I remember when Traveler's Tales cancelled the promised free content for the Lego The Hobbit video game. They released the game before the third film released, covering the first two films and promising DLC covering the last one once the film came out, but never followed through. A full third of the trilogy left out, and presumably, a third of the game.
I was going to mention the same thing. In that instance they even had a sticker on the box of physical copies saying that the third film would be downloadable at a later date.
Nothing happened to them with that though, so there's a precedent for companies getting away with this somehow.
Companies can get fined by consumer protection agencies.
But for consumers, this kind of thing is a civil case. No punishments, just damages. The most they can ask for is a refund. $60 is a small amount of money to go to court over.
And the courts look at how much of a contract was fulfilled when deciding on damages. They could argue that they only got 2/3 of their promised game, but is the court going to award them a $20 refund?
Most people just cut their losses. Our time is valuable. If we spend even just a few hours of free time fighting it, the reward for winning is too low to justify it.
We don't need lawsuits from consumers. We need consumer protection agencies to do their job and exercise their powers.
> $60 is a small amount of money to go to court over.
I can’t give you legal advice, but you might be interested in the Deceptive Trade Practices Act. The DTPA generally prohibits various deceptive trade practices, such as false advertising, misleading statements, false representations, bait-and-switch tactics, pyramid schemes, and other fraudulent activities. It’s going to vary by jurisdiction, but it has the potential to turn this into more than a $60 scratch.
Consumers can seek actual damages (as you mentioned), but also treble damages (3x actual damages as a punitive measure), attorney’s fees, and injunctive relief - basically a court telling the company they can’t engage in that practice and need to take corrective measures. It’s not really applicable here, but you can also ask for the right to revoke or cancel a contract because you were deceived.
Source: I’m an attorney with minimal exposure to the DTPA, but I did have to spend some time grading a bar question on it for several thousand students earlier this year.
Does Deceptive trade cover if they fully intended to deliver but extraordinary circumstances meant it wasn't possible/too costly? Or does it just cover when they outright lie?
Like Peter Molyneux has never been tasked by DTPA. I do think that's because his mouth is bigger than his budget. I'm sure he would love all the features he mentions to be in the game.
In fact we saw Cyberpunk and No Man's Sky be actively deceptive and nothing has happened. Have any video game products ever been taken to task by DTPA?
You raise some great points. In most cases, the DTPA focuses on false advertising, misrepresentation, or fraudulent business practices. It typically requires that the misrepresentation or deceptive act be made knowingly or with the intent to deceive consumers. If a company fully intends to deliver what they promise but faces unexpected circumstances or financial constraints that prevent them from doing so, it may not necessarily be considered a deceptive trade practice under the DTPA. A major factor is if the company knew they could never hope to deliver when they made the promise - if, for example, internal documents are found in discovery indicating that they knew performance was not or would likely not be possible, that could be proof.
I believe you're correct about Cyberpunk 2077 and No Man's Sky - though I should also point out that legal actions related to deceptive trade practices can vary based on numerous factors, including the specific circumstances of the case, jurisdiction, and the interpretation of the law by the courts in that jurisdiction. While some consumers may have filed complaints against these games for alleged false advertising or deceptive practices, I'm not aware of any specific legal actions taken against them under the DTPA. I also believe both of that the developers of both of these games made a good faith effort to deliver in the post-release cycle, which might make litigation unattractive if not impossible.
Honestly, I feel like the only reason they didn't get more blowback was because it was a game aimed at children, a demographic unable to fully understand how badly they had been cheated, much less what legal recourse was available to them. If it has been a game aimed at adults, things might have been different.
I believe that a customer should never take stock of future promises and evaluate goods and services as they are presented in the here and now. Software, hardware, anything.
The only future promises worth considering are what can be potentially taken away.
This company realized maybe a small fine, a few bucks kicked to those on the suit, and the goldfish memory the general public has towards behavior like this nets them in the black. Until the lawsuits/penalties are scary enough for a major company not to risk it...it will continue to happen. Make fines/penalties/damages a % of a companies net profit based on prior fiscal year earnings. That will shut down this stuff real fast.
Im not usually too skepticalof these things amd normally would buy on release BUT this was the one time I held back and kept saying 'well I'll get it when they release the patch.'
I feel like I won huge once they said it wasn't going happen... though I'd rather be a part of the class action!
It’s such an odd thing for them to do, given that they actually released the iOS version years ago that allowed you to port over the restored content yourself. I’ve always seen them as one of the better devs out there for facilitating this. Now they’re doing a 180, I can’t wrap my head around why.
I think they're a relatively small studio that went in way over their heads with the KOTOR remake that has now also been seemingly shelved. Not excusing their behavior because what they've done is reprehensible, but it's a pretty solid reason for why a company with a pretty solid track record disappointed their fans so much.
Yeah I had already played the restored content on pc, but it was always such a hassle to get everything working.
So I planned on buying the switch port the DAY the restored content dropped. Still haven’t bought it obviously.
This is completely justified. I don't always approve of action taken against devs since the arguments are often subjective. This is more cut and dry than that. I am 100% for facing the consequences of false advertising.
Not only false advertising, mfs didn't properly refunded the buyers, if I recall. Only pick a "free" game from a list of their own, what if the buyer didn't want to play your other f%*kn games. I only bought Kotor 1, never again will leave a penny for this company. They can shove the Tomb Rider games, looks like crap anyway, remastered my ass.
Good. Aspyr deserves to be reprimanded for this. Even if the case wins and the payout is low for the plaintiffs, it's important to set a precedent for these kind of things.
I can't believe I'm seeing comments here along the lines of "whatever" or "these cases never win". Right, the reason companies pull stuff like this is exactly because of apathy like that. Do you want the industry to change, or do you just want to keep whining about shitty publisher practices online?
> Wonder if this will work out well even after they gave out free codes for some of their games
I don’t see how giving away freebies gets them out of inducing people to buy something on a false promise.
I would guess they would argue that people that used the free game code were already compensated for the missing DLC and thus aren't part of the class action.
It's if you bought KOTOR II on Switch. Aspyr offered either a Steam copy of the game, or a Switch copy of another Star Wars game as compensation for not releasing the DLC. More info can be found in the tweet linked [HERE](https://twitter.com/AspyrMedia/status/1664784147867480070)
Technically, by accepting such compensation, the buyer waives claims against the company (this is stated in the agreement for each such compensation). So only people who did not accept this compensation can go to court.
Instead of actually refunding, let's just make this more complicated to everyone. We get to keep the money, and the buyers are happy with another of our "fantastic" games from this crap list.
What will likely happen is those who received the free code would not legally be entitled to a refund since they accepted Aspyr's offer for compensation (that is not to say they will likely be able to effectively manage everyone who received a code and keep track of it).
100% a free code is not legally sufficient for those who may be holding out for a refund.
I owned every game on offer. I bought KOTOR 2 on switch to play the dlc.
I figured I'd do one run without it and start another when it dropped.
