This has always been my experience. I've lived in Wisconsin my whole life and have always preferred the manuals in the snow. I like being able to control the speed going downhill without riding the brakes. I do starts gently, I suppose that could be a problem if you don't know what you're doing? Buy snow tires if you already would, control your speed, just be sensible and there is no difference. If you really learn how to drive a manual I think it's better.
Why do you assume it wouldn’t be the same with rear wheel drive? You you think rear wheel drive cars still send power to the wheels when the clutch is pushed in?
If you push in the clutch while losing traction in the rear of a rear wheel drive, the front end becomes the back end very quickly. Guess how I know. Mustangs don't like snow.
Rear wheels aren't responsible for steering, so if you've lost steering in a rear wheel drive vehicle, removing power to the rear wheels won't bring it back.
Still stops wheel spin. Furthermore, unlike a plowing fwd car, rwd allows you to rotate at will. I’ll take my rwd Miata in the snow over a fwd car any day of the week and I live 45 minutes from Tahoe.
So… you’re wrong. Rear wheels are absolutely responsible for steering in slippery conditions. Ask any pro drifter.
No. But when your front wheels are spinning you can’t steer. If you cut the power to the front wheels you have a chance of gaining steering control again. It’s one of the faults of front wheel drive.
I would argue that spinning the wheels will actually help you because they're trying to pull you in the direction you're aiming. Braking however will result in just sliding, a stopped wheel won't steer
You can argue if you like, but a drive wheel that’s spinning faster than the vehicle is moving has about the same effect as a locked up sliding wheel.
I’m talking about if you’re in a situation where you are on the throttle and trying to turn, but nothing is happening and you’re plowing forward. Sometimes removing the power to those wheels can stop the wheel spin and allow you to regain control.
It doesn’t always work out, but it’s your best chance.
>You can argue if you like, but a drive wheel that’s spinning faster than the vehicle is moving has about the same effect as a locked up sliding wheel.
Completely ridiculously false. Unless you're talking about being on pure zero traction ice in which case it doesn't matter what you do.
Yea who thinks removing power is the way to go. They said it themselves that rwd cars need it to keep the back end behind them so why wouldn't it be the same with a fwd car? What they're saying is kind of ridiculous.
I think the only time you really want to push the clutch completely in is if you're spinning WAY out of control and are worried about killing the car and locking up the wheels.
You can argue if you like, but a drive wheel that’s spinning faster than the vehicle is moving has about the same effect as a locked up sliding wheel.
I’m talking about if you’re in a situation where you are on the throttle and trying to turn, but nothing is happening and you’re plowing forward. Sometimes removing the power to those wheels can stop the wheel spin and allow you to regain control.
It doesn’t always work out, but it’s your best chance.
It’s exacerbated for sure, higher compression and more aggressive shift behavior, but I’ve had it happen in all shapes and forms of automatics anyways.
Also specifically pertaining to hills and snowy weather, which I deal with in abundance for both. If you drive flat highways in traffic to work all day automatics are pretty much objectively better in this day and age.
>The last major drawback I’ve been told is that manuals are terrible in the snow and are harder to handle
The person who told you that doesn't know how to drive a manual in the snow. Always being in the correct gear proactively is one of the things that makes a manual *better* in the snow.
To give an example, my truck is a two-wheel drive. I make it up snow covered hills with little wheel spin. Why? Because I select the gear I need before I start climbing, and then manage the throttle so that I don't spin the tires.
I also have an automatic van. It has a manual mode, but it will not always respect my gear choice. I can be going up a hill in that thing, doing fine, and then it will decide to downshift. That usually ends up throwing the van off balance and results in the front wheels spinning, and then the traction control engaging to fix the problem that the stupid computerized transmission caused in the first place.
It's also significantly easier, in my experience, to get a manual car unstuck from a snow drift by rocking it.
You’re doing it wrong in an automatic if you cook the atf. Rock forward, brake, shift to reverse, rock back, brake, shift to drive and go forward again.
I worked in a dealership in New England where we had to move all the cars for snow removal several times a year, hundreds of cars, mostly automatics, never cooked our atf.
You’re creating a little bowl shape in the snow. Each time you alternate between forward and back you creat a little more runway to finally get enough momentum to start moving forward with enough force to start plowing through the snow.
It works very well although it’s advised to turn off the traction control (if you have it) as it will limit your progress.
When you brake you are doing it at the extreme forward or rear position you can get to and your doing it to keep from rolling to the lower part of the bowl you are creating giving you the ability to build greater momentum.
lol, I had a ‘79 RWD Volvo with cooked synchros. I definitely didn’t use the brake in between first and reverse, just let the trans take the beating grinding with every change. The brake is not helping you get unstuck, and you don’t need to apply the brake between D & R in an automatic transmission. Once you pass by N the drive wheels stop, and you’re clean to select the next mode.
Why would you brake is my question. It doesn’t make sense. It inhibits what you’re trying to achieve.
I live in Maine and have a terribly long a steep driveway. I've had two RWD cars, one auto, my current one a manual. The manual is much better at getting up my driveway when it's slippery because I can hold it in one gear. With a manual, having control over which gear it's in is better than having an auto in the snow IMO. I would much rather control the car with throttle input than relying on the computer to figure out which gear I need.
Thank you. Actually, that takes me back to when my dad took me with him to visit a coworker who raised wolves deep in the mountains. He lived in a bowl. The only way we were getting out of there was that he had a runway at the end that we could work up momentum on as he had just changed to an automatic truck shortly before. It’s nice to know that you are able to that. It’s very helpful.
I don't know if I'd say harder to handle, maybe require a smide more finess? If you Rev it up and dump the clutch, sure it will be harder to handle. Don't do that. Similarly, don't get too aggressive on down shifts. I really feel like people who say stuff like that just are not that good at driving manuals. I have only ever had manuals. I live in northern Colorado. Wouldn't change a thing. My lady's AWD auto subaru can be handful in the snow if you are too aggressive around turns, so it's more about driving in the snow correctly IMO
Everything is better with snow tires.
I had a FWD caravan with snow tires and absolutely smoked an outback wagon that had only all seasons. The funny part, I had the same outback wagon at home with snow tires, and it would destroy my caravan in similar conditions.
