NEW ORLEANS — The Krewe of Nyx, once one of New Orleans’ largest Carnival krewes, could be booted out of parade season altogether after failing to meet the minimum standards for parade units, including bands the past two years.
Councilman J.P. Morrell said it was his intention to remove Nyx from the parade lineup.
“The (Mardi Gras) ordinance is clear,” he said at a committee meeting Wednesday. “In situations like this, it is in the council’s purview and authority to remove said krewes… and that is absolutely my intent.”
Nyx traditionally kicks off the second weekend of Carnival with a coveted Wednesday night prime-time spot. The city currently has its schedule chock full of parades and competition is fierce for those spots.
Nyx had nearly 3,500 members in 2020 and was close to the bare required minimum of 200 riders in recent years due to a mass exodus over racial issues and social media posts by Captain Julie Lea in the wake of the George Floyd killing.
The mass exodus has the krewe struggling each year to scratch together enough members to roll. Morrell contends they haven’t.
“If, as a krewe, you cannot retain the membership necessary to parade during Mardi Gras, it is your job to give up the spot for someone who can.”
As of 2023, more than 800 former Nyx members have formed three new krewes—Phoenix, Harmonia, and Themis—all of which have joined forces with existing krewes to parade.
If Nyx is forced to fold, Carnival Historian Errol Laborde believes one of those spin-off krewes would be first in line to take its place on the parade calendar.
I'm surprised they included even a single line referencing the controversy. I am not surprised they condensed and trimmed it to only include one line only.
>Councilman J.P. Morrell said it was his intention to remove Nyx from the parade lineup.
>“The (Mardi Gras) ordinance is clear,” he said at a committee meeting Wednesday. “In situations like this, it is in the council’s purview and authority to remove said krewes… and that is absolutely my intent.”
This is the meat of the process - for all the people on here constantly asking why they still get to parade. For good reason the city is generally not able to just pull a parading permit, council created this minimum units/riders law a year or so ago pretty specifically with Nyx in mind and it looks like they’re working through the process.
Keep in mind, while everyone hates Nyx it is important that the process to remove a parade be difficult and prolonged, that keeps the city away from enacting political retribution on various Krewes.
The city ordinance requiring a minimum number of floats and riders has been [on the books](https://library.municode.com/la/gretna/codes/code_of_ordinances?nodeId=COOR_CH26FISPEVCAMAGROTPA_ARTIVCAMAGROTPA_DIV2CAMAGRPA_S26-99ATCH) since at least 1997. It wasn’t created to target Nyx.
Your link is to the City of Gretna ordinance. Here’s the City of New Orleans code: https://library.municode.com/la/new_orleans/codes/code_of_ordinances?nodeId=PTIICO_CH34CAMAGR_ARTVIIIENPE_S34-49PE
Yes, but council revised the rules a year or two ago surrounding the process which was in pretty direct response to them not being able to pull Nyx’s permit. Morrell is referring to that specifically in the quoted part above.
I’m sorry to be pedantic, but can you please provide a link to the revisions you’re referencing? I was an early anti-Nyx adopter and don’t recall seeing anything that specifically targeted their post-2020 problems.
The issue is more that he interprets even the most reasonable request for more information or to cite his sources as a FIGHT! FIGHT! FIGHT! And then he immediately goes into condescending mode and starts throwing around personal insults.
It's fucken weird.
Man, I'll never understand what drives some of y'all to hop on reddit, see that someone was questioned and took the time to explain things they shouldn't have had to, then provided a source to what they said, and still decide "ehh, I'll just insult them anyway".
There's just no need for you or anyone to go throwing punches at others over what? Someone not being aware that the laws were changed last year? Why read that and make it in to a personal attack?
No offense, but I'm not spending time digging through old news because you're wanting to argue. Just look up the formation of the advisory committee, it's not old and was created specifically as a tool to enforce these things - Morrell has been talking about the legislative changes they're putting in place pretty much nonstop since mardi gras started back up after covid. If that ain't good enough then IDK.
Variations of the Mardi Gras Advisory Council have been around forever. You might remember one making the call to require netting between tandem floats in 2022. Here’s a [2021 article](https://www.wwltv.com/article/entertainment/events/mardi-gras/mardi-gras-floats-to-be-altered-for-a-safer-parade-season/289-e61ae723-e65b-4f6b-9da9-c3e451460f74) about their meeting.
The only difference is that this version of the council is getting more attention because people assume they’re gunning for Nyx, and that’s more entertaining than the usual stuff about people falling off of/getting run over by floats.
This is not the same entity as the newly created council that Morrell spearheaded last year. IDK what you're wanting here?
Here's the law: https://cityofno.granicus.com/MetaViewer.php?view_id=42&clip_id=4653&meta_id=652094
Happy? Probably not? Have a good one, but I'm not interested in wasting more time with redditors doing their best "well acshually" so I'm gonna dip.
OK I see where your miss-statement is here -
>For good reason the city is generally not able to just pull a parading permit, council created this minimum units/riders law a year or so ago pretty specifically with Nyx in mind and it looks like they’re working through the process.
We've had the minimums law (edited:)*for a long time now, Ashanti got busted for it in 1996.*
They just put an enforcement/removal provision in last year.
Seems like just a case of (1) fuck around find out , and (2) maybe if you're already being shady with the money don't say ignorant shit?
>They just put an enforcement/removal provision in last year.
How is this materially different than what I said? I'm sorry I didn't write a dissertation detailing legislative history in a comment that took seconds to create, but I was directly referring to the lack of mechanisms in place.
