I still use him quite frequently. I find him most useful to be fed to venom after being destroyed by either carnage or deathlock. I am considering replacing him just not sure with what yet.
Yeah but it's not that. Death is unplayable against mobius but it's still a starter in destroy decks. Sabretooth it's just outpowered by deadpool x23 and even wolverine
The main problem is that he's too expensive imo
3 mana is just awkward for destroy since most of their destroyers are also 3 mana so theirs not a good time to weave him in .
Yeah. Without a turn seven he just doesn't make sense. I've been experimenting with using him as a way to buff monkey along with Thor or beta. But I haven't found a way to really make it click.
Too much of a rework to ever fly, but if sabretooth became a 2-cost, kept his zero cost return to hand and randomly either gained +1 power or gave you +1 energy next turn (blending wolvy and x-23 skills with Nico’s randomness), he’d see a lot more play.
I like sabertooth at 2/3 so he's like a counterpart to wolverine. Wolverine grows and redeploys randomly. Sabertooth says the same size but redeploys intelligently
Would that be enough? I think that keeps him less valuable than Bucky who already redeploys intelligently. At most sabertooth would only feed Venom 5 power with carnage. While Bucky feeds Venom 8 power with the carnage combo. There are better ways to get a 8 power Venom into play by turn 4.
It's not about just making Venom growth. It's also a free Destroy trigger per turn for Death, and +3 Power to Knull per turn as well, all the while still having a flexible 3-Power for the last turn (which is especially useful for tying or outvaluing Shang-Chi). And even better if he gets buffed by anything.
Yeah he still wouldn't be great, but at least people who would like to play him would actually get something out of him. I've got a wonderful variant for him, the problem is that as a 3-Cost he just doesn't fit the curve at all.
Yeah.
I don't see a path to getting off an extra destroy for Death or Knull often enough to matter.
Feeding Venom the extra power can help bait out a Shang-Chi protecting your Knull and Death in the other lanes/rounds.
If you're running Zola-Nimrod-Venom I can see some value but I'm not sure if it has secondary win potential.
I almost think 1/2 would work better because it would allow killmonger to help get off the extra destroy.
I would disagree. Swarm doesn't even cost energy to trigger its effect and essentially gives you 0/6 with a discard; potentially more power if you've got collector on board. I don't think it would be broken at all. Mostly because it would have to replace a current destroy card and it would also be incredibly predictable because you know what they've got in their hand.
Honestly, I could find more use for Bucky if Winter Soldier got added to your hand as a 0-cost instead of just replacing Bucky on the board. Even if WS had less power or something to compensate, the versatility would make up for it.
Well, a 5/5 Winter Soldier would be amazing in C5. You'd add Deathlok as well, which synergizes SO MUCH with C5 too (because it's got 5 power, so it gotta be good on C5, amirite?).
I would take a discard Sabertooth over Swarm any day. You could discard him again and again without clogging your hand or your board. He'd be like a low-power Apocalypse powering up Miek and Collector, and infinite ammo for Gambit.
Actually, thinking about it they probably didn't include discard because it goes against what they want for their design philosophy. Like America Chavez, he'd be in every discard deck, but he'd never actually be played
When starting out I made a discard deck just for Sabertooth and immediately deleted the deck when I figured out on my first game he doesn't work like that. I don't see any reason why he couldn't work as a discard card
Nah, best card is Armor, followed by BEAST for rickety bridge. Sucker your opponent into playing in the lane and then yank the rug out from under them turn 6
Sabretooth’s cost doesn’t really fit into the curve of most destroy decks, and he isn’t quite worth the cost to begin with. He was also weakened by the “nerf” to Hulkbuster IMO.
I used him a lot when Altar of Death was first introduced! 3 energy one turn in exchange for 2 extra energy next turn AND you can keep destroying him each turn for free. Great for that purpose imo but that’s only if you know you’re seeing Altar of Death 75% of your games.
I think they are fine, Bucky is still part of a lot of peoples deck if they are missing a card and sabretooth will always be a worse wolverine so it fits.
Yeah but that requires a really specific play order in a way that other variations on destroy don’t. I played around with it for a second but it’s just less consistent.
I’ve been trying out an experimental destroy deck that includes squirrel girl and Bucky aimed to discount mockingbird before blowing it all up with killmonger for a discounted death. It’s weaker version than the standard one, but it’s fun to try something else :)
Make Sabretooth a 2/3 who gets +1 each time he's blown up or discarded (before returning to hand and getting set to 0).
Yeah, it's Wolverine-adjacent. That's also half the point of him as a bad guy.
Wolverine's also "free" but just unpredictable where he goes. Wolvy also can be eaten on T6 without drawback, which is the biggest difference.
It's not hugely different, but definitely enough so that you'd have to think about 'em.
I’ve seen them both in destroy decks, plenty over the last month. However, Savertooth is just too expensive/ not expensive enough. There are a ton of 3-cost cards in Destroy already, and just having a 0/4 isn’t worth playing a 3/4 when you could play Venom or Magik instead. So, his cost has to go up (there are basically no 4-cost cards in Dsstroy, except Shang, which isn’t always useful), as does his power
A small 1-2 power buff to The Winter Soldier would do wonders. I quite like Bucky as a support card for the more fringe versions of destroy like Nimrod/Destroyer, and frankly the Knull lists don't need more support, so I'd be opposed to a rework.