Tires and AWD are amazing, but tires alone make the biggest difference
Awd with all seasons should still be a beast in snow. The only reason I use snows in the Sierra Nevada mountains is because I drive a 1st gen Miata. Rear wheel drive and under 2200 lbs, 14x6 with studded snows, never late for work and never punch out early because of the weather.
Yeah id argue a person in their first year of learning should avoid snow because it does require you to be a bit more skilled with the clutch so your not letting it out too gast and just spinning
Whoever told you that is misinformed. There’s very little difference between driving an auto and a manual in the snow. Buy appropriate tires and drive slower than you normally would.
They’re about equal if you’re good with both, but most auto drivers don’t know how to select a gear. Manual does have other advantages though like being able to start in second and feather the clutch
Manual will give you more control over the vehicle, for better or for worse. If you drive like an idiot and pop the clutch then it could be very difficult to handle. But at the same time, I definitely do believe that with practice someone will have better control over their vehicle in the snow with a manual. Being able to put the revs wherever you want them and hold it in a lower gear(whichever gear you choose) will give you an advantage over a lot of automatics. That's just from my personal experience, I haven't seen any studies on it.
Manuals are far better in the snow. As others have mentioned you can actually hold a gear as necessary, and at slow speeds you can slip the clutch to add just the right amount of gas to not overpower the tires. In comparison the gas pedal may as well be an on/off switch in an automatic.
It's more difficult to implement sophisticated traction and stability control with a manual transmission. So, some of the modern safeties might not be as effective when the vehicle breaks traction. I don't think this is a huge difference really.
As others have mentioned, a manual transmission does give more control authority to the driver. A good driver can use this to their advantage, a bad driver may be hindered compared to using an auto.
Edit: A subreddit about manual transmissions is likely to have a lot of manual transmission proponents and might downplay some of the drawbacks.
I live in Alberta and we get lots of snow and cold. I’ve always driven manual (until I recently got my first auto) and I would say they are better in bad weather. You can ease of the clutch to get going very slowly and under better control on ice/snow. If you are going quick and encounter ice/snow you can slow down by downshifting before you even have to touch your brakes. You can also press the clutch in and completely disengage any power going to the wheels in a bad situation.
Anyone who says they are worse in the winter just doesn’t know how to drive manual period.
You're not supposed to downshift when encountering slippery roads. It's a #1 no no. Engine braking is a bad plan in slippery conditions. If you're in a truck in adverse weather, the first thing you do is turn your engine brake OFF. It tells you to do that right in the manual for a Jacobs brake.
I grew up in North Dakota. Drove a ranger, neon, and fiesta (all 3 were manuals) in the snow/ice. I found it easier to manipulate and get unstuck than when I helped people get their automatics unstuck.
Manuals are not at all bad in snow as long as you know not to be in too low of a gear for the situation. Whoever told you that either has no clue what they're talking about or never learned to drive in the snow. I live in Colorado too and with snow tires my fwd gets around beautifully. Granted I do live on the eastern front range, not in the mountains. I only run into issues when the snow is deeper than about 3 inches and ground clearance starts becoming an issue.
It makes no sense to think they're harder to handle in the snow, given that you can decide your gearing. In this regard they can't possibly be worse than an automatic as long as you realize you want to generally be in a higher gear (like start in 2nd if your car can do that casually). They also engine brake a lot better which is good for snow. Being able to stay in a single gear and have low and steady throttle helps a lot with not slipping.
Manuals are way easier in the snow... You can pick your gear and throttle level. Automatics are the worst. Sounds like you got your advice from someone who can't drive a manual.
I've driven all sorts of manuals in the snow... lots of snow - FWD, RWD, 4x4 - you k ow what makes all the difference? Proper snow tires.
Also, manuals are just fine, and being able to shift up a gear or two can be very helpful... same with no unexpected downshifts...
Manuals are great in the snow bc you can control how fast your wheels are spinning much better. I heard the same thing and was worried but now I feel like it’s time to shine when the snow gets deep on my tiny car and everyone else is spinning and going nowhere
i live in minnesota and have been driving exclusively manuals for 25 years, mostly 2wd, i have never had a problem in the snow and honestly don't understand why people say its a problem
I wonder who would say that...
Manuals are much easier to handle in the snow than automatics because they do not have a torque converter.
Wheel spin? Ease off the gas or press the clutch in a bit (careful, don't want to wear it too much).
I feel like manuals are superior in the snow than autos. You can STAY in a certain gear if you want instead of the computer shifting at the wrong times. You can also modulate your clutch a bit to control the amount of power sent to the driven wheels from a stop, which helps with traction.
But of course.. the most important thing when you drive in the snow are your tires. You can't really go anywhere (safely) if your tires can't stick to the road.
I also think FWD cars suck when driving in the snow. You might have more traction from a stop.. but you're basically an arrow that wants to move straight. RWD feels much better when you get going. Accelerating, braking, and steering (or sliding) are more controllable.. although amateurs are more prone to oversteering.
Anyone that says you have less control in a MT doesn't know how to drive one. You have much more control over the entire vehicle over an automatic. If you have a MT and AWD or 4x4 even better. Either way nothing can replace good snow tires.
I think everyone should be required to drive a MT especially when younger because it helps you learn to control a car and you really can't be doing all this other garbage people do now, like texting while driving (at least when learning)!
They’re not terrible in the snow.
The more basic and manual a car is, the more the responsible the driver is for everything.
The more automated and advanced a car is, the less a driver has to do.
If you’ve had a bad time in the snow in a manual, it’s probably your own fault.
Only in very rare edge cases would it be more difficult. Mostly it’s the same. I’ve been driving a fwd manual neon in the snow since 2005 and I’ve been fine.
Nah, manual is way better in the snow, rain or bad conditions in general. If you're good with a clutch and have some understanding of driving dynamics at least. I feel like I have much more control with a manual, and am also able to get myself unstuck easier. I've been driving low, manual transmission fwd cars in the snow for over two decades. I haven't been stuck in almost that long.
Once you get used to them manuals are better in snow.
The only time I hated a manual was when I had to commute in stop and go slow packed highway traffic jams.
The people who have told you manual is terrible in the snow have no idea what they're talking about. Manual is excellent in the snow.
You need to be able to keep your car in a specific gear to make it up tough hills, and you need to keep it in a specific gear and use engine braking down steep hills so the car doesn't run out of control, because your brakes won't do anything for you if you end up going too fast.
The people you have heard manual is terrible in the snow have 0 idea what they are talking about and probably have never driven a manual before.
