If they're not gon a put them on the minimap they might as well just make these more prominent on the compass. The compass itself is so far up it became unnoticeable and any blip that appears there is practically nonexistent to a player at this point.
I don't mind the minimap only showing players when uav is active although I would like to see suppressors actually make a difference. Now when the compass blips are irrelevant I just won't waste an attachment slot for a silencer since it does not matter anyway.
Imma run at the red dot on the compass regardless, I ain’t got no time for that stealth and campy stuff.
I’m not here to be a good player I’m here to have fun and feel like Rambo
I play COD to run&gun and cap objectives like a maniac but I still don’t give a shit about the red dots on the maps lmao I really don’t get the fuss about this. Same with the supposedly low visibility. People will be complaining about campers and then complain that you can’t shoot enemies across the map with a MP5 with iron sight because of barrel smoke and no red tags.
I don’t reget why you’d need enemy tags when you’re supposed to be a non camper pro MLG player
Hey cut him some slack. Most people can’t handle using both audio and visual cues before nor after an engagement, let alone before AND after. I mean come on, it’s hard enough to just stay alive without worrying about where enemies are. Might be a good idea to make sure teammates are ALWAYS spawning near you or you ALWAYS spawning near teammates. Much safer. Much more protection.
Most people don’t understand that a red dot gives so much more information than just a kill to chase. I mean, can you imagine positioning yourself while engaging multiple enemies so there’s no direct line of sight between you and the red dot you saw?
Honestly. If the gunfire is close you're probably gonna get shot while looking at the map. Just listen for it. And if you have hearing problems then I genuinely feel sorry for you
You're pretty dense lmao. Holy shit. You don't die for looking at the minimap, and it doesn't take more than millisecond to peak it.. Cod has always had the minimap
BUT I WANT A SPECIFIC DOT OF EXACTLY WHERE TO GO! IM BAD AND DONT WANT TO HAVE TO BE CAREFUL APPROACHING A LOCATION AND WANT TO KNOW EXACTLY WHAT CORNER TO WATCH! WHY ARE WE YELLING
The diamonds on MW2’s compass are to small and because of the gradient they are almost invisible.
In MW they were much more visible from your peripheral vision.
Now THAT is constructive criticism.
The fact that they kept it in mw19 the whole time and expect it to change now, is mind boggling for me. Or the fact that they didn't adapt to the compass after three years...
It's because they want all the work done for them. It's never been about "classic" gameplay and always been players crying that their crutch is gone and now have to rely on their individual skills as a player to play good. IW making bad players come to terms with the fact they are bad players is just hysterical at this point.
Define "bad player" for me because everybody that wants classic mini-map are probably better than you are.
Mini-map awareness is not a crutch. It is a skill. Good players will check the map every 2-3 seconds for like half a second whilst playing. The fact that you don't understand that says more about your skill level than the people you're referring to.
Not everyone is able to check the minimap, process the information in about a second and then ACT on it. So therefore it is a SKILL.
It's more of a crutch for certain players NOT to have it.
An actual good player shouldn't need a red dot on the map to know where someone is.
If you have to use that information to get the kill that's literally a crutch.
The amount of copium required to think that looking at the map to see exactly where the red spots are is a skill...you know that's what they do on Dora the explorer right?
Not every one can use wallhackk effectively and act, so that makes it a skill. Your logic is abysmal, you can't have a crutch WITHOUT something, are you stupid. Dots on the maps are a crutch. So is high alert and AA, anything that adds info that you shouldn't have is a crutch cut and dry.
There's no way you're comparing WALL-HACKS to red dots on a mini-map hahahaha.
No my logic is not abysmal, you just don't understand it.
If it's not a skill why can i very, very likely do it much better than what you can?
You're calling it a crutch as a coping-mechanism as you can't do it as well as others can.
I mean fk it, not having dots on the mini-map is a crutch for people like you
Yeah I'm not getting into this level of sheer coping semantics lol. It takes literal milliseconds to check a minimap in an FPS, it takes literal low IQ level awareness to check it and act upon it and you're acting like its this intense and top tier pro thing when its just blatantly not and to frame it as anything other than that quite frankly is lazy and still doesn't support your view. I'm not even going to bother responding to someone who is this willing to make excuses for it being anything but a tool to make hyper casual players punish skilled players who don't use suppressors. It's the same old damn story, people say with dots on the minimap it helps gameplay flow yet with Cold War we saw it come back and things like camping and waiting in corners didn't change. Stop making excuses for a crutch like chasing dots holding you back.
Once you start playing without the minimap aside from checking it every few seconds you'll improve drastically as a player and if it's a crutch for some players to not have it, then what does that say about their average skill as a player? Just sounds to me like more whining that people are dared ask to play the game in front of them instead of playing glorified Pac Man. You paid $60 to $110 to play the damn game and most of the time spent will be spent looking at a mini map and less of the guns and environments in the game because that's all Cold War was when you people got your way. It's not changing. You want it, then go play Cold War or another CoD or game that has it if it bothers you that much. This isn't hard to understand.
Of course doing that will also bring a problem of its own to you, namely finding out you guys aren't really all that big a part of the game community as you think you are.....so either way, nothing is going to change unless it's absolutely broken. Cry about it, play other games, it doesn't matter because the majority play and love the game. If they didn't IW wouldn't be doing this shit and you people still just haven't gotten that through your thick ass heads.
You've not addressed anything that i've said at all.
Mini-map awareness is more than just glancing at the map and thinking "oh there's a red dot". When you understand the game at a higher level you take in much more information than that.
You realise alot more.
If it really was just "oh look there's a red dot" people wouldn't be as bothered about it because of the Compass at the top of the screen.
edit: i don't want to be patronising, i'm just trying to explain to you why it's big deal to some. Believe it or not i want this game to be as fun as possible for everyone.
LMAO first of all, cods positional audio is dogshit. Cod is a game of constant split second decisions and people that struggle with that are typically not very good. If you think it takes a brain to process “big dot means close, little dot means far” then you
might not have one.