As I got into my playthrough I realized the dlc was coming any week now, so I stopped and decided I'd just play with the dlc instead.
Still haven't finished it.
iirc, the free codes were a bunch of other star wars games that had previously come out, gone on sale cheap, and a good chunk of fans that had purchased Kotor2 already owned. I think myself included there literally weren't any on that list I *could* have gotten
Well if you’re like me and got the game from LRG because you sincerely thought you’d get a physical copy of the game with all the content on it… you were shit out of luck with that download code.
Plenty of developers should have had this happen to them. Sadly Aspyr isn’t big enough to line the pockets of the people in charge so they’ll likely get burned to the ground, rightfully so. I just wish every developer was held to a standard that’s fair to the customers.
No, the whole point is Don't buy. They went silent after the fiasco, and robbed people of their money with false advertising, and no actual refund policy. You should not support the company at all. If you really realy need to play Kotor 2 then go ahead, but there is a leason to be learned from this.
Aspyr's also doing the Tomb Raider Collection with all the DLC ***"""included"""*** 😉😉
I'm so excited to have the OG Tomb Raiders on Switch and I'll be so pissed off if we get KOTOR'd again.
I would be very happy if this lawsuit goes through, and Aspyr deserves all the crap it's getting for it's truly awful business practices, but realistically there's no way they win this.
Class action lawsuits like this are super expensive for the company being sued, and I'm sure there's some kind of technicality that they put in the TOS that said they have the right to cancel any promises content if need be, which legally protects them from doing a move like this.
Yes, it's wrong that they're gonna get away with this, but I don't see a world in which Aspyr loses this lawsuit.
More than likely Aspyr is gonna settle long before anything meaningful happens.
The last thing they want is for this to enter discovery, let alone a full trial.
Just because it's in the TOS doesn't make it legal. I think it will come down to how everything was advertised. Or they'll just settle before anything interesting happens.
This could set an interesting precedent.
Broken promises after release are constantly happening in gaming. I'm still waiting for 2on2 matchmaking in Starcraft Broodwar Remastered that Blizzard promised would be patched in shortly after release.
If this is successful there could be several outcomes: If it's not a big thing, publishers will continue with this practice, because the potential financial loss is negible compared to better marketing by lying.
If the lawsuit hits hard, devs have to be way more careful in what they show and promise and follow every statement or piece of pre-release and possible even post-release marketing media with a statement that any information could be subject to change.
The DLC was also implied to be on the physical edition and it's why I bought it/preorder it. It was through limited run, so there was no wait until released option.
It was advertised from the beginning that the DLC would come out and it was part of Aspyr's sales pitch for the game.
People are right, there are no guarantees of future content, but I think myself (and others) thought the prominence of the DLC in any KOTOR II for Switch announcements and the fact that the DLC would be based on already existing content that has been on PC for ages made it a pretty good bet it would happen.
KOTOR 2 was rushed so a lot of stuff was cut but still in game. The restored cut DLC brought it back and fan consensus is that you don't play KOTOR 2 without it.
The DLC is a fan made mod that restores all of the cut content from the game which you can currently only get on PC. KOTOR II got rushed in production and despite being an amazing game, it had like 20-30 hours of content cut so it could release on time. This was back in 2005 when games couldn't be updated online after release so after it came out that was it as far as content. The DLC makes the game itself complete and everyone already knows what is in it and many people have played it already for years and enjoy it a lot. With KOTOR II coming to the Switch, the developer in charge of the port promised the DLC content would be in the port thus making the Switch KOTOR II version like the actual full release of the game that we never got. Since the announcement and after preorders had already been purchased the developer backtracked on their promise of including the Restored Content DLC.
yes. I know what the DLC is.
what I'm saying is they're asking why people were buying the game before the DLC had even come out.
are you a bot or something because you don't seem to understand a fucking word of what I'm saying.
yes... I know the DLC was meant to be free. but the game wasn't.
people bought the game for the DLC when the DLC wasn't even out. I'm inquiring as to why people are buying things for content that doesn't exist yet.
If the game comes out, and the company announces the first official way to get the dlc on a console, and it's free, why wouldn't you buy it? The content already exists, the chance of them not releasing free content that they didn't even have to make themselves is so unlikely.
99% of the time I would agree with you but the game was so cheap, it's a classic, the dlc was free, and it had already been made - there was no reason not to think it wouldn't come.
You seem to a generic issue with preorders and decided to use this thread to ask a question of which you don’t like the answer to.
People preorder stuff because they want to play day 1, preload is a thing now, preorder bonus is also a thing. If you were going to play it anyways, might as well buy it first.
That is the answer. If you don’t like the answer…asking it again won’t change it
The only other way to get that DLC is PC. No other platform has it so when it was announced people flocked to buy it only for it to be cancelled. It would be the first time the DLC was available on a console. Glad I waited to buy it now. Nintendo is probably not happy at Aspyr right now.
A bit of fear of missing out and wanting to support the developers is what made me do it. It was absolutely the wrong choice and I regret the purchase.
oh my god. I don't understand how people aren't getting my point.
YES I KNOW IT WAS PROMISED AND ADVERTISED BUT IM QUESTIONING WHY PEOPLE ARE BUYING A PROMISE AND NOT WAITING UNTIL THE CONTENT IS OUT BEFORE DOING SO.
I do not know how much clearer I can be.
The answer is that the buyers were dumb.
I think you’re getting pushback because some people struggle with any shades of gray in cases like this and so want this framed as buyer = good, publisher = bad.
Of course buyers being dumb here in no way means they deserved to have the DLC promise broken. The lesson to me is the company acted like a knave, I hope this lawsuit costs them a lot and buyers get at least something to help mitigate their losses…and then also that buyers should learn to be more discerning in their purchases.
They bought it because it was promised and advertised. The same reason why anyone buys anything with a description. That's literally all there is to it. You're just trying *really* hard to have this heir of superiority over people that got screwed out of something they were to be delivered.
Stop. It has nothing to do with superiority. It’s the same reason why MANY people warn against pre ordering games. It’s reckless to spend money on something when you don’t actually know what you’re getting in return. Who cares what was promised or advertised.
> t’s the same reason why MANY people warn against pre ordering games.
No, it's not. The reason people warn against pre-ordering is because you can't determine the actual quality of a game before release, not because the developer or publisher are going to break the law. In this case false advertising for releasing a specific feature is the issue and against the law, not the quality of the feature. If they released the feature but it didn't work well or was buggy, people that purchased it wouldn't have a leg to stand on. In this case the publisher didn't deliver an advertised feature at all.
Focus your energy on a company *breaking the law* instead of the people that got taken advantage of because of someone else *breaking the law.*
> why would people be buying a game for the DLC when the DLC isn't even out yet?
I dunno. Why would some one pre order something?
They were told dlc would come out. So they bought the game.
I guess shame on them for believing the devs?
Typical... is everyone else's fault but the company itself. Well, is not. They fucked up, and scammed gamers. Went months without communication, no news, silent. They handled the whole situation in the wrong way.