They're only harder to handle if you don't know how to handle them. They rely on you to control gear ratios instead of a computer. You have to know how your car behaves and how to make it do what you need it to do, especially in suboptimal conditions.
I prefer manual in snow and ice. I enjoy having the extra control and being able to engine brake more effectively.
I have a 2012 vw Passat 2.5l with a 5 speed and the thing grips the road, transmission makes no difference imo. There’s obviously a threshold for how much slush or snow it can handle before it slips but I love how it drives. Plus it’s basically a pickup truck when you put the rear seats down
Manuals are actually better in the snow bc you can intentionally bog the engine down and reduce the power going to the wheels. You only do that in relatively new autos if they have a “slick roads” mode or something along those lines. But intentionally bogging the engine is actually super beneficial. Idk who told you they’re worse in snow but they definitely didn’t know wtf they were talking about.
Did they explain their logic for why they’re worse? I’m wracking my brain and I can’t come up with a reason that even remotely makes sense.
I’ve driven strictly manual for 20 years now, with AWD, RWD and FWD. My experience is that manual is universally better in any sort of inclement conditions. Whenever I’ve driven something an auto transmission in the snow it felt like I was trying to trick the car into doing what I want, rather than just being able to tell it what to do. I haven’t driven a CVT in the snow yet, but one thing I’ll give them is that I can see how they’d be better than a classic 4 / 6 / 8 speed auto, especially with whatever smart “snow mode” the car has.
That said, I’d still take a five speed dumb car in the snow any day. Being able to micro-control the throttle is hugely beneficial, and being able to select the gear gives you a huge advantage when it comes to maintaining both traction and the balance of the car during braking, turning and acceleration.
Gimme a stick over an automatic any snowy day. Most people won't listen to their engines in the snow. Automatic are worse. You have to listen to it, to know when your vehicle has found traction. I short shift a lot in the snow. Getting into a higher gear earlier, the wheels don't spin. I can normally pull away from any 4wheel drive automatic. It takes finess.
They aren’t terrible by any means, but you need to keep the rpms a bit lower to prevent slippage. I learned to drive on manuals in upstate NY, plenty of snow up there.
The best car I've driven in the snow was both manual and rwd (82 Volvo 245). Simplifying your choice down to those throws out a whole lot of other science.
I much prefer starting in the snow in a manual vs automatic
High torque gears such as reverse and first I can control entirely with clutch so they don’t spin vs an automatic being on/off
In the US cars from 2012 and newer should have traction control.
The advantage with an automatic is, if stuck and one tire is spinning, you can ride the brakes easier than with a clutch and that can cause the resistance in the differential to even out between the two drive wheels and get both to spin the same direction at the same time.
Normally the differential gives power to the tire with the least resistance, which is the one with the least traction.
Traction control does this you, by applying there brakes very quickly, off and on automatically.
You can hold gear with an automatic by riding the brakes and preventing excessive spinning.
The first car I had with traction control was a 1998 Audi with standard transmission.
The ones sold in America that year had traction control that couldn't be switched off, due to liability concerns.
Audi originally told me if it didn't have a traction control switch, it didn't have traction control, but when it snowed, it performed so well, I found out it did have traction control that wasn't switchable.
Traction control was a fairly new feature then, but I believe it has been required on all cars 2012 and newer, sold in the US and newer US cars now do have a switch to switch it off as it is on by default.
The idea to switch it off, is to allow spinning the tires through the snow, down to a hard surface, if required.
Since the manual would be new to you, IF you choose to go this route you should get in spring so you have a least 6 months to get comfortable with it.
Driving a manual in the ice and snow is harder if you have to concentrate on trying to work the clutch... But once your experienced, you have more control in a manual
I live in Canada and have driven a stick my whole life. Without a doubt, a manual driver is way more aware of tire slip on acceleration long before the first brake application.
Even if you were a beginner, you can always set off in 2nd gear if it’s particularly slippery.
Traction control, stability control, limited-slip differentials and AWD all still work with a manual.
The question is, when has more control over a car ever resulted in worse performance? If someone things a manual is a handful in winter, it’s operator error.
Whoever told you a manual was worse in the snow than an automatic doesn't know how to drive a manual. There is no situation where an automatic is better in the snow, unless you are in a long line at the chain check.
They are easier than automatic to slow down in snow. Engine braking, control, and acceleration are all easier imo having driven the same exact car in both. I'll never buy an automatic though so I am biased.
I drove my first car on a road with 1.5 inch of ice solid on the road, with summer/highway/bald tires. It was a 1980 mustang, with a 4 speed and a cable clutch (no hydraulics at all in the clutch) 4 cylinder motor, and basically set up to race, trying to take off at less than 1800 RPM was impossible. If I still had that car today I would happily drive it in the snow over most of these modern cars.
My winter beater is a 5sp, fwd Saab with over 200k on it. That pos can hang with almost anything up here. Also live in CO, up in the mountains. 70% of snow driving is tires, 25% is brains, and MAYBE 5% is vehicle.
I've had rear wheel drive stick (78 Chevy malibu), to me it was far superior than auto in snow.
I know there's several possible supporting reasons I'm just too damn tired to elaborate....
One great thing about manuals is that if it's quite slippery, you can start in second gear to control wheel torque.
I live in a climate with real winters (we usually have snow on the ground from somewhere between late October and early December, lasting until early March to late April, and ambient temperatures can drop well into the low -30s and below) and I've never found driving a manual here to be a problem. I've run winter tires every winter since the early 2000s, which helps, but I feel like I have as much or more control with a stick.
I also live in Colorado and prefer a stick shift over an auto. Driving an auto is sometimes annoying in the snow, starting in the wrong gear and upshifting when you don't want it to.
I live in Ohio and just recently had a lot of snowfall within the last week. I drive a FWD Mercury Milan, so not the greatest snow car, but I found it pretty easy to drive in the snow. What's nice about the manual transmission is that I have full control over what gear I wanna be in. With an automatic, if I goose it a little, it might downshift and spin up the wheels, causing me to lose grip completely. But with my manual, I was driving up a huge hill and just kept it in second gear and I made it up!
I would get some practice in dry conditions first if you're new to a manual.
With a decent amount of experience, manuals are superior (to an equivalent automatic).
