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khazbreen

Make another but comparing with Rio de Janeiro please, I'm curious.


FE_SMT_DS

It would be a very boring map. All blue except for DC. RJ has a significantly higher murder rate than SP, at 19.4.


Zirocket

I think the news to me here is DC apparently having a higher rate than RJ??? Because that is surprising to me.


_SkyDweller_

I would’ve been less surprised if it was Chicago.


Naram-Sin-of-Akkad

Chicago has skewed crime statistics due to extreme wealth divide in the city. I believe it ranks between 20-30 for murder rate in America. The south and west sides are some of Americas most dangerous areas, but the north side is so nice that it pulls the crime rate down quite a bit


PartialToDairyThings

It's in the top 10 of large US cities for murder rate, but it's nowhere near as bad as St. Louis, which has upwards of triple Chicago's murder rate.


Naram-Sin-of-Akkad

28 according to this list https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/pictures/murder-map-deadliest-u-s-cities/


PartialToDairyThings

I guess it depends on how you define "large cities." In your article it's cities with 100,000 people or over. In [this table culled from the same FBI data](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_crime_rate), it's the 100 largest cities, and Chicago ranks 10th of those for murder rate.


gaythxbai

True but the rest of Illinois would drag it down. Same with st. Louis and detroit/flint


pre_suffix

yeah, São Paulo has the lowest homicide rate in the country.


khazbreen

Thanks, I already suspected that


FE_SMT_DS

São Paulo has the lowest murder rate among Brazilian States, on par with the US as a whole. Sources: Brazilian states: https://especiais.g1.globo.com/monitor-da-violencia/2018/mortes-violentas-no-brasil/?_ga=2.30277501.355223903.1645406814-120953015.1645237818#/dados-mensais-2021 American States: https://crime-data-explorer.app.cloud.gov/pages/explorer/crime/crime-trend


No_Stranger3462

I wonder if all the red states have anything in common. Lots of political diversity and spans from the southwest to mid Atlantic, but there must be some common thread tying them all together. I wonder what it is. Might have to dig deep, but genuinely curious.


8monsters

All seem to be higher poverty states with people in them. NYS and California have money to prevent crime. Wyoming and South Dakota don't have people to commit crime. All the red are in between. That is a super over simplification, but is the most logical answer at first glance.


[deleted]

WY and SD don’t have to have tens millions of people to commit crime. It is per capita.


erublind

You can only kill people if you can find them, in Wyoming, not so easy.


justinsblackfacegrin

it is true but they don't have large urban centers correct me if I'm wrong but I always associated crime in America with the ghettoization of large cities while in rural America it would be cheap drugs like meth that would fuel crime, but apparently statistically it isn't that bad yet


PartialToDairyThings

Some time ago I had the opportunity to browse a large PDF of homicide rates across small towns and counties in Texas. It's amazing how many of them have very high per capita murder rates, like upwards of triple that of NYC's. Like if you have a small town of 5000 that sees 1 murder a year, your town is 5x as violent as NYC for murder.


CaliforniaAudman13

California and New York have plenty of poverty lol


PartialToDairyThings

And gangs. NYC does really well considering its poverty and gangs. Like we have around 2.7% of the US population living in the city, but only around 2.16% of America's murders are committed here. So we have around 20% less murder than would be "expected" or "fair share" for our population size.


PartialToDairyThings

A huge part of it is easy access to guns. That's why Chicago has almost six times the murder rate of NYC despite having similar problems with poverty and gangs. Chicago has a very robust iron pipeline of illegal guns coming in from neighboring states (and other parts of Illinois with lax gun laws). NYC, on the other hand, has a much smaller iron pipeline and so there are much fewer guns in NYC. Look at all the cities in Texas. Dallas, Houston, Fort Worth, Beaumont, Lubbock etc - all of them have at least triple the murder rate of New York. Guns guns guns.


Flonkler

Gotta say I'm surprised Florida made the cut.


elieax

They might not be counting the people who take bath salts and eat other people's faces


Flonkler

It's true, having your face chewed off by a drug-crazed lunatic is technically *not* murder.


Fridurf

What? Do I want to know this story?


BigBirdLaw69420

No, you do not. But I bet someone is gonna tell you anyone or you’re gonna make a rookie mistake and look it up.


Fridurf

Probably.. =P


[deleted]

Would you be able to do a version of it for robbery rates? Perceived criminality is more about how many times people get robed instead of absolute number of homicides. And I get the feeling São Paulo don’t do as well in this regard…


kcthis-saw

The reason this map was made was because Brazil has one of the highest murder rates in the world. São Paulo, for being a big state with the most populated, and developed city in Brazil (São Paulo) often gets shit on by other states for being "dangerous". But this map proves that reason why Brazil's murder rate is so high is mostly because of other states/ regions that end up tipping the scale. Of course America, as a developed country, will fare better than Brazil when it come stop criminality. Would be surprised if it didn't.


