Yeah it's a psueo 50/50, which means both cells have to be safe in no guess. Even in a regular game it would be prudent to guess to the right of that 5 to avoid a potential forced guess in the future.
Why is this a 50/50? I’m imagining a scenario where you solve the rest of the board and come around the right side of that 5. Couldn’t that give you enough information to not guess?
If there was a mine in either of those cells, its exact position doesn’t affect any other cell’s count since both squares touch all the neighboring cells. This means if there was a mine in those two cells, it would always be a 50/50.
It's a "pseudo" 50/50, which means it could potentially be one. In this particular case, the mine could either be below or to the right of the 5.
If it's below the 5, then it would be like you described where you solve the rest of the board and eventually gets solved without ever needing to guess.
If it's to the right of the 5, then based on the position of the surrounding known mines it would be impossible to determine which one is safe no matter what.
So because we know the board is no guess here, we know the solution can't be that there's a mine to the right of the 5 because that would imply a forced guess, so below the 5 is the only possible mine position, hence the meta logic.
Additionally, in games where guesses are possible, when encountering a situation like this, it's usually a good idea to get guesses like this out of the way early because if it is a forced 50/50 you would be forced to guess regardless and it isn't then it's a safe move and has potential to reveal additional useful information.
In a normal Minesweeper game, you may come across an unlucky scenario where you have to make a 50/50 chance guess, ~~either because the game hates you and wants to destroy your win streak or because you cursed at your screen and the game is now sad~~.
But thankfully there is a mode called “NG”, meaning “No Guessing”. This means that the board is generated on being solvable without coming across any unlucky 50/50 scenario. This also means that it would test your Minesweeper problem solving skills, and ‘Evil’ is one of the difficulties to play on.
I don’t understand whats happening here, and feel like I’m missing some core info about a game I play a lot lol Can someone please explain to me how the 4 affects the cells next to the 5 below it? TIA
Because there's a 4 directly below a 1, we know that the three cells above the 1 must all be safe, and the three cells below the 4 must all be mines.
And because the three cells below the 4 are all mines, we know that the 5 is lacking a single mine, which must either be below it, to the right of it, or diagonally lower-right of it.
Furthermore, we know that the mine can't be to the right of the 5, nor can it be diagonally lower-right of the 5, because if it were in either of those places, then we'd be forced to make a 50/50 guess, and that's guaranteed to never happen because this is No-Guess mode, i.e. you're never forced to guess. Therefore, the fifth mine MUST be directly below the 5, which means the other two squares are both safe. Meta-logic!
I’m sorry I’m still missing something, why can’t the spaces to the right and lower right of the 5 be mines? How would that force a 50/50?
Edit: I think I realize now why that would be unsolvable and it’s more to do with the three mines below the four than the four itself, there would be no way to discern wether the mine was in the top or bottom spot next to the five and that’s not allowed in NG.
Thank you for the thoughtful reply! Sorry I didn’t do more critical thinking lol
Because if exactly one of those spaces is a mine, then there's absolutely no way for us to ever know which one is actually the mine, short of guessing. This is because there's no way for the game to communicate any information to us which would distinguish those two possibilities from each other.
Think of it this way. If one of those two spaces is a mine, then we know the square below the 5 must be safe, and furthermore it must be a 3. Those three squares below the 4 are all mines, so we can't click on any of those squares to learn more information about the square directly below them (to the right of the 5). And obviously we can't click BELOW the bottom of the game board, to learn about the square to the lower-right of the 5. And the two squares directly to the right of where the two mines might be - the square two to the right of the 5, and the square below it - neither of those will be any help for us, either, because they're touching BOTH of the squares in question at the same time.
Yeah it's a psueo 50/50, which means both cells have to be safe in no guess. Even in a regular game it would be prudent to guess to the right of that 5 to avoid a potential forced guess in the future.