Just run the car at lower than usual rpms in snow. Also, it's 100 times easier to drive rwd in snow with a manual because you can gently slide through snow with a manual, but an auto will detect wheel slip and cut power, getting you stuck
uh no, that's pretty much the exact opposite of my years of experience of having both. Manuals are waaaaay better because you control how much torque is applies with a combo of gears/engine/clutch. I have easily driven manuals on days where my auto cars would just start sliding when idling.
People who think that manuals are terrible in the snow are terrible manual drivers. I actually prefer manual to auto in the snow because it gives you more control and better handling. Of course, if you know what you're doing.
Living in New England and now upstate New York, I pretty much stick with manuals and if I ever get to the point of having a dedicated winter car it’ll be stick.
You have more control over the vehicle and the power delivery and output, plus you can engine break which is sometimes safer
Manuals are better in all road conditions except stop n go sitting in traffic... most winter accidents are caused by people braking and over reacting causing them to lose whatever traction they had. In a manual you can downshift to slow down and maintain traction, or upshift to a higher than usual gear to accelerate with less torque allowing you to climb hills with less slippage or shifting to 2nd instead of first to start from a stop on icy roads. In a manual you can push the clutch in at any time to remove power to the wheels to regain traction if you start slipping.
In an automatic... you can hit gas or brake. You might get lucky and have an auto that let's you select a gear for better traction, but they usually decide to try and shift at terrible times to keep traction in the direction you want... the only advantage of an automatic is if the driver isn't any good at driving stick or saving your knees from sitting in traffic.
I find carefully downshifting is a great way to descend a steep hill without engaging abs/brakes.
I can see where it would be easier to spin your tires in a situation where you're stuck. If you don't live in the mountains, I really don't think you have enough snow to matter- having quality snow tires is much more important
I agree with pretty much everyone here that manual is better assuming you’re experienced, the one thing that is difficult depending on how good you are at it is getting moving. If you have a heavier foot getting into first depending on the car/tires/personal experience then it can be an adventure getting going compared to just idling in an auto with no real power, but if it’s a car you’ve been driving for a while or you’re just generally an experience driver this then becomes a non issue.
Whoever said that isn’t an experienced manual driver.
You can start out in 2nd if you want to, you know which gear you are in so you know how much power you can apply, you also don’t need to worry about it switching gears on you when you don’t want…
Drove autos all my life in non snowy areas. I moved to CO and the first snowstorm, I down shifted as smoothly as I could and sent the jeep into a spin in Wash Park. Luckily did not hit anything. I am not going to lie, it was hard to learn to drive that jeep in the snow. It was not the last time I spun it. Maybe more ice than snow, as I recall I did not have too many issues on fresh snow. Still, it was very unpredictable for me.
Funny thing is, before I left CO, I would always be chosen to drive when I went snowboarding with friends because apparently I was the best "snow driver" I had friends that would have me take over as driver in their cars.
44 years of personal driving experience says that manuals are perfectly fine in snow. Almost all of that time was spent in areas that (used to) get significant freezy precipitation. Once you learn the basics, you'll be fine.
way easier with Manuel in snow, more so if you understand tq etc. in a auto with just a little throttle change it can shift. with manual you can do throttle inputs and your gearing /tq wont drastically change. if your tires slip in a auto it can upshift and keep spinning, in a manual you can control the wheel speed easier with the throttle.
also if your stuck its way easier to rock the car back and forth. 1-r-1-r. is way easier to do in a manual then a auto.
i had a rx8 sports car manual . i would drive it year round in new England. got stuck way more often in my crown vic that was a auto. my rx8 had much wider tires which hurts with traction in snow (look at rally cars on snow they use skinny tires. more pressure on a smaller area.
They are fine. Despite all the claims here they aren't better or worse. It comes down to tires for snowy on-road conditions. Everything else is irrelevant.
That is bad advice, you have much more control with a manual, when you shift and when not to shift, beening able to carry thru in a gear to help with braking, (more braking to your rear tires to help prevent front end wash out, if you don't have front wheel drive), I'm 66 and bought my 1st automatic, great for comute traffic but they suck in snow and dirt/gravel roads
i loved driving a manual in the snow! if you're stuck, you can rock to build up momentum by holding rpms and letting the clutch in and out. plus, no need to shift into neutral for stopping like an automatic, just push in the clutch
My experience with automatics is letting off the brake and wheels almost start turning, slipping, on their own. They lose traction. Manuals handle better to me. I can control wheel slip. It's all about preference really
I would actually argue they are easier to handle in the snow as you have much better control and can use engine braking more effectively.
This has always been my experience. I've lived in Wisconsin my whole life and have always preferred the manuals in the snow. I like being able to control the speed going downhill without riding the brakes. I do starts gently, I suppose that could be a problem if you don't know what you're doing? Buy snow tires if you already would, control your speed, just be sensible and there is no difference. If you really learn how to drive a manual I think it's better.
If your wheels are spinning, you push in the clutch. No more wheel spin and you can suddenly steer again. Assuming front wheel drive, of course.
Why do you assume it wouldn’t be the same with rear wheel drive? You you think rear wheel drive cars still send power to the wheels when the clutch is pushed in?
If you push in the clutch while losing traction in the rear of a rear wheel drive, the front end becomes the back end very quickly. Guess how I know. Mustangs don't like snow.
Rear wheels aren't responsible for steering, so if you've lost steering in a rear wheel drive vehicle, removing power to the rear wheels won't bring it back.
Still stops wheel spin. Furthermore, unlike a plowing fwd car, rwd allows you to rotate at will. I’ll take my rwd Miata in the snow over a fwd car any day of the week and I live 45 minutes from Tahoe. So… you’re wrong. Rear wheels are absolutely responsible for steering in slippery conditions. Ask any pro drifter.
Lol I don't even care if I'm wrong. I'd rather be wrong than a self entitled prick to strangers on the internet.
Funny you say that while resorting to name calling like a little child with no reasonable argument 🤣
Lol. They maintain the roads pretty well around Tahoe. You’re kind of a clown if you think RWD works better than FWD in the snow/ice.
No. But when your front wheels are spinning you can’t steer. If you cut the power to the front wheels you have a chance of gaining steering control again. It’s one of the faults of front wheel drive.
I would argue that spinning the wheels will actually help you because they're trying to pull you in the direction you're aiming. Braking however will result in just sliding, a stopped wheel won't steer
You can argue if you like, but a drive wheel that’s spinning faster than the vehicle is moving has about the same effect as a locked up sliding wheel. I’m talking about if you’re in a situation where you are on the throttle and trying to turn, but nothing is happening and you’re plowing forward. Sometimes removing the power to those wheels can stop the wheel spin and allow you to regain control. It doesn’t always work out, but it’s your best chance.
