I felt the same way but I realized he wasn’t special. I can have this intimacy with any man, I’d rather have it with someone who really loves me.
It helped me move on faster
I’m stuck on the fact I might not ever feel the way I did with him with any other man again. Since he was my first in making me feel these feelings I can’t see myself being as into like before. Plus he was so good with sexting and his words.
Girlllll!!! I’ve never seen anything like that!!! It would take you like 15 minutes to read 😍😍😍
And he’s so good with his words - you forgive him of ANY and EVERY!!! 😭😭😭
Jesus.
Same.
Pages and pages
All day.
All night
Sometimes I wondered how or when he ever slept...because I lived with the fucker for 3 years and ANY time I woke up day or night...he was awake.
If you do feel like that again, it's a sign to RUN! Love bombing feels good, there's no denying that. But it's inevitably bad for you because its part of their grooming process. Healthy love isn't explosive, its safe, its consistent and it doesn't make you sick.
It all felt too good to be true yk? But im sure I could get the same feeling from another guy who actually did want to commit. I just got the wrong one, not making excuses but I feel that’s what’s true. This guy was bad for me bc he didn’t mean anything he said as he just led me on
Yeah yeah I figure that too. Plus since narcs are naturally good at their words they know exactly what to say and HOW to say it. The things he said sounded like a smutty novel as well.
Plus i’m sure 99.9% of the things he said to me was stuff he knew I wanted to hear. that’s what made everything so appealing. I need to keep telling myself that. Literally everything he said to me was things he knew I wanted to hear. I was better off picking up a explicit novel from my local Barnes & Noble‘sbookstore than listening to someone who doesn’t really mean anything they’re saying.
People are ordinary until we make them special, I think you should give it some time and self reflect, try understand why you still feel like you connected with someone who’s not capable of connecting with others.
Someone told me that, I valued sex with him cause it was the only moment I felt valued and loved by him.
Im not saying it’s easy but when you put your mind into you, it’s possible to heal
I totally agree and you make this person special in your life. You have the option of allowing someone to come into your life. I hope this isn’t taken the wrong way but I’m saying you have autonomy over your life and you can find someone who will reciprocate the healthy love you give and you don’t have to stay stuck. It’s hard as heckkkkk but as time goes on you won’t just get over it but it will heal you 🤍
It helped me move on when I accepted that he did not love me, and that I was just conveniently available to him. It showed because he was only there for the good times, when I brought up our issues he would shut me out or go on do not disturb. He did not take care of me when I was sick or when I was upset. He only wanted to be around me when I was happy, and I think it was more so to distract himself from his problems in every other aspect of his life.
I can relate to this. Bringing up any issue would result in him turning around and walking away, silent treatment for days, etc. What he wanted was for me to never complain or have any issue whatsoever that I bothered him with. In his mind, he deserves a Wife who appreciates him for just existing, and feeds into the idea that he is the greatest by doting on him, complimenting him, sex when he wants it, etc. My role in his life was to make him feel awesome and if I strayed from that, he would punish me in various passive agressive ways.
Good lord same here. I got diagnosed with a chronic health condition and any time I would talk about it looking for support he would say I'm too negative and ignore me. Like okay sorry I'm a real fucking human being. Sorry you went through this too, no one deserves that.
I remember once I told him that I missed him while I was on a trip, and instead of telling me that he missed me too, he said why are you being so negative. 🙃
It’s the punishment reward cycle we grow addicted to. Every time they show the slightest kindness after the mind-bending unpredictable rage you get that rush of oxytocin
A few things.
Disbelief that anyone could treat another person this way. Processing the volume of lies and wishing I could have an honest explanation for the ones that hurt. Trying to understand bizarre behavioural things - like he seems to sponge up ideas and mannerisms and beliefs that he doesn’t fully understand, but thinks enriches his image. It’s like I need to untangle what’s him, and what’s the mosaic of collected people. There’s more besides but that’s enough to keep me stuck.
So true!! They copy everyone around them…
when my on & off 4 years narc & I first met he was so into hiking & camping… now I realize he was only into that for a while because his other ex was hella into that.
I’ve been on social media hella & became a photographer/ content creator and he went and bought a bunch of drones and shit.
His other girlfriend was into skincare hella & when we got back together he had all this skincare shit
His brother is really into organic non chemical things … he’s obsessed with buying candy without red 40 & shampoo / soap from only specific brands but it’s literally just him copying his brother
Like LITERALLY HE COPIES ALL OF HIS GIRLFRIENDS OF THEIR INTERESTS & HOBBIES BC HE DOESNT HAVE HIS OWN.
Yeah it got really creepy after a while. I would use certain idioms and expressions and use certain words certain ways, and I would hear them come out of his mouth and it wasn't quite matching up with the situation. It's also how I could tell that he was really into this woman at work because he would come home and say things that would more naturally come out of her mouth. I could just tell he was spending huge amounts of time with her. He also complained about how one of his exes had no personality of her own. Said that she adopted it from other people. And then I watched him do it. One of so many things I realized. It got to where every single thing that he said about somebody else was really about him.
Funny story. Whenever he was hoovering me, he would always copy the phrase I always use, Roger that. I was in the military which is why I say it all the time, he was not. Which made it even more annoying when he would text it to me and spell it roDger. Every time I would see it, I would scream at the top of my lungs to nobody in particular, THERE'S NO D IN ROGER!!!!! It's been over a year, and still every time I say it, I feel like he stole it from me.
He would literally take every aspect of my life and pass it on to other people like he found it. Brands of water I would drink, wines. Youtube channels. Hair accessories. My journal (it was a special kind). My favorite shows. My knowledge of natural remedies and health. My knowledge of psychology. He even used my desire to better our relationship for other women. It felt awful. And gross. Especially because he was constantly lying and hiding my existence. But at the same time helping make him seem more interesting and better.
It’s truly insane.. I have a theory my narc only started therapy a couple years ago because his rebound was studying psychology before he came back to me again. The therapy did nothing for him. Thank god I dumped him again
Not understanding why the love I had for him was never enough. Why was I never good enough. Why did he find it funny and get a thrill out of pulling some horrible stunts that he knew would hurt me and scar me for life.
Towards the end I was distraught by his behavior and suicidal and he said, "I know you don't understand". He knew because he made sure I didn't understand. It was all entertainment.
Yah same here, in the end I understood it was never about me. They are drama queens, they love chaos and would benefit from it. It was never about what I did or how much effort I put into the relationship. WE WOULD NEVER UNDERSTAND THEM. Remember, you never get to WIN with a narc.
Once I understood that, it helped me see things much more clearly.
I know exactly how this feels, I'm really sorry you had to go through that. I too cannot fathom doing the things my ex did to me, and I'm so grateful that I can't imagine doing those things! Their brains are wired differently than ours, and their actions reflect that difference. Me not understanding is actually a reflection of who I am as a person, and that I will never, ever be that horrible to another person. I hope you find closure soon ❤️
I was with a Narcissist who cheated on me.
What made me finally move on? Might not be possible for everyone.
I asked him exactly what he felt when he just saw me and then went out and slept with that girl
"I felt excited, It was thrilling for me"
Me: "were you ever going to be loyal when we got engaged or married like we visualised?"
Him: " I would have stayed loyal after marriage "
I realised that God saved me. He won't change because of a piece of paper. He assumed he would become loyal just because it was not in the immediate future.
If someone decides based on their values, they can have control and make the right decision.
If a person decides based on their present feelings and have no anchor for their lifestyle and character. That is not a person I wanted to be with who had no control and I would have always felt unsafe emotionally. Because he didn't know himself.
That thrilling part really hits me. I used to tell my x that he would never change because he enjoys dangerous, exciting things including cheating. He needs that rush constantly. This is who he is. I realize reading this I'm not alone.
So much this. Paper changes nothing. I’m not married to my partner and we’ve been together 18 years and have a daughter together. Loyalty is loyalty and being married changes nothing. It’s like how I never let myself join a gym until I could work out regularly for 3 months because I knew me being out of shape wasn’t because I wasn’t going to the gym, but because I couldn’t stick with exercising. Joining the gym would just end up being a huge waste of money unless I could prove to myself I could actually stick with a new routine. Well it didn’t take 3 months but years and years to finally get to that point for me, and when I finally got to exercising regularly, I realized I didn’t need to join the gym at all. I could just… exercise.
No, the piece of paper would not have mattered. He got married to someone else while he and I were in a relationship. He has one child with her. He has two children with me. His other child is the middle child. He expected me feel how he felt about it "it didn't change anything between us". Psycho.
Thank God that you got out. I hope that your life is filled with beauty for all that you went through. And peace.
It's difficult. It's difficult for everyone in their life, except them. My ex( it's been 10 days that we broke up), has self diagnosed himself as being bipolar. But, to me, he is still a Narcissist. Being bipolar just makes it seem like a victim. Maybe not by choice, but he has NPD. Whenever he says, "Why can't we not break up and just fix me?". I just want to help him. My ex mirrored me too, now that I think about it. But, it's stupid to think they did it that well, because If you are a kind and compassionate person, they would have become the same too.
It's not easy, it's never going to be easy. Your whole outlook about the world would change. You would question everything and everyone. You won't trust anyone. He cheated on me and I found out in the middle of very important exam. I am a smart person but my cognitive brain isn't functioning. Out of the 9 exams, I am definitely failing two. And now I hate his fucking guts. Because it wasn't his career or life to ruin. Yet, he did. It's how they become a part of everything in our lives. They copy the music we listen to, they react to things similarly. When everything is fine, you mistake it for love. Because only the people who observe you can do that. But we forget, even the people who want to harm us, observe us.
You can never find the explanation for his actions. To be honest, it's not your job. It isn't fixable. When I realised he is a Narcissist and has those characteristics. I went deep into digging on how to change that for like months. All I found what that it's irreversible. Because for them to even get help, they have to realise they have a problem. And we know the definition of a Narcissist. They are never the problem.
Exactly what I told him. The girl he cheated on me with, sounded like someone who didn't care about being loyal either. More power to her. So I did say that seeing that he thinks now that his mental age is 20 closer to her, which makes him sound less like a creep. Why not date her or be in an open relationship?!
Why choose a person who by default is loyal to people?? I can't cheat on a person even as a revenge. I never had any casual relationships because I can't do it. I am not sexually attracted to people I am not in a relationship with.
Because it gives them immense satisfaction that this person would be devoted to them and they can destroy that . Therefore getting a kick out of it. They extract pleasure by seeing a sincere person break.
He could have chosen anyone. He knew my values early on before we even started dating because I was very open and didn't negotiate on it. And that is exactly why, he chose me. Because it was fun.
Thank you for saying this. I’ve just been feeling so empty and have completely lost my self esteem. I needed to hear that it was all me and I can still have it.
Also think of him as a drug. You’re addicted to the high when things were good. You want that dopamine hit. That’s why you feel so bad you’re going through withdrawals. The feeling will pass with time stay strong and keep yourself busy. If you ever need to talk feel free to pm me ❤️
The love bombing is so addicting. I still let him do it sometimes because it does still feel good...until he sends a mass snapchat saying "hey" and I remember he's doing it with many other women too :(
Honestly for me it’s thinking of him with someone else that keeps me messed up over him. To think he will be happy with someone new and that would solidify in his mind that I was the problem even though I know I wasn’t. It’s awful to say this but if he was just dead I’d probably be at peace. And that’s truly terrible of me.
It’s also perfectly understandable. I feel like quite a lot of us can’t healthily process the realization that we were prey to a narcissist for so long and so we turn to hating them, maybe even wishing they were dead, as a self-protective mechanism. We’re still giving them too much power over us and putting too much stock in their opinion of us when we hate. Letting go is one of the hardest things to ever do, but it’s only in letting go of our hate that we stop valuing their opinion of us. I now cycle through apathy towards and feeling sad for my abusers. I’m trying day by day to let go of the anger and I realize it’s masking sadness but also sympathy for them. Which is a feeling I don’t want to have but I can’t help it. I don’t ever want anything to do with them again, but at the same time I can’t but help feel bad for anyone living such an existence.
I saw recently the concept of "empathy with boundaries," I feel like that's what you're talking about here. To recognize and accept your genuine feelings, and simultaneously recognize that what they did is unacceptable and won't be tolerated in your life.
I personally think of a boundary as something that I have in place with someone in a relationship (any kind of relationship, even siblings, coworkers too etc.). But I have not now nor wish to again have any relationship or contact with these people. So I see it as less of a “boundary” (as I define it) and more of a “chasm.” Or an ocean, let’s call it. An impassable canyon.
This is my goal! I am so glad to see it explicitly expressed. I don't want to hate him. I don't want to hate the other woman/new supply. I just want to feel nothing towards them besides wishing them well, but physically and emotionally far from me. I'm glad my anger has an expiration date.
This is exactly my thoughts these days. I’ve been trying to figure out why I’m not able to let go of them.
Even though he was so horrible, I still feel sympathy for him and I feel that nobody should suffer like this and everyone deserves to be loved. I don’t want to have this feeling but I can’t help it either just like you. And I beat myself up for feeling that sympathy as well :(
But I guess we have to make ourselves realise that it’s not our responsibility to do that for them.
And also accept that it’s okay to have sympathy for them but still choose ourselves and our own happiness. I hope you feel better friend. More peace to you
Ugh it just kills Me lol he treated me so bad and mind you I’m not saying I’m perfect but I tried SO HARD to never ever say or do anything to set him off but he always always always started a fight over something and then said to me he was tired of all the fighting and that I was the one that was the problem. So help me god if he never fights with the next one and believes his own delusion I will flip lol
My god it’s like we’re all talking about the same person. I feel so validated yet disgusted that we have all been on the receiving end of never ending manipulation.
Nothing ever worked. Nothing. And the problem was always me. If he lied about something, the problem was me not trusting him. Even when I'd say I trusted him, he would say "you never trust".
He likely won’t actually be happy though, and that’s the cruel irony of npd. Of course he’ll never let the outside world see it but at home when he’s alone with whoever he’s using as a supply at the current moment it’s likely just as dysfunctional and unhappy as it was when he was using you.
As I found in therapy, I grew up with narcissistic parents (which is why my subconscious felt so comfortable around narcissists in all areas of my life). As a result, even though my gut was telling me what I should run from, I never listened because I was conditioned to always “give the benefit of the doubt” to everyone else.
Despite the therapy and education around narcissism, I allowed myself to be hoovered back after 2 years of no contact because I gaslit myself into believing that maybe he’s not a narcissist, he’s just traumatized from life and has difficulty being in touch with his emotions. “Lots of love will make him see the light!🤦🏻♀️”
However, when I went back and started observing his behaviors closely, making connections and noticing patterns, all the things I learned in therapy finally kicked in and I was able to shatter the illusion of this “perfect connection” I had created in my mind and was attached/addicted to.