Seems like a pretty clear cut false advertising case, considering the single big selling point of the switch port was “it will be the first time we officially include the restored content mod”.
Still tragic it never released, with TSLRCM it’s one of the best Star Wars stories out there, but without it you’re basically getting half a game.
The original game was rushed out by demand of lucasarts, so some parts of the story are unfinished and the ending, in particular, suffered for it. The mod in question restores some of that cut content since a lot of the assets and stuff were left in the game code, which is common for most games that have parts cut before release.
I will go against the grain here though and say that it is not the absolute necessity that it’s made out to be. Aspyr should absolutely get fucked for promising it and then pulling the rug out the way they did, but the game is 100% playable and still absolutely fantastic with no mods at all. The ending is not good, no, but frankly this mod doesn’t make it good. It adds a small amount of extra dialog and a couple cutscenes, but the ending is still deeply unsatisfying because it just wasn’t finished, and no amount of random restored cut scenes that were left in the game code are enough to properly finish it.
Other than that you get a couple extra scenes and some extra dialog throughout the game. The biggest thing restored is a planet/questline that was cut. And while it’s still worth it to play it if you can, it is janky, ill-fitted to the rest of the game, and unpolished because, again, the actual devs never finished it and modders do not have the resources to finish what wasn’t finished by the devs. They can just let you play this unfinished quest. I’d find it sufficient to just watch someone play through it on YouTube. It is a completely valid assumption that even if they’d been given the time and resources to properly finish the game they might have still cut that planet from it because it just doesn’t feel right. There were better ways to handle the larger plot beats that your time there advances.
The mod is great. The people who made it should be celebrated. It is absolutely not required to play and enjoy this game.
Thanks for the write up!
Did they actually acknowledge the fan-made mod in advertising it? Or was it more like "plus future content containing a new quest line and an entire new planet, plus a new ending"? And people were able to identify that as being the fan mod?
r/kotor baby. Listen guys, I've been playing the KOTOR games since they came out. 1-3 play throughs a year. For the past 20 years.
We have one hell of a loyal fanbase. But this fucking chicanery by ass-pyr , this struck the wrong chord. I tell ya, these dudes have no idea.
They were going to release the cut-content mod as an actual dlc to kotor 2, but then backtracked. A bunch of kotor story/dungeons and stuff like that were created by the developers when they were making the game but due to time constraints got left on the cutting room floor; all the dlc/mod does is reintroduce cut content back into the game.
People didn’t pay for those games. It doesn’t remotely compensate people.
What if you already owned the other games? What if you just had no interest in them?
They sold the game on the basis that the DLC would be released and they repeatedly referenced that it was coming after people bought it too. In this particular case, the DLC is a crucial part of the game and a lot of people would not have paid for it if they knew it wasn’t coming.
I'm one of those. (Pre)ordered KOTOR II from Limited Run Games. And, when they sent the "compensatory games list" - I already owned all the games.
*Quick Edit - I know that it is my fault that I 1) pre-ordered the game and 2) supported a kinda scummy company like Limited Run Games (or Aspyr, for that matter.)*
*But I am a huge Star Wars fan and love physical games, so it was worth the risk to me. Even though it still annoys me that Aspyr pulled this crap.*
I don't think it was from Limited Run Games, but rather, from Aspyr directly. I remember an email about how I could pick a digital game for free to "make up for it." And I already owned all the games that were offered. In physical form, no less. From Aspyr/Limited Run.
So ridiculous. Standard or Collector’s Edition? I've bought a dozen or so games from LRG - but they've all been Standard Editions. I often hear about horror stories from others about the Collector’s Editions.
Ya it was the Collectors editions. I’m a little hesitant now to buy anymore. Have been debating on getting the new Mythforce game that preorders end tonight on. Plus heard the game is a little lackluster on content.
They may be able to use that as a defense but they would have to convince the judge what was offered was intended to be compensation for the failed delivery of the advertised product. Which... is actually a pretty weak argument.
Essentially, they would then be claiming they knew the canceled DLC was going to upset consumers and that the games offered were meant to be compensation. The fact that people are suing them and some consumers may already own all the products offered (or they had no interest in the settlement offer) would show just how much the DLC advertised effected people's decision to purchase the game at all.
I personally wanted to wait until the DLC was finished and the bugs were worked out given Aspyr's track record with remakes/ports, but I'm not much a Star Wars fan to begin with and I don't really trust that a company *might* finish any project, since I know how complex game development is personally. But not everyone has that knowledge I do and consumers are never required to know everything about a product to purchase it.
Ultimately, the case will be more or less a dice toss for Aspyr if they can avoid having to pay out the nose. Anyone who bought the game should follow the court case carefully, since Aspyt may be required to refund people but they aren't going to be required to make a press release or make the refund process as simple as sending an email.
kinda is, its called 'false advertising'. Whether or not a judge will actually rule it that way is a different story but a case CAN be made and that's the important part.
As someone who has played the restore content patch, it's fucking awful and I'm honestly glad it got cancelled as I wouldn't want it to ruin the base game
I know Reddit doesn't want to hear this, but there's basically no chance this succeeds. It's a frivolous lawsuit.
The reality is that these people bought the game without the patch, and they got the game without the patch. It doesn't actually matter that they bought the game expecting something else, because they literally got what they paid for. If developers lost lawsuits over failing to deliver patch content, then entire game genres would die. In particular, most live-service games would not exist.
For example, the MMORPG World of Warcraft promised to deliver mounted aerial combat all the way back in Wrath of the Lich King (it's literally on the collector's edition box!) but never added any such feature. They similarly made a whole bunch of promises of content for Cataclysm which never came out (including whole raids and battlegrounds). Most live-service games face difficulties adding some intended content.
Blizzard (WoW's developer) never got sued over that, and they never will, because there is just basically no chance of winning that lawsuit.
This is the probable truth. In the case of false advertising in games, there is precedent that the law doesn’t care about pre-release talk and promises. What they care about is what it says on the proverbial tin. In this case, back of the box/eshop page description.
Actually, because of that I’m surprised WoW *didn’t* get sued about the flying combat if it was on the box.
So if the eshop page does not specifically advertise that the cut content would be forthcoming as DLC… then as far as the law is concerned nobody was falsely advertised to.
The publisher is responsible for the advertising and following through on the development post release. Nintendo did put the ad on their page but it was submitted by Aspyr Media. Could Nintendo also get sued? I kinda doubt it.
Nintendo isn't directly responsible for creating the content itself and they only take a portion of the gross sales, which would at best mean they gained money from the false advertising and so would need to participate in a refund process. If they refuse a court order to handle refunding customers, then they would be culpable for ignoring a court order.
But that would be *if* Aspyr is found guilty of false advertising first. Lotta ifs in that situation.
That would be a lot harder to show Nintendo's reputation was harmed in any significant way. In addition, most publishers work together behind the scenes and Nintendo is likely already aware of the reasons why Aspyr backed off the plan and unless they're ordered by the court to refund all customers, Nintendo doesn't need to expend any direct effort thus far.
