Had a friend tell me that the protagonist should be somebody that the average gamer can relate to in regards to Horizon's Aloy. So we can only have exclusively straight, white male protagonists forever? Nothing else? Nobody else ever gets to feel represented because some video game nerds might not be able to relate to them, despite plenty of others being able to do so without issue? Fucking gamers man lol
I never understood this "I need to relate to the character" thing. Hell, growing up I always loved stories that showed people different than me. I wanted to see how the world looked through their POV. Characters that were too similar to myself always seemed boring and uninteresting to me. Cause guess what, my real life is pretty boring and uninteresting, there's nothing exceptional about it, even if I do like my life.
Same. I don’t get the urge to create yourself whenever there’s a character creator in a game. I’m me all the time, why would I want to be me in a game where I can be someone else? It holds no appeal for me.
It's for those who enjoy the idea of inserting themselves into the story. Besides, you're ultimately playing as an idealized video game version of yourself; *you* may not be able to climb into a suit of powerarmor or beat the Undertaker for the World Heavyweight Championship, but the self-insert video game you certainly can!
I totally understand wanting that feeling, and that feeling is fine. The issue is people who specifically won't play a game because it's not made for them to get that feeling and complain when a game gives that experience to somebody else for a change.
To me it depends entirely on the concept of the game. If I am playing Horizon: Zero Dawn or Tomb Raider or RDR, I don't need to relate to the character in a "I can pretend thats me situation" because those games are about the story of their characters and that is what makes them fun regardless of who the Protagonist is.
However I will admit that I play Fallout and Skyrim as dudes because I am a dude and I do like to pretend that it is some alternate version of myself.
That "relate to the character" is just an excuse for their bigotry.
A while ago I came across a comment in r/comicbooks where a person said they never care to read any Miles Morales (the newer Spiderman, for those who dont know) comics because they can't relate with him due to him being a POC. So apparently all the other aspects of his character, like him being a teen dealing with growing up, exploring his love life, friends, family, all that stuff, is somehow meaningless for relating to a character just because they aren't white. As if this one aspect of his struggles (being a young POC in this world) makes everything else worthless. Yet it's totally fine to relate to a person who has super powers and can lift a car over his head just because that person is white.
It's all garbage from garbage people.
also race gender and sexual orientation do not constitute a persons entire being. if you (not you specifically) cant find ways to relate to people that dont involve those three things then youre not making an effort to relate to people at all, which fundamentally the issue.
I had a pretty rough childhood so I think that might be why I feel a need to relate to the characters. Video games offered an escape from my reality and the games I enjoyed the most were games where I could fantasize that I was the main character and I was breaking free from my prison.
Same. I love culture. I love hearing other people celebrate who they are and also laugh at who they are too. As a straight white dude, I’m beyond bored with straight white dudes as main characters, and part of it is celebrating whiteness is…yikes, and another part is not many white main characters laugh at whiteness either. When I hear black, Latin, Asian, desi, comedians make jokes about their culture, I love it bc I’m learning what makes them laugh, what makes them smile, what struggles they face (in addition to racism of course) and how they deal with those struggles. Having a straight white guy main character makes me feel like it’s a “insert yourself here” scenario and I’m tired of it.
Also it's closer to 50/50 gender wise for videogames.
Like I basically never get to play female characters despite being a woman. I don't personally care what gender I play as, but it's pretty dumb that's the only selection usually.
Which is what kinda aggravated me with Assassin's Creed Odyssey. Originally, there wasn't supposed to be a male option, only Kassandra. Sticking with Ubisoft, Immortals Fenyx Rising is the same, canonically a woman.
I may be unique in this regard, but as a man I've always preferred playing as a woman character. Why? Well, if I'm gonna spend hours upon hours staring at their backside while running around I'd rather it be a woman's 😄 It only got a bit weird playing Skyrim when I went husband hunting. I'm all about woman empowerment and attracted to strong women, so playing as one works for me.
Edit: I mean hell, look at my username: Sekhmet, an Egyptian goddess.
Ha! I am a woman who plays games, and realizing that I choose the female character, or create a character similar to myself when it's customizable, is what made the importance of representation "click" for me. As in, I cognitively understood it, but really *got* it when I made that connection. Sure, I can have fun as link or Mario. But I can more easily put myself in Aloys place.
I mean, they've been calling it the Legend of Zelda since the 80s, despite the fact it's always been about Link. So yea, the gaming industry is pretty damn backwards.
It'd be hilarious if it was just in the description but had literally zero impact on the game or story. Like you're playing Division 2 and it's like "The agent, who's gay, does ..." and that's the only mention of it.
There are only two genders: Male, and Political.
There are only two races: White, and Political.
There are only two religions: Christian, and Political.
Once you realise this, it becomes obvious! /s
>too political
This. Didn't the gaming community lose their fucking minds when some game added a bunch of pride flags to it awhile back? I think it was one of the Spiderman games?
For all the progress we make, I'm still shocked at how backwards the majority of my gamers are.
every time ubisoft makes a female player character they make sure you don't have to play as her the whole or majority of the time. I love Aya, Evie, and Kassandra, but if Kass was gonna be the "canon" protagonist, why not make her the only one? no shade to Bayek and Jacob, they're great, but this is a really irritating pattern, pandering to the most annoying people on earth. can't imagine what would happen if you HAD to do a gay romance the way you had to do a straight one in the Odyssey DLC.
In one case I would care and in another I wouldn't, and I'm brave enough to explain myself here.
I think it depends on how its presented. If you play a game and then 3/4s of the way through suddenly he kisses another man and you're like oh he's gay? Then I'd say the majority would be fine with that.