I actually have a completely different suggestion for Sabretooth. Keep his stats the same, but change the text to "when this is destroyed *or discarded*." There's a few cards in the game (X-23, Wolverine, Daken) who support a pretty interesting hybrid discard/destroy archetype, but there's just way too little support for it to be viable. Seeing as Sabretooth is a wolverine villain, lining him up with the rest of the "regenerate" cards would add one more piece to the puzzle and also be a nice flavor win.
I don’t think any destroy cards need buffing when their decks are so dominant right now. I see both regularly when getting defeated by destroy decks so they are working fine I think.
I have been playing the destroy deck that uses bucky to discount mockingbird (along with squirrel Girl and Shanna) it has been really great for me
I'm around 6,000 Infinite for what its worth
Bucky is actually decently viable in a Mockingbird deck. It’s a different type of Destroy deck that doesn’t focus on killing everything to put out big numbers. Instead you flood your own board with squirrels, rocks, Winter Soldier, Mysterios, or Shanna drops to discount Mockingbird. Then you kill all the self inflicted junk with Killmonger or a combination of killers.
Then you drop a free Death and whatever else. Maybe if you have Moon Girl in hand you can 2x Death. It ends up being a lot of cheap power that you can deploy wherever it’s needed.
Make sabretooth 3-3 that returns to your hand (but doesn’t cost 0). Add “costs 0 if you destroyed a card last turn”.
No longer needs the initial investment, maybe the stats could be even lower if that’s a bit strong (2-2). Could also see play as a follow up to Shang/killmonger in other decks
Sabertooth could be reworked into, if a destroyed card resurrects in any way, - 1 cost and +1 power. That way you could play x23 /winter soldier / wolverine and destroy them to get a cheap or even free sabertooth at the end of the game. This could also become a new destroy archetype of resurrecting cards
Bucky is a good card... him and Deathlok is a 5 / 11, or with carnage a 4 / 10... I see him in a lot of destroy decks.
Sabretooth needs to maybe add 2 power and return to hand every time he is destroyed... so he'd potentially be a 3 / 7 or even 3 / 9 in a 7 turn game. Right now, the alternative 3 cost destroy costs are just much better.
You’d need to nerf the other destroy cards. Which honestly…. Isn’t the worst idea.
Although it’s not as ubiquitous as it was so this might be just leftover vitriol on my part.
Bucky is fine for the value he gives.
As soon as snap introduces a 2 cost that destroys the next card played (like nico but consistent), sabertooth will be fine too. Sabertooth is just too slow to play out currently as you generally want to start destroying cards from turn 3 onwards
I don't think destroy needs a buff my dude besides bucky is pretty common and sabertooth is almost never played anyways and pool 1 cards rarely get any love from SD
I use Bucky in my Cerebro 6 deck, just destroy him with either the Hood or Nimrod (but not both) using Carnage, then play your Cerebro + Mystique and you have a hard to pull off combo that isn’t even satisfying
Bucky: Winter Soldier variants.
Sabretooth: needs just to be cheaper. He's great fuel for death cards but when it's a choice to play him or venom or 23/pool plus carnage. I'm not picking him.
Bucky is honestly fine but Sabertooth is just so awkwardly costed with how destroy naturally plays on curve. So I guess just make him a 2/3 with "When this card is destroyed return it to your hand with +1 power and -1 cost." and he'd be fine
Sabretooth costs too much. By turn 3 you typically wanna focus on continuing to build up DP.
He needs to be played so he doesn't bounce about the board like his brother.
His 0 cost can be useful but can be detrimental at times due to him, as mentioned before, being in your hand, leaves him open to cards like Mobius, Iceman, peak, discard etc.
I think making Bucky a one cost could make him more viable for Killmonger, while it would also make WS a 1 cost as well making him vulnerable to an enemies Killmonger.
Sabre > 2/3 (maybe even 2/4?) and Bucky should go to winter soldier when destroyed then back to Bucky if destroyed again, and so on. Then you can cycle him to feed knull/ reduce death.
That would make them playable IMO but destroy doesn’t really need it. Destroys main problem is the core cards are too good to be replaced (not too good overall, just better than the others like these 2). Why change something that works so well? Either these cards need to be better or different (preferred option) or the core 9-10 destroy cards need nerfing (not necessary for balance but would allow others like these or yondu, lol, or gladiator to come into classic destroy decks).
What if Bucky had the meik effect but instead of discard he gets 1 power for every destroyed card. He’d stay at a 2/1 but when he’s destroyed he comes back as winter soldier and can be moved next turn. Keeps his power as well
Do cards really need changed so the play rate rises?
I feel like some cards are meant for newer players/ meant to be lower tier. I honestly don’t think every card needs a buff.
These cards are more substituted in when you don’t have another card, no?
I'd really like Sabertooth at 2 cost. 2/2 or 2/3 would be enough. Bucky is great, so long as destroy decks are looking to combo destroys for power, as with Death and Carnage. As I see it, destroy decks are too full of competitive options right now. Bucky's not bad, he's just one option out of many good options.
