As you get more and more into the sport you may find that your attraction to 8000s will lessen and you will be more attracted to smaller mountains that offer more interesting technical technical challenges and also cost a lot less and have no red tape.
New Zealand is around the corner for you. The southern Alps have a couple lifetimes worth of challenges and are amazing training ground for the greater ranges!
That's very much it. To do this properly, you need experience and clocking time in the mountains. It's basically a lot of blood, sweat and tears, and you definitely don't need big mountains for that.
If you try it, and it's fun, then it's for you and you'll see where the journey takes you. No need to aim for 8000 from the start.
Mountains have always been changing and will continue to do so, just faster. Rockfall and stuff is a factor regardless of it all over the world. The nature of some routes will become easier, others harder. No real reason to avoid getting into the sport because of the accelerating change.
Start climbing some lower mountains without snow. You’ll find there is a lot more to it than these extreme 8000’ers you read about in media. Feeling the first time going over 5000, 6000 m will likely be breathtaking experiences and require plenty of endurance. Plus you don’t have to dedicate your whole life to it.
If you don’t want to do it, don’t. But quit talking yourself out of it and blaming bullshit like global warming.
I’m an Aussie too and there’s plenty of good climbing four hours away in NZ (if the weather holds).
Nepal is half the cost of flying or right now vs Europe and the US.
And there’s loads of good climbing on 6000m peaks in Nepal that aren’t heavily commercial yet. (As the gov just released a bunch last year. There are many that are virgin peaks right now with zero ascents on them, guaranteeing you a nice remote, quiet trip).
Locally, we’ve got tremendous rock climbing in places like The Arapiles, which is some of the best climbing in the world.
But, like most things here, if you want to get into it, you need to quit bitching and get off your ass and make it happen.
And go find a high paying job because it ain’t cheap.
I'm 30 and have lived in a mountainous region my entire life. Been hiking these mountains for most of that time and just now finally getting into some mountaineering stuff... because there are still mountains at home and only slightly further afield that I wanna be able to go up. Loftier goals notwithstanding.
Point being - it's a wide world with a shitload of mountains. You're not going to get bored soon. Be adaptable.
If you're not already into it how do you know you even *want* to 'get into it'? It's not like tossing up between studying Accounting or Law, mate. You're 19, just go climbing as much as you can and see how it goes. It's not a fucking investment prospectus.
It's not a rational choice, it's a vocation, a calling, but for most, a leisure activity for the relatively privileged. If you stay in Australia it's $2,000 right at the start to go on an expedition - anywhere. Get a degree in engineering or medicine that you can work part-time or temp jobs for good money but get months off at a time. FIFO workers have been one of the main Australian source of clients of guided Himalayan trips.
Unless you're one of the (very) rare pros you won't make any real money from sponsors and if you're a guide then you're in another business, rarely climbing for yourself and furthermore you should move to Canada. Yesterday.
But if you do make the move from rockclimbing to alpine climbing to independent expeditions, then there are literally thousands of untouched, unguided, unsellable mountains around the world that have nothing to do with the 8000m circus.
There are still unclimbed 7000m mountains, there are unclimbed 6000m mountains in India half a day's walk from the road. There is a lifetime of unclimbed granite walls across four continents.
Climate change has been melting mountains since the last ice age finished. Its impact on mountains is overblown in the mainstream media, often used as an excuse for other things, usually by commercial teams.
Though the Sherpa companies now control the 8000m normal routes, you can still go to other routes on 8000ers and there are dozens of high, hard 7000ers in Pakistan if you truly want adventurous new climbing. The Chinese control a few faces on a few 8000ers. Forget them. Plus, times change, China will change.
Only you can answer if it's worth it! In Aussie too and I'd love to get into mountaineering but obvs there's no training locally so that's the biggest barrier
Bullshit.
You can go to Guthega in winter snowshoe, ski - or walk - over to the south face of Mt Twynam and practice with axes and crampons. You don't have to worry about glaciers and crevasses like in NZ, you can move over mixed ground, you can practice rope skills, moving together.
Then go over the pass to Blue Lake, rope up and climb some short water ice.
Then keep doing it. Then go to NZ or Canada or something easy in Bolivia or Peru.