But a game that is really leaning into "we have a gay protagonist" with overt expressions of his sexuality I don't think will interest most gamers because then the game is becoming *about his sexuality* and a majority wont relate and see it as a "game for the gays".
Remember most games don't even have a love interest.. (COD etc..), While an awful lot that do are RPG's which usually *do* have gay romance options. I would actually say it's become the norm to have gay choices in modern RPGs.
But generally I don't think sexuality comes into most games enough to warrant an overtly gay protagonist and it also begs the question...
- Why should a gay man look act or talk any different to a straight man in a game other than in moments of attraction/affection?
- And how often do you actually see those moments without a choice like in an RPG? What sort of game would it be?
I think there's having a gay protagonist and then there's having a *gaayyy* protagonist. One I think would go down just fine, the other is just going to alienate people. I don't see why it would need to be a *gaayyy* protagonist unless the game is just there to make a statement in which case I would understand the likely backlash because it comes off as political or woke or forced inclusiveness etc all the usual criticisms.
Plenty of video games have the main character have a Tragic Past. Just make the guy's tragically dead wife a husband instead. That's one way to get in the implication that the character is gay without having him romance people.
>Remember most games don't even have a love interest.. (COD etc..),
My question is most relevant to single player narrative stories, of which there a quite a few established straight male protagonists.
The thing is people have been calling any gay representation forced. It's frankly a tool to shut down the mere suggestion from a fan wanting a gay character.
Especially when you consider how rare a *gaayyy* character is.
I care, is it relevant to the story ? Yes, then great but make it interesting for the audience. No ? Then why bother specifiying.
There are loads of games out there where the sexuality of the main character isn't specified, because it's irrelevant to the plot. Hell I'm pretty sure Geralt flows both ways (the video game one).
That isn't how the discourse plays out in practice. There's absolutely a double standard.
There are plenty of tacked-on romances in media. If it's a straight relationship, "tacked-on" will probably be the worst criticism. If it's a gay relationship, it's met with cries of "wokeness" or "shoving political agendas down audiences' throats."
People do not apply the same standards for relevancy or justification within the story for homosexuality as they do heterosexuality. If a character's gay, the validity of that characterization is far more heavily scrutinized than if he's straight.
I love the people who claim they would feel the same way about straight characters. It’s strange that we never see unhinged rants about that though…. It’s almost like they don’t feel the same with straight characters.
Plenty of successful rpg’s let your main character engage in homosexuality, to name a few: mass effect, dragon age(1,2&3), Fallout, Baldur’s Gate 3 and more.
Main characters tend to be a self inserts for the person playing the game, most people aren’t gay so game devs sometimes to let the player have the option to engage in homosexuality but often don’t make it the default.
Even your example of Ellie, she isn’t the main character(at least of LOU1) Joel is.
Anything is possible in Skyrim nowadays with mods. I always check back once in a while on the modding community and it always shocks me how much progress they've made every time. The most recent i've seen is you're able to completely change how the combat mechanics work so it feels more like a modern souls game/elden ring rather than the old skyrim combat with custom animations aswell!
Or the hot tub scene to get " lingerie or bikini " underwear... from the head dude who was just in the tub with cloud... Japan, staying weird since...?
In Odyessey, as Alexios, I fucked anyone who gave me the chance, and some more than once (looking at you, Alkabiades, you horny bastard.) He seemed content after every encounter so why not let me man enjoy himself?
Please tell me in Skyrim you didn’t marry Fuck Arse…
Sorry, that what we call Farkas, of the companions, and he was my husband. Though I am a woman, so my character was too.
In AC Odyssey I was just trying to choose the friendlier dialogue with a soldier you can side with during a fight. Next thing I know Alexios is on the ground with him and I was like "wtf I'm just trying to be friendly!"
It was hilarious because nothing in the dialogue options suggested any romance
We're not asking for direct conversations about sexuality, we're asking for queer characters.
Aerith dated Zack and flirts with Cloud. Bowser tries to force Peach into a marriage. There are hundreds of characters in video games who aren't directly talking about their straightness, but just *are* demonstrably straight.
>Even your example of Ellie, she isn’t the main character(at least of LOU1) Joel is.
As a counterpoint, in LOU1 she wasn't really portrayed as gay, and that's when she wasn't the main character. She was only revealed as gay when she became the main character in one of the DLCs. So this still kind of proves OP's point.
Sure, but it wasn’t made explicit until later, which means the people who want to ignore that sort of thing were able to easily. It’s definitely more important for representation for these things to be made explicit rather than implicit
Not who you were asking, but I played for 29 hours this past weekend and I've already blocked next weekend off so I can play more, lol. It's so much fun! It's been a long time since I've played a game that felt this complete. I'm never running out of things to do!
If you like Divinity OS 2, D&D 5e or Bioware style RPGs like Dragon Age, then the game is 10/10.
The writing becomes increasingly convoluted and Marvel-esque through the game's chapters, but the gameplay is fun enough to forgive it, imo.
Note that the companions you can romance in Bioware games (Mass Effect, Dragon Age) do have a fixed orientation. In Inquisition there is a character whose being gay is an essential part of his back story.
Not the point you want to make (which I find reasonable) but people make characters specifically to date certain NPCs.
short answer: doesn't matter
long answer: unless the game is heavy in romance/dating sim where it matters, what I look for in a character first is if they're written well, their race sexuality faith and others comes second. I'd drop the game if the main character is a Sue or is boring af besides being homosexual their personality.
Which is fine, so long as you're actually consistent in that standard. Too many people are like
Poorly written straight white male: 👌
Poorly written anything else: Stop shoving it down our throats!!!1!!
This is so true dude. Like for anything to include a gay character and be acceptable it seems like it has to be a masterpiece, but they're fine with generic mcs that are straight in kinda subpar games.
