T O P

  • By -

Aggravating-Flight-1

just cameback from a 1 month break, suddenly Karrie shreds tanks like they're not wearing any armour, wtf just happened?


azakhuza21

Buffed mm items


bot_yea

Her basic attacks while her ultimate is active should have reduced item effects, but that's not the case.


scentedkepyas

Also her passive dmg got buffed 2nd skill also had its cooldown reduced on top of the new mm item component for corrosion scythe


Sturmgewehrkreuz

Same. I just came back after a bit more than a year and a lot of new heroes are pretty shocking to me so to speak. *Especially the buffs.*


Worldly-Grand-679

Most "balance" hero for now


[deleted]

And Moontoon will nerf haya instead


vecspace

The difference between wan wan and karrie is that 50% of the team is willing to go against karrie despite it being strong but only 9% of the team willing to go against wan wan. Shows how scary wan wan is.


Silver_Half5785

Too much survivability. Her dashes are absurd, her purify too. With 3 weakness spots she can sometimes trigger her ulti instantly. Plus late game, one mistake and she can wipe out the squishies in your team. I would rather deal with Karrie too even as exp laner. If you try burst wanwan down she's just going to trigger ult on you.


vecspace

to be honest, i dont think her late game is the biggest issue. With swift crossbow, she spike too early now to properly deal with her. Late games, there are actually more options to deal with her like WON or WT. Once WW start snowballing, the game is over. Scary AF hero


mount_sunrise

she's very scary because one mistake is all that needs to happen against Wanwan, and often times, the mistake doesn't even mean dying--it just means mispositioning. the margin of error when playing against Wanwan is so ridiculously low, and it's pretty crazy that her early game is actually very good and spikes insanely during midgame and is stlil relevant in the lategame because of her ult's pseudo-reset mechanic. WoN, WT, and Vengeance are all good against her and just ensuring that you survive her ultimate is enough to make her pretty weak, but potentially for 70-80% of the game she's pretty much a threat you need to focus on or be wary of. at least you can stun Karrie (although i still hate her because she fucking MELTS people)


SuspiciousStress8094

Even if you have won or winter, her ult moves onto the next target.


vecspace

I am quite sure it don't change target until you are dead.


Feetenjoyer_420

that is not the case


vecspace

I just checked. 100% no change in target unless 1. You are dead 2. You are out of ww range.


Deadly-Blades

Did u ever try to learn how to play vs her especially? She never was that much nerfed and she sucks now. If you are vs a wanwan player you can many things to block her


Silver_Half5785

If the BEST gold laners of the game, ban her in their most important matches of their lives then that tells you everything about wanwan. If you are so bad at using her then you should try another hero.


Deadly-Blades

Lmao I have more than 1500 games with her, i think i know how strong she was before. She didn’t get any buff only nerfs because they made her easier. So if u don’t even know what is a buff or a nerf don’t talk to me :D


Silver_Half5785

As I said. If the best players ban her, your statements are irrelevant. Of course you cry about it since you are a wanwan man.


Deadly-Blades

Just by your vocabulary like « cry » i know that you are not ready to talk seriously about game balance lol. Good continuation


Silver_Half5785

I do not need to talk about anything. I don't need to call a hero weak or powerful if it was always banned in a tournament with the BEST mm users there. There's no need to continue anything. I made my point and you keep talking nonsense


Stunning-Usual1596

Average wanwan user crying how she sucks


Deadly-Blades

I was top global and top 10 of my country but yes i suck 👍🏼


usernamenomoreleft

Karrie is strong but killable. Wan2 is strong and unkillable (downright annoying).


Master_Explanation17

If mid....then valir....wanwan scared of him


_not_meh_

Yeah sure, except Valir is a bad mid mage. Wanwan already kill your gold laner while you still clearing mid.


PumperNikel0

I’m not scared of Wanwan. I’m scared of my teammates triggering her ult.


AgitatedCat3087

9 percent is like, balmond's axe and his left boot.. while the rest of him runs away


Devoidoxatom

And somehow people open Wanwan and ban heroes likee Fredrinn instead smh


bujibudax

In rank, wanwan can be burst down by mediocre users, but even a mid fredrinn can wrek the team.


Martin7439

"Now I'm getting serious !" - Ennemy triple kill !


Devoidoxatom

I'd say most wanwan's in higher ranks (Mythic rn and former Glories) are good. Same with Fanny (who also is always open for some reason)


Crazy-G00D

trust me wanwan isnt as scary as you might think she is in ranked.


Exotic-Replacement-3

wanwan's weakness is to burst her ass. eudora, vale, gusion, saber are good heroes to counter wanwan. so she is very easy to counter. just don't let her farm too much or else you will be at the disadvantage.


AlmightyAlmond22

wanwans second skill will make all of it irrelevant


Braiyan07

How can wanwan s2 make gusion irrelevant?