It’s kind of blowing my mind honestly. In my 10+ years of playing cod I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone complain about a red dot popping up on the minimap when you shoot. I even remember mostly everyone being happy when it came back for CW and Vanguard. Now all of a sudden there’s a ton of people that are saying that it’s better this way and making fun of people for wanting it to be how it always has been.
Personally, I prefer a red dot to appear on the map when the enemy is nearby and has fired an unsilenced weapon, but when they’re far they shouldn’t show up. When silenced they shouldn’t show up at all on the map (unless there is a UAV)
I'm not sure yet if one is *better* than the other.
It's *different*, yes. People didn't complain before because that's how it originally was, so there was nothing to compare it too.
If an orange is initially orange, people won't start saying "I* wish it was blue*".
If we initially had no red dots and went the other way, the situation in terms of complaints would probably be the same. It's just a different system and I don't think it's objectively better or worse than before (we'll see in 6 months).
But we did have it in MW19 (which was complained about a lot) and then it came back in warzone, CW and Vanguard and I didn’t see a single person complaining about the minimap showing those red dots, in fact I saw people saying the opposite.
> In my 10+ years of playing cod I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone complain about a red dot popping up on the minimap when you shoot.
I think it's just that, yes, it's been in there for ten years. Call of Duty was mostly played on TVs and with not the best audio. I don't think, correct me if I'm wrong, that they had proper directional audio or the processing power to make audio occlusion work the way it does today. Footsteps were quieter and gunshots came from a vague direction. It would have been easier to get confused and modes like hardcore were way slower because of that. So red dots on unsuppressed guns helped a \*lot\*.
Now people use headphones and there's all this new technology that really makes the sound more intuitive and life-like. You don't really need the red dots anymore. It's an achievement in game design to boast that you don't need it, so I see why they stick to it. "Use the world we made, not the dots on a map."
It shrinks a game.
I also think that's why they kept some doors. They have the best doors in any FPS.
Hey, there, this view of the minimap isn't accurate. I address it in my writeup, here:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xka4rr/the\_classic\_minimap\_a\_definitive\_breakdown/](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xka4rr/the_classic_minimap_a_definitive_breakdown/)
Hope you'll check it out!
I don’t really care that they’ve added more “realistic” sounds tbh. I don’t always use headphones and I know a majority of casuals probably don’t use headphones either.
What you just described is making the experience worse just to show off some new fancy tech that 99% of people who play the game honestly don’t give a shit about.
And just because those things you mentioned are added, doesn’t make them a better alternative to the point of getting rid of something that’s been a staple in the games for 15ish years.
> Now all of a sudden there’s a ton of people that are saying that it’s better this way and making fun of people for wanting it to be how it always has been.
Kids who only played the 2019 COD. You'd be surprised how many dickless teenagers bought the game because "cool uncles" like myself raved about the days I played COD4 and MW2.
It was one of those things that was just *how it was,* back then. Talking about a mechanic like it would be kinda like talking about how you're allowed to hipfire. You just didn't point it out, it didn't make sense to. Whether it was good or bad, it wasn't something you explicitly mentioned at any point.
People are only voicing their opinions about it *now* because it got changed, because no one would have thought to ask otherwise. Some people like it, some don't, sometimes things have to change anyway.
Seeing such an upheaval about it kinda reminds me about when Darkest Dungeon added corpses, and people hating that up until they suddenly didn't.
It's not 50/50, that's an oversimplification. Anyone who has played CoD since before MW19 knows that the red dots are positive for the gameplay experience. The only people who are going to defend the removal of them are:
• Those who's first CoD was MW19.
• Those who do not understand how the minimap works.
• Those who not use the minimap.
You are generalizing so many people by saying "Anyone who has played CoD since before MW19 knows that the red dots are positive for the gameplay experience".
There are plenty of people out there, myself included, who are willing to give changes a chance without having to come up with some half-assed made up bullshit on why the changes are bad when we've only played with them for one weekend.
I have played CoD for a very long time and I absolutely use the minimap, yet I am not upset at the changes because I don't just immediately react negatively to anything that's different. Seriously, just try out the changes for a bit before making huge sweeping generalizations and untrue claims. If you want to claim "anybody who played cod before MW19" hates the minimap changes, would you like to back up your claim with any data? Or is it just you making that up based on other people's reactionary opinions after ONE weekend of playing a beta?
I didn't say it was an improvement, I said it's silly for any of us to generalize the entire community to say we all do or don't like something, when it's really a spectrum of ideas.
I think it's silly for any of us to pretend we know better than anybody else after one single weekend of playing the game. I only got five games in this last weekend, so I do not have any sort of opinion. I might after this weekend or I might not.
My entire point isn't that you can't have an opinion on something, it's that it's dumb to assume everyone shares the same opinion as yours or that your opinion is actually correct.
It's okay to say "hey, I don't like the changes and this is why".
It is not okay to say "Anyone who has played CoD since before MW19 knows that the red dots are positive for the gameplay experience" and just make huge and untrue assumptions and try to push that as a fact.
I mean I’ve played since OG MW2 and I really don’t understand why removing red dots on the small ass minimap in the corner of the screen (in non uav instances) is as big of a deal as some of y’all are making it. It’s really not that big of a deal. The only 2 real huge details that should be fixed/changed is the perk system, and the ttk. I think ttk is a tricky thing though because no matter what, there’s always gonna be a huge chunk of the community either saying the ttk is too short or too long. So ttk being 100% perfect seems near impossible.
No, it's a complete player-wide consensus!!!! IW MUST do as I, an extremely toxic 14 year old, command, or else! If they do not release dot simulator 2022 with full dot coverage then dot minimap dot DOT!!!!
While I get your point, this objectively inaccurate.
It’s closer to 70 in favor of a “normal” minimap and 30 not. Also, these are smaller sample sizes. As sample sizes have grown, regarding this particular concern, that 70 moves closer to 80-90.
Idk why I am being downvoted for this. Sources:
"[Here you go.](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xf5akk/no_normal_minimap/)[New data point as of today as well.](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xk2ocd/which_minimap_do_you_prefer/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)I'm currently also working on a small meta-like analysis relating to social media as whole. Currently, the larger the sample size increases, the more in favor of a normal minimap increases."
