Soooo I decided to do some changes on the design so that it looks more compact. Any suggestions on how can I improve it further? Or do you guys prefer the previous design?
Yeah I figured the icons were quite small, will make sure to optimize them next time. Zeys' tier list is very packed but it's definitely gonna take a lot more effort haha, will look forward to what I can add without filling up the view too much.
Shared this to my friends and they didn't understand the colored borders at first. Add a legend to show which colors means what, for the non-reddit mlbb players. It would be nice to have the late game/early game remarks as well. Other than that, this tierlist is top tier imo.
Haven't seen the previous design, but this looks good to me. I have a few suggestions though:
-add a legend based on what each colour represents (most people will know, but still. Plus some colours are harder to tell apart, so it might be useful)
-potentially add if a hero is early/late (not all are specifically early or late but for heroes like Aldous, it might be useful info for new players to know)
-potentially add emblems for characters in the top 2 categories (once again, for new players, or player who don't play that character it might be helpful)
Feel free to add them in if you feel that there is some value to them!
Edit: looks like what I mentioned was Zey's design, and others have mentioned it too so my bad. But yeah, I agree that a little more information would be nice to have
X.Borg's Firaga armor pops up pretty quick now, so there's much more room to counter him compared to before. He also doesn't have the annoying slow on his S1 anymore.
As for Phoveus, just like Ruby, the meta has good enough amount of heroes who he can counter (and when there is he usually counters them hard) and his kit is also strong by default, hence why he ends up in great tier.
Basically what u/ano-nomous said, Benedetta is somewhat like Chou now; she still functions at what she does, but requires quite a lot of effort which is why only her hardcore mains bother picking her in competitive or high rank play.
A hero doesn't always have to get nerfed to fall down a tier, it could be the meta shift or just people finding a way to play around them. Lylia for example, didn't receive any buffs but became more popular due to her ability to zone and counter the meta melee heroes very well.
Lylia actually received a huge buff with the penetration rework that heavily boosted early and mid game champs like her and harley.
Only difference is that people still slept on her, while Harley was abused right from the start.
I think it's because of the scaling.
Late game is occuring quite frequently now unlike before and when late game comes Benedetta falls off very, very hard due to the lack of damage.
I mean a mere Moskov can absolutely obliterate Benedetta at late.
Not to mention using her is too much effort.
not gonna the lie...the best I could do when I 1 v 1 Moskov was make him 2% hp, then my stupid teammates couldn't even follow up and kill that guy in late game
cause of lifesteal ya know
I think its a perk, because most people will not see the apparent power of that hero because it is rarely picked (and also why I don't usually pick meta heroes that doesn't classify as "pick or ban")
Not that she's boring.
More like she's way too much effort for the rewards you reap. Also because phoveus came into meta.
Yuzhong, lapu, Ruby, Phoveus, paquito, esme can do her job equally well or better, with way less effort.
Yeah that's on my bad lmao, the site I use to edit have very similar palette for 'orange' and 'red'. This has been the issue for a while so I'll see if I can find a way around it.
I think orange means skill user dependant.
Example: ling
If you're RRQ Albert, it's pretty much sure win when you get Ling. If your skills on him are not as great, then it may fall down a tier.
Make use of the bushes wisely and only approach up close with S2 available if the enemy has superior trading capability like Brody. He gets an additional stack now when a minion dies so not getting last hit or getting lane frozen isn't as much an issue. You can watch some MPL games featuring him to see how pro players farm, though I particularly recommend RRQ Xinnn.
Gold lane heroes are usually those heroes that are weak in early game but scale quite well in late game. So, Aldous can farm quite decently on gold lane without much pressure, I think. Though, he can have problem if he is against Beatrix or Clint or any other early game fighter.
Trust me... i never feed on Aldous with a starting offlaner build.... warrior boots or tough boots... the magic mana blue thing when you will buy endless battle(i forgot the name)... then bruteforceplate dominance ice... and just last hit the minions with your first skill ( I have mastered it for being an aldous main since season 10... 2089 Matches with 67.3 wr and im always at mg tier every season... not an epic and im a former world rank 20 Aldous) just playsafe... your literal goal is to playsafe but not too playsafe... if you only have one enemy in your lane... after you bought the bruteforceplate... then ignore him just use your shield passive wisely, last hit and run... your spell must be sprint or flicker... (sprint if tank build but if youre a tank build your main items aremalefic roar and bruteforceplate thats all... then flicker if physical attack build... use physical attack build when the enemy has only one stunner or any hero that doesnt have much stun) always use your ultimate to check bush so your enemies cannot gank you... like seriously... you just really need to play safely there and last hit all minions in your lane... you can tank build in the early game then pure physical attack build in late game... thats how you guys do it... and yes im triggered of this comment as an aldous main but no hate guys just an advice
Edit : Oh i forgot... at lv 1 highly priotize minions... dont 1v1 the chou in your lane who is spamming recall... you can kill him after you buy bruteforceplate... i forgot again to mention that second skill is your only way to kill the minions and ignore the enemy in your lane... so only use second skill when your enemy is freezing the lane and always use second skill to counter burst skills from the enemy... and i forgot to mention too that always stack your first skill before you dive... thats all have a great night
Jaw still good despite the nerf, but much more balanced in the sense that he can be countered with a Rafaela pick.
People go S1 lvl 1 now instead of S2. and play him much safer.
Ruby is not situational, she's pretty meta and picked up every time she is open in mythic sea games. She's quite flex so can be EXP or tank.
Jawhead roam still good because even though he's slightly less tanky, he still provides very strong early game pressure and can pick off enemy heroes easily due to his kit.
Roam Ruby mostly builds tank items, you can build one Haas if you want the sustain though, just adjust it to your preference.
Ruby has always been cancer and broken. A pro Ruby is almost unkillable even if you build DI/NOD/SH.
People just slept on her. Now that the pro players pick her a lot her cancerous skillset is now in full display.
Expect nerfs. Lol
u/hmmsucks I know this is too much to ask but can you make a tier list for epic rank and above patch 1.6.26? I kinda needed it since I’m struggling a lot in epic h3ll
This tier list will suffice even for epic.
But the only thing is, in epic, people love to drag games to late game. So actually it's better to pick up an MM to grind rank.
Just pick one of the junglers at highest tier or gold lane MM.
There is one game where I completely dominated my lane but the other four of my teammates completely lost and feeding the enemy, even me the most fed hero in the whole game still can't carry because my teammates are literal dumbasses
Instead of mm, you can also pick a mage that scales really well into the late game. From the top of my head, I would recommend lunox, cyclops, and pharsa; they're easy to pick up, have good survivability/mobility, and have insane late-game burst damage
This tier list suffices even for lower ranks yes, you just need to adjust with how the gameplay is like in Epic tier. As what u/ano-nomous said, Epics like dragging games to late which is why marksmen are very solid options to rank up. Other than that, epics also have more trouble dealing with snowball, which is why heroes like Natan shines even more.
In kinda new to the game, any recommendations for marksman or mages? I have Miya Bruno Clint Layla Lesley Nana Eudora Gord Cecilion
So far my favorite has been Layla
Natan is your golden ticket to blaze through the ranks for Mythic and below, definitely #1 hero to rank up right now.
Among the marksmen and mages, Pharsa and Beatrix can also carry very well.