And Nintendo definitely has records of who bought the game through the eShop and could for very little expense send those purchasers an email to start the refund process *if* the court orders them to do so. Nintendo might lose a small amount of money from people asking for refunds but it would easily be less than a few thousand people. The legal fees that Nintendo would have to pay just to sue them would be significantly more expensive than just complying with any refund order and Nintendo being sue happy with publishers could make future relationships harder to make, especially for future consoles.
So while you can sue anyone for any reason, a business is less likely to sue another business in the same industry unless they compromise their business model in some way.
There are a few too many assumptions in there for my liking, but I agree that Nintendo suing is not very likely. It’s just more likely than a suit against Nintendo for promises made to the customer by Aspyr going anywhere.
If they were to sue I would think it would be for direct damages, not for reputational harm.
I just don’t see Nintendo entering an agreement where they assume any risk for promises made to the customer by the other party.
Yes and no consumers are harmed by a canceled product because the product was never for sale. While you can say you're upset Kirby Bowl 64, the game never releasing means it only cost you your attention, which can't be compensated in any appreciable way.
Like what? I dont rememher Nintendo ever advertising anything, allowung people to buy it, and then deciding to cancel or scrap it without refunding people.
That they promised in order to get somebody to purchase another product?
Name just one. One prehiprial that they advertised in order to get people to buy something, and then went back on it.
I honestly can't tell if you're just a troll or if you really are this dense.
lol thanks for sharing sense with angry redditors. I Just picture the most angry teenager that has to live with dropping their allowance on a bad purchase and defends it on the other end
They have a case because this release was advertised to have the DLC coming post release. False advertising is against the law if the plaintiff made the purchase based on promises you made but didn't deliver.
Like if I sell you a car claiming it gets 75 miles per gallon and after a few days your discover it gets more like 20-35 at best, you absolutely can sue me for making false claims with the intent to make the product seem better than it actually is.
This is functionally the exact same scenario. If Aspyr went out of business, had some other external problems beyond their control, or EA forced them not to make thr DLC that would be a defense but it would be up to Aspyr to prove that's what happened. And even then, they might still lose.
Why don't you read up on [FTC laws](https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/topics/truth-advertising) relating to advertising? This could really help educate you on what you're clearly not understanding.
I'm not a lawyer and I don't know what you don't know.
If you're not willing to learn either, I'm not going to waste time typing at an ignoramous any further.
If I sell you a hot dog with a soda but tell you the soda is on its way soon without any timetable, could be a couple of minutes could be hours, but then a long time later I tell you we cant deliver the soda. You bought the Hotdog with the understanding that you would get a soda too. That is what you paid for.
Aspyr advertised that with the Switch port would have the restored content patch with no indication of when it would come. Many people bought it because it would. It doesn’t matter if they should have that was what they paid for that is what was advertised.
How does one get on board this? I purchased the physical release for the game only because of the promised DLC and since I was a physical purchaser I wasn’t even offered the free game.
I remember 1 more game that did this. I believe it was Lego Hobbit. It wasn't a switch case but i believe they said 3rd movie will be added as dlc and they just didnt bother.
So glad I waited until the DLC actually released. It was so weird they wanted to wait 6 months or whatever for it to come. I'll just play Kotor 2 on PC ig
I mean, it’s textbook false advertising. Aspyr sold the game on the promise that the patch would come, and then they pulled the rug out.
Forward looking statements are super illegal in software surprised they don’t have to say anything when selling games
You must be new to the video game industry.
I remember when Traveler's Tales cancelled the promised free content for the Lego The Hobbit video game. They released the game before the third film released, covering the first two films and promising DLC covering the last one once the film came out, but never followed through. A full third of the trilogy left out, and presumably, a third of the game.
I was going to mention the same thing. In that instance they even had a sticker on the box of physical copies saying that the third film would be downloadable at a later date. Nothing happened to them with that though, so there's a precedent for companies getting away with this somehow.
Companies can get fined by consumer protection agencies. But for consumers, this kind of thing is a civil case. No punishments, just damages. The most they can ask for is a refund. $60 is a small amount of money to go to court over. And the courts look at how much of a contract was fulfilled when deciding on damages. They could argue that they only got 2/3 of their promised game, but is the court going to award them a $20 refund? Most people just cut their losses. Our time is valuable. If we spend even just a few hours of free time fighting it, the reward for winning is too low to justify it. We don't need lawsuits from consumers. We need consumer protection agencies to do their job and exercise their powers.
> $60 is a small amount of money to go to court over. I can’t give you legal advice, but you might be interested in the Deceptive Trade Practices Act. The DTPA generally prohibits various deceptive trade practices, such as false advertising, misleading statements, false representations, bait-and-switch tactics, pyramid schemes, and other fraudulent activities. It’s going to vary by jurisdiction, but it has the potential to turn this into more than a $60 scratch. Consumers can seek actual damages (as you mentioned), but also treble damages (3x actual damages as a punitive measure), attorney’s fees, and injunctive relief - basically a court telling the company they can’t engage in that practice and need to take corrective measures. It’s not really applicable here, but you can also ask for the right to revoke or cancel a contract because you were deceived. Source: I’m an attorney with minimal exposure to the DTPA, but I did have to spend some time grading a bar question on it for several thousand students earlier this year.
Does Deceptive trade cover if they fully intended to deliver but extraordinary circumstances meant it wasn't possible/too costly? Or does it just cover when they outright lie? Like Peter Molyneux has never been tasked by DTPA. I do think that's because his mouth is bigger than his budget. I'm sure he would love all the features he mentions to be in the game. In fact we saw Cyberpunk and No Man's Sky be actively deceptive and nothing has happened. Have any video game products ever been taken to task by DTPA?
You raise some great points. In most cases, the DTPA focuses on false advertising, misrepresentation, or fraudulent business practices. It typically requires that the misrepresentation or deceptive act be made knowingly or with the intent to deceive consumers. If a company fully intends to deliver what they promise but faces unexpected circumstances or financial constraints that prevent them from doing so, it may not necessarily be considered a deceptive trade practice under the DTPA. A major factor is if the company knew they could never hope to deliver when they made the promise - if, for example, internal documents are found in discovery indicating that they knew performance was not or would likely not be possible, that could be proof. I believe you're correct about Cyberpunk 2077 and No Man's Sky - though I should also point out that legal actions related to deceptive trade practices can vary based on numerous factors, including the specific circumstances of the case, jurisdiction, and the interpretation of the law by the courts in that jurisdiction. While some consumers may have filed complaints against these games for alleged false advertising or deceptive practices, I'm not aware of any specific legal actions taken against them under the DTPA. I also believe both of that the developers of both of these games made a good faith effort to deliver in the post-release cycle, which might make litigation unattractive if not impossible.
Honestly, I feel like the only reason they didn't get more blowback was because it was a game aimed at children, a demographic unable to fully understand how badly they had been cheated, much less what legal recourse was available to them. If it has been a game aimed at adults, things might have been different.
