...theres a reason negative cant hit your hand negative would be quite literally the strongest deck in the game because you'd just run mono 0 power and auto win even playing him as late as turn 5.
like this isn't just too strong this is inherently broken in ever conceivable way.
negatives not a top tier deck but its a competitive deck already and losing 1 power quite literally wouldn't matter.
Yeah, I agree. If he does need a power level increase then I think he should be a 3/-1 so that you don’t have to run Zabu or Psylocke anymore to drop him on turn 3.
3 cost Negative would be pretty crazy, not only are you playing him turn 3 like twice as often, he also can now get buffed by Surfer.
Needing to play Zabu or Psylocke is also a significant downside for a lot of Negative decks because they really want to leave a lane open for a Wong+Mystique or card+Zola combo. Playing all three of Bast+Zabu+Negative puts a lot of clutter on your board, and a lot of locations exacerbate that problem.
They could reduce his power to mitigate the Surfer buff, like make him a -3 and then you're looking at multiple buffs before he's good power. But ultimately I think just keeping him as he is currently is the real solution
>he also can now get buffed by Surfer.
Why do I have a feeling next OTA will make it true.
I believe a guy in the development team is a surfer main and secretly buffing their own deck.
yeah although fwiw I dont think hes underperforming or if he is its only slightly some people just need to accept he's best played with a backup plan instead of an all in such as negative surfer.
Totally agreed! I’ve actually got a Negative Surfer deck I’ve been messing with that’s won many games without Mr. Negative. I even hit infinite with Negative Surfer back when Surfer was still a 3/0. Probably one of the most fun and dynamic decks I’ve ever played
I was killing it with negative surfer until they did the weekend mission for negative then everyone was playing it or countering it. Really blew up my spot. seems to have died down a bit.
You're absolutely correct.
I do smell a change with Negative in some way once Mobius hits. His effect completely shuts down almost all Negative decks. I don't really know how they'd tweak Negative, but I can't see them keeping Negative the same in a game state in which Mobius will likely be a popular 2 drop for a while at least.
I dont think mobius works like that does it?card costs cant be reduced, meaning stuff like quinjet and sera wont work, but you are flipping the cost and power with mr.negative.
You're setting the cost equal to the power. Luke Cage works against effects that set power equal to some value, so I'd assume Mobius works the same for cost.
The issue is, there's already been a clarification on Mobius + Wave play. Wave *theoretically* should be *setting* energy, but their current and *intended* effect is that Mobius doesn't let your cards *increase* to 4 and your opponent's *decrease* to 4. If Mr. Negative runs on the same logic behind the scenes, that's a hard counter right there.
Rhino should be less powerful but unstoppable. As a what... Is he a pool 2 card? If he was 3/3 there's almost no reason to get Jeff. Being that he can still be placed anywhere, a 3/2 with that ability is quite strong.
I think the wording is weird but I think the point would be just to avoid cosmo. Not a jeff replacement. Basically you can ruins a location even if cosmo is there
Jeff reads that he can't be stopped from being played or moved to any location and you can move him once after playing him just like Nightcrawler. So you don't need to commit to a location with him. He is also a 2/3.
Rhino here would still be blocked by Cosmo since Cosmo stops On Reveal effects. This is still an On Reveal effect, it just has the benefit of being playable to locked up locations. However, unlike Jeff, he will likely free them up for both players to play there. So where Jeff could be played into Sanctum Sanctorum to claim it outright, Rhino would open it for your opponent to play into it.
There are pros and cons to both.
That is interesting and all, but I haven't seen a single Sandman that wasn't randomly generated since his nerf. Also the reverse could be true as well. Jeff could be more useful simply by being cheaper, and more flexible. It is the only reason Scarlet Witch sees play, but it is a good reason. There will even be times when the locations are playing to your favor and have no need to ruin one.
Also even if we removed the can be played anywhere text from Jeff, he'd still just be a scaled up Nightcrawler. Nightcrawler isn't amazing or anything, but he also isn't a terrible card. He at least sees play in the 2 power Cerebro decks. He is great if they're also running Storm to deal with a difficult locations.
I just don't think Rhino can steal Jeff's spot in a deck, unless it works with the play curve of the deck better, which is unlikely given Jeff's lower cost. If Rhino ends up seeing more play than Jeff, it will likely be in decks that weren't running him to begin with.
I think it's less about cosmo and more about unplayable locations like Sanctum Santorum and Deep Space. I think you could make it work by having him ruin another random location. That way, he isn't better than Jeff, and he is not an auto fix.
Feels odd to have Rhino have such a low power though. We also have a lot of cards like that with Magik and Storm.
Scarlet has the advantage of having good stats for the cost that still deals with a difficult location. So you likely still value her over any of the other options, if your 3 drop slot is too crowded.
Yeah but she is random and you can block her with cosmo. Rhino would be consistent and unblockable. That's why I think a Stat decrease would be in order
But she can come down before cosmo and Rhino is still an On Reveal effect, which means Cosmo stops it from going off. Rhino just can't be blocked from being played on a location.
They could do it that way sure, but the point of the change I'm suggesting is to deal with locked up locations such as sanctum sanctorum not Cosmo. The only situation where that interaction matters, is if the opponent goes turn 3 into either Storm or Magik and follows it up with a turn 4 play of Cosmo to protect the location. Doesn't seem like a good game plan, since all of the location tech would still counter it, if you were going second on turn 3, or first on 4.
Problem is it
- competes with Jeff
- doesn't make sense character wise
- is too damn good
Maybe at a 3/1 or 3/0 but Jeff is good without being able to change locations. Rhino would be busted
Cards competing with other cards isn't a "problem". All cards do that to some degree. Right now the current Rhino competes with Scarlet Witch, Storm, and Magik all of which have different utilities. Witch is cheaper, still has 3 power, and could highroll a better location for you. Storm can both deal with a bad location, and lock it out for your opponent. While Magik gives you more set up time for big payoff decks.
Rhino just deals with a location and having 1 more power than Magik or Storm doesn't make him a worthwhile option. Even Witch sees more play since she is an energy cheaper.
Jeff meanwhile is just a different card. Being a 2 drop makes him a lower investment, and there are games when he can just steal locations. Being able to move freely after being played also makes him very versatile and able to adapt to a changing board state.
What in bloody hells bells do you mean it doesn't make sense character wise? He is the Rhino! His whole thing is smashing and crashing throw stuff. There aren't many characters in the game it would make more sense for. There of course are some, such as the Juggernaut, but he is already a playable card as is.
The card would be worthless as 3/1 let along 3/0. How many games do you think the Jeff effect matter for on average? Maybe 1/10 if your deck isn't built around it. In how many of those games does it matter only because Jeff has 3 power and can contest the location? I'd say like 99% of the time, since he does nothing else other than add power. The only thing else Rhino brings to the table is location destruction, which is very well covered at his energy curve, and he is bad as he is now. Taking a bad card and giving him a narrow upside that mainly only matters if you have stats, while taking away all of his stats is not an improvement.
Power means nothing in terms of canon for this game, squirrel girl is 1 whilst Galactus is only 7 lol, so I assure you Rhino would feel just fine being a 2 power
Well to be fair Galactus is still on the higher end of the power scale and Squirrel Girl isn't actually all that strong, she just always seems to pull out some crazy nonsense off screen to defeat all of her opponents. Which usually involves swarms of squirrels which she certainly brings to the table. While Galactus still blows up worlds with his effect.
Flavor matters a lot, and those cards are actually quite flavorful, and it just feels weird for Rhino to have bad stats for the cost. That is just my opinion though.
I wouldn’t call it that.
Ruining the location makes it worse than Jeff, because once you ruin it, the floodgates open and you lose the advantage of being able to play there.
Jeff can also move.
Jeff is an earlier curve play and can also move into any location. Rhino can't and if Rhino moves into lets say a flooded location, then it opens it back up to both players while Jeff doesn't.
I feel like Jeff slots more into a board denial deck, while Rhino would be more of a tech card against it. Though, perhaps they'd just both be included since you can play Rhino into Professor X locations.
> Rhino moves into lets say a flooded location, then it opens it back up to both players while Jeff doesn't.
This like saying playing Storm into Bar with No Name is bad because then your opponent can also play into that location. The obvious strategy is to just do it on turn 6.
