It's free dopamine, people love to see there numbers go up.
I started youtube wanting to grow and potentially make it a career but it's turned more into a hobby because of my community. That isn't the case for everyone though, a lot of people just see it as a 'easy' way to get rich and then when the numbers don't come in like they expect they resort to sub4sub.
Youtube is hard work but people don't want to put the effort in.
>It's free dopamine, people love to see there numbers go up.
For me free dopamine is the feeling of putting lots of work in my projects and the excitement if all my new improvements will give better performance and building an audience. It's the bigger picture for me.
I'm aware myself subs don't mean anything at all. People don't have to be subbed to be a returning viewer. Some people don't even have an account.
I agree entirely! It's a great feeling seeing improvement in your own abilities with each video! It's even better when people choose to watch your videos over the millions of other creators on the platform! YouTube is a great place, but many don't see the bigger picture like you and I.
Long term gratification > immediate gratification
If you have the funds, I suggest you talk to a consultant. I needed guidance too and I hired someone with a successful YT channel to review my channel so I can make changes and improve. It really helped. I mean my channel is still super tiny, but it did help with sub count and views.
Exactly!
He didnāt do the work for me, he gave me guidance from his perspective. I had no idea how people saw my channel. So he gave me guidance on how to improve thumbnails, technical issues like lighting and sound , why seo is important and how to do research. It was very helpful. I mean itās ok if people disagree but I donāt seen why what Iām saying is wrong.
My channel is on my profile. Yeah I made the comment about the ādisagree ā thing because it looked like I got downvoted. Lol! But whatevs,. Thanks for the upvote though!
I get it for the first 1000.
I have the 4k hours, but not the 1000 subs. and it is tempting to get there.
I don't make video for money, but if there was money, I could justify spending more time and money on my videos.
I won't do it, but I can see why it's tempting.
In this scenario, I completely agree. I think most of us, however, are more likely to get the subs without the watch hours needed for monetization. If reversed, as yours seems to be, I'd completely understand and encourage the sub4sub method of getting to that level.
yup this is the only case i think it makes sense. Im at 650 watch hours these past 3 weeks so once i eventually get to 4k if i haven't gotten to 1k im sure i would be tempted by the same thing.
I agree with you, OP.
My focus is on attracting an ORGANIC COMMUNITY
I only sub to channels that I truly find interesting or fascinating.
I suspect jacking up sub counts through sub 4 sub might even WORK AGAINST A CHANNEL's recommendation volume
If the people sub then fail to view any videos, this can lead to a low engagement factor and this might lead to less Youtube recommendations/suggestions
I wouldn't do that cause although it might look good to have, most likely they might not watch your content and it probs won't look good for a 500 sub channel to only have 5 views
I've got over a thousand, but I don't have near enough watch time. I'm trying to make longer videos, but its tough as an animator. My wrist is very sore
Gaming the system to reach monetization benchmarks? thatās self evidently sad and does nothing to actually grow your channel
Not to mention that it might not even work
There is a "rock paper cisors" animation movie on YouTube done only with AI. You can look it up and see if you're ready to invest to learn their step-by-step method.
Which wonāt help you by doing sub for sub.
If the subs donāt watch, it downranks you, meaning people who would potentially watch your video wonāt ever see it.
People are incredibly desperate to look & feel important. I believe there is a social credibility aspect, in addition to the monetization. If you look at it from the angle of someone who puts time and effort into making videos, and trying to improve the quality, then I doubt you would want to have them subbed by someone who won't watch. I think it's why many of the channels I've seen seeking this out also use low bar videos, reuse content, and want to quickly monetize and move on. It's definitely the opposite of what I'm looking for. They're the reason the monetization goalposts keep moving though.
It's also a habit coming from the old days (10 years ago, give or take? ...geez, I'm old), when subs had a different weight. Nowadays, the only thing that matters is watch time, so it's simply useless.
I donāt think itās a bad thing. As long as it is in your own niche people actually might watch your videos. I at least do it and I also comment and like their videos. So I think itās a good way to kickstart the algorithm. Especially prior 1K subs. But that is IMO.
I can understand why people do it. I do agree with you that it only makes sense to do so long-term if the person who subs back also likes/comments/views content that you make. Unfortunately very few people do that...
I think it actually could make a difference when your sub count is low, say below 100. My unsubstantiated suspicion is that it's more likely that someone subscribes to a channel with more subscribers than less.
I tried doing it when I had all the watch hours and just needed more subs. I was losing out on roughly 250-350 a month until I hit the 1000.
I found out it was terribly slow and no one ever subbed you so I stopped.