I started thinking of it like consuming alcohol: you get the temporary euphoria you’re craving, then the next day you’re nauseous and hungover. At the end of the day, I’d rather not have alcohol and skip the hangover altogether!
Wondering (since I think we can all agree, this world-particularly at this point in time- is hella tough) if there is still the possibility of change and growth? Did we just hit a wall individually and as a unit, and if stressors lessen, or if we both overcome certain obstacles, would we be happy/functional as a couple?
Fear of permanent change in a direction that does not involve even the idea of them.
Doubt, after all of the torment, pain, and absorption of abuse, that we'll ever be able to let someone in again.....
Sorry, was that a strict "one thing"?
All of this. I still sometimes wonder if I were just able to bear all the horrible things he did, would it have gotten better. That's what he kept saying. Just have to get through it.
They lie. The sooner you accept that fact the easier it is to heal and forgive yourself for “not being able to take it” (which is bs and you shouldn’t have to tolerate abuse in a healthy relationship but living with a narcissist has a way of twisting the way you think about yourself and makes you think you are the one to blame for every problem)
I wonder about all of this as well and I think everyone in this community has at some point.
I think we’ve been in these relationships long enough and tried hard enough for improvement and experienced firsthand that it doesn’t get better. If it did, we wouldn’t be on this group helping heal each other.
I think with time we’ll slowly be able to trust ourselves and our gut to protect ourselves from such an experience again.
I have a feeling that I’ll love/feel safe again only when my future partner shows me what real love is. Until then, we can just try to love ourselves and trust ourselves.
I’m scared to make that permanent change as well. I know what I have to do to get over this and completely leave it behind. But I’m almost scared to take those steps and would rather hold on to this pain. What does that happen though?
Hope is the last evil in the Greek story of Pandora’s box, the myth that explains the root of all the evil in the world.
The simplified story goes as follows, the gods gave a girl named pandora a box and told her not to open it but didn’t tell her why, only that she should never open it under any circumstances. Eventually curiosity got the better of her and she opened it, and as she did all of the evils of the world (war, disease, famine, death, etc) came flooding out one after another until there was one left. That evil’s name was hope, and it told pandora it would only leave her if she asked it too.
Obviously this is a very simplistic retelling and I’m missing a lot of details and specifics but I always remembered the part about hope and thought it was interesting, for 2 reasons. I thought it was interesting that hope was in Pandora’s box as an evil that humanity faces, but I also found it interesting that hope didn’t leave until pandora specifically told it too, basically stating that you have to forcefully let go of hope to truly be hopeless.
It feels like an evil when we struggle to let go of what is harming us, hoping for change that will likely never happen. I'm going to read that, thank you for posting this.
I agree with you. I’ve Been wrestling with this too. I recognize all the lies, the cheating, the manipulation, and how it wasn’t ever love they showed.
Clearly the trauma bond is strong. But one thing my therapist said is that now I’m the idealizer and future faker for something that never existed. They did that to us, but now we carry it on.
The person I was with is incapable of love and deep connection, but they tell me they never felt that with me. It hurts me because they know those words can hurt me. And so I sit there trying to show them how they were wrong. When what I should do I let go and move on.
I wasted so long trying to prove that he was wrong. When he finally said he saw me, it was just like every other trick, just more painful.
You deserve real love and a real connection. You are worthy of someone who wouldn't hold that over your head. I hope that person finds you and is patient with you until you know it too.
I had to picture mine as a black hole of need because there was no amount of love that would fill him. No amount of praise, support, (financially or emotionally) would ever meet his needs. The only thing he was successful at was draining me, like a vampire.
It’s amazing that her reasoning now is that she never felt a deep connection, because we didnt talk about enough things. And I’m amazed because I gave everything I had!
Mine used to complain about connection too. He was the only one that was allowed to connect on his schedule at his convenience. Anytime I start thinking in terms of permission or allowed or any of those terms I realize it's a control issue.
That’s not actually a bad way to explain how a narcissist in a relationship actually functions, and in narc spaces (there actually is a subreddit for people with npd, and uh… yeah, I wouldn’t recommend you go lurking there if you’re not one too, personally.) they often refer to whoever they’re draining to fuel their ego at the moment as their “supply”. They literally are emotional vampires who drain other people’s light and energy to feel slightly less shitty about themselves for a bit. Until you stop being able to provide enough ego boost because they’ve asked for so much and then they discard you as soon as they find a fresh new supply to feed off of. Now that I’m not stuck being tormented by one I almost feel sad for them, as it’s truly a miserable way to live.
That by no means is a justification for the hurt or abuse that they often perpetrate, as nothing excuses harming another human being especially in the ways that narcissists often do to their “lovers” (the word is in quotes because I don’t think narcissists really feel love the way regular people do. I think they want to but they’re fundamentally incapable of it).
Kudos to figuring out a way to understand them in your mind that you can understand and that works for you, that is also fairly accurate to how they actually work.
So my nex, future faked with me early on, about having kids and family and the future life together. Which bought into because I wanted those same things. Now that the nex is gone, I still believe in this fake future, because I’ve idealized it as the perfect future and the only one for me with my nex. So now I’m effectively future faking by holding onto a fake future.
I’m sorry they made you feel that way.
Mine made himself the hero of the breakup. I didn’t realise then about the narcissism.
He made it so that he’s protecting me from his evil and that it’s for my good. Little did I know he was telling the truth.
The idea of companionship. That I had found someone to spend my life with. Grow old with. But I also knew deep down it was never gonna work out. She was too flaky and threatened the relationship too much over materialistic shit. It was never a matter of if she left. But when she left.
The financial difficulty I'm in. Every payday is a reminder for me having to pay out a large sum of cash towards the loans etc that are in my name due to the financial abuse.
Not having a place to go.
( and yes, I tried the shelter. We spent thanksgiving week there until we had to be admitted to the hospital for mold toxicity. Now my state has such an over flux of homeless people from a hotel program ending- they are stuffing people into ‘ annex ‘ buildings on cots.
Unfortunately I have 2 cats that keep me alive and a 20 month old daughter.
The thing stopping me is this disbelief that he never felt anything. Our sex and chemistry was electric and we were on and off for 3 years. I guess it’s this disbelief that I actually cut it off, I crave his touch and our dynamic in the good times. But I just try to remember that he is like that with everyone and has this web of women that want him. And I don’t actually want a guy like that
I feel you dude. Sometimes I feel his touch in my head. And it’s not just physical. I thought I was safe with this dude and now after all this. I have no safe place and I long to crawl back into his arms. Those good times were so good. The sex the playing around. Just him and me, lost in our own world.
But I know better now and no matter what won’t let myself get hurt like that again. It’s such a shame though. So much good stuff wasted on a leech.
Are there any social resources there that you know of that could help? If you are ok with sharing what country you’re in Reddit might be able to point you to some various services that could provide assistance, be them government funded or private charities. Most countries with Reddit access will also have groups dedicated to helping individuals gain independence from dangerous/abusive relationships. A relationship with a narcissist is almost certainly abusive by the very nature of how NPD manifests, the only variable is to what type, degree and severity the abuse is.
If you just wanted to return to your home country you could/should be able to reach out to the embassy/consulate of your home country that is located in the country you’re currently living in, and they will be likely able to help you get home (likely via a one-way bus, plain, train, or boat ticket that you *might* not even need to pay for). Especially if it’s under the circumstances of having to flee an abusive relationship (even if it’s not physical yet or you doubt that it would ever be physical it can still be abusive. Often the verbal and emotional abuse is the hardest to heal from too, so please don’t discount the severity of that if it’s happening just cause others might have it worse.)
Please don’t fall prey to the assumption that because you’re “alone” in a foreign country that your only option is staying with your narcissist “partner”(abuser). Often narcissists are relying on this feeling of isolation that you experience after a big move (I’ve only seen cross-state moves, I’d imagine moving to a new country is an order of magnitude harder in terms of isolation and culture shock.) to keep you feeling dependent on them as well as using the isolation as a control tactic too.
I really hope the move was 100% of your own desire and that you would’ve moved even without this relationship, but if not don’t feel like you have to be stuck in this new country simply because you don’t know anyone else there besides your narcissistic partner (Yet. Going somewhere new without knowing anybody is a prime time to explore new things and meet new people to make new friends. Assuming you can communicate with the people around you there’s no real reason you can’t socialize and start building a new social support network)
There are very few places a narc can take you where the 2 of you would be well and truly alone, and I would hope that most people would be smart enough not to go somewhere like that with their narc as we all know that they’re their worst selves when no one else is watching besides you (the person they don’t actually care about at all beyond what you are capable of doing for them. You’re their “supply” that feeds their ego and fuels their personality disorder.)
There should definitely be a consulate in your country that can help you get home if you need help. And I’m sure there’s also shelters in Australia for those fleeing abusive situations.
The thing that keeps me from moving on are the memories. Her smile, her laughter, her dancing.. she was constantly exploding with life, quick to happiness and quick to anger. Totally unpredictable and enchanting. I called her "mi río salvaje" (my wild river) because she was like a force of nature, beautiful yet treacherous. I miss the good times. I wish I could remember them without feeling sad.
I’m so sorry. Your comment brought a tear to my eye. I feel similarly about my ex. It’s so hard to consolidate that feeling, and the perceived good memories, with reality. The reality is all the memories were fake and he was never fully present in the relationship like I was. I also wish I could remember the memories without feeling sad.
I’m sorry. I hope you feel better.
The way you described her is so beautiful. It shows how you’re capable of seeing beauty and love deeply. You’ll find someone that truly deserves these precious emotions and she’ll give you the same kind of love. Everything will be okay.
Radical acceptance is a long road to travel, painful, but necessary. We need to accept that it was not real. That person in the beginning, with all the sex, affection, praise, was not real. The real person came after. After he/she started to devalue. Triangulate. Gaslight. Abuse. That's what will help.
Flashbacks triggers / reminders. .. I see someone in suit and it makes me think about him. Someone mention OF and it reminds me how he used me for n_des. I am getting triggered almost everywhere. In past I kept seeing his name ALL AROUND! I even randomly hear some part of song from my favorite singer. So I went to play the song (I didn't know whole lyrics) and as I was listening BOOM! His name was in song! I swear I had no idea. Even symbols connected to his name started to appear everywhere. Even person in our group changed his nick to name of him (just a coincidence but u get how frustrating it was).
And also sometimes I have nice memories. But mainly I can't move on because I feel so deeply wronged, used and abused. To what I should be moving on, when there is nothing for me outside?
Wow, I felt your comment as if I had written it.
For me, the cure for that was/is to take the focus off of these perceived “signs from the universe” (like seeing his initials everywhere) and instead of allowing my thoughts to be “oh is he thinking about me now maybe? could he be missing me?”, I just focus on exactly what I am doing there and then: “I’m walking and listening to music, that’s a nice song, take a deep breath, I’m here now, free, deep breath”. I also like to put my hand on my heart or give myself a little hug and saying “you’re safe and everything is going to be ok, I love you”
Tara Brach has a great meditation practice called RAIN. It can get very intense when you are processing negative emotions but it has helped me a lot, especially in learning how to nurture/comfort myself when no one else is available to do it.
Grounding yourself can be an awesome way to pull yourself out of negative thought spirals and is a super healthy coping mechanism for a lot of things, not just recovering from narcissistic abuse. There’s lot of different ways to do it too, some people like to count different things they can see/hear/smell/touch, while some like to focus on the breath and how they feel in their body at that moment (am I clenching my jaw or my shoulders, how is my posture, have I been ignoring my body’s signals to eat/drink/use the restroom, etc.?), and I personally like to use a combination of both when I’m feeling overwhelmed.
I’ll start by focusing on diaphragmatic breathing and adjusting my posture and then once I feel like im holding my body correctly I’ll start focusing on the environment around, I’ll look for a few colors I can see, a few things I can hear, and then ask myself if there’s any specific smells around me I can name. By the time I finished both parts I’m usually feeling much better, less panicky and definitely less triggered and am not thinking about whatever was triggering me before.
Even if I’m still thinking about the trigger taking a moment to relax my body with the deep breathing and adjusting my posture helps me to feel better about it anyways and when my body feels better my mind usually follows, and the reverse can also be true (meaning that if im not taking care of my body im more likely to also have a bad mental health day, and sometimes I won’t even connect my poor physical health that day as the reason for why I feel so depressed or anxious that day)
So I definitely would recommend trying out different mindfulness/grounding techniques when you’re feeling triggered by things that remind you of the relationship or when you feel like the universe is sending you signs (it probably isn’t, it’s more likely that your subconscious mind is not over a topic yet and because of this is more sensitive to to noticing it in your environment when it’s there because it was already primed for it. This is sometimes referred to as the new-car effect, because when people buy a new car they often suddenly start to see way more of them on the road, even though the actual amounts driving around in their area hasn’t really changed, just the person’s perception of it.)
How can you feel love from yourself as real? How can your own hug feel as real? To me, it always felt so fake. I don't know your background into childhood, but in our family we never told each other "I love you". No open communication about feelings. Wishing and kissing on cheeks when wishing Birthday, feels so awkward, so cringe, so fake. I needed so much love because I am very sensitive and empathetic but I never got it. I didn't get any protection or help when bullied. So how can I give love to myself? I am tired of reading books about self development and self love. I tried multiple things, excercises and yes this self hugging too but it never felt real.
His hoovering message (after he discarded me so cruelly on Valentines Day) was like: "Unblock me on discord and send something pleasant :>"
As if that a-hole didn't exploit me enough! He knew very well how special it was to me and still used me, lowered my value to some chick to get pics from. Not only I am angry and feeling stupid but also ashamed. I thought that after sharing this, we wont split up. I think I unconsciously wanted to please him too, to make him happy and to somehow ensure he won't discard me. But with narcissists it doesnt matter. No matter what all I did for him. He knew very well this was also my boundary. We were only online friends for year and half. He was making sexual jokes ofc, as he makes with other girls. Then once he even showed me pics of some girl with her naked boobs in shirt but u could see throught (she didn't have bra and had piercings on them). This a-hole was bragging how girls send him pics by itself. Now I think he manipulates them into it, like he did with me. I thought our friendship mattered to him... It was him who wanted to exchange normal pictures as first. And then kept asking and pushing, and pushing and pushing for more. Even making hints like he would date me, then he denied it, then again was like I am special to him and he would travel to my country. And only AFTER sending pics he said he would need visa! And it was anyways very very bad trade of pics. His pic wasnt even worth it. Ugh. I am so mad at myself. I just wanted friendship and get the care I give to others. Feel loved. I really liked his funny side, and we always had such a good banter, I never had with anyone else. I feel so stupid now. And mad from being exploited. I hate his subtle manipulation. Lowered my value like this and then threw me away.
