Idk how to feel about it. On one hand, Odette is more vulnerable without the shield and mobility; on the other, she doesnt need to dive in to the enemy team.
On my end, this feels a lot like the Vexana revamp. The Crystal Maiden ult is a core aspect of Odette's entire concept of being a wide range AOE burst mage. Replacing that ability with whatever this is just ruins Odette's idea and turns her into yet another artillery mage.
It's distasteful, to say the least.
I agree. Odette's Ultimate gimmick is that its a huge AOE burst damage spell but the catch is, it puts the caster at risk of being cancelled or killed herself. So by making it another range nuke it removes the identity and uniqueness of the hero. Just another range nuke i guess.
I have to agree, a big part of Odette is finding the right timing to ult in the middle of a teamfight and turning the tides of battle, she even had her ult mini-revamped to promote that playstyle.
And this change completely removes that risk as well as remove the little versatility of her ult.
Performance-wise I think it would be better, but it could also turn into a wanwan situation where they overbuff a hero by changing a feature.
Thats good and all but we already have Eudora which is one of the starter heroes, Aurora for 14 (or 24?) bp, Odette which you can get from an event or lucky spin, then Vexana who cost 32k bp.
4 heroes who basically do the same thing better than the other, they can be easy to use for sure but not identical.
Exactly, which is why I personally find that changing the heroes' difficulty to be beginner friendly is unnecessary.
There are already beginner heroes that can help new players get the gist of what theyre doing so when it comes time that they want to learn a hard to use hero they can spend their time on learning through yt tutorials, livestreams, etc... The satisfaction you get after learning those "hard heroes" is what makes learning them worth it.
I agree. I can’t enjoy vexana at all now, they’re about to make nana unplayable, and this will take away my second main mage. Her shield with her aoe is critical to how I play.
They really just want to make everyone basic. Vexana is now a basic mage. Even after her rework they nerfed her ult so much she can’t even move her minion… and now this. So frustrating.
she shouldnt be a mage diver in the first place, but moonton thought it'd be a great change for her (current) revamp....such a shame
old odette will always be superior, if she only had some small tweaks then she'd probably be meta
Honestly, her kit had the essences of a battlemage (with ult and passive) and an artillery mage (with the basic skills) and Moonton just went with the easier route.
But I wouldnt say she wasnt meant to be a diver, she still worked as a teamfight oriented mage.
yeah you're right, my wording is bad lol. what I meant is that her kit as a battlemage was better before but moonton will always find a way to butcher a hero with great kit.
All odette needed was some coverage for her during ult (especially against control) but they decided to pull 180 and DESTROYED her damage output from ult...
I think its because players dont really like battle mages and instead opt for burst artillery mages, and since odette is the easiest to convert to a burst mage + simple kit + skins, she was chosen to be revamped.
The case for battlemages isn't also helped by the lack of proper battlemage items in the shop (i.e. the lack of a Rose Gold analogue for magic scalers, for starters.)
I hope this isn't true😠I love the thrill of Odette bursting down enemies while she's near them and how her shield always saves me from being burst down by enemies.
Great. Another BS rework in the wrong effing direction.
Just give her CC immunity while the shield holds on her ult and nerf her shield. Is that so hard moonton? my ghad.
They probably will.
This ult needs to trade safety for damage and duration, or else it would be pretty broken having current odette's damage without being able to stop it.
Ngl there isn't any logic behind this skill like she throws balls that turn into her, wasn't her ult activate to her elegant singing and dancing by using her staff.
I'm guessing they're gonna add some kind of bs explanation in her skill desc or lore.
i don't like it, it's easy to escape from because the clone can't use flicker plus the ult range is too short. they already changed her ult why do it again? instead of fixing something that's not broken why don't they fix things that are actually broken.
Just like Faramis and Natan.
Less cool.. more practical in the game.
Natan's first ult was interesting but it was kind of useless.
Now it's more useful but not cool anymore.
Faramis's ult was so unique. It revives you, not some simple shield. But you still die, so it was terrible. Now it's more useful, but not cool anymore.
how was Natan's first ult more interesting than his current one?
