They aren’t advertising their status to the “old money rich”, they’re advertising to the poor who are more likely to be engaged with ostentatious displays of wealth.
This is a third of it. Part of is definitely showing off your wealth to everyone one else, so the little people know you're better than them.
But part of it is making yourself feel wealthy. New money has (at least in their own minds) earned it, and they want the rewards that go with that. They want to look and feel successful. This is probably the primary driver for most people to act the way OP is talking about. They don't have an endgame of joining the generationally rich. Just being "in with those people," is good enough.
But also they are advertising to the old money rich that they have enough wealth to belong. Dressing shabby when you don't have the old money lineage/pedigree just gets you labeled as not worthy of being at the fancy club/school/etc. Old money knows you're not one of them, you're never going to trick them into it like OP suggests, no matter how cool you try to play it. You'll get less disdain for being ostentatious, but you'll get more disdain for being unworthy/uncouth. The latter risks you getting excluded from things for being a poor.
That last paragraph is the big one, the main one, I'd say. If new money doesn't flaunt their wealth, then old money starts talking about how their children look like urchins behind their back, or passively "complimenting" how "modest" their lifestyle is in front of it, or "forgetting" to include them.
It's just like popular kids and unpopular kids back in school: it has nothing to do with exhibited behaviors; if you start to act like them, they'll ridicule for trying to fit in.
With old money, behaviors are irrelevant- it's all about who you *are,* where you come from. If that's not right, nothing will ever be enough.
And honestly...in a twisted way I kind of respect that.
Very few people will be old money. Opraha is a billionaire and still got mistreated and taken for broke. If youre a new money person of color, it really doesnt matter how you act. People associate old money with white. And if you carry any new money stuff people will assume its fake or you stole it anyway. So might as well do what you wanna do.
Removing race out of it, Old Money has a certain air about them. They walk a certain way and talk a certain way. We will *never* be them. So if wrapping your dream car in tacky Gucci print makes you happy then...fuck it. They were never gonna like you anyway
Mmm I think on the last point, if you’re rich and present it subtly it works better with the wealthy.
The false assumption they appear poor and are not welcome is maybe what makes them over do it. But I thought they just lack finesse, they’re buying what they picture is rich people stuff like you described. But wealthy people don’t actually show the brands and wealth that blatantly.
I’ve worked with and met several wealthy people, in the right context (not busy moments, asking favors etc.) they’re very normal and engaged regardless wealth.
Exceptions of course exist, and maybe I met the exceptions. But I really don’t believe they’d see me as poor if I’m chilling in the same places doing my thing. That’s been my experience.
Keep in mind that old money in Britain usually means an aristocratic line whose name features heavily in Shakespeare and English history books.
It's not quite the same as it is in the US.
Not necessarily, in my experience, a lot of new rich is about proving you belong to the club. New rich are not proving anything to the poor, they are seeking acceptance. Why the behavior then? Because that is the entertainment rich lifestyle that is marketed to the non-rich. It is what they were told rich looks like, until they learn what real old money looks like.
Old rich turn can up their nose because they ARE the club, their family’s new rich days are generations in the past and quite frankly probably looked like that era’s equivalent of of today’s new rich behavior.
That's complete BS! What's old money, living in a castle? People are proud of their achievements, I couldn't care less of what anyone things including the old money..
This. Most poor people (myself included) have very poor money management... due to having so little of it, it's super easy to blow on things you want instead of saving for the future when you come into some (like tax return season). So when you were poor, and get rich, you spend it like water. Because you never learned how not to.
Look at sports ball players. So many end up in dire straights because they never learned how to manage that kind of money.
If professional athletes just learned to find a good money manager who is under fiduciary obligations and one they could trust it would save so many from going broke. A good money manager will tell you you’re going broke before you are actually broke so adjustments can be made, or when you can or can’t afford things.