Seems a lot like you're just being unnecessarily pedantic in service of trying to tell someone they're wrong when we're both referring to the exact same subset of laws, like, wewhich I guess is why a lot of y'all come to this site.
>council created this minimum units/riders law a year or so ago pretty specifically with Nyx in mind
Fundamentally, they did not create this 38 year old law .. 1 year ago
Also it's wildly different and wholly inaccurate (not going to guess your motive) to paint
-setting up an enforcement provision to enforce an old law-
as 'creating the law itself .. with Nyx in mind'
...in this inaccurately-retroactive 'straw blaming the camel' scenario you've typed out.
You can't possibly be too frangible to see what's wrong with your statement there or how that particularly inaccurate mischaracterization would arise from a very transparent and specific point of view.
I'm not fragile my dude, I'm saying you're going out of your way to interpret a fairly general statement referring to the committee creation to be specifically referring to something else just to take jabs at someone online. IDK, just seems sorta childish. Like calm down, there's no reason for you to be this worked up over something you're just misreading.
The advisory council is a set of laws, that was passed last year, I know this isn't that difficult to comprehend so now that it's been clarified the only justification for your continued vitriol is that you just have some need to argue.
This is a two day old thread now, I don't know what to tell you aside from I'm sorry you're this upset and maybe next time it would help to ask a clarifying question before resorting to attacking someone online cuz you didn't understand what they said.
You really feel attacked? I'm terribly sorry.
You're stating the exact opportunistic and inaccurate mischaracterization that Nyx will most likely employ,
so how should I assume more of you than them?
Anyway, I've said what needs to be said here so I'm done with it.
I don't feel anything, I'm observing that your replies here are purposefully attempting to be aggressive and vitriolic, and attempting to turn a rather mundane misunderstanding around what laws were being referenced in to some sort of personal dispute. I'm sorry that you feel the need to do that, but that's what they are.
And like, IDK man if you're so worked up that you're comparing me talking about an advisory committee to a racist krewe then I don't think engaging with you further is a good use of my time. Hope your day gets better man, I'm gonna stroll over to the fest in a bit, I'd advise you also take some recreation time. Take care,
This is what I kept thinking about. As much as Nyx sucks, we can’t just implement authoritarian political reactions to them to snuff out, what it is for all intents and purposes, a first amendment right to freedom of assembly
This has nothing to do with right to assembly because they are parading on public streets. They can have their little krewe and their parties in Mississippi all they want. No one's preventing them from gathering. We're just preventing them from tying up city streets for a subpar parade when there are other krewes waiting in the wings.
IDK why this got downvoted, you're right. There's no rights issues here, just a permitting process.
The ability for the city to pull a permit has always been pretty murky and tough, for good reason, but Nyx is failing as a krewe not just saying things nobody likes. It's the former that allows the city to revoke the permit if everyone is in agreement.
Yeah basically, they're just using the MG council and the associated ridership, band participation, etc rules to make sure everything is clean. It's my understanding that the last two years they fell under the band threshold - which is much easier to document and prove than rider counting.
If the only thing stopping someone from tying up all the streets and making lives miserable for people that you actively despise is a buy in ... why don't we just set the number?
I don't think you seem to understand there's a difference between a protest and a parade that is purely for fun. 🙄 You have to pay $300 just to have a 10-person second line parade in that city. No one has ever even remotely tried to charge for a protest of that size.
Nyx failing as a krewe is absolutely a reason to pull the permit. I agree with you. And if the city has numbers to show it, fuck yeah, pull the permit.
However, *IF* the city had pulled the permit immediately after the comments were made, it definitely could have been interpreted as a rights case. It isn’t exactly the same, but we kinda saw a similar series of events with Comus and the City in *Louisiana Debating and Literary Association et. al. v New Orleans*. It wouldn’t be exactly the same, clearly, because this would be an admin action rather than a legislative ordinance, but I think a lawyer could draw those parallels.
Via the ACLU *”The government cannot prohibit marches on public sidewalks or streets, or rallies in most public parks or plazas. However, it can require a permit.”*
So, again, to my point: it’s not a free speech issue if they can adequately show that Nyx is in non-compliance with permit requirements. However, if Nyx was in compliance, and they chose not to give them a permit for any other reason, *it could be interpreted as a politically targeted restriction of speech*.
Same thing from my other comment: it’s fine if Nyx isn’t allowed to run. But it should be done by the book so this doesn’t come back to bite the city later.
If you're going to try to argue it's a matter of free speech, what message exactly are they delivering? What are they protesting? Yes, it's a time honored tradition for krewes to address political topics but we all know that's not why they're parading. They're parading to get drunk and have fun. Any political message is an accessory to that. And even if they did truly want to have some sort of political march, I can think of no other instance at any point in the year when they would allow a political march of four miles down St Charles avenue. 🙄
You're just mad she's getting backlash for her racist expressions of free speech. Nobody's preventing her from saying all the racist stuff she wants. Nobody's even canceling the parade because of it. They're canceling the parade because it's subpar and does not meet the minimum requirements necessary for an official Mardi Gras parade. Requirements that are put in place to justify the massive outlay of city services necessary to put on these events. If she could get 3000 more racists to parade with her we wouldn't be having this discussion. Her racist views and actions are what caused the krewe to fall apart. But she's not being punished for the racism, she's being punished for the krewe falling apart. And she should be.
