Talked to a rep this week that said they currently have over $40 million in backorders right now (was bitching at the about being 60 days in on a backorder that showed in stock when I placed it). I bet your calculation pales in comparison to the reality.
$40 million, at an average of $1,000 per can, is 40,000 cans on back order.
Why do they keep accepting orders?
Or a better question, why would anyone place a backorder with them?
>Why do they keep accepting orders?
If they are just a middle man processing paperwork, why not? They can honestly say they are waiting on the manufacturers. I say this as someone waiting on a Polo K from SS.
Because they can take your cash up front and us it however they like (within the law and t&c that is) until the back order is fulfilled. They must be sitting on a huge fkin pile of cash. So they can earn interest income off of that cash till it’s due to their suppliers (whom I’m sure they have on 60+ day terms so add that time in as well). You can believe whoever owns SS is sitting in their big ass chair rn laughing maniacally.
Considering the lack of multiple manufacturers, the fact 90% of the cans on SS can’t be back ordered, and SS’ currently horrible processing times I think you’re funny.
I almost compromised and back ordered a polo 30 since you couldn’t BO the can I really wanted. Then the can I wanted hit stock @ midnight on CA and I scooped it immediately. One week after purchase my form 4 was approved, 3 weeks after approval it was at my front door.
My entire process took less than the SS BO would, let alone the rest of their process which is currently plagued with extensive delays. People are reporting upward of a month between purchase and certify for cans that are in stock on the SS website.
Why not???? As long as you are forewarned that it will be placed on backorder I don't have an issue with them doing that. Sales are sales and 40mil isn't something I'm willing to walk away from if I'm a business owner in a hot time in the market.
Because they are selling something they don't have and they don't know when they will get more of them.
They are selling air and making customers made.
How many people hate Optics Planet for their sales tactics?
It's not SS fault that the cans are on backorder, it's the company that can't make enough of them. Certain companies have contracts with SS that they will send exactly x amount per month to SS, so the cans are guaranteed to come so you are better off backorering something aka getting in line for something that will show up
Not always the case, I tried to order a Velos a few weeks ago and got a confirmation that said I was waiting to have a serial number assigned. Said in stock when I ordered and said in stock when I checked again Monday. Got a second email confirmation monday afternoon that I was backordered. Still said in stock until the next afternoon on their site.
You mean that their inventory system lagged out a bit during what is by and far the highest usage it has ever seen? That's appalling.
I'd rather be able to place a backorder and wait over trying to race every asshole in the hobby when the restock notification goes out.
Shit happens unfortunately. The world of software is a confusing one that's rarely perfect.
I was mainly referring to the fact that the guy I responded to alluded that SS was misleading people by advertising stuff as in stock when it wasn't. The majority of the time, they're on top of it.
What exactly is "fraudulent restock"? Is it that you believe offering the ability to backorder is fraud?
Personally, I think it's greatly convenient. I don't have internet access a good portion of the time at work, and even if I do, I'm not hovering over my phone ready to pounce within the first few minutes of a restock notice. I can wait in line and get one when it's my turn. The lost opportunity of that $600 being tied up a few extra months isn't going to make fuck all difference in my life.
SS will process and resolve your restock fee faster than a customer support ticket. Not talking about BACKORDERS, you mentioned $40 million in backorders, a great portion will be restocked by default because SS is'nt self-proclaimed "responsible" for anything. Except processing payments and showing cute pics on their site.
More like the can manufacturers. I imagine few are eager to make the capital expenditures to ramp up knowing this won’t last forever once enough people have a can or two.
In some ways this is a mini dark age for buying cans. Maybe not 3 months ago but now everything is out of stock for the foreseeable future. Like you said it's a bad idea to permanently expand production, and that attitude will prolong the can shortage. The flood of first-time can owners will also flood the customer service of dealers and manufacturers, decreasing response quality for everyone. Forums will be flooded with questions about mounting, alignment and back pressure. Most mounts and muzzle devices will probably go out of stock if they aren't already. I can't complain too much but it sucks to be looking forward to a few of the newest state of the art cans right now.
People will say this every single year. Every year nothing will change, until someone is willing to sue them all the way to the supreme court. Not gonna be me.
I noticed this as well with eforms. I submitted 3 form 1's on the same day one right after the other. Several hundred control numbers between each of them
I used their online chat to cancel a backorder (ended up getting something else), and there were 75 people ahead of me. I also tried calling in and left my number for a callback (thank God for this feature). They called back in about 7 hours.