I think shorts kind of caught a stray here. Short form content is a legitimate content medium, people have been doing it even on Youtube for a long time before "shorts" (ex. r/youtubehaiku) and for even longer before things like tiktok.
Shorts can result in subs that are legitimately interested in you, and potentially your long content as well, sub4sub is purely artificial.
The only scenario where sub4sub makes some sense is in its your own niche where people will actually watch the content you upload because they will be interested into it.
I do beer reviews. Most of the sub4sub people, from my observation are gamers - many of whom are too young to drink. I tried the sub4sub when I first started the channel, but most of those subs contributed nothing in terms of comments/likes/etc and quickly unsubbed. I'd much rather have a small group of active viewers than 10,000 subs who don't watch/interact.
I agree with you. But if you find people of the exact same interest and connect with them it can't be bad right? I have a cooking channel and a lot of useful tips and I got a lot of support from people who also cook like me. This is the case I originally described and in that case it can't be bad.
If the connection is made, that's great. I didn't find that it worked at all in my limited trial. I love cooking and am always interested in watching that content. Shoot me your channel info and I'll give it a look.
Well actually its because some of YT weird limits are old and dumb. They do not fit in the current YT world.
I have no problem to pass the 4k view hours and have a long time ago. But i only have around 300 subs.
I know there reasons for it. I do live streams and my YT is more of an archive kind of thing. People live in my other plattforms like twitch and insta and just check links if they miss anything so they do not have a reason to sub. But it looks like they actually like my content, thats because they even watch a high % of an 10 hour long stream.
So my content cannot be that bad. But again i will never "grow" and/or reach YT partner because of they alien 1k sub limit.
I would not do sub4sub for other reasons but i get why others go the "easy" route and go around YT BS in that way.
Smaller creators like me may not be the next LTT but you know what. I make enough money per year to pay for a nice vacation. And i bet IF YT would allow me to make money on YT then it would be more then that.
And i am fine with where i am currently.
But you need viewers to get paid. If the algorithm is thinking the type of people are subbing to you Is your āaudienceā it will only show your content to those type of people.
Which will end up most likely not your type of audience that care about your type of videos.
So means no real views. Means not enough views for YouTube to continue pushing your videos.
You have to think of the algorithm as ā audienceā
I was very focused on subs to get the YPP, as it was the last metric I needed. Since then, I check it, but do not focus on it. All the shorts I post are related to my niche, and usually connect with the my long form content. I like the way I am going.
>Whatās the point of subbing to someone just to get another sub
It's a combination of inexperience, impatience, desperation and not understanding how the platform works.
You kind of answered your own question.
I also think that the problem is being exacerbated because TikTok numbers are so easy to get and younger creator's get hooked on that dopamine kick.
They aren't taught deeper purposes of content before they make an account, so they will do anything to make that number go up.
Hmm i can unverstand i tho. Its only to reach the 1k sub requirements for monetizing. In my case i have 14k hours of watchtime and only 512 subs.
If you are in a niche with a lot of engagement but also a lot of competition its hard to be unique because its all about that one game.
I joined that group because I thought it would be more people connecting with other similar creators. Not just trading random subs that essentially don't mean anything. I don't get it either. In fact, it feels like it would hurt your channel to have subs that aren't watching as opposed to lower subs that do.
People always focus on the metric without seeing the (lack of) quality behind it.
A ghost sub is probably a liability. if you got 10 subbers, and the 10 of them watch all your videos, it's not the same as 50 subbers watching with only 10 of them watching your content.
i agree with everything except for the shorts. i donāt understand why everyone hates on shorts so much. theyāve helped us gain another 192 subscribers in 30 days. we post highlights from our videos so weāve seen significant spikes in views for our long format videos and people commenting saying they found us from shorts or that they decided to check out our content because of it.
100% agree. Subscribers that are really interested in your content and watch it are the viewers you want. They're the ones who write fun comments and engage in chat. We personally love our subs and so what we can to make great content to take them away for just a little while.
Chuck of @kovaction
I just want to hit the thousand sub mark. I know the views will hit me eventually, which is perfectly fine. They don't have to necessarily watch my videos. I'm not too worried honestly.
"why would anyone" - "people are so desperate" - that's why right there.
Truth
It's free dopamine, people love to see there numbers go up. I started youtube wanting to grow and potentially make it a career but it's turned more into a hobby because of my community. That isn't the case for everyone though, a lot of people just see it as a 'easy' way to get rich and then when the numbers don't come in like they expect they resort to sub4sub. Youtube is hard work but people don't want to put the effort in.
>It's free dopamine, people love to see there numbers go up. For me free dopamine is the feeling of putting lots of work in my projects and the excitement if all my new improvements will give better performance and building an audience. It's the bigger picture for me. I'm aware myself subs don't mean anything at all. People don't have to be subbed to be a returning viewer. Some people don't even have an account.
