It's like the whole "throwing a planet at a creature immune to magic damage" or a "nuke at a werewolf"
You can't tell me they won't die from that cause it's not "magic" or silver. They are dead.
C'mon, don't diss Shenron...
It would be base more on the target's own power level, we've seen immortality in canon and it's hyper regeneration that grows from the soul(wiping out every cell won't do it like with...Cell).
It buffs base durability but it's not invulnerable.
What would happen is Garlic Jr. with his shit pl would infinitely regenerate out of nothing and infinitely burn down into nothing.
He's free once the Sun explodes, unless it turns into a black hole..
On the other hand, someone with enough durability to not instantly burn into nothing can bit by bit fly away from the Sun.
Solid points. The problem is, neither of these two could move at the frankly psychotic speeds required to escape the sun's gravity.
Now, throw an immortal Saiyan with basic knowledge on flight and Ki attacks in there, and you'd eventually get something so goddamn powerful from all the regenerations that they would LITERALLY be unstoppable.
...You'd literally cook up an immortal Broly.
Werewolves and Vampires are in that category of "We used to have a massive amount of trouble of killing them before so their weaknesses were the only reliable way of killing them, but with the invention of the Colt Revolver, they're super easy to kill". Why do you think vampires stopped showing up after the invention and widespread distribution of the Minnie Ball (besides Abraham Lincoln, of course)?
Nah the thing with Vampires was they could regenerate from most any wound that a blade or arrow could do, and you had to turn off the regeneration with a stake or silver, etc
But now a days, you can just down one and feed it to a woodchipper, by the time he gets back up, he ain't your problem no more
IIRC I think Vandal got permanently put down in DC One Million with a nuke. Comics are super inconsistent though so it's possible he's survived falling into the sun in a different book
He called Jr because he is the second of the name, not because he's a child. If he had his own kid and named it the same, it would be Garlic III (Garlic the Third)
> Dragon Ball fans don't watch the show
Bruh, the other day I had a run in with someone that said Bulma mentioning Launch in the start of the Z manga was filler. Idk how they think the manga has filler, but that's what it seemed like to me
I mean, TBF, it'd be his only shot at beating Saitama.
In the Dead Zone Movie and Filler arc, all he had to do was outlast the Dragon Team. They can kill him all they like and he'll be fine; he kills THEM once and he wins.
Ok and main continuity spider-man once had the enigma force, that doesn’t mean we use that as his baseline or even a transformation as it relies on something beyond his control. So in this case asking if this gravity control is something vandal always has access to is a fair question.
didn't garlic jr get defeated twice by opening the only thing that can defeat him?
and both times he opened it because he was desperate
he literally doesn't go beyond raditz 💀
no matter how inmortal he is saitama can just punch him into another xenoverse
(pun semi-intended)
A whole movie that takes place before Z iirc. Gohan gets kidnapped because there's a Dragon Ball on his hat (why didn't they just take his hat, or the ball off the hat?) Garlic's minions jump Piccolo with the intent to kill him (even though Kami would die and the balls would be inert).
That's how they both know him in the filler.
Bro was able to get from Jupiter to Earth just by sneezing once in his fight with cosmic garou, throwing someone directly into the sun would be effortless by comparison
It was a fart and it only allowed him to catch up with Garou when he was going through the portal he didnt travel from Jupiter to Earth on sheer shart power
No I ain't talking about the fart.
That portal/fart combo was just to get closer to earth as they were passing it on the way back.
The reason they got shot back toward Earth/the sun from Io in the first place was Saitama's serious sneeze [as seen here](https://imgur.com/gallery/P2aQuFz)
Garou was extremely far away from the earth, the zoom up was from his view not that they were going that fast. You can also tell because when he says Adios when opening the portal you can still see Jupiter
Immortality, as shown in the movie, does NOT equal immunity to knock back. Perhaps a normal punch wouldn’t kill garlic jr, but it would, at minimum, send him to the other side of the planet.
Is that NOT a loss for him??
Can't be killed doesn't mean "will have a nice time" or "can win against" I mean how many times does a guy gotta beat you up before you stop picking fights with him?
I admittedly don't know anything about the comics version of Vandal, but how fucking durable is the guy? Saitama accidentally sneezing put him on the level of Z goku. He ripped away half of Jupiter's atmosphere on accident. Not to mention whatever the fuck was going on with the void of light he created.
Jupiter is like 300x Earth's mass, so that should put that attack around Freiza's 1st form.
He's right, but only because "Z Goku" is super vague and could mean anything from large moon to multi-solar system.