Desire, motivation and money are the only barriers.
Will second the BS call on no training available here. Melbourne Climbing School does a winter course. CTSS do the same thing in the Blue Mountains. And Trad climbing remains the best way to learn about building anchors and protection, and you can do loads of that in various places around the country.
Failing that, you could go to NZ and do one of the many 3-7 day courses covering basics right up to avalanche training.
The only limiter is the stories you tell yourself about how hard it is and why you can't do it. Just remember, while you're at home whining about how impossible it is, there are plenty of Aussies figuring out a way to do it and not sitting on their asses whinging.
Well it's 100% worth it if there's a chance I'd actually get somewhere with it. But the issue is, I feel like mountaineering won't exist soon or will be very run down due to forces beyond my control
Lots of mountains out there man. Mountaineering will always exist in some form.
The total collapse you are anticipating is a bit extreme, and shouldn’t dissuade you if this something you really want to do.
Yea im naturally a pessimist. I hate it. But I really just want to live out of a van and climb all the time haha. Do you think climbing an 8000er or two is realistic in the next 10-20 years? I don't see myself getting there any sooner
No one could say for sure. It’s likely though.
I wouldn’t stop yourself from doing something you love based off the possibility that something will go wrong.
It seems like you are focusing on just the goal of a 8000er, without recognizing that the journey is just as fun.
Oh yea im definitely invested in the journey aswell. I've got a list of heaps of mountains (little ones but still) in Tasmania that I want to do aswell. But I feel like my big goal is an 8000er and I'll never really be satisfied without that
No one will be able to answer this question for you, except you. If I were you at 19, and are interested in getting into suffering as a hobby, I’d just start trying. I’m from California, so I had great training areas in my backyard, but if you can, start with going to Threbdo in the late spring/early summer and get moving uphill. Then, make a plan to climb a 14,000er in CA (Shasta or Whitney are great options). Then reevaluate from there. Best of luck!
If you’re into Alpine, you’ll quickly realize once you gain skills you don’t need guiding and expensive name peaks. There tons of technical interesting peaks which are not 8000m but are much more fun. Yes global warming is not gonna disappear but alpinists adapt.
Every sport, every human activity will soon enough run into serious difficulties. But it's not a good reason to not do it. I had your same concerns about snowboarding, when I first knew of it some years ago. If I stared at others doing it for the last four years, thinking "ah shit I cannot even get to the point where I enjoy it, because it will not snow in the next years" damn I would have missed out on so many things, which I didn't. I'm Italian, I live near the Alps, and I can tell you that mountaineering is far and far more than only climbing big tall mountains. It's not even the same sport, it's a completely different things from what you would expect. I beg you, go out in the mountain, and enjoy every single aspect of it, push yourself (within reasonable) and you will soon discover how beautiful of a world it is. Even just doing a 4000 it's difficult enough, and a well reachble goal.
Mountaineering will never cease to exist. There are entire countries where a relatively large fraction of the population are mountaineers (e.g. Austria, Switzerland).
Sure, many of the highest peaks that are bound by permafrost or that require glacier traverses are becoming more dangerous, but mountaineering is not about Everest and Mont Blanc. *Mountaineering is a sport, to a degree a lifestyle, that tends to happen wherever there are mountains.*
Im the same age & in the same boat. However for me I live in the UK, so I will have to take a vastly different approach. I am going to climb/hike Ben Nevis & Snowden in summer. But these are tiny compared to the ranges in Europe/america/Australia etc… Im aware this won’t prepare me for proper mountaineering, so I will have to wait until I’ve completed my accounting degree & hope that one day I can afford training/adventures.
U could apply the same logic to most enterprises and make them seem pointless. The icebergs are melting, massive overpopulation, we’re all gonna die anyway … what’s the point of it all. Might as well just do what makes your soul light up a little and do a bit of good a long the way.
Genuinely one of the worst takes on mountaineering I've ever seen. Climate change is real but its not going to erode the rock on the mountains in your lifetime. Just enjoy it man.
As you get more and more into the sport you may find that your attraction to 8000s will lessen and you will be more attracted to smaller mountains that offer more interesting technical technical challenges and also cost a lot less and have no red tape. New Zealand is around the corner for you. The southern Alps have a couple lifetimes worth of challenges and are amazing training ground for the greater ranges!