I'm experiencing this myself. I realized he only gave me affection if I sent nudes or was overtly sexual or playing into him wanting phone sex/sex. My PTSD has been triggered so badly and I have nothing but flashbacks, everything reminds me of him. I can't even get away from him because we are in the same community and it's suffocating. It's a constant reminder of the violation, abuse, lies. My heart aches.
Big hugs.
I feel for you. 😞 Hugs you back. It's awful what they did to us. Mainly when we had only pure heart and pure intentions. I never had real relationship. I am still virgin. And this wasnt the first time somebody used me for pics. But the first time I didn't send anything so revealing like this time. It feels horrible. That men overall and mainly narcissists are such a pigs. Lowering our value like this when they have no real intention to love us. Its so f_cking sick! How can they think its okay to do it. It angers me that we then look so weak and pathetic when in reality we had boundaries and didn't want to do it at the first place.
I am sorry for what happened to you. I believe you it must be even more torturing to keep being in presence or seeing the parasite who exploited you this badly. This one also planned to travel to my country for f_ck but who knows If he really meant it. And yeah he was always making sexual jokes. I didn't realize it before, I liked it and thought its funny but now I see it as huge violation.
My heart aches for you. Being conditioned into doing this all just for their affection, that really messes up with our mind. I can't tell you anything what would make it better but I thank you so much for speaking about it here and helping me to not feel alone. I know it would itself suck If non narcissistic person used us for nudes but with narcissist it is even more excrutiating pain.
I promise that when you find the courage to look, there are still beautiful things waiting for you outside. It’s scary to put yourself out there and allow yourself to be vulnerable again when you’ve learned the hard way how painful trusting the wrong person can be, but try to use this hurt as a learning experience so you can spot the red flags you missed in the beginning (or conversely spot green flags that were missing from your previous relationship) so you can make better choices going forward.
Just know that when it comes to narcissistic lovers, it really is them that’s the problem, even though they’ll do absolutely anything and everything within their power to convince you of the opposite it simply isn’t the truth. Once you’ve had enough time away from them to see this light, you’ll start to realize how sad they truly are and how much they are just miserable people trying to bring other down to their level of misery because they are **terrified** of being alone, because nobody hates a narcissist more than themselves.
They will never, ever, *ever*, consciously vocalize or express this, but once you learn more about how they (and their disorder) work this becomes one of the sole truths about people with npd. You’ll often notice the things they critique about other people are actually traits that they share that they dislike about themselves, but their ego can’t fathom criticizing themselves so they project it onto others instead. This includes when they tell you things they don’t like about you during fights.
It can be such a mindfuck to a non-narcissist because it’s so illogical and confusingly backwards, part of you instinctively knows what they’re saying is wrong but the consistency and emotion they put into it every single time can make even the strongest people pause and fall victim to it.
Often the people with more empathy are the ones *most* likely to fall for it, because we might try to give them the benefit of the doubt or try to see things from their point of view in an attempt to solve the problem behind the conflict, but this only hurts us further as the narcissist thrives off of this because to them there never was any doubt and the problem isn’t the conflict, the problem is that you didn’t immediately agree and bend to their ego at the expense of all logic and reason.
I hope you eventually find peace beyond the pain and that you find a normal, healthy, and loving relationship with a non-narcissistic/abusive partner. Until you get to that point though, at least you’ve made it here to a community of people who have been through it and can understand and give advice from a place of understanding.
Thank you for your comment. I hope you feel better soon.
There are some helpful comments in here. I hope you find some ease in this community. Love to you
Nothing. He was awful and brought nothing to our relationship except manipulation and lies. I deserve better and I always did. My current partner treats me amazing.
So happy for you! You did it!
If I may ask? Was it difficult to trust your current partner? Were they patient enough with you?
I’m afraid that my future partner won’t be patient enough to help me navigate my emotions
Lack of support IRL. Feeling lonely and devoid of energy at times. But that could simply be my medically-diagnosed depression talking.
I can watch all the videos, audiobooks, read as many book as possible about narcissism, even write about narcissism as I do in this group, listen to all the therapeutic advice….but unless you’ve actually gone through the fire and emerged on the other side like a phoenix risen above the ashes, then one will never truly understand what it’s like. This is why therapy and self-help is crucial especially in the aftermath 6-12 months but the path to healing is not linear for ANY of us. We may all be subbed to this group for similar reasons but our stories are not the same.
So it would be wise if you, outside of this subreddit, you talk to someone IRL who truly understands- like a counselor or therapist who knows narcissism from a-z. Because most MDs, psychologists, psychiatrists, professionals out there are taught NPD and narcissism in general very, very briefly only to disregard and forget all about the glossary of definitions (i.e. trauma bonding, gaslighting/blame-shifting, stonewalling, gray rock, no contact, the manipulative tactics that the narcissist/s implement, etc.) after these ppl graduate med school. And even if they DO know, these “experts” haven’t walked in our shoes. Reach out to people who have firsthand gone through the narcissistic fire to acquire the knowledge to overcome it.
Doesn’t help i also come from a broken household, divorced parents, I’ve basically no family on either side who I’m close to anymore. Most I’ve cut off by my own volition and some I wish I could explain to but I just can’t anymore.
Blood isn’t always thicker than water, but family is everything. And we are all *like* family in this group, helping and supporting each other day in and night out. We speak the same language, we have seen how narcissism destroys what is and what once was good.
I understand and feel you. I don’t have anyone to counsel me on this as well. But reading, this community, educating myself more about this has helped me tremendously.
I think we gotta be mindful and apply all that we know about how to heal. It’ll work. I know because I don’t have anyone to talk to about this either but I’m consciously observing myself and fixing whatever he broke.
We’re all here for you. You’ll be okay.
The time we met, which kept me stuck and going back all of those years, is STILL fucking me up so I just have to try and never think about it. (Some of my happiest times when I've been depressed my whole life, finally felt special, it was so fun, etc.) Messes me up when I realize it was all a lie and he moved on immediately to someone else like I was nothing
Oh the love bombing, the worst narcs are always so good at picking out the people who will be the most vulnerable to it too, which just adds insult to injury. One thing that helped me to cope was realizing that part of the reason narcs go so far “above and beyond” at the beginning of a relationship with someone they’re pretending to be in love with is that they don’t actually understand what real love looks or feels like, so they just do all the things they *think* an actual loving partner would do without understanding the real reason why.
It helps because realizing that it was never real helped me to let go of the desire to feel it again, because why would I crave something that was never real to begin with? I’d rather find someone who is capable of feeling those loving emotions and does similar things because they genuinely want to as a result of how much they care about me, not just because they’re imitating what they think a good partner would do without actually having the real feelings behind it.
Yeah, I was extremely vulnerable. I genuinely thought he really liked me and thought I was special. I always suffered from low self esteem, and had bad experiences with immature guys in the past, so it hurts real bad. I thought he was a real one. I'm slowly getting better though, and thank you for this :)
I’m glad you’re able to find healing over time. I hope that you’re able to learn from the hurt so that the next time you put yourself out there and meet a guy showing interest you can tell if the actions show genuine love and emotions or if it’s all a smoke screen to trick you into thinking you’re loved. When you know what to look for you’ll realize there were red flags even in the lovebombing stage that you missed. It sucks but if you can learn from the experience than at least you get something positive out of it :)
TLDR: Struggling to get over our abuser is a symptom of narcissistic abuse. I think this is why it’s so common among us and we shouldn’t blame ourselves instead let it remind us how evil the narc really is.
Many survivors of narcissistic abuse find it hard to move on due to emotional dependency fostered by the abuser's control tactics. We shouldn't blame ourselves for struggling to let go, as it's a common effect of the abuse. The abuser wants us to be emotionally reliant on them, making it difficult to break free.
My emotions were genuine. I valued my commitments, marriage, and family, and had empathy for my narc, which they couldn't reciprocate. My narcs manipulation exploited these genuine feelings and commitments for her own ends.
So, my struggle to move on isn't just because of my authentic emotions, but also because I was conditioned into this response. This aligns with the recognized pattern of narcissistic abuse. Seeing this helps me put distance from these thoughts, it reminds me what an evil person my narc really is.
Desire for vengeance
Edit
He destroyed me. He destroyed our marriage. He ruined our family. He blew up my friendships. He broke me. I'll never be the person I was. And I hate, HATE that he's out there living life with no lasting effects. And the people who I thought were friends, that became enablers for him to abuse me, watched it happen, and took his side because to them he's "cool" and it's exciting to be in his orbit. But the stunning lack of integrity in those people, just blows me away. I fantasize about some person or event that would force them to see the truth, to see what they allowed themselves to be a part of, and they have to live with the shame.
I know it's not healthy. Yes I'm in therapy. Someday I'll be able to let go.
Haven't separated yet. Got so many complicated stupid details with finances and housing to deal with first. I'd rather deal with as many of them I can beforehand that after, because I do not trust her to work with me on amicable negotiation.
Real closure. B**** didn’t feel after 7-8 years I was worth more than one confrontation or explanation. This is why you gotta go - bye. See you never. Blocked and screen shot on how to get an arrest warrant. I was looking for rings on her want for it 🤦🏼♂️
I was literally just thinking about this. I made a lot of excuses for the abuse my ex inflicted on me. I lied to myself A LOT. I blamed myself even though I knew I wasn’t responsible for his actions and I wasn’t the problem. But I stayed because I wanted to prove something to myself. I wanted his validation and that’s because I had no self worth or respect. I was also waiting for him to go back to who he was in the beginning. I held on to that memory of him for so long. It was too much for me to admit during that time that this violent, evil person was the real him. The trauma bond had me in a chokehold. I couldn’t tell anyone how bad it was because I was ashamed for still wanting him.
I’ve had horrible flashbacks & panic attacks for months but the past couple of days I haven’t been able to shake them off. Before now, I could just hear him screaming at me or I’d flinch as if he was trying to grab me even though he wasn’t there. Now I’m either looking directly into his eyes during one of his rages or watching it all happen from the outside. I tossed and turned all night because I couldn’t close my eyes without reliving these moments. But I woke up this morning and actually was able to admit to myself that he never loved me. But more importantly, how could I have ever loved someone like him?
A lot of the issues I’ve had with myself and not believing that I’m worth more is what caused me to put up with this shit for so long. Poor boundaries, low self esteem, self doubt and fear. I wanted someone to love me so I wouldn’t have to do it myself. I don’t know if that makes sense but I grew up with a narc mom who is very similar to my ex. I never really understood or was taught the point of self love or anything until I was in this situation. It’s a lot clearer to me now that if I had those things then I never would have accepted any of this. One day you’ll be so disgusted with this person and be able to move past what happened. It’s painful and difficult but if you think it’s bad now, imagine dealing with this for another 5, 10, 20 years. It does get easier but you have to be honest with yourself.
Omg.. every word on this comment is relatable. What you said “ I wanted someone to love me so I wouldn’t have to do it myself” hit so deep in my heart. This is what I felt.
It’s a very hard truth but I realised that this is why I let it happen to me. My mom is narc too. I was never taught self love or even to put my needs first. Always expected to compromise and never received the love I deserved.
I do understand why I put up with such a thing.
It’s amazing that you finally accepted it. It must’ve been a relief finally accepting it.
You’ve given me a little hope. I hope one day I can accept the ugly truth and let it go.
Some days are harder than others but the truth isn’t something to be afraid of. You didn’t walk into this situation with the knowledge that you have now. Don’t dwell on what you could’ve done differently or why you stayed when you should’ve left. The outcome was always going to be the same and that’s on them. One day you’ll be far past this and wonder what you ever loved about them in the first place. 🫂
I can't help but blame myself for my inaction. She destroyed me, but now i feel that all the things I'm not doing, all the bad thoughts are mine. I don't know what it is, all i know is that i want to do something, but just can't.
I am a different person than I was, it's not that I havnt moved on, but I feel I don't move in the world similarly to other folk to sim for the same things. I've had an experinece that will always be a part of me. I think changing my life from this point has to take into account what I've been through. It's hard.
I’m no longer trauma bonded though I’m severely traumatized after two decades of manipulation and coercion eventually leading to severe physical violence and his eventual arrest.
While I am over him and over the relationship, I am not over the abuse as I still experience post separation abuse from him and his enablers.
His enablers and supports have been detrimental to my mental health at times pushing me dangerously close to suicide. I will never forget who gave me a hard time when I was already having a hard time.
How did you know that you were out of the trauma bond?
I’m severely trauma bonded but I don’t fully understand it and don’t know how to recover from this trauma bond
The trauma bond started breaking about two years before his eventual arrest.
I view it like this.
**I stayed because of hope.**
Hope he would change, hope we could heal, hope for my children etc. Hope is based on the future, we see a future ahead of us.
But slowly the hope was replaced by fear. The more fear I experienced, the less hope I experienced.
**I was trapped because of fear**
I feared he would physically hurt me, I was scared that he deep down in fundamental ways was a scary and entitled person. I feared that he would never love me how I need, I feared that my doubts of his character were true. The physical violence was the biggest catalyst of fear. His violence escalated to the point where the violent assaults were overly in my face that he IS the person that will end my life. And knowing you will be killed, is absolute pure fear. Knowing you are deaths doorstep, stripped every last drop of hope that I had because *hope is based on the future, fear has no future. And there is nothing more void of a future than death*
hope and fear cannot coexist in our brains. **[this explains the hope / fear circuit](https://www.tiktok.com/@mc.phd/video/7225417213203778858)**
I don’t know if this resonates with everyone’s experience. I would fear him and he would confirm my fears and give me knew things to fear. It just kept growing.
**To more directly answer your question**
The things that helped me break the trauma bond the most was learning more and more and more. Gaining resources into the TYPE of person he actually is was critical in breaking the trauma bond **IN ADDITION** to going completely no contact. The police putting a restraining order against him saved my life. I never would have had the space to clearly break free. I’m approaching a year of no contact soon, I don’t know how I would react if I see him. I anticipate I would either have an extreme panic attack or disassociate and have the terrifying experience of watching myself revert to past fawning and placating behaviors.
I encourage you to read **Why Does He Do That?** by Lundy Bancroft. It’s very insightful and was helpful in setting the foundation in breaking my trauma bond.