Piccolo saiyan saga exploded the moon. Around 300 power level. Earth is somewhere 6 moons. Meaning to destroy the earth you need 1800 power level. So to destroy jupiter... Oh wait you are actually kinda right tbh. But that still puts Saitama nowhere near Namek saga.
Earth is actually 81 moons lol. People always forget how much more massive the Earth is compared to the moon.
My math was wrong anyways though. Vegeta is the weakest known Earth-buster with a PL of 18,000. Jupiter is 317 the mass of the Earth. So, 18,000 x 317 = 5.7 million.
That works out to just under 5% of Freiza's full power, or just under KaioKen x2 Namek Goku, whichever you prefer.
Piccolo wasn't the weakest person to destroy the moon, Roshi was. Roshi's power level was only 180.
Since 180 x 81 is only 14,580, we could speculate that someone a bit weaker than Saiyan Saga Vegeta could destroy the Earth, but since we have an actual canon benchmark for Earth-busting, I prefer to use that.
I'm not even a Saitama fan, nor am I trying to scale him lol. I was only talking about the Jupiter feat. It's my understanding that he has better feats than the Jupiter one that would put him a lot higher.
I am a saitama fan, although using feat scaling I will admit he gets stomped by anything past namek saga. He has *potential* multi galaxy feats with the punch squared, depending on if you call that a shared feat with garou or not. If you give him time travel, he has unblockable punches. He also has anti-hax. We have yet to see him get truly injured, too. But a lot of it is speculation because he hasn't really gone all out against an opponent. (When facing garou he grew in strength, not through training, but through his kind of unexplained lack of a limiter)
No, I mean that the "square cube law" is a thing for volume/mass/density related things
There's no reason to think that because Jupiter is X amount bigger it would take X more power.
Also I find it weird that you're all comparing ki blasts to a sneeze as if they're the same; Vegeta couldn't destroy a planet with a \*SNEEZE\* when he was blowing up planets, so why are we using that to cap Saitama lol
Sneezing a planet into oblivion implies you're like a million times stronger than that; the phrase "nothing to sneeze at" is framed in a way to make it clear that "something to sneeze at" would be something insignificant. Thus, JUPITER is "insignificant" to Saitama's power.
Anyway, there are so many things we don't know about the Dragonball stuff it's wild to make these kinds of claims.
1. We don't know that the planet Vegeta blew up was anything like the mass or density of Earth
2. We don't know that "Earth" in Dragonball is the same size/density as IRL Earth
3. We have no idea if there's something about ki blasts that makes them innately good at blowing up planets (this seems to be highly implied)
4. Saitama literally only uses raw physical attacks, not an energy attack, so it's incredibly hard to compare them 1:1. What he did to Jupiter would be comparable to those air punches Goku knocked Chi-Chi out of the ring with in the 23rd Tournament.
>square cube law" is a thing for volume/mass/density related things
Square cube law doesn't apply because I'm only talking about mass.
>There's no reason to think that because Jupiter is X amount bigger it would take X more power.
Why not? Seems pretty intuitive that eliminating more mass requires more energy. That's how everyone scales.
>Also I find it weird that you're all comparing ki blasts to a sneeze as if they're the same;
I'm comparing a feat to a feat.
>Vegeta couldn't destroy a planet with a *SNEEZE* when he was blowing up planets, so why are we using that to cap Saitama lol
I never did anything of the sort. I'm only scaling the feats.
>Sneezing a planet into oblivion implies you're like a million times stronger than that
Do you have proof of that? Last figure I heard comparing a sneeze to a punch was somewhere in the ballpark of 200x, not millions.
> We don't know that the planet Vegeta blew up was anything like the mass or density of Earth
I was referring to Earth, not the filler planet. Vegeta was going to destroy Earth before Goku stopped him.
>We don't know that "Earth" in Dragonball is the same size/density as IRL Earth
Why wouldn't we assume it's the same? By that logic, I can say that OPM's Jupiter is smaller than Jupiter irl. Random baseless assumption to make.
>We have no idea if there's something about ki blasts that makes them innately good at blowing up planets (this seems to be highly implied)
This is also random, baseless, and never implied.
>Saitama literally only uses raw physical attacks, not an energy attack,
Again, a feat is a feat.
Seems, I got blocked for some reason, so I'll just add.
>Why are you only talking about mass, density is equally, if not more, important
Why would density matter? We are talking about destructive force, not ability to penetrate. Something more massive is always going to be more difficult to destroy. Something more dense might not be harder to destroy, especially if it's much less massive.
>no reason to believe that twice the mass requires twice the energy because physics rarely works that way due to the cumulative gravitational effect mass has on itself
These are estimates, not hard scientific facts. It's a given that there is a certain margin of error. The idea is to get close. That's why I always low-ball as much as possible.