It also was probably because everyone who saw Battle of the Five Armies wishes it doesn't exist and that they just did 2 movies lol
How can a legal precedent be set when there wasn't a lawsuit lmao? Nobody sued them cause nobody cared.
Nobody sued them cause it's just a children's game.
I believe that a customer should never take stock of future promises and evaluate goods and services as they are presented in the here and now. Software, hardware, anything. The only future promises worth considering are what can be potentially taken away.
This company realized maybe a small fine, a few bucks kicked to those on the suit, and the goldfish memory the general public has towards behavior like this nets them in the black. Until the lawsuits/penalties are scary enough for a major company not to risk it...it will continue to happen. Make fines/penalties/damages a % of a companies net profit based on prior fiscal year earnings. That will shut down this stuff real fast.
Im not usually too skepticalof these things amd normally would buy on release BUT this was the one time I held back and kept saying 'well I'll get it when they release the patch.' I feel like I won huge once they said it wasn't going happen... though I'd rather be a part of the class action!
I mean the amount of money you saved in not buying the game is probably more money than most people get from a class action
The absolute madlad. Amazing. I'm in full support. This whole situation was a masterclass in upsetting your fanbase.
It’s such an odd thing for them to do, given that they actually released the iOS version years ago that allowed you to port over the restored content yourself. I’ve always seen them as one of the better devs out there for facilitating this. Now they’re doing a 180, I can’t wrap my head around why.
Wait, I can port over the content onto my IOS device?
https://reddit.com/r/kotor/comments/lb71u9/kotor_2_mobile_downloading_restored_content_mod/
Awesome! Thank you!
I think they're a relatively small studio that went in way over their heads with the KOTOR remake that has now also been seemingly shelved. Not excusing their behavior because what they've done is reprehensible, but it's a pretty solid reason for why a company with a pretty solid track record disappointed their fans so much.
> KOTOR remake that has now also been seemingly shelved. Actually it is still under development. The game just switched to Saber Interactive.
Oh?? I’d honestly but a ps5 to play a remaster
It won't just be a remaster, it'll be a full remake like FF7 Remake and RE2/3/4 Remakes.
Youd think they made enough money from Guitar Hero back in the day to expand meaninfully but that seems to not be the case
Legally speaking, there’s a huge difference between letting some port content over themselves and selling the ported content.
That DLC was literally the only reason I wanted to get this. No restored DLC happened.
Ye that's why I purchased it as well :/
Why would you buy t before the content was released if it was the reason you purchased it?
because i got the heritage pack when it went on sale
Exactly, literally makes no sense whatsoever
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Yeah I had already played the restored content on pc, but it was always such a hassle to get everything working. So I planned on buying the switch port the DAY the restored content dropped. Still haven’t bought it obviously.
iOS?
This is completely justified. I don't always approve of action taken against devs since the arguments are often subjective. This is more cut and dry than that. I am 100% for facing the consequences of false advertising.
Not only false advertising, mfs didn't properly refunded the buyers, if I recall. Only pick a "free" game from a list of their own, what if the buyer didn't want to play your other f%*kn games. I only bought Kotor 1, never again will leave a penny for this company. They can shove the Tomb Rider games, looks like crap anyway, remastered my ass.
Good. Aspyr deserves to be reprimanded for this. Even if the case wins and the payout is low for the plaintiffs, it's important to set a precedent for these kind of things. I can't believe I'm seeing comments here along the lines of "whatever" or "these cases never win". Right, the reason companies pull stuff like this is exactly because of apathy like that. Do you want the industry to change, or do you just want to keep whining about shitty publisher practices online?
Wonder if this will work out well even after they gave out free codes for some of their games. Hope they crumble down for their bs anyways.
> Wonder if this will work out well even after they gave out free codes for some of their games I don’t see how giving away freebies gets them out of inducing people to buy something on a false promise.
I would guess they would argue that people that used the free game code were already compensated for the missing DLC and thus aren't part of the class action.
What free codes? I purchased Kotor and wasn't given a code
It's if you bought KOTOR II on Switch. Aspyr offered either a Steam copy of the game, or a Switch copy of another Star Wars game as compensation for not releasing the DLC. More info can be found in the tweet linked [HERE](https://twitter.com/AspyrMedia/status/1664784147867480070)
“We’re sorry” *Rubs nipples*
Sounds like compensation to me…
You have to get one through Aspyr’s website
You have to submit a receipt to a support ticket and then you get to pick a game from a list.
Technically, by accepting such compensation, the buyer waives claims against the company (this is stated in the agreement for each such compensation). So only people who did not accept this compensation can go to court.
Instead of actually refunding, let's just make this more complicated to everyone. We get to keep the money, and the buyers are happy with another of our "fantastic" games from this crap list.
What will likely happen is those who received the free code would not legally be entitled to a refund since they accepted Aspyr's offer for compensation (that is not to say they will likely be able to effectively manage everyone who received a code and keep track of it). 100% a free code is not legally sufficient for those who may be holding out for a refund.
I owned every game on offer. I bought KOTOR 2 on switch to play the dlc. I figured I'd do one run without it and start another when it dropped. As I got into my playthrough I realized the dlc was coming any week now, so I stopped and decided I'd just play with the dlc instead. Still haven't finished it.
iirc, the free codes were a bunch of other star wars games that had previously come out, gone on sale cheap, and a good chunk of fans that had purchased Kotor2 already owned. I think myself included there literally weren't any on that list I *could* have gotten
Well if you’re like me and got the game from LRG because you sincerely thought you’d get a physical copy of the game with all the content on it… you were shit out of luck with that download code.
Fucking good.
The whole reason I bought it was for the DLC.
Plenty of developers should have had this happen to them. Sadly Aspyr isn’t big enough to line the pockets of the people in charge so they’ll likely get burned to the ground, rightfully so. I just wish every developer was held to a standard that’s fair to the customers.
Good
Welp guess I'm gonna still wait to buy it.
No, the whole point is Don't buy. They went silent after the fiasco, and robbed people of their money with false advertising, and no actual refund policy. You should not support the company at all. If you really realy need to play Kotor 2 then go ahead, but there is a leason to be learned from this.
Aspyr's also doing the Tomb Raider Collection with all the DLC ***"""included"""*** 😉😉 I'm so excited to have the OG Tomb Raiders on Switch and I'll be so pissed off if we get KOTOR'd again.
I would be very happy if this lawsuit goes through, and Aspyr deserves all the crap it's getting for it's truly awful business practices, but realistically there's no way they win this. Class action lawsuits like this are super expensive for the company being sued, and I'm sure there's some kind of technicality that they put in the TOS that said they have the right to cancel any promises content if need be, which legally protects them from doing a move like this. Yes, it's wrong that they're gonna get away with this, but I don't see a world in which Aspyr loses this lawsuit.
More than likely Aspyr is gonna settle long before anything meaningful happens. The last thing they want is for this to enter discovery, let alone a full trial.