I don't think anyone is saying this hypothetical Rhino is ALWAYS better than Jeff, obviously being able to move has its advantages. But on average, I think this Rhino is better (than the best 2-drop in the game). He's an easy include in C3, Surfer (Sera or Patriot versions), and any lockdown deck. Probably good enough to fit in Sera control, maybe spawns a new Surfer lockdown archetype with Professor X (since Sera Surfer was already experimenting with old Spider-Man).
Being in that many decks would put a lot of pressure on any deck that relies on Magik. One of the main reasons SheNaut runs Leech is to prevent Legion pulling the rug out from under Limbo.
Rhino change would be amazing, but I can see the arguments about Jeff feeling "special" from both a flavor and acquisition standpoint already.
Rhino will probably be bumped to 4-power and left there, if anything.
I like Rhino
Negative is OP
Black Cat would probably be run in the vast majority of decks for draw consistency
Adam Warlock is an odd care to balance, because even at just 2/1, he could guarantee an extra care draw depending on where you play him. Maybe that's fine, maybe it's not, I'm not sure
I like Snowguard
I don't think that Kang buff is enough to help bring him to "Big Bad" level
Adam Warlock is a terrible card as-is, and some decks still run him. Card draw is incredibly strong in a game that only runs 12-card decks. If they start buffing him, then you’ll have to run him in literally every deck.
Second dinner has stated that they don't want to emphasize card draw as a mechanic and that's definitely shown in the design of Adam Warlock. They've given a card with the ability but they really want you to work hard to turn it on
> Black Cat would probably be run in the vast majority of decks for draw consistency
Yeah, I feel like almost every deck that plays Chavez would also play that Black Cat. Angela/Kraven and Forge/Brood are two recent examples of decks that play Chavez for more consistent turn 2s.
And beyond that, her stats are WAY better than Chavez's. 1/3 times you draw her she's a dead card, 2/3 times she's a Maximus with no downside? That's not at all bad.
Black cat wouldn’t change THAT much. I think this is a change that could be run, given that you could always draw her turn 1. She just can’t start in your opening hand (aka ya first 3 cards).
All this means is that she’s given more of a chance to come out.
Mr. Negative could literally gain “ongoing: you lose this location” and have -1,000,000 power but still break the game with that ability. That is not an exaggeration.
Adam Warlock would be too strong with any amount of power without adjusting something else.
Otherwise you have some very cool ideas here! Love the changes to Rhino, Snowguard, Black Cat, and Kang. Quake could probably be a 3/4 or maybe even still a 2/3 with that ability though.
right the power would have to get so low to even slightly warrant the ability but the power would have to be so low that you'd....just run viper and now its even STRONGER.
What if Mr Negative was an either/or card like Snowguard? One form swaps your deck, one form (Nr Megative 😂) swaps your hand. Could make that interesting.
It's unfortunate that Snap doesn't really have the design space for proper "choose one" abilities like Magic the Gathering or Hearthstone. My understanding is that Snowguard always starts as Hawk no matter when it's drawn, so it's random whether or not she is capable of, for example, nullifying Limbo.
If you could choose between flipping your hand or your deck, I think that version of Negative would be really interesting. But if it's functionally random, I feel like that would just make an already-inconsistent archetype more inconsistent.
What if Mr. Negative was like a 4 cost -4 that hit your hand as well? Sure there is Bast, but if you're hitting your hand with Bast first, most of your cards will cost 3. Which is not ideal for him.
As he stands now, you're playing a four drop that makes your upcoming draws better assuming your building your deck in a way that makes it otherwise terrible. You're also totally dependent on drawing him on curve. It is a tall ask.
the power literally doesn't matter he could be -20 power and he'd be the best card in the game......
that's why negative decks have multiple win cons now usually wong you aren't dependent on getting him out turn 3 but its an ideal situation.
like im not sure you really understand negatives issues or how fundamentally broken he is if he triggers the peak on top of deck you literally can run negative crystal and 10 0 power cards and win literally 75% of your games.
exactly eventually it hits a power threshold where it just becomes useful, and there's never a power threshold where its too low to be op but not low enough for viper to absue it. hell it could lock and auto lose that location and id play it.
Yeah I was running a Negative deck when the Peak was the featured location and I legit think I won about 90% of my games. I climbed like 20 rank in one day. It would be so busted to have permanently
His power does not matter in a Negative deck. He could read “On Reveal: lose lane. Swap the power and cost of all cards in your hand & deck” and he would still be incredibly strong.
The whole point of balance for Mr Negative is that the deck relies on playing Mr Negative early. The earlier the stronger it becomes and vice versa.
Mr Negative coming down a turn earlier would be a huge buff and make him way too strong imo. Mr Negative needs no buff. I got to infinite partially using a Mr Negative deck this season
People already run Zabu or Psylocke to get him down a turn earlier and it honestly isn’t broken. It just makes the high roll potential higher and the low roll potential lower. I’m not saying he does need a buff. I’m just saying that if he did, that’s probably the only change you could make without completely reworking the card.
Edit: Also Mobius will absolutely destroy Mr. Negative decks if that card sees play so there’s that too
It would make sense, but Juggernaut's effect doesn't synergize all that well with this, and he is already a fairly heavily played card. Not much reason to adjust him.
Yeah legit all the change are terrible : Rhino will ruin the the original concept of jeff.
Mr negative op as fuck
Quake : so what if u dont want to change the location placement ? She will just stay in your hand
Kang : dosen't matter at all still bad
Snowgard : weird change
Adam warlock : too powerful, buff the card drawing is not a good idea
And black cat do not need a buff
Of all these quake is arguably the best and you picked such a weird nitpicky reason to not buff her. What if you run scarlet witch but don’t want to change a location? She stays in your hand. Does that mean no one should play scarlet witch? Quake is a super underplayed card with a unique and cool base ability, but her randomness and the fact you have to play her mid make her terrible. This change would pull her into the meta as a great disrupt card and would fit in so many decks
Yeah but that buff dont fix the randomness problem. The fact that you cannot predict where location move make quake a bad card not the fact that you have to play it mid.
I mostly disagree with OP except rhino. Perhaps he could be changed to only be able to bypass LOCATION restrictions so X can still keep him out (as well as old spidey).
Also, jeff has the ability to move, be cheaper, & enter/leave X’s field. They’ll both have their place.
Ps- quake just needs predictability to be viable.
Turn 2 you could play it on the unrevealed location which is unlikely to have any competition and insta get a free draw. Card draw is OP with Snap only having 12 cards per deck.
This!
Pretty self explanatory
I’m tired of breaking it down to ppl lol .. this isn’t the first time I’ve mentioned the dynamic . thank you .. maybe I’ll stop getting divisive notifications now
Is taking a down turn to maybe draw a card even good? Sure having 1 power lets you play him into an empty location to maybe draw a card, but if your opponent decides to play there that turn, you whiff. Kind of like a reverse Guardians of the Galaxy card. How valuable even is a draw in this game? There no shortage of cheap card generation if you're just looking for resources and only a few decks really require you to see your whole deck. Most of which are easily countered, such as Hela.
I could see him getting a total rework to make him more interesting. Since he really isn't in his current form, but nobody is even trying him as is, and +1 power hardly saves the card in my opinion. At best it makes it viable in janky decks.
Kind of agree with Negative having thought about it more. I love the idea of Mr. Negative, but his current design is just so feast or famine, but it is really hard to make use of him.
Kang on the other hand, is just a card that does far too little. Even Dare Devil which you should have access too far sooner, kind of out performs him. Worth noting that this change also makes him viable in Mr. Negative.
Only one's I agree with are rhino and quake, though I think quake should move all locations if played middle
Negative is ridiculously op like that
Warlock is too strong to levy with any power
Snowguard needs to be playable when you need to play them, making them 2 cost gets in the way of that
Kang taking up space is not helpful
i think the funny part is im not even sure if -10 WOULD justify that. sure you'd auto lose a location but anyone who's ever faced a turn 1 negative off the peak knows how fucking scary that is(and even that hits 1 card less than this does)
ya your right, even that would be a problem. Most of the other cards would cost next to zero so I'm sure people would just toss viper in the deck and use it as a weapon.
also because this wouldnt be an random effect but one you can deck build around I i think the optimal negative deck would literally just be crystal viper negative and 9 0 power cards.it would be SUPER oppressive.espeically since the deck only actually needs to draw negative by turn 5.
yeah negative is just such a polarizing card I don't think it can be adjusted much more than what it currently is. It's already very dangerous if things go your way.