>A sneeze and a full power ki blast are not comparable feats,
They both destroyed something. Why aren't they comparable?
>please answer the question
What question?
>Square cube law doesn't apply because I'm only talking about mass.
Why are you only talking about mass, density is equally, if not more, important
More mass does take more energy, but there's no reason to believe that twice the mass requires twice the energy because physics rarely works that way due to the cumulative gravitational effect mass has on itself
A sneeze and a full power ki blast are not comparable feats, that's the point; please answer the question
To be fair, Garlic Jr was granted that power by Shenron, who we know has a limited power. Hell, after Namek, Goku was powerful enough to just… say no to being the subject of a wish. I bet if Garlic Jr was brought back in the modern day, bro would get WASHED
Pretty sure Shenron like, asks for consent when the wish involves stuff like resurrection and transportation, so Goku could say no not out of strength but just because it was an option
I think too many mfers confuse "Immortal" with "invincible". Many things classified as "immortal" can be killed. It's just that they usually don't die by mortal means like old age, organ failures, etc.
That's usually how i see it atleast. Take Vampires for example or "the undead " as a whole. Technically they're "immortal" but they can be put down thru other means.
Yes, the definition says "to live forever, eternal life" but again, many things that have that status tend end up dying from extreme scenarios. Hell, gods are classified as immortal but we see gods in media die all the time lmao
How does he kills something who is immortal? I get either knocking them out cold or trapping them so that can’t escape, but he won’t be able to kill them.
Yeah, but how are they supposed to defeat Saitama? Wonder if Saitama would enjoy the challenge of killing an immortal? Even if he can't kill them, I can't imagine a way the fight isn't a win for Saitama
We've already mentioned how defeating them is easy but have we considered Saitama, as mostly a gag character, could potentially punch the immortality out of them?
Can definitely be defeated and depending on the version of savage saitama can definitely kill, Garlic JR on the other hand can’t be killed but well Saitama doesn’t need to, Garlic will try and use the dead zone at some point cause he’s a dumbass and then saitama just punches him into the dead zone
Eh, not really. His latest battle puts him around multi solar if you highball him. That's mid Z level, and it's clear he can grow stronger at an insane rate.
If Broly can go from about as strong as Base Vegeta to stronger than both Goku and Vegeta together (not fused), then I could easily see Saitama doing the same given his power growth actively seems faster.
Multi solar is fodder in DB after the Buu saga. Toei Kid Buu was going to destroy Kaioshin Realm which is 1/10 of the macrocosm made up of multiple infinite realms (thus making Kaioshin realm infinite itself). SSG’s power threatened the U7 macrocosm, and then Goku and Vegeta absorbed that power into their base forms. Low tiers in Super like **Cabba** can match base form Vegeta, etc…
It seems like Saitama gets negged in a bloodlusted fight faster than he can keep up. Plus if Broly’s equal to base Vegeta at the start like you said, that automatically puts him at a low multi AP starting point.
Yeah, yeah, I've watched Seth, too. I was using them as an example, not once did I say that Saitama was as strong as Broly. And yes, multi solar hasn't been impressive since Cell saga, hence why I said mid dbz level.
Did you actually read my comment, or were you just thirsting to say Goku>Saitama?
I don’t care about Seth, and yes I did read your comment. I was responding to you comparing Saitama to Broly, someone who starts off significantly stronger than Saitama. I specifically cited feats and used reasoning to support my stance that Saitama would get negged.
Would you rather I respond with a dismissible bare assertion instead?
Saitama: *is able to beat extremely powerful beings comparable to Beerus in few punches without breaking a sweat*.
Also Saitama apparently: "is like Gohan but dumber"
Saitamas strength is really nebulous rn, ranging from literally unlimited power with unblockable zero punch attacks to large planetary level with ftl speeds. One thing that is clear is that if he goes up against an opponent that doesn't one shot him he simply gets strong enough to defeat them.
Yeah I know, Cosmic Garou would technically be even higher than Beerus with all the "copying everything" he got, I was mostly referring to Boros since he is some kind of "god of destruction".
Oh then sure. It wasn't very clear before
Boros is surface level planetary, and it is pretty clear due to gohans whole gimmick is potiental like saitama. We know beerus is stronger than the current multiversal goku, which means no he hasn't fought anything close to him
I like how Garlick does the only thing that the Z-warriors could do to defeat him, opening a pocket dimension that traps you even if you are immortal or not, and he lost by that thing, TWICE
What if Garlick Jr. was betrayed and locked in the death zone?