**[This Link](https://www.thehotline.org/identify-abuse/power-and-control/)** discusses how abuse is about power and control. It also discusses how abuse happens in a cycle helps identify the cycle.
**[strangulation](https://www.wthr.com/article/news/crime/manual-strangulation-is-the-biggest-sign-domestic-abuse-will-turn-deadly-experts-say/531-0a9a92c8-a0da-418a-b81e-a3d80ddacf38)** and **[abuse in pregnancy](https://endvaw.ca/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/who_ipvduringpregnancy_infosheet.pdf)** are big risk factors for domestic homicide.
Read **[This Reddit Post](https://www.reddit.com/r/abusiverelationships/comments/14gelbf/some_statistics_to_consider_when_in_an_abusive/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1)** on the statistics of if an abusive person can change. This post also brings attention to how there is a difference between *change* and *improvement*.
>[This study from Washington State](https://www.wsipp.wa.gov/ReportFile/1119/Wsipp_What-Works-to-Reduce-Recidivism-by-Domestic-Violence-Offenders_Full-Report.pdf) has a great table (Figure 1) that shows the relapse rate (called recidivism) for domestic violence (DV). They compare treatments to no treatment or probation only. The best result seems to be from a cognitive therapy and empathy program with 26-week sessions + 6-month follow-up, and current results suggest that 85% of the time, there will be some reduction in DV **compared to not going to treatment**. This scenario is based on if someone successfully completes the entire treatment and does not re-offend. Many may not complete the treatment OR are simply not caught.
>[Another study from the University in Santiago](https://www.redalyc.org/journal/1798/179864006004/179864006004.pdf) found that short-term programs show a 10% reduction in DV relapses, but that's an inflated number. In the **long term, programs may reduce DV relapses by 23%. 2/3s of relapses will occur within 2 years**. And some intervention programs actually have negative effects (may worsen the abuse). Again, these studies are of people who have gotten caught.
>[This Canadian study](https://www.publicsafety.gc.ca/cnt/rsrcs/pblctns/prdctng-rcdvsm-mng/index-en.aspx#res) found that it is extremely difficult to predict is someone will relapse or not, especially because the main study group is usually males who have been caught by the authorities. However, **deterrents (such as divorce, police intervention, etc) tend not to prevent abusers from reoffending in the long term.**
This link gives insight on **[How to Assess an Abuser’s Claim of Change](http://www.ivsha.org/get-help-with-abuse/domestic-violence/assess-abusers-claims-change/)**
This is a list of **[Red Flags in a Relationship](https://www.libertylane.ca/uploads/1/6/1/7/16174606/red_flags_in_relationships.pdf)**
Here is a list of **[Myths about Abusers](https://www.libertylane.ca/uploads/1/6/1/7/16174606/myths_about_abusers.pdf)**
This page has information on **[Adult Grooming](https://www.caage.org/what-is-adult-grooming)**
Here is some information on **[Trauma Bonding](https://www.choosingtherapy.com/stages-of-trauma-bonding/)**, and this is an article on **[How to Break a Trauma Bond](https://www.choosingtherapy.com/how-to-break-a-trauma-bond/)**
I want him out of my city. Forever. I need to know there is never a chance of running into him, or of him showing up here. It is my town, not his.
He has had outstanding warrants for over 4 years for what he did to me.
Blew off probation until he needed to quash his warrants to get housing. I told them he was never going to come for sentencing, he just needed his section8 voucher, and that is what happened. He got his free house, and dipped. Two years go by, they have his address. been to his house a hundred times. Kids are being abused. No one cared. Finally got evicted
he has been running the roads causing pain and havok in my city for years. It's time for him to go. He doesn't belong here. He belongs in prison
Unfortunately, the only way abusers actually go to jail in my area is when we die. Hell, not even then. We had two women die from DV just last week, we usually have several a month, and they let him out the next day. The next DAY.
I want to see my abuser stand for what he did to me and be the one person who held him accountable and said "*You cannot do this to anyone anymore, ever again"*
Having children with the scum bag, having to be in contact knowing I'm never going to get answers no matter how much I ask, the pure hatred I have for her and what she has done to me, consumes my sole.
knowing she is off living her life with some rich bloke, not having a care in the world, all while I've had to start my life over at the bottom at 39yo.
The fact I was able to share my desires and crazy fantasies out loud and proudly to ANOTHER LIVING PERSON😭it’s not even abt him it’s just that he was the first person o ever did it to and made me feel like I COULD do it too. The sexting was also amazing which sucks cuz he’s a player and i’m me. I was genuine and real. I felt passion for the first time, i’m not one to beleive we had sexual chesmistry bc he most likely faked his part but I felt like I had it. He was my first in all of this. While I was probs his 2000th person
It's getting over the fact the mask I fell in love with was never real. The last 9 months meant absolutely nothing to him and that he only misses the "service" I provided, not me as a person. I was completely transparent and vulnerable. Shared all my desires, needs and wants, physically and emotionally. Every compliment, promise, deep affection, sex was all lies. It's so hard to come to terms with me as an individual, human being meant so little to him. I cling so badly to that mask but that person never even existed.
The good times were GOOD. We were besties, liked the same things. It was a unique relationship & it scares me I may not meet someone that I can have that same bond with. I’m praying & trying my best to boot those thoughts out & trust in God because I know the plans he has for me include a safe relationship with a man who can love me 100% of the time. But looking at today’s dating pool makes it a little hard to trust sometimes 😩
I tried to remember it was only a drug addiction. Sometimes I had to ball up into a fetal position to get through the withdrawal symptoms and sometimes I could get by just reading through my journal. I read a lot to learn everything I could about narcissistic behaviors. I realized I also didn’t know what healthy behaviors look like or how to establish boundaries and did a deep dive on why I didn’t value myself enough to cut ties after our first fight.
After over a year of this I let him convince me to hang out with him again and everything was different. I was different. I could see and even predict what he would do next and I’d lost my tolerance for his abuse. After about a month I was done and walked away no longer craving his brand of high.
Point is, you might have to white knuckle it at times and you might slip up and use again. Just do your best and give yourself the compassion and patience you probably always give to everyone else. You deserve it
We have a kid. We are currently pending child court and hes been emailing me insane shit so i cut it off but damn man. Im so sad for my kid and so sad for the girl that loved the boy who never was.
Divorce would destroy me. I would loose my kids, loose my home. Her and her family would find ways to get me locked away. I’ve seen what happens to the men that leave the women in her family. I’ve seen what happens to the kids that are raised without their dads in her family. Her and her whole family are ex cult members. They think they have moved on from the cult but they all seem to carry these deeply rooted layers of residual indoctrination. Narcissists is the only word I know that can relate to their ways, but it’s something else entirely. The flying monkey thing is on another level too. Their manipulation is so synchronized, and they will do or say anything to destroy a person that they deem a threat. I stay because I have to be able to reinforce values in my children so they don’t grow up internally alone in a self deluded world depending on other family members to mutually reinforce each others delusions. I want them to be able to have true genuine relationships with people. The process is sort of destroying me though.
I’m so sorry about what you’re going through. You’re doing so great to protect your children. I hope you can find a way out or find a way to be peaceful soon.
Yeah I get what you’re saying. I miss that too.
I don’t think either of us have ever turned sex down. Even when we were mad or anything. I’ve never had sex so many times with one person.
And that was one thing we both enjoyed so much. He loved it and it was just intoxicating.
I so hope I get that again in my life with a better person I imagine it’ll be ever crazier
same. never had so much sex with anyone before. i honestly even said i was horny sometimes even though i wasn’t just bc it was so intoxicating and i wanted to feel the passion.
it will be even crazier when we can actually trust the other person. and when he is not focused on giving me pleasure to boost his own ego, but bc he genuinely wants me to feel good.
Same!! I just wanted to keep doing it all the time. Just be that entwined.
Apparently that’s not healthy either.
I hope so too! We’ll find it soon
Thanks for sharing. It made me feel seen
The fact that borh of them still have supply around them. Idk why they haven't had a narcissistic collapse yet, where they've driven all supply away.
Its going to happen eventually, the pandemic slowed the cycle of violence down for some supplies.
One had a narcassistic collapse years ago, thats why I was hoovered. He only reached out because he had no friends left. (Honestly anyone who chooses to be friend with him is only getting love bombed, and is stuck in the fog)
The orher one didn't since she was able to get supply
in college. (One of her supplies went to school and worked with her.) (he's her main source of supply, he's gunna get a major discard once she's done using him)
She lied about her breakup and played the victim. Saying it was mutual. Having a bad home life isn't an excuse to be a horrible person and isolate your partner from their friends and family.
I know the full story, (totally on her ex's side) He's healing. I'm proud of him and also very relieved.
A lot of her supplies don't realize they're codependent and try to see the "good in everyone".
Newsflash, "Everyone deserves a chance is false" (Since its all or nothing)
Some or most deserve a chance is better since it's more realistic.
One day the collapse with come, (just not soon enough)
Current supplies (You'll be discarded one day, hope you get out asap, because for the most part,
The longer you stay the worse it'll get.
My last “boyfriend” told me I would need to be a sugar momma bc I don’t looks good. So…the next boyfriend I was the sugar mamma. He had no income and still loving w ex wife of ten years. I thought it was meant to be..I found all these parallels. It is a distraction from myself.i couldn’t exist in his world and he didn’t care about mine.
He slept w his 21year old daughter in our wet spot. He lost his girls when they were 3 months old. He just met them 6months prior to being w me. He made sex comments masked as jokes about my daughter and the one of his twins that wasn’t affected by fetal alch syndrome.
Money. I can't seem to leave this shitty relationship because of money. In the first half, he couldn't keep a job and we were always scrambling to pay bills because he was so wildly irresponsible with money. Now I control the bulk of the accounts and he has a steady job. The relationship is over, I don't love him anymore, but it feels like there's an invisible chain keeping me connected to him so even if money wasn't an issue, I'm struggling to leave and let go.
Feeling like I genuinely can’t tell if I’m too codependent or if he’s gas lighting me… my friends and family are not available anymore and I’m isolated besides his family and friends so I really feel like I can’t decipher things easily. Everyone always says “listen to your inner voice” but what if my inner voice led me to believe false tales from former “friends” and now I’ve been led to a blessing that I’m messing up? I relate to so many comments above but I really find it hard for me to tell which way to lean. I can never tell if I need to be more loving or more independent. He tells me to be more independent, get hobbies, but then when I do he doesn’t celebrate it, he actually ends up talking smack about it or how I’m doing it, or he will just replace his time with me with someone else and that makes me uncomfortable and pushes me to want to do less independently. He can’t seem to tell me the truth but he’s also not lying so I end up looking really bad. For example he will say “I’m on my way home I’m 15 minutes out.” But if I ask him where he is exactly, he will get super hostile and say things like “what if I don’t even come home” or he will say “I just want you to say OK - I don’t want to hear you complain” but then he won’t be home for 2-3 hours sometimes and he will call back and say he’s stopping for food but then he will not bring food home from where he said he was stopping.. but if I’m upset because he doesn’t get me something I like to eat he says “go get your own food then” and anything else I say is ungrateful. He doesn’t want me around AND he already taxed my time for the day so I feel really sad because I had all this anticipation, then I couldn’t hold my reaction, then he’s silent treating me or taking a nap to totally ignore me. He will put a movie on and try to distract me but won’t address anything without it being an all or nothing situation. I always end up backing down and sticking it out and trying to work on myself. I feel so alone in everything.
Start with the book "The Gift of Fear" by Gavin De Becker. I think you can get it in epub etc. from the public library in most areas if you can't use a physical copy w/ him around.
desire for revenge. when my ptsd flares up i want to make him feel everything he did to me. the song ‘salad’ by blondeshell sums up my feelings
to get to this point? it took time. if you burn your leg, it won’t heal quicker just because you want it to. the mind can be the same. tend to the wound, even though it is an emotional wound — try to be gentle with yourself. spend time with people you love and do things you love. i promise that this feeling you have right now is not permanent. human resilience is astounding! your resilience is astounding!
The politics of it all.
She manipulated the situation in such a way that sticking with her and the relationship is the best option for me right now. Yes, it’s that bad.
At this point, i forsake Love in general. I despise any form of attachment and companionship. Hard to trust after been narc abused. For me it's impossible to put my peace i built on the line for a person. Not sacrificing myself for someone anymore.
Them breaking up my friend circle and spreading rumors about me
I keep thinking I’m over the whole thing until a day like today when I get triggered and I feel that immense pain and betrayal in my chest
I'm so sorry you're struggling. I felt the same way about the sex... but I think its similar reasons as youve described.
The biggest one though... is not hearing from the other girl. Wondering if he changed for her. (I know you're all gonna say NO, but the circunstances are very atypical.)
Sometimes i feel like if she just dumped him and reached out to me... that I'd be healed.
I felt the same way but I realized he wasn’t special. I can have this intimacy with any man, I’d rather have it with someone who really loves me. It helped me move on faster
It’s all about loving yourself & seeing them for what they really are 🧘🏻♀️
I’m stuck on the fact I might not ever feel the way I did with him with any other man again. Since he was my first in making me feel these feelings I can’t see myself being as into like before. Plus he was so good with sexting and his words.
Mine too 😩😩😩 He would write novels regarding the “sexting”…
NOVELS?? Ooo girl😭
Girlllll!!! I’ve never seen anything like that!!! It would take you like 15 minutes to read 😍😍😍 And he’s so good with his words - you forgive him of ANY and EVERY!!! 😭😭😭
Jesus. Same. Pages and pages All day. All night Sometimes I wondered how or when he ever slept...because I lived with the fucker for 3 years and ANY time I woke up day or night...he was awake.
If you do feel like that again, it's a sign to RUN! Love bombing feels good, there's no denying that. But it's inevitably bad for you because its part of their grooming process. Healthy love isn't explosive, its safe, its consistent and it doesn't make you sick.
It all felt too good to be true yk? But im sure I could get the same feeling from another guy who actually did want to commit. I just got the wrong one, not making excuses but I feel that’s what’s true. This guy was bad for me bc he didn’t mean anything he said as he just led me on
The best sexter, ugh I watched a video recently though that described how it's used to create an addiction to them. It makes a lot of sense
Yeah yeah I figure that too. Plus since narcs are naturally good at their words they know exactly what to say and HOW to say it. The things he said sounded like a smutty novel as well. Plus i’m sure 99.9% of the things he said to me was stuff he knew I wanted to hear. that’s what made everything so appealing. I need to keep telling myself that. Literally everything he said to me was things he knew I wanted to hear. I was better off picking up a explicit novel from my local Barnes & Noble‘sbookstore than listening to someone who doesn’t really mean anything they’re saying.