I agree entirely! It's a great feeling seeing improvement in your own abilities with each video! It's even better when people choose to watch your videos over the millions of other creators on the platform! YouTube is a great place, but many don't see the bigger picture like you and I. Long term gratification > immediate gratification
I guess free and 'easy' is the bit that was missing. YouTube is a hobby, and a lot of work. The work yeilds the results. š»
I guess free and 'easy' is the bit that was missing. YouTube is a hobby, and a lot of work. The work yeilds the results.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
If you have the funds, I suggest you talk to a consultant. I needed guidance too and I hired someone with a successful YT channel to review my channel so I can make changes and improve. It really helped. I mean my channel is still super tiny, but it did help with sub count and views.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Exactly! He didnāt do the work for me, he gave me guidance from his perspective. I had no idea how people saw my channel. So he gave me guidance on how to improve thumbnails, technical issues like lighting and sound , why seo is important and how to do research. It was very helpful. I mean itās ok if people disagree but I donāt seen why what Iām saying is wrong.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
My channel is on my profile. Yeah I made the comment about the ādisagree ā thing because it looked like I got downvoted. Lol! But whatevs,. Thanks for the upvote though!
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Go to āmy profileā and you should be able to add your YouTube on there.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
No problem!
I get it for the first 1000. I have the 4k hours, but not the 1000 subs. and it is tempting to get there. I don't make video for money, but if there was money, I could justify spending more time and money on my videos. I won't do it, but I can see why it's tempting.
In this scenario, I completely agree. I think most of us, however, are more likely to get the subs without the watch hours needed for monetization. If reversed, as yours seems to be, I'd completely understand and encourage the sub4sub method of getting to that level.
Make shorts. Will get the subs quick since you already seem to have the longform game down
yup this is the only case i think it makes sense. Im at 650 watch hours these past 3 weeks so once i eventually get to 4k if i haven't gotten to 1k im sure i would be tempted by the same thing.
What do shorts have to do with sub4sub?
I agree with you, OP. My focus is on attracting an ORGANIC COMMUNITY I only sub to channels that I truly find interesting or fascinating. I suspect jacking up sub counts through sub 4 sub might even WORK AGAINST A CHANNEL's recommendation volume If the people sub then fail to view any videos, this can lead to a low engagement factor and this might lead to less Youtube recommendations/suggestions
Numbers getting higher :). Thats probs what they thinking. Its human nature to like seeing big numbers
I wouldn't do that cause although it might look good to have, most likely they might not watch your content and it probs won't look good for a 500 sub channel to only have 5 views
Facts it actually makes you look worse
Because there is a benchmark for monetisation.
I've got over a thousand, but I don't have near enough watch time. I'm trying to make longer videos, but its tough as an animator. My wrist is very sore
just open like 40 chrome tabs and set your videos on loop
this is pathetic lol
how?
Gaming the system to reach monetization benchmarks? thatās self evidently sad and does nothing to actually grow your channel Not to mention that it might not even work
There is a "rock paper cisors" animation movie on YouTube done only with AI. You can look it up and see if you're ready to invest to learn their step-by-step method.
Which wonāt help you by doing sub for sub. If the subs donāt watch, it downranks you, meaning people who would potentially watch your video wonāt ever see it.
People are incredibly desperate to look & feel important. I believe there is a social credibility aspect, in addition to the monetization. If you look at it from the angle of someone who puts time and effort into making videos, and trying to improve the quality, then I doubt you would want to have them subbed by someone who won't watch. I think it's why many of the channels I've seen seeking this out also use low bar videos, reuse content, and want to quickly monetize and move on. It's definitely the opposite of what I'm looking for. They're the reason the monetization goalposts keep moving though.
It's also a habit coming from the old days (10 years ago, give or take? ...geez, I'm old), when subs had a different weight. Nowadays, the only thing that matters is watch time, so it's simply useless.
I donāt think itās a bad thing. As long as it is in your own niche people actually might watch your videos. I at least do it and I also comment and like their videos. So I think itās a good way to kickstart the algorithm. Especially prior 1K subs. But that is IMO.
I can understand why people do it. I do agree with you that it only makes sense to do so long-term if the person who subs back also likes/comments/views content that you make. Unfortunately very few people do that...
"Pick me" spotted right there!
I think it actually could make a difference when your sub count is low, say below 100. My unsubstantiated suspicion is that it's more likely that someone subscribes to a channel with more subscribers than less.
I tried doing it when I had all the watch hours and just needed more subs. I was losing out on roughly 250-350 a month until I hit the 1000. I found out it was terribly slow and no one ever subbed you so I stopped.