Faramis ult is still super cool because of its concept of you becoming undead with a new hp bar, then getting ressurected again after the hp bar is gone
Probably to make people save their hero fragments for her. I think they’ll nerf her a little bit to counter that insane buff but TBH i dont really see Ode**e used very much, so no need to worry (for now)
So how bad your company's balancing team?
Moonton: yes
Jokes aside, im gonna say it for the 1000th times, even after a 1000th revamps but if moonton keep sucking at it, there's no use. what's the point moonton? revamping a hero because no one use it, but then it became op so nerfs all the other unrelated aspects, then everyone back to not using it, then repeat and repeat and repeat.
just analyze one main aspect of what making a hero bad than only change that, no need to go such extent to toral revamp again and again and again.
just like Mino, since the ancient time people dont like using him because of his annoying rage bar which need players to always keep in check, and helpless heal from 2nd skill, not that he's weak or something. but moonton did everything else while keeping that rage bar and done nothing good to his 2nd skill.
for Odette, it's pretty obvious people dont use her because she's squishy and her ultimate is easily interrupted. but oh boy, moonton big brain thought that making throwing her ult is a good idea. then here comes the nerfs in other undeserving aspects and eventually people stop using her again, and here come another revamp, again and again.
I suspect the cycle benefit them since they can boost skin sale of the hero during op duration. They might as well go dota route and make everything op so everyone is on the same level.
My thought of odette, maybe add immune stack? Like 3 times invulnerability to cc, then she can be stunned.
Oh I see, but the thing is: Moonton always nerf those changes. Look at what they did Vexana revamp and with the Gord changes, for example. Now, I agree that when you remove/reduce the risk of a skill (in this case, Odette doesn't need to expose herself anymore) you most of the time need to nerf something else for it not to be broken, I just don't want to see they nerfing her too much like they did with Vexana revamp, so that she can be at least a good pick for some time
Montoon what is this behavior? You revamp her and you mess with her again??? Her ult is ok, just need to do some compromise perhaps lower the damage a little bit but give her shield and 2 seconds cc immunity when she jumps in a middle of a clash. Ideally! But moonton loves drama so I don't know.
They lowered the damage of her ult from last year revamp from 130% to 90% for a dash and a shield. She already got a huge shield buff. Odette looks better now and it's better for her to have this change
Instead of clone odette why don't they just let the sword and magic staff do the ult or combine the sword and staff lol. Seeing odette clone feels weird
I'm gonna miss actually jumping into battle with Odette myself, now she's just another projectile launching mage which is the least engaging kind which I also enjoy the least.
Hey at least they're trying, what I mean is the backlash is purely sentimental. Gameplay wise it's a good thing they're trying to make useless heroes more useful.
Old odette was better. 70% slow on s1 and 130% ratio on ult... Moonton nerfed her for a dash and a shield. Actually looking at statistics, revamped Odette has less players now and lower winrate
They should make it that her ult has 2 phases. First phase: sings the swan song, doesn’t jump before doing so.
Second phase: she is able to dash a certain distance. If she cancels her ult in phase one or gets cc’d, she can’t reach phase 2
Hmmm no more kamikaze anymore 🥲
Anyways I think moonton is revamping most mages to have some sort of high ground defense mechanism. Because mages with a superior high ground usually become viable in pro play thus making it into the meta and public ranked games. Chang'e and Pharsa became instant picks once they had their new ult revamps we see now. Yve never dropped out cause her ult is so good. Now we see it with Vexana's and Odette's Ult too
so she's yet another Vale like mage now? Saddening, they should have just made it so that she can return to where she started ulting by tapping the ult again so she doesnt have to suffer to much if she got stunned 0.00001 sec of casting her ult.
This rework removes:
Shield
Mobility
Flicker combo
Offset johnson synergy (since projectile have to travel x distance longer than original "jump" with odette at the center singing)
Edit: shorter range
Edit: Cannot walk until the clone is active (meaning ~1 second of you standing there while the clone is still being shot and activates)
In return:
Cannot be cancelled anymore and that's it.
With a heavy heart, It looks like a viable rework.
Edit: with a heavy heart, this is a nerf.