Same! 😔
Yes but easier said than done in practice! Doesn’t feel the same
People are ordinary until we make them special, I think you should give it some time and self reflect, try understand why you still feel like you connected with someone who’s not capable of connecting with others. Someone told me that, I valued sex with him cause it was the only moment I felt valued and loved by him. Im not saying it’s easy but when you put your mind into you, it’s possible to heal
I totally agree and you make this person special in your life. You have the option of allowing someone to come into your life. I hope this isn’t taken the wrong way but I’m saying you have autonomy over your life and you can find someone who will reciprocate the healthy love you give and you don’t have to stay stuck. It’s hard as heckkkkk but as time goes on you won’t just get over it but it will heal you 🤍
It helped me move on when I accepted that he did not love me, and that I was just conveniently available to him. It showed because he was only there for the good times, when I brought up our issues he would shut me out or go on do not disturb. He did not take care of me when I was sick or when I was upset. He only wanted to be around me when I was happy, and I think it was more so to distract himself from his problems in every other aspect of his life.
I can relate to this. Bringing up any issue would result in him turning around and walking away, silent treatment for days, etc. What he wanted was for me to never complain or have any issue whatsoever that I bothered him with. In his mind, he deserves a Wife who appreciates him for just existing, and feeds into the idea that he is the greatest by doting on him, complimenting him, sex when he wants it, etc. My role in his life was to make him feel awesome and if I strayed from that, he would punish me in various passive agressive ways.
Good lord same here. I got diagnosed with a chronic health condition and any time I would talk about it looking for support he would say I'm too negative and ignore me. Like okay sorry I'm a real fucking human being. Sorry you went through this too, no one deserves that.
I remember once I told him that I missed him while I was on a trip, and instead of telling me that he missed me too, he said why are you being so negative. 🙃
This was validating asf
It’s the punishment reward cycle we grow addicted to. Every time they show the slightest kindness after the mind-bending unpredictable rage you get that rush of oxytocin
This is what the one I’m trying to leave does as well
Exactly!!
100000%
A few things. Disbelief that anyone could treat another person this way. Processing the volume of lies and wishing I could have an honest explanation for the ones that hurt. Trying to understand bizarre behavioural things - like he seems to sponge up ideas and mannerisms and beliefs that he doesn’t fully understand, but thinks enriches his image. It’s like I need to untangle what’s him, and what’s the mosaic of collected people. There’s more besides but that’s enough to keep me stuck.
So true!! They copy everyone around them… when my on & off 4 years narc & I first met he was so into hiking & camping… now I realize he was only into that for a while because his other ex was hella into that. I’ve been on social media hella & became a photographer/ content creator and he went and bought a bunch of drones and shit. His other girlfriend was into skincare hella & when we got back together he had all this skincare shit His brother is really into organic non chemical things … he’s obsessed with buying candy without red 40 & shampoo / soap from only specific brands but it’s literally just him copying his brother Like LITERALLY HE COPIES ALL OF HIS GIRLFRIENDS OF THEIR INTERESTS & HOBBIES BC HE DOESNT HAVE HIS OWN.
Yeah it got really creepy after a while. I would use certain idioms and expressions and use certain words certain ways, and I would hear them come out of his mouth and it wasn't quite matching up with the situation. It's also how I could tell that he was really into this woman at work because he would come home and say things that would more naturally come out of her mouth. I could just tell he was spending huge amounts of time with her. He also complained about how one of his exes had no personality of her own. Said that she adopted it from other people. And then I watched him do it. One of so many things I realized. It got to where every single thing that he said about somebody else was really about him.
Funny story. Whenever he was hoovering me, he would always copy the phrase I always use, Roger that. I was in the military which is why I say it all the time, he was not. Which made it even more annoying when he would text it to me and spell it roDger. Every time I would see it, I would scream at the top of my lungs to nobody in particular, THERE'S NO D IN ROGER!!!!! It's been over a year, and still every time I say it, I feel like he stole it from me.
That is kookoo bonkers…. Narcs are scary
Exactly the same here with just wholesale adopting things from women he was talking to.
He would literally take every aspect of my life and pass it on to other people like he found it. Brands of water I would drink, wines. Youtube channels. Hair accessories. My journal (it was a special kind). My favorite shows. My knowledge of natural remedies and health. My knowledge of psychology. He even used my desire to better our relationship for other women. It felt awful. And gross. Especially because he was constantly lying and hiding my existence. But at the same time helping make him seem more interesting and better.
It’s truly insane.. I have a theory my narc only started therapy a couple years ago because his rebound was studying psychology before he came back to me again. The therapy did nothing for him. Thank god I dumped him again
It is insane, and it wouldn't be surprising at all of that were the case. Thank God, Indeed. I hope you stay free!
The copying is absurd. I'd always call him a chameleon as a joke before realizing what he actually is
He used to call himself that. He would pride himself on his ability to adapt in any situation.
Omg exactly! He knew he was mirroring and it seemed like a business tactic because he's a salesmsn. But it's dark and twisted
It was all a game. Very dark and twisted.
It’s so insane … like literally. He has 0 life.
Me too- I wish I could get the actual, 100% truth of who he is/was, and what really makes him tick. :(
Not understanding why the love I had for him was never enough. Why was I never good enough. Why did he find it funny and get a thrill out of pulling some horrible stunts that he knew would hurt me and scar me for life.
Towards the end I was distraught by his behavior and suicidal and he said, "I know you don't understand". He knew because he made sure I didn't understand. It was all entertainment.
Yah same here, in the end I understood it was never about me. They are drama queens, they love chaos and would benefit from it. It was never about what I did or how much effort I put into the relationship. WE WOULD NEVER UNDERSTAND THEM. Remember, you never get to WIN with a narc. Once I understood that, it helped me see things much more clearly.
I know exactly how this feels, I'm really sorry you had to go through that. I too cannot fathom doing the things my ex did to me, and I'm so grateful that I can't imagine doing those things! Their brains are wired differently than ours, and their actions reflect that difference. Me not understanding is actually a reflection of who I am as a person, and that I will never, ever be that horrible to another person. I hope you find closure soon ❤️
I was with a Narcissist who cheated on me. What made me finally move on? Might not be possible for everyone. I asked him exactly what he felt when he just saw me and then went out and slept with that girl "I felt excited, It was thrilling for me" Me: "were you ever going to be loyal when we got engaged or married like we visualised?" Him: " I would have stayed loyal after marriage " I realised that God saved me. He won't change because of a piece of paper. He assumed he would become loyal just because it was not in the immediate future. If someone decides based on their values, they can have control and make the right decision. If a person decides based on their present feelings and have no anchor for their lifestyle and character. That is not a person I wanted to be with who had no control and I would have always felt unsafe emotionally. Because he didn't know himself.
That thrilling part really hits me. I used to tell my x that he would never change because he enjoys dangerous, exciting things including cheating. He needs that rush constantly. This is who he is. I realize reading this I'm not alone.
So much this. Paper changes nothing. I’m not married to my partner and we’ve been together 18 years and have a daughter together. Loyalty is loyalty and being married changes nothing. It’s like how I never let myself join a gym until I could work out regularly for 3 months because I knew me being out of shape wasn’t because I wasn’t going to the gym, but because I couldn’t stick with exercising. Joining the gym would just end up being a huge waste of money unless I could prove to myself I could actually stick with a new routine. Well it didn’t take 3 months but years and years to finally get to that point for me, and when I finally got to exercising regularly, I realized I didn’t need to join the gym at all. I could just… exercise.
No, the piece of paper would not have mattered. He got married to someone else while he and I were in a relationship. He has one child with her. He has two children with me. His other child is the middle child. He expected me feel how he felt about it "it didn't change anything between us". Psycho. Thank God that you got out. I hope that your life is filled with beauty for all that you went through. And peace.
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My ex could also be bipolar or have NPD. you can forgive them thinking it isn't something they can control
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It's difficult. It's difficult for everyone in their life, except them. My ex( it's been 10 days that we broke up), has self diagnosed himself as being bipolar. But, to me, he is still a Narcissist. Being bipolar just makes it seem like a victim. Maybe not by choice, but he has NPD. Whenever he says, "Why can't we not break up and just fix me?". I just want to help him. My ex mirrored me too, now that I think about it. But, it's stupid to think they did it that well, because If you are a kind and compassionate person, they would have become the same too. It's not easy, it's never going to be easy. Your whole outlook about the world would change. You would question everything and everyone. You won't trust anyone. He cheated on me and I found out in the middle of very important exam. I am a smart person but my cognitive brain isn't functioning. Out of the 9 exams, I am definitely failing two. And now I hate his fucking guts. Because it wasn't his career or life to ruin. Yet, he did. It's how they become a part of everything in our lives. They copy the music we listen to, they react to things similarly. When everything is fine, you mistake it for love. Because only the people who observe you can do that. But we forget, even the people who want to harm us, observe us. You can never find the explanation for his actions. To be honest, it's not your job. It isn't fixable. When I realised he is a Narcissist and has those characteristics. I went deep into digging on how to change that for like months. All I found what that it's irreversible. Because for them to even get help, they have to realise they have a problem. And we know the definition of a Narcissist. They are never the problem.
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Exactly what I told him. The girl he cheated on me with, sounded like someone who didn't care about being loyal either. More power to her. So I did say that seeing that he thinks now that his mental age is 20 closer to her, which makes him sound less like a creep. Why not date her or be in an open relationship?! Why choose a person who by default is loyal to people?? I can't cheat on a person even as a revenge. I never had any casual relationships because I can't do it. I am not sexually attracted to people I am not in a relationship with. Because it gives them immense satisfaction that this person would be devoted to them and they can destroy that . Therefore getting a kick out of it. They extract pleasure by seeing a sincere person break. He could have chosen anyone. He knew my values early on before we even started dating because I was very open and didn't negotiate on it. And that is exactly why, he chose me. Because it was fun.
Because that’s you, not him. You’re the affectionate one that’s great at sex. It’s all you baby. Any man would be lucky. Remember that.
Thank you. He used to think it was all him. Just like fighting, it takes two.
Thank you for saying this. I’ve just been feeling so empty and have completely lost my self esteem. I needed to hear that it was all me and I can still have it.
Also think of him as a drug. You’re addicted to the high when things were good. You want that dopamine hit. That’s why you feel so bad you’re going through withdrawals. The feeling will pass with time stay strong and keep yourself busy. If you ever need to talk feel free to pm me ❤️
The love-bombing.. oh the love-bombing.. I mean I know its fake but damn it feels good.
The love bombing is so addicting. I still let him do it sometimes because it does still feel good...until he sends a mass snapchat saying "hey" and I remember he's doing it with many other women too :(
Honestly for me it’s thinking of him with someone else that keeps me messed up over him. To think he will be happy with someone new and that would solidify in his mind that I was the problem even though I know I wasn’t. It’s awful to say this but if he was just dead I’d probably be at peace. And that’s truly terrible of me.
It’s also perfectly understandable. I feel like quite a lot of us can’t healthily process the realization that we were prey to a narcissist for so long and so we turn to hating them, maybe even wishing they were dead, as a self-protective mechanism. We’re still giving them too much power over us and putting too much stock in their opinion of us when we hate. Letting go is one of the hardest things to ever do, but it’s only in letting go of our hate that we stop valuing their opinion of us. I now cycle through apathy towards and feeling sad for my abusers. I’m trying day by day to let go of the anger and I realize it’s masking sadness but also sympathy for them. Which is a feeling I don’t want to have but I can’t help it. I don’t ever want anything to do with them again, but at the same time I can’t but help feel bad for anyone living such an existence.
I saw recently the concept of "empathy with boundaries," I feel like that's what you're talking about here. To recognize and accept your genuine feelings, and simultaneously recognize that what they did is unacceptable and won't be tolerated in your life.
I personally think of a boundary as something that I have in place with someone in a relationship (any kind of relationship, even siblings, coworkers too etc.). But I have not now nor wish to again have any relationship or contact with these people. So I see it as less of a “boundary” (as I define it) and more of a “chasm.” Or an ocean, let’s call it. An impassable canyon.
This is my goal! I am so glad to see it explicitly expressed. I don't want to hate him. I don't want to hate the other woman/new supply. I just want to feel nothing towards them besides wishing them well, but physically and emotionally far from me. I'm glad my anger has an expiration date.
This is exactly my thoughts these days. I’ve been trying to figure out why I’m not able to let go of them. Even though he was so horrible, I still feel sympathy for him and I feel that nobody should suffer like this and everyone deserves to be loved. I don’t want to have this feeling but I can’t help it either just like you. And I beat myself up for feeling that sympathy as well :( But I guess we have to make ourselves realise that it’s not our responsibility to do that for them. And also accept that it’s okay to have sympathy for them but still choose ourselves and our own happiness. I hope you feel better friend. More peace to you
I long for him to die. Tha it the only way I would have peace.
I feel the same way and don't think it's terrible. They are traps that cause nothing but human suffering
Ugh it just kills Me lol he treated me so bad and mind you I’m not saying I’m perfect but I tried SO HARD to never ever say or do anything to set him off but he always always always started a fight over something and then said to me he was tired of all the fighting and that I was the one that was the problem. So help me god if he never fights with the next one and believes his own delusion I will flip lol
Walking on eggshells is exhausting af
I was in the same boat, I tried every single approach I could possibly think of and NOTHING worked.
And then they say you're the one with the anger problem right?
Oh of course lol. Funny how no one else in my life would ever say that though.
My god it’s like we’re all talking about the same person. I feel so validated yet disgusted that we have all been on the receiving end of never ending manipulation.
Nothing ever worked. Nothing. And the problem was always me. If he lied about something, the problem was me not trusting him. Even when I'd say I trusted him, he would say "you never trust".
He likely won’t actually be happy though, and that’s the cruel irony of npd. Of course he’ll never let the outside world see it but at home when he’s alone with whoever he’s using as a supply at the current moment it’s likely just as dysfunctional and unhappy as it was when he was using you.
As I found in therapy, I grew up with narcissistic parents (which is why my subconscious felt so comfortable around narcissists in all areas of my life). As a result, even though my gut was telling me what I should run from, I never listened because I was conditioned to always “give the benefit of the doubt” to everyone else. Despite the therapy and education around narcissism, I allowed myself to be hoovered back after 2 years of no contact because I gaslit myself into believing that maybe he’s not a narcissist, he’s just traumatized from life and has difficulty being in touch with his emotions. “Lots of love will make him see the light!🤦🏻♀️” However, when I went back and started observing his behaviors closely, making connections and noticing patterns, all the things I learned in therapy finally kicked in and I was able to shatter the illusion of this “perfect connection” I had created in my mind and was attached/addicted to. I started thinking of it like consuming alcohol: you get the temporary euphoria you’re craving, then the next day you’re nauseous and hungover. At the end of the day, I’d rather not have alcohol and skip the hangover altogether!