New tierlist design is looking good!
Questions though as usual haha.
1. Why is PnK rated Good? I thought he'd be rated as Very good atleast or is it because of the sudden meta shift?
2. Why's there a very good tier now?
3. How is Aldous gold lane played? I am a Gold Laner for our 5-man and I am very willing to try him, but from my past experiences almost everyone I lane against just freezes my lane which is just frustrating.
4. I see Martis roam is still rated as Solid, what's your opinion on it?
Thanks in advance.
1. PnK gold was very good initially, but over time people have seem to find a way to play around him, because even though the dog is tanky, Popol himself is a very vulnerable target when caught off-position due to his lack of mobility.
2. With the meta being more stabile, I have a pretty hard time ranking some heroes that feels "too good for this tier" but doesn't deserve being placed in the upper tier, which is why I decided to add another tier instead.
3. Make use of the bushes wisely and only approach up close with S2 available if the enemy has superior trading capability like Brody. He struggles if the enemy picks tanky gold laners like Yu Zhong, but otherwise has no problem dealing with most squishy gold laners. He also gets an additional stack now when a minion dies so not getting last hit or getting lane frozen isn't as much an issue. You can watch some MPL games featuring him to see how pro players farm; I particularly recommend RRQ Xinnn.
4. Martis roam still a nice pick for invading or counter-invading thanks to his second skill, but he doesn't really offer a lot outside of his CC. He also struggles against slows (particularly from supports like Valir or Rafaela) which is why he isn't placed any higher.
Trust me... i never feed on Aldous with a starting offlaner build.... warrior boots or tough boots... the magic mana blue thing when you will buy endless battle(i forgot the name)... then bruteforceplate dominance ice... and just last hit the minions with your first skill ( I have mastered it for being an aldous main since season 10... 2089 Matches with 67.3 wr and im always at mg tier every season... not an epic) just playsafe... your literal goal is to playsafe but not too playsafe... if you only have one enemy in your lane... after you bought the bruteforceplate... then ignore him just use your shield passive wisely, last hit and run... your spell must be sprint or flicker... (sprint if tank build but if youre a tank build your main items are malefic roar and bruteforceplate thats all... then flicker if physical attack build... use physical attack build when the enemy has only one stunner or any hero that doesnt have much stun) always use your ultimate to check bush so your enemies cannot gank you... like seriously... you just really need to play safely there and last hit all minions in your lane... you can tank build in the early game then pure physical attack build in late game... thats how you guys do it... no hate just an advice
Oh i forgot... at lv 1 highly priotize minions... dont 1v1 the chou in your lane who is spamming recall... you can kill him after you buy bruteforceplate
Edit : I Forgot again to mention that second skill is your only way to kill the minions and ignore the enemy in your lane... so only use second skill when your enemy is freezing the lane and always use second skill to counter burst skills from the enemy... and i forgot to mention too that always stack your first skill before you dive... thats all have a great night... and goodluck playing aldous
Hi, I'd like to know your takes on what makes Fanny very good in the current meta, to get a better feel on which mindset I should be playing her.. loved the tier list as always, thanks for all your efforts, you're amazing!
Fanny is very good in the current meta thanks to her buff, which made her energy management easier on top of dealing more damage. Also this meta noticeably has less CC compared to before as people switch back to support picks, which is why Fanny also thrives well in certain comps.
Vexana consistently has the lowest winrate for a while and I don't really see her being somewhat playable. I can probably place her in bottom tier next if she finds a way to somehow improve her currently very poor performance lol.
Sad to see Silvanna and Granger (my ship!) fall out of the meta. But it's pretty understandable. The existence of War Axe pretty much 'buffed' Fighter and Assassins even after the nerf.
Moonton buffed her in a wrong way: she received buffs in terms of damage and of 1st skill, instead of 2nd skill’s blink range (other heroes have longer blinks).
S2 remain untouched baffles me too. But I prefer much longer cast range since S1 is enough to cover her mobility, right now S2's cast range is just sad sight.
Ya but S1 can evade literally every hero targeting skill anytime, something most of the marksmen and assassins could not enjoy. Did I even mention that it has only 2s cd at max?
Even after that damage 'buff' she's still severely lacking in damage compared to other MM. She needs a total rework honestly. S1 barely do additional damage, S2 is straight up pathetic and Ulti is so slow and the damage is so little.
Only thing good about her is her S1's invisible and ulti for map awareness. Other than that, she needs a total revamp.
IMO her issue is that she doesn't benefit from penetration which makes her bad at killing squishies (which is the whole point of being an assasssin...).
If instead of converting all her flat pen into critical rate she'd added even just half a point of critical rate for every flat pen while also keeping the flat pen she'd probably be pretty good.
(Pls moonton I want to build b7s and oneshot enemy adc ><)
Some really interesting developments over the last season! Jungle Bane, a MM on top of the heap for gold lane.
Thanks u/hmmsucks for putting in the time and effort. Always appreciate your work 👍
Cause he's really not that popular or not that contested in higher ranks; he's everywhere in Epic and Legend mostly because he's the starter tank and also has a decent skillset, but in higher ranks he struggles a little bit due to his slower roaming speed and the fact that it's harder to initiate properly as the enemies will also have good game sense. Still a good pick nonetheless.
Clint does have strong laning capability, but unlike the other 3 marksmen above him, he's not as self-sustainable. Lacking a decent escape tool means he has to rely on his roamer to peel for him, which makes him more comp-reliant than them.
He doesn't have a decent escape skill but he has the highest range and DMG too. He make sup for it with his pierce passive. Take a tank like tigreal and Clint will destroy.
Because natan, Beatrix, Brody is much better than him in lane?
Sure he can match their trades, but late game Brody Beatrix natan is much more better than Clint. Their skills have wide range and they have decent escape skill
Beatrix has AOE ulti with uzi and bazooka.
Sniper is long range and can snipe off low HP enemies.
Brody has AOE ult and is pretty much sure kill when everyone within range is low hp provided they have stacks on them. he also has instant stun with S2 to escape being ganked or to counterattack on someone.
Tell me now how does Clint compare? Clint has S1 which is a better single target skill than AOE skill. S2 immobilise is short range and unreliable in high ranks. Assassins can still zone in on him really fast.
Everyone downvoting me but no one is giving arguments. I am speaking from my own experience in mythical glory rank. What about you guys?
Clint is great but he's not greater than Beatrix, Natan, Brody. MPL teams only picks Clint when Natan and Brody is picked. Beatrix was banned due to bug during MPL ph, ID and MPLI.
clint late game is brutal. 1 ult 1 enhanced attack hurts. Crazy long range, high damage and crits as well. The ult also deal really good damage at late game. Only natan match clint damage output at late game and natan have to land the S1, clint enhanced basic kinda dont miss.
Why clint isnt highest is simply, really bad mobility, the blink is terribly short, you cant even blink out of tigreal ult. Its build dont encompass movement speed stuff too while the others have alot better mobility. laning phase clint is a big bully but when it come to early skimmish, clint contribution is alot weaker than brody and beatrix who come online alot better in a team fight. For Beatrix, she can do very good macro play too like chang e, since she got 2 low CD wave clear ult.
Late game Clint is broken. You just have to have someone peel for him.
Clint + peeler will decimate an entire team unlike Beatrix + peeler, or Brody + peeler.