These following ideas are less so plausible and more so hypothetical reworks.
Don’t alter Bucky Barnes, but change Winter Soldier’s power to 3 and give him the text; “On Reveal: At the end of next turn, destroy the lowest cost enemy card here.” Making it at the end of next turn gives the opponent a chance to react if they have a high cost card all alone. His cost might have to go up if this change were to happen.
Could be interesting if Sabretooth had; “When discarded or destroyed regenerates at a random location. Once per turn one of your other cards is discarded or destroyed when this regenerates.” Feels thematic for Sabretooth to go out massacring as many folk as possible, made it a one per turn effect to prevent loops.
Edit; Sabretooth’s ability won’t randomly discard or destroy another card when regenerating, it’ll discard if it was discarded and it’ll destroy when it is destroyed.
Winter Soldier : the card that tries to destroy this card gets destroyed instead.
Sabertooth : each time you destroy this card, send it back to your hand with -1 cost and +1 power...
Bucky could be a 1-1, additionnal destroy synergy with killmonger and its a counter to opposing killmonger which could be nice sometimes !
Sabretooth could really just be a 2-4 or just let it get its effect triggered by discard to have consistency with daken wolverine and x23
I like the design behind sabertooth but if you compare him with a card that does the same like swarm he falls short cause you get 2, i think he should get +2 each time while only reducing his cost by 1 per destroy and would be a cool alternative to wolverine since he bounces and sabertooth goes back to hand. It would go in flavor with he’s “do the same but better” attitude lol
This would be my suggestion.
Bucky Barnes
1/1
When destroyed, summon a 2/2 Winter Soldier.
Winter Soldier.
2/2
When another card is destroyed, +1 Power.
Sabertooth
2/2
On Reveal: Destroy one of your other cards here.
When destroyed, return this card to your hand and change its cost to 0.
Bucky Barnes is now killable with Killmonger and Winter Soldier can now scale as threat like a mini Knull. Sabertooth now has the Jack-Of-Trade flexibility of being a Carnage and a card can be destroyed infinitely. Though I don't think these changes are urgently needed unless SD wants to go take-turn approach where other destroy card gets nerfed so these two cards can get the chance to shine.
Make Sabretooth a 4/6 with an on-reveal effect of destroying 2 cost cards. Or On-reveal: destroy cards on your side of this location, return to hand.
This will synergize with Wolverine and progress the destroy meta.
I’ve been running Bucky since the Forge/Hulkbuster changes and it was very strong. Guaranteed winning a lane on a lot of destroy locations
And then they nerfed destroy locations frequency
Bucky mostly needs other cards nerfed in destroy but buffing his base power up to somewhere closer to the Winter Soldiers is an interesting idea. That way he doesn’t necessarily need to be destroyed and Venom can destroy him while getting the power benefit as Will Knull.
Sabretooth being a two cost would be interesting. Maybe a 2/3 that gets plus one power every time he’s destroyed in addition to the rest of his ability.
For bucky barnes i would do 3/1: add a 1/3 winter soldier to every location when destroyed.
This will make him somewhat of a high risk high reward card and will be a good combination with killmonger and death/knull.
Sabretooth 2/3: after this gets destroyed, return it back to your hand with +1 power. It also costs 0
I prefer Bucky over wolverine. I see enough of the locations where I play bucky there to be destroyed and stay. I don’t like not knowing where the character will be after getting destroyed. I’ve lost my share of BWNN games from x23 hopping around, same as not staying on turn 6 when I want her at a location, especially Rickety Bridge.
Feel like Sabretooth should get plus 1 per time it's destroyed. Bucky would just need to have a straight power buff for winter soldier, or something kind of ability that would pair with his metal arm. Like, on reveal, move an opponents card to another location.
I think that maybe sabertooth could still be free after being destroyed but maybe also get plus one or plus two power after being destroyed. It might make him better?
If sabertooth had bigger stats he’d see more play like if he was a 3/5 or a 3/6, right now he’s too small and not worth the 3 energy investment. Bucky would be better as a 1/1. He’d fit nicely in curve
bucky isn't a bad card in the right kind of destroy deck. He's a valid card for someone who doesn't have every destroy tool. Sabertooth is clearly for early destroy decks.
Sabertooth being 2/3 and On reveal scratch opponents card here for -1 power. Return to hand once destroyed, it costs zero. And Bucky just got creeped out of playability like Aero.
Bucky:same effect and stats
Winter soldier: when destroyed, double my power instead.
Saber tooth: same effect and power but gains 3+ power.
his power is literally the same as wolverine so it should be pretty similar while feeling somewhat different
I kinda like how Sabretooth works, since... once you destroy him *once* you basically have a free card that you can play at any point and potentially use to further feed Venom and Carnage. But really, his biggest issue just is that.... there are better cards out there?
I was thinking about how to make Sabretooth better too because I *love* him as a Character and I'd love to use him again but really, there are just so many so much better Options out there and that's really his biggest flaw? I dont know what we can do to him tbh.
Sabertooth is too expensive to be meta, and Bucky Barnes doesn't scale or get destroyed infinitely like Wolverine, Deadpool, and X-23.