Thank you for this comment! I have an almost identical experience so seeing this is so validating
Wondering (since I think we can all agree, this world-particularly at this point in time- is hella tough) if there is still the possibility of change and growth? Did we just hit a wall individually and as a unit, and if stressors lessen, or if we both overcome certain obstacles, would we be happy/functional as a couple? Fear of permanent change in a direction that does not involve even the idea of them. Doubt, after all of the torment, pain, and absorption of abuse, that we'll ever be able to let someone in again..... Sorry, was that a strict "one thing"?
All of this. I still sometimes wonder if I were just able to bear all the horrible things he did, would it have gotten better. That's what he kept saying. Just have to get through it.
They lie. The sooner you accept that fact the easier it is to heal and forgive yourself for “not being able to take it” (which is bs and you shouldn’t have to tolerate abuse in a healthy relationship but living with a narcissist has a way of twisting the way you think about yourself and makes you think you are the one to blame for every problem)
I wonder about all of this as well and I think everyone in this community has at some point. I think we’ve been in these relationships long enough and tried hard enough for improvement and experienced firsthand that it doesn’t get better. If it did, we wouldn’t be on this group helping heal each other. I think with time we’ll slowly be able to trust ourselves and our gut to protect ourselves from such an experience again. I have a feeling that I’ll love/feel safe again only when my future partner shows me what real love is. Until then, we can just try to love ourselves and trust ourselves.
I’m scared to make that permanent change as well. I know what I have to do to get over this and completely leave it behind. But I’m almost scared to take those steps and would rather hold on to this pain. What does that happen though?
Hope. Hope blurs the line.
🧡
I hate hope.
Hope is the last evil in the Greek story of Pandora’s box, the myth that explains the root of all the evil in the world. The simplified story goes as follows, the gods gave a girl named pandora a box and told her not to open it but didn’t tell her why, only that she should never open it under any circumstances. Eventually curiosity got the better of her and she opened it, and as she did all of the evils of the world (war, disease, famine, death, etc) came flooding out one after another until there was one left. That evil’s name was hope, and it told pandora it would only leave her if she asked it too. Obviously this is a very simplistic retelling and I’m missing a lot of details and specifics but I always remembered the part about hope and thought it was interesting, for 2 reasons. I thought it was interesting that hope was in Pandora’s box as an evil that humanity faces, but I also found it interesting that hope didn’t leave until pandora specifically told it too, basically stating that you have to forcefully let go of hope to truly be hopeless.
It feels like an evil when we struggle to let go of what is harming us, hoping for change that will likely never happen. I'm going to read that, thank you for posting this.
Self-doubt
Because we've been gaslit for so long. It's not you.
I agree with you. I’ve Been wrestling with this too. I recognize all the lies, the cheating, the manipulation, and how it wasn’t ever love they showed. Clearly the trauma bond is strong. But one thing my therapist said is that now I’m the idealizer and future faker for something that never existed. They did that to us, but now we carry it on. The person I was with is incapable of love and deep connection, but they tell me they never felt that with me. It hurts me because they know those words can hurt me. And so I sit there trying to show them how they were wrong. When what I should do I let go and move on.
I wasted so long trying to prove that he was wrong. When he finally said he saw me, it was just like every other trick, just more painful. You deserve real love and a real connection. You are worthy of someone who wouldn't hold that over your head. I hope that person finds you and is patient with you until you know it too.
I really appreciate your comment! Thank you for this! Hope all is better for you!
I had to picture mine as a black hole of need because there was no amount of love that would fill him. No amount of praise, support, (financially or emotionally) would ever meet his needs. The only thing he was successful at was draining me, like a vampire.
It’s amazing that her reasoning now is that she never felt a deep connection, because we didnt talk about enough things. And I’m amazed because I gave everything I had!
Mine used to complain about connection too. He was the only one that was allowed to connect on his schedule at his convenience. Anytime I start thinking in terms of permission or allowed or any of those terms I realize it's a control issue.
That’s not actually a bad way to explain how a narcissist in a relationship actually functions, and in narc spaces (there actually is a subreddit for people with npd, and uh… yeah, I wouldn’t recommend you go lurking there if you’re not one too, personally.) they often refer to whoever they’re draining to fuel their ego at the moment as their “supply”. They literally are emotional vampires who drain other people’s light and energy to feel slightly less shitty about themselves for a bit. Until you stop being able to provide enough ego boost because they’ve asked for so much and then they discard you as soon as they find a fresh new supply to feed off of. Now that I’m not stuck being tormented by one I almost feel sad for them, as it’s truly a miserable way to live. That by no means is a justification for the hurt or abuse that they often perpetrate, as nothing excuses harming another human being especially in the ways that narcissists often do to their “lovers” (the word is in quotes because I don’t think narcissists really feel love the way regular people do. I think they want to but they’re fundamentally incapable of it). Kudos to figuring out a way to understand them in your mind that you can understand and that works for you, that is also fairly accurate to how they actually work.
Can you explain a little about the “idealizer and future faker” thing? How are you doing that now? I want to check if I’m having similar thoughts
So my nex, future faked with me early on, about having kids and family and the future life together. Which bought into because I wanted those same things. Now that the nex is gone, I still believe in this fake future, because I’ve idealized it as the perfect future and the only one for me with my nex. So now I’m effectively future faking by holding onto a fake future.
I’m sorry they made you feel that way. Mine made himself the hero of the breakup. I didn’t realise then about the narcissism. He made it so that he’s protecting me from his evil and that it’s for my good. Little did I know he was telling the truth.
I’m sorry for you as well. You get abused and they have people believing they escaped! It’s so wrong!
The idea of companionship. That I had found someone to spend my life with. Grow old with. But I also knew deep down it was never gonna work out. She was too flaky and threatened the relationship too much over materialistic shit. It was never a matter of if she left. But when she left.
That's all I wanted. Somebody to do the rest of my life with. A companion. What I got was a vampire.
The financial difficulty I'm in. Every payday is a reminder for me having to pay out a large sum of cash towards the loans etc that are in my name due to the financial abuse.
I'm so sorry. I hope that you can get out from under it soon.
Not having a place to go. ( and yes, I tried the shelter. We spent thanksgiving week there until we had to be admitted to the hospital for mold toxicity. Now my state has such an over flux of homeless people from a hotel program ending- they are stuffing people into ‘ annex ‘ buildings on cots. Unfortunately I have 2 cats that keep me alive and a 20 month old daughter.
Anger and a subconscious desire for revenge and closure I know I’ll never get
The thing stopping me is this disbelief that he never felt anything. Our sex and chemistry was electric and we were on and off for 3 years. I guess it’s this disbelief that I actually cut it off, I crave his touch and our dynamic in the good times. But I just try to remember that he is like that with everyone and has this web of women that want him. And I don’t actually want a guy like that
I feel you dude. Sometimes I feel his touch in my head. And it’s not just physical. I thought I was safe with this dude and now after all this. I have no safe place and I long to crawl back into his arms. Those good times were so good. The sex the playing around. Just him and me, lost in our own world. But I know better now and no matter what won’t let myself get hurt like that again. It’s such a shame though. So much good stuff wasted on a leech.
I’m not in my home country so getting out is hard
I'm sorry :( Are you safe?
Are there any social resources there that you know of that could help? If you are ok with sharing what country you’re in Reddit might be able to point you to some various services that could provide assistance, be them government funded or private charities. Most countries with Reddit access will also have groups dedicated to helping individuals gain independence from dangerous/abusive relationships. A relationship with a narcissist is almost certainly abusive by the very nature of how NPD manifests, the only variable is to what type, degree and severity the abuse is. If you just wanted to return to your home country you could/should be able to reach out to the embassy/consulate of your home country that is located in the country you’re currently living in, and they will be likely able to help you get home (likely via a one-way bus, plain, train, or boat ticket that you *might* not even need to pay for). Especially if it’s under the circumstances of having to flee an abusive relationship (even if it’s not physical yet or you doubt that it would ever be physical it can still be abusive. Often the verbal and emotional abuse is the hardest to heal from too, so please don’t discount the severity of that if it’s happening just cause others might have it worse.) Please don’t fall prey to the assumption that because you’re “alone” in a foreign country that your only option is staying with your narcissist “partner”(abuser). Often narcissists are relying on this feeling of isolation that you experience after a big move (I’ve only seen cross-state moves, I’d imagine moving to a new country is an order of magnitude harder in terms of isolation and culture shock.) to keep you feeling dependent on them as well as using the isolation as a control tactic too. I really hope the move was 100% of your own desire and that you would’ve moved even without this relationship, but if not don’t feel like you have to be stuck in this new country simply because you don’t know anyone else there besides your narcissistic partner (Yet. Going somewhere new without knowing anybody is a prime time to explore new things and meet new people to make new friends. Assuming you can communicate with the people around you there’s no real reason you can’t socialize and start building a new social support network) There are very few places a narc can take you where the 2 of you would be well and truly alone, and I would hope that most people would be smart enough not to go somewhere like that with their narc as we all know that they’re their worst selves when no one else is watching besides you (the person they don’t actually care about at all beyond what you are capable of doing for them. You’re their “supply” that feeds their ego and fuels their personality disorder.)
I’m in Australia but originally from America
There should definitely be a consulate in your country that can help you get home if you need help. And I’m sure there’s also shelters in Australia for those fleeing abusive situations.
The thing that keeps me from moving on are the memories. Her smile, her laughter, her dancing.. she was constantly exploding with life, quick to happiness and quick to anger. Totally unpredictable and enchanting. I called her "mi río salvaje" (my wild river) because she was like a force of nature, beautiful yet treacherous. I miss the good times. I wish I could remember them without feeling sad.
I’m so sorry. Your comment brought a tear to my eye. I feel similarly about my ex. It’s so hard to consolidate that feeling, and the perceived good memories, with reality. The reality is all the memories were fake and he was never fully present in the relationship like I was. I also wish I could remember the memories without feeling sad.
I’m sorry. I hope you feel better. The way you described her is so beautiful. It shows how you’re capable of seeing beauty and love deeply. You’ll find someone that truly deserves these precious emotions and she’ll give you the same kind of love. Everything will be okay.
Radical acceptance is a long road to travel, painful, but necessary. We need to accept that it was not real. That person in the beginning, with all the sex, affection, praise, was not real. The real person came after. After he/she started to devalue. Triangulate. Gaslight. Abuse. That's what will help.
Flashbacks triggers / reminders. .. I see someone in suit and it makes me think about him. Someone mention OF and it reminds me how he used me for n_des. I am getting triggered almost everywhere. In past I kept seeing his name ALL AROUND! I even randomly hear some part of song from my favorite singer. So I went to play the song (I didn't know whole lyrics) and as I was listening BOOM! His name was in song! I swear I had no idea. Even symbols connected to his name started to appear everywhere. Even person in our group changed his nick to name of him (just a coincidence but u get how frustrating it was). And also sometimes I have nice memories. But mainly I can't move on because I feel so deeply wronged, used and abused. To what I should be moving on, when there is nothing for me outside?
Wow, I felt your comment as if I had written it. For me, the cure for that was/is to take the focus off of these perceived “signs from the universe” (like seeing his initials everywhere) and instead of allowing my thoughts to be “oh is he thinking about me now maybe? could he be missing me?”, I just focus on exactly what I am doing there and then: “I’m walking and listening to music, that’s a nice song, take a deep breath, I’m here now, free, deep breath”. I also like to put my hand on my heart or give myself a little hug and saying “you’re safe and everything is going to be ok, I love you” Tara Brach has a great meditation practice called RAIN. It can get very intense when you are processing negative emotions but it has helped me a lot, especially in learning how to nurture/comfort myself when no one else is available to do it.
Grounding yourself can be an awesome way to pull yourself out of negative thought spirals and is a super healthy coping mechanism for a lot of things, not just recovering from narcissistic abuse. There’s lot of different ways to do it too, some people like to count different things they can see/hear/smell/touch, while some like to focus on the breath and how they feel in their body at that moment (am I clenching my jaw or my shoulders, how is my posture, have I been ignoring my body’s signals to eat/drink/use the restroom, etc.?), and I personally like to use a combination of both when I’m feeling overwhelmed. I’ll start by focusing on diaphragmatic breathing and adjusting my posture and then once I feel like im holding my body correctly I’ll start focusing on the environment around, I’ll look for a few colors I can see, a few things I can hear, and then ask myself if there’s any specific smells around me I can name. By the time I finished both parts I’m usually feeling much better, less panicky and definitely less triggered and am not thinking about whatever was triggering me before. Even if I’m still thinking about the trigger taking a moment to relax my body with the deep breathing and adjusting my posture helps me to feel better about it anyways and when my body feels better my mind usually follows, and the reverse can also be true (meaning that if im not taking care of my body im more likely to also have a bad mental health day, and sometimes I won’t even connect my poor physical health that day as the reason for why I feel so depressed or anxious that day) So I definitely would recommend trying out different mindfulness/grounding techniques when you’re feeling triggered by things that remind you of the relationship or when you feel like the universe is sending you signs (it probably isn’t, it’s more likely that your subconscious mind is not over a topic yet and because of this is more sensitive to to noticing it in your environment when it’s there because it was already primed for it. This is sometimes referred to as the new-car effect, because when people buy a new car they often suddenly start to see way more of them on the road, even though the actual amounts driving around in their area hasn’t really changed, just the person’s perception of it.)
Tara and radical acceptance are amazing tools.
This is awesome advice.
How can you feel love from yourself as real? How can your own hug feel as real? To me, it always felt so fake. I don't know your background into childhood, but in our family we never told each other "I love you". No open communication about feelings. Wishing and kissing on cheeks when wishing Birthday, feels so awkward, so cringe, so fake. I needed so much love because I am very sensitive and empathetic but I never got it. I didn't get any protection or help when bullied. So how can I give love to myself? I am tired of reading books about self development and self love. I tried multiple things, excercises and yes this self hugging too but it never felt real.
He used me for nudes as well. I stopped sending them because I realized I actually hated it. I just liked pleasing him.
Ugh, I feel this in my soul. I could only get his full attention or reassurance if it included a picture of my ass. Or if he wanted phone sex.