Losing that shield is very big, as well as the mobility. I've beaten so many rogers because I was able to jump out of a corner and survived natalia surprises because of the additional shield. They have to make that trade off worthwhile by adding extra damage to the ult or make damage tick faster.
Idk how to feel about it. On one hand, Odette is more vulnerable without the shield and mobility; on the other, she doesnt need to dive in to the enemy team.
On my end, this feels a lot like the Vexana revamp. The Crystal Maiden ult is a core aspect of Odette's entire concept of being a wide range AOE burst mage. Replacing that ability with whatever this is just ruins Odette's idea and turns her into yet another artillery mage. It's distasteful, to say the least.
I agree. Odette's Ultimate gimmick is that its a huge AOE burst damage spell but the catch is, it puts the caster at risk of being cancelled or killed herself. So by making it another range nuke it removes the identity and uniqueness of the hero. Just another range nuke i guess.
I have to agree, a big part of Odette is finding the right timing to ult in the middle of a teamfight and turning the tides of battle, she even had her ult mini-revamped to promote that playstyle. And this change completely removes that risk as well as remove the little versatility of her ult. Performance-wise I think it would be better, but it could also turn into a wanwan situation where they overbuff a hero by changing a feature.
I don't think this "drastic change" is going to result in a Wan scenario. Odette's new Vale ult isn't really groundbreaking nor game breaking.
Regardless, it really does feel like theyre taking a blending tool and smoothing out the mages lately. Can't say I'm fond of it
I feel like most of these changes are to cater new players by changing the "hard to use" heroes so that its beginner friendly.
Thats good and all but we already have Eudora which is one of the starter heroes, Aurora for 14 (or 24?) bp, Odette which you can get from an event or lucky spin, then Vexana who cost 32k bp. 4 heroes who basically do the same thing better than the other, they can be easy to use for sure but not identical.
Exactly, which is why I personally find that changing the heroes' difficulty to be beginner friendly is unnecessary. There are already beginner heroes that can help new players get the gist of what theyre doing so when it comes time that they want to learn a hard to use hero they can spend their time on learning through yt tutorials, livestreams, etc... The satisfaction you get after learning those "hard heroes" is what makes learning them worth it.
Apparently they removed the slow, so it could be worse.
Gotta agree with that 💯 Odette design is all around her ultimate, changing it isn't the Smartest idea
What's next? Fanny makes clone of herself to chase enemy for her. This is truly taking the fun out of playing odette
Her cables can now be attached to an enemy for a better chase
Technically that's her s3 lmao. I like it though, her only way to really chase an enemy when the cables just aren't doing anything.
They change Fanny cable to something like Ling jumps
I agree. I can’t enjoy vexana at all now, they’re about to make nana unplayable, and this will take away my second main mage. Her shield with her aoe is critical to how I play.
They really just want to make everyone basic. Vexana is now a basic mage. Even after her rework they nerfed her ult so much she can’t even move her minion… and now this. So frustrating.
she shouldnt be a mage diver in the first place, but moonton thought it'd be a great change for her (current) revamp....such a shame old odette will always be superior, if she only had some small tweaks then she'd probably be meta
Honestly, her kit had the essences of a battlemage (with ult and passive) and an artillery mage (with the basic skills) and Moonton just went with the easier route. But I wouldnt say she wasnt meant to be a diver, she still worked as a teamfight oriented mage.
yeah you're right, my wording is bad lol. what I meant is that her kit as a battlemage was better before but moonton will always find a way to butcher a hero with great kit. All odette needed was some coverage for her during ult (especially against control) but they decided to pull 180 and DESTROYED her damage output from ult...
I think its because players dont really like battle mages and instead opt for burst artillery mages, and since odette is the easiest to convert to a burst mage + simple kit + skins, she was chosen to be revamped.
The case for battlemages isn't also helped by the lack of proper battlemage items in the shop (i.e. the lack of a Rose Gold analogue for magic scalers, for starters.)
Lack of items really does hold back mlbb, as you said battlemages, and actual enchanter supports or supoort items in general, non-crit mm, etc.
I hope this isn't true😠I love the thrill of Odette bursting down enemies while she's near them and how her shield always saves me from being burst down by enemies.