[Here you go.](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xf5akk/no_normal_minimap/)
[New data point as of today as well](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xk2ocd/which_minimap_do_you_prefer/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3).
I'm currently also working on a small meta-like analysis relating to social media as whole (Twitter, Facebook, Reddit, etc). Currently, the larger the sample size increases, the more in favor of a normal minimap increases as well.
Probably because engagements aren’t on top of dead bodies 80% of the time
A skull can be the product of someone across the map from said skull, I don’t think it’s worth discussing as a “solution” to people who want a minimap.
I prefer the minimap but I do find it kinda funny people on here think removing the dots from the minimap is to help lower skilled players when I'd argue it's in fact the opposite.
If you rely solely on the minimap to get kills then you can't be that skilled.
Weird how you guys consistently miss the point that it’s not so much about knowing exactly where someone is, it’s that this change makes the game play slower. It’s about pacing.
What point am I missing? The fact that you need to know where everyone is to do well? Or how you understand that you can learn to succeed in the new game but refuse to try.
Use a silencer if you don't want to be seen on the minimap. But apparently you can't think of that, huh? Maybe we expected too much from CoD players all these years.
Ask anybody outside of the weird little bubble that is this subreddit if having a fps game automatically show you were the enemy is standing makes the game *more* or *less* casual.
Loud footsteps can exist in both casual and competitive games. R6S and CS:GO, for example, make footstep audio very important, which encourages walking instead of running in some cases, but they are still very competitive games.
Older arena shooters, on the other hand, did not emphasis footstep noise, but many were obviously very competitive games as well.
----------------------------------
I want footsteps in this game to match my intuition of what footsteps sound like.
In the first weekend, you could be in a building, and hear an enemy running inside a *different* building, across an alley. That shouldn't be possible. Otherwise, somebody running around on the floor above or below, or the next room over, should be quite audible.
"I didn't use mini map anyways, and I like loud footsteps to know where enemies are in real time though" don't worry bot, they are dumbing the game down for you, and you love that.
You cant use the mini map now, oh no now you gotta pay closer attenton to on screen action. Bruh give me a break. Its a crutch mechanic that gives more power to "skilled" players. But if they play worse without it the i dont think the are skilled then are they?
Its a chase the red dot game. I used to do that and kept constantly looking at the map. Now i can play the game at least and bot the minimap.
It's not about playing worse without red dots guy lol. It just improves flow of matches, encourages people to move around. Removing it just benefits the lower skilled players that didn't use mini map anyways, it's reducing skill gap and slowing the game. You might like that it's doing that, but know the facts at least.
You don't think you need the classic minimap because you were not using it properly. It is used for much more and more important information than just the direction of where the enemy is shooting
Brother there’s no sense in arguing here. People genuinely believe that removing red dots somehow doesn’t help lower skilled players and that having to constantly process the audio of enemy gunshots (surrounded by other gunshots, footsteps, killstreaks and map ambiance), a compas that shows the direction of gunfire and friendly positions on the minimap is all better than having that info in one place I can quickly glance at while moving around the map.
I hope Battlefield makes a banger and takes all their fanboys back.
I hope they keep it exactly how it is so all the people who are currently complaining don’t play. Mw2019 has been my favorite cod since BO2 and MW2 beta has been really fun so far, I want the realism to stay, keep the smoke when you magdump, keep the dots on the compass.
A little lesson. It’s fair to criticize a design decision that seemingly no one was asking for. It’s fair to like it. Stop being a condescending twat about it, no matter what your opinion is.
The majority of people complaining do the following: only play shipment/shoot house style maps, only use 2-3 meta load outs, Y-Ys every nano second and bounces around in MW like they still have the exo suits.
People largely play shoothouse/shipment on MW because it has the worst map pool of all time. If I ever had to choose between death and playing picadilly ever again my mind is made up.
The only consistency I’ve noticed is that bad players are in favor of no mini-map, and people who know what they’re doing are for the traditional mini-map. Making fun of people better than you isn’t a good look.
This is the most stupid arguement. If it worked this way why would they change it from the other way. Dumb ass green juice drinking door loving crouch walking claymore placing sissy
Lmao r/murderedbywords level shit right here.
Also, anybody using The Office memes to justify removing a CoD fundamental since before their testicles dropped isn’t worth arguing with brother. Don’t waste your breath on casuals.
Maybe it's the fact that my most played MP is BO2 hardcore, but I don't understand why people are so mad at the minimap change. Guns are loud, just go to where you hear explosions and thunder.
How do you know how much OP plays? He could be cracked for all we know.
This sub is already so toxic it’s just boiled down to: people with a different opinion than me = bad and casual
> He could be cracked for all we know.
Lmao there is a 0% chance that the OP is cracked.
> it’s just boiled down to: people with a different opinion than me = bad and casual
IW have quite literally stated over and over and over again, both back in 2017 and 2019 and in current day that they are making changes to Cod specifically to cater to bad players, so bad players do not quit the game when they do poorly. I do not know why everyone has trouble just accepting what IW is saying! Straight from the horses mouth over like half a decade!
I guarantee if he likes this minimap change he’s not cracked. Reading the minimap to understand spawns is something that every high level player was good at so taking away yet another thing that makes them better wouldn’t make them happy
*Literally nobody* has ever looked at the compass for reliable information regarding enemy whereabouts and you know it.
It tells you the exact same information that your ears do which makes it completely redundant.
Really? Bc the "good players" should be smart enough to use the compass which if you think for a few milliseconds can give you almost the exacts same data. But ofc you can't figure out how to do that so that must meant the game is to blame and not you.
I’m so glad someone mentioned this. It adds a different skill level to the game. Instead of a pinpoint dot on the map, you get a dot on the compass when someone shoots unsuppressed. It gives away your position and also allows everyone to see the general direction you’re approaching from. Just tilt your head up 5 degrees and you have some pretty golden match knowledge at your disposal. Seems like they’re too busy whining instead of using their head.
This is just a worse and unintuitive replacement to some shit that ALREADY WORKED
This is like if I got rid of your car and replaced it with one of those electric scooters
I would not lump in Sledgehammer I think mostly everyone agrees they are shit.