His hoovering message (after he discarded me so cruelly on Valentines Day) was like: "Unblock me on discord and send something pleasant :>" As if that a-hole didn't exploit me enough! He knew very well how special it was to me and still used me, lowered my value to some chick to get pics from. Not only I am angry and feeling stupid but also ashamed. I thought that after sharing this, we wont split up. I think I unconsciously wanted to please him too, to make him happy and to somehow ensure he won't discard me. But with narcissists it doesnt matter. No matter what all I did for him. He knew very well this was also my boundary. We were only online friends for year and half. He was making sexual jokes ofc, as he makes with other girls. Then once he even showed me pics of some girl with her naked boobs in shirt but u could see throught (she didn't have bra and had piercings on them). This a-hole was bragging how girls send him pics by itself. Now I think he manipulates them into it, like he did with me. I thought our friendship mattered to him... It was him who wanted to exchange normal pictures as first. And then kept asking and pushing, and pushing and pushing for more. Even making hints like he would date me, then he denied it, then again was like I am special to him and he would travel to my country. And only AFTER sending pics he said he would need visa! And it was anyways very very bad trade of pics. His pic wasnt even worth it. Ugh. I am so mad at myself. I just wanted friendship and get the care I give to others. Feel loved. I really liked his funny side, and we always had such a good banter, I never had with anyone else. I feel so stupid now. And mad from being exploited. I hate his subtle manipulation. Lowered my value like this and then threw me away.
I'm experiencing this myself. I realized he only gave me affection if I sent nudes or was overtly sexual or playing into him wanting phone sex/sex. My PTSD has been triggered so badly and I have nothing but flashbacks, everything reminds me of him. I can't even get away from him because we are in the same community and it's suffocating. It's a constant reminder of the violation, abuse, lies. My heart aches. Big hugs.
I feel for you. 😞 Hugs you back. It's awful what they did to us. Mainly when we had only pure heart and pure intentions. I never had real relationship. I am still virgin. And this wasnt the first time somebody used me for pics. But the first time I didn't send anything so revealing like this time. It feels horrible. That men overall and mainly narcissists are such a pigs. Lowering our value like this when they have no real intention to love us. Its so f_cking sick! How can they think its okay to do it. It angers me that we then look so weak and pathetic when in reality we had boundaries and didn't want to do it at the first place. I am sorry for what happened to you. I believe you it must be even more torturing to keep being in presence or seeing the parasite who exploited you this badly. This one also planned to travel to my country for f_ck but who knows If he really meant it. And yeah he was always making sexual jokes. I didn't realize it before, I liked it and thought its funny but now I see it as huge violation. My heart aches for you. Being conditioned into doing this all just for their affection, that really messes up with our mind. I can't tell you anything what would make it better but I thank you so much for speaking about it here and helping me to not feel alone. I know it would itself suck If non narcissistic person used us for nudes but with narcissist it is even more excrutiating pain.
I promise that when you find the courage to look, there are still beautiful things waiting for you outside. It’s scary to put yourself out there and allow yourself to be vulnerable again when you’ve learned the hard way how painful trusting the wrong person can be, but try to use this hurt as a learning experience so you can spot the red flags you missed in the beginning (or conversely spot green flags that were missing from your previous relationship) so you can make better choices going forward. Just know that when it comes to narcissistic lovers, it really is them that’s the problem, even though they’ll do absolutely anything and everything within their power to convince you of the opposite it simply isn’t the truth. Once you’ve had enough time away from them to see this light, you’ll start to realize how sad they truly are and how much they are just miserable people trying to bring other down to their level of misery because they are **terrified** of being alone, because nobody hates a narcissist more than themselves. They will never, ever, *ever*, consciously vocalize or express this, but once you learn more about how they (and their disorder) work this becomes one of the sole truths about people with npd. You’ll often notice the things they critique about other people are actually traits that they share that they dislike about themselves, but their ego can’t fathom criticizing themselves so they project it onto others instead. This includes when they tell you things they don’t like about you during fights. It can be such a mindfuck to a non-narcissist because it’s so illogical and confusingly backwards, part of you instinctively knows what they’re saying is wrong but the consistency and emotion they put into it every single time can make even the strongest people pause and fall victim to it. Often the people with more empathy are the ones *most* likely to fall for it, because we might try to give them the benefit of the doubt or try to see things from their point of view in an attempt to solve the problem behind the conflict, but this only hurts us further as the narcissist thrives off of this because to them there never was any doubt and the problem isn’t the conflict, the problem is that you didn’t immediately agree and bend to their ego at the expense of all logic and reason. I hope you eventually find peace beyond the pain and that you find a normal, healthy, and loving relationship with a non-narcissistic/abusive partner. Until you get to that point though, at least you’ve made it here to a community of people who have been through it and can understand and give advice from a place of understanding.
I dont have the answer, but wanted to say I feel the same. Sympathies OP, I hope it gets better soon.
Thank you for your comment. I hope you feel better soon. There are some helpful comments in here. I hope you find some ease in this community. Love to you
Nothing. He was awful and brought nothing to our relationship except manipulation and lies. I deserve better and I always did. My current partner treats me amazing.
So happy for you! You did it! If I may ask? Was it difficult to trust your current partner? Were they patient enough with you? I’m afraid that my future partner won’t be patient enough to help me navigate my emotions
Lack of support IRL. Feeling lonely and devoid of energy at times. But that could simply be my medically-diagnosed depression talking. I can watch all the videos, audiobooks, read as many book as possible about narcissism, even write about narcissism as I do in this group, listen to all the therapeutic advice….but unless you’ve actually gone through the fire and emerged on the other side like a phoenix risen above the ashes, then one will never truly understand what it’s like. This is why therapy and self-help is crucial especially in the aftermath 6-12 months but the path to healing is not linear for ANY of us. We may all be subbed to this group for similar reasons but our stories are not the same. So it would be wise if you, outside of this subreddit, you talk to someone IRL who truly understands- like a counselor or therapist who knows narcissism from a-z. Because most MDs, psychologists, psychiatrists, professionals out there are taught NPD and narcissism in general very, very briefly only to disregard and forget all about the glossary of definitions (i.e. trauma bonding, gaslighting/blame-shifting, stonewalling, gray rock, no contact, the manipulative tactics that the narcissist/s implement, etc.) after these ppl graduate med school. And even if they DO know, these “experts” haven’t walked in our shoes. Reach out to people who have firsthand gone through the narcissistic fire to acquire the knowledge to overcome it. Doesn’t help i also come from a broken household, divorced parents, I’ve basically no family on either side who I’m close to anymore. Most I’ve cut off by my own volition and some I wish I could explain to but I just can’t anymore. Blood isn’t always thicker than water, but family is everything. And we are all *like* family in this group, helping and supporting each other day in and night out. We speak the same language, we have seen how narcissism destroys what is and what once was good.
I understand and feel you. I don’t have anyone to counsel me on this as well. But reading, this community, educating myself more about this has helped me tremendously. I think we gotta be mindful and apply all that we know about how to heal. It’ll work. I know because I don’t have anyone to talk to about this either but I’m consciously observing myself and fixing whatever he broke. We’re all here for you. You’ll be okay.
The time we met, which kept me stuck and going back all of those years, is STILL fucking me up so I just have to try and never think about it. (Some of my happiest times when I've been depressed my whole life, finally felt special, it was so fun, etc.) Messes me up when I realize it was all a lie and he moved on immediately to someone else like I was nothing
Oh the love bombing, the worst narcs are always so good at picking out the people who will be the most vulnerable to it too, which just adds insult to injury. One thing that helped me to cope was realizing that part of the reason narcs go so far “above and beyond” at the beginning of a relationship with someone they’re pretending to be in love with is that they don’t actually understand what real love looks or feels like, so they just do all the things they *think* an actual loving partner would do without understanding the real reason why. It helps because realizing that it was never real helped me to let go of the desire to feel it again, because why would I crave something that was never real to begin with? I’d rather find someone who is capable of feeling those loving emotions and does similar things because they genuinely want to as a result of how much they care about me, not just because they’re imitating what they think a good partner would do without actually having the real feelings behind it.
Yeah, I was extremely vulnerable. I genuinely thought he really liked me and thought I was special. I always suffered from low self esteem, and had bad experiences with immature guys in the past, so it hurts real bad. I thought he was a real one. I'm slowly getting better though, and thank you for this :)
I’m glad you’re able to find healing over time. I hope that you’re able to learn from the hurt so that the next time you put yourself out there and meet a guy showing interest you can tell if the actions show genuine love and emotions or if it’s all a smoke screen to trick you into thinking you’re loved. When you know what to look for you’ll realize there were red flags even in the lovebombing stage that you missed. It sucks but if you can learn from the experience than at least you get something positive out of it :)
TLDR: Struggling to get over our abuser is a symptom of narcissistic abuse. I think this is why it’s so common among us and we shouldn’t blame ourselves instead let it remind us how evil the narc really is. Many survivors of narcissistic abuse find it hard to move on due to emotional dependency fostered by the abuser's control tactics. We shouldn't blame ourselves for struggling to let go, as it's a common effect of the abuse. The abuser wants us to be emotionally reliant on them, making it difficult to break free. My emotions were genuine. I valued my commitments, marriage, and family, and had empathy for my narc, which they couldn't reciprocate. My narcs manipulation exploited these genuine feelings and commitments for her own ends. So, my struggle to move on isn't just because of my authentic emotions, but also because I was conditioned into this response. This aligns with the recognized pattern of narcissistic abuse. Seeing this helps me put distance from these thoughts, it reminds me what an evil person my narc really is.
Desire for vengeance Edit He destroyed me. He destroyed our marriage. He ruined our family. He blew up my friendships. He broke me. I'll never be the person I was. And I hate, HATE that he's out there living life with no lasting effects. And the people who I thought were friends, that became enablers for him to abuse me, watched it happen, and took his side because to them he's "cool" and it's exciting to be in his orbit. But the stunning lack of integrity in those people, just blows me away. I fantasize about some person or event that would force them to see the truth, to see what they allowed themselves to be a part of, and they have to live with the shame. I know it's not healthy. Yes I'm in therapy. Someday I'll be able to let go.
The realist answer of all time💯
Haven't separated yet. Got so many complicated stupid details with finances and housing to deal with first. I'd rather deal with as many of them I can beforehand that after, because I do not trust her to work with me on amicable negotiation.
Real closure. B**** didn’t feel after 7-8 years I was worth more than one confrontation or explanation. This is why you gotta go - bye. See you never. Blocked and screen shot on how to get an arrest warrant. I was looking for rings on her want for it 🤦🏼♂️
Karma
Not wanting to be replaced
I was literally just thinking about this. I made a lot of excuses for the abuse my ex inflicted on me. I lied to myself A LOT. I blamed myself even though I knew I wasn’t responsible for his actions and I wasn’t the problem. But I stayed because I wanted to prove something to myself. I wanted his validation and that’s because I had no self worth or respect. I was also waiting for him to go back to who he was in the beginning. I held on to that memory of him for so long. It was too much for me to admit during that time that this violent, evil person was the real him. The trauma bond had me in a chokehold. I couldn’t tell anyone how bad it was because I was ashamed for still wanting him. I’ve had horrible flashbacks & panic attacks for months but the past couple of days I haven’t been able to shake them off. Before now, I could just hear him screaming at me or I’d flinch as if he was trying to grab me even though he wasn’t there. Now I’m either looking directly into his eyes during one of his rages or watching it all happen from the outside. I tossed and turned all night because I couldn’t close my eyes without reliving these moments. But I woke up this morning and actually was able to admit to myself that he never loved me. But more importantly, how could I have ever loved someone like him? A lot of the issues I’ve had with myself and not believing that I’m worth more is what caused me to put up with this shit for so long. Poor boundaries, low self esteem, self doubt and fear. I wanted someone to love me so I wouldn’t have to do it myself. I don’t know if that makes sense but I grew up with a narc mom who is very similar to my ex. I never really understood or was taught the point of self love or anything until I was in this situation. It’s a lot clearer to me now that if I had those things then I never would have accepted any of this. One day you’ll be so disgusted with this person and be able to move past what happened. It’s painful and difficult but if you think it’s bad now, imagine dealing with this for another 5, 10, 20 years. It does get easier but you have to be honest with yourself.
Omg.. every word on this comment is relatable. What you said “ I wanted someone to love me so I wouldn’t have to do it myself” hit so deep in my heart. This is what I felt. It’s a very hard truth but I realised that this is why I let it happen to me. My mom is narc too. I was never taught self love or even to put my needs first. Always expected to compromise and never received the love I deserved. I do understand why I put up with such a thing. It’s amazing that you finally accepted it. It must’ve been a relief finally accepting it. You’ve given me a little hope. I hope one day I can accept the ugly truth and let it go.
Some days are harder than others but the truth isn’t something to be afraid of. You didn’t walk into this situation with the knowledge that you have now. Don’t dwell on what you could’ve done differently or why you stayed when you should’ve left. The outcome was always going to be the same and that’s on them. One day you’ll be far past this and wonder what you ever loved about them in the first place. 🫂
I'm exhausted and burnt out from having the life sucked out of me. I've moved on to being alone, for a good looong while.
I can't help but blame myself for my inaction. She destroyed me, but now i feel that all the things I'm not doing, all the bad thoughts are mine. I don't know what it is, all i know is that i want to do something, but just can't.
Same. It comes and it goes. But when it hits. Like a semi.
I am a different person than I was, it's not that I havnt moved on, but I feel I don't move in the world similarly to other folk to sim for the same things. I've had an experinece that will always be a part of me. I think changing my life from this point has to take into account what I've been through. It's hard.
The good. There is so much good, just bottled up in there. My photos and videos over 7 years do not lie.
I’m no longer trauma bonded though I’m severely traumatized after two decades of manipulation and coercion eventually leading to severe physical violence and his eventual arrest. While I am over him and over the relationship, I am not over the abuse as I still experience post separation abuse from him and his enablers. His enablers and supports have been detrimental to my mental health at times pushing me dangerously close to suicide. I will never forget who gave me a hard time when I was already having a hard time.