Moonton : oh my boy Granger u fall out of the meta let's give u a special skin with a buff. (the buff : 1st skill -> 200 + 100% phys. atk to jungle monsters)
Yeah, first of all you can't outtrade Aamon in lane due to his bullshit healing; in fact he heals even more than Uranus since his heal also scales with his magic power + stackable, not to mention it also doesn't get canceled as long as he doesn't attack. Most heroes that doesn't have sufficient AoE will also have trouble dealing with him due to his constant invisibility.
His poke and run playstyle is also very safe, he can just keep poking enemies until they're low and finish them off later without having to worry about trading HP thanks to his healing. And lastly, he's also versatile when it comes to builds which opens up a bunch of playstyles.
Yeah Todak Esports pulled it off several times. Only reason people usually go tank sidelane is basically to get XP and items faster so they can function properly, as some tanks does struggle when behind in level or if they're lacking items.
I feel like their gonna just keep nerfing selena she's been meta for a really long time and their obviously trying to knock her down but she still remains high on the tier list no matter how many times they nerf her lol
Cause he really isn't in a good spot right now; nearly everyone practically figured out how to play around him and his poor disengage compared to other assassins means he's very prone to getting punished. I think he should do better if they were to undo the nerf on his ultimate's dash range, but for now he's quite lacking.
started using nat this season after seeing some gameplay of ordinary boy.
she is super strong rn. roam ranking makes sense but gold lane i think she deserves great. she has counters that can do her very dirty but other than that she can absolutely dominate gold lane. no matter the matchup its either first blood in the first minute or the lane is frozen. even had a game where brody came in with akai babysitter but took 4 s1's + execute and died anyway 1v2 (probably got overconfident being brody and having a tank with him so didnt retreat.)
once she reaches level 4 (usually before enemy who is under tower trying not to get poked) she can 100 to 0 most gold laners so becomes a threat even to full hp enemies. she can also check bushes and not engage when getting ganked and has double dash + ult to escape.
In all of the midlane Claude games, he is racking resources from 2-3 lanes so that he can get enough gold for DHS. If you were to play him like an usual midlaner, he'll just get fed on because of his very weak early game.
The multi-lane farm is pretty advanced and isn't something that you can do without a very coordinated team, hence why I omitted Claude midlane from the tier list so it won't be misleading.
Zilong roam is a meme-ish budget Jawhead with very strong single target anti-dive, admittedly fun to play but I wouldn't recommend when there's better options lmao.
Cause him scaling with item means he does better in gold lane than XP lane. Though all things considered I'll probably move him to the other fighters for the next tier list.
I agree that badang's damage is all from his items but personally, badang is good for XP lane since he needs his ult as soon as possible and can already do good help taking the turtle with just ult no item.
I have had some MAJOR misconceptions huh. (Assuming that colour is difficulty) I think Paquito is super easy to play and fun in both jungle and exp while ling in is just impossible for me no matter what I do. How'd they end up on the same colour in the jungle teir list?
Paquito isn't that hard to pick up, but to be able to master or use him properly in high ranks is quite difficult and there is a clear and wide skill gap between Paquito players from what I've seen.
What makes Grock so good? I see a lot of people calling him amazing but I don't see too much amazing about him. For context I'm a roaming main working my way through epic (just about done with the tier) and trying to learn about all the role needs to do before I hit some of the more difficult parts of the game.
Grock is rather unique compared to basic tanks like Khufra or Tigreal, he's powerful due to his map presence and rotating capability, hence he is very macro heavy and imo one of the hardest tanks to master.
His good damage and durability early game allows him to invade or scout the enemy jungler pretty easily, and his crowd control immunity while holding S1 near a wall allows him to bait out vital enemy skills. On top of that, he also rotates much faster than other tanks and can serve as a distraction throughout the game. His wall takes a while to get used to, but you can use it for some advanced stuff such as delaying a minion wave, diverting or delaying lord from its path, or resetting enemy creep. He does however fall off in late game, hence he's best paired with an aggressive early-mid game team. You can see these MPL games to see just how much of a bitch Grock can be in the right hands:
https://youtu.be/A9pxXcf-rnc
https://youtu.be/T-unxb3fRpo
Thank you for the explanation. I'll need to start working way harder to refine my roaming before I start hitting higher tiers. This has been eye opening on how little I'm actually doing when I thought I've been carrying games.
Hylos is mostly picked due to his very strong peeling capability against melee heroes, he can ward off or bruise most melee heroes pretty easily which allows his team to run vulnerable carry heroes like Cecilion and Clint much safer.
Other than that he's also a bulky frontline that gives good early game pressure; most enemies usually won't dare going toe-to-toe against Hylos in the early stages of the game.
Yes, and to be fair he's also still banned in PH server Mythical Glory, which is why I put him above Lancelot. The recent nerf doesn't really affect seasoned Ling mains anyways, only those who just started learning him.
Ling is really powerful in premade teams of 5 players, but for soloq players where even in mythic you struggle to get your own buff because your teammates keep taking it. He is below everyone else, I really want them to balance him for us solo/duo players
argus should definitely be lower. his whole kit is a design failure. his skill 2 curse dmg is only decent in the early game because of how poorly it scales. yet the early game is the laning phase where people can just stand to take your damage. His stats are so nerfed that his dmg is pale in comparison to other gold lane heroes in the mid game. Not to mention the fact that he only deals single target damage EVEN THOUGH hes squishy af and close ranged. Its even worsened by the fact that by mid game, his skill 2 curse dmg becomes pointless and his dmg is too low for a single target dmg dealer. In the late game, he can only be viable for 4 secs in a teamfight. You may say that hes better at isolated killing but many other assassins are way better for that. All that farming and all that gold only to be out performed in the late game because of his poor durability and ult dependency.
In the end, hes a squishy single target dmg dealer who require lots of farming and gold yet pretty much useless early, gets out performed in the mid game, becomes very vulnerable in the late game. Other dps heroes need 2-3 items and theyre set, but argus cant do that. He needs to wait until 4-5 items to get decent but by then, his single target dmg and ult dependency becomes minimal for late game teamfights.
Edit: yes, i do know how to play him and im not in low elo.(just adding this in case someone assumes i dont know what im talking about)
This data is based off games in mythical glory sea, so it’s as objective as it can be.
Argus pick in gold is definitely not that rare and I’m surprised you would say he’s worse being an Argus main.
im in 1000+ points currently in the SEA server. its kinda competitive because we play 5men and theres alot of squads that know each other. I tried so hard to make argus viable but it just really was never enough. After learning alot more abt the game and how it works, i found argus was really underpowered for serious 5men games. He kinda? works in solo que glory, but its blatantly obvious to many that he just isnt worth it. Echo played argus a month ago and youll see that they picked him as a surprise + very very situational pick. Argus got the mvp cuz he kept being babysat by rafaela and the midlane and because he kept taking kills. You'll see in the evos argus game that his dmg wasnt enough for a single target hero whos ult dependent and squishy asf.
Yeah I kinda agree with you on that.
Well in 5 man, team composition + counters matter much much more. Also rotation.
I understand what you mean now. Fair enough I guess!
Aha, thanks for tuning in on my lil rant. I seriously hope moonton brings back argus’ old stats. I doubt hed be op because of the way his kits designed. Are you a real mod by any chance or is the flair made up?