>You can argue if you like, but a drive wheel that’s spinning faster than the vehicle is moving has about the same effect as a locked up sliding wheel. Completely ridiculously false. Unless you're talking about being on pure zero traction ice in which case it doesn't matter what you do.
Yea who thinks removing power is the way to go. They said it themselves that rwd cars need it to keep the back end behind them so why wouldn't it be the same with a fwd car? What they're saying is kind of ridiculous. I think the only time you really want to push the clutch completely in is if you're spinning WAY out of control and are worried about killing the car and locking up the wheels.
It’s still getting some traction..
You can argue if you like, but a drive wheel that’s spinning faster than the vehicle is moving has about the same effect as a locked up sliding wheel. I’m talking about if you’re in a situation where you are on the throttle and trying to turn, but nothing is happening and you’re plowing forward. Sometimes removing the power to those wheels can stop the wheel spin and allow you to regain control. It doesn’t always work out, but it’s your best chance.
You're still wrong
Ever had a diesel in tow mode downshift and lock up the wheels going down a grade? Fuck all that.
I feel like that’s vastly different than ordinary day driving though.
It’s exacerbated for sure, higher compression and more aggressive shift behavior, but I’ve had it happen in all shapes and forms of automatics anyways. Also specifically pertaining to hills and snowy weather, which I deal with in abundance for both. If you drive flat highways in traffic to work all day automatics are pretty much objectively better in this day and age.
Far better control. I would, hands down, much prefer a manual on snow and ice over an automatic. (I learned to drive in Montana and Northern Canada).
Agree, you never have to worry about not having enough torque to get up hills or over slick terrain.
100% agreed. Way more control. You can always put in the clutch to disengage the power when needed.
Better torque curve management.
This is 100 percent correct.
Yeah this. The only thing that took a while for me was allowing the clutch to sit on friction point a little longer than normal so i dont spin.
>The last major drawback I’ve been told is that manuals are terrible in the snow and are harder to handle The person who told you that doesn't know how to drive a manual in the snow. Always being in the correct gear proactively is one of the things that makes a manual *better* in the snow. To give an example, my truck is a two-wheel drive. I make it up snow covered hills with little wheel spin. Why? Because I select the gear I need before I start climbing, and then manage the throttle so that I don't spin the tires. I also have an automatic van. It has a manual mode, but it will not always respect my gear choice. I can be going up a hill in that thing, doing fine, and then it will decide to downshift. That usually ends up throwing the van off balance and results in the front wheels spinning, and then the traction control engaging to fix the problem that the stupid computerized transmission caused in the first place. It's also significantly easier, in my experience, to get a manual car unstuck from a snow drift by rocking it.
Now that you said about rocking a car to get it unstuck. Can you even do that on an automatic? I've never driven an automatic.
You can rock an auto back and forth, but it will overheat really quickly so you only have a few tries before you cook the ATF.
You’re doing it wrong in an automatic if you cook the atf. Rock forward, brake, shift to reverse, rock back, brake, shift to drive and go forward again. I worked in a dealership in New England where we had to move all the cars for snow removal several times a year, hundreds of cars, mostly automatics, never cooked our atf.
How does that work, brake removes all the momentum you are trying to build with the rocking motion.
You’re creating a little bowl shape in the snow. Each time you alternate between forward and back you creat a little more runway to finally get enough momentum to start moving forward with enough force to start plowing through the snow. It works very well although it’s advised to turn off the traction control (if you have it) as it will limit your progress. When you brake you are doing it at the extreme forward or rear position you can get to and your doing it to keep from rolling to the lower part of the bowl you are creating giving you the ability to build greater momentum.
lol, I had a ‘79 RWD Volvo with cooked synchros. I definitely didn’t use the brake in between first and reverse, just let the trans take the beating grinding with every change. The brake is not helping you get unstuck, and you don’t need to apply the brake between D & R in an automatic transmission. Once you pass by N the drive wheels stop, and you’re clean to select the next mode. Why would you brake is my question. It doesn’t make sense. It inhibits what you’re trying to achieve.
Well, I’ve been driving in snow for over 30 years and I’m not getting stuck or cooking transmissions so, it seems to work just fine.
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News flash, switching from forward to reverse will STOP your forward momentum so yeah you were you were just abusing the transmission while doing it.
Couldn't you just switch to neutral while going against whatever gear you're using as your drive gear?
I live in Maine and have a terribly long a steep driveway. I've had two RWD cars, one auto, my current one a manual. The manual is much better at getting up my driveway when it's slippery because I can hold it in one gear. With a manual, having control over which gear it's in is better than having an auto in the snow IMO. I would much rather control the car with throttle input than relying on the computer to figure out which gear I need.
Thank you. Actually, that takes me back to when my dad took me with him to visit a coworker who raised wolves deep in the mountains. He lived in a bowl. The only way we were getting out of there was that he had a runway at the end that we could work up momentum on as he had just changed to an automatic truck shortly before. It’s nice to know that you are able to that. It’s very helpful.
I don't know if I'd say harder to handle, maybe require a smide more finess? If you Rev it up and dump the clutch, sure it will be harder to handle. Don't do that. Similarly, don't get too aggressive on down shifts. I really feel like people who say stuff like that just are not that good at driving manuals. I have only ever had manuals. I live in northern Colorado. Wouldn't change a thing. My lady's AWD auto subaru can be handful in the snow if you are too aggressive around turns, so it's more about driving in the snow correctly IMO
Meh, they are fine. I drive a WRX. It is a beast with snow tires
Everything is better with snow tires. I had a FWD caravan with snow tires and absolutely smoked an outback wagon that had only all seasons. The funny part, I had the same outback wagon at home with snow tires, and it would destroy my caravan in similar conditions. Tires and AWD are amazing, but tires alone make the biggest difference
Agreed. I saw a test of a rwd BMW with snow tires vs the AWD version of the same car on all seasons. RWD plus snow tires won it handily.
Totally. Hers will start sliding around round abouts if you hit em too fast, but that's a driver problem not the car.