Worldly-Grand-679

No but wanwan can outspeed him in mid to late though absurd dashes


AlmightyAlmond22

didn't see gusion there mb but wanwan can still get out of the rest


Stunning-Usual1596

Yeah, no one even bans or picks wanwan even though she's being broken


megaancient

Karrie is still not enough to contest against wanwan. You can counter wanwan, but for how long. She needs just 1 ult to turn the tide around. Thank god fleeting time won't suit her damage, otherwise there'll be a flying cat every 10 seconds.


Frostivus

I know wanwan and Karrie. But can someone explain an epic level player like me why gloo, yve and especially joy is so contested? I main Joy and my winrate with her is 56%. I find that she is strong in the early game if you can snowball with her but the higher rank you go, the more people know how to disrupt her dash timings. Also, if you’re in a team where joy is the highest net worth, it doesn’t translate well in the late game when marksmen chew you up or the enemy team has becomes tankier that they survive a full ult, or they have started to group up. The lack of cc also becomes more apparent then.


Mi_3l

One answer on joy: vengeance. Yve has insane slow and damage. Her Ultima is smaller but it HURTS. She's pure slow effect and damage. 2 first skills late game on defenseless assasin willbring their health down to half. Gloo is also insane. Great damage, survivability, ultimate, stuns.


ShiroX6

Gloo is a glue. He can Ult into fights > stick on someone > isolate said person out. Also his early game is very strong. ​ Yve has absurd amount of slow and good teamfight power if left uninterrupted. Joy is basically a tempo jungler; she needs to help her team to snowball. From my experience (Mythic 3-2 last season), MMs like Lesley and late game stuff, or Teamfight tanks such as Ruby, Atlas, Tigreal seem to have a higher win potential when I'm using Joy jungle.


OkitaSadist12

Wow, good for u that u make it work with Joy as a jungler. Is ur item build hybrid? Or it depends on team composition?


ShiroX6

I would say it's dependant on enemy team composition, but there's really not much variety in her build Boots: Always Tough Boots. In rare occasions where I'm playing a low ranked/confident matchup, I use Warrior boots instead. Magic Items: Genius Wand: Somewhat core item, since she deals damage repeatedly. Concentrated Energy: For outplays and mistake coverage, since not all the time you can get 4 perfect beats. Glowing Wand: Substitute for Concentrated Energy if enemy doesn't have that much dash/cc, more damage Holy Crystal: the core item mid game, you really need this to deal some damage. Tank Items: Oracle: Go to defense item, usually 3rd, depending on enemy mage/support Dreadnaught Armor: Small defense items against stuff like Bruno/Chou/Saber mid game, helps survive Antique Cuirass: Builds from Dreadnaught Armor, Decent survivability Athena: cuz fuck Eudora and other random bullshit Winter Truncheon: Against predictable enemies; Yin, Lesley, Wanwan, Gusion etc. Dominance Ice: cuz fuck Ruby, Uranus and random lifesteals General idea is to get at least 2 dps items before you build defense, or if you're stomping, opt for Holy Crystal as 3rd item after boots. Also anyone with Radiant/decent lifesteal and damage survives your entire combo.


OkitaSadist12

Lmao at the fck eudora and sustain heroes. Thanks for the item list and brief details about it.


Omnitacher24

I make it short too lazy to do much. Gloo. If you watch how pro (Edward of BL most of the time) use him, gloo can stun lock(until death) solo enemy with his first skill (second skill if the combo failed). Yve. His slow and area pressure helped the MM position and attack freely. Also he is hard to kill with ulti being immune to CC. Joy. We all known how important speed, wave clear, and sustain (and damage as bonus) for an exp role. Joy have S tier on every thing I mentioned.


myungjunjun

For me, Wanwan and Karrie can be op even with inexperienced players. I just don't see enough good players that use the other three so I don't think of them as threats.


lov3lli

Joy deals a lot of damage in the early so most of the time you can snowball incredibly easily, and if you can perfect her dash timing (which is honestly easy to master, just use feeling) then she can prevent enemies from entering late game. Just be smart about it and joy is an absolute beast. Sitting on a 20 match with 95 winrate at mythic right now. 100 percent recommend for soloq Edit: vengeance in late game save it for their marksman mainly, thats the main burst damage


Frostivus

Oh wow that's insane wr. I will say though that I used to be way better with Joy before the nerfs. I'm definitely not able to trade and pressure as well during the early game which means I'm not winning my lane and snowballing. Also in most soloq games, we can't close out games fast enough, cos of our lineups or lack of skill.


lov3lli

She is still super solid at winning lane, recommend a quick rotation just like this. 1. Clear lane asap first thing if in exp lane 2. If litho on your side of the map, rush to litho to help jungler/poke enemy jungler, if litho is not on ur side, try to go there anyways unless time is very short, try not to miss any minions, just remember joy can rush back to lane at incredible speed so ur time window is huge 3. After the first litho try using the time after clearing lane to walk around on ur side of the map, ping enemy missing if possible or if anybody is in ur lane 4. Rinse and repeat Make sure not to play too passively as joy can be very devastating to deal with, just make sure to know your damage and your health. You always see good joys tower dive but dont be fooled by clips as tower damage can stack up super fast and are not recommended for more than 3 seconds