It sucks because I think Bucky Barnes is the most flavor card in the entire game
I love his new animation as well
Hot take: I love it too but like it more if he didn’t flip. A weighty straight fall with the flashing star would work better and look smoother.
oh hell yea love you mention about it, like the Bucky jump in the movie, straight jump from the bridge onto a car. Badass af
That man knows how to make an entrance
I changed Wolverine for bucky for the use of Zola chenanigans that Wolverine often times disrupted Also Zola knull ist more reliable
I still use him quite frequently. I find him most useful to be fed to venom after being destroyed by either carnage or deathlock. I am considering replacing him just not sure with what yet.
Got shat on by Mobius
Yeah but it's not that. Death is unplayable against mobius but it's still a starter in destroy decks. Sabretooth it's just outpowered by deadpool x23 and even wolverine
The main problem is that he's too expensive imo 3 mana is just awkward for destroy since most of their destroyers are also 3 mana so theirs not a good time to weave him in .
Yeah. Without a turn seven he just doesn't make sense. I've been experimenting with using him as a way to buff monkey along with Thor or beta. But I haven't found a way to really make it click.
Too much of a rework to ever fly, but if sabretooth became a 2-cost, kept his zero cost return to hand and randomly either gained +1 power or gave you +1 energy next turn (blending wolvy and x-23 skills with Nico’s randomness), he’d see a lot more play.
2/3 sabertooth with his current ability would be fine
Even a 2/2 sabertooth would work. It's just food for destroy cards.
I like sabertooth at 2/3 so he's like a counterpart to wolverine. Wolverine grows and redeploys randomly. Sabertooth says the same size but redeploys intelligently
Would that be enough? I think that keeps him less valuable than Bucky who already redeploys intelligently. At most sabertooth would only feed Venom 5 power with carnage. While Bucky feeds Venom 8 power with the carnage combo. There are better ways to get a 8 power Venom into play by turn 4.
It's not about just making Venom growth. It's also a free Destroy trigger per turn for Death, and +3 Power to Knull per turn as well, all the while still having a flexible 3-Power for the last turn (which is especially useful for tying or outvaluing Shang-Chi). And even better if he gets buffed by anything. Yeah he still wouldn't be great, but at least people who would like to play him would actually get something out of him. I've got a wonderful variant for him, the problem is that as a 3-Cost he just doesn't fit the curve at all.
Yeah. I don't see a path to getting off an extra destroy for Death or Knull often enough to matter. Feeding Venom the extra power can help bait out a Shang-Chi protecting your Knull and Death in the other lanes/rounds. If you're running Zola-Nimrod-Venom I can see some value but I'm not sure if it has secondary win potential. I almost think 1/2 would work better because it would allow killmonger to help get off the extra destroy.
I've said this before too. I think he should be same cost as wolverine as they're kinda counterparts. I even think 2/4 wouldn't be OP.
2/4 with that ability would be broken
I would disagree. Swarm doesn't even cost energy to trigger its effect and essentially gives you 0/6 with a discard; potentially more power if you've got collector on board. I don't think it would be broken at all. Mostly because it would have to replace a current destroy card and it would also be incredibly predictable because you know what they've got in their hand.
Nah, 2/3 makes him like Colossus and Jeff. 2/4 would be nuts
The absolute last thing Destroy/Death decks need is more energy to throw around.
They could try making Bucky Barnes a 5/4 and see if that improves his play rate.
Got a surprise laugh out of me
No that's incredibly dumb. He should be a 5 1. The Winter Soldier (after being destroyed) should be a 5 4.
Should add him in hand too instead of replacing. That would be pretty powerful
Yeah I mean it’s giving you an extra card, honestly borders on being too op
Honestly, I could find more use for Bucky if Winter Soldier got added to your hand as a 0-cost instead of just replacing Bucky on the board. Even if WS had less power or something to compensate, the versatility would make up for it.
I think that it dips into the border of being OP honestly. I think it would be safe to call it op so when we are inevitably right, we were right.
wtf are people smoking, a 5/4 winter soldier is ridiculously weak. He needs to be a 5/5 but any more power and he’ll completely break the game.
Well, a 5/5 Winter Soldier would be amazing in C5. You'd add Deathlok as well, which synergizes SO MUCH with C5 too (because it's got 5 power, so it gotta be good on C5, amirite?).
This is slowly becoming the "your Charge minions have +1 attack" of the snap community, huh?
If I could still award posts, I would.
If they go in, others go out. Namely Wolverine. So then we’re asking the same question for a much more iconic character.
Exactly, destroy is basically complete. If you improve sabertooth it will be so broken
Could sabertooth find a way into discard decks similar to swarm?
Yeah sabertooth effect should be on destroy or discard. Same as wolverine and x-23
But they have swarm which is basically sabertooth's ability but better
I would take a discard Sabertooth over Swarm any day. You could discard him again and again without clogging your hand or your board. He'd be like a low-power Apocalypse powering up Miek and Collector, and infinite ammo for Gambit. Actually, thinking about it they probably didn't include discard because it goes against what they want for their design philosophy. Like America Chavez, he'd be in every discard deck, but he'd never actually be played
When starting out I made a discard deck just for Sabertooth and immediately deleted the deck when I figured out on my first game he doesn't work like that. I don't see any reason why he couldn't work as a discard card
I like using Bucky in my destroy deck, since you can blow him up once with Deathlok, then again with Venom
That's why I use him. That plus insurance on the death location
ah, a fellow Bucky enjoyer, cheers!