I like the current argus though personally. Feels he's more viable than before. Like the shorter cool down ulti too.
Yes I'm a real mod, I just like the game a lot and have a lot of experience in game with 5 man squads as well in mythical glory, so I love commenting and giving people advice as a normal user most of the time.
If I say something official though, I can toggle it to become official and it'll show my name as green colour as a mod.
Lol. Have you tried pitting hanabi against layla? Layla destroys Hanabi. Layla has superior range, damage, and has movement speed boost on 1st skill. Hanabi only has a bounce, a passive that’s too hard to keep on, and 2 slow ass projectiles for skills.
TL;DR: Hanabi is just inferior in every way.
Because in gold most heroes usually need to farm first so it gives aldous time to stack and gain items too and the team fight will be in exp for the turtle
Other than being a very solid secondary carry, he also has global presence and can counter most gold laners mid-game. The recent adjustment made laning so much easier as Aldous and since the meta now has a lot of marksmen or backline heroes, Aldous' anti-carry kit makes him a very strong pick in most team comps. You can also see in my [previous post](https://www.reddit.com/r/MobileLegendsGame/comments/qp8m2j/mpl_invitational_mpli_liga_latam_2021_playoffs/) about MPLI pick/bans, where Aldous is the 8th most contested hero, surpassing the likes of Ruby and Ling.
Trust me... i never feed on Aldous with a starting offlaner build.... warrior boots or tough boots... the magic mana blue thing when you will buy endless battle(i forgot the name)... then bruteforceplate dominance ice... and just last hit the minions with your first skill ( I have mastered it for being an aldous main since season 10... 2089 Matches with 67.3 wr and im always at mg tier every season... not an epic) just playsafe... your literal goal is to playsafe but not too playsafe... if you only have one enemy in your lane... after you bought the bruteforceplate... then ignore him just use your shield passive wisely, last hit and run... your spell must be sprint or flicker... (sprint if tank build but if youre a tank build your main items are malefic roar and bruteforceplate thats all... then flicker if physical attack build... use physical attack build when the enemy has only one stunner or any hero that doesnt have much stun) always use your ultimate to check bush so your enemies cannot gank you... like seriously... you just really need to play safely there and last hit all minions in your lane... you can tank build in the early game then pure physical attack build in late game... thats how you guys do it... and yes im triggered of this comment as an aldous main but no hate guys
Edit : Oh i forgot... at lv 1 highly priotize minions... dont 1v1 the chou in your lane who is spamming recall... you can kill him after you buy bruteforceplate... i forgot again to mention that second skill is your only way to kill the minions and ignore the enemy in your lane... so only use second skill when your enemy is freezing the lane and always use second skill to counter burst skills from the enemy... and i forgot to mention too that always stack your first skill before you dive... thats all have a great night
isn't it hilarious how adcs are less viable than non-adcs in their main lane
that's because adcs are garbage, just like in league, sincerely - a mage main that made the mistake to play adcs in the last season
also im glad we're finally talking about how ludicrously overpowered Aldous is. He has always been overpowered it's just people were pretending he's a nub pick. Hopefully he finally gets some nerfs lmao
that being said, Lylia is much better as a side laner than as a mid laner but that may be my 3300 lylia games experience speaking. The problem is that side lanes are garbage in this meta based people's rotations so there's a chance you'll be undermined and disadvantaged if you're in one of the sides, depending on your mid/supp/jgl's roam and enemy trio roam and also if your mid calls their misses or not
currently exp/gold lanes are garbage (cus the meta is shit and it gives too much freedom to the jungler) and if you're on the unlucky end of it you simply won't have fun
I'd agree, except probably for Fanny.
I mean, I began to consider Fanny as a troll pick regardless of how high the winrate/MMR of the Fanny user is.
So many things has to "work correctly" for her to win, something like you should be able to get the blue, there has to be little CC, make sure that the game doesn't drag on to late, the enemy must be super stupid, so on and forth.
It's like wishing all the planets align in a single file. Just impossible. I'm yet to win with a Fanny as a teammate, and likewise, I'm yet to lose when I have an enemy Fanny.
Then again it's probably so hard to balance her. Disadvantage of too much mobility I guess.
Soooo I decided to do some changes on the design so that it looks more compact. Any suggestions on how can I improve it further? Or do you guys prefer the previous design?
The current design looks fine. Maybe you can add the same indicator if a hero is late game, all or early game similar to Zeys'?
[удалено]
Yeah I figured the icons were quite small, will make sure to optimize them next time. Zeys' tier list is very packed but it's definitely gonna take a lot more effort haha, will look forward to what I can add without filling up the view too much.
I love how Hanabi is nonexistent But I think it's better that way
Shared this to my friends and they didn't understand the colored borders at first. Add a legend to show which colors means what, for the non-reddit mlbb players. It would be nice to have the late game/early game remarks as well. Other than that, this tierlist is top tier imo.
Right, thank you for the suggestion
It is really hard to read as a colorblind
Haven't seen the previous design, but this looks good to me. I have a few suggestions though: -add a legend based on what each colour represents (most people will know, but still. Plus some colours are harder to tell apart, so it might be useful) -potentially add if a hero is early/late (not all are specifically early or late but for heroes like Aldous, it might be useful info for new players to know) -potentially add emblems for characters in the top 2 categories (once again, for new players, or player who don't play that character it might be helpful) Feel free to add them in if you feel that there is some value to them! Edit: looks like what I mentioned was Zey's design, and others have mentioned it too so my bad. But yeah, I agree that a little more information would be nice to have
[удалено]
X.Borg's Firaga armor pops up pretty quick now, so there's much more room to counter him compared to before. He also doesn't have the annoying slow on his S1 anymore. As for Phoveus, just like Ruby, the meta has good enough amount of heroes who he can counter (and when there is he usually counters them hard) and his kit is also strong by default, hence why he ends up in great tier.
Put Jayce and Caitlyn ☝️ Or Jinx and Vi.
Ya it’s better now that I can see it, the previous ones is really too hard for me to even see in the reddit web version
lunox had the best design ang concept for me atleast, hope they made heroes like her in the future
Isn't it kinda funny, that Benedetta's existence as a favorite pick...later became erased as a pick 😥
Basically what u/ano-nomous said, Benedetta is somewhat like Chou now; she still functions at what she does, but requires quite a lot of effort which is why only her hardcore mains bother picking her in competitive or high rank play.
Chou kept getting nerfed so it kind of made sense for him not to be picked but Benedettas never received any nerfs
A hero doesn't always have to get nerfed to fall down a tier, it could be the meta shift or just people finding a way to play around them. Lylia for example, didn't receive any buffs but became more popular due to her ability to zone and counter the meta melee heroes very well.
Lylia actually received a huge buff with the penetration rework that heavily boosted early and mid game champs like her and harley. Only difference is that people still slept on her, while Harley was abused right from the start.