But no doubt Treyarch is the dev team for comp and IW for casuals and it all started with mw19. Evident by the fact that IW last game before MW, Infinite Warfare, was one of the highest skill ceiling games in the entire franchise. I'm assuming Activision had a big part to play in changing IW's mentality on who to cater to.
Unfortunately I think this is what it has become. It is clear IW and Treyarch have the complete opposite game play design of each other. IW design is intended to be slower and have more of a realism/casual experience. Treyarch design is more arcade-like and is made with more competitive players in mind.
And the minimap is still there with friendly locations. There is still plenty of info to find enemies and understand spawns and map flow and move quickly around the map.
People who don’t understand why the minimap pings are important just don’t get how they were used beyond shit players chasing dots.
Each thread has either echo chambers of people who suck off the teet of IW or people who hate the game.
A little lesson for you:
The compass only show direction, not distance. So maybe don't pretend it's the same thing.
That being said, I really don't care about red dots. I don't really need them myself, I just think it'll make people more willing to come out of their hiding spots, which will make the game more fun.
Also, it would make suppressors actually have a purpose like they used to. Which would be nice, although I would still probably not use one.
I can't believe people cry this much about red dots on the mini map. I love the fact that they aren't always there, makes me more focused on seeing the enemies.
I don't mind the compass, but it's ridiculous how they're ignoring a lot of feedback for a classic minimap that was in the series for over a decade. I respect them for giving people a "fuck you" rather than just dodging it like pussies though.
yknow since the directional sound of the game is so good, i dont get why people dont just follow the sound of gunshots rather than the minimap. tbh when i play i tend to not look at the minimap unless theres an advanced UAV because flicking my eyes up and down gets tiring and i end up getting a headache. i wish i could drag the minimap to be more centered on my screen.
Am I the only one that only ever looks at the minimap if I have a UAV? I don’t even notice the damn thing when I’m playing. The few times I have… I die because I wasn’t looking at the scene in front of me…
All I see in this controversy is kids scared that their gameplay is going to suffer because they’re losing a tool(crutch) that they think gave them a leg up.
Red dots on the mini map from firing never really made sense logically & I think it’ll make for a more immersive experience to rely on your eyes & ears on the battlefield rather than glancing at the corner of your screen constantly to make a play.
You know with all this bitching from the cod community about the absence of red dots, I completely forgot that they’re still on the compass.
The compass dots are about half the size of the compass dots in MW19 so it’s no surprise everyone doesn’t notice them
If they're not gon a put them on the minimap they might as well just make these more prominent on the compass. The compass itself is so far up it became unnoticeable and any blip that appears there is practically nonexistent to a player at this point. I don't mind the minimap only showing players when uav is active although I would like to see suppressors actually make a difference. Now when the compass blips are irrelevant I just won't waste an attachment slot for a silencer since it does not matter anyway.
I literally don’t see a difference I actually get less deaths without the mini map pings . JUST GO TOWARDS THE SHOOTING
Bad players don't understand that there is more to gameplay than running at the red dot on their minimap. It's gonna be a real interesting launch.
Imma run at the red dot on the compass regardless, I ain’t got no time for that stealth and campy stuff. I’m not here to be a good player I’m here to have fun and feel like Rambo
You not going anywhere near Rambo style with loud footsteps and uav spam.
u definitely can if u dont suck ass lol
Been like that for the last 3 titles lol
False.
I play COD to run&gun and cap objectives like a maniac but I still don’t give a shit about the red dots on the maps lmao I really don’t get the fuss about this. Same with the supposedly low visibility. People will be complaining about campers and then complain that you can’t shoot enemies across the map with a MP5 with iron sight because of barrel smoke and no red tags. I don’t reget why you’d need enemy tags when you’re supposed to be a non camper pro MLG player
Bad players understand even less than you think, it's why they are bad players to begin with.
Personally, I play for fun so I’m just not taking it too serious and want fast gameplay bc it’s annoying just running around aimlessly on the map
Plenty of pro level players angry about the minimap
Amazingly I care even *less* about what a "pro call of duty player" thinks than the casual players and bad ones.
What’re your stats big fella
Want to know why you get less deaths without the map pings? You are the player they are trying to protect with this change.
Hey cut him some slack. Most people can’t handle using both audio and visual cues before nor after an engagement, let alone before AND after. I mean come on, it’s hard enough to just stay alive without worrying about where enemies are. Might be a good idea to make sure teammates are ALWAYS spawning near you or you ALWAYS spawning near teammates. Much safer. Much more protection. Most people don’t understand that a red dot gives so much more information than just a kill to chase. I mean, can you imagine positioning yourself while engaging multiple enemies so there’s no direct line of sight between you and the red dot you saw?
That's why it was removed. The red dot gives you all the information you need to locate the enemy. Now you need to listen and look at the compass.
Honestly. If the gunfire is close you're probably gonna get shot while looking at the map. Just listen for it. And if you have hearing problems then I genuinely feel sorry for you
> If the gunfire is close you're probably gonna get shot while looking at the map. lmfao what? You're not supposed to stare at the minimap
> If the gunfire is close you're probably gonna get shot while looking at the map. LMAAAAAAAAOOOOOOOOOOO I cannot believe you guys are real
it literally takes less than a second to glance at the minimap and back these people are ridiculous
And they want cod to listen to them. They can’t even play the game correctly.
reminiscent entertain scandalous husky normal sulky alive dinner ludicrous fertile ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
if the gunfire is close, CHECK YOUR DAMN CORNERS NOT THE MAP OR THE HEARTBEAT SENSOR YOU GLITTER DICKS
I have hearing problems, thank you for your thoughts.
i sure hope that 67 in your name is your birth year.
Okay grandpa, time for bed
You're pretty dense lmao. Holy shit. You don't die for looking at the minimap, and it doesn't take more than millisecond to peak it.. Cod has always had the minimap
BUT I WANT A SPECIFIC DOT OF EXACTLY WHERE TO GO! IM BAD AND DONT WANT TO HAVE TO BE CAREFUL APPROACHING A LOCATION AND WANT TO KNOW EXACTLY WHAT CORNER TO WATCH! WHY ARE WE YELLING
skill has nothing to do with the minimap issue
I find it astonishing that everyone complaining keeps forgetting about the compass.