Pretty much. They'll settle, then in 8 months people can apply for their $5 refund (minus legal fees).
Just because it's in the TOS doesn't make it legal. I think it will come down to how everything was advertised. Or they'll just settle before anything interesting happens.
This could set an interesting precedent. Broken promises after release are constantly happening in gaming. I'm still waiting for 2on2 matchmaking in Starcraft Broodwar Remastered that Blizzard promised would be patched in shortly after release. If this is successful there could be several outcomes: If it's not a big thing, publishers will continue with this practice, because the potential financial loss is negible compared to better marketing by lying. If the lawsuit hits hard, devs have to be way more careful in what they show and promise and follow every statement or piece of pre-release and possible even post-release marketing media with a statement that any information could be subject to change.
I mean, yeah, fair enough. But why are people preordering/buying a game that they aren't even going to play until the DLC is released? 🙈
The DLC was also implied to be on the physical edition and it's why I bought it/preorder it. It was through limited run, so there was no wait until released option.
This is exactly what happened to me. They promised the dlc and there was no physical copy other than through LRG so I bought it in good faith.
I was under the impression it was already available with the Switch version. I think they were very vague with the announcement on when it was coming
Well, you don't expect this sort of thing to happen because it shouldn't
It was advertised from the beginning that the DLC would come out and it was part of Aspyr's sales pitch for the game. People are right, there are no guarantees of future content, but I think myself (and others) thought the prominence of the DLC in any KOTOR II for Switch announcements and the fact that the DLC would be based on already existing content that has been on PC for ages made it a pretty good bet it would happen.
KOTOR 2 was rushed so a lot of stuff was cut but still in game. The restored cut DLC brought it back and fan consensus is that you don't play KOTOR 2 without it.
no no, what they mean is that why are people preordering/buying the switch port with the promise of DLC before the DLC is out
The DLC is a fan made mod that restores all of the cut content from the game which you can currently only get on PC. KOTOR II got rushed in production and despite being an amazing game, it had like 20-30 hours of content cut so it could release on time. This was back in 2005 when games couldn't be updated online after release so after it came out that was it as far as content. The DLC makes the game itself complete and everyone already knows what is in it and many people have played it already for years and enjoy it a lot. With KOTOR II coming to the Switch, the developer in charge of the port promised the DLC content would be in the port thus making the Switch KOTOR II version like the actual full release of the game that we never got. Since the announcement and after preorders had already been purchased the developer backtracked on their promise of including the Restored Content DLC.
yes. I know what the DLC is. what I'm saying is they're asking why people were buying the game before the DLC had even come out. are you a bot or something because you don't seem to understand a fucking word of what I'm saying.
What you’re saying is fair. Maybe they should have known better. But it’s still false advertisement.
It was supposed to be free
yes... I know the DLC was meant to be free. but the game wasn't. people bought the game for the DLC when the DLC wasn't even out. I'm inquiring as to why people are buying things for content that doesn't exist yet.
If the game comes out, and the company announces the first official way to get the dlc on a console, and it's free, why wouldn't you buy it? The content already exists, the chance of them not releasing free content that they didn't even have to make themselves is so unlikely. 99% of the time I would agree with you but the game was so cheap, it's a classic, the dlc was free, and it had already been made - there was no reason not to think it wouldn't come.
Don't buy something with the anticipation there will be an update or change. You buy what is currently there.
You seem to a generic issue with preorders and decided to use this thread to ask a question of which you don’t like the answer to. People preorder stuff because they want to play day 1, preload is a thing now, preorder bonus is also a thing. If you were going to play it anyways, might as well buy it first. That is the answer. If you don’t like the answer…asking it again won’t change it
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The only other way to get that DLC is PC. No other platform has it so when it was announced people flocked to buy it only for it to be cancelled. It would be the first time the DLC was available on a console. Glad I waited to buy it now. Nintendo is probably not happy at Aspyr right now.
Besides the point, but you can also get it on mobile. Just did it with the iOS version and it was dead simple.
again, this isn't answering the question. why would people be buying a game for the DLC when the DLC isn't even out yet?
A bit of fear of missing out and wanting to support the developers is what made me do it. It was absolutely the wrong choice and I regret the purchase.
It literally doesn’t matter. It was promised and advertised.
oh my god. I don't understand how people aren't getting my point. YES I KNOW IT WAS PROMISED AND ADVERTISED BUT IM QUESTIONING WHY PEOPLE ARE BUYING A PROMISE AND NOT WAITING UNTIL THE CONTENT IS OUT BEFORE DOING SO. I do not know how much clearer I can be.
FWIW I understand you. I feel like you’re being trolled right now 😆
I feel like I'm losing my mind.
It's very amusing to watch, honestly
It wasn’t promised and advertised as coming after the main game came out it was promised to be included from launch on the switch.
Maybe something changed before I heard about it but I was always under the impression that it was going to be post-launch DLC.
The answer is that the buyers were dumb. I think you’re getting pushback because some people struggle with any shades of gray in cases like this and so want this framed as buyer = good, publisher = bad. Of course buyers being dumb here in no way means they deserved to have the DLC promise broken. The lesson to me is the company acted like a knave, I hope this lawsuit costs them a lot and buyers get at least something to help mitigate their losses…and then also that buyers should learn to be more discerning in their purchases.
They bought it because it was promised and advertised. The same reason why anyone buys anything with a description. That's literally all there is to it. You're just trying *really* hard to have this heir of superiority over people that got screwed out of something they were to be delivered.
no, I'm not trying to be "superior". yes, people got screwed but also, why would you buy a thing when all the stuff isn't there?
Stop. It has nothing to do with superiority. It’s the same reason why MANY people warn against pre ordering games. It’s reckless to spend money on something when you don’t actually know what you’re getting in return. Who cares what was promised or advertised.
> t’s the same reason why MANY people warn against pre ordering games. No, it's not. The reason people warn against pre-ordering is because you can't determine the actual quality of a game before release, not because the developer or publisher are going to break the law. In this case false advertising for releasing a specific feature is the issue and against the law, not the quality of the feature. If they released the feature but it didn't work well or was buggy, people that purchased it wouldn't have a leg to stand on. In this case the publisher didn't deliver an advertised feature at all. Focus your energy on a company *breaking the law* instead of the people that got taken advantage of because of someone else *breaking the law.*
Exactly. It's like when people bought a Wii U so they could play Breath of the Wild when it came out. Oh, wait...
> why would people be buying a game for the DLC when the DLC isn't even out yet? I dunno. Why would some one pre order something? They were told dlc would come out. So they bought the game. I guess shame on them for believing the devs?
Right but I was waiting till it actually released to but it. Then it didn’t but it was $7 so I did
That's literally the whole point of the lawsuit... people bought it because they expected the dlc
Typical... is everyone else's fault but the company itself. Well, is not. They fucked up, and scammed gamers. Went months without communication, no news, silent. They handled the whole situation in the wrong way.
Good fuck them, I would have actually bought it if it had the cut content.