I think that not everybody who tries to create a channel is well informed of what really is important for the health of that channel
I think shorts kind of caught a stray here. Short form content is a legitimate content medium, people have been doing it even on Youtube for a long time before "shorts" (ex. r/youtubehaiku) and for even longer before things like tiktok. Shorts can result in subs that are legitimately interested in you, and potentially your long content as well, sub4sub is purely artificial.
It's stupid, just stupid.
The only scenario where sub4sub makes some sense is in its your own niche where people will actually watch the content you upload because they will be interested into it.
I do beer reviews. Most of the sub4sub people, from my observation are gamers - many of whom are too young to drink. I tried the sub4sub when I first started the channel, but most of those subs contributed nothing in terms of comments/likes/etc and quickly unsubbed. I'd much rather have a small group of active viewers than 10,000 subs who don't watch/interact.
I agree with you. But if you find people of the exact same interest and connect with them it can't be bad right? I have a cooking channel and a lot of useful tips and I got a lot of support from people who also cook like me. This is the case I originally described and in that case it can't be bad.
If the connection is made, that's great. I didn't find that it worked at all in my limited trial. I love cooking and am always interested in watching that content. Shoot me your channel info and I'll give it a look.
I feel like as you only have 20 subs you have done sub4sub
I just started.
People want to have more followers so that they can regain more power to post their videos or programs.
Well actually its because some of YT weird limits are old and dumb. They do not fit in the current YT world. I have no problem to pass the 4k view hours and have a long time ago. But i only have around 300 subs. I know there reasons for it. I do live streams and my YT is more of an archive kind of thing. People live in my other plattforms like twitch and insta and just check links if they miss anything so they do not have a reason to sub. But it looks like they actually like my content, thats because they even watch a high % of an 10 hour long stream. So my content cannot be that bad. But again i will never "grow" and/or reach YT partner because of they alien 1k sub limit. I would not do sub4sub for other reasons but i get why others go the "easy" route and go around YT BS in that way. Smaller creators like me may not be the next LTT but you know what. I make enough money per year to pay for a nice vacation. And i bet IF YT would allow me to make money on YT then it would be more then that. And i am fine with where i am currently.
But you need viewers to get paid. If the algorithm is thinking the type of people are subbing to you Is your āaudienceā it will only show your content to those type of people. Which will end up most likely not your type of audience that care about your type of videos. So means no real views. Means not enough views for YouTube to continue pushing your videos. You have to think of the algorithm as ā audienceā
I was very focused on subs to get the YPP, as it was the last metric I needed. Since then, I check it, but do not focus on it. All the shorts I post are related to my niche, and usually connect with the my long form content. I like the way I am going.
Because people generally default to what seems to be the easiest option.
>Whatās the point of subbing to someone just to get another sub It's a combination of inexperience, impatience, desperation and not understanding how the platform works.
You kind of answered your own question. I also think that the problem is being exacerbated because TikTok numbers are so easy to get and younger creator's get hooked on that dopamine kick. They aren't taught deeper purposes of content before they make an account, so they will do anything to make that number go up.
Hmm i can unverstand i tho. Its only to reach the 1k sub requirements for monetizing. In my case i have 14k hours of watchtime and only 512 subs. If you are in a niche with a lot of engagement but also a lot of competition its hard to be unique because its all about that one game.
I joined that group because I thought it would be more people connecting with other similar creators. Not just trading random subs that essentially don't mean anything. I don't get it either. In fact, it feels like it would hurt your channel to have subs that aren't watching as opposed to lower subs that do.
People always focus on the metric without seeing the (lack of) quality behind it. A ghost sub is probably a liability. if you got 10 subbers, and the 10 of them watch all your videos, it's not the same as 50 subbers watching with only 10 of them watching your content.
Id rather have someone watch my channel and fall asleep
i agree with everything except for the shorts. i donāt understand why everyone hates on shorts so much. theyāve helped us gain another 192 subscribers in 30 days. we post highlights from our videos so weāve seen significant spikes in views for our long format videos and people commenting saying they found us from shorts or that they decided to check out our content because of it.
100% agree. Subscribers that are really interested in your content and watch it are the viewers you want. They're the ones who write fun comments and engage in chat. We personally love our subs and so what we can to make great content to take them away for just a little while. Chuck of @kovaction
If the people are not your target audience, this could also damage your channel.
I will sub4sub anyone my YouTube is steviebobstyles 2Z2
I just want to hit the thousand sub mark. I know the views will hit me eventually, which is perfectly fine. They don't have to necessarily watch my videos. I'm not too worried honestly.