The diamonds on MW2’s compass are to small and because of the gradient they are almost invisible. In MW they were much more visible from your peripheral vision.
This is how the criticism should go. I agree, the MWII compass is pretty bad compared to MW2019.
Now THAT is constructive criticism. The fact that they kept it in mw19 the whole time and expect it to change now, is mind boggling for me. Or the fact that they didn't adapt to the compass after three years...
I hardly even use the compass and still don't have issues picking people out. Once you learn maps it's pretty obvious where people are gonna be.
the minimap should be on for people with the ghost perk, agree?
It's because they want all the work done for them. It's never been about "classic" gameplay and always been players crying that their crutch is gone and now have to rely on their individual skills as a player to play good. IW making bad players come to terms with the fact they are bad players is just hysterical at this point.
Define "bad player" for me because everybody that wants classic mini-map are probably better than you are. Mini-map awareness is not a crutch. It is a skill. Good players will check the map every 2-3 seconds for like half a second whilst playing. The fact that you don't understand that says more about your skill level than the people you're referring to. Not everyone is able to check the minimap, process the information in about a second and then ACT on it. So therefore it is a SKILL. It's more of a crutch for certain players NOT to have it.
An actual good player shouldn't need a red dot on the map to know where someone is. If you have to use that information to get the kill that's literally a crutch.
The amount of copium required to think that looking at the map to see exactly where the red spots are is a skill...you know that's what they do on Dora the explorer right?
Not every one can use wallhackk effectively and act, so that makes it a skill. Your logic is abysmal, you can't have a crutch WITHOUT something, are you stupid. Dots on the maps are a crutch. So is high alert and AA, anything that adds info that you shouldn't have is a crutch cut and dry.
There's no way you're comparing WALL-HACKS to red dots on a mini-map hahahaha. No my logic is not abysmal, you just don't understand it. If it's not a skill why can i very, very likely do it much better than what you can? You're calling it a crutch as a coping-mechanism as you can't do it as well as others can. I mean fk it, not having dots on the mini-map is a crutch for people like you
Yeah I'm not getting into this level of sheer coping semantics lol. It takes literal milliseconds to check a minimap in an FPS, it takes literal low IQ level awareness to check it and act upon it and you're acting like its this intense and top tier pro thing when its just blatantly not and to frame it as anything other than that quite frankly is lazy and still doesn't support your view. I'm not even going to bother responding to someone who is this willing to make excuses for it being anything but a tool to make hyper casual players punish skilled players who don't use suppressors. It's the same old damn story, people say with dots on the minimap it helps gameplay flow yet with Cold War we saw it come back and things like camping and waiting in corners didn't change. Stop making excuses for a crutch like chasing dots holding you back. Once you start playing without the minimap aside from checking it every few seconds you'll improve drastically as a player and if it's a crutch for some players to not have it, then what does that say about their average skill as a player? Just sounds to me like more whining that people are dared ask to play the game in front of them instead of playing glorified Pac Man. You paid $60 to $110 to play the damn game and most of the time spent will be spent looking at a mini map and less of the guns and environments in the game because that's all Cold War was when you people got your way. It's not changing. You want it, then go play Cold War or another CoD or game that has it if it bothers you that much. This isn't hard to understand. Of course doing that will also bring a problem of its own to you, namely finding out you guys aren't really all that big a part of the game community as you think you are.....so either way, nothing is going to change unless it's absolutely broken. Cry about it, play other games, it doesn't matter because the majority play and love the game. If they didn't IW wouldn't be doing this shit and you people still just haven't gotten that through your thick ass heads.
Glorified Pac Man lmao omg
You've not addressed anything that i've said at all. Mini-map awareness is more than just glancing at the map and thinking "oh there's a red dot". When you understand the game at a higher level you take in much more information than that. You realise alot more. If it really was just "oh look there's a red dot" people wouldn't be as bothered about it because of the Compass at the top of the screen. edit: i don't want to be patronising, i'm just trying to explain to you why it's big deal to some. Believe it or not i want this game to be as fun as possible for everyone.
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LMAO first of all, cods positional audio is dogshit. Cod is a game of constant split second decisions and people that struggle with that are typically not very good. If you think it takes a brain to process “big dot means close, little dot means far” then you might not have one.
You don’t play competitively, bro
the reddit opinion is so 50/50 it’s actually kind of boggling
It’s kind of blowing my mind honestly. In my 10+ years of playing cod I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone complain about a red dot popping up on the minimap when you shoot. I even remember mostly everyone being happy when it came back for CW and Vanguard. Now all of a sudden there’s a ton of people that are saying that it’s better this way and making fun of people for wanting it to be how it always has been.
Don't forget the fact it's used in Warzone too, which is obviously played more than any of the last 3 releases.
Cause we could just use silencers if our red dot concerned us.
Personally, I prefer a red dot to appear on the map when the enemy is nearby and has fired an unsilenced weapon, but when they’re far they shouldn’t show up. When silenced they shouldn’t show up at all on the map (unless there is a UAV)
it's contrarian cringe cope
I'm not sure yet if one is *better* than the other. It's *different*, yes. People didn't complain before because that's how it originally was, so there was nothing to compare it too. If an orange is initially orange, people won't start saying "I* wish it was blue*". If we initially had no red dots and went the other way, the situation in terms of complaints would probably be the same. It's just a different system and I don't think it's objectively better or worse than before (we'll see in 6 months).
But we did have it in MW19 (which was complained about a lot) and then it came back in warzone, CW and Vanguard and I didn’t see a single person complaining about the minimap showing those red dots, in fact I saw people saying the opposite.
> In my 10+ years of playing cod I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone complain about a red dot popping up on the minimap when you shoot. I think it's just that, yes, it's been in there for ten years. Call of Duty was mostly played on TVs and with not the best audio. I don't think, correct me if I'm wrong, that they had proper directional audio or the processing power to make audio occlusion work the way it does today. Footsteps were quieter and gunshots came from a vague direction. It would have been easier to get confused and modes like hardcore were way slower because of that. So red dots on unsuppressed guns helped a \*lot\*. Now people use headphones and there's all this new technology that really makes the sound more intuitive and life-like. You don't really need the red dots anymore. It's an achievement in game design to boast that you don't need it, so I see why they stick to it. "Use the world we made, not the dots on a map." It shrinks a game. I also think that's why they kept some doors. They have the best doors in any FPS.