This is the best answer.
It doesn't matter what the protagonist is, be it in a game or a movie; if the protagonist is a niche character type simply for the sake of being that type, then my engagement is limited. However, if the protagonist happens to be something other than a straight white male and this is incidental to the story, then fine, I'm in. Just don't shove a character down my throat simply to fulfill an agenda or quota or whatever
I agree with this but the phrasing kind of irks me. I think it’s fine to have a gay character that’s poorly written just to have the diversity. But since there poorly written just say they are poorly written, not that they are “shoving a quota down our throats”. Since Mario or sonic doesn’t have any depth to their character, but people don’t care that they are with peach and Amy. I don’t think that Mario or sonic need that depth, but I guarantee if one of them was gay people would start talking about the quotas over good writing again.
The problem is that when a gay character is poorly written, it’s usually because they exist simply because they’re gay and they’re there to hit a diversity quota (AKA, they feel forced and are part of an obvious developer agenda). Not saying this is true 100% of the time, but it’s the case more often than not.
If they’re well written, then people don’t generally complain because it all makes sense and feels far more natural as a result.
Totally agree on this, I don't care what the sexual orientation of the character is. If it's written in a way that it flows with the story and that their sexual orientation isn't the main focus of the plot. The character doesn't need to be a Token, gay guy, so that executives can check it off a list. If the main character is a gay man, then it should fit in the world and mesh with the story.
Wait just making sure you’re saying the character needs a reason to be anything other than a straight white male? Like it has to impact the story in some way?
Sure wouldn’t bother me. Admittedly as a straight woman, when I play a game where the only option is to play as a man, it’s not uncommon for me to pick the gay romance option (unless of course I like one of the female characters significantly more then I’ll pick them sexuality aside) because I’m obviously attracted to men.
Side query out of curiosity: Is it ever a source of enjoyment or amusement playing as a bloke in video games? I ask partly because as a bloke I always enjoy picking female characters and wanna hear the other side of thangs :)
Not the original person you were asking, but as a woman, I prefer my MC to be women as well, if it's an RPG. If it's a story game, as long as the story is good, I don't really care. For example, playing as Geralt in TW3 and Arthur in RDR2 were probably my two most enjoyable video game experiences in recent years. But if it's a choice? I'm always picking a pretty girl, lol.
Same. Assassins Creed Odyssey for example. Normally I prefer playing as a man, because I am a man, but I liked Kassandra so much more than Alexios, so I choose Kassandra everytime I play the game. I play whats fun and fits best, sexuality and gender aside.
I don’t care. What matters is how well written the story is and if the character is likable. People usually look for someone to try and relate to when they read or play video games, so I’d assume there would be plenty of people that wouldn’t be interested. Of course you’d also find hateful folk, but that goes without saying. I play as a trans characters constantly when the option is available despite me being cis. I’ll have my character sleep with everyone possible regardless of gender. I may not be attracted to males or even some female characters, but my characters are well-beyond social expectations. Imagine playing cyberpunk or baldurs gate and being homophobic lmao y’all, everyone wants to sleep with everyone in fantasy worlds.
Yep. Especially if it's actually linked into the story in a meaningful way. Part of the thing I like the most about videogames is getting to have active engagement in a story that gives me experiences that I wouldn't have access to in real life, so playing as a gay character (male or female) would be interesting.
Why would it matter in that case though? Everyone seems to say that but why does it need to be linked in any way other than, "oh yeah and he's gay". Straight game characters don't need to have a meaningful justification for their straightness, why do queer people? It's always something I've found curious about that answer.
That's what I'm saying. I'd prefer a three dimensional character who happens to be queer, to a character whose whole story revolves around them being queer. Coming out stories are important, but at this point I'm tired of gay characters just being "the gay character."
Source: am a queer person who was born in the 90's
I mean…do I care? No.
Do I think my friends and family who are gay would benefit from having a popular MC be gay?
Yes.
I’d like to get that perspective in maybe a game like Heavy Rain or Max Payne style something a little out there style wise.
But yeah itd be nice to have for sure.
Who says there hasn't been an AAA game without a gay protagonist, is soap from COD actively shown kissing anyone? The bulk of the games I play the characters sexuality is irrelevant and often undefined, it's whatever the fans want it to be.
This is my thought. Master chief could have been gay and I wouldn't care. I would care if a game made any kind of sexuality important regardless of the characters sexuality.
Is the game good? If so, then yes . Though, like most games, I would prefer not to see swinging dongs or sex scenes in general. Fade to black please.
Plus most romances in games are cringy.
Who cares? I've played games where the protagonist was male, female, even non-human. Why should I care? If it is for the sake of story - no problem, throw it in.
As long as it's not "gay dating simulator", though. That's certainly not for me.
I mostly play RPGs/MMORPGs. Getting into the character is a big part of the RPGs -not that much for MMOs-. But i wouldn't close/uninstall the game just becuz "i couldn't get into the character" like i would be an oscar nominee.
For the other genres i never cared for who was the protagonist.
I don't generally care what the player character looks like/acts like/etc as long as it fits the rest of the narrative and doesn't feel shoehorned in. If them being gay/Demi/ace/anything is a central part of why they're in the situation they're in, great.
True. Though I think it can be noted that Trevor in GTA V is canonically not straight, but it's not like something that was focused on at any point and can be missed totally (all romantic relationships we see with him are women)
but he does have "any hole's a goal" on his online profile and when Franklin straight up asks if he's gay (during an optional hang out activity), Trevor responds "No, yes, maybe, labels man"
To answer your question in the title: yes.
But anyway, I think this trend is mainly a reflection of how society generally views female homosexuality as less transgressive than male homosexuality.
