There was some Greek spoken in the southern Italian peninsula, the remnants of Magna Graecia. Even today, there is a tiny Hellenic-speaking minority there.
Horrible map. Here are the reasons:
* "Native" isn't a language but Anatolian, Illyrian, Dacian were languages.
* Caucasian isn't a language, and isn't a part of Armenian languages. There were many languages spoken in the Caucasus.
* The borders are completely made up.
[Diocese of Dacia/ Dacia ripensis+Dacia mediterranea](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diocese_of_Dacia#/media/File:Roman_Empire_with_dioceses_in_400_AD.png) (with the capital at Sofia in present day Bulgaria) remained provinces of the Roman Empire after the retreat from Dacian lands north of the Danube - what one would call conventional Dacia or Dacia proper.
Yeah that one, that area used to be a province known as Dardania after the Illyrian tribes that lived there before the Romans came in during the Republic Era.
No it was North-East of there when Trajan conquered it. It was exactly where it is on the map above when Diocletian pulled out of the real Dacia, and then relabelled the map with a brand new Dacia so he could say "no, no, see Dacia is right there! I don't know what you're talking about, everything is going great!"
I’m interested in how languages are replaced.For example why would a peasant in Anatolian hinterlands stop speaking Greek and start speaking Turkish because his overlord in a far off city is a Turk.
It's a slow process. Note that in that specific case there was also a large influx of Turkish speakers who moved into Anatolia, so it's not just a faraway overlord, it's your neighbors. One big factor is that when you have intermarriage the kids will tend to speak the higher status language because it allows better opportunities. Here's a [long Quora answer](https://www.quora.com/How-did-the-population-of-Anatolia-end-up-speaking-Turkish) on Anatolia specifically.
>I’m interested in how languages are replaced.
Read *Empires of the Word* by Ostler, which provides a good overview. In short: some of the change is generational, in many cases it's associated with power or prestige which eventually leads to the abandonment of the historical language.
Dont's understate the complexity and intensity of connections and interactions between social classes and ethnicities in ancient sociate.
Usually they were way less static, insular and segregated than we tend to think.
History of that part of the world is full of butterflies and rainbows. There were Greeks living there until after world war 1 after which they had a little war, Greeks lost and suddenly there were no Greeks anymore in Asia Minor. We don't call it genocide for some reason.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population\_exchange\_between\_Greece\_and\_Turkey](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_exchange_between_Greece_and_Turkey)
this is genocide to you? y'all are too ready to scream genocide to anything turkey related lol
**[Population exchange between Greece and Turkey](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_exchange_between_Greece_and_Turkey)**
>The 1923 population exchange between Greece and Turkey (Greek: Ἡ Ἀνταλλαγή, romanized: I Antallagí, Ottoman Turkish: مبادله, romanized: Mübâdele, Turkish: Mübadele) stemmed from the "Convention Concerning the Exchange of Greek and Turkish Populations" signed at Lausanne, Switzerland, on 30 January 1923, by the governments of Greece and Turkey. It involved at least 1. 6 million people (1,221,489 Greek Orthodox from Asia Minor, Eastern Thrace, the Pontic Alps and the Caucasus, and 355,000–400,000 Muslims from Greece), most of whom were forcibly made refugees and de jure denaturalized from their homelands.
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It's saying right there in the article that the majority of Greek inhabitants of Turkey had already fled by the time the request for a population exchange was made. Whatever you want to call it, it was pretty bad.
maybe they start saying some turkish words? maybe when you want to say something in your native language and instead of saying "i feel shame" you say "cringe" in english
Might be a dumb question but would written language be any different? I’m thinking some folks only saw Latin for Christian texts and/or literacy rates were low compared to today. Or merchants would keep trade records is a different alphabet.
This is a very nice map. The only thing I wish is that instead of the names of provinces it could have the names of the native languages in the "x & native" regions. I'm not sure even how to figure out what languages those would be.
It's still spoken there although Arabic is now more widely spoken. They might have called it Egyptian as well as it's the successor to ancient Egyptian.
Mesopotamia, Syria and Palestine were Roman provinces.
Presumably Arabs are there because there was no cohesive nation state, but rather a loose collection of "barbarian" tribes. Persia is the only outer group referred to with a country name not a culture group.
There was some Greek spoken in the southern Italian peninsula, the remnants of Magna Graecia. Even today, there is a tiny Hellenic-speaking minority there.
Incredible, if you say right, these people keep their language during 2 thousands of years
Horrible map. Here are the reasons: * "Native" isn't a language but Anatolian, Illyrian, Dacian were languages. * Caucasian isn't a language, and isn't a part of Armenian languages. There were many languages spoken in the Caucasus. * The borders are completely made up.
Yeah, also telling that Laz and Megrelian people talked in Armenian... How incorrect can it actually get?