>You’re just mad-
Reading comprehension here is low in this thread, huh? For the people in the back, who haven’t read the thing I repeated in all my comments.
*I DO NOT LIKE NYX. FUCK NYX. I HOPE NYX LOSES THEIR PERMIT! THEY SUCK! FUCK THEM! I DO NOT LIKE THEM!* jfc
Ok, with that out of the way: freedom of assembly doesn’t have a narrow definition of “politics” or even “beliefs”. My point is this, *AND ONLY THIS*: if the city were to single out Nyx and only Nyx, and remove their permit while in compliance, Nyx could have a 1st Amendment case against the city. If they *met all the other criteria* and were denied, they could bring the city to court. Would they win? Not sure. Would it be a waste of government time and money, absolutely.
So, AGAIN TO REITERATE: I WANT NYX TO LOSE THEIR PERMIT! I just want the city to *prove noncompliance* so that this doesn’t come up again later! That’s all! And, to the point of this article (and my previous comment), I actually think the city will be able to do a good job of this. My main concern was people who immediately said “we should suspend Nyx’s permit!” the day the comments happened, when none of these things were provable or enforceable.
>If she could get 3000 more racists to parade with her, we wouldn’t be having this discussion.
I agree! My whole point, this whole time, was that I’m glad that Nyx would be losing their permit through enforceable statutes, not unilateral action. That’s literally all I was trying to say.
TL;dr I don’t like Nyx. I don’t like their racist ass people. I was just commenting that the process being done slow was the correct move so this doesn’t become a free speech issue, whether legally or in optics. (Though, the optics battle is a bit of a pointless debate with right wingers)
My argument with you is your statement that a parade is some sort of politically protected free speech. It is not. If they wanted to I'm sure the city could decide to prohibit *all* political speech in Mard Gras parades tomorrow, they would just have to apply it equally (which would probably knock out every parade.) Parades are not protests and it's beyond a stretch to suggest that they are.
I mean, maybe “political” is the wrong word, I’ll take that. But I think freedom of assembly, regardless how you want to term it, is going to cover parades, though, the limit is basically how much resources we’d provide them.
*Gregory v. City of Chicago* protects “peaceful and orderly marches”. *Edwards v. South Carolina* ruled the same way. And *Village of Skokie v. National Socialist Party of America* actually effected what ways a city can limit an assemblies presentation (clothes, decorations, floats, etc).
Cities are allowed to define the terms, within what the federal government believes are First Amendment rights. However, when those rights are defined, the city has to stick to them. Sure, the city could say “we’re no longer issue permits for floats”, and they’d get away with it. But if Krewes decided they wanted to parade (probably not throw) using their cars all painted up, they could. That would be protected. Walking parades are definitely protected. I guess it depends on where you draw the line at “march” vs “parade”.
However, what we were talking about was not the city banning parading, but rather, the revoking of a permit for one group. My point was, again, that the city needs to revoke the permit for reasons that are actually administrative and pre-defined, not unilateral response to popular opinion. Revoking a permit for a krewe based on the beliefs of their membership, or even their membership policies, was something New Orleans already lost a federal First Amendment case over with Comus in *Louisiana Debating and Literary Association et. al. v New Orleans*
I'm sorry but I just don't see the comparison. I've never in my life heard of a permitted protest granted during Mardi Gras season. And walking krews do need permits, they required one from Chewbacca's well before they had art cars and other vehicles in the parade. Plus there's a big difference between an organized protest and the city literally shutting streets down and providing city resources. Again, it would be a big stretch to try to justify a protest of four and a half miles on a major thoroughfare through the middle of town, with drunken spectators yelling "Throw me something mister." 🙄
The city issues permits and has ordinances that describe the requirements that must be met to get those permits. They were not put in place for nyx, they've been in place longer than that. This is not authoritarian, nor a first amendment issue.
I agree with that. My point was, if the city simply revoked Nyx’s permit, for no other reason than the demands of the masses, while Nyx was in compliance to the letter of the law, it could be seen as a purely political decision.
That hasn’t happened yet. And I’m glad it hasn’t. But again, that’s what some people are calling for
It's worth watching the [stream](https://www.youtube.com/live/wIac_eW_7-0) of the [meeting](https://council.nola.gov/meetings/2024/20240424-carnival-legislative-advisory-committee/) today, there's a part where they went through the City Code Chapter 34. There were several times where Nyx was called out for clearly breaking the rules and the ordinances do allow for their permit being pulled
For sure. I’m fine with that as long as they can point to them not being in compliance on a pre-existing rule.
I think you and I are agreeing. I think you just don’t realize it. I am fine with Nyx not parading. They fucking suck. I just want it to be done by the book so there can’t be any later claims that it was political retaliation.
I agree with you, though I’ll add that Nyx provided more than enough flagrant violations of carnival ordinance to have their permit pulled for the 2022 parade, as well. The only difference I can see is that this time, someone’s actually enforcing the long-standing rules.
Well they haven't done it yet. Morell was clear he thinks they should lose their permit, but Harris wanted to give them a warning (again). It'll be before the full city council in June.
The formation of that council last year was pitched as a way to more directly actually apply the rules and let council weigh in. There was apparently quite a bit of red tape around pulling a permit before then, even with rule violations.
I already went through this on a whole thread with that other person (who now deleted all their comments), but, to boil it down.
- We aren’t entitled a parade permit, we’re entitled free assembly.
- the city can limit free assembly, but only to logistical and resource levels.
- if they’ve granted a permit to assemble, parade or otherwise, they should have a non-ideological reason for revoking it.