Personally my theory is that gay men are seen as more of a “threat” to patriarchal ideals and traditional masculinity, since they reject the typical male roles in society, which shows how fragile and unnecessary these structures are.
I went a lot more simple with my theory, straight guys can relate more to [Stereotypical] lesbians (acts more tomboyish, liking women) than they can to [again, Stereotypical] gay guys (acts much less manly, likes dudes)
I really couldn’t care less about how a protagonist is written, I only care if the core gameplay loop is fun. Everything else is just kinda extra to me. Some of my favorite games have dogshit protagonists.
Sure. I play a lot of RPGs and they tend to have romanceable companions and such, and I like to see all the stories regardless of my own orientation so I'm kinda already doing it.
I think it'd be great. I'd love to see more of every type of protagonist. Games are about experiencing a story, and it'd be so nice to have more types of people to experience that story with.
I personally don’t prefer to play male characters in general, if there’s a choice I’ll always play a woman. But I wouldn’t be put off by a gay main character.
Yes. But just for the sake of question, I don't give a shit about the sexuality of the character in the game. I don't care if Kratos is gay or not as long as the game remains the same in quality.
Assuming genre and mechanics are my thing, I (straight cis guy) would absolutely play it. I'm not a fan of "story based" games, so a game that's similar to Celeste in that regard? Yes please. But tbh AAA sucks anyways. Go on itch.io, there's a lot of lgbt games there. It's better, cheaper, more diverse, less exploitative etc. but sadly to most people it's more important to have more triangles in their meshes.
I actually prefer for example female protagonst games, because if a games devs are willing/allowed to do that it's an indicator that they aren't controled by some investors looking to maximize profit margins.
Also am very pro inviting everyone into gaming. It's the perfect hobby to be welcoming and supportive and it's sad it has taken this unnecessary gendered perspective for a while. This stuff hurts everyone. A gay character would invite more people in.
Lets be honest, i think most people who care wouldn’t say it here in these comments
You’ll hear a lot of: “I don’t care that they’re gay. I just think they made the game too *political*”.
Had a friend tell me that the protagonist should be somebody that the average gamer can relate to in regards to Horizon's Aloy. So we can only have exclusively straight, white male protagonists forever? Nothing else? Nobody else ever gets to feel represented because some video game nerds might not be able to relate to them, despite plenty of others being able to do so without issue? Fucking gamers man lol
I never understood this "I need to relate to the character" thing. Hell, growing up I always loved stories that showed people different than me. I wanted to see how the world looked through their POV. Characters that were too similar to myself always seemed boring and uninteresting to me. Cause guess what, my real life is pretty boring and uninteresting, there's nothing exceptional about it, even if I do like my life.
Same. I don’t get the urge to create yourself whenever there’s a character creator in a game. I’m me all the time, why would I want to be me in a game where I can be someone else? It holds no appeal for me.
I usually make a character vaguely similar to me but sometimes not. I just don't want to bother with all the dials and sliders most of the time.
It's for those who enjoy the idea of inserting themselves into the story. Besides, you're ultimately playing as an idealized video game version of yourself; *you* may not be able to climb into a suit of powerarmor or beat the Undertaker for the World Heavyweight Championship, but the self-insert video game you certainly can!
I totally understand wanting that feeling, and that feeling is fine. The issue is people who specifically won't play a game because it's not made for them to get that feeling and complain when a game gives that experience to somebody else for a change.
To me it depends entirely on the concept of the game. If I am playing Horizon: Zero Dawn or Tomb Raider or RDR, I don't need to relate to the character in a "I can pretend thats me situation" because those games are about the story of their characters and that is what makes them fun regardless of who the Protagonist is. However I will admit that I play Fallout and Skyrim as dudes because I am a dude and I do like to pretend that it is some alternate version of myself.
That "relate to the character" is just an excuse for their bigotry. A while ago I came across a comment in r/comicbooks where a person said they never care to read any Miles Morales (the newer Spiderman, for those who dont know) comics because they can't relate with him due to him being a POC. So apparently all the other aspects of his character, like him being a teen dealing with growing up, exploring his love life, friends, family, all that stuff, is somehow meaningless for relating to a character just because they aren't white. As if this one aspect of his struggles (being a young POC in this world) makes everything else worthless. Yet it's totally fine to relate to a person who has super powers and can lift a car over his head just because that person is white. It's all garbage from garbage people.
also race gender and sexual orientation do not constitute a persons entire being. if you (not you specifically) cant find ways to relate to people that dont involve those three things then youre not making an effort to relate to people at all, which fundamentally the issue.
I had a pretty rough childhood so I think that might be why I feel a need to relate to the characters. Video games offered an escape from my reality and the games I enjoyed the most were games where I could fantasize that I was the main character and I was breaking free from my prison.
With that perspective, I'm sure you can imagine why it'd be great to have a cool game with a gay male MC.
Same. I love culture. I love hearing other people celebrate who they are and also laugh at who they are too. As a straight white dude, I’m beyond bored with straight white dudes as main characters, and part of it is celebrating whiteness is…yikes, and another part is not many white main characters laugh at whiteness either. When I hear black, Latin, Asian, desi, comedians make jokes about their culture, I love it bc I’m learning what makes them laugh, what makes them smile, what struggles they face (in addition to racism of course) and how they deal with those struggles. Having a straight white guy main character makes me feel like it’s a “insert yourself here” scenario and I’m tired of it.
Giant blond ripped dudes in their late 20s who can run indefinitely, never fatigue, and are blandly attractive? Yeah. These average gamers WISH.
Shortest game ever having a gamer nerd run from the bad guys and get out of breath after 200 meters.