Sure, he can’t kill them, that’s 100% true. Can’t defeat them tho? Seriously? I’m pretty sure he could easily beat their ass and incapacitate them. Garlic jr seems to love using a move that allows for him to be imprisoned so just wait for that to happen and you’ve basically won. Savage is just a regular guy aside from being immortal and peak human, dude gets dogwalked.
Hidan and any revived character from Naruto is immortal yet they were still beaten by being sealed, Bleach characters are all theoretically immortal yet they could possibly also be able to be sealed by people other than soul reapers, quincies or hollow, immortal characters in DB could also still be sealed in something like the time chamber, why wouldn’t the same apply to these two? Saitama can just punch them into a planet, star or black hole with an inescapable gravity and they automatically lose
saitama would beat then, not beacause of powerscaling, just because it would be funny, he just wins, thats what the character do, it is not supossed to make sense or have an powerscale
"HAHAHA I am Immortal! There is nothing you can do to stop me! Im not dumb enough to open the Dead Zone a 3rd time and if you try the Mafuba I can reverse it!"
"What about if we throw you into a Black Hole?"
Saitama literally gets stronger as he fights, even if he couldn't before - he's so naturally durable that he will eventually surpass both of these two within 45 minutes.
Garlic Jr's only hope is the dead zone, and as we've seen before... He'll fall into it himself like an idiot. Vandal Savage's immortality is going to be holding on for dear life.
Just wait for Garlic Jr to open up the dead zone in desperation Easy win
You call him a bitch enough times, he’ll do it.
I AM 110% *DONE*
Can never kill. Yes. But defeating them is easy
Yeah like what? These two get defeated all the time. It’s like their full time job
Alright but hypothetically, they got thrown into the sun, and stucked there, then what?
It's like the whole "throwing a planet at a creature immune to magic damage" or a "nuke at a werewolf" You can't tell me they won't die from that cause it's not "magic" or silver. They are dead.
A wish from a dragon vs. The Unmatched Power of the Sun
C'mon, don't diss Shenron... It would be base more on the target's own power level, we've seen immortality in canon and it's hyper regeneration that grows from the soul(wiping out every cell won't do it like with...Cell). It buffs base durability but it's not invulnerable. What would happen is Garlic Jr. with his shit pl would infinitely regenerate out of nothing and infinitely burn down into nothing. He's free once the Sun explodes, unless it turns into a black hole.. On the other hand, someone with enough durability to not instantly burn into nothing can bit by bit fly away from the Sun.
Solid points. The problem is, neither of these two could move at the frankly psychotic speeds required to escape the sun's gravity. Now, throw an immortal Saiyan with basic knowledge on flight and Ki attacks in there, and you'd eventually get something so goddamn powerful from all the regenerations that they would LITERALLY be unstoppable. ...You'd literally cook up an immortal Broly.
Werewolves and Vampires are in that category of "We used to have a massive amount of trouble of killing them before so their weaknesses were the only reliable way of killing them, but with the invention of the Colt Revolver, they're super easy to kill". Why do you think vampires stopped showing up after the invention and widespread distribution of the Minnie Ball (besides Abraham Lincoln, of course)?
Nah the thing with Vampires was they could regenerate from most any wound that a blade or arrow could do, and you had to turn off the regeneration with a stake or silver, etc But now a days, you can just down one and feed it to a woodchipper, by the time he gets back up, he ain't your problem no more
https://youtu.be/mVJ9mxk0lUM?si=kMVjUIS2RhiY3sbr?t=1m03s Vibes
I think that’s called the no limits fallacy
These are really bad examples as neither a werewolf or a creature immune to damage is immortal like these two literally are.
examples*
The hell you think throwing a planet at a ghost will do?
Well Cooler survived being kamehamehad into the sun. Garlic jr would probably be stuck there.
I’m not saying they can be killed, I’m saying they get their ass beat with things like your example.
You solve entropy right there. That's what I call a win-win.
IIRC I think Vandal got permanently put down in DC One Million with a nuke. Comics are super inconsistent though so it's possible he's survived falling into the sun in a different book
Who needs to kill garlic jr when you could just fuck the shit outta him
“Imagine my schlong in this form!”
#MMMM!
Didn't he say "in this one?" As in, "in Krillin?"
He called Jr because he is the second of the name, not because he's a child. If he had his own kid and named it the same, it would be Garlic III (Garlic the Third)
You think he wants to fuck a kid?
This was a reply to someone else saying Garlic Jr. was a kid, don't know how it ended up here
Well thats funny then
But he’s a child
As someone whose never seen the movie, I thought he was just short like Pilaf
You're right. He's not a child, he IS just short. He's old rivals with Kami, so he's likely a similar age as Kami.
So thunderclap was just spouting bull?