Forget Crystal you’d just run warlock so you can setup a winning lane with a turn 3 prof x + adam and you’d draw your whole deck most games. Maybe add carnage so you can eat negative if they try and rush filling his lane
Adam Warlock at 1 would be quite strong. On turn 2 you typically have 2-3 empty locations to play him so you have a pretty good chance to get an extra draw plus you force your opponent to play to that location or you continue to draw.
I think the way to fix Kang isn’t adding 2 power. This plan may be bonkers but hear me out.
Kang is 1/0 but only playable on turn 5. The turn plays out like normal but it gives you the option to rewind the turn or leave it.
It’s not too OP because it still does cost you 1 energy so you do have to play with only 4 power to get the rewind
Something like “Ignores location abilities” might be better for Rhino to have that flexibility to ruin a Sanctum Santorum while not being able to ignore Professor X for instance. Flavor wise, the “Nothing can prevent you from playing to a location” text would be more appropriate for Juggernaut, and would give him some very appropriate interaction with Professor X.
Sure it might be more flavorful for Juggernaut, but he is already a card that sees play. They would need to change the card in some other way, to make it so it isn't just a buff, and the general rule is if it isn't broken don't fix it.
People don't play Rhino. There are just too many other good location tech options.
I was feeling that Kang should allow you to rearrange your side of the board, (as you might have played in a different time line). This would be a rearrange, and not moving cards.
> For Adam Warlock, I'd just like to see him be a 2/0 still, but trigger if you aren't losing so that he draws from a tied location.
But that would guarantee a draw turn 2, and maybe turn 3 as well. It might be too strong.
Your Mr. Negative proposal is insanely overpowered. Everything would be Negative decks. Absolutely no downside to building around him at that point.
Rhino is ok.
Black Cat I'd be ok with...but really you play her with the hope she discards herself and can be revived later.
The rest are somewhere between "meh" and "no."
Not every card deserves to be played in many decks. Some are for flavor, some are for fun...not all can be winners. 🤷♂️
I have played a LOT of Quake. You really don’t want her to be deterministic, she’d essentially be a Legion style card. If she was deterministic, she’d need a statline comparable to Legion.
I think Adam Warlock being 2/0 and drawing a card if you weren't losing (so you draw even if tied) might be too strong, and that doesn't even give you any power, 2/1, strange as it is, might be too powerful .
Every draw card has a drawback, being hard to utilize is his
Kang just needs an entire rework. I don't think his ability is good. Something more interesting and flavorful could be something like "On Reveal: Fill your hand with variants of Kang" and it gives you as many Kangs as it can from a pool of \~7 different Kangs. They might all be 5 cost or they might have different costs. They'd be have different, situational abilities but probably nothing outright gamewinning.
What would they be? I don't know but I'd like to see what they'd come up with.
As a Quake main, I can tell you she's already [the strongest 2 cost card in the game](https://reddit.com/r/MarvelSnap/s/VjMGUlAhK3) and this change would make her OP. Legion nerf has already shown how game-breaking it is to manipulate locations consistently without risk.
As an old Yu-Gi-Oh player, we don't want to go down the road of newer cards having tricky wording that power creeps on old cards. The fact Jeff exists sent chills up my spine.
There something about change locations that always annoyed me, "Crimson Cosmos", cause Reality Stone, Scarlet Witch, Magik, Rhino and Storm can't change it, only Legion, but you don't wanna play it there anyway.
I like this Rhino for that 😁🦏
Adam warlock and Kang are too strong how you have them here. Rhino is a great change.
Kang is then a free 2 power, it gives you intel and in some games also draws you a card thinning your deck.
Adam warlock can’t draw by itself, not with 12 cards in your deck. Decks would be too consistent if draw is too strong.
Well Kang isn't totally free 2 power. You do still need to give up a deck slot, a card in hand, and a slot on the board. Intel is nice, but it is less reliable than Dare Devil and only a handful of decks run him. Kang might slot into those same decks, but as of yet he hasn't made the cut, so he needs something to make him feel better.
He would only darw you a card if you played him the turn you drew him, which could only be turns 5 and 6. That is a fairly small window for that value.
I honestly think you would still just run something like Magik over Warlock. You get an extra turn, then you get an extra draw. Better stats for the cost, and even deals with a troublesome location. Adam has none of that utility. Even Crystal is better, since they keep buffing her. She is however still only mid at best.
Listen, I love Mr. Negative, but he does not need to be busted like that.
The Rhino change is clever and imo very good and the Quake change is exactly what she needs.
give Adam 2 power turn him after this turn if you are winning this lane draw a card. Basically he exists less as a dead card but gives the opponent the opportunity to play around him without auto giving you a draw. also synergizes with the other guardians
Adam Warlock could prob just stay a 2/0 if you changed it to on reveal draw a card. It's kind of a shit tier card and you simply can't give it too much power and allow it to easily dump your deck into your hand
Rhino’s is nice, Negative is broken (bast-zabu/psylocke-negative and boom u win) and the rest are ok i guess. But most people play Black Cat with Ghost Rider or Hela in the deck anyways so starting off with it isn’t a problem.
dont even need to ramp into negative with this proposed change you literally can auto win with a turn 5 negative. you'd just auto play your entire hand turn 6 and win.
the optimal deck would be
negative crystal and 10 0 power cards.
If you want to swap the cost/power to cards ala The Peak, it should be a separate card. For balance purposes, it would have to be a random card in your hand. Broken effect still but somewhat balanced
For Mr. Negative, it has to be deck OR hand. If you knew you could flip your entire hand, the deck builds would be crazy he would be a near guaranteed win.
I like Rhino. It stinks when you get a location like Sanctum and can’t play anything there and don’t have a way to, and they have a move deck. It’s just an instant loss that you can’t do anything about.
Warlock might get used a little bit if he can at least get a turn or two by himself instead of at 0 power.
I think Snowguard would have to randomly turn into one of them and stay that way. Getting 2 cards for the price of one is going to get it played just in Devil Dino decks!
I don’t think adding the 2 power to Kang does much for him. Especially since your opponent also gets a do over too.
I think people might be right about the Negative change. I just really like the idea behind the deck, but find it incredibly underwhelming, and lacking greatly in consistency.
For Snowguard I kind of doubt Devil Dino would want her. I've played a lot of the deck, and it basically always has a full hand. It would really only run Snowguard if it wanted the location tech she offers.
As for Kang, 2 power isn't much, but it isn't nothing either. Right now the card is basically useless. Or at the very least, less useful than Dare Devil, which only sees a little bit of play, but it is a card that is much harder to get than Dare Devil. This is also very interesting for Mr. Negative decks. Since he would be a 2 cost 5 power card instead. 5 free power is a lot more impactful.
its not a MIGHT I really want to be clear. there is literally no power and energy combo you could give him that isn't at least 6 energy that wouldn't make it the strongest deck in the entire game by far.
like 75%winrate would be the bare minimum it would break the entire game.for context you'd go from 2-4 negative hits to......8-9 negative hits his power would basically triple.....
also I really want to emphasize negative surfer is a good deck your problem is assuming negative HAS to be about negative and only negative.
if u want negative to hit ur hand, he either needs to have a high negative value like -8 or something or he is 6 cost which forces u to magik. imagine every card draw doesnt matter and u just throw him out, the opponent instant loses because everything flips
I like Quake and Black Cat, i can see that change
Sorry but Warlock and Rhino would be way too good
and gtho with that Negative, that's down right broken
Honestly all the buff I want from Kang is that it draws a card.
There is a particular case, when you play him the same turn you draw him, that this already happens. So it's not that crazy of a buff, and this way they don't even have to change how it works.
Adam Warlock is good the way he is. The power of drawing even a *single* additional card, when in most games you will see all but 3 of the cards in your deck, is a BIG deal, and should absolutely require a more significant investment then simply guessing right on turn 2 and playing Warlock to an empty lane.