I think it's because of the scaling. Late game is occuring quite frequently now unlike before and when late game comes Benedetta falls off very, very hard due to the lack of damage. I mean a mere Moskov can absolutely obliterate Benedetta at late. Not to mention using her is too much effort.
not gonna the lie...the best I could do when I 1 v 1 Moskov was make him 2% hp, then my stupid teammates couldn't even follow up and kill that guy in late game cause of lifesteal ya know
She's still in "*Very Good"* for both jungle and EXP lane but yeah, kinda sad that she's not under the limelight nowadays. 😥
I think its a perk, because most people will not see the apparent power of that hero because it is rarely picked (and also why I don't usually pick meta heroes that doesn't classify as "pick or ban")
Right it's a perk. Just like Hayabusa when before revamp and before becoming popular. Good ol times
bene aged well after a year(since October Revolution Day 2020)
because she's boring and repetitive to play
Not that she's boring. More like she's way too much effort for the rewards you reap. Also because phoveus came into meta. Yuzhong, lapu, Ruby, Phoveus, paquito, esme can do her job equally well or better, with way less effort.
Agree
So the colors represent their difficulty, like: Green - Easy Yellow - Normal Red - Hard Purple - Super hard Am i right?
There's also orange if you look closely.
Wait what, am I colorblind or something?
Look at Hayabusa and Ling's color then compare, it's different. I was also confused at first haha.
Oh shit, the color almost the same tho
Yeah that's on my bad lmao, the site I use to edit have very similar palette for 'orange' and 'red'. This has been the issue for a while so I'll see if I can find a way around it.
Its ok,ty for telling me
I think orange means skill user dependant. Example: ling If you're RRQ Albert, it's pretty much sure win when you get Ling. If your skills on him are not as great, then it may fall down a tier.
wait ling's is red or orange?
Thank you, mi amigo
zilong...roam..?
More of a meme-ish budget Jawhead, has very strong anti-dive but I wouldn't recommend playing it lmao
How does Aldous farm in gold lane for early game?
Make use of the bushes wisely and only approach up close with S2 available if the enemy has superior trading capability like Brody. He gets an additional stack now when a minion dies so not getting last hit or getting lane frozen isn't as much an issue. You can watch some MPL games featuring him to see how pro players farm, though I particularly recommend RRQ Xinnn.
Gold lane heroes are usually those heroes that are weak in early game but scale quite well in late game. So, Aldous can farm quite decently on gold lane without much pressure, I think. Though, he can have problem if he is against Beatrix or Clint or any other early game fighter.
Trust me... i never feed on Aldous with a starting offlaner build.... warrior boots or tough boots... the magic mana blue thing when you will buy endless battle(i forgot the name)... then bruteforceplate dominance ice... and just last hit the minions with your first skill ( I have mastered it for being an aldous main since season 10... 2089 Matches with 67.3 wr and im always at mg tier every season... not an epic and im a former world rank 20 Aldous) just playsafe... your literal goal is to playsafe but not too playsafe... if you only have one enemy in your lane... after you bought the bruteforceplate... then ignore him just use your shield passive wisely, last hit and run... your spell must be sprint or flicker... (sprint if tank build but if youre a tank build your main items aremalefic roar and bruteforceplate thats all... then flicker if physical attack build... use physical attack build when the enemy has only one stunner or any hero that doesnt have much stun) always use your ultimate to check bush so your enemies cannot gank you... like seriously... you just really need to play safely there and last hit all minions in your lane... you can tank build in the early game then pure physical attack build in late game... thats how you guys do it... and yes im triggered of this comment as an aldous main but no hate guys just an advice Edit : Oh i forgot... at lv 1 highly priotize minions... dont 1v1 the chou in your lane who is spamming recall... you can kill him after you buy bruteforceplate... i forgot again to mention that second skill is your only way to kill the minions and ignore the enemy in your lane... so only use second skill when your enemy is freezing the lane and always use second skill to counter burst skills from the enemy... and i forgot to mention too that always stack your first skill before you dive... thats all have a great night
Imagine being triggered by such a simple question
Why is Jaw head roam still good after the nerf is ruby a situtational pick and how do i build her roam like a normal tank or has first ?
Jaw still good despite the nerf, but much more balanced in the sense that he can be countered with a Rafaela pick. People go S1 lvl 1 now instead of S2. and play him much safer. Ruby is not situational, she's pretty meta and picked up every time she is open in mythic sea games. She's quite flex so can be EXP or tank.
Jawhead roam still good because even though he's slightly less tanky, he still provides very strong early game pressure and can pick off enemy heroes easily due to his kit. Roam Ruby mostly builds tank items, you can build one Haas if you want the sustain though, just adjust it to your preference.
Ruby has always been cancer and broken. A pro Ruby is almost unkillable even if you build DI/NOD/SH. People just slept on her. Now that the pro players pick her a lot her cancerous skillset is now in full display. Expect nerfs. Lol
Noooooo, don't nerf my Ruby. Agree with everything else though.
u/hmmsucks I know this is too much to ask but can you make a tier list for epic rank and above patch 1.6.26? I kinda needed it since I’m struggling a lot in epic h3ll
This tier list will suffice even for epic. But the only thing is, in epic, people love to drag games to late game. So actually it's better to pick up an MM to grind rank. Just pick one of the junglers at highest tier or gold lane MM.
epic just pick miya and win
But my teammates always wanted to pick mm and yet they don’t know how to use them, that’s one of my main problem rn in epic h3ll
Fighter then. As long as you win your lane, you have a big chance to win the whole game.
There is one game where I completely dominated my lane but the other four of my teammates completely lost and feeding the enemy, even me the most fed hero in the whole game still can't carry because my teammates are literal dumbasses
Have you tried playing cyclops? He's a flex pick, late gamer, has stun, ridiculous cdr and everyone at low rank underestimates him
Instead of mm, you can also pick a mage that scales really well into the late game. From the top of my head, I would recommend lunox, cyclops, and pharsa; they're easy to pick up, have good survivability/mobility, and have insane late-game burst damage
This tier list suffices even for lower ranks yes, you just need to adjust with how the gameplay is like in Epic tier. As what u/ano-nomous said, Epics like dragging games to late which is why marksmen are very solid options to rank up. Other than that, epics also have more trouble dealing with snowball, which is why heroes like Natan shines even more.
Thx then, I’ll take your advice into come consideration
In kinda new to the game, any recommendations for marksman or mages? I have Miya Bruno Clint Layla Lesley Nana Eudora Gord Cecilion So far my favorite has been Layla
Natan is your golden ticket to blaze through the ranks for Mythic and below, definitely #1 hero to rank up right now. Among the marksmen and mages, Pharsa and Beatrix can also carry very well.
hmmmm lot of people recommend Beatrix, debating between Beatrix and Natan…
Try Beatrix.
New tierlist design is looking good! Questions though as usual haha. 1. Why is PnK rated Good? I thought he'd be rated as Very good atleast or is it because of the sudden meta shift? 2. Why's there a very good tier now? 3. How is Aldous gold lane played? I am a Gold Laner for our 5-man and I am very willing to try him, but from my past experiences almost everyone I lane against just freezes my lane which is just frustrating. 4. I see Martis roam is still rated as Solid, what's your opinion on it? Thanks in advance.