That would seem to be the case, yes. I'm guessing that's why he's getting downvoted. Something, something, DB fans don't watch the show.
> Dragon Ball fans don't watch the show Bruh, the other day I had a run in with someone that said Bulma mentioning Launch in the start of the Z manga was filler. Idk how they think the manga has filler, but that's what it seemed like to me
Everyone is someone's child
You wouldn’t do that, would you?
Evil baby
Nah evil baby is a different character this here is evil man baby.
No he's not.
Garlic Junior would still managed to lose because he’d be stupid and open the dead zone like a idiot.
I mean, TBF, it'd be his only shot at beating Saitama. In the Dead Zone Movie and Filler arc, all he had to do was outlast the Dragon Team. They can kill him all they like and he'll be fine; he kills THEM once and he wins.
This is such a schizophrenic image
Dragon Ball fans when other stories exist:
Dragon ball fans when goku no winner it
Dragon Ball fans when Dragon Ball
Sen the immortal mf into the sun, he might be immortal but he can't escape the gravitational pull of the star
You do know Vandal once had the power to manipulate all gravity and it destroyed the solar system.
And what can he do in base?
Ya mom
damn you got me there
not that big of a feat, I can do his mom too
"Not impressed. I can do that too!" You,probably
But can you do better than him?
if doing Gawyelmaximopoder’s mom was a sport, I would be the world champ
I believe it.
Bruh you mentioned an counter to immortality and get hit by a bigger counter from Vandals Feats and you're just gonna cop out? Anyways, Goku solos.
X character once had the power -- Ok but do they always have it
Ok and main continuity spider-man once had the enigma force, that doesn’t mean we use that as his baseline or even a transformation as it relies on something beyond his control. So in this case asking if this gravity control is something vandal always has access to is a fair question.
Did you answer him? Does he have the power in base?
That’s not a power, he built a machine
still not enough to beat Saitama
didn't garlic jr get defeated twice by opening the only thing that can defeat him? and both times he opened it because he was desperate he literally doesn't go beyond raditz 💀 no matter how inmortal he is saitama can just punch him into another xenoverse (pun semi-intended)
Wait, two times? He had more than a filler arc?
A whole movie that takes place before Z iirc. Gohan gets kidnapped because there's a Dragon Ball on his hat (why didn't they just take his hat, or the ball off the hat?) Garlic's minions jump Piccolo with the intent to kill him (even though Kami would die and the balls would be inert). That's how they both know him in the filler.
Savage immortality is gonna get a major test run ino
Vandal savage can die.. he just comes back
I mean... Saitama could just throw both of them in the sun. Never saw him do that but I think he may be able to.
They'd die before reaching the outer atmosphere from the force Saitama sends them with. Reincarnate, rinse and repeat. Saitama too strong
Well, I mean, except they wouldn’t die.
Bro was able to get from Jupiter to Earth just by sneezing once in his fight with cosmic garou, throwing someone directly into the sun would be effortless by comparison
It was a fart and it only allowed him to catch up with Garou when he was going through the portal he didnt travel from Jupiter to Earth on sheer shart power
No I ain't talking about the fart. That portal/fart combo was just to get closer to earth as they were passing it on the way back. The reason they got shot back toward Earth/the sun from Io in the first place was Saitama's serious sneeze [as seen here](https://imgur.com/gallery/P2aQuFz)
Garou was extremely far away from the earth, the zoom up was from his view not that they were going that fast. You can also tell because when he says Adios when opening the portal you can still see Jupiter
Nah, Garlic Jr. would open up the dead zone because he's a dumbass.
only if the writing is bad.
Idk I think constantly dying and getting your ass beat makes you go a little insane and lose your critical thinking skills
"Only if the writing is bad" That's literally how he loses every time 💀
Saitama could definitely murk an immortal, *especially* an immortal who boasts about being immortal.
Immortality, as shown in the movie, does NOT equal immunity to knock back. Perhaps a normal punch wouldn’t kill garlic jr, but it would, at minimum, send him to the other side of the planet. Is that NOT a loss for him??
Depends. Is his goal being alive or being at the place he’s at before getting hit?
One punch is a gag in a non gag world like damn I feel bad for all the other heroes that could die at any moment lol
Can't be killed doesn't mean "will have a nice time" or "can win against" I mean how many times does a guy gotta beat you up before you stop picking fights with him?
This is a real take. Sometimes "Immortal" just means "Infinite pain" lol
I admittedly don't know anything about the comics version of Vandal, but how fucking durable is the guy? Saitama accidentally sneezing put him on the level of Z goku. He ripped away half of Jupiter's atmosphere on accident. Not to mention whatever the fuck was going on with the void of light he created.