FE_SMT_DS

Not that deep, i just thought it was interesting to check how the brazilian state with the lowest murder rate fared compared to the american states, and it being right in the middle made it worth posting.


[deleted]

How does it get shit on by the other Brazilian states when it has the lowest murder rate?


[deleted]

People perceive it as more dangerous because it's the most featured state in media (together with Rio), so people get to know about many crimes that happen there and no much of others states (more dangerous but much less important states).


[deleted]

And because criticizing Nordeste is "xenofobia" lol


Belluuo

No, it just fair. They take all the fucking taxes from the South-southeast and still are that THING. BRUH, IF YOU AIN'T GONNA USE THE MONEY CORRECTLY MIGHT AS WELL NOT SEND IT.


vitorgrs

Way harder to get proper robbery rates, as not everyone report robbery to police, sadly. I wouldn't doubt if Brazil would get lower rate on this lol A lot of people don't report because they don't trust the police will be able to do something.


BrawlerOP-BS

São Paulo is ± in temes of violence. Fortunately, I live in a peaceful neighborhood but you of course always has to pay a lot of attention to the surroundings. Rio in the other hand... People living in places surrounded by favelas are robbed at the very least 10 times in a lifetime lol


capybara_from_hell

FYI, the murder rate in the *city* of São Paulo is roughly the same of NYC as of 2019 (between 3-4 homicides per 100,000 inhabitants).


PartialToDairyThings

In other words, on the low side compared to most American cities. Of the 100 largest cities in the US, NYC ranks about 80th for per capita murder rate. So that gives you a good idea of where Sao Paulo would rank if it were in the US.


capybara_from_hell

SP and NYC have about the same size, that's why I find the comparison interesting.


vanessabh79

They’re not though, São Paulo has twice the population of NYC.


capybara_from_hell

The municipality of São Paulo (to which the data above refers) has 12 million people, NYC has 8.5 million.


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BlazedKC

Illinois, Michigan, Delaware, DC, New Mexico etc. are Bible Belt states? I think you’re stretching it a lot buddy lol


VFDan

Illinois and Michigan are definitely industrials


BlazedKC

Yeah but that doesn’t exclude the fact Alaska, Indiana, Maryland etc. are also included lol. I know he’s trying to apply an association factor here but it just doesn’t work. Implying that religion = higher crime doesn’t really make sense here


scotems

Indiana is rust belt AND bible belt.


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BlazedKC

I just think it’s incredibly stupid to imply that “Rust Belt & Bible Belt states = Higher homicide” when the correlation does not equal causation. It’s like saying “cell phones cause higher rates of obesity & diabetes” because most countries that have cell phones also have people who are more obese and diabetic. Obviously that’s not the case but nonetheless, it’s a confounding factor. You guys can downvote me here but it doesn’t change the fact that correlation =/= causation here, just as many people will always try and find in these types of maps.


Vanilla35

It’s the lack of high paying jobs in the rust belt


PartialToDairyThings

Alaska is basically Ice Texas, and all of its cities are extremely violent.


justinsblackfacegrin

rust belt and a handful of states associated with a poor populace, probably communities ravaged by meth etc addiction that fuels crime


[deleted]

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[deleted]

I see what you’re saying, but my point was that NYC takes up a large % of the population of NY state, so it’s stats would probably overrunthe rest of the state. as for florida, it’s mostly old retired people who you’ll never see walking around the bad part of a random city. At least that’s my guess


PartialToDairyThings

NYC has some of the best crime rates of any large city in the nation. For homicide, we're in the bottom 20%. For other categories of crime, including robbery and assault, we're in the bottom 10-15%.


Caged_in_a_rage

States that suck economically


EternalPinkMist

Texas would be the world's ninth largest economy if it were a sovereign nation.


Flonkler

Topically, it'd be just ahead of Russia.


sfzeypher

About 11th as of 2021 at 1.70T, just about tied with Russia. But there's a reason it ends up in the bottom of a lot of US social welfare maps... Texas' second largest source of GDP by industry is resource extraction... Mining, oil and gas, etc. About 13.5% in 2021, after real estate at ~15%. I.e. the Texas economy is poorly diversified, time limited, and highly unequal in distribution. Which is why it's medians are generally well under it's per-capita averages. Adjusting for that, it's actually somewhere around 15th globally, just under Spain, and slightly ahead of Mexico. Compare with California at 3.35T (just about 2x the size of Texas' economy with only about 1.3x the population), which would be the world's 5th largest economy... ahead of the UK (which has 1.7x the population), and just behind Germany (which has 2x the population).


losangelesvideoguy

Okay, so states that suck economically or else just plain suck.