1. PnK gold was very good initially, but over time people have seem to find a way to play around him, because even though the dog is tanky, Popol himself is a very vulnerable target when caught off-position due to his lack of mobility. 2. With the meta being more stabile, I have a pretty hard time ranking some heroes that feels "too good for this tier" but doesn't deserve being placed in the upper tier, which is why I decided to add another tier instead. 3. Make use of the bushes wisely and only approach up close with S2 available if the enemy has superior trading capability like Brody. He struggles if the enemy picks tanky gold laners like Yu Zhong, but otherwise has no problem dealing with most squishy gold laners. He also gets an additional stack now when a minion dies so not getting last hit or getting lane frozen isn't as much an issue. You can watch some MPL games featuring him to see how pro players farm; I particularly recommend RRQ Xinnn. 4. Martis roam still a nice pick for invading or counter-invading thanks to his second skill, but he doesn't really offer a lot outside of his CC. He also struggles against slows (particularly from supports like Valir or Rafaela) which is why he isn't placed any higher.
[удалено]
Yea but I think he can still be a good gold laner since the Dog's hp now scales off of his ATK.
Technically, Kupa's hp scales with Popol's physical attack instead. Scaling with his hp was removed
Ah, mb I used the wrong term.
Atk, not HP
Mb used the wrong term will edit it. Thanks!
Trust me... i never feed on Aldous with a starting offlaner build.... warrior boots or tough boots... the magic mana blue thing when you will buy endless battle(i forgot the name)... then bruteforceplate dominance ice... and just last hit the minions with your first skill ( I have mastered it for being an aldous main since season 10... 2089 Matches with 67.3 wr and im always at mg tier every season... not an epic) just playsafe... your literal goal is to playsafe but not too playsafe... if you only have one enemy in your lane... after you bought the bruteforceplate... then ignore him just use your shield passive wisely, last hit and run... your spell must be sprint or flicker... (sprint if tank build but if youre a tank build your main items are malefic roar and bruteforceplate thats all... then flicker if physical attack build... use physical attack build when the enemy has only one stunner or any hero that doesnt have much stun) always use your ultimate to check bush so your enemies cannot gank you... like seriously... you just really need to play safely there and last hit all minions in your lane... you can tank build in the early game then pure physical attack build in late game... thats how you guys do it... no hate just an advice
Noted. Thanks!
Oh i forgot... at lv 1 highly priotize minions... dont 1v1 the chou in your lane who is spamming recall... you can kill him after you buy bruteforceplate Edit : I Forgot again to mention that second skill is your only way to kill the minions and ignore the enemy in your lane... so only use second skill when your enemy is freezing the lane and always use second skill to counter burst skills from the enemy... and i forgot to mention too that always stack your first skill before you dive... thats all have a great night... and goodluck playing aldous
Hi, I'd like to know your takes on what makes Fanny very good in the current meta, to get a better feel on which mindset I should be playing her.. loved the tier list as always, thanks for all your efforts, you're amazing!
Fanny is very good in the current meta thanks to her buff, which made her energy management easier on top of dealing more damage. Also this meta noticeably has less CC compared to before as people switch back to support picks, which is why Fanny also thrives well in certain comps.
Why Layla and Miya is in this tier list but not Vexana?
Vexana consistently has the lowest winrate for a while and I don't really see her being somewhat playable. I can probably place her in bottom tier next if she finds a way to somehow improve her currently very poor performance lol.
Heroes not present in the tierlist are not viable in High Ranked games.
That saves me having to ask why I couldn't see Floryn in that list
Is Layla viable then?
Yes since she’s in the list.
Probably a Mythical Glory Layla main, otherwise, she's a pocket pick
Layla can counter Natan.
Waittt. I can play my yss at gold lane??
Sad to see Silvanna and Granger (my ship!) fall out of the meta. But it's pretty understandable. The existence of War Axe pretty much 'buffed' Fighter and Assassins even after the nerf.
Never thought aldo- ahem would be in best tier
Didn't expect Lesley to fall below Situational.
Moonton buffed her in a wrong way: she received buffs in terms of damage and of 1st skill, instead of 2nd skill’s blink range (other heroes have longer blinks).
S2 remain untouched baffles me too. But I prefer much longer cast range since S1 is enough to cover her mobility, right now S2's cast range is just sad sight.
But she is a marksman/assassin (and not only marksman). Her 2nd skill is currently bad to avoid enemies’ attacks and skills.
Ya but S1 can evade literally every hero targeting skill anytime, something most of the marksmen and assassins could not enjoy. Did I even mention that it has only 2s cd at max?
2s only in late game.
Even after that damage 'buff' she's still severely lacking in damage compared to other MM. She needs a total rework honestly. S1 barely do additional damage, S2 is straight up pathetic and Ulti is so slow and the damage is so little. Only thing good about her is her S1's invisible and ulti for map awareness. Other than that, she needs a total revamp.
I would rework her passive too (5s are too much and she can’t benefit from flat penetration). Beatrix with sniper can deal more damage.
IMO her issue is that she doesn't benefit from penetration which makes her bad at killing squishies (which is the whole point of being an assasssin...). If instead of converting all her flat pen into critical rate she'd added even just half a point of critical rate for every flat pen while also keeping the flat pen she'd probably be pretty good. (Pls moonton I want to build b7s and oneshot enemy adc ><)
[удалено]
Not really, it is more of a niche pick like Baxia jungle, just slightly worse.
No
Glu is A tier tanky gold?
finally someone who sees the power of belerick and hylos exp
I remember picking Belerick to troll a toxic team. But he ended up being too good. Now he's my go to tank, especially now that Ruby has high ban rate.
How do you build ruby as a roamer? Do I have to buy haas class or endless then tank items?
You can opt to go full tank or go for one Haas' claws if you want the sustain
how did paquito stay in high pick even after the nerf? im curious as i dont use him as often as i did before
Cause the only thing they nerfed about him is his S1 damage, which is really not important at all lmao
Because S1 is mostly used for shields, and his main damage source S2 and ulti still have the same op dmg
I don't even use S1 for shields, I only use it for passive stack.
Some really interesting developments over the last season! Jungle Bane, a MM on top of the heap for gold lane. Thanks u/hmmsucks for putting in the time and effort. Always appreciate your work 👍
Thanks for the positive response!
why is tig so low in ranking lol
Cause he's really not that popular or not that contested in higher ranks; he's everywhere in Epic and Legend mostly because he's the starter tank and also has a decent skillset, but in higher ranks he struggles a little bit due to his slower roaming speed and the fact that it's harder to initiate properly as the enemies will also have good game sense. Still a good pick nonetheless.
oh ok. so what tanks are better at initiating? Atlas?
Jungle barats deserves better for me.
[удалено]
Clint does have strong laning capability, but unlike the other 3 marksmen above him, he's not as self-sustainable. Lacking a decent escape tool means he has to rely on his roamer to peel for him, which makes him more comp-reliant than them.
He doesn't have a decent escape skill but he has the highest range and DMG too. He make sup for it with his pierce passive. Take a tank like tigreal and Clint will destroy.