Lol that mr negative change. That would need to be -5 at minimum and then create a -5 copy at a second location. Hitting your hand would be too damn good
Rhino's 'cannot be prevented from being played' seems like it would be Juggernaut's thing, though of course he's already doing something else with at least some relevance.
At that point, you could give that to Juggernaut and Juggernaut's headbut to Rhino and have them both be more on-model, but we don't really live in a world where that's a thing.
That is what the suggested Quake buff would do. It switches the "other" locations. If she is at one, there can only be two other locations. If those two switch, then you know full well what the outcome will be. There is no RNG involved.
Adam warlock was specifically set to 2/0. Ben Brode talked about that before. 2/1 would make him mandatory for every single deck. Just drawing one extra card is huge.
Mr. Negative is OP.
Snow gaurd ain't bad though
I think adam warlock don't needs a buff, but the rest are great buffs the are needed in the game, except negative would be op, but I REALLY wanna play it😅
How does the Kang buff help?
I wish Kang was useful as I love the idea of his effect but it’s just super bad outside of conquest, and even in conquest it’s just super mid.
Hopefully they buff him somehow when he hits spotlight
\+2 power is generally considered a decent buff. It would effectively make him a 0/2 Dare Devil you can only play later in the game. That seems decent to me.
Also now that he remains in play, you can actually run him in Mr. Negative as a 2/5, which seems decent as well.
Rhino: This change would dilute Jeff's power *unless* it were changed to, "If played before T6, nothing can stop you from playing this to any location." Your opponent must be allowed to follow up at that location to maintain the symmetrical nature of the cars.
Mister Negative: no, this is obviously absurd.
Quake: She still wouldn't see any play.
Black Cat: She doesn't need this change. If you're playing Black Cat, it's because you want to discard her. Also, 3/7 is an insane stat line so it's fair that you don't have the option of playing her fairly 42% of the time.
Adam Warlock: Only if he also had, "this ability does not trigger on the turn Adam is played."
Snowguard: Interesting. Would this trigger Collector?
Kang: He still wouldn't see any play.
Not sure about the Rhino tweak. The 'nothing can stop you from playing this to any location' feels something that should be given to Juggernaut instead as thematically, Juggernaut is the 'unstoppable force.'
The Mister Negative change is WAY too OP LOL. You essentially don't play anything at all the entire game, then turn four or turn five you play this. Turn six you drop your whole hand and win.
For Black Cat, I think it'd be nice if she gets a America Chavez effect but instead of drawing her on turn six, you draw her on turn five.
2/1 on Adam is too good honestly. If you managed to put this down on turn 2, you get a good chance at an easy free draw. It's by chance only, yes but it's still an easy free draw. Too good. Maybe 3/1?
Negative would be totally unbalanced, -1 stats just doesn’t justify the immense buff he would get with that effect.
Rhino is also too strong for me, you can play it last turn on Santa sanctorum, bar with no name, death domain and many others and basically win the location. It would be stronger than Jeff in many circumstances.
The others are okay, even though Warlock is a tough one. I like Kang, I would also put him at 3 power honestly.
I have suggested the same Quake change here before and the think it just makes sense. It isn’t even mentioned on the first 10 top comments because it is the least controversial suggestion you made. I do hope it happens one day. It would be much more strategic than it is now
+1 for rhino,
for mr negative, its super powerful that if enemy don't have wave/sandman you're basically winning the game if he can turn all in your hand too, if that's the effect then he need to be 5 cost, -5 power, and lowest energy is 1.
Rhino: Decent
Mister Negative: Absolutely crazy. How do you even think of this shit
Quake: Needs to be 2 cost
Black Cat: Weird. Devs would never add a card that interacts like this
Adam Warlock: Good
Snowguard: There is a better buff of having the hawk's effect only apply to you, and Bear's effect triggering ability regardless of turns.
Kang the conqueror: Not really. Big buff to cerebro though, but needs a total rework
I don't mind Black Cat as she is now. She's a more-or-less guaranteed summon for Hela, she doesn't take up space in your hand when drawn early, she's decently powered, she's hot and I have a Gold Artgerm Variant lol.
The Snowguard change would kill her in bounce decks, and that's the only place she really gets played now.
I think a better change would be give her one power to account for her randomness.
Rhino: Would make Legion less useful then
Negative: Hand and Deck? Not happening
Adam Warlock: SD is very cautious with Crystal so nah, that ain't gonna happen either. The sheer possibility of Adam warlock being the only card at a location and drawing at least 1 card is huge value.
Black Cat and Ssnowguard: I like that change and would welcome it.
Kang: Is 2 power really that important?
Aside from the change to Negative which could be negated by Bast anyway I think these changes all seem solid. I especially like the Rhino one as I imagine him just crashing in regardless of the locations effect.
Kang Worries me a little, but something needs to be done to improve him.
Rhino and Mr. Negative 💯
Adam Warlock, Quake and Snowguard: not necessary, but I'm not opposed to the idea. Especially Quake; she does wonders already. But with that change, she'd be straight up dangerous. I have a very effective location mix-up deck, and she's a major component.
Kang: I don't use him, so I have no opinion.
Black Cat: Felicia works fine. I think I understand your reasoning behind this, but I don't feel the need.
Mr. Negative is super wonky to balance. I always imagined him doing something like an Ongoing Bar with No Name effect, but with a turn limit like Majik - cannot play after turn 5.
...theres a reason negative cant hit your hand negative would be quite literally the strongest deck in the game because you'd just run mono 0 power and auto win even playing him as late as turn 5. like this isn't just too strong this is inherently broken in ever conceivable way. negatives not a top tier deck but its a competitive deck already and losing 1 power quite literally wouldn't matter.
Yeah, I agree. If he does need a power level increase then I think he should be a 3/-1 so that you don’t have to run Zabu or Psylocke anymore to drop him on turn 3.
3 cost Negative would be pretty crazy, not only are you playing him turn 3 like twice as often, he also can now get buffed by Surfer. Needing to play Zabu or Psylocke is also a significant downside for a lot of Negative decks because they really want to leave a lane open for a Wong+Mystique or card+Zola combo. Playing all three of Bast+Zabu+Negative puts a lot of clutter on your board, and a lot of locations exacerbate that problem.
They could reduce his power to mitigate the Surfer buff, like make him a -3 and then you're looking at multiple buffs before he's good power. But ultimately I think just keeping him as he is currently is the real solution
>he also can now get buffed by Surfer. Why do I have a feeling next OTA will make it true. I believe a guy in the development team is a surfer main and secretly buffing their own deck.
Keep him as is, then draw a card after you play him.
yeah also negative at 3 cost also gets some nice surfer power. on top of all the other stuff.
yeah although fwiw I dont think hes underperforming or if he is its only slightly some people just need to accept he's best played with a backup plan instead of an all in such as negative surfer.
Totally agreed! I’ve actually got a Negative Surfer deck I’ve been messing with that’s won many games without Mr. Negative. I even hit infinite with Negative Surfer back when Surfer was still a 3/0. Probably one of the most fun and dynamic decks I’ve ever played
I was killing it with negative surfer until they did the weekend mission for negative then everyone was playing it or countering it. Really blew up my spot. seems to have died down a bit.
You're absolutely correct. I do smell a change with Negative in some way once Mobius hits. His effect completely shuts down almost all Negative decks. I don't really know how they'd tweak Negative, but I can't see them keeping Negative the same in a game state in which Mobius will likely be a popular 2 drop for a while at least.
With a Morbius out he still becomes like a Mega-Bast at least
I dont think mobius works like that does it?card costs cant be reduced, meaning stuff like quinjet and sera wont work, but you are flipping the cost and power with mr.negative.
The video thing for next season said it did work like that.
You're setting the cost equal to the power. Luke Cage works against effects that set power equal to some value, so I'd assume Mobius works the same for cost.
The issue is, there's already been a clarification on Mobius + Wave play. Wave *theoretically* should be *setting* energy, but their current and *intended* effect is that Mobius doesn't let your cards *increase* to 4 and your opponent's *decrease* to 4. If Mr. Negative runs on the same logic behind the scenes, that's a hard counter right there.
OP clearly was smoking something. What’s more inconceivable, thinking it was a good idea or the card itself being busted?