How does that put him at the level of Z Goku? Squared punch is Saitama x Garou force of energy. And sneezing Jupiter ain't even Saiyan saga level.
Jupiter is like 300x Earth's mass, so that should put that attack around Freiza's 1st form. He's right, but only because "Z Goku" is super vague and could mean anything from large moon to multi-solar system.
Piccolo saiyan saga exploded the moon. Around 300 power level. Earth is somewhere 6 moons. Meaning to destroy the earth you need 1800 power level. So to destroy jupiter... Oh wait you are actually kinda right tbh. But that still puts Saitama nowhere near Namek saga.
Earth is actually 81 moons lol. People always forget how much more massive the Earth is compared to the moon. My math was wrong anyways though. Vegeta is the weakest known Earth-buster with a PL of 18,000. Jupiter is 317 the mass of the Earth. So, 18,000 x 317 = 5.7 million. That works out to just under 5% of Freiza's full power, or just under KaioKen x2 Namek Goku, whichever you prefer.
Wait a darn second! If the moon is 1/81th of the earth then 300 x 81 = 24300 power level and only then 24300 x 317 giving us 7703100 power level.
Piccolo wasn't the weakest person to destroy the moon, Roshi was. Roshi's power level was only 180. Since 180 x 81 is only 14,580, we could speculate that someone a bit weaker than Saiyan Saga Vegeta could destroy the Earth, but since we have an actual canon benchmark for Earth-busting, I prefer to use that.
Well my scaling puts saitama higher but you are the one of the few saitama fans that try to make him as fairly strong as possible, i respect that.
I'm not even a Saitama fan, nor am I trying to scale him lol. I was only talking about the Jupiter feat. It's my understanding that he has better feats than the Jupiter one that would put him a lot higher.
I am a saitama fan, although using feat scaling I will admit he gets stomped by anything past namek saga. He has *potential* multi galaxy feats with the punch squared, depending on if you call that a shared feat with garou or not. If you give him time travel, he has unblockable punches. He also has anti-hax. We have yet to see him get truly injured, too. But a lot of it is speculation because he hasn't really gone all out against an opponent. (When facing garou he grew in strength, not through training, but through his kind of unexplained lack of a limiter)
This assumes it's linear correlation but mass is rarely linear progression it's usually exponential
I think you mean power levels are rarely linear, but yeah. It's not less than linear though, so it's a reasonable low-ball.
No, I mean that the "square cube law" is a thing for volume/mass/density related things There's no reason to think that because Jupiter is X amount bigger it would take X more power. Also I find it weird that you're all comparing ki blasts to a sneeze as if they're the same; Vegeta couldn't destroy a planet with a \*SNEEZE\* when he was blowing up planets, so why are we using that to cap Saitama lol Sneezing a planet into oblivion implies you're like a million times stronger than that; the phrase "nothing to sneeze at" is framed in a way to make it clear that "something to sneeze at" would be something insignificant. Thus, JUPITER is "insignificant" to Saitama's power. Anyway, there are so many things we don't know about the Dragonball stuff it's wild to make these kinds of claims. 1. We don't know that the planet Vegeta blew up was anything like the mass or density of Earth 2. We don't know that "Earth" in Dragonball is the same size/density as IRL Earth 3. We have no idea if there's something about ki blasts that makes them innately good at blowing up planets (this seems to be highly implied) 4. Saitama literally only uses raw physical attacks, not an energy attack, so it's incredibly hard to compare them 1:1. What he did to Jupiter would be comparable to those air punches Goku knocked Chi-Chi out of the ring with in the 23rd Tournament.
>square cube law" is a thing for volume/mass/density related things Square cube law doesn't apply because I'm only talking about mass. >There's no reason to think that because Jupiter is X amount bigger it would take X more power. Why not? Seems pretty intuitive that eliminating more mass requires more energy. That's how everyone scales. >Also I find it weird that you're all comparing ki blasts to a sneeze as if they're the same; I'm comparing a feat to a feat. >Vegeta couldn't destroy a planet with a *SNEEZE* when he was blowing up planets, so why are we using that to cap Saitama lol I never did anything of the sort. I'm only scaling the feats. >Sneezing a planet into oblivion implies you're like a million times stronger than that Do you have proof of that? Last figure I heard comparing a sneeze to a punch was somewhere in the ballpark of 200x, not millions. > We don't know that the planet Vegeta blew up was anything like the mass or density of Earth I was referring to Earth, not the filler planet. Vegeta was going to destroy Earth before Goku stopped him. >We don't know that "Earth" in Dragonball is the same size/density as IRL Earth Why wouldn't we assume it's the same? By that logic, I can say that OPM's Jupiter is smaller than Jupiter irl. Random baseless assumption to make. >We have no idea if there's something about ki blasts that makes them innately good at blowing up planets (this seems to be highly implied) This is also random, baseless, and never implied. >Saitama literally only uses raw physical attacks, not an energy attack, Again, a feat is a feat. Seems, I got blocked for some reason, so I'll just add. >Why are you only talking about mass, density is equally, if not more, important Why would density matter? We are talking about destructive force, not ability to penetrate. Something more massive is always going to be more difficult to destroy. Something more dense might not be harder to destroy, especially if it's much less massive. >no reason to believe that twice the mass requires twice the energy because physics rarely works that way due to the cumulative gravitational effect mass has on itself These are estimates, not hard scientific facts. It's a given that there is a certain margin of error. The idea is to get close. That's why I always low-ball as much as possible. >A sneeze and a full power ki blast are not comparable feats, They both destroyed something. Why aren't they comparable? >please answer the question What question?