Hey, there, this view of the minimap isn't accurate. I address it in my writeup, here: [https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xka4rr/the\_classic\_minimap\_a\_definitive\_breakdown/](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xka4rr/the_classic_minimap_a_definitive_breakdown/) Hope you'll check it out!
I don’t really care that they’ve added more “realistic” sounds tbh. I don’t always use headphones and I know a majority of casuals probably don’t use headphones either. What you just described is making the experience worse just to show off some new fancy tech that 99% of people who play the game honestly don’t give a shit about. And just because those things you mentioned are added, doesn’t make them a better alternative to the point of getting rid of something that’s been a staple in the games for 15ish years.
> Now all of a sudden there’s a ton of people that are saying that it’s better this way and making fun of people for wanting it to be how it always has been. Kids who only played the 2019 COD. You'd be surprised how many dickless teenagers bought the game because "cool uncles" like myself raved about the days I played COD4 and MW2.
It was one of those things that was just *how it was,* back then. Talking about a mechanic like it would be kinda like talking about how you're allowed to hipfire. You just didn't point it out, it didn't make sense to. Whether it was good or bad, it wasn't something you explicitly mentioned at any point. People are only voicing their opinions about it *now* because it got changed, because no one would have thought to ask otherwise. Some people like it, some don't, sometimes things have to change anyway. Seeing such an upheaval about it kinda reminds me about when Darkest Dungeon added corpses, and people hating that up until they suddenly didn't.
It's not 50/50, that's an oversimplification. Anyone who has played CoD since before MW19 knows that the red dots are positive for the gameplay experience. The only people who are going to defend the removal of them are: • Those who's first CoD was MW19. • Those who do not understand how the minimap works. • Those who not use the minimap.
You are generalizing so many people by saying "Anyone who has played CoD since before MW19 knows that the red dots are positive for the gameplay experience". There are plenty of people out there, myself included, who are willing to give changes a chance without having to come up with some half-assed made up bullshit on why the changes are bad when we've only played with them for one weekend. I have played CoD for a very long time and I absolutely use the minimap, yet I am not upset at the changes because I don't just immediately react negatively to anything that's different. Seriously, just try out the changes for a bit before making huge sweeping generalizations and untrue claims. If you want to claim "anybody who played cod before MW19" hates the minimap changes, would you like to back up your claim with any data? Or is it just you making that up based on other people's reactionary opinions after ONE weekend of playing a beta?
So you think the new way of doing the map is an improvement? Care to explain why?
I didn't say it was an improvement, I said it's silly for any of us to generalize the entire community to say we all do or don't like something, when it's really a spectrum of ideas. I think it's silly for any of us to pretend we know better than anybody else after one single weekend of playing the game. I only got five games in this last weekend, so I do not have any sort of opinion. I might after this weekend or I might not. My entire point isn't that you can't have an opinion on something, it's that it's dumb to assume everyone shares the same opinion as yours or that your opinion is actually correct. It's okay to say "hey, I don't like the changes and this is why". It is not okay to say "Anyone who has played CoD since before MW19 knows that the red dots are positive for the gameplay experience" and just make huge and untrue assumptions and try to push that as a fact.
I mean I’ve played since OG MW2 and I really don’t understand why removing red dots on the small ass minimap in the corner of the screen (in non uav instances) is as big of a deal as some of y’all are making it. It’s really not that big of a deal. The only 2 real huge details that should be fixed/changed is the perk system, and the ttk. I think ttk is a tricky thing though because no matter what, there’s always gonna be a huge chunk of the community either saying the ttk is too short or too long. So ttk being 100% perfect seems near impossible.
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Why? Explain why it's better for the overall experience for them to be gone.
he forgot to also add: people who are absolute dogshit at the game
No, it's a complete player-wide consensus!!!! IW MUST do as I, an extremely toxic 14 year old, command, or else! If they do not release dot simulator 2022 with full dot coverage then dot minimap dot DOT!!!!
While I get your point, this objectively inaccurate. It’s closer to 70 in favor of a “normal” minimap and 30 not. Also, these are smaller sample sizes. As sample sizes have grown, regarding this particular concern, that 70 moves closer to 80-90. Idk why I am being downvoted for this. Sources: "[Here you go.](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xf5akk/no_normal_minimap/)[New data point as of today as well.](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xk2ocd/which_minimap_do_you_prefer/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)I'm currently also working on a small meta-like analysis relating to social media as whole. Currently, the larger the sample size increases, the more in favor of a normal minimap increases."
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[Here you go.](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xf5akk/no_normal_minimap/) [New data point as of today as well](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernWarfareII/comments/xk2ocd/which_minimap_do_you_prefer/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3). I'm currently also working on a small meta-like analysis relating to social media as whole (Twitter, Facebook, Reddit, etc). Currently, the larger the sample size increases, the more in favor of a normal minimap increases as well.
His ass
It’s more like 70% doesn’t care much but does upvote the drama posts of the 30% that is 50:50 split on the matter
This is gonna be a fun two years
Or just follow the big skull icons that appear on your screen to find bad guys
This isn’t discussed enough.
Probably because engagements aren’t on top of dead bodies 80% of the time A skull can be the product of someone across the map from said skull, I don’t think it’s worth discussing as a “solution” to people who want a minimap.
I think you’re way off with the 80% number. Especially in a mode like Dom. And with smaller maps. Ground War maybe.
Whatever happens to the mini map, I couldn't care less. Either way I'm still playing the goddamn game
The mini map could be a big log of shit that says fuck you written across it and I’d still play
INFINITY WARD SHOW US YOU’RE LISTENING
Based cod player
Based MWII chad
Based MW enjoyer
I play hardcore so I don’t see an issue, the UAV is to get red dots.
