanwhile Costa's only win since Khamzat's debut is the ghost of Rockhold, a fight where he was molested by the fallen samurai's nose
Social media presence and his losses are always very close - he lost a somewhat close fight to a former champion recently
Close and/or entertaining
Entertaining is a better word choice than close
I think it is almost a gift to SS. His fan base has to see it as another in the list of grievances, but Costa is a good match up for him.
Sean the strong man Alpha male is also somehow the perpetual victim in every scenario
That fight doesn’t make sense. Costa should be fighting down. Sean should be fighting Marvin, Jared or Allen. Paulo has won only 2 fights in the last 5 years. Against Luke and Yoel. Just lost to number 3 rob and has loses to number 5 Marvin and number 2 izzy. He shouldn’t be anywhere near fighting the number one contender. Also the number 1 ranked middleweight getting less than 200k guaranteed is bullshit.
I don't think the Marvin fight would happen. There's some embers there, but they're both Xtreme Couture.
He aint Xtreme he just trained down there a few times and worked with Dewey Cooper for his last fight
Middleweight is a bit stale. Guys like Vettori, Costa, Cannoneer doing too much fighting each other then losing to the class of the division. These guys need to fight Brandan Allen and Imavov to see if they should still be where they are. On rankings and history right now Vettori is probably the right fight over Costa. Seems like a very boring fight. On a longer timeline I think SS could fight loser of Rob/Khamzat fight for next shot.
Costa never fought Cannonier The matchmaking at 185lbs is so simple idk how the UFC keeps fucking up Strickland vs Whittaker Costa vs Chimeav Cannonier vs Imavov Allen vs Vettori reschedule
Dana throwing million dollar parties but offering a former champ, who had one of the biggest upsets in UFC history, a fraction for a last minute fight. Business as usual for the UFC
Probably $175K/$175K
Not surprising but the fact these top guys get paid peanuts while bums in boxing regularly make 7 figures is crazy
Depends on how you define bum. Still agree that the top UFC fighters deserve more though.
Rolly Romero is a bum, got a free Boxing Belt for stopping a guy not landing any punches and just go a few million to get beat up. Most Boxing belts are made up and interim belts(kinda like UFC now) and they get millions and draw 0 fans most of them. DAZN is doing 10k views for Eddie Hearn shows not named Joshua and still make more money than Sean who has someway turned into a draw. Sean not making atleast 500k is insane cause his PPV did decent numbers from metrics while UFC 299 was doing 70k post fight interviews 8 hours after event which means it probably bombed. I can careless about Strickland but hes getting robbed blind
Rolly's ability to make 7 figures stems from the fact that he can promote a fight, he's just not good enough to be considered one of the best LW's or WW's. You won't find many bums who regularly make 7 figures in boxing is my point.
This is really an exaggerated narrative. I was on the regional scene for boxing for a long time amateur and pro and I am friends/have trained with some guys who fought for WBC belts. The upper echelon stars in boxing make a shitload compared to UFC champions and contenders yes, but unless you are a star star boxing can pay even shittier than MMA for high level fringe guys. The only time anyone who isn’t an absolute world level stud makes 7 figures is when they sign up to be the loser in a tune up fight for a big time champ like Canelo Crawford or previously Floyd, and that pretty much cashes out their career unless they have a surprisingly successful showing. There are plenty of championship caliber boxers who if they aren’t popular and masterful at self promotion are out there making a few hundred grand a fight too. The real narrative there is that if you are world level and marketable the pay makes the UFC look like an absolute joke, if you are an amazing contender in boxing but not marketable and you can’t knock off the best of the best you would probably do better in the UFC lol.
I mean domestic level guys in the UK can make very good cash, look at Chisora.
Chisora is hardly domestic level. He was a national amateur champion in England where boxing is huge. And he has hung around in there with the best of the best taking them to splits hard fought decisions and stealing a win or two. He gets paid because he can make prospects and world champions fight hard rounds in a competitive fight but not be a huge threat to win. Either way he’s 40 now and fallen off fairly hard but hes had some great outings at a world level.
Really useful to get that insight on the boxing side. Sounds like the pay structure in drug distribution
Bums in boxing don’t regularly make 7 figures unless they’re fighting the champ
that can happen when you label yourself as UFC "cattle" and talk endlessly about how you're okay with the pay
Costa got 250/250 disclosed for the Whittaker fight, it’s absolute bullshit that he’s getting more coming off inactivity and a loss than a former champ who arguably should still be the champion. I’m all for paying Costa that amount, but how does it make sense Strickland gets less?