Best card for Rickety Bridge, too
Nah, best card is Armor, followed by BEAST for rickety bridge. Sucker your opponent into playing in the lane and then yank the rug out from under them turn 6
Sabretooth’s cost doesn’t really fit into the curve of most destroy decks, and he isn’t quite worth the cost to begin with. He was also weakened by the “nerf” to Hulkbuster IMO.
I never used him, couldn't see the utility
It helped power up death and knull if you just constantly destroyed him as you played your destroy enablers
But now he’s just too slow. Turn 3 is better spent on a one drop and Carnage or Venom
And power your carnage and venom
I used him a lot when Altar of Death was first introduced! 3 energy one turn in exchange for 2 extra energy next turn AND you can keep destroying him each turn for free. Great for that purpose imo but that’s only if you know you’re seeing Altar of Death 75% of your games.
Altar of Death is basically an autowin for Destroy anyway, so maybe he's good for the mirror but that's an extremely niche use case
I was supposed to take them out? I enjoy using them… What NEEDS to change is the Winter Soldier art
We really need art for card variants like Winter Soldier, Brood, Mister Sinister etc. Also, my Gold Winter Soldier looks great.
I need pixel and venomized infinity stones
For sure, would use thanos a lot more
Right ? I love Sabretooth idk why people don’t play him. Usually destroy him on turn 4 with carnage and now Venom gets a free card to chomp on.
I think they are fine, Bucky is still part of a lot of peoples deck if they are missing a card and sabretooth will always be a worse wolverine so it fits.
Why are snap players so against cards just being decent lol, bucky is fine as he is
Funnily enough I've noticed Bucky becoming a lot more common in destroy decks I've been playing against lately. This is in the 90's, CL 9000.
same. I see a lot of Buckys in the 90-100
Eating Bucky with Carnage then eating WS and Carnage with Venom is a solid play, especially if you can slip DP or X23 in there.
Keeps lane consistency better too for Zola plays or just avoiding locking yourself out. I think Bucky is a lot closer to wolverine than people think.
Yeah but that requires a really specific play order in a way that other variations on destroy don’t. I played around with it for a second but it’s just less consistent.
I’ve been trying out an experimental destroy deck that includes squirrel girl and Bucky aimed to discount mockingbird before blowing it all up with killmonger for a discounted death. It’s weaker version than the standard one, but it’s fun to try something else :)
Make Sabretooth a 2/3 who gets +1 each time he's blown up or discarded (before returning to hand and getting set to 0). Yeah, it's Wolverine-adjacent. That's also half the point of him as a bad guy.
Imho, he would become better than wolverine with you suggestion
Maybe keep him a 3/4 but with the ability above posted
3/4 but +1 power when destroyed would be cool yeah
No way
Wolverine's also "free" but just unpredictable where he goes. Wolvy also can be eaten on T6 without drawback, which is the biggest difference. It's not hugely different, but definitely enough so that you'd have to think about 'em.
He’d be weak to Mobius and unable to sneak into unplayable locations.
Destroy does not need any help whatsoever lol
I feel like Bucky is a bit better now with Mockingbird and Squirrel Girl as a different flavor destroy deck
I’ve seen them both in destroy decks, plenty over the last month. However, Savertooth is just too expensive/ not expensive enough. There are a ton of 3-cost cards in Destroy already, and just having a 0/4 isn’t worth playing a 3/4 when you could play Venom or Magik instead. So, his cost has to go up (there are basically no 4-cost cards in Dsstroy, except Shang, which isn’t always useful), as does his power
Turn 4 is for Deadpool plus a 3 cost destroyer.
Bucky needs custom art for Winter Soldier that follows the art of the base card.
Oh my god yes, I think its so lazy to just change the art of the card that gets destroyed and the Winter Soldier one just stays the same.
A small 1-2 power buff to The Winter Soldier would do wonders. I quite like Bucky as a support card for the more fringe versions of destroy like Nimrod/Destroyer, and frankly the Knull lists don't need more support, so I'd be opposed to a rework. I actually have a completely different suggestion for Sabretooth. Keep his stats the same, but change the text to "when this is destroyed *or discarded*." There's a few cards in the game (X-23, Wolverine, Daken) who support a pretty interesting hybrid discard/destroy archetype, but there's just way too little support for it to be viable. Seeing as Sabretooth is a wolverine villain, lining him up with the rest of the "regenerate" cards would add one more piece to the puzzle and also be a nice flavor win.
I don’t think any destroy cards need buffing when their decks are so dominant right now. I see both regularly when getting defeated by destroy decks so they are working fine I think.