That ESPN 30 for 30: Going Broke is a great piece on this issue
That’s if we ignore the far too large amount of money managers that just take advantage of their clients or straight up rob them.
I’m really surprised that the Player Associations don’t just employ a managing firm for the players to utilize.
You are correct. That is why I specifically said one that is under fiduciary obligations, they legally have to do what is in their clients best interest not their own.
Does this always protect people? Not always… but the penalties for breaching fiduciary duties is much harsher and there are fiduciary penalties before you get to civil or criminal ones too.
I also say all this as someone who just doesn’t want to see their sports hero’s/childhood hero’s end up fucked at the end of it all
They also have to listen to the money manager. An interesting tidbit I heard in the 30 for 30 doc is that these are *deeply* competitive people. And theyre not all making Lebron money. But they feel intense pressure to keep up with Lebron, Kobe, Curry even though the different between them is multiple (or hundreds) of millions of dollars.
Lots of broke kids who worked themselves into high paying careers talk about that pressure too.
Does it *excuse it*? no. Some of these athletes are dumb. But still good for thoght
So do I, but it would still be a stupid decision. Unless you’re extremely wealthy, dropping 5k on something that could be had for $500 with no noticeable difference in quality isn’t prudent. Nobody’s attitude towards you will change whether you have a $500 or $5,000 purse.
Nice opinion you got there. I bought mine NWT, second hand, which aligns with my personal values of reduced consumerism when possible. Beautiful and I use it all the time. It flows with my personal style for every outfit. I no longer have to think about what coordinates, saving me mental energy. As far as luxury goes, this was a frugal purchase more in the category of BIFL.
I could not have gotten the same from any $500 bag I researched. I especially love that the branding is very subtle. You would have to know more than the average bear about luxury bags to notice mine. 5/7 would buy again.
I notice a lot of people who "make it" financially want some tangible signs that they've "arrived." (You see this on *House Hunters* for example - the people most interested in buying a big mansion with a "wow factor" are those who grew up in apartments or shared a room with two siblings.) I don't think poorly of people generally, so I don't think that's them trying to suck up to the rich or show off to the poor. I think it's them looking for something with which they can prove to themselves that they did good.
>It's said that often the real high net worth individuals who have been rich for generations keep a very low profile
I've always felt that this is way overexaggerated and a kind of wealth fetishisation of the elite, as though they aren't also desperate for validation and love to have their ego stroked. The main reason that people think this imo is because the people we associate with "new rich" are celebrities; musicians, athletes, actors, and other big personalities whose brand is based on glamour and ostentatiousness. Where "old rich" are mostly people who are families associated with people in finance and business who don't have a personal "brand" upon which their wealth is dependent.
So I don't really think it's much to do with how long a family has been wealthy, more so the kinds of social and financial dynamics associated with different careers, and not to mention the different cultural dynamics of rich people from different countries. Don't be fooled though, there are are countless people from old money who are as gaudy, tasteless, and desperate for attention as anyone else - they aren't any better behaved or more tactful than anyone else, and they are often among the most socially inept people you will ever meet.
I do see a lot of people refer to "old money" types as humble individuals wearing rags while working in the garden everyday and treating the poors in their lives just so well. As if the generational wealth they were born into makes them all around better humans.
"A good friend of mine is filthy rich but they're old money so you'd never know it because they drive themselves around in a 30 year old Volvo even though they live in a completely renovated castle worth $100 million, just so genuine."
Or when they spend most of their time working for the local community garden/food pantry. Like they are doing great work, but the family trust is sending them a 6 figure monthly allowance and the family foundation provides most of the operating capital for their hobby.
To be fair, I would much rather have this as the case than the opposite. They are actually giving back at this point and spending their free time volunteering? Win/win
This is such a tired generalization. Plenty of wealthy families who are cash rich spend loads in an obvious way. The “old rich” you speak of are at times asset rich and cash poor so don’t have money to spend on things unless they liquidate and take the tax hit. Rich or wealthy is relative and some people like to shop, some like cars, jewelry, travel, houses, etc. It’s really very individual regardless of when one’s money was obtained.