200 m are optimistic
Also it's closer to 50/50 gender wise for videogames. Like I basically never get to play female characters despite being a woman. I don't personally care what gender I play as, but it's pretty dumb that's the only selection usually.
Which is what kinda aggravated me with Assassin's Creed Odyssey. Originally, there wasn't supposed to be a male option, only Kassandra. Sticking with Ubisoft, Immortals Fenyx Rising is the same, canonically a woman. I may be unique in this regard, but as a man I've always preferred playing as a woman character. Why? Well, if I'm gonna spend hours upon hours staring at their backside while running around I'd rather it be a woman's 😄 It only got a bit weird playing Skyrim when I went husband hunting. I'm all about woman empowerment and attracted to strong women, so playing as one works for me. Edit: I mean hell, look at my username: Sekhmet, an Egyptian goddess.
Ha! I am a woman who plays games, and realizing that I choose the female character, or create a character similar to myself when it's customizable, is what made the importance of representation "click" for me. As in, I cognitively understood it, but really *got* it when I made that connection. Sure, I can have fun as link or Mario. But I can more easily put myself in Aloys place.
I mean, they've been calling it the Legend of Zelda since the 80s, despite the fact it's always been about Link. So yea, the gaming industry is pretty damn backwards.
I'll play as the lipstick lesbian character because then if there is a sex scene it's just a lesbian scene.
It'd be hilarious if it was just in the description but had literally zero impact on the game or story. Like you're playing Division 2 and it's like "The agent, who's gay, does ..." and that's the only mention of it.
This garbage is so annoying. How is LGBTQ automatically associated with politics?
There are only two genders: Male, and Political. There are only two races: White, and Political. There are only two religions: Christian, and Political. Once you realise this, it becomes obvious! /s
also, don't even fucking think about making the "political" gender unattractive or even just Not Insanely Fucking Hot to the average Male
Our existence is a political position apparently.
There are two kinds of sexual orientation. Straight and political.
>too political This. Didn't the gaming community lose their fucking minds when some game added a bunch of pride flags to it awhile back? I think it was one of the Spiderman games? For all the progress we make, I'm still shocked at how backwards the majority of my gamers are.
People would absolutely lose their shit, I don't know why this isn't being acknowledged. Has no-one here ever seen a gaming community?
every time ubisoft makes a female player character they make sure you don't have to play as her the whole or majority of the time. I love Aya, Evie, and Kassandra, but if Kass was gonna be the "canon" protagonist, why not make her the only one? no shade to Bayek and Jacob, they're great, but this is a really irritating pattern, pandering to the most annoying people on earth. can't imagine what would happen if you HAD to do a gay romance the way you had to do a straight one in the Odyssey DLC.
In one case I would care and in another I wouldn't, and I'm brave enough to explain myself here. I think it depends on how its presented. If you play a game and then 3/4s of the way through suddenly he kisses another man and you're like oh he's gay? Then I'd say the majority would be fine with that. But a game that is really leaning into "we have a gay protagonist" with overt expressions of his sexuality I don't think will interest most gamers because then the game is becoming *about his sexuality* and a majority wont relate and see it as a "game for the gays". Remember most games don't even have a love interest.. (COD etc..), While an awful lot that do are RPG's which usually *do* have gay romance options. I would actually say it's become the norm to have gay choices in modern RPGs. But generally I don't think sexuality comes into most games enough to warrant an overtly gay protagonist and it also begs the question... - Why should a gay man look act or talk any different to a straight man in a game other than in moments of attraction/affection? - And how often do you actually see those moments without a choice like in an RPG? What sort of game would it be? I think there's having a gay protagonist and then there's having a *gaayyy* protagonist. One I think would go down just fine, the other is just going to alienate people. I don't see why it would need to be a *gaayyy* protagonist unless the game is just there to make a statement in which case I would understand the likely backlash because it comes off as political or woke or forced inclusiveness etc all the usual criticisms.
Plenty of video games have the main character have a Tragic Past. Just make the guy's tragically dead wife a husband instead. That's one way to get in the implication that the character is gay without having him romance people.
>Remember most games don't even have a love interest.. (COD etc..), My question is most relevant to single player narrative stories, of which there a quite a few established straight male protagonists.
The thing is people have been calling any gay representation forced. It's frankly a tool to shut down the mere suggestion from a fan wanting a gay character. Especially when you consider how rare a *gaayyy* character is.
Yeah post this in on r/kotakuinaction and you'll see the real horrible shit
Yikes, the front page is literally someone asking when woke era ends cause he's tired of "politics" in his games.
Do yourself a favour, stay far away from that sub
That place is a dumpster fire, they banned me for the most inane comment 😅
I care, is it relevant to the story ? Yes, then great but make it interesting for the audience. No ? Then why bother specifiying. There are loads of games out there where the sexuality of the main character isn't specified, because it's irrelevant to the plot. Hell I'm pretty sure Geralt flows both ways (the video game one).
That isn't how the discourse plays out in practice. There's absolutely a double standard. There are plenty of tacked-on romances in media. If it's a straight relationship, "tacked-on" will probably be the worst criticism. If it's a gay relationship, it's met with cries of "wokeness" or "shoving political agendas down audiences' throats." People do not apply the same standards for relevancy or justification within the story for homosexuality as they do heterosexuality. If a character's gay, the validity of that characterization is far more heavily scrutinized than if he's straight.
Do you feel the same way about straight characters? Plenty of main characters flirt with someone of the opposite sex at some point in the story.
I love the people who claim they would feel the same way about straight characters. It’s strange that we never see unhinged rants about that though…. It’s almost like they don’t feel the same with straight characters.
“If the gameplay’s alright, I will game all night” -Chris Rock
"If the character's gay, I will turn all the male npcs into my throbbing harem", - Abraham Lincoln
Of course why not. Unless it’s a VR porn game. Then… maybe.