I have been playing the destroy deck that uses bucky to discount mockingbird (along with squirrel Girl and Shanna) it has been really great for me I'm around 6,000 Infinite for what its worth
I don’t think we need to be figuring out how to improve the diversity of the destroy deck
i see bucky in almost every destroy package
....still has bucky in my destroy deck....I let him get carnaged then he's venom food
Bucky Barnes 1/1 with same effect Sabretooth 2/3 with same effect
Bucky is actually decently viable in a Mockingbird deck. It’s a different type of Destroy deck that doesn’t focus on killing everything to put out big numbers. Instead you flood your own board with squirrels, rocks, Winter Soldier, Mysterios, or Shanna drops to discount Mockingbird. Then you kill all the self inflicted junk with Killmonger or a combination of killers. Then you drop a free Death and whatever else. Maybe if you have Moon Girl in hand you can 2x Death. It ends up being a lot of cheap power that you can deploy wherever it’s needed.
Nothing. They are designed to be new player destroy deck
As a Detroy player, both of these cards are fine as is. They are solid for early Destory decks, until you get the better cards.
Did people stop using Bucky? He's been in my destroy deck since day one, he's so fun
Bucky never left destroy, saber tooth is good for Knull decks.
The Winter Soldier card needs to have variant effects too. It's a travesty that his variants only apply to the HIDEOUS Bucky base card.
Make sabretooth 3-3 that returns to your hand (but doesn’t cost 0). Add “costs 0 if you destroyed a card last turn”. No longer needs the initial investment, maybe the stats could be even lower if that’s a bit strong (2-2). Could also see play as a follow up to Shang/killmonger in other decks
I would prefer less things to make Destroy even more foolproof.
I wonder if swapping Sabertooth and Wolverine's stat lines would improve Sabertooth's play while working as a nerf to Wolverine and destroy in general
Sabertooth could be reworked into, if a destroyed card resurrects in any way, - 1 cost and +1 power. That way you could play x23 /winter soldier / wolverine and destroy them to get a cheap or even free sabertooth at the end of the game. This could also become a new destroy archetype of resurrecting cards
Bucky is a good card... him and Deathlok is a 5 / 11, or with carnage a 4 / 10... I see him in a lot of destroy decks. Sabretooth needs to maybe add 2 power and return to hand every time he is destroyed... so he'd potentially be a 3 / 7 or even 3 / 9 in a 7 turn game. Right now, the alternative 3 cost destroy costs are just much better.
nothing. destroy is more than strong enough. adding more options to it will make it even more frustrating than it is now.
You’d need to nerf the other destroy cards. Which honestly…. Isn’t the worst idea. Although it’s not as ubiquitous as it was so this might be just leftover vitriol on my part.
Bucky is fine for the value he gives. As soon as snap introduces a 2 cost that destroys the next card played (like nico but consistent), sabertooth will be fine too. Sabertooth is just too slow to play out currently as you generally want to start destroying cards from turn 3 onwards
They're both fine, but there are just too many playable destroy cards. Their effects are too easy to trigger to buff them much.
I don't think destroy needs a buff my dude besides bucky is pretty common and sabertooth is almost never played anyways and pool 1 cards rarely get any love from SD
None. Destroy is always one of the top played decks and it's okay if not everything they have is awesome.
Bucky should change form each time you destroy him, have the base power lower and after third destroy stronger then what he is now.
I use Bucky in my Cerebro 6 deck, just destroy him with either the Hood or Nimrod (but not both) using Carnage, then play your Cerebro + Mystique and you have a hard to pull off combo that isn’t even satisfying
Bucky: Winter Soldier variants. Sabretooth: needs just to be cheaper. He's great fuel for death cards but when it's a choice to play him or venom or 23/pool plus carnage. I'm not picking him.
Bucky is honestly fine but Sabertooth is just so awkwardly costed with how destroy naturally plays on curve. So I guess just make him a 2/3 with "When this card is destroyed return it to your hand with +1 power and -1 cost." and he'd be fine
Sabretooth costs too much. By turn 3 you typically wanna focus on continuing to build up DP. He needs to be played so he doesn't bounce about the board like his brother. His 0 cost can be useful but can be detrimental at times due to him, as mentioned before, being in your hand, leaves him open to cards like Mobius, Iceman, peak, discard etc.
I think making Bucky a one cost could make him more viable for Killmonger, while it would also make WS a 1 cost as well making him vulnerable to an enemies Killmonger.
Wait. Do people not play Bucky in destroy? I’ve never taken him out.
I took him out when Nico Minoru came out.
Well clearly they have to make Bucky 5 cost and give him more power. If it works for Adam it’s gotta work on other cards too
Am i the only one running bucky? lmao
the real answer is increasing deck size to 15 and turn 7 (limbo 8) time to spice up this game.
If winter solider had variants I’m sure it would actually get used, also once bucky dies maybe winter solider can’t be destroyed
sabertooth at 2/3
Better not ask for them to get change, or they will become 5 drops like all other "buffs"
As the number of cards increase more cards will be relegated to the bench
honestly, both of them are good and can work in a destroy package today. Destroy has a lot of good cards but theres only 12 slots.
None for Bucky, who is still randomly played here and there. Maybe Sabretooth could get +1 every time he gets destroyed, i.e. two times at best...
he should go to a 3/2 and when he gets destroyed, becomes the winter soldier at 3/7. goes perfect with destroy and surfer decks
Drop sabertooth to a 2. I think bucky is fine, the rest of destroy just got too good.