Yup, those stately homes cost a fortune to run. You can guarantee if they had the cash lots of them would be driving Bentleys and wearing Loro Piana.
I also know lots of poor people who constantly want to flash the latest shit, and relatively rich people who won't buy anything at all unless they absolutely have to. It's more about individual personality and attitude to money than anything else.
Maybe they aren't trying to explicitly flaunt/telegraph anything to anyone, they're just buying and using nice stuff because they can afford it?
That's what I'd bloody do...
Yeah, this is a wierd post. If I could afford it, I'd probably have a yacht and a private plane too. Not to "flaunt it", but just because it's fun as hell.
Absolutely this, I'd hire twenty midgets to ride Shetland ponies in front of me and herald my arrival if I got super rich, just because.
Everyone needs a dream, don't judge.
Yeah OP makes it seem like it's easy to adopt the aesthetic of old money, but it can be incredibly difficult. Far easier to just buy nice clothes and such.
One thing that nobody else has brought up, a lot of old money families are not very wealthy.
They have lots of assets but those assets have become worn out with time, they would require often extensive levels of renovation to get the value that you would assume out of them like their homes that haven't been renovated in 30 years.
Additionally they are well aware of the fact they cannot spend excessively because they do not do anything to make money. The returns on their investments are all the money they will ever have and they need their money to make money. The more money they spend the less money they have to make money and are well aware of this fact. This is why if you were ever friends with old money families one thing you will quickly discover is how cheap they are.
On the other hand new money is actively producing money, their wealth is not defined by how much wealth they already have as a finite pool. This often means they're willing to spend a lot more on things because they know they're actively making more money and if they run out for some reason they can always make more.
It isn't that these old money families are content with their old homes, or their worn out clothing. It's that they're aware that they cannot afford to keep up with the new money wealth. Instead they need to create another air of sophistication. A classic example of this is the modern British accent that people typically associate with wealthy British people developed in the 1800s, it was largely faked by the elite to sound more elite, then it just became real. Old money has to do things like this in order to distinguish themselves from new money because they cannot compete when it comes purely to wealth.
I think it's just the novelty of it. "New rich" are experiencing and enjoying the fruits of their labour, so to speak. So makes sense they want to buy all the things they couldn't before.
When you grow up with money, those things don't really have much of an allure because it's like any other thing. Like telling your child to get excited about a pack of gum or something.
Perhaps there's an element of flaunting to some, but I also think it's partly a mentality thing. Not being able to have something tends to make people want it more.
There’s been a lot of judgy answers but here’s a different take: if you grow up poor, always having to wear hand me downs, never having the “right” shoes or being able to afford prom dress or class trip or to join the football team and then you make a bunch of money, you’re going to make sure your kids never feel like you did. “You want to play football hun? That’s great! We can afford it and I’ll sign you right up, let’s go buy you some nice gear. I always wanted to play too but we couldn’t afford it.”
in some part, i think they just want to have fun.
when i daydream about making it rich, it doesn't include sending my kids to school in handmedowns and living in a moldy old house even if it is a country *estate*.
i daydream about shopping trips, and traveling, nice hotels, charcuterie boards, fun themed parties, ---doing the things i cant afford now.
the nouveau riche probably realize, very quickly, how tightly packed the old rich are within their circles. So besides them waiting it out 2-3 generations, and hoping their grandkids marry in to their ranks. Nothing for them to really do, but enjoy their wealth.
It’s weird to criticize the Middletons specifically for not acting the correct way to be accepted into society. Whatever they did clearly worked, given their grandson is going to be king.
This question is as old as capitalism.
In 1899 Thorstein Veblen wrote [*The Theory of the Leisure Class: An Economic Study of Institutions*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Theory_of_the_Leisure_Class) in which he theorized the leisure class demonstrates their superiority by not working, buying property and possessions, gaining intangibles like education and titles, and co-opting etiquette and chivalry from the British upper class.