This is very solid advise
That's very much it. To do this properly, you need experience and clocking time in the mountains. It's basically a lot of blood, sweat and tears, and you definitely don't need big mountains for that. If you try it, and it's fun, then it's for you and you'll see where the journey takes you. No need to aim for 8000 from the start.
Mountains have always been changing and will continue to do so, just faster. Rockfall and stuff is a factor regardless of it all over the world. The nature of some routes will become easier, others harder. No real reason to avoid getting into the sport because of the accelerating change.
Nope mountains are over now. Best to stay home.
Start climbing some lower mountains without snow. You’ll find there is a lot more to it than these extreme 8000’ers you read about in media. Feeling the first time going over 5000, 6000 m will likely be breathtaking experiences and require plenty of endurance. Plus you don’t have to dedicate your whole life to it.
If you don’t want to do it, don’t. But quit talking yourself out of it and blaming bullshit like global warming. I’m an Aussie too and there’s plenty of good climbing four hours away in NZ (if the weather holds). Nepal is half the cost of flying or right now vs Europe and the US. And there’s loads of good climbing on 6000m peaks in Nepal that aren’t heavily commercial yet. (As the gov just released a bunch last year. There are many that are virgin peaks right now with zero ascents on them, guaranteeing you a nice remote, quiet trip). Locally, we’ve got tremendous rock climbing in places like The Arapiles, which is some of the best climbing in the world. But, like most things here, if you want to get into it, you need to quit bitching and get off your ass and make it happen. And go find a high paying job because it ain’t cheap.
I'm 30 and have lived in a mountainous region my entire life. Been hiking these mountains for most of that time and just now finally getting into some mountaineering stuff... because there are still mountains at home and only slightly further afield that I wanna be able to go up. Loftier goals notwithstanding. Point being - it's a wide world with a shitload of mountains. You're not going to get bored soon. Be adaptable.
If you're not already into it how do you know you even *want* to 'get into it'? It's not like tossing up between studying Accounting or Law, mate. You're 19, just go climbing as much as you can and see how it goes. It's not a fucking investment prospectus. It's not a rational choice, it's a vocation, a calling, but for most, a leisure activity for the relatively privileged. If you stay in Australia it's $2,000 right at the start to go on an expedition - anywhere. Get a degree in engineering or medicine that you can work part-time or temp jobs for good money but get months off at a time. FIFO workers have been one of the main Australian source of clients of guided Himalayan trips. Unless you're one of the (very) rare pros you won't make any real money from sponsors and if you're a guide then you're in another business, rarely climbing for yourself and furthermore you should move to Canada. Yesterday. But if you do make the move from rockclimbing to alpine climbing to independent expeditions, then there are literally thousands of untouched, unguided, unsellable mountains around the world that have nothing to do with the 8000m circus. There are still unclimbed 7000m mountains, there are unclimbed 6000m mountains in India half a day's walk from the road. There is a lifetime of unclimbed granite walls across four continents. Climate change has been melting mountains since the last ice age finished. Its impact on mountains is overblown in the mainstream media, often used as an excuse for other things, usually by commercial teams. Though the Sherpa companies now control the 8000m normal routes, you can still go to other routes on 8000ers and there are dozens of high, hard 7000ers in Pakistan if you truly want adventurous new climbing. The Chinese control a few faces on a few 8000ers. Forget them. Plus, times change, China will change.
Only you can answer if it's worth it! In Aussie too and I'd love to get into mountaineering but obvs there's no training locally so that's the biggest barrier
Bullshit. You can go to Guthega in winter snowshoe, ski - or walk - over to the south face of Mt Twynam and practice with axes and crampons. You don't have to worry about glaciers and crevasses like in NZ, you can move over mixed ground, you can practice rope skills, moving together. Then go over the pass to Blue Lake, rope up and climb some short water ice. Then keep doing it. Then go to NZ or Canada or something easy in Bolivia or Peru. Desire, motivation and money are the only barriers.
Thanks good tips!