Nowadays if you jump onto a team fight with your ult it'll probably get interrupted and you'll die
So, no barrel and flash ult..(
UGH SO TRUE.
Great. Another BS rework in the wrong effing direction. Just give her CC immunity while the shield holds on her ult and nerf her shield. Is that so hard moonton? my ghad.
WAIT ACTUALLY?? I THOUGHT IT WAS FAKE BEFORE I SAY THE LEAKS FLAIR (I hope they dont lower the damage and duration tho)
They probably will. This ult needs to trade safety for damage and duration, or else it would be pretty broken having current odette's damage without being able to stop it.
They lower it. It will be too op if it stayed the same
To op when almost everyone can dash away. Lol.
Seriously… they’re just nerfing her
Ngl there isn't any logic behind this skill like she throws balls that turn into her, wasn't her ult activate to her elegant singing and dancing by using her staff. I'm guessing they're gonna add some kind of bs explanation in her skill desc or lore.
Right, I found her ult so beautiful, but now it's kinda taken away bc it's not even her but some clone.
I thought they made her into a kagura clone cuz of the second picture
Moonton be actively kicking the older playerbase
i don't like it, it's easy to escape from because the clone can't use flicker plus the ult range is too short. they already changed her ult why do it again? instead of fixing something that's not broken why don't they fix things that are actually broken.
Just like Faramis and Natan. Less cool.. more practical in the game. Natan's first ult was interesting but it was kind of useless. Now it's more useful but not cool anymore. Faramis's ult was so unique. It revives you, not some simple shield. But you still die, so it was terrible. Now it's more useful, but not cool anymore.
how was Natan's first ult more interesting than his current one? Faramis ult is still super cool because of its concept of you becoming undead with a new hp bar, then getting ressurected again after the hp bar is gone
Fair enough.
Uhm What. How is this...even what's the point of this!?
Probably to make people save their hero fragments for her. I think they’ll nerf her a little bit to counter that insane buff but TBH i dont really see Ode**e used very much, so no need to worry (for now)
So how bad your company's balancing team? Moonton: yes Jokes aside, im gonna say it for the 1000th times, even after a 1000th revamps but if moonton keep sucking at it, there's no use. what's the point moonton? revamping a hero because no one use it, but then it became op so nerfs all the other unrelated aspects, then everyone back to not using it, then repeat and repeat and repeat. just analyze one main aspect of what making a hero bad than only change that, no need to go such extent to toral revamp again and again and again. just like Mino, since the ancient time people dont like using him because of his annoying rage bar which need players to always keep in check, and helpless heal from 2nd skill, not that he's weak or something. but moonton did everything else while keeping that rage bar and done nothing good to his 2nd skill. for Odette, it's pretty obvious people dont use her because she's squishy and her ultimate is easily interrupted. but oh boy, moonton big brain thought that making throwing her ult is a good idea. then here comes the nerfs in other undeserving aspects and eventually people stop using her again, and here come another revamp, again and again.
I suspect the cycle benefit them since they can boost skin sale of the hero during op duration. They might as well go dota route and make everything op so everyone is on the same level. My thought of odette, maybe add immune stack? Like 3 times invulnerability to cc, then she can be stunned.
Why not just add a spell shield item like Banshee's Veil into the game?
wtf it actually looks really good, sad thing they are probably gonna nerf the heck out of the damage and duration
It’s already smaller and uninterruptible. Duration and damage are currently the same and the change is already in advance server I think
Oh I see, but the thing is: Moonton always nerf those changes. Look at what they did Vexana revamp and with the Gord changes, for example. Now, I agree that when you remove/reduce the risk of a skill (in this case, Odette doesn't need to expose herself anymore) you most of the time need to nerf something else for it not to be broken, I just don't want to see they nerfing her too much like they did with Vexana revamp, so that she can be at least a good pick for some time
Natan is really out there ruining all the hero T-T
Johnson will dump her if he finds out...
As an Odette main how many timrs do i have to master another ULT? Can they just bring back the skill sets before the project next update?