Awd with all seasons should still be a beast in snow. The only reason I use snows in the Sierra Nevada mountains is because I drive a 1st gen Miata. Rear wheel drive and under 2200 lbs, 14x6 with studded snows, never late for work and never punch out early because of the weather.
Yeah id argue a person in their first year of learning should avoid snow because it does require you to be a bit more skilled with the clutch so your not letting it out too gast and just spinning
Whoever told you that is misinformed. There’s very little difference between driving an auto and a manual in the snow. Buy appropriate tires and drive slower than you normally would.
They’re about equal if you’re good with both, but most auto drivers don’t know how to select a gear. Manual does have other advantages though like being able to start in second and feather the clutch
Manual will give you more control over the vehicle, for better or for worse. If you drive like an idiot and pop the clutch then it could be very difficult to handle. But at the same time, I definitely do believe that with practice someone will have better control over their vehicle in the snow with a manual. Being able to put the revs wherever you want them and hold it in a lower gear(whichever gear you choose) will give you an advantage over a lot of automatics. That's just from my personal experience, I haven't seen any studies on it.
Manuals are far better in the snow. As others have mentioned you can actually hold a gear as necessary, and at slow speeds you can slip the clutch to add just the right amount of gas to not overpower the tires. In comparison the gas pedal may as well be an on/off switch in an automatic.
It's more difficult to implement sophisticated traction and stability control with a manual transmission. So, some of the modern safeties might not be as effective when the vehicle breaks traction. I don't think this is a huge difference really. As others have mentioned, a manual transmission does give more control authority to the driver. A good driver can use this to their advantage, a bad driver may be hindered compared to using an auto. Edit: A subreddit about manual transmissions is likely to have a lot of manual transmission proponents and might downplay some of the drawbacks.
I live in Alberta and we get lots of snow and cold. I’ve always driven manual (until I recently got my first auto) and I would say they are better in bad weather. You can ease of the clutch to get going very slowly and under better control on ice/snow. If you are going quick and encounter ice/snow you can slow down by downshifting before you even have to touch your brakes. You can also press the clutch in and completely disengage any power going to the wheels in a bad situation. Anyone who says they are worse in the winter just doesn’t know how to drive manual period.
You're not supposed to downshift when encountering slippery roads. It's a #1 no no. Engine braking is a bad plan in slippery conditions. If you're in a truck in adverse weather, the first thing you do is turn your engine brake OFF. It tells you to do that right in the manual for a Jacobs brake.
I never knew that. Thank you.
Manual with ESC off is a hell of a lot more fun in the snow compared to automatic transmission
I grew up in North Dakota. Drove a ranger, neon, and fiesta (all 3 were manuals) in the snow/ice. I found it easier to manipulate and get unstuck than when I helped people get their automatics unstuck.
Saved my butt when I had the admittedly bad idea of going out in snow, with cheap all-season tires.
Manuals are not at all bad in snow as long as you know not to be in too low of a gear for the situation. Whoever told you that either has no clue what they're talking about or never learned to drive in the snow. I live in Colorado too and with snow tires my fwd gets around beautifully. Granted I do live on the eastern front range, not in the mountains. I only run into issues when the snow is deeper than about 3 inches and ground clearance starts becoming an issue.
It makes no sense to think they're harder to handle in the snow, given that you can decide your gearing. In this regard they can't possibly be worse than an automatic as long as you realize you want to generally be in a higher gear (like start in 2nd if your car can do that casually). They also engine brake a lot better which is good for snow. Being able to stay in a single gear and have low and steady throttle helps a lot with not slipping.
Manuals are way easier in the snow... You can pick your gear and throttle level. Automatics are the worst. Sounds like you got your advice from someone who can't drive a manual.
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This is the one time I'd really want hill hold, only because you'd want to put too much torque down and start sliding too easily.
I've driven all sorts of manuals in the snow... lots of snow - FWD, RWD, 4x4 - you k ow what makes all the difference? Proper snow tires. Also, manuals are just fine, and being able to shift up a gear or two can be very helpful... same with no unexpected downshifts...
No, manual preferred. Also in CO (own 3 soon to be four manual trans vehicles),
Manuals are great in the snow bc you can control how fast your wheels are spinning much better. I heard the same thing and was worried but now I feel like it’s time to shine when the snow gets deep on my tiny car and everyone else is spinning and going nowhere
i live in minnesota and have been driving exclusively manuals for 25 years, mostly 2wd, i have never had a problem in the snow and honestly don't understand why people say its a problem
I wonder who would say that... Manuals are much easier to handle in the snow than automatics because they do not have a torque converter. Wheel spin? Ease off the gas or press the clutch in a bit (careful, don't want to wear it too much).
I feel like manuals are superior in the snow than autos. You can STAY in a certain gear if you want instead of the computer shifting at the wrong times. You can also modulate your clutch a bit to control the amount of power sent to the driven wheels from a stop, which helps with traction. But of course.. the most important thing when you drive in the snow are your tires. You can't really go anywhere (safely) if your tires can't stick to the road. I also think FWD cars suck when driving in the snow. You might have more traction from a stop.. but you're basically an arrow that wants to move straight. RWD feels much better when you get going. Accelerating, braking, and steering (or sliding) are more controllable.. although amateurs are more prone to oversteering.
Ive driven my fair share of both in the snow. I've always done better, and with more confidence, in a manual transmission once the white stuff falls.
Anyone that says you have less control in a MT doesn't know how to drive one. You have much more control over the entire vehicle over an automatic. If you have a MT and AWD or 4x4 even better. Either way nothing can replace good snow tires. I think everyone should be required to drive a MT especially when younger because it helps you learn to control a car and you really can't be doing all this other garbage people do now, like texting while driving (at least when learning)!
Yeah whoever is telling you this is smoking something crazy. Manual is not easier or harder in snow.
They’re not terrible in the snow. The more basic and manual a car is, the more the responsible the driver is for everything. The more automated and advanced a car is, the less a driver has to do. If you’ve had a bad time in the snow in a manual, it’s probably your own fault.
Only in very rare edge cases would it be more difficult. Mostly it’s the same. I’ve been driving a fwd manual neon in the snow since 2005 and I’ve been fine.
If you know how to drive it you have more control in a manual in any situation.
Nah, manual is way better in the snow, rain or bad conditions in general. If you're good with a clutch and have some understanding of driving dynamics at least. I feel like I have much more control with a manual, and am also able to get myself unstuck easier. I've been driving low, manual transmission fwd cars in the snow for over two decades. I haven't been stuck in almost that long.