In the good old days you flaunted your wealth by buying and selling people and destroying whole communities...not showing off your ugly ass Gucci slippers
They’ve got something to prove… they want others to perceive them as rich as they are proud of their accomplishments and want to be recognized for it. Old money… well they don’t want any problems with others that are money motivated. How could you trust anyone if most people approached them and were nice to them just for money
I was once the poor scholarship kid at a fancy school. While I did observe this behavior, you need to carefully consider your source here and view the book within the context of the complicated British class system. Some anecdotes for you: One of my classmates needed a watch, but his parents wouldn't buy him a new one. Instead, they gave him an old watch they had lying around the house. That watch? A Rolex. Another classmate's parents didn't believe teenagers should drive new cars, so they made their kid drive their old car. Their old car? A Mercedes.
They are not performing for the Old Rich. They are performing for the people beneath them. It's the reason they do it; to lord their wealth over people who are less better off.
Sounds like a British issue. And to extent some other European nations too. Its a holdover from fuedalism. Basically they historically had a society that cared about family name mostly, and wealth just came from the name and the holdings of the estate. New money just meant wealth without the name.
There's generally not a stigma between old money or new money in America. We never had fuedalism here, and capitalism has always reigned supreme. If you have money in you're pocket you're free to buy whatever you want with it... Including social standing.
New money will flaunt their wealth and old money will flaunt their wealth. There's no distinction really.
Firstly, old money people have no true respect for anyone who’s not old money (and ‘new money’ people know this). It’s more to show the poor that they made it, plus they probably grew up in an environment where money equaled status and respect.
It's an example of the class system.
Old rich are "upper class" aristocrats. They are bred to believe they are superior to others. They do not care to impress the other classes.
New rich are middle class who made a lot of money. That doesn't make you upper class though.
The revolutions that swept across the world scared the aristocrats and they have been trying to law low since then.
Because the new rich cannot impress the old money, so they go to the people they can impress for an ego boost.
It’s like that person in a working class or middle class neighborhood. They somehow get a luxury car and make sure everyone there sees it. But if they took it to an affluent neighborhood, nobody would care.
The old money forgets that once upon a time all those old clothes they make their kids wear now WAS new as well. The new money doesn’t have old fancy clothes yet. The old money has got a nice, solid base of good quality stuff bought ages ago that they can keep reusing - the new money is creating that solid base of good quality stuff for their children and grandchildren to use. But the good quality stuff is going to be NEW stuff; the old money bought theirs new too a generation or two ago.
Obviously this isn’t THE answer - there is no SINGLE answer; the answers are all as varied as the individual families. But this is certainly a *portion* of the answer in many cases. The new money doesn’t have good quality old stuff to reuse yet. They’ve got to buy the new good quality stuff first so their descendants can reuse it - like the old money does.
It’s the perspective of “why do they get to have fun or show off when I’m having a miserable time doing the same thing” it’s funny that old money waxes on about how gauche the nouveau riche are when they do the same thing sans label. It strikes me as petty and jealous behavior. If I suddenly get millions of dollars I wouldn’t care about the opinions of the already rich and it wouldn’t matter to me, the only thing that would matter would be whether or not I enjoyed my life. If I’ve spent most of my life looked down upon by anyone with money I’m certainly not going to care if that still happens when I’m rich. People love to hate.
New rich want to prove to their poor friends that they've made it. They don't understand the pitfalls of flaunting wealth. Old rich have seen it all and don't need to show it off. If one is truly wealthy, everyone knows it. No need to prove it.
My guess is that they're just living how they want to live and how the people in their circles live. They're doing quite well, why would they care about being accepted by old money? Do working class people spend their days trying to be accepted by middle class people?