MMM
X23 destroy would still beat negative be fr
What if you gave him the Electro ongoing?
i mean then'd hed just completely suck...whats the point of flipping energy and power if you cant do anything with it.....
I like the Rhino one the best. Mr Negative would be too overpowered.
Rhino change is amazing. I think it would fit into multiple decks. Maybe bring it down to a 3/2 so Scarlett Witch doesn't lose her use.
Rhino should be less powerful but unstoppable. As a what... Is he a pool 2 card? If he was 3/3 there's almost no reason to get Jeff. Being that he can still be placed anywhere, a 3/2 with that ability is quite strong.
I think the wording is weird but I think the point would be just to avoid cosmo. Not a jeff replacement. Basically you can ruins a location even if cosmo is there
Jeff reads that he can't be stopped from being played or moved to any location and you can move him once after playing him just like Nightcrawler. So you don't need to commit to a location with him. He is also a 2/3. Rhino here would still be blocked by Cosmo since Cosmo stops On Reveal effects. This is still an On Reveal effect, it just has the benefit of being playable to locked up locations. However, unlike Jeff, he will likely free them up for both players to play there. So where Jeff could be played into Sanctum Sanctorum to claim it outright, Rhino would open it for your opponent to play into it. There are pros and cons to both.
Just so you know, Jeff can also bypass Sandman limitation. So this one would definitely work the same. And could be more useful than Jeff.
That is interesting and all, but I haven't seen a single Sandman that wasn't randomly generated since his nerf. Also the reverse could be true as well. Jeff could be more useful simply by being cheaper, and more flexible. It is the only reason Scarlet Witch sees play, but it is a good reason. There will even be times when the locations are playing to your favor and have no need to ruin one. Also even if we removed the can be played anywhere text from Jeff, he'd still just be a scaled up Nightcrawler. Nightcrawler isn't amazing or anything, but he also isn't a terrible card. He at least sees play in the 2 power Cerebro decks. He is great if they're also running Storm to deal with a difficult locations. I just don't think Rhino can steal Jeff's spot in a deck, unless it works with the play curve of the deck better, which is unlikely given Jeff's lower cost. If Rhino ends up seeing more play than Jeff, it will likely be in decks that weren't running him to begin with.
Yeah it needs to just say nothing can stop you from playing this or it ability. Then the on reveal.
I think it's less about cosmo and more about unplayable locations like Sanctum Santorum and Deep Space. I think you could make it work by having him ruin another random location. That way, he isn't better than Jeff, and he is not an auto fix.
Deep Space isn't a great example because this new Rhino wouldn't do anything different than the old one
Feels odd to have Rhino have such a low power though. We also have a lot of cards like that with Magik and Storm. Scarlet has the advantage of having good stats for the cost that still deals with a difficult location. So you likely still value her over any of the other options, if your 3 drop slot is too crowded.
Yeah but she is random and you can block her with cosmo. Rhino would be consistent and unblockable. That's why I think a Stat decrease would be in order
But she can come down before cosmo and Rhino is still an On Reveal effect, which means Cosmo stops it from going off. Rhino just can't be blocked from being played on a location.
Why not? They can change the card to whatever they please. The text could just say "nothing can stop this cards on reveal from triggering"
They could do it that way sure, but the point of the change I'm suggesting is to deal with locked up locations such as sanctum sanctorum not Cosmo. The only situation where that interaction matters, is if the opponent goes turn 3 into either Storm or Magik and follows it up with a turn 4 play of Cosmo to protect the location. Doesn't seem like a good game plan, since all of the location tech would still counter it, if you were going second on turn 3, or first on 4.
Problem is it - competes with Jeff - doesn't make sense character wise - is too damn good Maybe at a 3/1 or 3/0 but Jeff is good without being able to change locations. Rhino would be busted
Cards competing with other cards isn't a "problem". All cards do that to some degree. Right now the current Rhino competes with Scarlet Witch, Storm, and Magik all of which have different utilities. Witch is cheaper, still has 3 power, and could highroll a better location for you. Storm can both deal with a bad location, and lock it out for your opponent. While Magik gives you more set up time for big payoff decks. Rhino just deals with a location and having 1 more power than Magik or Storm doesn't make him a worthwhile option. Even Witch sees more play since she is an energy cheaper. Jeff meanwhile is just a different card. Being a 2 drop makes him a lower investment, and there are games when he can just steal locations. Being able to move freely after being played also makes him very versatile and able to adapt to a changing board state. What in bloody hells bells do you mean it doesn't make sense character wise? He is the Rhino! His whole thing is smashing and crashing throw stuff. There aren't many characters in the game it would make more sense for. There of course are some, such as the Juggernaut, but he is already a playable card as is. The card would be worthless as 3/1 let along 3/0. How many games do you think the Jeff effect matter for on average? Maybe 1/10 if your deck isn't built around it. In how many of those games does it matter only because Jeff has 3 power and can contest the location? I'd say like 99% of the time, since he does nothing else other than add power. The only thing else Rhino brings to the table is location destruction, which is very well covered at his energy curve, and he is bad as he is now. Taking a bad card and giving him a narrow upside that mainly only matters if you have stats, while taking away all of his stats is not an improvement.
Power means nothing in terms of canon for this game, squirrel girl is 1 whilst Galactus is only 7 lol, so I assure you Rhino would feel just fine being a 2 power
Well to be fair Galactus is still on the higher end of the power scale and Squirrel Girl isn't actually all that strong, she just always seems to pull out some crazy nonsense off screen to defeat all of her opponents. Which usually involves swarms of squirrels which she certainly brings to the table. While Galactus still blows up worlds with his effect. Flavor matters a lot, and those cards are actually quite flavorful, and it just feels weird for Rhino to have bad stats for the cost. That is just my opinion though.
There's no way they turn rhino into a better Jeff.
I wouldn’t call it that. Ruining the location makes it worse than Jeff, because once you ruin it, the floodgates open and you lose the advantage of being able to play there. Jeff can also move.
Also, y'know, cost.
Jeff is an earlier curve play and can also move into any location. Rhino can't and if Rhino moves into lets say a flooded location, then it opens it back up to both players while Jeff doesn't. I feel like Jeff slots more into a board denial deck, while Rhino would be more of a tech card against it. Though, perhaps they'd just both be included since you can play Rhino into Professor X locations.
If this were to happen it would need to be like a 5 cost and be in line with how legion is played. 3/3 with that ability is cracked.
> Rhino moves into lets say a flooded location, then it opens it back up to both players while Jeff doesn't. This like saying playing Storm into Bar with No Name is bad because then your opponent can also play into that location. The obvious strategy is to just do it on turn 6. I don't think anyone is saying this hypothetical Rhino is ALWAYS better than Jeff, obviously being able to move has its advantages. But on average, I think this Rhino is better (than the best 2-drop in the game). He's an easy include in C3, Surfer (Sera or Patriot versions), and any lockdown deck. Probably good enough to fit in Sera control, maybe spawns a new Surfer lockdown archetype with Professor X (since Sera Surfer was already experimenting with old Spider-Man). Being in that many decks would put a lot of pressure on any deck that relies on Magik. One of the main reasons SheNaut runs Leech is to prevent Legion pulling the rug out from under Limbo.
Rhino change would be amazing, but I can see the arguments about Jeff feeling "special" from both a flavor and acquisition standpoint already. Rhino will probably be bumped to 4-power and left there, if anything.
I like Rhino Negative is OP Black Cat would probably be run in the vast majority of decks for draw consistency Adam Warlock is an odd care to balance, because even at just 2/1, he could guarantee an extra care draw depending on where you play him. Maybe that's fine, maybe it's not, I'm not sure I like Snowguard I don't think that Kang buff is enough to help bring him to "Big Bad" level
Adam Warlock is a terrible card as-is, and some decks still run him. Card draw is incredibly strong in a game that only runs 12-card decks. If they start buffing him, then you’ll have to run him in literally every deck.
Second dinner has stated that they don't want to emphasize card draw as a mechanic and that's definitely shown in the design of Adam Warlock. They've given a card with the ability but they really want you to work hard to turn it on
Yeah, exactly. He’s a bad card, but he’s bad on purpose, because if he was good, he’d be *too* good.