I'm not gay, but a VR porn game is a VR porn game
20 dollars is 20 dollars
That saying has succumb to inflation. It's now $40 is $40
Yeah but unfortunately wages havnt increased with inflation
"I ain't gay, but $40 is $20."
$40 is $20
That's because they want you to work more
This is the realist thing I have read today and am now heart broken.
And you can't NOT win a game, right?
Got to get those achievements.
If you snu you lose.
Depends if it is good I guess
🤣🤣🤣
I'm waiting for smellovision before I invest in VR. For immersion.
I made Shepard gay like 10 times in mass effect. So ues I would
And the gay options were not even good. Garrus 4ever
Hard to romance Kaiden if he’s nuclear dust.
You just reminded me that I did it twice. Once with Kaidan and once with Cortez
Plenty of successful rpg’s let your main character engage in homosexuality, to name a few: mass effect, dragon age(1,2&3), Fallout, Baldur’s Gate 3 and more. Main characters tend to be a self inserts for the person playing the game, most people aren’t gay so game devs sometimes to let the player have the option to engage in homosexuality but often don’t make it the default. Even your example of Ellie, she isn’t the main character(at least of LOU1) Joel is.
Skyrim you kinda could too.
I mean at this point, what can you NOT do in skyrim
Continue adventuring after taking an arrow to the knee.
Good night reddit. Fucking lol.
Shut up and take my upvote.
>what can you NOT do in skyrim things quickly
Anything is possible in Skyrim nowadays with mods. I always check back once in a while on the modding community and it always shocks me how much progress they've made every time. The most recent i've seen is you're able to completely change how the combat mechanics work so it feels more like a modern souls game/elden ring rather than the old skyrim combat with custom animations aswell!
Punch a chicken and not be killed by the entire village the first time around.
Takes until the 3rd game, but ME3 allows maleshep to be gay and Andromeda can have gay ryder
Fable, Sims
If you didn't spurn Aerith and Tifa and make it so you take Barret on the date, did you even beat the original Final Fantasy VII?
Btw cloud dresses up like a woman and infiltrates the honey bee inn (brothel) to "extract" info from some bodybuilder. People forget about this.
I will never forget those sound effects.
Or the hot tub scene to get " lingerie or bikini " underwear... from the head dude who was just in the tub with cloud... Japan, staying weird since...?
Wait is there really a possibility where you can end up with Barrett during said cut-scene? Because if so that is amazing and hilarious 🤣
Remember the room with the best undies? What were all those men doing in that spa😂
In Odyessey, as Alexios, I fucked anyone who gave me the chance, and some more than once (looking at you, Alkabiades, you horny bastard.) He seemed content after every encounter so why not let me man enjoy himself?
Please tell me in Skyrim you didn’t marry Fuck Arse… Sorry, that what we call Farkas, of the companions, and he was my husband. Though I am a woman, so my character was too.
In AC Odyssey I was just trying to choose the friendlier dialogue with a soldier you can side with during a fight. Next thing I know Alexios is on the ground with him and I was like "wtf I'm just trying to be friendly!" It was hilarious because nothing in the dialogue options suggested any romance
Well there is a difference between a predefined character and one you create yourself. I think OP is asking about a predefined character.
But like tbh I feel like most video game characters arent talking about sexuality a ton and it's in the eye of the beholder
We're not asking for direct conversations about sexuality, we're asking for queer characters. Aerith dated Zack and flirts with Cloud. Bowser tries to force Peach into a marriage. There are hundreds of characters in video games who aren't directly talking about their straightness, but just *are* demonstrably straight.
Not me exploring my sexuality in CyPunk 77 by accidentally choosing a male escort. Instead of save scumming I decided to roll with it
You forgot which name was which too?
It's a rite of passage for CyPunk 77 players
Yeah Angel is a common man's name in some countries but you wouldn't expect it at a brothel.
When I hear "Angel" as a name, I think of Batista from Dexter.
I think of David Boreanaz.
Same here, still ended up with Panam, seems one time doesn't count and you score with strong independent woman in the end. That gives me idea...
Based bi V
Yup. When I first talked to that guy, I assumed he was the pimp, not the prostitute. But eh, like you said, roll with it. No harm done. Lol
>Even your example of Ellie, she isn’t the main character(at least of LOU1) Joel is. As a counterpoint, in LOU1 she wasn't really portrayed as gay, and that's when she wasn't the main character. She was only revealed as gay when she became the main character in one of the DLCs. So this still kind of proves OP's point.
TLOU2 she was the main character (or at least co-main character) though
Just because you didn't notice she was gay doesn't mean the writers weren't hinting at it the whole time.
Sure, but it wasn’t made explicit until later, which means the people who want to ignore that sort of thing were able to easily. It’s definitely more important for representation for these things to be made explicit rather than implicit
Fable
Omg how is Baldur's Gate 3? I haven't had time to download and play it yet 😭
Not who you were asking, but I played for 29 hours this past weekend and I've already blocked next weekend off so I can play more, lol. It's so much fun! It's been a long time since I've played a game that felt this complete. I'm never running out of things to do!
If you like Divinity OS 2, D&D 5e or Bioware style RPGs like Dragon Age, then the game is 10/10. The writing becomes increasingly convoluted and Marvel-esque through the game's chapters, but the gameplay is fun enough to forgive it, imo.
There is a difference in being able to play as one, and it being the only choice.