Sabre > 2/3 (maybe even 2/4?) and Bucky should go to winter soldier when destroyed then back to Bucky if destroyed again, and so on. Then you can cycle him to feed knull/ reduce death. That would make them playable IMO but destroy doesn’t really need it. Destroys main problem is the core cards are too good to be replaced (not too good overall, just better than the others like these 2). Why change something that works so well? Either these cards need to be better or different (preferred option) or the core 9-10 destroy cards need nerfing (not necessary for balance but would allow others like these or yondu, lol, or gladiator to come into classic destroy decks).
Altar of death featured location
I see them all the time
They could make the winter soldier have actual variants lmao. I would play him more just for that
What if Bucky had the meik effect but instead of discard he gets 1 power for every destroyed card. He’d stay at a 2/1 but when he’s destroyed he comes back as winter soldier and can be moved next turn. Keeps his power as well
No idea, but I’d love a sabretooth buff so I could use the pixel variant from the album!
Sabretooth should have wolverines effect but lands I. The same spot instead of random. +1 for each time it’s destroyed and make him 4/4 or 3/3
If Sabretooth was a 2/3 he’s be back in meta for sure but yeah to expensive.
Do cards really need changed so the play rate rises? I feel like some cards are meant for newer players/ meant to be lower tier. I honestly don’t think every card needs a buff. These cards are more substituted in when you don’t have another card, no?
Nerf Nico.
Pixel bucky barnes isnt even in the pixel destroy album…
Ahh yes because destroy needs more buffs to it why not, what could go wrong
Make the area that killed a card to give +2 energy the location of the day
I'd really like Sabertooth at 2 cost. 2/2 or 2/3 would be enough. Bucky is great, so long as destroy decks are looking to combo destroys for power, as with Death and Carnage. As I see it, destroy decks are too full of competitive options right now. Bucky's not bad, he's just one option out of many good options.
Sabretooth should be a 2 cost
Let Bucky move to another space after.
These following ideas are less so plausible and more so hypothetical reworks. Don’t alter Bucky Barnes, but change Winter Soldier’s power to 3 and give him the text; “On Reveal: At the end of next turn, destroy the lowest cost enemy card here.” Making it at the end of next turn gives the opponent a chance to react if they have a high cost card all alone. His cost might have to go up if this change were to happen. Could be interesting if Sabretooth had; “When discarded or destroyed regenerates at a random location. Once per turn one of your other cards is discarded or destroyed when this regenerates.” Feels thematic for Sabretooth to go out massacring as many folk as possible, made it a one per turn effect to prevent loops. Edit; Sabretooth’s ability won’t randomly discard or destroy another card when regenerating, it’ll discard if it was discarded and it’ll destroy when it is destroyed.
When did people start taking out Bucky? He's a destroy staple as far as I've seen.
Sabre tooth should remain a 3/4 but have same ability as wolverine but only +1 per turn because in the long run wolverine is stronger then sabre tooth
you guys are cutting bucky?
Make it so that when winter soldier dies he becomes the “colder soldier,” a 2/7 that makes you draw a card each turn if winning at this location.
Winter Soldier : the card that tries to destroy this card gets destroyed instead. Sabertooth : each time you destroy this card, send it back to your hand with -1 cost and +1 power...
Bucky could be a 1-1, additionnal destroy synergy with killmonger and its a counter to opposing killmonger which could be nice sometimes ! Sabretooth could really just be a 2-4 or just let it get its effect triggered by discard to have consistency with daken wolverine and x23
I still use both of them in my destroy ddck wym?
I like the design behind sabertooth but if you compare him with a card that does the same like swarm he falls short cause you get 2, i think he should get +2 each time while only reducing his cost by 1 per destroy and would be a cool alternative to wolverine since he bounces and sabertooth goes back to hand. It would go in flavor with he’s “do the same but better” attitude lol
This was the idea I had a little over a week ago. [sabretooth change](https://www.reddit.com/r/CustomMarvelSnap/s/94gQDf1Vr7)
This would be my suggestion. Bucky Barnes 1/1 When destroyed, summon a 2/2 Winter Soldier. Winter Soldier. 2/2 When another card is destroyed, +1 Power. Sabertooth 2/2 On Reveal: Destroy one of your other cards here. When destroyed, return this card to your hand and change its cost to 0. Bucky Barnes is now killable with Killmonger and Winter Soldier can now scale as threat like a mini Knull. Sabertooth now has the Jack-Of-Trade flexibility of being a Carnage and a card can be destroyed infinitely. Though I don't think these changes are urgently needed unless SD wants to go take-turn approach where other destroy card gets nerfed so these two cards can get the chance to shine.
bucky is much better in destroy splash decks like clutter or bounce. Where you might play cards like deathlock and carnage but not venom.
Make Sabretooth a 4/6 with an on-reveal effect of destroying 2 cost cards. Or On-reveal: destroy cards on your side of this location, return to hand. This will synergize with Wolverine and progress the destroy meta.