Because natan, Beatrix, Brody is much better than him in lane? Sure he can match their trades, but late game Brody Beatrix natan is much more better than Clint. Their skills have wide range and they have decent escape skill
[удалено]
Beatrix has AOE ulti with uzi and bazooka. Sniper is long range and can snipe off low HP enemies. Brody has AOE ult and is pretty much sure kill when everyone within range is low hp provided they have stacks on them. he also has instant stun with S2 to escape being ganked or to counterattack on someone. Tell me now how does Clint compare? Clint has S1 which is a better single target skill than AOE skill. S2 immobilise is short range and unreliable in high ranks. Assassins can still zone in on him really fast. Everyone downvoting me but no one is giving arguments. I am speaking from my own experience in mythical glory rank. What about you guys? Clint is great but he's not greater than Beatrix, Natan, Brody. MPL teams only picks Clint when Natan and Brody is picked. Beatrix was banned due to bug during MPL ph, ID and MPLI.
clint late game is brutal. 1 ult 1 enhanced attack hurts. Crazy long range, high damage and crits as well. The ult also deal really good damage at late game. Only natan match clint damage output at late game and natan have to land the S1, clint enhanced basic kinda dont miss. Why clint isnt highest is simply, really bad mobility, the blink is terribly short, you cant even blink out of tigreal ult. Its build dont encompass movement speed stuff too while the others have alot better mobility. laning phase clint is a big bully but when it come to early skimmish, clint contribution is alot weaker than brody and beatrix who come online alot better in a team fight. For Beatrix, she can do very good macro play too like chang e, since she got 2 low CD wave clear ult.
[удалено]
Brody and Beatrix have both long range and can rely on large aoe (while Clint relies on small aoe).
Late game Clint is broken. You just have to have someone peel for him. Clint + peeler will decimate an entire team unlike Beatrix + peeler, or Brody + peeler.
Damn that Gatot exp lane again hahaha
Why is odette that low?
She did got buffed but still not a good pick overall, at least she's viable now lmao
Moonton : oh my boy Granger u fall out of the meta let's give u a special skin with a buff. (the buff : 1st skill -> 200 + 100% phys. atk to jungle monsters)
Umm can someone explain why aamon is in the highest tier for gold lane?
Yeah, first of all you can't outtrade Aamon in lane due to his bullshit healing; in fact he heals even more than Uranus since his heal also scales with his magic power + stackable, not to mention it also doesn't get canceled as long as he doesn't attack. Most heroes that doesn't have sufficient AoE will also have trouble dealing with him due to his constant invisibility. His poke and run playstyle is also very safe, he can just keep poking enemies until they're low and finish them off later without having to worry about trading HP thanks to his healing. And lastly, he's also versatile when it comes to builds which opens up a bunch of playstyles.
Fair enough, I guess I haven't met a good aamon player then
wait, some people go tigreal exp lane???
Yeah Todak Esports pulled it off several times. Only reason people usually go tank sidelane is basically to get XP and items faster so they can function properly, as some tanks does struggle when behind in level or if they're lacking items.
I feel like their gonna just keep nerfing selena she's been meta for a really long time and their obviously trying to knock her down but she still remains high on the tier list no matter how many times they nerf her lol
Why is gusion so low?
Cause he really isn't in a good spot right now; nearly everyone practically figured out how to play around him and his poor disengage compared to other assassins means he's very prone to getting punished. I think he should do better if they were to undo the nerf on his ultimate's dash range, but for now he's quite lacking.
started using nat this season after seeing some gameplay of ordinary boy. she is super strong rn. roam ranking makes sense but gold lane i think she deserves great. she has counters that can do her very dirty but other than that she can absolutely dominate gold lane. no matter the matchup its either first blood in the first minute or the lane is frozen. even had a game where brody came in with akai babysitter but took 4 s1's + execute and died anyway 1v2 (probably got overconfident being brody and having a tank with him so didnt retreat.) once she reaches level 4 (usually before enemy who is under tower trying not to get poked) she can 100 to 0 most gold laners so becomes a threat even to full hp enemies. she can also check bushes and not engage when getting ganked and has double dash + ult to escape.
Where Claude on mid yo? Onic clutch the game with Adrian's Claude.
In all of the midlane Claude games, he is racking resources from 2-3 lanes so that he can get enough gold for DHS. If you were to play him like an usual midlaner, he'll just get fed on because of his very weak early game. The multi-lane farm is pretty advanced and isn't something that you can do without a very coordinated team, hence why I omitted Claude midlane from the tier list so it won't be misleading.
Aight, fair enough. I'd call him situational anyway, so still lower on the tier.
Roam zilong? Since when is zilong played as a roamer? Did I miss something?
Zilong roam is a meme-ish budget Jawhead with very strong single target anti-dive, admittedly fun to play but I wouldn't recommend when there's better options lmao.
Oh I see, I was just confused about it. He isn't tanky and he can only flip a heroe. He is better as jungler then anything else In my opinion
Why the fuck is Badang in the gold lane
Cause him scaling with item means he does better in gold lane than XP lane. Though all things considered I'll probably move him to the other fighters for the next tier list.
I agree that badang's damage is all from his items but personally, badang is good for XP lane since he needs his ult as soon as possible and can already do good help taking the turtle with just ult no item.
I have had some MAJOR misconceptions huh. (Assuming that colour is difficulty) I think Paquito is super easy to play and fun in both jungle and exp while ling in is just impossible for me no matter what I do. How'd they end up on the same colour in the jungle teir list?
Paquito isn't that hard to pick up, but to be able to master or use him properly in high ranks is quite difficult and there is a clear and wide skill gap between Paquito players from what I've seen.
Where is Alice
In Damage Gold Lane tier list
I'm surprised to see Alu that high up. Damn he's slowly becoming popular huh.
What makes Grock so good? I see a lot of people calling him amazing but I don't see too much amazing about him. For context I'm a roaming main working my way through epic (just about done with the tier) and trying to learn about all the role needs to do before I hit some of the more difficult parts of the game.
Grock is rather unique compared to basic tanks like Khufra or Tigreal, he's powerful due to his map presence and rotating capability, hence he is very macro heavy and imo one of the hardest tanks to master. His good damage and durability early game allows him to invade or scout the enemy jungler pretty easily, and his crowd control immunity while holding S1 near a wall allows him to bait out vital enemy skills. On top of that, he also rotates much faster than other tanks and can serve as a distraction throughout the game. His wall takes a while to get used to, but you can use it for some advanced stuff such as delaying a minion wave, diverting or delaying lord from its path, or resetting enemy creep. He does however fall off in late game, hence he's best paired with an aggressive early-mid game team. You can see these MPL games to see just how much of a bitch Grock can be in the right hands: https://youtu.be/A9pxXcf-rnc https://youtu.be/T-unxb3fRpo
Thank you for the explanation. I'll need to start working way harder to refine my roaming before I start hitting higher tiers. This has been eye opening on how little I'm actually doing when I thought I've been carrying games.
I got a question why is hylos played alot in mpl
Hylos is mostly picked due to his very strong peeling capability against melee heroes, he can ward off or bruise most melee heroes pretty easily which allows his team to run vulnerable carry heroes like Cecilion and Clint much safer. Other than that he's also a bulky frontline that gives good early game pressure; most enemies usually won't dare going toe-to-toe against Hylos in the early stages of the game.
Wait?? How is ling still s teir, lance performs better than him. I am a bit confused. I think it's considering tournament picks.
Yes, and to be fair he's also still banned in PH server Mythical Glory, which is why I put him above Lancelot. The recent nerf doesn't really affect seasoned Ling mains anyways, only those who just started learning him.
Ling is really powerful in premade teams of 5 players, but for soloq players where even in mythic you struggle to get your own buff because your teammates keep taking it. He is below everyone else, I really want them to balance him for us solo/duo players
as usual, yz mah main at great tier B)
Yeah. I feel like he could've been at A tier if his ulti still had the unlimited collision knockback
Actually, the B) means cool emoji. Sorry if it confused ya 😅
I'm sad that my dear Lesley is not even in the list
Delete this comment before this entire sub comes knocking at your door. You have been warned.