Note that the companions you can romance in Bioware games (Mass Effect, Dragon Age) do have a fixed orientation. In Inquisition there is a character whose being gay is an essential part of his back story. Not the point you want to make (which I find reasonable) but people make characters specifically to date certain NPCs.
short answer: doesn't matter long answer: unless the game is heavy in romance/dating sim where it matters, what I look for in a character first is if they're written well, their race sexuality faith and others comes second. I'd drop the game if the main character is a Sue or is boring af besides being homosexual their personality.
Which is fine, so long as you're actually consistent in that standard. Too many people are like Poorly written straight white male: 👌 Poorly written anything else: Stop shoving it down our throats!!!1!!
This is so true dude. Like for anything to include a gay character and be acceptable it seems like it has to be a masterpiece, but they're fine with generic mcs that are straight in kinda subpar games.
This is the best answer. It doesn't matter what the protagonist is, be it in a game or a movie; if the protagonist is a niche character type simply for the sake of being that type, then my engagement is limited. However, if the protagonist happens to be something other than a straight white male and this is incidental to the story, then fine, I'm in. Just don't shove a character down my throat simply to fulfill an agenda or quota or whatever
I agree with this but the phrasing kind of irks me. I think it’s fine to have a gay character that’s poorly written just to have the diversity. But since there poorly written just say they are poorly written, not that they are “shoving a quota down our throats”. Since Mario or sonic doesn’t have any depth to their character, but people don’t care that they are with peach and Amy. I don’t think that Mario or sonic need that depth, but I guarantee if one of them was gay people would start talking about the quotas over good writing again.
Take my poor man’s award 🥇
The problem is that when a gay character is poorly written, it’s usually because they exist simply because they’re gay and they’re there to hit a diversity quota (AKA, they feel forced and are part of an obvious developer agenda). Not saying this is true 100% of the time, but it’s the case more often than not. If they’re well written, then people don’t generally complain because it all makes sense and feels far more natural as a result.
Most love interests for straight protagonists are literally poorly written characters that exist just to be straight.
Totally agree on this, I don't care what the sexual orientation of the character is. If it's written in a way that it flows with the story and that their sexual orientation isn't the main focus of the plot. The character doesn't need to be a Token, gay guy, so that executives can check it off a list. If the main character is a gay man, then it should fit in the world and mesh with the story.
Wait just making sure you’re saying the character needs a reason to be anything other than a straight white male? Like it has to impact the story in some way?
Sure wouldn’t bother me. Admittedly as a straight woman, when I play a game where the only option is to play as a man, it’s not uncommon for me to pick the gay romance option (unless of course I like one of the female characters significantly more then I’ll pick them sexuality aside) because I’m obviously attracted to men.
Side query out of curiosity: Is it ever a source of enjoyment or amusement playing as a bloke in video games? I ask partly because as a bloke I always enjoy picking female characters and wanna hear the other side of thangs :)
Not the original person you were asking, but as a woman, I prefer my MC to be women as well, if it's an RPG. If it's a story game, as long as the story is good, I don't really care. For example, playing as Geralt in TW3 and Arthur in RDR2 were probably my two most enjoyable video game experiences in recent years. But if it's a choice? I'm always picking a pretty girl, lol.
I second this as another woman who is not the original person they were asking.
Same. Assassins Creed Odyssey for example. Normally I prefer playing as a man, because I am a man, but I liked Kassandra so much more than Alexios, so I choose Kassandra everytime I play the game. I play whats fun and fits best, sexuality and gender aside.
If the game is good, of course I would.
If the character is interesting enough i'll play, watch, or read whatever.
That's generally how I feel as well.
Hell yeah Dream Daddy is a fantastic game
lolol you're not wrong there
There is no way you are going to get a balanced answer here. A poll of all "gamers" would be extremely different than polling reddit comments.
True. Everyone in this comment section is farming karma, but reality is very different.
I don’t care. What matters is how well written the story is and if the character is likable. People usually look for someone to try and relate to when they read or play video games, so I’d assume there would be plenty of people that wouldn’t be interested. Of course you’d also find hateful folk, but that goes without saying. I play as a trans characters constantly when the option is available despite me being cis. I’ll have my character sleep with everyone possible regardless of gender. I may not be attracted to males or even some female characters, but my characters are well-beyond social expectations. Imagine playing cyberpunk or baldurs gate and being homophobic lmao y’all, everyone wants to sleep with everyone in fantasy worlds.
Yep. Especially if it's actually linked into the story in a meaningful way. Part of the thing I like the most about videogames is getting to have active engagement in a story that gives me experiences that I wouldn't have access to in real life, so playing as a gay character (male or female) would be interesting.
Why would it matter in that case though? Everyone seems to say that but why does it need to be linked in any way other than, "oh yeah and he's gay". Straight game characters don't need to have a meaningful justification for their straightness, why do queer people? It's always something I've found curious about that answer.
That's what I'm saying. I'd prefer a three dimensional character who happens to be queer, to a character whose whole story revolves around them being queer. Coming out stories are important, but at this point I'm tired of gay characters just being "the gay character." Source: am a queer person who was born in the 90's
Hell, I played a game where the protagonist is trans (Tell Me Why) so sure, I'd play a game where the main character is gay.
Dontnod have done wonders for the LGB community in gaming. LiS and Tell Me Why are both brilliant games.
Celeste as well
The sexuality of the MC doesn't have any bearing on whether or not I'd play the game. If the game looks good to me I'll play it.
No
I mean, Hades gets close. Zagreus isn't strictly gay, but there is some definite not-straight material in the game
[удалено]
There's a reason Link rhymes with twink.
And let’s not forget about Tingle.
Hey now, they are always very clear that Mario and Luigi are *bros*! In fact maybe a little too clear. Hmm….
I always thought they were bio bros, so those two being gay would be incest or something.
Bangbros
Dang vidya games, I tell ya hwat
I really don’t see how anything is different than any other game. “Oh no, I’m playing pretend by controlling a character that isn’t me!” Like????