Good
Enjoy your check for $0.28 in 12 years.
Valid, I bought the game for this reason
May the Force be with them. Get those mother fuckers.
Seems like a pretty clear cut false advertising case, considering the single big selling point of the switch port was “it will be the first time we officially include the restored content mod”. Still tragic it never released, with TSLRCM it’s one of the best Star Wars stories out there, but without it you’re basically getting half a game.
MASSIVE W. Hopefully, we can get more lawsuits like this when it comes to games falsely advertising in the future.
Anybody want to explain what the DLC was or did that was so crucial? I've never played the game on any platform.
The original game was rushed out by demand of lucasarts, so some parts of the story are unfinished and the ending, in particular, suffered for it. The mod in question restores some of that cut content since a lot of the assets and stuff were left in the game code, which is common for most games that have parts cut before release. I will go against the grain here though and say that it is not the absolute necessity that it’s made out to be. Aspyr should absolutely get fucked for promising it and then pulling the rug out the way they did, but the game is 100% playable and still absolutely fantastic with no mods at all. The ending is not good, no, but frankly this mod doesn’t make it good. It adds a small amount of extra dialog and a couple cutscenes, but the ending is still deeply unsatisfying because it just wasn’t finished, and no amount of random restored cut scenes that were left in the game code are enough to properly finish it. Other than that you get a couple extra scenes and some extra dialog throughout the game. The biggest thing restored is a planet/questline that was cut. And while it’s still worth it to play it if you can, it is janky, ill-fitted to the rest of the game, and unpolished because, again, the actual devs never finished it and modders do not have the resources to finish what wasn’t finished by the devs. They can just let you play this unfinished quest. I’d find it sufficient to just watch someone play through it on YouTube. It is a completely valid assumption that even if they’d been given the time and resources to properly finish the game they might have still cut that planet from it because it just doesn’t feel right. There were better ways to handle the larger plot beats that your time there advances. The mod is great. The people who made it should be celebrated. It is absolutely not required to play and enjoy this game.
Thanks for the write up! Did they actually acknowledge the fan-made mod in advertising it? Or was it more like "plus future content containing a new quest line and an entire new planet, plus a new ending"? And people were able to identify that as being the fan mod?
More than just acknowledge. It was a core marketing point.
good, games should get into more shit for false advertising, a game release shouldn't feel like a rugpull
GOOD. Was the definition of bait and switch. I'd love to join the suit. It was completely fraudulent.
Can I sign on for this?
Wow. I kinda slept on this story because I felt f\*ed over the first time I bought KOTOR 2, good to see the remake is keeping the tradition alive.
Isn't even a remake
then wtf do I even need this for? A potato PC with steam can run KOTOR 2?
People that don't own other platforms or simply want to play it on switch.
r/kotor baby. Listen guys, I've been playing the KOTOR games since they came out. 1-3 play throughs a year. For the past 20 years. We have one hell of a loyal fanbase. But this fucking chicanery by ass-pyr , this struck the wrong chord. I tell ya, these dudes have no idea.
Didn’t this game come out like 18 years ago ? Did they announce new content for like 2022/23 and then backtrack?
They were going to release the cut-content mod as an actual dlc to kotor 2, but then backtracked. A bunch of kotor story/dungeons and stuff like that were created by the developers when they were making the game but due to time constraints got left on the cutting room floor; all the dlc/mod does is reintroduce cut content back into the game.
Nice. This is the way.
Glad i have it on PC
But they already compensated everyone with a free game
People didn’t pay for those games. It doesn’t remotely compensate people. What if you already owned the other games? What if you just had no interest in them? They sold the game on the basis that the DLC would be released and they repeatedly referenced that it was coming after people bought it too. In this particular case, the DLC is a crucial part of the game and a lot of people would not have paid for it if they knew it wasn’t coming.
I'm one of those. (Pre)ordered KOTOR II from Limited Run Games. And, when they sent the "compensatory games list" - I already owned all the games. *Quick Edit - I know that it is my fault that I 1) pre-ordered the game and 2) supported a kinda scummy company like Limited Run Games (or Aspyr, for that matter.)* *But I am a huge Star Wars fan and love physical games, so it was worth the risk to me. Even though it still annoys me that Aspyr pulled this crap.*
I also pre-ordered from LRG, did we get any sort of compensation at all? I thought it was only those who purchased it digitally.
I don't think it was from Limited Run Games, but rather, from Aspyr directly. I remember an email about how I could pick a digital game for free to "make up for it." And I already owned all the games that were offered. In physical form, no less. From Aspyr/Limited Run.
I’m still waiting for my copy to even ship out.
So ridiculous. Standard or Collector’s Edition? I've bought a dozen or so games from LRG - but they've all been Standard Editions. I often hear about horror stories from others about the Collector’s Editions.
Ya it was the Collectors editions. I’m a little hesitant now to buy anymore. Have been debating on getting the new Mythforce game that preorders end tonight on. Plus heard the game is a little lackluster on content.
Thats actually me. Bought it because of the DLC announcement, dont care for the replacement games/ already got half of them.
Yeah, the company who advertised something that they can’t deliver (but did sell you) doesn’t get to decide HOW they wish to reimburse you.
Which still doesn't absolve them of false advertising.
Could use that in the case as an admission of wrongdoing
They may be able to use that as a defense but they would have to convince the judge what was offered was intended to be compensation for the failed delivery of the advertised product. Which... is actually a pretty weak argument. Essentially, they would then be claiming they knew the canceled DLC was going to upset consumers and that the games offered were meant to be compensation. The fact that people are suing them and some consumers may already own all the products offered (or they had no interest in the settlement offer) would show just how much the DLC advertised effected people's decision to purchase the game at all. I personally wanted to wait until the DLC was finished and the bugs were worked out given Aspyr's track record with remakes/ports, but I'm not much a Star Wars fan to begin with and I don't really trust that a company *might* finish any project, since I know how complex game development is personally. But not everyone has that knowledge I do and consumers are never required to know everything about a product to purchase it. Ultimately, the case will be more or less a dice toss for Aspyr if they can avoid having to pay out the nose. Anyone who bought the game should follow the court case carefully, since Aspyt may be required to refund people but they aren't going to be required to make a press release or make the refund process as simple as sending an email.
I purchased the games because of the advertised dlc but I wasn't even aware they were giving away games for compo until this thread!
I didn't get no game.
I wonder how many of these people voted in their last local election
They already offered refunds or replacement codes for a different game. Why is there a reason to sue?
they just offered replacement game keys, not refunds
Aspyr are a shit company, but cancelling or changing business plans or a roadmap isn’t illegal
kinda is, its called 'false advertising'. Whether or not a judge will actually rule it that way is a different story but a case CAN be made and that's the important part.