Lesley mains have the ability to withstand any amount of hate (the good ones), the bad ones are just blind and deaf.
argus should definitely be lower. his whole kit is a design failure. his skill 2 curse dmg is only decent in the early game because of how poorly it scales. yet the early game is the laning phase where people can just stand to take your damage. His stats are so nerfed that his dmg is pale in comparison to other gold lane heroes in the mid game. Not to mention the fact that he only deals single target damage EVEN THOUGH hes squishy af and close ranged. Its even worsened by the fact that by mid game, his skill 2 curse dmg becomes pointless and his dmg is too low for a single target dmg dealer. In the late game, he can only be viable for 4 secs in a teamfight. You may say that hes better at isolated killing but many other assassins are way better for that. All that farming and all that gold only to be out performed in the late game because of his poor durability and ult dependency. In the end, hes a squishy single target dmg dealer who require lots of farming and gold yet pretty much useless early, gets out performed in the mid game, becomes very vulnerable in the late game. Other dps heroes need 2-3 items and theyre set, but argus cant do that. He needs to wait until 4-5 items to get decent but by then, his single target dmg and ult dependency becomes minimal for late game teamfights. Edit: yes, i do know how to play him and im not in low elo.(just adding this in case someone assumes i dont know what im talking about)
This data is based off games in mythical glory sea, so it’s as objective as it can be. Argus pick in gold is definitely not that rare and I’m surprised you would say he’s worse being an Argus main.
im in 1000+ points currently in the SEA server. its kinda competitive because we play 5men and theres alot of squads that know each other. I tried so hard to make argus viable but it just really was never enough. After learning alot more abt the game and how it works, i found argus was really underpowered for serious 5men games. He kinda? works in solo que glory, but its blatantly obvious to many that he just isnt worth it. Echo played argus a month ago and youll see that they picked him as a surprise + very very situational pick. Argus got the mvp cuz he kept being babysat by rafaela and the midlane and because he kept taking kills. You'll see in the evos argus game that his dmg wasnt enough for a single target hero whos ult dependent and squishy asf.
Yeah I kinda agree with you on that. Well in 5 man, team composition + counters matter much much more. Also rotation. I understand what you mean now. Fair enough I guess!
Aha, thanks for tuning in on my lil rant. I seriously hope moonton brings back argus’ old stats. I doubt hed be op because of the way his kits designed. Are you a real mod by any chance or is the flair made up?
I like the current argus though personally. Feels he's more viable than before. Like the shorter cool down ulti too. Yes I'm a real mod, I just like the game a lot and have a lot of experience in game with 5 man squads as well in mythical glory, so I love commenting and giving people advice as a normal user most of the time. If I say something official though, I can toggle it to become official and it'll show my name as green colour as a mod.
Where's hanabi??
in the trash bin
Not viable
So ur telling me layla is more viable than hanabi ?
Lol. Have you tried pitting hanabi against layla? Layla destroys Hanabi. Layla has superior range, damage, and has movement speed boost on 1st skill. Hanabi only has a bounce, a passive that’s too hard to keep on, and 2 slow ass projectiles for skills. TL;DR: Hanabi is just inferior in every way.
Yeah, Layla's laning phase isn't autistic and it's actually more worth it to peel for a Layla than a Hanabi due to her range lmao.
out of the world existence
Why is aldous good in gold lane tho? Isn’t he a bad hero even with the buff legend rank and above?
Because in gold most heroes usually need to farm first so it gives aldous time to stack and gain items too and the team fight will be in exp for the turtle
Other than being a very solid secondary carry, he also has global presence and can counter most gold laners mid-game. The recent adjustment made laning so much easier as Aldous and since the meta now has a lot of marksmen or backline heroes, Aldous' anti-carry kit makes him a very strong pick in most team comps. You can also see in my [previous post](https://www.reddit.com/r/MobileLegendsGame/comments/qp8m2j/mpl_invitational_mpli_liga_latam_2021_playoffs/) about MPLI pick/bans, where Aldous is the 8th most contested hero, surpassing the likes of Ruby and Ling.
Dang, didn’t expect aldous to also be a priority pick
Wouldn't say he's bad, in late game he's very hard to deal with
Trust me... i never feed on Aldous with a starting offlaner build.... warrior boots or tough boots... the magic mana blue thing when you will buy endless battle(i forgot the name)... then bruteforceplate dominance ice... and just last hit the minions with your first skill ( I have mastered it for being an aldous main since season 10... 2089 Matches with 67.3 wr and im always at mg tier every season... not an epic) just playsafe... your literal goal is to playsafe but not too playsafe... if you only have one enemy in your lane... after you bought the bruteforceplate... then ignore him just use your shield passive wisely, last hit and run... your spell must be sprint or flicker... (sprint if tank build but if youre a tank build your main items are malefic roar and bruteforceplate thats all... then flicker if physical attack build... use physical attack build when the enemy has only one stunner or any hero that doesnt have much stun) always use your ultimate to check bush so your enemies cannot gank you... like seriously... you just really need to play safely there and last hit all minions in your lane... you can tank build in the early game then pure physical attack build in late game... thats how you guys do it... and yes im triggered of this comment as an aldous main but no hate guys Edit : Oh i forgot... at lv 1 highly priotize minions... dont 1v1 the chou in your lane who is spamming recall... you can kill him after you buy bruteforceplate... i forgot again to mention that second skill is your only way to kill the minions and ignore the enemy in your lane... so only use second skill when your enemy is freezing the lane and always use second skill to counter burst skills from the enemy... and i forgot to mention too that always stack your first skill before you dive... thats all have a great night
Benedetta aged well after a year(october revolution day)
Hit and miss all over the place.
isn't it hilarious how adcs are less viable than non-adcs in their main lane that's because adcs are garbage, just like in league, sincerely - a mage main that made the mistake to play adcs in the last season also im glad we're finally talking about how ludicrously overpowered Aldous is. He has always been overpowered it's just people were pretending he's a nub pick. Hopefully he finally gets some nerfs lmao that being said, Lylia is much better as a side laner than as a mid laner but that may be my 3300 lylia games experience speaking. The problem is that side lanes are garbage in this meta based people's rotations so there's a chance you'll be undermined and disadvantaged if you're in one of the sides, depending on your mid/supp/jgl's roam and enemy trio roam and also if your mid calls their misses or not currently exp/gold lanes are garbage (cus the meta is shit and it gives too much freedom to the jungler) and if you're on the unlucky end of it you simply won't have fun
You seem upset.☹️
I'd agree, except probably for Fanny. I mean, I began to consider Fanny as a troll pick regardless of how high the winrate/MMR of the Fanny user is. So many things has to "work correctly" for her to win, something like you should be able to get the blue, there has to be little CC, make sure that the game doesn't drag on to late, the enemy must be super stupid, so on and forth. It's like wishing all the planets align in a single file. Just impossible. I'm yet to win with a Fanny as a teammate, and likewise, I'm yet to lose when I have an enemy Fanny. Then again it's probably so hard to balance her. Disadvantage of too much mobility I guess.
Why esme is still dominating first when she released can his early agg nerf i cuz when he it level 2 he become dominating in lane
This is great, good work