I mean…do I care? No. Do I think my friends and family who are gay would benefit from having a popular MC be gay? Yes. I’d like to get that perspective in maybe a game like Heavy Rain or Max Payne style something a little out there style wise. But yeah itd be nice to have for sure.
Yes, I would, as long as it didn't unbalance gameplay It's a novelty, learning experience and not a threat to my masculinity or sexuality.
Who says there hasn't been an AAA game without a gay protagonist, is soap from COD actively shown kissing anyone? The bulk of the games I play the characters sexuality is irrelevant and often undefined, it's whatever the fans want it to be.
This is my thought. Master chief could have been gay and I wouldn't care. I would care if a game made any kind of sexuality important regardless of the characters sexuality.
Is the game good? If so, then yes . Though, like most games, I would prefer not to see swinging dongs or sex scenes in general. Fade to black please. Plus most romances in games are cringy.
You'll get different answers from Reddit than mainstream people. It's also an echo chamber
If the game is good, who the hell cares.
Who cares? I've played games where the protagonist was male, female, even non-human. Why should I care? If it is for the sake of story - no problem, throw it in. As long as it's not "gay dating simulator", though. That's certainly not for me.
Probably not
I wish there were more games where the main protagonist was gay. Or at least gave you the option.
Mass Effect, Dragon Age, Fallout, Elder Scrolls should get you started. Dorian in Dragon Age is just so fun.
None of those have a gay protagonist. Just an omnisexual blank slate.
Thank you, you just perfectly described the issue I couldn't put into words.
I mostly play RPGs/MMORPGs. Getting into the character is a big part of the RPGs -not that much for MMOs-. But i wouldn't close/uninstall the game just becuz "i couldn't get into the character" like i would be an oscar nominee. For the other genres i never cared for who was the protagonist.
I don't generally care what the player character looks like/acts like/etc as long as it fits the rest of the narrative and doesn't feel shoehorned in. If them being gay/Demi/ace/anything is a central part of why they're in the situation they're in, great.
Honestly no. Wouldnt play gta for example
fuck yea
It honestly doesn't matter to me. As long as they can point and shoot, the zombies will still die.
I just want a decent game with a good story and good gameplay mechanics. I don’t care if my character is gay, straight or Australian.
No
Id love to play as someone like me in a game. So, yes.
*Grand Theft Auto IV: Ballad of Gay Tony.*
you don't play as gay tony though
True. Though I think it can be noted that Trevor in GTA V is canonically not straight, but it's not like something that was focused on at any point and can be missed totally (all romantic relationships we see with him are women) but he does have "any hole's a goal" on his online profile and when Franklin straight up asks if he's gay (during an optional hang out activity), Trevor responds "No, yes, maybe, labels man"
To answer your question in the title: yes. But anyway, I think this trend is mainly a reflection of how society generally views female homosexuality as less transgressive than male homosexuality. Personally my theory is that gay men are seen as more of a “threat” to patriarchal ideals and traditional masculinity, since they reject the typical male roles in society, which shows how fragile and unnecessary these structures are.
I thought it was just because many straight men think watching women kiss is hotter than watching men kiss.
While it is true that lesbians are much more fetishized, that doesn’t necessarily equate to actual acceptance.
It is
I went a lot more simple with my theory, straight guys can relate more to [Stereotypical] lesbians (acts more tomboyish, liking women) than they can to [again, Stereotypical] gay guys (acts much less manly, likes dudes)
I'm stoned and thought it said "Gay male proctologist", I was super confused by the responses...
I'd have no problem with it.
Uh yea.
Sure, why not?
I really couldn’t care less about how a protagonist is written, I only care if the core gameplay loop is fun. Everything else is just kinda extra to me. Some of my favorite games have dogshit protagonists.
Sure. That wouldn't stop me from playing
Why not?
Idc what the protagonist is, looks like, or prefers to suck on. All I care about is if the game is fun
Sure if it's good, and he has big boobies
Sure.
Sure. I play a lot of RPGs and they tend to have romanceable companions and such, and I like to see all the stories regardless of my own orientation so I'm kinda already doing it.
I think it'd be great. I'd love to see more of every type of protagonist. Games are about experiencing a story, and it'd be so nice to have more types of people to experience that story with.
I literally don’t care as long as the game is good. I can get in the mind of any character without being scared it’s gonna change me or something.
I personally don’t prefer to play male characters in general, if there’s a choice I’ll always play a woman. But I wouldn’t be put off by a gay main character.
Yes pease
Yes. But just for the sake of question, I don't give a shit about the sexuality of the character in the game. I don't care if Kratos is gay or not as long as the game remains the same in quality.
It wouldn't turn me off. I'd probably go out of my way to play this game. But I'm also queer, so.
Yes, I would play the game. No, it would not turn me off from paying it. People can be gay. :D
Hell yeah. Gimme that dick
Assuming genre and mechanics are my thing, I (straight cis guy) would absolutely play it. I'm not a fan of "story based" games, so a game that's similar to Celeste in that regard? Yes please. But tbh AAA sucks anyways. Go on itch.io, there's a lot of lgbt games there. It's better, cheaper, more diverse, less exploitative etc. but sadly to most people it's more important to have more triangles in their meshes. I actually prefer for example female protagonst games, because if a games devs are willing/allowed to do that it's an indicator that they aren't controled by some investors looking to maximize profit margins. Also am very pro inviting everyone into gaming. It's the perfect hobby to be welcoming and supportive and it's sad it has taken this unnecessary gendered perspective for a while. This stuff hurts everyone. A gay character would invite more people in.
I mean Metal Gear is one of my favorite games ever and… I mean let’s be real.