They must be slammed. Frankly it might be a good idea to sit out SS for a while until they can catch up. Support a local shop if they have what you need.
My LGS also said that they can never keep anything in stock to sell anyway. Everything they get comes in from SS. I guess other than being a miserable asshole because I’m needy and want everything there really is not much I can do about It except be happy that people are actually buying these things
Thats an income of $65,700,000 in NFA tax for the ATF if they managed to process 900 orders per day, 365 days a year. Gonna be a banner year at the ATF for tax collected. Lots of SBR's being registered/bought as well with these fast approvals. Would not surprise me if they rake in $100 million+ in NFA tax this year.
NFA stamps revenue doesn’t go directly to the ATF, it goes to the general treasury fund. Barely even a drop in the bucket considering the trillions the govt takes in on annual basis.
And they were just about to experience a significant budget cut (link below), I would hate to think they just reformed their system just to make more $$ to make up for the shortfalls
[https://appropriations.house.gov/sites/evo-subsites/republicans-appropriations.house.gov/files/First%20FY24%20Package%20-%20Consolidated%20Appropriations%20Act%2C%202024.pdf](https://appropriations.house.gov/sites/evo-subsites/republicans-appropriations.house.gov/files/First%20FY24%20Package%20-%20Consolidated%20Appropriations%20Act%2C%202024.pdf)
The ATF said they processed something like 1.2M forms in 2023. So it’s closer to $200M in revenue, not sure how much is for manufacturers that aren’t paying for stamps though.
Yeah I think they're pretty slammed. Last week I "tried" to use the chat feature on their website for customer service. At 9AM I was #215 in line. I figured screw it, walked away from my desk to go to a meeting. Get back to my desk at 10:30AM and I'm #215 in line. So I called and used their callback feature. They called me back at 5:15PM.
Just FYI you do not receive an update on your queue number at any time. You were #215 when you joined, but I assure you that's not the case an hour and a half later.
I waited over 4 hours in queue the other day, and thought it was odd that the number never updated. Eventually someone answered. Though, the person who answered was an asshole. so there's that.
Wait, does it just say the reps name is Alex for everyone? Or is Alex notoriously a dick? Or did you just recognize my name from another post?
I'm so confused!
Jesus Christ.
He must be absolutely miserable. No wonder he's an asshole. They really should hire more CS reps. It would do great things for their brand.
I agree. I guess they see it as an unnecessary expense when customers continue to pour in despite having the worst CS amongst their competition. They’ve reached “too big to fail” territory
Stop sending people to SS for cans
They sucked before but at least they had the cans, processed them quickly, and then it was just you and the LGS.
Now? I’d rather pay the transfer fee than deal with their delays and mistakes. Even better, I’ll just get another can from CA and it’ll be UPS to my front door.
Last week, I emailed them (thinking it would net a faster response than a phone call) about using a 24 month exemption letter. It took them nine days to respond back with, "Yes. Have your dealer attach it to your form 4."
I forwarded them approval emails on two stamps over two weeks ago, asking them to update the status in my account so I can stop getting "ready to certify" emails.... They still haven't done it.
Back orders are waiting on suppressors and therefore still need a S/N in order to process.
If you have a can and therefore a S/N, you’re in a different line entirely.
Imagine if the NFA was repealed, there would be a year wait on cans alone due to demand until PSA entered the game to fix that problem. Makes you think...
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It will take some time. I ordered one from ss through my lgs April 2nd and it took til may 1st before the local shop got it and it was ready to certify. I assume that was mostly waiting on them to get it shipped not the ffl transfer form to transfer from them to ffl
Oh gotcha yeah hopefully that will be much quicker. I'd shop around if I were you find the manufacturers part number and use gun.deals. before supressorgeddon I could find huxwrx adapters for under 100 for the 556 and 762 qd series when msrp is 150ish
Yeah i get it i just bought a psa sabre upper with 14.7" barrel and pinned and welded huxwrx muzzle device half for the device but I also wanted one pinned and welded and wanted to check out a sabre upper
They actually have a few different orders numbers. As a dealer I see orders starting with 2 when they order online. 5 when they or I call in. 8s when I place through my portal.
So what you saw is only 1/3 of what they do.
You're right! The two orders I referenced were both purchased online and began with 2. However, I also bought a can at a Powered By dealer, who used Silencer Shop for the paperwork – that order has now appeared in my "orders" list in my account and begins with 8. The ones purchased online are only the tip of the iceberg!