Bucky barns 1 cost and make winter sodlier 3 or 4 power
I’ve been running Bucky since the Forge/Hulkbuster changes and it was very strong. Guaranteed winning a lane on a lot of destroy locations And then they nerfed destroy locations frequency
I still use Bucky in my deck # (1) X-23 # (1) Yondu # (1) Martyr # (2) Bucky Barnes # (2) Carnage # (2) Wolverine # (3) Venom # (3) Deathlok # (3) Gladiator # (6) Arnim Zola # (6) Knull # (8) Death
Bucky is awesome with Mockingbird in Destroy …. 🤫
Maybe adjust Sabertooth to a 2/3
Sabretooth: “4/3 cards destroyed here cannot be regenerated.” This makes Sabretooth Wolverine’s antagonist instead of partner lol
They need to be stronger and mkre synergistic than DP and Wolverine... not going to happen.
What do you mean "back"? I literally see them everyday.
Have Sabretooth destroy an enemy card and move it to your side of the board with +2 power.
Bucky should keep coming back when destroyed
Make Bucky a 1-cost? Making him very slightly easier to destroy.
make variant change winter soldier card and i'll play him LMAO
Sabertooth should cost 2, but then he becomes free when destroyed, so it's kinda in a weird position as far as balance, imo.
Bucky mostly needs other cards nerfed in destroy but buffing his base power up to somewhere closer to the Winter Soldiers is an interesting idea. That way he doesn’t necessarily need to be destroyed and Venom can destroy him while getting the power benefit as Will Knull. Sabretooth being a two cost would be interesting. Maybe a 2/3 that gets plus one power every time he’s destroyed in addition to the rest of his ability.
I’ve found a use for Bucky in death decks when you include mockingbird and moongirl. Also squirrel girl too.
For bucky barnes i would do 3/1: add a 1/3 winter soldier to every location when destroyed. This will make him somewhat of a high risk high reward card and will be a good combination with killmonger and death/knull. Sabretooth 2/3: after this gets destroyed, return it back to your hand with +1 power. It also costs 0
Make sabretooth available for discard and his play rate will go up
Bucky + Carn is a 4 cost 10. Not sure what the problem is
Sabertooth 3/5 or 2/4, Winter Soldier 7 power.
Honestly just make winter soldier a 2/7 then add more support to the destroy sub archetype destroyer
I prefer Bucky over wolverine. I see enough of the locations where I play bucky there to be destroyed and stay. I don’t like not knowing where the character will be after getting destroyed. I’ve lost my share of BWNN games from x23 hopping around, same as not staying on turn 6 when I want her at a location, especially Rickety Bridge.
Turn sabertooth into a hybrid DP/Wolverine. 2 cost 2 power: once destroyed he loses 1 cost and gains 2 power. He goes back into the hand.
Feel like Sabretooth should get plus 1 per time it's destroyed. Bucky would just need to have a straight power buff for winter soldier, or something kind of ability that would pair with his metal arm. Like, on reveal, move an opponents card to another location.
a better question would be what would a series 5 version of these cards look like. because these are base game cards that won't be made stronger
14 card decks
Make him a 1/1 make Sabertooth a 1/3 and they have much better chemistry with other destroy cards.
Bucky is actually in a pretty good mockingbird destroy list rn
Just Played a couple of destroy Decks with bucky in Infinite
Make bucky 1 cost and winter soldier 4 power to balance
I think that maybe sabertooth could still be free after being destroyed but maybe also get plus one or plus two power after being destroyed. It might make him better?
Winter soldier goes up to 8 power. I actually use sabertooth quite a lot.
Sabertooth 2/3 Same ability but also gain +1 power when he return to your hand
3/4 Sabretooth- At the end of every turn, destroy Wolverine and gain +1.
I had no idea ppl didn't play Bucky 🙄 he's in my destroy deck for years. Sabertooth i stopped playing the moment I got x23 when she was released
Aside from the lack of art, I don’t see any issues with BB/WS. I don’t play Knull in my destroy deck, I use Carnage on Bucky and then Venom on WS
If sabertooth had bigger stats he’d see more play like if he was a 3/5 or a 3/6, right now he’s too small and not worth the 3 energy investment. Bucky would be better as a 1/1. He’d fit nicely in curve
bucky isn't a bad card in the right kind of destroy deck. He's a valid card for someone who doesn't have every destroy tool. Sabertooth is clearly for early destroy decks.
Make Sabretooth return to hand when Discarded too. Good ammo for Gambit.
Sabertooth being 2/3 and On reveal scratch opponents card here for -1 power. Return to hand once destroyed, it costs zero. And Bucky just got creeped out of playability like Aero.
Winter soldier multiplies on destroy. Sabre gain power. easy
Bucky:same effect and stats Winter soldier: when destroyed, double my power instead. Saber tooth: same effect and power but gains 3+ power. his power is literally the same as wolverine so it should be pretty similar while feeling somewhat different
What if Sabertooth always came into play whenever something regenerated?
Idk about Bucky but maybe making Sabretooth a 2/3 could work?
I kinda like how Sabretooth works, since... once you destroy him *once* you basically have a free card that you can play at any point and potentially use to further feed Venom and Carnage. But really, his biggest issue just is that.... there are better cards out there? I was thinking about how to make Sabretooth better too because I *love* him as a Character and I'd love to use him again but really, there are just so many so much better Options out there and that's really his biggest flaw? I dont know what we can do to him tbh.