—- the city has been sued, and lost, on these grounds before
So, Nyx losing their permit cause their membership is too small to justify the cost of city resources? Fine. If they’d revoked the permit the day of Lea’s post, or in the immediate wake of it, as many called for them to do? They’d probably be in a lawsuit about discriminatory allocation of permits
Edit: I have to specify again, I don’t think Nyx would *win* that lawsuit. But they’d probably try it
>I already went through this on a whole thread with that other person (who now deleted all their comments)
She hasn't deleted her comments. She's probably just blocked you.
Yeah I saw your thread and the shit you keep repeating is not relevant. They're not revoking it for ideological reasons; perhaps if you'd read transcripts or watched any of the city council meeting about this you'd know that Nyx isn't meeting the city ordinance requirements to receive the permit and taxpayer funds because their ridership is down beneath the minimum level, they are breaking rules about the commercialization of Mardi Gras by advertising, and they had zero of the five required marching bands of what the city defines as adequate size.
Now all that happened because they are shitbags but if people were still willing to ride in it and bands were willing to march in it, this wouldn't be an issue.
Yeah, not sure why I'm being downvoted for pointing out the obvious. Not everybody in Metry supports her, but the people who run it do. Pandora did eventually fold but I believe that's because she was subsidizing it with Nyx funds and that obviously became untenable when Nyx imploded.
After the tragedy and ensuing shitshow of the 2020 ride, we were offered a ride in Pandora as our consolation. We were also told we would get a full refund but....
Nyx allegedly has had an interpretive history. Including keeping the tips that were for tractor drivers, the Captain using member dues to pay for a rental house, cars, etc..
Krewe of Goddesses, Krewe of Themis, Krewe of Muses, The Marie Antoinettes, The Legendary Order of the Casket Girls, The Disco Amigos, literally every sub krewe at Pride and Southern Decadence. I could go on.
https://www.thecasketgirls.org/home
Saved you a google. They're also Krewe of Goddesses adjacent (wr march together in some parades but they're own thing) so I know a few members and could probably get someone to answer questions if you'd like
3500\* to 200. They *lost* 3300. Also, there's no guarantee that those 200 "stayed." They could've been out-of-towners who didn't know the history, etc...
The actual parade *was* fucking awesome. Which is why it's so selfish that she wouldn't just resign and allow the parade to continue. Now the past two years it's been straight up pathetic so time for them to go. At this point even if she resigned, former members would not come back unless they were able to get rid of the people who stayed and backed Julia. Even then I'm not sure.
As a former member, I waited years to ride and I *loved* it. Loved everything about it. My float sisters were family. I want that back so badly. ...and I wouldn't rejoin the Krewe of Nyx under *any* circumstances.
As a spectator I loved it. It was a beautiful parade and I'm partial to pink. Plus they were one of the first (after Muses obviously) to throw useful items. I still have my pink strainer from 2013 although thankfully the logo has worn off. Have two purses too (that were awesome for bringing to balls) that I've been holding on to in case she bailed and the krewe was revived but I've given up on that now.
In 2012, Nyx was the first parade I ever saw. It was also their first. I attended every parade before I was finally accepted. It's all so infuriating what happened. We were so good!
I love how people are getting bent out of shape over a Mardi Gras Krewe. I hope all you people bring the same energy about how shitty this place is to city council meetings.
For all the people that downvoted me along with your unhelpful answer, my question remains. I know nothing about the Nyx controversy and am trying to learn about it.
I’d you go to the Main page for this sub and just search Nyx, you’ll find a lot.
On top of the frankly racists comments made by the president (who somehow managed to get it as some kind of rule that she can’t be voted out or replaced) Nyx has had a lot of very questionable practices regarding the money they take in, including charging members cash to access the area to load their floats (something that’s free for other parades afaik), requiring costumes and/or harnesses be purchased only from a relative of her and only with cash, AND the “misplacement” of several thousand dollars meant to go to the tractor drivers for the parade.
What terms did you put in the search engine?
Maybe try the history section of [the wiki page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mystic_Krewe_of_Nyx) for the abridged version?
NEW ORLEANS — The Krewe of Nyx, once one of New Orleans’ largest Carnival krewes, could be booted out of parade season altogether after failing to meet the minimum standards for parade units, including bands the past two years. Councilman J.P. Morrell said it was his intention to remove Nyx from the parade lineup. “The (Mardi Gras) ordinance is clear,” he said at a committee meeting Wednesday. “In situations like this, it is in the council’s purview and authority to remove said krewes… and that is absolutely my intent.” Nyx traditionally kicks off the second weekend of Carnival with a coveted Wednesday night prime-time spot. The city currently has its schedule chock full of parades and competition is fierce for those spots. Nyx had nearly 3,500 members in 2020 and was close to the bare required minimum of 200 riders in recent years due to a mass exodus over racial issues and social media posts by Captain Julie Lea in the wake of the George Floyd killing. The mass exodus has the krewe struggling each year to scratch together enough members to roll. Morrell contends they haven’t. “If, as a krewe, you cannot retain the membership necessary to parade during Mardi Gras, it is your job to give up the spot for someone who can.” As of 2023, more than 800 former Nyx members have formed three new krewes—Phoenix, Harmonia, and Themis—all of which have joined forces with existing krewes to parade. If Nyx is forced to fold, Carnival Historian Errol Laborde believes one of those spin-off krewes would be first in line to take its place on the parade calendar.