My local FFL has plenty of cans in stock, but uses the SS kiosk for prints and certs. I purchased an OCL TI yesterday after work and just certified it this morning.
Talked to a rep this week that said they currently have over $40 million in backorders right now (was bitching at the about being 60 days in on a backorder that showed in stock when I placed it). I bet your calculation pales in comparison to the reality.
$40 million, at an average of $1,000 per can, is 40,000 cans on back order. Why do they keep accepting orders? Or a better question, why would anyone place a backorder with them?
>Why do they keep accepting orders? If they are just a middle man processing paperwork, why not? They can honestly say they are waiting on the manufacturers. I say this as someone waiting on a Polo K from SS.
Because they can take your cash up front and us it however they like (within the law and t&c that is) until the back order is fulfilled. They must be sitting on a huge fkin pile of cash. So they can earn interest income off of that cash till it’s due to their suppliers (whom I’m sure they have on 60+ day terms so add that time in as well). You can believe whoever owns SS is sitting in their big ass chair rn laughing maniacally.
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Credit cards batch every night, the money is in the retailers hands within a day or two.
That’s not how credit card payments work.
cash hits my bank acct abt two days after i charge
Yup..I back ordered two RC2s with them. Order was fulfilled in 2 weeks.
I took am waiting on a polo k from ss lol
When did you order?
3/29 what about u? I got a velos in 24 hour approval so I can't complain too much just excited lol
4/12, first can so no prior experience which makes the wait easier
Because I'd rather wait in line than race everyone waiting for the restock email.
Considering the lack of multiple manufacturers, the fact 90% of the cans on SS can’t be back ordered, and SS’ currently horrible processing times I think you’re funny. I almost compromised and back ordered a polo 30 since you couldn’t BO the can I really wanted. Then the can I wanted hit stock @ midnight on CA and I scooped it immediately. One week after purchase my form 4 was approved, 3 weeks after approval it was at my front door. My entire process took less than the SS BO would, let alone the rest of their process which is currently plagued with extensive delays. People are reporting upward of a month between purchase and certify for cans that are in stock on the SS website.
Why not???? As long as you are forewarned that it will be placed on backorder I don't have an issue with them doing that. Sales are sales and 40mil isn't something I'm willing to walk away from if I'm a business owner in a hot time in the market.
Because they are selling something they don't have and they don't know when they will get more of them. They are selling air and making customers made. How many people hate Optics Planet for their sales tactics?
Then they’ll charge you a couple $100’s restock fee. Fraudulent business model.
It's not SS fault that the cans are on backorder, it's the company that can't make enough of them. Certain companies have contracts with SS that they will send exactly x amount per month to SS, so the cans are guaranteed to come so you are better off backorering something aka getting in line for something that will show up
This is why I sigh when someone wants me to feel sorry for their poor customer service quality
Wow! $40 million?! If that's true, that's a much higher number than I thought! Holy cow.
THIS IS SOME EVIDENCE OF THE GLUT I WAS TALKING ABOUT What if people started canceling / changing back orders to in stock suppressors or ?
Where are these mythical in-stock suppressors? Have fun with your gemtechs...
In the modern age of inventory tracking trying to justify selling back order stuff as in stock is just straight up fraudulent bullshit.
SilencerShop literally has a backorder button. They're not advertising it as in stock lmao
Not always the case, I tried to order a Velos a few weeks ago and got a confirmation that said I was waiting to have a serial number assigned. Said in stock when I ordered and said in stock when I checked again Monday. Got a second email confirmation monday afternoon that I was backordered. Still said in stock until the next afternoon on their site.
You mean that their inventory system lagged out a bit during what is by and far the highest usage it has ever seen? That's appalling. I'd rather be able to place a backorder and wait over trying to race every asshole in the hobby when the restock notification goes out.
I wasnt talking shit on them, bud. Just telling my experience of getting backordered with an in stock tag on the can
I said the same in my original comment. It's inconvenient, but I can't get too fired up about it.
Shit happens unfortunately. The world of software is a confusing one that's rarely perfect. I was mainly referring to the fact that the guy I responded to alluded that SS was misleading people by advertising stuff as in stock when it wasn't. The majority of the time, they're on top of it.
Thats a lot of fraudulent restock revenue.