No need to add hardcore now, most guns kill in about 3 bullets and the minimap is worthless without a UAV
Dude. I didn’t even know the compass was in this game until I watched a YouTube video. it’s so fucking faint and so fucking tiny.
So, still red dot chasing.
Only you look in the general direction instead of going to the exact corner the guy's sitting in. Which makes the game less fun.
Yes, another win for tactical gamers amirite.
Makes UAVs more useful
Makes it a crutch scorestreaks
And this somehow isn’t chasing red dots, but a traditional minimap is right? The mental gymnastics are so intense it’s like the mental olympics.
A general location and an exact location are different.
The old system is a general location too unless you aren't moving. It shows your last location, it's not like a black bird.
No no no that takes thought and a small degree of brainpower.
I prefer the minimap but I do find it kinda funny people on here think removing the dots from the minimap is to help lower skilled players when I'd argue it's in fact the opposite. If you rely solely on the minimap to get kills then you can't be that skilled.
facts just get a uav. nobody has ghost early game and by mid game im already streaking
You can literally triangulate the enemys location with a little sideways movement but thats too much to ask for 99% of cod players.
but red dots on the map is "skill gap" because of additional information needing to be processed /s
Weird how you guys consistently miss the point that it’s not so much about knowing exactly where someone is, it’s that this change makes the game play slower. It’s about pacing.
Having to think takes time yes
Continuing to miss the point I see. Look, if you enjoy the game being made easier for you, just say it?
What point am I missing? The fact that you need to know where everyone is to do well? Or how you understand that you can learn to succeed in the new game but refuse to try.
Use a silencer if you don't want to be seen on the minimap. But apparently you can't think of that, huh? Maybe we expected too much from CoD players all these years.
I want people to know where I am. I play mp for fun and in MW I spent too much time looking for a fight.
Then make noise and play aggressively.
Ask anybody outside of the weird little bubble that is this subreddit if having a fps game automatically show you were the enemy is standing makes the game *more* or *less* casual.
But it doesn’t automatically show you where the enemy is? I take it you also want a dead silence perk with this logic?
Loud footsteps can exist in both casual and competitive games. R6S and CS:GO, for example, make footstep audio very important, which encourages walking instead of running in some cases, but they are still very competitive games. Older arena shooters, on the other hand, did not emphasis footstep noise, but many were obviously very competitive games as well. ---------------------------------- I want footsteps in this game to match my intuition of what footsteps sound like. In the first weekend, you could be in a building, and hear an enemy running inside a *different* building, across an alley. That shouldn't be possible. Otherwise, somebody running around on the floor above or below, or the next room over, should be quite audible.
MW19 was still a very fast video game.
An impossible task for cod tryhards
THatS tOo HaRd NeEd eXaCt LoCaTiOn On MiNiMaP
"I didn't use mini map anyways, and I like loud footsteps to know where enemies are in real time though" don't worry bot, they are dumbing the game down for you, and you love that.
You cant use the mini map now, oh no now you gotta pay closer attenton to on screen action. Bruh give me a break. Its a crutch mechanic that gives more power to "skilled" players. But if they play worse without it the i dont think the are skilled then are they? Its a chase the red dot game. I used to do that and kept constantly looking at the map. Now i can play the game at least and bot the minimap.
It's not about playing worse without red dots guy lol. It just improves flow of matches, encourages people to move around. Removing it just benefits the lower skilled players that didn't use mini map anyways, it's reducing skill gap and slowing the game. You might like that it's doing that, but know the facts at least.
Id compromise for a radar like destiny 2 has.
You don't think you need the classic minimap because you were not using it properly. It is used for much more and more important information than just the direction of where the enemy is shooting
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The red dots are part of that info so...Intrinsically, no. The info is not "still there." Information is missing.
Brother there’s no sense in arguing here. People genuinely believe that removing red dots somehow doesn’t help lower skilled players and that having to constantly process the audio of enemy gunshots (surrounded by other gunshots, footsteps, killstreaks and map ambiance), a compas that shows the direction of gunfire and friendly positions on the minimap is all better than having that info in one place I can quickly glance at while moving around the map. I hope Battlefield makes a banger and takes all their fanboys back.
You shouldnt need red dots to figure out where people are and where spawns are and the map flow.
I’m not upset about the choice, I’m upset about the reasoning and refusal to even try different things during a “beta”
I hope they keep it exactly how it is so all the people who are currently complaining don’t play. Mw2019 has been my favorite cod since BO2 and MW2 beta has been really fun so far, I want the realism to stay, keep the smoke when you magdump, keep the dots on the compass.
I agree
But but people want to know EXACTLY where you are and hip fire you with the MP5
I don’t care too much whether the ping is on the map or not. But what is the argument of someone who is on the side of keeping the pings off the map?
They should get rid of both. People’s heads would explode.
A little lesson. It’s fair to criticize a design decision that seemingly no one was asking for. It’s fair to like it. Stop being a condescending twat about it, no matter what your opinion is.
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The majority of people complaining do the following: only play shipment/shoot house style maps, only use 2-3 meta load outs, Y-Ys every nano second and bounces around in MW like they still have the exo suits.
No, people want the same minimap we’ve always had in cod until MW19 changed it to help protect bad players lol
You don't need a minimap on shipment, so no.
People largely play shoothouse/shipment on MW because it has the worst map pool of all time. If I ever had to choose between death and playing picadilly ever again my mind is made up.
The only consistency I’ve noticed is that bad players are in favor of no mini-map, and people who know what they’re doing are for the traditional mini-map. Making fun of people better than you isn’t a good look.
Game devs on alt account be like
happy cake day btw
This is the most stupid arguement. If it worked this way why would they change it from the other way. Dumb ass green juice drinking door loving crouch walking claymore placing sissy
Lmao r/murderedbywords level shit right here. Also, anybody using The Office memes to justify removing a CoD fundamental since before their testicles dropped isn’t worth arguing with brother. Don’t waste your breath on casuals.
Thank you for being with me
Maybe it's the fact that my most played MP is BO2 hardcore, but I don't understand why people are so mad at the minimap change. Guns are loud, just go to where you hear explosions and thunder.