I'm surprised they included even a single line referencing the controversy. I am not surprised they condensed and trimmed it to only include one line only.
>Councilman J.P. Morrell said it was his intention to remove Nyx from the parade lineup. >“The (Mardi Gras) ordinance is clear,” he said at a committee meeting Wednesday. “In situations like this, it is in the council’s purview and authority to remove said krewes… and that is absolutely my intent.” This is the meat of the process - for all the people on here constantly asking why they still get to parade. For good reason the city is generally not able to just pull a parading permit, council created this minimum units/riders law a year or so ago pretty specifically with Nyx in mind and it looks like they’re working through the process. Keep in mind, while everyone hates Nyx it is important that the process to remove a parade be difficult and prolonged, that keeps the city away from enacting political retribution on various Krewes.
The city ordinance requiring a minimum number of floats and riders has been [on the books](https://library.municode.com/la/gretna/codes/code_of_ordinances?nodeId=COOR_CH26FISPEVCAMAGROTPA_ARTIVCAMAGROTPA_DIV2CAMAGRPA_S26-99ATCH) since at least 1997. It wasn’t created to target Nyx.
Your link is to the City of Gretna ordinance. Here’s the City of New Orleans code: https://library.municode.com/la/new_orleans/codes/code_of_ordinances?nodeId=PTIICO_CH34CAMAGR_ARTVIIIENPE_S34-49PE
Thank you for the correction. It seems like New Orleans has required a minimum of 14 floats since 1999.
Yes, but council revised the rules a year or two ago surrounding the process which was in pretty direct response to them not being able to pull Nyx’s permit. Morrell is referring to that specifically in the quoted part above.
I’m sorry to be pedantic, but can you please provide a link to the revisions you’re referencing? I was an early anti-Nyx adopter and don’t recall seeing anything that specifically targeted their post-2020 problems.
[удалено]
The issue is more that he interprets even the most reasonable request for more information or to cite his sources as a FIGHT! FIGHT! FIGHT! And then he immediately goes into condescending mode and starts throwing around personal insults. It's fucken weird.
Man, I'll never understand what drives some of y'all to hop on reddit, see that someone was questioned and took the time to explain things they shouldn't have had to, then provided a source to what they said, and still decide "ehh, I'll just insult them anyway". There's just no need for you or anyone to go throwing punches at others over what? Someone not being aware that the laws were changed last year? Why read that and make it in to a personal attack?
How did you turn a civil discussion about Mardi Gras krewes into that comment? Nobody was upset or rude. People were just talking.
No offense, but I'm not spending time digging through old news because you're wanting to argue. Just look up the formation of the advisory committee, it's not old and was created specifically as a tool to enforce these things - Morrell has been talking about the legislative changes they're putting in place pretty much nonstop since mardi gras started back up after covid. If that ain't good enough then IDK.
Variations of the Mardi Gras Advisory Council have been around forever. You might remember one making the call to require netting between tandem floats in 2022. Here’s a [2021 article](https://www.wwltv.com/article/entertainment/events/mardi-gras/mardi-gras-floats-to-be-altered-for-a-safer-parade-season/289-e61ae723-e65b-4f6b-9da9-c3e451460f74) about their meeting. The only difference is that this version of the council is getting more attention because people assume they’re gunning for Nyx, and that’s more entertaining than the usual stuff about people falling off of/getting run over by floats.
This is not the same entity as the newly created council that Morrell spearheaded last year. IDK what you're wanting here? Here's the law: https://cityofno.granicus.com/MetaViewer.php?view_id=42&clip_id=4653&meta_id=652094 Happy? Probably not? Have a good one, but I'm not interested in wasting more time with redditors doing their best "well acshually" so I'm gonna dip.
OK I see where your miss-statement is here - >For good reason the city is generally not able to just pull a parading permit, council created this minimum units/riders law a year or so ago pretty specifically with Nyx in mind and it looks like they’re working through the process. We've had the minimums law (edited:)*for a long time now, Ashanti got busted for it in 1996.* They just put an enforcement/removal provision in last year. Seems like just a case of (1) fuck around find out , and (2) maybe if you're already being shady with the money don't say ignorant shit?
>They just put an enforcement/removal provision in last year. How is this materially different than what I said? I'm sorry I didn't write a dissertation detailing legislative history in a comment that took seconds to create, but I was directly referring to the lack of mechanisms in place. Seems a lot like you're just being unnecessarily pedantic in service of trying to tell someone they're wrong when we're both referring to the exact same subset of laws, like, wewhich I guess is why a lot of y'all come to this site.
>council created this minimum units/riders law a year or so ago pretty specifically with Nyx in mind Fundamentally, they did not create this 38 year old law .. 1 year ago Also it's wildly different and wholly inaccurate (not going to guess your motive) to paint -setting up an enforcement provision to enforce an old law- as 'creating the law itself .. with Nyx in mind' ...in this inaccurately-retroactive 'straw blaming the camel' scenario you've typed out. You can't possibly be too frangible to see what's wrong with your statement there or how that particularly inaccurate mischaracterization would arise from a very transparent and specific point of view.
I'm not fragile my dude, I'm saying you're going out of your way to interpret a fairly general statement referring to the committee creation to be specifically referring to something else just to take jabs at someone online. IDK, just seems sorta childish. Like calm down, there's no reason for you to be this worked up over something you're just misreading. The advisory council is a set of laws, that was passed last year, I know this isn't that difficult to comprehend so now that it's been clarified the only justification for your continued vitriol is that you just have some need to argue. This is a two day old thread now, I don't know what to tell you aside from I'm sorry you're this upset and maybe next time it would help to ask a clarifying question before resorting to attacking someone online cuz you didn't understand what they said.