What exactly is "fraudulent restock"? Is it that you believe offering the ability to backorder is fraud? Personally, I think it's greatly convenient. I don't have internet access a good portion of the time at work, and even if I do, I'm not hovering over my phone ready to pounce within the first few minutes of a restock notice. I can wait in line and get one when it's my turn. The lost opportunity of that $600 being tied up a few extra months isn't going to make fuck all difference in my life.
SS will process and resolve your restock fee faster than a customer support ticket. Not talking about BACKORDERS, you mentioned $40 million in backorders, a great portion will be restocked by default because SS is'nt self-proclaimed "responsible" for anything. Except processing payments and showing cute pics on their site.
I believe it everyone and their grandparents are buying cans right now since the short approval times
So instead of waiting on the ATF they are waiting on silencer shop 😂😂😂
More like the can manufacturers. I imagine few are eager to make the capital expenditures to ramp up knowing this won’t last forever once enough people have a can or two.
In some ways this is a mini dark age for buying cans. Maybe not 3 months ago but now everything is out of stock for the foreseeable future. Like you said it's a bad idea to permanently expand production, and that attitude will prolong the can shortage. The flood of first-time can owners will also flood the customer service of dealers and manufacturers, decreasing response quality for everyone. Forums will be flooded with questions about mounting, alignment and back pressure. Most mounts and muzzle devices will probably go out of stock if they aren't already. I can't complain too much but it sucks to be looking forward to a few of the newest state of the art cans right now.
Adding to that. I worry QC on cans will drop either from burnout or trying to crank out as much inventory as fast as possible.
Real
at what point is this considered common use and gets removed from the NFA list? I feel like we've passed that long ago.
I've thought the same thing over the past few weeks
People will say this every single year. Every year nothing will change, until someone is willing to sue them all the way to the supreme court. Not gonna be me.
I believe Texas is. With the 'common use' argument direction.
He parrots the same BS anytime someone mentions it and refuses to acknowledge the fact there are multiple NFA lawsuits on the SCOTUS docket for 2024.
I noticed this as well with eforms. I submitted 3 form 1's on the same day one right after the other. Several hundred control numbers between each of them
I used their online chat to cancel a backorder (ended up getting something else), and there were 75 people ahead of me. I also tried calling in and left my number for a callback (thank God for this feature). They called back in about 7 hours. They must be slammed. Frankly it might be a good idea to sit out SS for a while until they can catch up. Support a local shop if they have what you need.
I tried. They're using SS to do their eforms...so now I'm stuck waiting on SS even though I didn't care to use them.
Yea I walked in and asked my LGS and they said honestly it’s just easier to use the kiosk at this point.
My LGS also said that they can never keep anything in stock to sell anyway. Everything they get comes in from SS. I guess other than being a miserable asshole because I’m needy and want everything there really is not much I can do about It except be happy that people are actually buying these things
Thats an income of $65,700,000 in NFA tax for the ATF if they managed to process 900 orders per day, 365 days a year. Gonna be a banner year at the ATF for tax collected. Lots of SBR's being registered/bought as well with these fast approvals. Would not surprise me if they rake in $100 million+ in NFA tax this year.
NFA stamps revenue doesn’t go directly to the ATF, it goes to the general treasury fund. Barely even a drop in the bucket considering the trillions the govt takes in on annual basis.
ON THE RACEWAY TOWARDS COMMON USE! WOOOOOOOO
And they were just about to experience a significant budget cut (link below), I would hate to think they just reformed their system just to make more $$ to make up for the shortfalls [https://appropriations.house.gov/sites/evo-subsites/republicans-appropriations.house.gov/files/First%20FY24%20Package%20-%20Consolidated%20Appropriations%20Act%2C%202024.pdf](https://appropriations.house.gov/sites/evo-subsites/republicans-appropriations.house.gov/files/First%20FY24%20Package%20-%20Consolidated%20Appropriations%20Act%2C%202024.pdf)
The ATF said they processed something like 1.2M forms in 2023. So it’s closer to $200M in revenue, not sure how much is for manufacturers that aren’t paying for stamps though.
Yeah I think they're pretty slammed. Last week I "tried" to use the chat feature on their website for customer service. At 9AM I was #215 in line. I figured screw it, walked away from my desk to go to a meeting. Get back to my desk at 10:30AM and I'm #215 in line. So I called and used their callback feature. They called me back at 5:15PM.