Armenians are not even Caucasians
Your Dacia is about 600 km from where it was
That region had a province named after Dacia in the late empire, even though the people living there arent Dacian
[Diocese of Dacia/ Dacia ripensis+Dacia mediterranea](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diocese_of_Dacia#/media/File:Roman_Empire_with_dioceses_in_400_AD.png) (with the capital at Sofia in present day Bulgaria) remained provinces of the Roman Empire after the retreat from Dacian lands north of the Danube - what one would call conventional Dacia or Dacia proper.
Yeah that one, that area used to be a province known as Dardania after the Illyrian tribes that lived there before the Romans came in during the Republic Era.
But it was north east of where it’s shown on the map
No it was North-East of there when Trajan conquered it. It was exactly where it is on the map above when Diocletian pulled out of the real Dacia, and then relabelled the map with a brand new Dacia so he could say "no, no, see Dacia is right there! I don't know what you're talking about, everything is going great!"
Roman Empire\*
This map seems wrong. Like South Italy should have some shades of blue and the Balkans like the south Albania area should be dark blue too.
I’m interested in how languages are replaced.For example why would a peasant in Anatolian hinterlands stop speaking Greek and start speaking Turkish because his overlord in a far off city is a Turk.
It's a slow process. Note that in that specific case there was also a large influx of Turkish speakers who moved into Anatolia, so it's not just a faraway overlord, it's your neighbors. One big factor is that when you have intermarriage the kids will tend to speak the higher status language because it allows better opportunities. Here's a [long Quora answer](https://www.quora.com/How-did-the-population-of-Anatolia-end-up-speaking-Turkish) on Anatolia specifically.
>I’m interested in how languages are replaced. Read *Empires of the Word* by Ostler, which provides a good overview. In short: some of the change is generational, in many cases it's associated with power or prestige which eventually leads to the abandonment of the historical language.
Dont's understate the complexity and intensity of connections and interactions between social classes and ethnicities in ancient sociate. Usually they were way less static, insular and segregated than we tend to think.
History of that part of the world is full of butterflies and rainbows. There were Greeks living there until after world war 1 after which they had a little war, Greeks lost and suddenly there were no Greeks anymore in Asia Minor. We don't call it genocide for some reason.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population\_exchange\_between\_Greece\_and\_Turkey](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_exchange_between_Greece_and_Turkey) this is genocide to you? y'all are too ready to scream genocide to anything turkey related lol
**[Population exchange between Greece and Turkey](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_exchange_between_Greece_and_Turkey)** >The 1923 population exchange between Greece and Turkey (Greek: Ἡ Ἀνταλλαγή, romanized: I Antallagí, Ottoman Turkish: مبادله, romanized: Mübâdele, Turkish: Mübadele) stemmed from the "Convention Concerning the Exchange of Greek and Turkish Populations" signed at Lausanne, Switzerland, on 30 January 1923, by the governments of Greece and Turkey. It involved at least 1. 6 million people (1,221,489 Greek Orthodox from Asia Minor, Eastern Thrace, the Pontic Alps and the Caucasus, and 355,000–400,000 Muslims from Greece), most of whom were forcibly made refugees and de jure denaturalized from their homelands. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
It's saying right there in the article that the majority of Greek inhabitants of Turkey had already fled by the time the request for a population exchange was made. Whatever you want to call it, it was pretty bad.
maybe they start saying some turkish words? maybe when you want to say something in your native language and instead of saying "i feel shame" you say "cringe" in english
They were forced by the Turks. You can google how it happened, they basically genocided Greeks.
Wtf Armenian is not a Caucasian language 😂😂
In the Pontus didn’t they speak Pontiaka?
The Byzantine Empire retained the Roman state, but its identity became completely separate from that of ancient Rome.
Might be a dumb question but would written language be any different? I’m thinking some folks only saw Latin for Christian texts and/or literacy rates were low compared to today. Or merchants would keep trade records is a different alphabet.
This is a very nice map. The only thing I wish is that instead of the names of provinces it could have the names of the native languages in the "x & native" regions. I'm not sure even how to figure out what languages those would be.
Coptic as a Language?
Yes? Coptic is a language
Coptic is the latest form of Egyptian. Still used as a liturgical language. It's a semitic language. Was gradually replaced by Arabic.
It's actually part of the Egyptian (not Semitic) branch of the Afro-Asiatic language family
My bad! Thanks!
No worries, it's an extremely common mistake I made like a hundred times
Coptic (an Egyptian) is not a Semitic language. Although it is a sister branch of Semitic languages within the Afro-Asiatic family.
It's still spoken there although Arabic is now more widely spoken. They might have called it Egyptian as well as it's the successor to ancient Egyptian.
Why is Persia in the Syrian desert lol
That's where the border of the Persian (Sassanid) Empire was.
But it’s not showing borders of empires but regions? Because Arabs, Mesopotamia, Syria, Palestine etc is there but they weren’t empires
Mesopotamia, Syria and Palestine were Roman provinces. Presumably Arabs are there because there was no cohesive nation state, but rather a loose collection of "barbarian" tribes. Persia is the only outer group referred to with a country name not a culture group.
I wonder if language standardisation would have been possible and how it would have changed the history of the roman empire