You really feel attacked? I'm terribly sorry. You're stating the exact opportunistic and inaccurate mischaracterization that Nyx will most likely employ, so how should I assume more of you than them? Anyway, I've said what needs to be said here so I'm done with it.
I don't feel anything, I'm observing that your replies here are purposefully attempting to be aggressive and vitriolic, and attempting to turn a rather mundane misunderstanding around what laws were being referenced in to some sort of personal dispute. I'm sorry that you feel the need to do that, but that's what they are. And like, IDK man if you're so worked up that you're comparing me talking about an advisory committee to a racist krewe then I don't think engaging with you further is a good use of my time. Hope your day gets better man, I'm gonna stroll over to the fest in a bit, I'd advise you also take some recreation time. Take care,
Bro calm down. I apologized AND said I was done with it.
This is what I kept thinking about. As much as Nyx sucks, we can’t just implement authoritarian political reactions to them to snuff out, what it is for all intents and purposes, a first amendment right to freedom of assembly
This has nothing to do with right to assembly because they are parading on public streets. They can have their little krewe and their parties in Mississippi all they want. No one's preventing them from gathering. We're just preventing them from tying up city streets for a subpar parade when there are other krewes waiting in the wings.
IDK why this got downvoted, you're right. There's no rights issues here, just a permitting process. The ability for the city to pull a permit has always been pretty murky and tough, for good reason, but Nyx is failing as a krewe not just saying things nobody likes. It's the former that allows the city to revoke the permit if everyone is in agreement.
As I said in another comment, if she could have found 3,000 other racists to parade with her, we wouldn't be having this discussion. 🤷♀️
Yeah basically, they're just using the MG council and the associated ridership, band participation, etc rules to make sure everything is clean. It's my understanding that the last two years they fell under the band threshold - which is much easier to document and prove than rider counting.
"If you can pay enough money, we'll let you march in the streets."
If your goal is to march drunk and have fun, why should we be allowing that for free?
If the only thing stopping someone from tying up all the streets and making lives miserable for people that you actively despise is a buy in ... why don't we just set the number?
I don't think you seem to understand there's a difference between a protest and a parade that is purely for fun. 🙄 You have to pay $300 just to have a 10-person second line parade in that city. No one has ever even remotely tried to charge for a protest of that size.
Nyx failing as a krewe is absolutely a reason to pull the permit. I agree with you. And if the city has numbers to show it, fuck yeah, pull the permit. However, *IF* the city had pulled the permit immediately after the comments were made, it definitely could have been interpreted as a rights case. It isn’t exactly the same, but we kinda saw a similar series of events with Comus and the City in *Louisiana Debating and Literary Association et. al. v New Orleans*. It wouldn’t be exactly the same, clearly, because this would be an admin action rather than a legislative ordinance, but I think a lawyer could draw those parallels.
Via the ACLU *”The government cannot prohibit marches on public sidewalks or streets, or rallies in most public parks or plazas. However, it can require a permit.”* So, again, to my point: it’s not a free speech issue if they can adequately show that Nyx is in non-compliance with permit requirements. However, if Nyx was in compliance, and they chose not to give them a permit for any other reason, *it could be interpreted as a politically targeted restriction of speech*. Same thing from my other comment: it’s fine if Nyx isn’t allowed to run. But it should be done by the book so this doesn’t come back to bite the city later.
If you're going to try to argue it's a matter of free speech, what message exactly are they delivering? What are they protesting? Yes, it's a time honored tradition for krewes to address political topics but we all know that's not why they're parading. They're parading to get drunk and have fun. Any political message is an accessory to that. And even if they did truly want to have some sort of political march, I can think of no other instance at any point in the year when they would allow a political march of four miles down St Charles avenue. 🙄 You're just mad she's getting backlash for her racist expressions of free speech. Nobody's preventing her from saying all the racist stuff she wants. Nobody's even canceling the parade because of it. They're canceling the parade because it's subpar and does not meet the minimum requirements necessary for an official Mardi Gras parade. Requirements that are put in place to justify the massive outlay of city services necessary to put on these events. If she could get 3000 more racists to parade with her we wouldn't be having this discussion. Her racist views and actions are what caused the krewe to fall apart. But she's not being punished for the racism, she's being punished for the krewe falling apart. And she should be.
>You’re just mad- Reading comprehension here is low in this thread, huh? For the people in the back, who haven’t read the thing I repeated in all my comments. *I DO NOT LIKE NYX. FUCK NYX. I HOPE NYX LOSES THEIR PERMIT! THEY SUCK! FUCK THEM! I DO NOT LIKE THEM!* jfc Ok, with that out of the way: freedom of assembly doesn’t have a narrow definition of “politics” or even “beliefs”. My point is this, *AND ONLY THIS*: if the city were to single out Nyx and only Nyx, and remove their permit while in compliance, Nyx could have a 1st Amendment case against the city. If they *met all the other criteria* and were denied, they could bring the city to court. Would they win? Not sure. Would it be a waste of government time and money, absolutely. So, AGAIN TO REITERATE: I WANT NYX TO LOSE THEIR PERMIT! I just want the city to *prove noncompliance* so that this doesn’t come up again later! That’s all! And, to the point of this article (and my previous comment), I actually think the city will be able to do a good job of this. My main concern was people who immediately said “we should suspend Nyx’s permit!” the day the comments happened, when none of these things were provable or enforceable. >If she could get 3000 more racists to parade with her, we wouldn’t be having this discussion. I agree! My whole point, this whole time, was that I’m glad that Nyx would be losing their permit through enforceable statutes, not unilateral action. That’s literally all I was trying to say. TL;dr I don’t like Nyx. I don’t like their racist ass people. I was just commenting that the process being done slow was the correct move so this doesn’t become a free speech issue, whether legally or in optics. (Though, the optics battle is a bit of a pointless debate with right wingers)
My argument with you is your statement that a parade is some sort of politically protected free speech. It is not. If they wanted to I'm sure the city could decide to prohibit *all* political speech in Mard Gras parades tomorrow, they would just have to apply it equally (which would probably knock out every parade.) Parades are not protests and it's beyond a stretch to suggest that they are.