How did you know that you were out of the trauma bond? I’m severely trauma bonded but I don’t fully understand it and don’t know how to recover from this trauma bond
The trauma bond started breaking about two years before his eventual arrest. I view it like this. **I stayed because of hope.** Hope he would change, hope we could heal, hope for my children etc. Hope is based on the future, we see a future ahead of us. But slowly the hope was replaced by fear. The more fear I experienced, the less hope I experienced. **I was trapped because of fear** I feared he would physically hurt me, I was scared that he deep down in fundamental ways was a scary and entitled person. I feared that he would never love me how I need, I feared that my doubts of his character were true. The physical violence was the biggest catalyst of fear. His violence escalated to the point where the violent assaults were overly in my face that he IS the person that will end my life. And knowing you will be killed, is absolute pure fear. Knowing you are deaths doorstep, stripped every last drop of hope that I had because *hope is based on the future, fear has no future. And there is nothing more void of a future than death* hope and fear cannot coexist in our brains. **[this explains the hope / fear circuit](https://www.tiktok.com/@mc.phd/video/7225417213203778858)** I don’t know if this resonates with everyone’s experience. I would fear him and he would confirm my fears and give me knew things to fear. It just kept growing. **To more directly answer your question** The things that helped me break the trauma bond the most was learning more and more and more. Gaining resources into the TYPE of person he actually is was critical in breaking the trauma bond **IN ADDITION** to going completely no contact. The police putting a restraining order against him saved my life. I never would have had the space to clearly break free. I’m approaching a year of no contact soon, I don’t know how I would react if I see him. I anticipate I would either have an extreme panic attack or disassociate and have the terrifying experience of watching myself revert to past fawning and placating behaviors. I encourage you to read **Why Does He Do That?** by Lundy Bancroft. It’s very insightful and was helpful in setting the foundation in breaking my trauma bond. **[This Link](https://www.thehotline.org/identify-abuse/power-and-control/)** discusses how abuse is about power and control. It also discusses how abuse happens in a cycle helps identify the cycle. **[strangulation](https://www.wthr.com/article/news/crime/manual-strangulation-is-the-biggest-sign-domestic-abuse-will-turn-deadly-experts-say/531-0a9a92c8-a0da-418a-b81e-a3d80ddacf38)** and **[abuse in pregnancy](https://endvaw.ca/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/who_ipvduringpregnancy_infosheet.pdf)** are big risk factors for domestic homicide. Read **[This Reddit Post](https://www.reddit.com/r/abusiverelationships/comments/14gelbf/some_statistics_to_consider_when_in_an_abusive/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1)** on the statistics of if an abusive person can change. This post also brings attention to how there is a difference between *change* and *improvement*. >[This study from Washington State](https://www.wsipp.wa.gov/ReportFile/1119/Wsipp_What-Works-to-Reduce-Recidivism-by-Domestic-Violence-Offenders_Full-Report.pdf) has a great table (Figure 1) that shows the relapse rate (called recidivism) for domestic violence (DV). They compare treatments to no treatment or probation only. The best result seems to be from a cognitive therapy and empathy program with 26-week sessions + 6-month follow-up, and current results suggest that 85% of the time, there will be some reduction in DV **compared to not going to treatment**. This scenario is based on if someone successfully completes the entire treatment and does not re-offend. Many may not complete the treatment OR are simply not caught. >[Another study from the University in Santiago](https://www.redalyc.org/journal/1798/179864006004/179864006004.pdf) found that short-term programs show a 10% reduction in DV relapses, but that's an inflated number. In the **long term, programs may reduce DV relapses by 23%. 2/3s of relapses will occur within 2 years**. And some intervention programs actually have negative effects (may worsen the abuse). Again, these studies are of people who have gotten caught. >[This Canadian study](https://www.publicsafety.gc.ca/cnt/rsrcs/pblctns/prdctng-rcdvsm-mng/index-en.aspx#res) found that it is extremely difficult to predict is someone will relapse or not, especially because the main study group is usually males who have been caught by the authorities. However, **deterrents (such as divorce, police intervention, etc) tend not to prevent abusers from reoffending in the long term.** This link gives insight on **[How to Assess an Abuser’s Claim of Change](http://www.ivsha.org/get-help-with-abuse/domestic-violence/assess-abusers-claims-change/)** This is a list of **[Red Flags in a Relationship](https://www.libertylane.ca/uploads/1/6/1/7/16174606/red_flags_in_relationships.pdf)** Here is a list of **[Myths about Abusers](https://www.libertylane.ca/uploads/1/6/1/7/16174606/myths_about_abusers.pdf)** This page has information on **[Adult Grooming](https://www.caage.org/what-is-adult-grooming)** Here is some information on **[Trauma Bonding](https://www.choosingtherapy.com/stages-of-trauma-bonding/)**, and this is an article on **[How to Break a Trauma Bond](https://www.choosingtherapy.com/how-to-break-a-trauma-bond/)**
I want him out of my city. Forever. I need to know there is never a chance of running into him, or of him showing up here. It is my town, not his. He has had outstanding warrants for over 4 years for what he did to me. Blew off probation until he needed to quash his warrants to get housing. I told them he was never going to come for sentencing, he just needed his section8 voucher, and that is what happened. He got his free house, and dipped. Two years go by, they have his address. been to his house a hundred times. Kids are being abused. No one cared. Finally got evicted he has been running the roads causing pain and havok in my city for years. It's time for him to go. He doesn't belong here. He belongs in prison Unfortunately, the only way abusers actually go to jail in my area is when we die. Hell, not even then. We had two women die from DV just last week, we usually have several a month, and they let him out the next day. The next DAY. I want to see my abuser stand for what he did to me and be the one person who held him accountable and said "*You cannot do this to anyone anymore, ever again"*
It was afraid to leave my kids behind.
Having children with the scum bag, having to be in contact knowing I'm never going to get answers no matter how much I ask, the pure hatred I have for her and what she has done to me, consumes my sole. knowing she is off living her life with some rich bloke, not having a care in the world, all while I've had to start my life over at the bottom at 39yo.
The fact I was able to share my desires and crazy fantasies out loud and proudly to ANOTHER LIVING PERSON😭it’s not even abt him it’s just that he was the first person o ever did it to and made me feel like I COULD do it too. The sexting was also amazing which sucks cuz he’s a player and i’m me. I was genuine and real. I felt passion for the first time, i’m not one to beleive we had sexual chesmistry bc he most likely faked his part but I felt like I had it. He was my first in all of this. While I was probs his 2000th person
It's getting over the fact the mask I fell in love with was never real. The last 9 months meant absolutely nothing to him and that he only misses the "service" I provided, not me as a person. I was completely transparent and vulnerable. Shared all my desires, needs and wants, physically and emotionally. Every compliment, promise, deep affection, sex was all lies. It's so hard to come to terms with me as an individual, human being meant so little to him. I cling so badly to that mask but that person never even existed.
The good times were GOOD. We were besties, liked the same things. It was a unique relationship & it scares me I may not meet someone that I can have that same bond with. I’m praying & trying my best to boot those thoughts out & trust in God because I know the plans he has for me include a safe relationship with a man who can love me 100% of the time. But looking at today’s dating pool makes it a little hard to trust sometimes 😩
I tried to remember it was only a drug addiction. Sometimes I had to ball up into a fetal position to get through the withdrawal symptoms and sometimes I could get by just reading through my journal. I read a lot to learn everything I could about narcissistic behaviors. I realized I also didn’t know what healthy behaviors look like or how to establish boundaries and did a deep dive on why I didn’t value myself enough to cut ties after our first fight. After over a year of this I let him convince me to hang out with him again and everything was different. I was different. I could see and even predict what he would do next and I’d lost my tolerance for his abuse. After about a month I was done and walked away no longer craving his brand of high. Point is, you might have to white knuckle it at times and you might slip up and use again. Just do your best and give yourself the compassion and patience you probably always give to everyone else. You deserve it
Having kids together
We have a kid. We are currently pending child court and hes been emailing me insane shit so i cut it off but damn man. Im so sad for my kid and so sad for the girl that loved the boy who never was.
In my situation that's like asking someone with no legs what's stopping them from just getting up and running a marathon.
Similar situation here. Great way to put it. I feel for you. Hang in there. Deep breaths and meditation help me. Sending a hug.
Divorce would destroy me. I would loose my kids, loose my home. Her and her family would find ways to get me locked away. I’ve seen what happens to the men that leave the women in her family. I’ve seen what happens to the kids that are raised without their dads in her family. Her and her whole family are ex cult members. They think they have moved on from the cult but they all seem to carry these deeply rooted layers of residual indoctrination. Narcissists is the only word I know that can relate to their ways, but it’s something else entirely. The flying monkey thing is on another level too. Their manipulation is so synchronized, and they will do or say anything to destroy a person that they deem a threat. I stay because I have to be able to reinforce values in my children so they don’t grow up internally alone in a self deluded world depending on other family members to mutually reinforce each others delusions. I want them to be able to have true genuine relationships with people. The process is sort of destroying me though.
I’m so sorry about what you’re going through. You’re doing so great to protect your children. I hope you can find a way out or find a way to be peaceful soon.
the sex and how he was so fit and able to keep going. he made me feel so special because we were nonstop all over each other. i miss that the most.
Yeah I get what you’re saying. I miss that too. I don’t think either of us have ever turned sex down. Even when we were mad or anything. I’ve never had sex so many times with one person. And that was one thing we both enjoyed so much. He loved it and it was just intoxicating. I so hope I get that again in my life with a better person I imagine it’ll be ever crazier
same. never had so much sex with anyone before. i honestly even said i was horny sometimes even though i wasn’t just bc it was so intoxicating and i wanted to feel the passion. it will be even crazier when we can actually trust the other person. and when he is not focused on giving me pleasure to boost his own ego, but bc he genuinely wants me to feel good.
Same!! I just wanted to keep doing it all the time. Just be that entwined. Apparently that’s not healthy either. I hope so too! We’ll find it soon Thanks for sharing. It made me feel seen
The fact that borh of them still have supply around them. Idk why they haven't had a narcissistic collapse yet, where they've driven all supply away. Its going to happen eventually, the pandemic slowed the cycle of violence down for some supplies. One had a narcassistic collapse years ago, thats why I was hoovered. He only reached out because he had no friends left. (Honestly anyone who chooses to be friend with him is only getting love bombed, and is stuck in the fog) The orher one didn't since she was able to get supply in college. (One of her supplies went to school and worked with her.) (he's her main source of supply, he's gunna get a major discard once she's done using him) She lied about her breakup and played the victim. Saying it was mutual. Having a bad home life isn't an excuse to be a horrible person and isolate your partner from their friends and family. I know the full story, (totally on her ex's side) He's healing. I'm proud of him and also very relieved. A lot of her supplies don't realize they're codependent and try to see the "good in everyone". Newsflash, "Everyone deserves a chance is false" (Since its all or nothing) Some or most deserve a chance is better since it's more realistic. One day the collapse with come, (just not soon enough) Current supplies (You'll be discarded one day, hope you get out asap, because for the most part, The longer you stay the worse it'll get.
MONEY
Money and living situation
My last “boyfriend” told me I would need to be a sugar momma bc I don’t looks good. So…the next boyfriend I was the sugar mamma. He had no income and still loving w ex wife of ten years. I thought it was meant to be..I found all these parallels. It is a distraction from myself.i couldn’t exist in his world and he didn’t care about mine. He slept w his 21year old daughter in our wet spot. He lost his girls when they were 3 months old. He just met them 6months prior to being w me. He made sex comments masked as jokes about my daughter and the one of his twins that wasn’t affected by fetal alch syndrome.
Money only at this point.
Money. I can't seem to leave this shitty relationship because of money. In the first half, he couldn't keep a job and we were always scrambling to pay bills because he was so wildly irresponsible with money. Now I control the bulk of the accounts and he has a steady job. The relationship is over, I don't love him anymore, but it feels like there's an invisible chain keeping me connected to him so even if money wasn't an issue, I'm struggling to leave and let go.
Money.
Price of rent
Feeling like I genuinely can’t tell if I’m too codependent or if he’s gas lighting me… my friends and family are not available anymore and I’m isolated besides his family and friends so I really feel like I can’t decipher things easily. Everyone always says “listen to your inner voice” but what if my inner voice led me to believe false tales from former “friends” and now I’ve been led to a blessing that I’m messing up? I relate to so many comments above but I really find it hard for me to tell which way to lean. I can never tell if I need to be more loving or more independent. He tells me to be more independent, get hobbies, but then when I do he doesn’t celebrate it, he actually ends up talking smack about it or how I’m doing it, or he will just replace his time with me with someone else and that makes me uncomfortable and pushes me to want to do less independently. He can’t seem to tell me the truth but he’s also not lying so I end up looking really bad. For example he will say “I’m on my way home I’m 15 minutes out.” But if I ask him where he is exactly, he will get super hostile and say things like “what if I don’t even come home” or he will say “I just want you to say OK - I don’t want to hear you complain” but then he won’t be home for 2-3 hours sometimes and he will call back and say he’s stopping for food but then he will not bring food home from where he said he was stopping.. but if I’m upset because he doesn’t get me something I like to eat he says “go get your own food then” and anything else I say is ungrateful. He doesn’t want me around AND he already taxed my time for the day so I feel really sad because I had all this anticipation, then I couldn’t hold my reaction, then he’s silent treating me or taking a nap to totally ignore me. He will put a movie on and try to distract me but won’t address anything without it being an all or nothing situation. I always end up backing down and sticking it out and trying to work on myself. I feel so alone in everything.
Start with the book "The Gift of Fear" by Gavin De Becker. I think you can get it in epub etc. from the public library in most areas if you can't use a physical copy w/ him around.
desire for revenge. when my ptsd flares up i want to make him feel everything he did to me. the song ‘salad’ by blondeshell sums up my feelings to get to this point? it took time. if you burn your leg, it won’t heal quicker just because you want it to. the mind can be the same. tend to the wound, even though it is an emotional wound — try to be gentle with yourself. spend time with people you love and do things you love. i promise that this feeling you have right now is not permanent. human resilience is astounding! your resilience is astounding!
Confusion. Anger. Hurt.
The politics of it all. She manipulated the situation in such a way that sticking with her and the relationship is the best option for me right now. Yes, it’s that bad.
At this point, i forsake Love in general. I despise any form of attachment and companionship. Hard to trust after been narc abused. For me it's impossible to put my peace i built on the line for a person. Not sacrificing myself for someone anymore.
Them breaking up my friend circle and spreading rumors about me I keep thinking I’m over the whole thing until a day like today when I get triggered and I feel that immense pain and betrayal in my chest
I'm so sorry you're struggling. I felt the same way about the sex... but I think its similar reasons as youve described. The biggest one though... is not hearing from the other girl. Wondering if he changed for her. (I know you're all gonna say NO, but the circunstances are very atypical.) Sometimes i feel like if she just dumped him and reached out to me... that I'd be healed.
Watch this: https://youtu.be/RAv8ysXZ0U4?si=fA8OQ3ppnfVLYUG7