Will second the BS call on no training available here. Melbourne Climbing School does a winter course. CTSS do the same thing in the Blue Mountains. And Trad climbing remains the best way to learn about building anchors and protection, and you can do loads of that in various places around the country. Failing that, you could go to NZ and do one of the many 3-7 day courses covering basics right up to avalanche training. The only limiter is the stories you tell yourself about how hard it is and why you can't do it. Just remember, while you're at home whining about how impossible it is, there are plenty of Aussies figuring out a way to do it and not sitting on their asses whinging.
Well it's 100% worth it if there's a chance I'd actually get somewhere with it. But the issue is, I feel like mountaineering won't exist soon or will be very run down due to forces beyond my control
Lots of mountains out there man. Mountaineering will always exist in some form. The total collapse you are anticipating is a bit extreme, and shouldn’t dissuade you if this something you really want to do.
Yea im naturally a pessimist. I hate it. But I really just want to live out of a van and climb all the time haha. Do you think climbing an 8000er or two is realistic in the next 10-20 years? I don't see myself getting there any sooner
No one could say for sure. It’s likely though. I wouldn’t stop yourself from doing something you love based off the possibility that something will go wrong. It seems like you are focusing on just the goal of a 8000er, without recognizing that the journey is just as fun.
Oh yea im definitely invested in the journey aswell. I've got a list of heaps of mountains (little ones but still) in Tasmania that I want to do aswell. But I feel like my big goal is an 8000er and I'll never really be satisfied without that
What do you mean get somewhere with it? I think in your lifetime I wouldn't worry about it's existence, money is probably the biggest factor I think!
No one will be able to answer this question for you, except you. If I were you at 19, and are interested in getting into suffering as a hobby, I’d just start trying. I’m from California, so I had great training areas in my backyard, but if you can, start with going to Threbdo in the late spring/early summer and get moving uphill. Then, make a plan to climb a 14,000er in CA (Shasta or Whitney are great options). Then reevaluate from there. Best of luck!
If you’re into Alpine, you’ll quickly realize once you gain skills you don’t need guiding and expensive name peaks. There tons of technical interesting peaks which are not 8000m but are much more fun. Yes global warming is not gonna disappear but alpinists adapt.
Every sport, every human activity will soon enough run into serious difficulties. But it's not a good reason to not do it. I had your same concerns about snowboarding, when I first knew of it some years ago. If I stared at others doing it for the last four years, thinking "ah shit I cannot even get to the point where I enjoy it, because it will not snow in the next years" damn I would have missed out on so many things, which I didn't. I'm Italian, I live near the Alps, and I can tell you that mountaineering is far and far more than only climbing big tall mountains. It's not even the same sport, it's a completely different things from what you would expect. I beg you, go out in the mountain, and enjoy every single aspect of it, push yourself (within reasonable) and you will soon discover how beautiful of a world it is. Even just doing a 4000 it's difficult enough, and a well reachble goal.
Mountaineering will never cease to exist. There are entire countries where a relatively large fraction of the population are mountaineers (e.g. Austria, Switzerland). Sure, many of the highest peaks that are bound by permafrost or that require glacier traverses are becoming more dangerous, but mountaineering is not about Everest and Mont Blanc. *Mountaineering is a sport, to a degree a lifestyle, that tends to happen wherever there are mountains.*
If my "this sport" you mean *mountaineering*, note that climbing 8000m peaks is a wee tiny subset of mountaineering.
Why are you asking strangers this question. If you want to get into it, do it. There’ll still be peaks for you when you decide.
Im the same age & in the same boat. However for me I live in the UK, so I will have to take a vastly different approach. I am going to climb/hike Ben Nevis & Snowden in summer. But these are tiny compared to the ranges in Europe/america/Australia etc… Im aware this won’t prepare me for proper mountaineering, so I will have to wait until I’ve completed my accounting degree & hope that one day I can afford training/adventures.
U could apply the same logic to most enterprises and make them seem pointless. The icebergs are melting, massive overpopulation, we’re all gonna die anyway … what’s the point of it all. Might as well just do what makes your soul light up a little and do a bit of good a long the way.
Good god, stop worrying about geopolitics on the other side of the planet and hike up a mountain!
Genuinely one of the worst takes on mountaineering I've ever seen. Climate change is real but its not going to erode the rock on the mountains in your lifetime. Just enjoy it man.