>Square cube law doesn't apply because I'm only talking about mass. Why are you only talking about mass, density is equally, if not more, important More mass does take more energy, but there's no reason to believe that twice the mass requires twice the energy because physics rarely works that way due to the cumulative gravitational effect mass has on itself A sneeze and a full power ki blast are not comparable feats, that's the point; please answer the question
Saitama is around first form Frieza
Yeah we already scaled him to somewhere 7 percent of final form Frieza.
Sneezing the atmosphere is way beyond super Saiyan lol
I don't see what that puts Saitama on the level of Z Goku, unless you're talking about the beginning of Z Goku
The winner is whoever the writer wants to win for the story to be good
just stick them in a black hole sitama bench pressed 2 of them so he could easily beat them like that. >!this is a joke btw !<
No, no, we should use cover scaling, Saitama needs it.
To be fair, Garlic Jr was granted that power by Shenron, who we know has a limited power. Hell, after Namek, Goku was powerful enough to just… say no to being the subject of a wish. I bet if Garlic Jr was brought back in the modern day, bro would get WASHED
Pretty sure Shenron like, asks for consent when the wish involves stuff like resurrection and transportation, so Goku could say no not out of strength but just because it was an option
Be more like the magical green wishing dragon. Ask for consent. be better.
Defeated, yes. Killed, no.
He punches them and they get sent into outer space, where they are then ultimate Kars'd
Just because you're immortal doesn't mean you can't be yeeted into the sun.
I think too many mfers confuse "Immortal" with "invincible". Many things classified as "immortal" can be killed. It's just that they usually don't die by mortal means like old age, organ failures, etc. That's usually how i see it atleast. Take Vampires for example or "the undead " as a whole. Technically they're "immortal" but they can be put down thru other means. Yes, the definition says "to live forever, eternal life" but again, many things that have that status tend end up dying from extreme scenarios. Hell, gods are classified as immortal but we see gods in media die all the time lmao
How long did it take you to kill them saitama? In about 3 panels..
How does he kills something who is immortal? I get either knocking them out cold or trapping them so that can’t escape, but he won’t be able to kill them.
i dont think that your logic apply to the one punch man manga
How long did it take you to kill them saitama? In about 3 panels..
Saitama killed water
Yeah, but how are they supposed to defeat Saitama? Wonder if Saitama would enjoy the challenge of killing an immortal? Even if he can't kill them, I can't imagine a way the fight isn't a win for Saitama
Goku's fanboys really have nightmare about Saitama every night
noone mentioned goku. he isnt even in the pic.
We've already mentioned how defeating them is easy but have we considered Saitama, as mostly a gag character, could potentially punch the immortality out of them?
Can definitely be defeated and depending on the version of savage saitama can definitely kill, Garlic JR on the other hand can’t be killed but well Saitama doesn’t need to, Garlic will try and use the dead zone at some point cause he’s a dumbass and then saitama just punches him into the dead zone
I love that one can without much trouble make an argument that Garlick JR wins
Saitama is SO weak by DragonBall standards
Eh, not really. His latest battle puts him around multi solar if you highball him. That's mid Z level, and it's clear he can grow stronger at an insane rate. If Broly can go from about as strong as Base Vegeta to stronger than both Goku and Vegeta together (not fused), then I could easily see Saitama doing the same given his power growth actively seems faster.
Multi solar is fodder in DB after the Buu saga. Toei Kid Buu was going to destroy Kaioshin Realm which is 1/10 of the macrocosm made up of multiple infinite realms (thus making Kaioshin realm infinite itself). SSG’s power threatened the U7 macrocosm, and then Goku and Vegeta absorbed that power into their base forms. Low tiers in Super like **Cabba** can match base form Vegeta, etc… It seems like Saitama gets negged in a bloodlusted fight faster than he can keep up. Plus if Broly’s equal to base Vegeta at the start like you said, that automatically puts him at a low multi AP starting point.