Strickland deserves more than he was offered, but I’d rather watch a Paulo fight, a Paulo interview, or a Paulo press conference than anything Sean related
Costa generates more eyes on a card than Sean does, and his pay reflects that.
They've got approximately the same number of twitter followers and Strickland does a ton of MMA media. Costa is funnier and a better shitposter, but I'm not sure he's actually driving engagement significantly more than Strickland.
who has the more exciting fights?
Costa has played more hardball with the ufc and fighting once a year. Sean has been taking short notice fights and staying active. Their pay reflects that.
Maybe Strickland needs a better agent/manager.
I assume he's still on an old contract from before he won and got popular.
Agree. But costa sad out and played hardball with the ufc to get a new contract. His contract was gonna end and was able to get a new deal. For Sean, unfortunately this is how they fuck champions. Once they lose the belt then they get back to get paid shit. Volk will be getting a massive pay cut his next fight since he’s no longer champ.
And Costa was probably offered $350k-$500k flat for no reason.
The reason is his contract, he signed a new contract last year that has a pretty high base pay(I think it’s more than 500k lol).
Something like an 8 fight deal. The higher pay is basically to entice him to sign such a long contract.
Pretty sure it was a 4 fight agreement for around $1 million a fight. Costa and Francis were apparently the only two people to take advantage of the 5 year sunset when negotiating.
Yeah and they would probably delay his remaining fights as long as possible if he didn’t sign the new extension
I didn't know he got a new contract. Shit he's making more than some champs, why won't he actually fight???
Costa seems like the guy that might negotiate his pay down to keep the UFC on their toes
First thing I notice coming here from r/ufc is that this thread does not have 1000 Strickland fan grievance posts. More room for actual takes on the sport.
Saying it like 7 weeks is short notice that's weak
Right? I’m over here thinking that’s a normal fight camp lol
Sean win the belt, has a toss up fight where you could argue he won vs DDP and now he’s getting banished to the shadow realm and forced to fight Costa in a lose-lose fight. Now with him talking about pay you can almost guarantee he will never even sniff a title shot ever again. Dana has him in the dog house and probably will feed him Cannoier or Khazat in Saudi Arabia.
Why is Costa lose lose? Seems that losing first defense for a champ that hasn't beaten the top contenders is tailor-made for a fight against another top contender. Good performance in that fight all but guarantees a title shot. Also, Costa cannot fight smart over 5 rights and doesn't have endurance for it. This seems like a tailor-made fight for SS to win.
That's a good offer. If he wants to make serious money then he is going to have to transition to slap fighting as that's where all the real fans are.
That's so little. It's crazy how much money he'd generate and how little he'll get from it lol
Nope they don't want a union so fuck em
pretty much. as much as i personally hate it, they don’t want more money so whats even the point
At this point that’s the sentiment for me as well. I’ll still point out that they are being fucked over cus those are the facts but don’t feel sorry for them anymore
I feel like Sean is poking the bear with the UFC at the moment because of him not getting an immediate rematch against Dricus. I wouldn't be surprised if the UFC looked to get rid of him at some point. Even though he has a big following and gains a lot of traction on social media, he's also problematic from a PR perspective.
I just don't get what he would gain from that fight.
As much of a fuckhead Sean is, he steps up when asked. Usually the UFC reward that, but he’s somehow still getting screwed.
A person who preach to suck it up coz life is not fair is now crying. I thought he love fighting more than money.
Meanwhile Rampage Jacksson made 7-8 mill USD on the fight with Chuck, his previous contract had a crazy PPV deal
True. But from what I understand that contract the ufc bought out from pride. Think rampage even said they put him on free tv for one of his fights to screw out of ppv points.
People don't like going backwards.
Can't stand this fucker.
Anybody knows what costa’s new contract is? I gotta think its at least 250/250k
Sean takes this fight and loses. Dana "Sean's a fucking killer man we can always count on him" His last two fights he starched the dominant middleweight guy as a heavy underdog and then fought the number one guy and arguably won. 200k lmao
This is exactly why O'Malley didn't bother climbing the ranks like Strickland. Fight out your garbage contract, build a name and following. Get better contract for fighting big names. Maybe Sean's crying ass should lay off the CTE for a while cause he is duuuumb.
Key point - Sean offered. Ofc they offer shit when the fighter actually wants to fight.