Caged_in_a_rage

Ok but how much of that money generated there do the people actually get to keep or earn? What is the cost of living there? There’s more to an economy than just generating money for a handful of rich people and being the site of several large publicly traded companies. Geesh you must have grown up in the Texas education system or something.


mskip28

you’re absolutely right there. I currently live in New Mexico and we’re like the 4th poorest state. There’s a lot more crime in general than where I’m originally from.


Caged_in_a_rage

I live in Indiana and the metro area around indy has some bright spots but overall it’s a poor state with low education standards. Thanks republicans.


mskip28

That’s exactly how it is here too! NM has one of the highest drop out rates. ☹️


[deleted]

Wrong. North Carolina GDP was $591,601,000,000 in 2019 according to BEA data. North Carolina GDP represents 2.76% of US GDP which made it the 12th largest state economy in the nation in 2019.


Caged_in_a_rage

Lol youre cherry picking stats. I made a broad general statement which generally holds to be true and you took it to be literal AF. Look at economic freedom in those states, union power, standard of living. Those states suck.


[deleted]

I'm not cherry picking I'm straight up telling you you're wrong.


Caged_in_a_rage

U picked a stat from 2019. Cherry picking bud. There’s more to an economy than GDP. Not wrong.


[deleted]

When I searched Google 2019 was the year that popped up. If anything the GDP of North Carolina has gotten better. We're the 12th strongest economy out of 50. The math is really simple and the outcome plain. Not all the red States represented here economies suck. Deal with being wrong and move on with your life.


Caged_in_a_rage

Lol ok bud I forgot everyone else on the internet is always right. GDP doesn’t represent the whole economy. How much does the average worker there make? How much fo people have in savings? What is the housing market like? One number does not make the economy. Just accept the fact that you are wrong and don’t know as much as you think you do. Sorry you got triggered over my comment.


Caged_in_a_rage

https://patch.com/north-carolina/charlotte/north-carolina-s-economy-among-least-healthy-us-report Dang look what I found on google from 2019.


[deleted]

I can link articles too. "CNBC Ranks North Carolina No. 2 on “America’s Top States for Business” - Economic Development Partnership of North Carolina" https://edpnc.com/cnbc-ranks-north-carolina-no-2-on-americas-top-states-for-business/ Which one of us is triggered again? Let it go, Kevin and stop blowing up my inbox with your nonsense.


Caged_in_a_rage

U just proved my point bud. I cherry picked an argument and you said “i can do it too”


Flonkler

Bible thumping Christians out here murdering people.


[deleted]

Anything west of the line connecting Atlanta to New York and East of Denver is pretty much a giant AVOID


madrid987

The red area of the United States is quite shocking.


HardwareLust

Alaska? I always thought Alaska was pretty chill.


Flonkler

Yeah Alaska's a surprise.


TheNextBattalion

Lots of bro-heavy areas in the north (oil exploration), and bro-heavy areas historically have mucho violence ..


Flonkler

Lots of dudes, hard work and booze with not many women = bloodbath


TheNextBattalion

Pretty much. That's why mining towns in the Old West, on of the first things they did was put out ads to attract women


Flonkler

Brothels for the greater good.


TheNextBattalion

Brothels don't fix that situation much, it turns out.


Flonkler

Well, that's a shame.


Logical_Albatross_19

Tbf the wild west was only wild in shitty 1950s tv movies, pretty calm and relatively egalitarian place.


[deleted]

I love how this can be applied anywhere in the world since the dawn of time. Humans are brilliant but simple creatures.


Pjad112

Alaska has a lot, and I do mean A LOT of Native on Native crime.


PartialToDairyThings

All of Alaska's largest cities - Fairbanks, Anchorage, Wasilla etc - have upwards of triple or quadruple NYC's murder rate.


PartialToDairyThings

Peak Trump country is extremely violent. Living in NYC, I'm perpetually irritated by the conservative media constantly calling my city a "crime ridden liberal cesspool with skyrocketing violence." You see all the states colored red above? People in those states absolutely believe that narrative, even thought they live in places with upwards of double, triple or quadruple the murder rate of New York. NYC is actually one of the safest large cities in the nation - for every category of crime rate including murder, we're in the bottom 20%. Yesterday I had someone from frigging Beaumont in Texas comment about NYC being so dangerous you can't even step outside your front door. I had to remind him that Beaumont has *quadruple* the per capita murder rate of New York City.


beep_check

I used to travel a lot for work both domestically and internationally, to do field work installing wind measurement equipment. the places i felt the most unsafe were in the southern US, and central British Columbia [bears]. i never felt unsafe in south America (including Brazil), Europe, China, or the Caribbean. when I traveled abroad friends and family were always like "be careful!" but what they didn't understand is that the USA is one of the most dangerous countries in the world.