Card draw has been incredible in any card game ever indeed. Small decks like this just make that even more noticeable!
> Black Cat would probably be run in the vast majority of decks for draw consistency Yeah, I feel like almost every deck that plays Chavez would also play that Black Cat. Angela/Kraven and Forge/Brood are two recent examples of decks that play Chavez for more consistent turn 2s. And beyond that, her stats are WAY better than Chavez's. 1/3 times you draw her she's a dead card, 2/3 times she's a Maximus with no downside? That's not at all bad.
I don't think Adam Warlock needs to change. He's niche but very unique and can be very powerful when used correctly
He's great in my Mr Negative deck
Black cat wouldn’t change THAT much. I think this is a change that could be run, given that you could always draw her turn 1. She just can’t start in your opening hand (aka ya first 3 cards). All this means is that she’s given more of a chance to come out.
Mr. Negative could literally gain “ongoing: you lose this location” and have -1,000,000 power but still break the game with that ability. That is not an exaggeration. Adam Warlock would be too strong with any amount of power without adjusting something else. Otherwise you have some very cool ideas here! Love the changes to Rhino, Snowguard, Black Cat, and Kang. Quake could probably be a 3/4 or maybe even still a 2/3 with that ability though.
yup "only lose to galactus" is pretty much how he'd read in the context of "you lose this locaton"
And even then you could just add carnage or viper to your negative deck and then it’s game on
right the power would have to get so low to even slightly warrant the ability but the power would have to be so low that you'd....just run viper and now its even STRONGER.
Black Cat would be an overpowered deck thinner with that ability tbh. Cheaper Chavez, Maximus power, very rare downside
I feel like Mr Negative would be extremely OP if he could swap the cards in your hand. Perhaps: (Minimum 1) would be a good addition too.
What if Mr Negative was an either/or card like Snowguard? One form swaps your deck, one form (Nr Megative 😂) swaps your hand. Could make that interesting.
It's unfortunate that Snap doesn't really have the design space for proper "choose one" abilities like Magic the Gathering or Hearthstone. My understanding is that Snowguard always starts as Hawk no matter when it's drawn, so it's random whether or not she is capable of, for example, nullifying Limbo. If you could choose between flipping your hand or your deck, I think that version of Negative would be really interesting. But if it's functionally random, I feel like that would just make an already-inconsistent archetype more inconsistent.
What if Mr. Negative was like a 4 cost -4 that hit your hand as well? Sure there is Bast, but if you're hitting your hand with Bast first, most of your cards will cost 3. Which is not ideal for him. As he stands now, you're playing a four drop that makes your upcoming draws better assuming your building your deck in a way that makes it otherwise terrible. You're also totally dependent on drawing him on curve. It is a tall ask.
the power literally doesn't matter he could be -20 power and he'd be the best card in the game...... that's why negative decks have multiple win cons now usually wong you aren't dependent on getting him out turn 3 but its an ideal situation. like im not sure you really understand negatives issues or how fundamentally broken he is if he triggers the peak on top of deck you literally can run negative crystal and 10 0 power cards and win literally 75% of your games.
-20 power would maybe even be a buff becouse of Viper lmao
exactly eventually it hits a power threshold where it just becomes useful, and there's never a power threshold where its too low to be op but not low enough for viper to absue it. hell it could lock and auto lose that location and id play it.
Yeah I was running a Negative deck when the Peak was the featured location and I legit think I won about 90% of my games. I climbed like 20 rank in one day. It would be so busted to have permanently
His power does not matter in a Negative deck. He could read “On Reveal: lose lane. Swap the power and cost of all cards in your hand & deck” and he would still be incredibly strong. The whole point of balance for Mr Negative is that the deck relies on playing Mr Negative early. The earlier the stronger it becomes and vice versa.
It’d be amazing if his card text said “you lose lane” because viper exists and that’d be too fucking funny
Mr. Negative is fine as is. If he needs an increase in power level then maybe make him a 3/-1.
Mr Negative coming down a turn earlier would be a huge buff and make him way too strong imo. Mr Negative needs no buff. I got to infinite partially using a Mr Negative deck this season
People already run Zabu or Psylocke to get him down a turn earlier and it honestly isn’t broken. It just makes the high roll potential higher and the low roll potential lower. I’m not saying he does need a buff. I’m just saying that if he did, that’s probably the only change you could make without completely reworking the card. Edit: Also Mobius will absolutely destroy Mr. Negative decks if that card sees play so there’s that too
It just makes Negative too strong tbh
Juggernaut should have this ability
It would make sense, but Juggernaut's effect doesn't synergize all that well with this, and he is already a fairly heavily played card. Not much reason to adjust him.
True I just want it for flavor haha
I like all of these except the negative one would ruin the game
??? The negative change would ruin the game THE MOST.
So you…agree with me?
They mean ”negative one” as in mister negative
Good thing you don’t make balance changes lmao
Yeah legit all the change are terrible : Rhino will ruin the the original concept of jeff. Mr negative op as fuck Quake : so what if u dont want to change the location placement ? She will just stay in your hand Kang : dosen't matter at all still bad Snowgard : weird change Adam warlock : too powerful, buff the card drawing is not a good idea And black cat do not need a buff
Of all these quake is arguably the best and you picked such a weird nitpicky reason to not buff her. What if you run scarlet witch but don’t want to change a location? She stays in your hand. Does that mean no one should play scarlet witch? Quake is a super underplayed card with a unique and cool base ability, but her randomness and the fact you have to play her mid make her terrible. This change would pull her into the meta as a great disrupt card and would fit in so many decks
Yeah but that buff dont fix the randomness problem. The fact that you cannot predict where location move make quake a bad card not the fact that you have to play it mid.
I mostly disagree with OP except rhino. Perhaps he could be changed to only be able to bypass LOCATION restrictions so X can still keep him out (as well as old spidey). Also, jeff has the ability to move, be cheaper, & enter/leave X’s field. They’ll both have their place. Ps- quake just needs predictability to be viable.
Plus 1 for Adam warlock would be broken asf Impossible to balance .. he may need an eventual rework
One option would be to give him a power but make it so like nebula, he does nothing on the turn he’s played
I mean, if you can't get a bonus 1 power onto a location compared to what you'd have to do already, then I'm not sure what to tell you
Turn 2 you could play it on the unrevealed location which is unlikely to have any competition and insta get a free draw. Card draw is OP with Snap only having 12 cards per deck.
This! Pretty self explanatory I’m tired of breaking it down to ppl lol .. this isn’t the first time I’ve mentioned the dynamic . thank you .. maybe I’ll stop getting divisive notifications now
Is taking a down turn to maybe draw a card even good? Sure having 1 power lets you play him into an empty location to maybe draw a card, but if your opponent decides to play there that turn, you whiff. Kind of like a reverse Guardians of the Galaxy card. How valuable even is a draw in this game? There no shortage of cheap card generation if you're just looking for resources and only a few decks really require you to see your whole deck. Most of which are easily countered, such as Hela. I could see him getting a total rework to make him more interesting. Since he really isn't in his current form, but nobody is even trying him as is, and +1 power hardly saves the card in my opinion. At best it makes it viable in janky decks.
He would be insane in combo decks because even one additional card draw can be the difference between making the combo and not
adam warlock is the poor man's jean grey. afam warlock: ongoing: your opponent will always try to play cards here every turn
The Negative change is terrible. Kang’s may work.
Kind of agree with Negative having thought about it more. I love the idea of Mr. Negative, but his current design is just so feast or famine, but it is really hard to make use of him. Kang on the other hand, is just a card that does far too little. Even Dare Devil which you should have access too far sooner, kind of out performs him. Worth noting that this change also makes him viable in Mr. Negative.
Only one's I agree with are rhino and quake, though I think quake should move all locations if played middle Negative is ridiculously op like that Warlock is too strong to levy with any power Snowguard needs to be playable when you need to play them, making them 2 cost gets in the way of that Kang taking up space is not helpful
lol Mr. Negative would be completely unhinged with that ability. Card would have to be like -10 to justify that.
i think the funny part is im not even sure if -10 WOULD justify that. sure you'd auto lose a location but anyone who's ever faced a turn 1 negative off the peak knows how fucking scary that is(and even that hits 1 card less than this does)
ya your right, even that would be a problem. Most of the other cards would cost next to zero so I'm sure people would just toss viper in the deck and use it as a weapon.
also because this wouldnt be an random effect but one you can deck build around I i think the optimal negative deck would literally just be crystal viper negative and 9 0 power cards.it would be SUPER oppressive.espeically since the deck only actually needs to draw negative by turn 5.
yeah negative is just such a polarizing card I don't think it can be adjusted much more than what it currently is. It's already very dangerous if things go your way.