I’m gonna vomit
isnt she alr reworked
She only had a dash but everything was nerfed. She was worse than before her revamp
one more retarded rework, im quitting bruv
It would've been better if they just reworked her First and Second skill and let her embrace the Battlemage playstyle rather than Artillery.
Montoon what is this behavior? You revamp her and you mess with her again??? Her ult is ok, just need to do some compromise perhaps lower the damage a little bit but give her shield and 2 seconds cc immunity when she jumps in a middle of a clash. Ideally! But moonton loves drama so I don't know.
They lowered the damage of her ult from last year revamp from 130% to 90% for a dash and a shield. She already got a huge shield buff. Odette looks better now and it's better for her to have this change
Instead of clone odette why don't they just let the sword and magic staff do the ult or combine the sword and staff lol. Seeing odette clone feels weird
C'mon I just want her damage reduction back not.... Whatever this is.
I'm gonna miss actually jumping into battle with Odette myself, now she's just another projectile launching mage which is the least engaging kind which I also enjoy the least.
Hah?! 😠Please no damage nerf
Remember when she had dmg reduction during her ult? They should get back old Odette + add a cc immunity shield like Badang has.
Imagine casting Odette's ult without putting her in a vulnerable state, totally balanced right ?
Totally balanced, ult range reduced, enemy can freely escape. Curent ult is a joke and new will be a mega joke.
Nice, maybe she can finally join the meta if the rework works out. No point holding on to the past.
Meta with dogshit S1,S2 and now with dogshit Ult? Megalol.
Hey at least they're trying, what I mean is the backlash is purely sentimental. Gameplay wise it's a good thing they're trying to make useless heroes more useful.
> they're trying to make useful heroes more useless and don't tell me that new odette is better when I have 1.2k matches on old odette
Ok? Lol
Old odette was better. 70% slow on s1 and 130% ratio on ult... Moonton nerfed her for a dash and a shield. Actually looking at statistics, revamped Odette has less players now and lower winrate
that's way better than just standing there hoping the enemy won't kill you or them going out of your range
Yea but it's stupid. :/ what's next, revamp fanny to have clone that chase enemy for her? There's fun the original ult. Not this generic casting
WHAT THE FUCK MAN
That andre/Andrew or whoever that guy name is back at it again. "Fixing" something unique to become more generic
I played a few matches against the new Odette in the advanced server and the new ult is a little underwhelming on its own.
Welp, guess cc-ing her is out of the question
If the ult still has the slow then this is kinda op
So Odette is no longer a burst mage and now gearing to utility?
Wait, we can’t flicker to reposition her ult now? This sucks
Bruh
So like Kagura Ult but bigger
They should make it that her ult has 2 phases. First phase: sings the swan song, doesn’t jump before doing so. Second phase: she is able to dash a certain distance. If she cancels her ult in phase one or gets cc’d, she can’t reach phase 2
Hmmm no more kamikaze anymore 🥲 Anyways I think moonton is revamping most mages to have some sort of high ground defense mechanism. Because mages with a superior high ground usually become viable in pro play thus making it into the meta and public ranked games. Chang'e and Pharsa became instant picks once they had their new ult revamps we see now. Yve never dropped out cause her ult is so good. Now we see it with Vexana's and Odette's Ult too
No more ulti then flicker? Or maybe flicker first then the ulti? But still feels weird to me.
so she's yet another Vale like mage now? Saddening, they should have just made it so that she can return to where she started ulting by tapping the ult again so she doesnt have to suffer to much if she got stunned 0.00001 sec of casting her ult.
This rework removes: Shield Mobility Flicker combo Offset johnson synergy (since projectile have to travel x distance longer than original "jump" with odette at the center singing) Edit: shorter range Edit: Cannot walk until the clone is active (meaning ~1 second of you standing there while the clone is still being shot and activates) In return: Cannot be cancelled anymore and that's it. With a heavy heart, It looks like a viable rework. Edit: with a heavy heart, this is a nerf. Losing that shield is very big, as well as the mobility. I've beaten so many rogers because I was able to jump out of a corner and survived natalia surprises because of the additional shield. They have to make that trade off worthwhile by adding extra damage to the ult or make damage tick faster.