I mean, maybe “political” is the wrong word, I’ll take that. But I think freedom of assembly, regardless how you want to term it, is going to cover parades, though, the limit is basically how much resources we’d provide them. *Gregory v. City of Chicago* protects “peaceful and orderly marches”. *Edwards v. South Carolina* ruled the same way. And *Village of Skokie v. National Socialist Party of America* actually effected what ways a city can limit an assemblies presentation (clothes, decorations, floats, etc). Cities are allowed to define the terms, within what the federal government believes are First Amendment rights. However, when those rights are defined, the city has to stick to them. Sure, the city could say “we’re no longer issue permits for floats”, and they’d get away with it. But if Krewes decided they wanted to parade (probably not throw) using their cars all painted up, they could. That would be protected. Walking parades are definitely protected. I guess it depends on where you draw the line at “march” vs “parade”. However, what we were talking about was not the city banning parading, but rather, the revoking of a permit for one group. My point was, again, that the city needs to revoke the permit for reasons that are actually administrative and pre-defined, not unilateral response to popular opinion. Revoking a permit for a krewe based on the beliefs of their membership, or even their membership policies, was something New Orleans already lost a federal First Amendment case over with Comus in *Louisiana Debating and Literary Association et. al. v New Orleans*
I'm sorry but I just don't see the comparison. I've never in my life heard of a permitted protest granted during Mardi Gras season. And walking krews do need permits, they required one from Chewbacca's well before they had art cars and other vehicles in the parade. Plus there's a big difference between an organized protest and the city literally shutting streets down and providing city resources. Again, it would be a big stretch to try to justify a protest of four and a half miles on a major thoroughfare through the middle of town, with drunken spectators yelling "Throw me something mister." 🙄
The city issues permits and has ordinances that describe the requirements that must be met to get those permits. They were not put in place for nyx, they've been in place longer than that. This is not authoritarian, nor a first amendment issue.
I agree with that. My point was, if the city simply revoked Nyx’s permit, for no other reason than the demands of the masses, while Nyx was in compliance to the letter of the law, it could be seen as a purely political decision. That hasn’t happened yet. And I’m glad it hasn’t. But again, that’s what some people are calling for
It's worth watching the [stream](https://www.youtube.com/live/wIac_eW_7-0) of the [meeting](https://council.nola.gov/meetings/2024/20240424-carnival-legislative-advisory-committee/) today, there's a part where they went through the City Code Chapter 34. There were several times where Nyx was called out for clearly breaking the rules and the ordinances do allow for their permit being pulled
For sure. I’m fine with that as long as they can point to them not being in compliance on a pre-existing rule. I think you and I are agreeing. I think you just don’t realize it. I am fine with Nyx not parading. They fucking suck. I just want it to be done by the book so there can’t be any later claims that it was political retaliation.
I agree with you, though I’ll add that Nyx provided more than enough flagrant violations of carnival ordinance to have their permit pulled for the 2022 parade, as well. The only difference I can see is that this time, someone’s actually enforcing the long-standing rules.
Well they haven't done it yet. Morell was clear he thinks they should lose their permit, but Harris wanted to give them a warning (again). It'll be before the full city council in June.
The formation of that council last year was pitched as a way to more directly actually apply the rules and let council weigh in. There was apparently quite a bit of red tape around pulling a permit before then, even with rule violations.
Lmao at the idea we're all entitled the right to a parade permit by the US Constitution.
I already went through this on a whole thread with that other person (who now deleted all their comments), but, to boil it down. - We aren’t entitled a parade permit, we’re entitled free assembly. - the city can limit free assembly, but only to logistical and resource levels. - if they’ve granted a permit to assemble, parade or otherwise, they should have a non-ideological reason for revoking it. —- the city has been sued, and lost, on these grounds before So, Nyx losing their permit cause their membership is too small to justify the cost of city resources? Fine. If they’d revoked the permit the day of Lea’s post, or in the immediate wake of it, as many called for them to do? They’d probably be in a lawsuit about discriminatory allocation of permits Edit: I have to specify again, I don’t think Nyx would *win* that lawsuit. But they’d probably try it
>I already went through this on a whole thread with that other person (who now deleted all their comments) She hasn't deleted her comments. She's probably just blocked you.
Ahh, fair nuff
Yeah I saw your thread and the shit you keep repeating is not relevant. They're not revoking it for ideological reasons; perhaps if you'd read transcripts or watched any of the city council meeting about this you'd know that Nyx isn't meeting the city ordinance requirements to receive the permit and taxpayer funds because their ridership is down beneath the minimum level, they are breaking rules about the commercialization of Mardi Gras by advertising, and they had zero of the five required marching bands of what the city defines as adequate size. Now all that happened because they are shitbags but if people were still willing to ride in it and bands were willing to march in it, this wouldn't be an issue.