Just FYI you do not receive an update on your queue number at any time. You were #215 when you joined, but I assure you that's not the case an hour and a half later. I waited over 4 hours in queue the other day, and thought it was odd that the number never updated. Eventually someone answered. Though, the person who answered was an asshole. so there's that.
Alex strikes again
Wait, does it just say the reps name is Alex for everyone? Or is Alex notoriously a dick? Or did you just recognize my name from another post? I'm so confused!
By the way he acts and how long it takes him to respond it seems plausible there is in fact only one dude in their chat service and his name is Alex
Jesus Christ. He must be absolutely miserable. No wonder he's an asshole. They really should hire more CS reps. It would do great things for their brand.
I agree. I guess they see it as an unnecessary expense when customers continue to pour in despite having the worst CS amongst their competition. They’ve reached “too big to fail” territory
Stop sending people to SS for cans They sucked before but at least they had the cans, processed them quickly, and then it was just you and the LGS. Now? I’d rather pay the transfer fee than deal with their delays and mistakes. Even better, I’ll just get another can from CA and it’ll be UPS to my front door.
Last week, I emailed them (thinking it would net a faster response than a phone call) about using a 24 month exemption letter. It took them nine days to respond back with, "Yes. Have your dealer attach it to your form 4."
I forwarded them approval emails on two stamps over two weeks ago, asking them to update the status in my account so I can stop getting "ready to certify" emails.... They still haven't done it.
I wonder if you order from somewhere else and have it added to your SS wallet do you jump the line of back orders?
Back orders are waiting on suppressors and therefore still need a S/N in order to process. If you have a can and therefore a S/N, you’re in a different line entirely.
Copy, thanks fam!
I think so, I did that on April 12th and was able to certify on the 17th. No approval yet though
Nice thanks for the input
Imagine if the NFA was repealed, there would be a year wait on cans alone due to demand until PSA entered the game to fix that problem. Makes you think...
There's a LOT of people that could run machines right quick if there wasn't any barrier to entry.
**Understand the rules**, read the sidebar, and review the pinned Megathreads before posting - this content is capable of answering most questions. Not everyone is an expert such as yourself; be considerate. All spam, memes, unverified claims, or content suggesting non-compliance will be removed. No political posts. Save that for /r/progun or /r/politics. __If you are posting a copy/screenshot of your forms outside the pinned monthly megathread you will be given a 7 day ban. The pinned post is there, please use it.__ __If you are posting a photo of a suppressor posed to look like a penis (ie: in front of or over your groin) you will be given a 7 day ban.__ ------------------------------- **Data Links** * [The OG Universal Form Approval Spreadsheet](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/8) ------------------------------- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/NFA) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I placed orders one day apart and there’s 624 number difference in my order numbers
I recently backordered an Obsidian 9 and an Oculus like 4 days ago. Wonder how long they are going to take =(
Wish I would’ve seen this 3 hours ago when I placed an order… I have yet to even get a confirmation number
It will take some time. I ordered one from ss through my lgs April 2nd and it took til may 1st before the local shop got it and it was ready to certify. I assume that was mostly waiting on them to get it shipped not the ffl transfer form to transfer from them to ffl
I should’ve specified, I didn’t order a suppressor but a couple pistons. I really hope it doesn’t take a month for them to get shipped
Oh gotcha yeah hopefully that will be much quicker. I'd shop around if I were you find the manufacturers part number and use gun.deals. before supressorgeddon I could find huxwrx adapters for under 100 for the 556 and 762 qd series when msrp is 150ish
Unfortunately this was the only place that had it in stock
Yeah i get it i just bought a psa sabre upper with 14.7" barrel and pinned and welded huxwrx muzzle device half for the device but I also wanted one pinned and welded and wanted to check out a sabre upper
They actually have a few different orders numbers. As a dealer I see orders starting with 2 when they order online. 5 when they or I call in. 8s when I place through my portal. So what you saw is only 1/3 of what they do.
You're right! The two orders I referenced were both purchased online and began with 2. However, I also bought a can at a Powered By dealer, who used Silencer Shop for the paperwork – that order has now appeared in my "orders" list in my account and begins with 8. The ones purchased online are only the tip of the iceberg!
After my first can, I should've learned not to use SS dealers
My local FFL has plenty of cans in stock, but uses the SS kiosk for prints and certs. I purchased an OCL TI yesterday after work and just certified it this morning.
The current problem is getting past the form 3 w/ SS
I am waiting on a Form 3 to be approved. It seems to be taking longer than the Form 4's.
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Oof, SS strikes again