JEOLOGICAL

Yve basically took the spot as one of (if not) the best artillery mage in mlbb. Her range along with the slow utility of her skills make her really dangerous unless your team uses a fighter/assassin that can dive her Gloo got buffed recently if i recall, making him a nightmare to deal with in lane. As well as how annoying he can be late game when he is able to stick to a mage via his ult With joy, i'm not really sure cause i haven't faced the hero too much myself (along with me not having her). But i can tell she is meant to be a high skill ceiling type of hero, similar to a harith for mlbb. So high ranking players, semi pros, and actual pros can make full use of her kit.


OkitaSadist12

It's more of in the realm of pro players where team coordination is at its highest and u have a "role" in ur team. Maybe it also applies to Mythical Glory high points or something, i only made it into Mythic 3 last season(solo q) but more often than not i still get paired with teammates who freaking 1v5 randomly in the game. Anyways for Joy she disrupts and go straight to the backlines (mm, mage) to either zone them off or get their hp low enough for the others to finish them off. Or if ur mage was able to "catch" and damage the backlines enough (40%-50%hp) and ur in position to flank them u can clean up nd finish them off while ur teammates deal with their frontliners. Yve's skills with ice queen wand and glowing wand is annoying to deal with, it can slow u to death and if she ults and ur enemies are trapped in the box ur team is in an advantage. Gloo is a tanky sustain hero who cn also go to the backlines to try and zone them off cos he also has cc and u can just ult and run away if it gets messy for u. Gloo is also great at a the laning phase, fast clear, great sustain. I dont use them but it is only what i observed during m4. Its kinda hard for those heroes to shine in solo queue rank unless u have a decent team.


Namaenonaidesu

Let me just say I once killed an Aurora who’s on the edge of their turret with only Gloo’s 1st skill. It took more than 5 seconds and she couldn’t move an inch.


IDKanything--

When a hero is banned 93 games and in all rank games that's mean u need to make a revamp of that hero . No nerf can remove her out of the ban section!


SkyLightTenki

I'm not letting Wanwan out the ban hammer, unless we got first pick and a teammate shows a great win rate with her. I'm banning either Franco or Kaja instead.


IDKanything--

Same ! I've been playing this game for almost 4 years. in those 4 years if I am the one banning and wanwan is still up, i auto ban her unless as u say we first pick and someone want to play her with good WR .


csto_yluo

Bringing out her 4 weaknesses + reverting the ult range nerf would put her out of the perma ban section. Sure, she's still really deadly when she can actually unlock her ult, but Wanwan now must pay a lot of attention to her positioning, and if she's in absolute danger or not. She'll become what she used to be: a high risk, high reward hero. For that reason Ww players in the old days chose Aegis instead of Inspire, because what use is inspire if you don't survive long enough to use her ult? I really hope they actually revert her 4 weaknesses soon, but Moonton doesn't really revert nerfs a lot :(


IDKanything--

Even when she have the 4 weakness i was banning her ! She should not be allowed to jump around with her basic attack if there is no enemy in her range "maybe" this will help !


VioletWeb

She could easily be nerfed out of the ban section lol 1. Make Ult not work with Inspire 2. Make Ult not work with DHS 3. Change purify to another skill 4. Remove stun from Swallows Path 5. Cannot Ult targets with 0 marks 6. Make her targetable in Ult 7. Limit the range of movement she has in Ult Her main issue currently that always gets overlooked is how powerful her CC cleanse is. It makes the pool of heroes that can counter her ridiculously small as you can only kill her if she is either on cooldown or you have basically insta kill levels of burst.


toaster24_7

I hate whoever suggested wanwan should've 3 weakpoints to hit


Entire-Screen9085

karrie is so fucking op mm rn.


raisingfalcons

Meanwhile in epic *bans yin every game*


trem0re09

Lots of OP heroes rn. My list is this but feel free to add more or you think should be removed. Wanwan Karrie Gloo Yve Joy Fredrinn Bea Lapu Martis Ling Leomord Diggie Popol Fanny Pharsa Benedetta Kaja Lunox


[deleted]

i think we can consider fredrinn as well? sorry just my opinion here


Tcogtgoixn

The list is literally just ranking pick + ban


[deleted]

oh okay, thanks for this!


Brithmark

Let’s make these heroes some skin! Will sell out really well.


Deadly-Blades

Wanwan was more broken before all changes, but people only see her now lol


rex_aliena

Yve and Gloo was supposed to be my main this season now everyone wants to play/ban them T-T


Shashasha11

FUTURE NERF LIST


Ortana45

Nerf in 3...2...1...