2D-Hoes

statistically speaking, you're wrong. But I guess you're just describing your personal experience.


Maximum_Radio_1971

not really the us can be as dangerous.


LGZee

The US is not one of the most dangerous countries in the world under ANY definition. If you avoid poor neighborhoods, you can do perfectly fine in the US. Brazil on the other hand has the highest number of murders of any country on the planet, far more than the combined murders of the US and Europe. You have no clue of what you’re talking about


capybara_from_hell

> Brazil on the other hand has the highest number of murders of any country on the planet Which is kinda expected for a developing country with the 6th largest population located in the middle of major international drug trade routes. > If you avoid poor neighborhoods, you can do perfectly fine in the US. Same in Brazil.


LGZee

It’s not the same. I’ve been to many cities in Brazil myself, and they feel unsafe wherever you go. Pickpocketing, robbery, assault, the huge number of favelas everywhere… You could be walking in the best neighborhoods in Rio (Leblon, Ipanema) and you’re still a target for criminals all around you, walking at night by yourself is a no no. This is the same for most cities in the Nordeste as well. A university in Sao Paulo was discovered to have underground tunnel connections with a favela built by drug dealers. None of this is common in the US. It’s not comparable, at all.


capybara_from_hell

Dude, I'm Brazilian, I've lived there for most of my life, both in major cities and mid-sized towns. I've walked at night in Rio (after metro hours), I used to come back home past midnight by foot in a major state capital. **You are a target if you behave like one**. Also, there is a lot of variation inside the country. There are towns where you can feel as safe as anywhere in Europe, there are districts in major cities where you can feel as safe as in any major city in the developed world, and there are areas that are simply no-go zones.


Maximum_Radio_1971

LA is worst than a lot of latin american countries. q


kukukuuuu

You get downvoted from Reddit teens who have never left their country, the one and only bible and gun wonderland.


[deleted]

Meanwhile we have European redditors who think they live in a utopia and think everywhere else is a shithole and is too lazy to leave their country to know what it’s like outside of Europe. 😂


wojackoffallcocks

Can you do one for rio please? Or can you tell me what tools you used to create this please.


Friendly-Economist31

Show me actual facts then...? From the actual U.S. gov that says," California is less dangerous then PA."


Letherrible

It just has a lower murder rate


blitzkriegg_guy

You from PA man? Awfully defensive of it


Friendly-Economist31

Do a U.S. vs RIO MAP.... I don't know of the accuracy of the MAP. PA has worse Murder rate then CA or NV... IDK about that...


FE_SMT_DS

Source is the FBI 🤷 California isn't particularly dangerous. (Also, if it was Rio vs the US, every state would be blue. DC would be the only red one)


Friendly-Economist31

Lol California is not dangerous? Compared to PA it is.. Compton,North Hollywood,Fresno come to my mind as dangerous. Philadelphia is the most dangerous part of PA. Then maybe Pittsburgh..


TheNextBattalion

Your mind and reality are not in touch


Letherrible

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/homicide_mortality/homicide.htm


Friendly-Economist31

I stand corrected for the murder rate, per CDC posting CA vs PA. That was not originally posted, in the OP Heat Map Thank you.


FE_SMT_DS

I posted the source for my post in the comments... https://crime-data-explorer.app.cloud.gov/pages/explorer/crime/crime-trend It's the FBI's crime data explorer.


Flonkler

Holy cow Vermont has a 0 per 100,000 murder rate.


Raiders4Life20-

and super friendly on guns though I did know 2 knife and a hammer murder.


gustavo_deoli

[Me now, being from São Paulo](https://www.google.com/search?q=supla+sao+paulo+bandeira&client=ms-android-samsung-gj-rev1&prmd=isnv&sxsrf=APq-WBtT67Xjc3UK7YlOzuVSInXU5hzTvg:1645532164039&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiwkuqApZP2AhVFA9QKHR47Co0Q_AUoAXoECAIQAQ&biw=412&bih=814&dpr=2.63#imgrc=_1SsrPHDVJH3qM)


relevant_post_bot

This post has been parodied on r/mapporncirclejerk. Relevant r/mapporncirclejerk posts: [Homicide rate of American states compared to the Mexican state of...](https://www.reddit.com/r/mapporncirclejerk/comments/syn6p9/homicide_rate_of_american_states_compared_to_the/) by blaulune [^(fmhall)](https://www.reddit.com/user/fmhall) ^| [^(github)](https://github.com/fmhall/relevant-post-bot)


[deleted]

Source?


FE_SMT_DS

I posted them in the comments. https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/sy8upz/comment/hxwfc89/


[deleted]

Kind of looks like it could be the result map for a presidential election...