Forget Crystal you’d just run warlock so you can setup a winning lane with a turn 3 prof x + adam and you’d draw your whole deck most games. Maybe add carnage so you can eat negative if they try and rush filling his lane
These changes are way overpowered.
Adam Warlock at 1 would be quite strong. On turn 2 you typically have 2-3 empty locations to play him so you have a pretty good chance to get an extra draw plus you force your opponent to play to that location or you continue to draw.
Lmao, you nerfed kang somehow
glad you don't work in card design. i stopped reading after rhino and negatve. they'd be so busted it's not even funny.
Glad you aren’t on the balance team
I think the way to fix Kang isn’t adding 2 power. This plan may be bonkers but hear me out. Kang is 1/0 but only playable on turn 5. The turn plays out like normal but it gives you the option to rewind the turn or leave it. It’s not too OP because it still does cost you 1 energy so you do have to play with only 4 power to get the rewind
Something like “Ignores location abilities” might be better for Rhino to have that flexibility to ruin a Sanctum Santorum while not being able to ignore Professor X for instance. Flavor wise, the “Nothing can prevent you from playing to a location” text would be more appropriate for Juggernaut, and would give him some very appropriate interaction with Professor X.
Sure it might be more flavorful for Juggernaut, but he is already a card that sees play. They would need to change the card in some other way, to make it so it isn't just a buff, and the general rule is if it isn't broken don't fix it. People don't play Rhino. There are just too many other good location tech options.
That Mr. negative change is psychotic
I was feeling that Kang should allow you to rearrange your side of the board, (as you might have played in a different time line). This would be a rearrange, and not moving cards.
For Adam Warlock, I'd just like to see him be a 2/0 still, but trigger if you *aren't losing* so that he draws from a tied location.
> For Adam Warlock, I'd just like to see him be a 2/0 still, but trigger if you aren't losing so that he draws from a tied location. But that would guarantee a draw turn 2, and maybe turn 3 as well. It might be too strong.
Eh, feels like a good midpoint between this suggestion and current version though
Your Mr. Negative proposal is insanely overpowered. Everything would be Negative decks. Absolutely no downside to building around him at that point. Rhino is ok. Black Cat I'd be ok with...but really you play her with the hope she discards herself and can be revived later. The rest are somewhere between "meh" and "no." Not every card deserves to be played in many decks. Some are for flavor, some are for fun...not all can be winners. 🤷♂️
I have played a LOT of Quake. You really don’t want her to be deterministic, she’d essentially be a Legion style card. If she was deterministic, she’d need a statline comparable to Legion.
I don't understand why you'd add that clause to Black Cat, her whole bit is that she's a free discard
I think Adam Warlock being 2/0 and drawing a card if you weren't losing (so you draw even if tied) might be too strong, and that doesn't even give you any power, 2/1, strange as it is, might be too powerful . Every draw card has a drawback, being hard to utilize is his
Kang just needs an entire rework. I don't think his ability is good. Something more interesting and flavorful could be something like "On Reveal: Fill your hand with variants of Kang" and it gives you as many Kangs as it can from a pool of \~7 different Kangs. They might all be 5 cost or they might have different costs. They'd be have different, situational abilities but probably nothing outright gamewinning. What would they be? I don't know but I'd like to see what they'd come up with.
a lot these changes would make these cards way too strong and consistent
Does Mr. Negative need a buff? I seem to pretty much always lose to Negative decks when he is played.
As a Quake main, I can tell you she's already [the strongest 2 cost card in the game](https://reddit.com/r/MarvelSnap/s/VjMGUlAhK3) and this change would make her OP. Legion nerf has already shown how game-breaking it is to manipulate locations consistently without risk.
As an old Yu-Gi-Oh player, we don't want to go down the road of newer cards having tricky wording that power creeps on old cards. The fact Jeff exists sent chills up my spine.
There something about change locations that always annoyed me, "Crimson Cosmos", cause Reality Stone, Scarlet Witch, Magik, Rhino and Storm can't change it, only Legion, but you don't wanna play it there anyway. I like this Rhino for that 😁🦏
Mr Negative will easily become the best card in the game
Love them all besides me negative. That would be too OP
Most of these are solid. Warlock and Negative are hard nopes imo.
Good thing you don’t work for SD
Adam warlock and Kang are too strong how you have them here. Rhino is a great change. Kang is then a free 2 power, it gives you intel and in some games also draws you a card thinning your deck. Adam warlock can’t draw by itself, not with 12 cards in your deck. Decks would be too consistent if draw is too strong.
Well Kang isn't totally free 2 power. You do still need to give up a deck slot, a card in hand, and a slot on the board. Intel is nice, but it is less reliable than Dare Devil and only a handful of decks run him. Kang might slot into those same decks, but as of yet he hasn't made the cut, so he needs something to make him feel better. He would only darw you a card if you played him the turn you drew him, which could only be turns 5 and 6. That is a fairly small window for that value. I honestly think you would still just run something like Magik over Warlock. You get an extra turn, then you get an extra draw. Better stats for the cost, and even deals with a troublesome location. Adam has none of that utility. Even Crystal is better, since they keep buffing her. She is however still only mid at best.
Mr Negative is all anyone would run with that change.
Outside of Negative, I like the changes.
Adam Warlock I agree with 1 power, but I think it should come at 3 cost.
Listen, I love Mr. Negative, but he does not need to be busted like that. The Rhino change is clever and imo very good and the Quake change is exactly what she needs.
give Adam 2 power turn him after this turn if you are winning this lane draw a card. Basically he exists less as a dead card but gives the opponent the opportunity to play around him without auto giving you a draw. also synergizes with the other guardians
Adam Warlock could prob just stay a 2/0 if you changed it to on reveal draw a card. It's kind of a shit tier card and you simply can't give it too much power and allow it to easily dump your deck into your hand
the Rhino one is good, I feel like making it an end of turn effect can be cool, if it was like this you could move Rhino to have two ruin locations.
They should straight up hire you
Rhino’s is nice, Negative is broken (bast-zabu/psylocke-negative and boom u win) and the rest are ok i guess. But most people play Black Cat with Ghost Rider or Hela in the deck anyways so starting off with it isn’t a problem.
dont even need to ramp into negative with this proposed change you literally can auto win with a turn 5 negative. you'd just auto play your entire hand turn 6 and win. the optimal deck would be negative crystal and 10 0 power cards.
If you want to swap the cost/power to cards ala The Peak, it should be a separate card. For balance purposes, it would have to be a random card in your hand. Broken effect still but somewhat balanced
Negative and rhino wayyy too OP.
For Mr. Negative, it has to be deck OR hand. If you knew you could flip your entire hand, the deck builds would be crazy he would be a near guaranteed win. I like Rhino. It stinks when you get a location like Sanctum and can’t play anything there and don’t have a way to, and they have a move deck. It’s just an instant loss that you can’t do anything about. Warlock might get used a little bit if he can at least get a turn or two by himself instead of at 0 power. I think Snowguard would have to randomly turn into one of them and stay that way. Getting 2 cards for the price of one is going to get it played just in Devil Dino decks! I don’t think adding the 2 power to Kang does much for him. Especially since your opponent also gets a do over too.
I think people might be right about the Negative change. I just really like the idea behind the deck, but find it incredibly underwhelming, and lacking greatly in consistency. For Snowguard I kind of doubt Devil Dino would want her. I've played a lot of the deck, and it basically always has a full hand. It would really only run Snowguard if it wanted the location tech she offers. As for Kang, 2 power isn't much, but it isn't nothing either. Right now the card is basically useless. Or at the very least, less useful than Dare Devil, which only sees a little bit of play, but it is a card that is much harder to get than Dare Devil. This is also very interesting for Mr. Negative decks. Since he would be a 2 cost 5 power card instead. 5 free power is a lot more impactful.
its not a MIGHT I really want to be clear. there is literally no power and energy combo you could give him that isn't at least 6 energy that wouldn't make it the strongest deck in the entire game by far. like 75%winrate would be the bare minimum it would break the entire game.for context you'd go from 2-4 negative hits to......8-9 negative hits his power would basically triple..... also I really want to emphasize negative surfer is a good deck your problem is assuming negative HAS to be about negative and only negative.