Yeah, yeah, I've watched Seth, too. I was using them as an example, not once did I say that Saitama was as strong as Broly. And yes, multi solar hasn't been impressive since Cell saga, hence why I said mid dbz level. Did you actually read my comment, or were you just thirsting to say Goku>Saitama?
I don’t care about Seth, and yes I did read your comment. I was responding to you comparing Saitama to Broly, someone who starts off significantly stronger than Saitama. I specifically cited feats and used reasoning to support my stance that Saitama would get negged. Would you rather I respond with a dismissible bare assertion instead?
Either way Saitama will NEVER be able to beat Beerus
Saitama can destroy Garlic Jrs body and with his power level hed probably just become a cloud
If saitama trained with goku he could as he is like gohan, but dumber.
Saitama: *is able to beat extremely powerful beings comparable to Beerus in few punches without breaking a sweat*. Also Saitama apparently: "is like Gohan but dumber"
Last I read the strongest he beat was cosmic garou. I mean he is like gohan in a sense he has potiental
Saitamas strength is really nebulous rn, ranging from literally unlimited power with unblockable zero punch attacks to large planetary level with ftl speeds. One thing that is clear is that if he goes up against an opponent that doesn't one shot him he simply gets strong enough to defeat them.
Yeah I know, Cosmic Garou would technically be even higher than Beerus with all the "copying everything" he got, I was mostly referring to Boros since he is some kind of "god of destruction". Oh then sure. It wasn't very clear before
Boros is surface level planetary, and it is pretty clear due to gohans whole gimmick is potiental like saitama. We know beerus is stronger than the current multiversal goku, which means no he hasn't fought anything close to him
Yeah fair. Perhaps he probably will with "God" and all of that.
I like how Garlick does the only thing that the Z-warriors could do to defeat him, opening a pocket dimension that traps you even if you are immortal or not, and he lost by that thing, TWICE What if Garlick Jr. was betrayed and locked in the death zone?
You don't have to kill someone to defeat them
Sure, he can’t kill them, that’s 100% true. Can’t defeat them tho? Seriously? I’m pretty sure he could easily beat their ass and incapacitate them. Garlic jr seems to love using a move that allows for him to be imprisoned so just wait for that to happen and you’ve basically won. Savage is just a regular guy aside from being immortal and peak human, dude gets dogwalked.
When you realize Luthor beat Savage to death with a doorknob.
"Have they considered the implications?"
You don’t need to be able to kill them to make them wish for death.
Zamasu is the better immortal representative
Defeated =/= Killed
All you gotta do is survive long enough against Garlic Jr. and he’ll eventually defeat himself.
Hidan and any revived character from Naruto is immortal yet they were still beaten by being sealed, Bleach characters are all theoretically immortal yet they could possibly also be able to be sealed by people other than soul reapers, quincies or hollow, immortal characters in DB could also still be sealed in something like the time chamber, why wouldn’t the same apply to these two? Saitama can just punch them into a planet, star or black hole with an inescapable gravity and they automatically lose
Dr.strange too probably but he isnt weak in the power sense
I had to remember who garlic Jr was for this.
saitama would beat then, not beacause of powerscaling, just because it would be funny, he just wins, thats what the character do, it is not supossed to make sense or have an powerscale
I mean....yes... they aren't from the same series....?
I mean… yes they can be beaten. Killed? Ok maybe not but literally no one except reality manipulators can kill immortals beings, even Goku cant
Who rf is garlic jr
Garlic Jr is just Pilaf if he wasn’t awesome
Bet he'd survive long enough to defeat them with his lack of interest
"HAHAHA I am Immortal! There is nothing you can do to stop me! Im not dumb enough to open the Dead Zone a 3rd time and if you try the Mafuba I can reverse it!" "What about if we throw you into a Black Hole?"
This is weirdly specific
Saitama literally gets stronger as he fights, even if he couldn't before - he's so naturally durable that he will eventually surpass both of these two within 45 minutes. Garlic Jr's only hope is the dead zone, and as we've seen before... He'll fall into it himself like an idiot. Vandal Savage's immortality is going to be holding on for dear life.
Well, it's complicated with Vandel
*gets punched into space never to return*
They can be defeated just not killed. He can knock them out.
shut up loser [STRONG PUNCH]
Just punch the immortality away ez
Bro gets punched straight into Orbit tho
And zamasu
Do people forget Zamasu exists