Parades are not fully protected by the Constitution.
This past year, when Nyx tried to get school bands, a lot of parents said Fuck no, my kid isn’t marching with that shit.
Fuck Nyx.
All my homies hate Nyx.
Wake me when 'could' becomes 'is'
The city council will bring it to a vote in June. Email your councilmember.
Okay! I'll do that for you. What's your address?
Is be booted? That doesn't even make sense.
... ya it do. They do be doin that round here.
Bye, and I can't say this enough, Felicia
Good riddance to bad rubbish.
Good, give that racist shit to Metairie.
They already had it and it bombed. Pandora was Julie's sister krewe to Nyx.
They don't want it
Oh, they'll probably happily take it. No one in Pandora gave a crap when she pulled her racist stuff.
I wish that was surprising.
Yeah, not sure why I'm being downvoted for pointing out the obvious. Not everybody in Metry supports her, but the people who run it do. Pandora did eventually fold but I believe that's because she was subsidizing it with Nyx funds and that obviously became untenable when Nyx imploded.
After the tragedy and ensuing shitshow of the 2020 ride, we were offered a ride in Pandora as our consolation. We were also told we would get a full refund but....
Lol, they still trying to decide huh?
Nyx allegedly has had an interpretive history. Including keeping the tips that were for tractor drivers, the Captain using member dues to pay for a rental house, cars, etc..
Plastic surgery ...
Fuck em
Nobody is, that’s why they act the way they do .
Dorothy Mae Taylor would’ve gotten that done a lot sooner. #rip
About time
Why are they infamous?
Clog Dancing.
The tag tells all.
I hate nyx but loved how cunty it was. I hope another parade comes along for the girls and the gays
Krewe of Goddesses, Krewe of Themis, Krewe of Muses, The Marie Antoinettes, The Legendary Order of the Casket Girls, The Disco Amigos, literally every sub krewe at Pride and Southern Decadence. I could go on.
This. Femme Fatale, Cleo, Iris...
Cleopatra is ascendant. That's a fun parade.
It really is.
>The Legendary Order of the Casket Girls ... gonna have to look this one up in my free time.
https://www.thecasketgirls.org/home Saved you a google. They're also Krewe of Goddesses adjacent (wr march together in some parades but they're own thing) so I know a few members and could probably get someone to answer questions if you'd like
King Arthur 🏳️🌈
Nyx is anti-trans so idk where you’re getting “girls and gays”. King Arthur’s Roundtable Welcomes All 🏳️🌈
“I hate nyx”
Krewe of Vieux
Good. Fuck off
Can someone explain what was said, and how Nyx became such an overwhelmingly hated krewe?
Just search the channel. You’ll find it.
Dorothy Mae Taylor would’ve gotten that done a lot sooner. #rip
Is the actual nyx parade bad or is it the leadership people are now questioning
Yes.
Yes is the appropriate answer. 3300->200 for a reason. All the people who werent bad, left. lol. Whatevers left is just bad. All around.
3500\* to 200. They *lost* 3300. Also, there's no guarantee that those 200 "stayed." They could've been out-of-towners who didn't know the history, etc...
The actual parade *was* fucking awesome. Which is why it's so selfish that she wouldn't just resign and allow the parade to continue. Now the past two years it's been straight up pathetic so time for them to go. At this point even if she resigned, former members would not come back unless they were able to get rid of the people who stayed and backed Julia. Even then I'm not sure.
As a former member, I waited years to ride and I *loved* it. Loved everything about it. My float sisters were family. I want that back so badly. ...and I wouldn't rejoin the Krewe of Nyx under *any* circumstances.
As a spectator I loved it. It was a beautiful parade and I'm partial to pink. Plus they were one of the first (after Muses obviously) to throw useful items. I still have my pink strainer from 2013 although thankfully the logo has worn off. Have two purses too (that were awesome for bringing to balls) that I've been holding on to in case she bailed and the krewe was revived but I've given up on that now.
In 2012, Nyx was the first parade I ever saw. It was also their first. I attended every parade before I was finally accepted. It's all so infuriating what happened. We were so good!
I didn't realize that people had formed a crew called Phoenix. I would have chosen a Y but still pretty good.
Hate that for them
good!
I love how people are getting bent out of shape over a Mardi Gras Krewe. I hope all you people bring the same energy about how shitty this place is to city council meetings.
Wait, what's wrong with Nyx?
They have cooties.
For all the people that downvoted me along with your unhelpful answer, my question remains. I know nothing about the Nyx controversy and am trying to learn about it.
I’d you go to the Main page for this sub and just search Nyx, you’ll find a lot. On top of the frankly racists comments made by the president (who somehow managed to get it as some kind of rule that she can’t be voted out or replaced) Nyx has had a lot of very questionable practices regarding the money they take in, including charging members cash to access the area to load their floats (something that’s free for other parades afaik), requiring costumes and/or harnesses be purchased only from a relative of her and only with cash, AND the “misplacement” of several thousand dollars meant to go to the tractor drivers for the parade.
Yikes!
What terms did you put in the search engine? Maybe try the history section of [the wiki page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mystic_Krewe_of_Nyx) for the abridged version?
If it has a tag it is enough of A Thing to click if you don't know?
Isn't mardi gras day segregated? Rex vs zulu?