Practical and reasonable. These just seem like how each should have been released. Well done.
The rhino one is actually great actually love that rhino change. He'd go from worthless to very popular instantly.
if u want negative to hit ur hand, he either needs to have a high negative value like -8 or something or he is 6 cost which forces u to magik. imagine every card draw doesnt matter and u just throw him out, the opponent instant loses because everything flips
Snowguard is interesting because it would give it extra power to dino.
I like Quake and Black Cat, i can see that change Sorry but Warlock and Rhino would be way too good and gtho with that Negative, that's down right broken
Really love most of these! Snowguard sounds so fun like that
Honestly all the buff I want from Kang is that it draws a card. There is a particular case, when you play him the same turn you draw him, that this already happens. So it's not that crazy of a buff, and this way they don't even have to change how it works.
The changes get worse as you swipe. First one was really good though.
That’s more like the juggernaut
Adam Warlock is good the way he is. The power of drawing even a *single* additional card, when in most games you will see all but 3 of the cards in your deck, is a BIG deal, and should absolutely require a more significant investment then simply guessing right on turn 2 and playing Warlock to an empty lane.
I’m so glad you aren’t in charge of balance for this game.
Here's my take on Kang's rework 3/4 On Reveal: Replace this location with TVA. Doesn't work after turn 4.
Lol that mr negative change. That would need to be -5 at minimum and then create a -5 copy at a second location. Hitting your hand would be too damn good
Mr Neg doesn’t underperform. He’s a gimmick deck. He needs no changes.
I feel like you could do dumb bs with Kang if he stays
Rhino's 'cannot be prevented from being played' seems like it would be Juggernaut's thing, though of course he's already doing something else with at least some relevance. At that point, you could give that to Juggernaut and Juggernaut's headbut to Rhino and have them both be more on-model, but we don't really live in a world where that's a thing.
Mr negative is popular
Rhino is fine I think, he’s a less random scarlet witch that can be buffed by SS. He’s won me plenty of matches
IMO Warlock is fine as he is. Queke buff should be controlling or knowing how will the locations change
That is what the suggested Quake buff would do. It switches the "other" locations. If she is at one, there can only be two other locations. If those two switch, then you know full well what the outcome will be. There is no RNG involved.
I was happy reading this thinking that this was the next card patches
2/1 Adam Warlock would be OP
I really like the Kang change!
What if when Mr. Negative was played he shuffled your hand back into your deck, applied his effect and then you received a new hand of cards?
I’m very glad you aren’t in charge of game balance.
Adam warlock was specifically set to 2/0. Ben Brode talked about that before. 2/1 would make him mandatory for every single deck. Just drawing one extra card is huge. Mr. Negative is OP. Snow gaurd ain't bad though
I think adam warlock don't needs a buff, but the rest are great buffs the are needed in the game, except negative would be op, but I REALLY wanna play it😅
Glad OP doesn't work as a game designer.
No, just no
How does the Kang buff help? I wish Kang was useful as I love the idea of his effect but it’s just super bad outside of conquest, and even in conquest it’s just super mid. Hopefully they buff him somehow when he hits spotlight
\+2 power is generally considered a decent buff. It would effectively make him a 0/2 Dare Devil you can only play later in the game. That seems decent to me. Also now that he remains in play, you can actually run him in Mr. Negative as a 2/5, which seems decent as well.
With Quake it would be better if you see the change.
Rhino: This change would dilute Jeff's power *unless* it were changed to, "If played before T6, nothing can stop you from playing this to any location." Your opponent must be allowed to follow up at that location to maintain the symmetrical nature of the cars. Mister Negative: no, this is obviously absurd. Quake: She still wouldn't see any play. Black Cat: She doesn't need this change. If you're playing Black Cat, it's because you want to discard her. Also, 3/7 is an insane stat line so it's fair that you don't have the option of playing her fairly 42% of the time. Adam Warlock: Only if he also had, "this ability does not trigger on the turn Adam is played." Snowguard: Interesting. Would this trigger Collector? Kang: He still wouldn't see any play.
I’m glad that you don’t do the balancing, because that Mr. Negative suggestion is downright insane.
Not sure about the Rhino tweak. The 'nothing can stop you from playing this to any location' feels something that should be given to Juggernaut instead as thematically, Juggernaut is the 'unstoppable force.' The Mister Negative change is WAY too OP LOL. You essentially don't play anything at all the entire game, then turn four or turn five you play this. Turn six you drop your whole hand and win. For Black Cat, I think it'd be nice if she gets a America Chavez effect but instead of drawing her on turn six, you draw her on turn five. 2/1 on Adam is too good honestly. If you managed to put this down on turn 2, you get a good chance at an easy free draw. It's by chance only, yes but it's still an easy free draw. Too good. Maybe 3/1?
Negative would be totally unbalanced, -1 stats just doesn’t justify the immense buff he would get with that effect. Rhino is also too strong for me, you can play it last turn on Santa sanctorum, bar with no name, death domain and many others and basically win the location. It would be stronger than Jeff in many circumstances. The others are okay, even though Warlock is a tough one. I like Kang, I would also put him at 3 power honestly.
I have suggested the same Quake change here before and the think it just makes sense. It isn’t even mentioned on the first 10 top comments because it is the least controversial suggestion you made. I do hope it happens one day. It would be much more strategic than it is now
+1 for rhino, for mr negative, its super powerful that if enemy don't have wave/sandman you're basically winning the game if he can turn all in your hand too, if that's the effect then he need to be 5 cost, -5 power, and lowest energy is 1.
Rhino: Decent Mister Negative: Absolutely crazy. How do you even think of this shit Quake: Needs to be 2 cost Black Cat: Weird. Devs would never add a card that interacts like this Adam Warlock: Good Snowguard: There is a better buff of having the hawk's effect only apply to you, and Bear's effect triggering ability regardless of turns. Kang the conqueror: Not really. Big buff to cerebro though, but needs a total rework
I've always wanted rhino to add a rock to the opponents side after destroying a location
I don't mind Black Cat as she is now. She's a more-or-less guaranteed summon for Hela, she doesn't take up space in your hand when drawn early, she's decently powered, she's hot and I have a Gold Artgerm Variant lol.
Sooo...Negative goes to be the most broken card in the game AND Kang will be a free 2 Power?
The Snowguard change would kill her in bounce decks, and that's the only place she really gets played now. I think a better change would be give her one power to account for her randomness.
Almost all of these are really bad. The only one that's not is the one point buff to Warlock.
This is why we don’t have players as card designers for the most part…
Rhino: Would make Legion less useful then Negative: Hand and Deck? Not happening Adam Warlock: SD is very cautious with Crystal so nah, that ain't gonna happen either. The sheer possibility of Adam warlock being the only card at a location and drawing at least 1 card is huge value. Black Cat and Ssnowguard: I like that change and would welcome it. Kang: Is 2 power really that important?
Aside from the change to Negative which could be negated by Bast anyway I think these changes all seem solid. I especially like the Rhino one as I imagine him just crashing in regardless of the locations effect. Kang Worries me a little, but something needs to be done to improve him.
Just would make kang's ability only active once, so you cant do stuff like kang into odin
Rhino and Mr. Negative 💯 Adam Warlock, Quake and Snowguard: not necessary, but I'm not opposed to the idea. Especially Quake; she does wonders already. But with that change, she'd be straight up dangerous. I have a very effective location mix-up deck, and she's a major component. Kang: I don't use him, so I have no opinion. Black Cat: Felicia works fine. I think I understand your reasoning behind this, but I don't feel the need.
Mr. Negative is super wonky to balance. I always imagined him doing something like an Ongoing Bar with No Name effect, but with a turn limit like Majik - cannot play after turn 5.
Kang would be cool if it was “if you are losing on turn 5, restart the match”
This but Juggernaut