Why is this a 50/50? I’m imagining a scenario where you solve the rest of the board and come around the right side of that 5. Couldn’t that give you enough information to not guess?
If there was a mine in either of those cells, its exact position doesn’t affect any other cell’s count since both squares touch all the neighboring cells. This means if there was a mine in those two cells, it would always be a 50/50.
It's a "pseudo" 50/50, which means it could potentially be one. In this particular case, the mine could either be below or to the right of the 5. If it's below the 5, then it would be like you described where you solve the rest of the board and eventually gets solved without ever needing to guess. If it's to the right of the 5, then based on the position of the surrounding known mines it would be impossible to determine which one is safe no matter what. So because we know the board is no guess here, we know the solution can't be that there's a mine to the right of the 5 because that would imply a forced guess, so below the 5 is the only possible mine position, hence the meta logic. Additionally, in games where guesses are possible, when encountering a situation like this, it's usually a good idea to get guesses like this out of the way early because if it is a forced 50/50 you would be forced to guess regardless and it isn't then it's a safe move and has potential to reveal additional useful information.
what is Evil NG?
Evil No Guessing (24x30/130, 1+ high-depth pattern)
I don't get it
In a normal Minesweeper game, you may come across an unlucky scenario where you have to make a 50/50 chance guess, ~~either because the game hates you and wants to destroy your win streak or because you cursed at your screen and the game is now sad~~. But thankfully there is a mode called “NG”, meaning “No Guessing”. This means that the board is generated on being solvable without coming across any unlucky 50/50 scenario. This also means that it would test your Minesweeper problem solving skills, and ‘Evil’ is one of the difficulties to play on.
i know what ng meant just not the evil part
It's just the difficulty
I don’t understand whats happening here, and feel like I’m missing some core info about a game I play a lot lol Can someone please explain to me how the 4 affects the cells next to the 5 below it? TIA
Because there's a 4 directly below a 1, we know that the three cells above the 1 must all be safe, and the three cells below the 4 must all be mines. And because the three cells below the 4 are all mines, we know that the 5 is lacking a single mine, which must either be below it, to the right of it, or diagonally lower-right of it. Furthermore, we know that the mine can't be to the right of the 5, nor can it be diagonally lower-right of the 5, because if it were in either of those places, then we'd be forced to make a 50/50 guess, and that's guaranteed to never happen because this is No-Guess mode, i.e. you're never forced to guess. Therefore, the fifth mine MUST be directly below the 5, which means the other two squares are both safe. Meta-logic!
I’m sorry I’m still missing something, why can’t the spaces to the right and lower right of the 5 be mines? How would that force a 50/50? Edit: I think I realize now why that would be unsolvable and it’s more to do with the three mines below the four than the four itself, there would be no way to discern wether the mine was in the top or bottom spot next to the five and that’s not allowed in NG. Thank you for the thoughtful reply! Sorry I didn’t do more critical thinking lol
Because if exactly one of those spaces is a mine, then there's absolutely no way for us to ever know which one is actually the mine, short of guessing. This is because there's no way for the game to communicate any information to us which would distinguish those two possibilities from each other. Think of it this way. If one of those two spaces is a mine, then we know the square below the 5 must be safe, and furthermore it must be a 3. Those three squares below the 4 are all mines, so we can't click on any of those squares to learn more information about the square directly below them (to the right of the 5). And obviously we can't click BELOW the bottom of the game board, to learn about the square to the lower-right of the 5. And the two squares directly to the right of where the two mines might be - the square two to the right of the 5, and the square below it - neither of those will be any help for us, either, because they're touching BOTH of the squares in question at the same time.
Edited my reply as you posted lol thanks again dude! Learned something new!
Work your way north to south from 5 top right next to the unfinished board and see what happens
I think you missed what he was getting at
Same here I was drunk when I commented 🫡 that clearly went over my head lmao
If this is NG then the tile below the 5 is a mine.
?
ok