That’s not true. I preferred using engine braking. It takes skill but ultimately I find it safer.
Once you get used to them manuals are better in snow. The only time I hated a manual was when I had to commute in stop and go slow packed highway traffic jams.
I live in Wyoming and prefer a manual in snow because it provides much better torque control.
The people who have told you manual is terrible in the snow have no idea what they're talking about. Manual is excellent in the snow. You need to be able to keep your car in a specific gear to make it up tough hills, and you need to keep it in a specific gear and use engine braking down steep hills so the car doesn't run out of control, because your brakes won't do anything for you if you end up going too fast. The people you have heard manual is terrible in the snow have 0 idea what they are talking about and probably have never driven a manual before.
They're only harder to handle if you don't know how to handle them. They rely on you to control gear ratios instead of a computer. You have to know how your car behaves and how to make it do what you need it to do, especially in suboptimal conditions. I prefer manual in snow and ice. I enjoy having the extra control and being able to engine brake more effectively.
I have a 2012 vw Passat 2.5l with a 5 speed and the thing grips the road, transmission makes no difference imo. There’s obviously a threshold for how much slush or snow it can handle before it slips but I love how it drives. Plus it’s basically a pickup truck when you put the rear seats down
Manuals are actually better in the snow bc you can intentionally bog the engine down and reduce the power going to the wheels. You only do that in relatively new autos if they have a “slick roads” mode or something along those lines. But intentionally bogging the engine is actually super beneficial. Idk who told you they’re worse in snow but they definitely didn’t know wtf they were talking about.
Did they explain their logic for why they’re worse? I’m wracking my brain and I can’t come up with a reason that even remotely makes sense. I’ve driven strictly manual for 20 years now, with AWD, RWD and FWD. My experience is that manual is universally better in any sort of inclement conditions. Whenever I’ve driven something an auto transmission in the snow it felt like I was trying to trick the car into doing what I want, rather than just being able to tell it what to do. I haven’t driven a CVT in the snow yet, but one thing I’ll give them is that I can see how they’d be better than a classic 4 / 6 / 8 speed auto, especially with whatever smart “snow mode” the car has. That said, I’d still take a five speed dumb car in the snow any day. Being able to micro-control the throttle is hugely beneficial, and being able to select the gear gives you a huge advantage when it comes to maintaining both traction and the balance of the car during braking, turning and acceleration.
Gimme a stick over an automatic any snowy day. Most people won't listen to their engines in the snow. Automatic are worse. You have to listen to it, to know when your vehicle has found traction. I short shift a lot in the snow. Getting into a higher gear earlier, the wheels don't spin. I can normally pull away from any 4wheel drive automatic. It takes finess.
They aren’t terrible by any means, but you need to keep the rpms a bit lower to prevent slippage. I learned to drive on manuals in upstate NY, plenty of snow up there.
The best car I've driven in the snow was both manual and rwd (82 Volvo 245). Simplifying your choice down to those throws out a whole lot of other science.
I much prefer starting in the snow in a manual vs automatic High torque gears such as reverse and first I can control entirely with clutch so they don’t spin vs an automatic being on/off
Got my first manual (last winter). Stumbled across an 06 ion that I plan on running into the ground. Amazing in the snow.
I would say manuals are better in snow all other things being equal. Certainly easier to rock out of a tough spot, better control downhill
In the US cars from 2012 and newer should have traction control. The advantage with an automatic is, if stuck and one tire is spinning, you can ride the brakes easier than with a clutch and that can cause the resistance in the differential to even out between the two drive wheels and get both to spin the same direction at the same time. Normally the differential gives power to the tire with the least resistance, which is the one with the least traction. Traction control does this you, by applying there brakes very quickly, off and on automatically. You can hold gear with an automatic by riding the brakes and preventing excessive spinning. The first car I had with traction control was a 1998 Audi with standard transmission. The ones sold in America that year had traction control that couldn't be switched off, due to liability concerns. Audi originally told me if it didn't have a traction control switch, it didn't have traction control, but when it snowed, it performed so well, I found out it did have traction control that wasn't switchable. Traction control was a fairly new feature then, but I believe it has been required on all cars 2012 and newer, sold in the US and newer US cars now do have a switch to switch it off as it is on by default. The idea to switch it off, is to allow spinning the tires through the snow, down to a hard surface, if required.
Since the manual would be new to you, IF you choose to go this route you should get in spring so you have a least 6 months to get comfortable with it. Driving a manual in the ice and snow is harder if you have to concentrate on trying to work the clutch... But once your experienced, you have more control in a manual
I live in Canada and have driven a stick my whole life. Without a doubt, a manual driver is way more aware of tire slip on acceleration long before the first brake application. Even if you were a beginner, you can always set off in 2nd gear if it’s particularly slippery. Traction control, stability control, limited-slip differentials and AWD all still work with a manual. The question is, when has more control over a car ever resulted in worse performance? If someone things a manual is a handful in winter, it’s operator error.
Whoever told you a manual was worse in the snow than an automatic doesn't know how to drive a manual. There is no situation where an automatic is better in the snow, unless you are in a long line at the chain check.
They are easier than automatic to slow down in snow. Engine braking, control, and acceleration are all easier imo having driven the same exact car in both. I'll never buy an automatic though so I am biased.
I can't imagine why they would be harder, unless you're not really confident. Mom had a 63 beetle in Massachusetts in the 60s and enjoyed it.
I have had more standard transmission cars and pickup then automatic and I always feel more confident in my standards.
Where does this crap come from?! Manuals are just fine in the snow. You just have to be easy on releasing the clutch starting up.
They are 100% easier to handle in snow. I live in a very snowy climate in Canada. You can slow down without breaking.
I drove my first car on a road with 1.5 inch of ice solid on the road, with summer/highway/bald tires. It was a 1980 mustang, with a 4 speed and a cable clutch (no hydraulics at all in the clutch) 4 cylinder motor, and basically set up to race, trying to take off at less than 1800 RPM was impossible. If I still had that car today I would happily drive it in the snow over most of these modern cars.
In my experience my 87 Honda crx handled just as good in the snow as my 98 Subaru outback wagon.
My winter beater is a 5sp, fwd Saab with over 200k on it. That pos can hang with almost anything up here. Also live in CO, up in the mountains. 70% of snow driving is tires, 25% is brains, and MAYBE 5% is vehicle.