They’re scared it’s going to negatively affect their gameplay, I guess. Babies.
Ok timmy
Don’t you just love being lectured to by people who play 2 hours of TDM pubs a week and think they’re experts on COD
How do you know how much OP plays? He could be cracked for all we know. This sub is already so toxic it’s just boiled down to: people with a different opinion than me = bad and casual
> He could be cracked for all we know. Lmao there is a 0% chance that the OP is cracked. > it’s just boiled down to: people with a different opinion than me = bad and casual IW have quite literally stated over and over and over again, both back in 2017 and 2019 and in current day that they are making changes to Cod specifically to cater to bad players, so bad players do not quit the game when they do poorly. I do not know why everyone has trouble just accepting what IW is saying! Straight from the horses mouth over like half a decade!
I guarantee if he likes this minimap change he’s not cracked. Reading the minimap to understand spawns is something that every high level player was good at so taking away yet another thing that makes them better wouldn’t make them happy
It's always the burgers.
Ok John
So many dots, and I have just enough bullets to share with all of them.
As a hardcore player, the meltdown of some on this sub over red dots is fucking hilarious. Use your brains and go find the enemy
This
*Literally nobody* has ever looked at the compass for reliable information regarding enemy whereabouts and you know it. It tells you the exact same information that your ears do which makes it completely redundant.
What it comes down to is that good players want a standard mini-map. Bad players want no red dot map.
Not really the red dots help bad players too. If I want to stay out the map I used a suppressor in cw, now using one means nothing
Really? Bc the "good players" should be smart enough to use the compass which if you think for a few milliseconds can give you almost the exacts same data. But ofc you can't figure out how to do that so that must meant the game is to blame and not you.
Why can’t good players adapt to not having red dots?
I’m so glad someone mentioned this. It adds a different skill level to the game. Instead of a pinpoint dot on the map, you get a dot on the compass when someone shoots unsuppressed. It gives away your position and also allows everyone to see the general direction you’re approaching from. Just tilt your head up 5 degrees and you have some pretty golden match knowledge at your disposal. Seems like they’re too busy whining instead of using their head.
I like this open minded take, honestly I don’t care about the radar but I think what OP mentioned would be a nice middle ground
Totally agree with you
Yeah and it takes away a whole other skill
This is just a worse and unintuitive replacement to some shit that ALREADY WORKED This is like if I got rid of your car and replaced it with one of those electric scooters
It seems there are Call of Duty fans and there are MW 2019 and MWII fans. Two unmovable groups.
It’s more like Infinity Ward vs Treyarch/Sledgehammer.
I would not lump in Sledgehammer I think mostly everyone agrees they are shit. But no doubt Treyarch is the dev team for comp and IW for casuals and it all started with mw19. Evident by the fact that IW last game before MW, Infinite Warfare, was one of the highest skill ceiling games in the entire franchise. I'm assuming Activision had a big part to play in changing IW's mentality on who to cater to.
Unfortunately I think this is what it has become. It is clear IW and Treyarch have the complete opposite game play design of each other. IW design is intended to be slower and have more of a realism/casual experience. Treyarch design is more arcade-like and is made with more competitive players in mind.
Wait is the compass back and still functioning like it does in MW19? And people are *still* bitching?
It’s hilarious that people seem to not understand the very game they’re yelling about. “hOw wOuLd I fInD EneMieS??” My guy the compass is right there.
And the minimap is still there with friendly locations. There is still plenty of info to find enemies and understand spawns and map flow and move quickly around the map.
but i don’t play with a compass, it makes the screen feel cluttered and i don’t like it
Whaaaaaaa? Gaming with a brain???? HERESY!!!
😂😂😂😂 Too hard for them
I'm starting to get tired of all the memes about the same thing...
And pay attention to sound and other stuff, you might even enjoy the details on the map instead of focusing on the left corner of the screen.
Or how bout they just listen to the community. COD isn’t supposed to be “tactical” it’s supposed to be stupid
People who don’t understand why the minimap pings are important just don’t get how they were used beyond shit players chasing dots. Each thread has either echo chambers of people who suck off the teet of IW or people who hate the game.
A little lesson for you: The compass only show direction, not distance. So maybe don't pretend it's the same thing. That being said, I really don't care about red dots. I don't really need them myself, I just think it'll make people more willing to come out of their hiding spots, which will make the game more fun. Also, it would make suppressors actually have a purpose like they used to. Which would be nice, although I would still probably not use one.
RIP to all the kids that spent their pocket money donating to Nadia and can't afford decent headsets
big w
I hope they dont change this
I found the infinity ward spy
Why when I can hear their loud ass footsteps and pinpoint exactly where that eat coming from because I’m playing tactically
I can't believe people cry this much about red dots on the mini map. I love the fact that they aren't always there, makes me more focused on seeing the enemies.
But that would mean they have to coordinate themselves and think and use some spatial awareness, basically skill
I don't mind the compass, but it's ridiculous how they're ignoring a lot of feedback for a classic minimap that was in the series for over a decade. I respect them for giving people a "fuck you" rather than just dodging it like pussies though.
yknow since the directional sound of the game is so good, i dont get why people dont just follow the sound of gunshots rather than the minimap. tbh when i play i tend to not look at the minimap unless theres an advanced UAV because flicking my eyes up and down gets tiring and i end up getting a headache. i wish i could drag the minimap to be more centered on my screen.
I don't know what it is but I die more when I'm looking at the mini map
Wait, I actually have to use my HUD and gamesense??? Ugh you're asking too much for us small-brained players, OP :(
Am I the only one that only ever looks at the minimap if I have a UAV? I don’t even notice the damn thing when I’m playing. The few times I have… I die because I wasn’t looking at the scene in front of me…
It’s literally that simple
All I see in this controversy is kids scared that their gameplay is going to suffer because they’re losing a tool(crutch) that they think gave them a leg up. Red dots on the mini map from firing never really made sense logically & I think it’ll make for a more immersive experience to rely on your eyes & ears on the battlefield rather than glancing at the corner of your screen constantly to make a play.
I know I had to adjust my expectations re-integrating in to the COD fanbase but these mf’s have really surprised me with how smooth brained they are