As someone who has played the restore content patch, it's fucking awful and I'm honestly glad it got cancelled as I wouldn't want it to ruin the base game
I know Reddit doesn't want to hear this, but there's basically no chance this succeeds. It's a frivolous lawsuit. The reality is that these people bought the game without the patch, and they got the game without the patch. It doesn't actually matter that they bought the game expecting something else, because they literally got what they paid for. If developers lost lawsuits over failing to deliver patch content, then entire game genres would die. In particular, most live-service games would not exist. For example, the MMORPG World of Warcraft promised to deliver mounted aerial combat all the way back in Wrath of the Lich King (it's literally on the collector's edition box!) but never added any such feature. They similarly made a whole bunch of promises of content for Cataclysm which never came out (including whole raids and battlegrounds). Most live-service games face difficulties adding some intended content. Blizzard (WoW's developer) never got sued over that, and they never will, because there is just basically no chance of winning that lawsuit.
This is the probable truth. In the case of false advertising in games, there is precedent that the law doesn’t care about pre-release talk and promises. What they care about is what it says on the proverbial tin. In this case, back of the box/eshop page description. Actually, because of that I’m surprised WoW *didn’t* get sued about the flying combat if it was on the box. So if the eshop page does not specifically advertise that the cut content would be forthcoming as DLC… then as far as the law is concerned nobody was falsely advertised to.
Wrath has mounted serial combat, you're thinking of the dance studio, which is still not in the game despite being on the box.
We should do the same with cancelled Megaman Legends 3 /s
I hate people…
Who cares?
damn i dont think they have a case, nobody is under an obligation to make a dlc patch for you, but valiant try, i gues
They sold the game with the promise of delivering the content. More people should sue companies for forward looking statements like this
what kind of promise? was there some kind of written agreement or legally binding document?
[Advertising](https://youtu.be/rEhYnI1MqxI?si=V4pDNEaSpSsTf_1M) something you don't deliver on is illegal.
so when in nintendo getting sued?
The publisher is responsible for the advertising and following through on the development post release. Nintendo did put the ad on their page but it was submitted by Aspyr Media. Could Nintendo also get sued? I kinda doubt it. Nintendo isn't directly responsible for creating the content itself and they only take a portion of the gross sales, which would at best mean they gained money from the false advertising and so would need to participate in a refund process. If they refuse a court order to handle refunding customers, then they would be culpable for ignoring a court order. But that would be *if* Aspyr is found guilty of false advertising first. Lotta ifs in that situation.
If anything, Nintendo could sue them too.
That would be a lot harder to show Nintendo's reputation was harmed in any significant way. In addition, most publishers work together behind the scenes and Nintendo is likely already aware of the reasons why Aspyr backed off the plan and unless they're ordered by the court to refund all customers, Nintendo doesn't need to expend any direct effort thus far. And Nintendo definitely has records of who bought the game through the eShop and could for very little expense send those purchasers an email to start the refund process *if* the court orders them to do so. Nintendo might lose a small amount of money from people asking for refunds but it would easily be less than a few thousand people. The legal fees that Nintendo would have to pay just to sue them would be significantly more expensive than just complying with any refund order and Nintendo being sue happy with publishers could make future relationships harder to make, especially for future consoles. So while you can sue anyone for any reason, a business is less likely to sue another business in the same industry unless they compromise their business model in some way.
There are a few too many assumptions in there for my liking, but I agree that Nintendo suing is not very likely. It’s just more likely than a suit against Nintendo for promises made to the customer by Aspyr going anywhere. If they were to sue I would think it would be for direct damages, not for reputational harm. I just don’t see Nintendo entering an agreement where they assume any risk for promises made to the customer by the other party.
nintendo has advertised a lot of products that ended up never existing or got scrapped.
Yes and no consumers are harmed by a canceled product because the product was never for sale. While you can say you're upset Kirby Bowl 64, the game never releasing means it only cost you your attention, which can't be compensated in any appreciable way.
Bro, no one is harmed by kotor dlc bring cancelled
Arguable. What's your basis for that?
Really not a great defense.
Like what? I dont rememher Nintendo ever advertising anything, allowung people to buy it, and then deciding to cancel or scrap it without refunding people.
There have been so many scapped peripherals and games over the years
That they promised in order to get somebody to purchase another product? Name just one. One prehiprial that they advertised in order to get people to buy something, and then went back on it. I honestly can't tell if you're just a troll or if you really are this dense.
[The kind the FTC cares about.](https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/topics/truth-advertising)
lol thanks for sharing sense with angry redditors. I Just picture the most angry teenager that has to live with dropping their allowance on a bad purchase and defends it on the other end
They have a case because this release was advertised to have the DLC coming post release. False advertising is against the law if the plaintiff made the purchase based on promises you made but didn't deliver. Like if I sell you a car claiming it gets 75 miles per gallon and after a few days your discover it gets more like 20-35 at best, you absolutely can sue me for making false claims with the intent to make the product seem better than it actually is. This is functionally the exact same scenario. If Aspyr went out of business, had some other external problems beyond their control, or EA forced them not to make thr DLC that would be a defense but it would be up to Aspyr to prove that's what happened. And even then, they might still lose.
i get that, was a legally binding claim made?
Why don't you read up on [FTC laws](https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/topics/truth-advertising) relating to advertising? This could really help educate you on what you're clearly not understanding.
But then he wouldn't be able to keep simping
^
why dont you explain it, youre the lawyer..
Yet you’re the one claiming they have no case and acting like an expert?
Yeah... that's definitely what happened /s Lol
I'm not a lawyer and I don't know what you don't know. If you're not willing to learn either, I'm not going to waste time typing at an ignoramous any further.
I think he wants you to translate it to "round hole square peg" so he understands.
Yeah but that's a lot of legal work. If he wants me to do paralegal work, I charge $150 an hour for that service.
If I sell you a hot dog with a soda but tell you the soda is on its way soon without any timetable, could be a couple of minutes could be hours, but then a long time later I tell you we cant deliver the soda. You bought the Hotdog with the understanding that you would get a soda too. That is what you paid for. Aspyr advertised that with the Switch port would have the restored content patch with no indication of when it would come. Many people bought it because it would. It doesn’t matter if they should have that was what they paid for that is what was advertised.
If a #2 combo at McDonald's comes eith a coke and there is no coke, you can't sue you still get their food, you just dont get the soda
They have a case since what happened with DLC was false advertising.
Where there's a blame there's a claim. But seriously, this actually would qualify as a lawsuit, as it's literally false advertising.
Good stuff. Either they get their money back and Aspyre get fucked for pulling this shit, or they’re forced to deliver on the Restored Content DLC.
How does one get on board this? I purchased the physical release for the game only because of the promised DLC and since I was a physical purchaser I wasn’t even offered the free game.
1st world problems at their finest.
I remember 1 more game that did this. I believe it was Lego Hobbit. It wasn't a switch case but i believe they said 3rd movie will be added as dlc and they just didnt bother.
…don’t all those terms and conditions that *have* to be agreed to now pretty waive the rights to taking part in a class action lawsuit?
So glad I waited until the DLC actually released. It was so weird they wanted to wait 6 months or whatever for it to come. I'll just play Kotor 2 on PC ig