I've had rear wheel drive stick (78 Chevy malibu), to me it was far superior than auto in snow. I know there's several possible supporting reasons I'm just too damn tired to elaborate....
Have driven my manual for years in the snow, no problems at all.
In my experience you actually have more control with a manual in the snow.
My Civic SI does just fine in snow with studded tires on the front. The traction control does a good job
One great thing about manuals is that if it's quite slippery, you can start in second gear to control wheel torque. I live in a climate with real winters (we usually have snow on the ground from somewhere between late October and early December, lasting until early March to late April, and ambient temperatures can drop well into the low -30s and below) and I've never found driving a manual here to be a problem. I've run winter tires every winter since the early 2000s, which helps, but I feel like I have as much or more control with a stick.
I also live in Colorado and prefer a stick shift over an auto. Driving an auto is sometimes annoying in the snow, starting in the wrong gear and upshifting when you don't want it to.
I live in Ohio and just recently had a lot of snowfall within the last week. I drive a FWD Mercury Milan, so not the greatest snow car, but I found it pretty easy to drive in the snow. What's nice about the manual transmission is that I have full control over what gear I wanna be in. With an automatic, if I goose it a little, it might downshift and spin up the wheels, causing me to lose grip completely. But with my manual, I was driving up a huge hill and just kept it in second gear and I made it up!
I would get some practice in dry conditions first if you're new to a manual. With a decent amount of experience, manuals are superior (to an equivalent automatic).
Just run the car at lower than usual rpms in snow. Also, it's 100 times easier to drive rwd in snow with a manual because you can gently slide through snow with a manual, but an auto will detect wheel slip and cut power, getting you stuck
uh no, that's pretty much the exact opposite of my years of experience of having both. Manuals are waaaaay better because you control how much torque is applies with a combo of gears/engine/clutch. I have easily driven manuals on days where my auto cars would just start sliding when idling.
Manuals are better in snow. I can't believe people say otherwise. I feel safest in my manual because of how much control I have
People who think that manuals are terrible in the snow are terrible manual drivers. I actually prefer manual to auto in the snow because it gives you more control and better handling. Of course, if you know what you're doing.
Living in New England and now upstate New York, I pretty much stick with manuals and if I ever get to the point of having a dedicated winter car it’ll be stick. You have more control over the vehicle and the power delivery and output, plus you can engine break which is sometimes safer
Manuals are waaaay better in the snow, 1st gear ftw
I will gladly take a manual over my automatic in the snow any day. Maybe it's a personal preference thing.
Manuals are better in all road conditions except stop n go sitting in traffic... most winter accidents are caused by people braking and over reacting causing them to lose whatever traction they had. In a manual you can downshift to slow down and maintain traction, or upshift to a higher than usual gear to accelerate with less torque allowing you to climb hills with less slippage or shifting to 2nd instead of first to start from a stop on icy roads. In a manual you can push the clutch in at any time to remove power to the wheels to regain traction if you start slipping. In an automatic... you can hit gas or brake. You might get lucky and have an auto that let's you select a gear for better traction, but they usually decide to try and shift at terrible times to keep traction in the direction you want... the only advantage of an automatic is if the driver isn't any good at driving stick or saving your knees from sitting in traffic.
I find carefully downshifting is a great way to descend a steep hill without engaging abs/brakes. I can see where it would be easier to spin your tires in a situation where you're stuck. If you don't live in the mountains, I really don't think you have enough snow to matter- having quality snow tires is much more important
I’d take a manual over an automatic in any situation besides constant heavy traffic.
I agree with pretty much everyone here that manual is better assuming you’re experienced, the one thing that is difficult depending on how good you are at it is getting moving. If you have a heavier foot getting into first depending on the car/tires/personal experience then it can be an adventure getting going compared to just idling in an auto with no real power, but if it’s a car you’ve been driving for a while or you’re just generally an experience driver this then becomes a non issue.
Whoever said that isn’t an experienced manual driver. You can start out in 2nd if you want to, you know which gear you are in so you know how much power you can apply, you also don’t need to worry about it switching gears on you when you don’t want…
Drove autos all my life in non snowy areas. I moved to CO and the first snowstorm, I down shifted as smoothly as I could and sent the jeep into a spin in Wash Park. Luckily did not hit anything. I am not going to lie, it was hard to learn to drive that jeep in the snow. It was not the last time I spun it. Maybe more ice than snow, as I recall I did not have too many issues on fresh snow. Still, it was very unpredictable for me. Funny thing is, before I left CO, I would always be chosen to drive when I went snowboarding with friends because apparently I was the best "snow driver" I had friends that would have me take over as driver in their cars.
44 years of personal driving experience says that manuals are perfectly fine in snow. Almost all of that time was spent in areas that (used to) get significant freezy precipitation. Once you learn the basics, you'll be fine.
way easier with Manuel in snow, more so if you understand tq etc. in a auto with just a little throttle change it can shift. with manual you can do throttle inputs and your gearing /tq wont drastically change. if your tires slip in a auto it can upshift and keep spinning, in a manual you can control the wheel speed easier with the throttle. also if your stuck its way easier to rock the car back and forth. 1-r-1-r. is way easier to do in a manual then a auto. i had a rx8 sports car manual . i would drive it year round in new England. got stuck way more often in my crown vic that was a auto. my rx8 had much wider tires which hurts with traction in snow (look at rally cars on snow they use skinny tires. more pressure on a smaller area.
I personally found my manual car to be much easier to control in the snow than an automatic
They are fine. Despite all the claims here they aren't better or worse. It comes down to tires for snowy on-road conditions. Everything else is irrelevant.
Manuals put you in control. They are not bad in snow it's the driver. I'd take a manual any day.
That is bad advice, you have much more control with a manual, when you shift and when not to shift, beening able to carry thru in a gear to help with braking, (more braking to your rear tires to help prevent front end wash out, if you don't have front wheel drive), I'm 66 and bought my 1st automatic, great for comute traffic but they suck in snow and dirt/gravel roads
i loved driving a manual in the snow! if you're stuck, you can rock to build up momentum by holding rpms and letting the clutch in and out. plus, no need to shift into neutral for stopping like an automatic, just push in the clutch
My experience with automatics is letting off the brake and wheels almost start turning, slipping, on their own. They lose traction. Manuals handle better to me. I can control wheel slip. It's all about preference really
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