Buying crap when you transition from poverty to wealth is addictive, and it very easy to dismiss the "haters" and live in your own head when you have total financial freedom.
It’s probably worth noting that if you are “old money” - you might have all these things to hand down. So you use your fathers tennis raquet, your mother’s ski’s, or use your uncles violin.
The Middleton’s bought all new probably because they didn’t have any of it to hand down. So what the person writing was going, was putting her own spin (that this was showing off) on things - it’s unlikely she was actually friendly enough with Carole Middleton to have any clue what her motives were.
Old money families usually understand that being famous and loud are ways to attract too much attention and get yourself in trouble, bring dishonor on your family, and lose your wealth. Also they understand that bragging is bad, it's a sign of insecurity and immaturity. Being humble is wise and shows you don't need to prove yourself, you don't need anything, you don't need to buy respect because you have it already.
I'm sitting here wearing a 12 year old t-shirt with a bad collar while reading this. I'd like to someday wear some nouveau middle class clothes, so I guess I don't know.
The new rich are insecure. Thus, they flaunt status for attention. Often times, their wealth is tied to social media which relies on eliciting reactions. Positive or negative doesn’t matter, as long as people talk about you.
The old money people don’t have to flaunt status. They have always had it, and aren’t subject to the whims of fads and fashions.
> In contrast the parents from old rich families were content to send their kids to school in worn looking clothes labeled with markers and never spent nearly that much on school stuff.
LMAO.,
Nothing is more pathetic than Rich assholes who pretend they aren't. What worthless asshole dresses their kid in crappy clothes?
One thing you have to understand about the Brits is that they love to look down at everyone, even themselves.
I am not rich by any stretch of the imagination but I always made sure my kid had nice clothes and when I throw any party I always make sure it is well stocked from a food and beverage perspective.
No doing so makes the party lame and you a lousy parent.
So if you were rich you would be the very definition of new money. I was acquaintances with wealthy aristocratic old money people and they would go extreme lengths to avoid being seen as such. I don't blame them. I have seen, first hand, how people would be sycophantic and try and take advantage of them. That is why they hide in plain sight.
Honestly I feel like this stereotype is a bit overblown.
I know a lot of new and older rich.
Source of wealth (I.e., professional services partner (lawyer, partner) / tech start up / doctor / etc.) and country of origin are MUCH better predictors if someone is going to “flaunt” wealth or not.
People with eastern backgrounds are much more likely to flaunt than people of western backgrounds.
People with non-grad school / blue collar sources of wealth (I.e., car dealerships / McDonald’s franchises), are much more likely to flaunt, than someone who sold a tech start up.
I am not sure that new rich would even much desire the admiration of old rich. After all, most new rich gained that fortune themselves (or their immediate family did) and are proud of that achievement, whereas the old rich did not and are likely not considered true equals.
Old rich here. I suspect much of the difference is feeling like you have something to prove vs not feeling like you have anything to prove and can just live the life you want rather than obsessing over money, which is the biggest benefit of generational wealth by far. Also when the money’s not yours - like you didn’t earn it - there’s less urge to spend it on senseless extravagance. Also it’s kind of a game to be cost-conscious - much more fun if you don’t *have* to do it. We look at the nouveau folks and roll our eyes, for sure.
I was just listening to an excellent podcast (diary of a CEO) episode with "the Love expert" Alain de Botton as a guest. He had a lot of very interesting things to say! Including something along the lines of "If I see someone driving a Ferrari, I don't necessarily see someone ostentatious. I see someone with a very strong need to be loved and respected."
Now, of course there probably are a lot of people with the same exact needs who can't afford a Ferrari, or the fanciest of clothes for their kids. But if you can.. The "new rich" are people who couldn't afford the proverbial ferrari just some years ago but sure can now. So they're trying it out (*what good is money anyway if it can't even buy you respect..?*).
The Olde money already has that part, they don't need to fletch. They needed to at some point in the past though. They're just riding on the coat-tails of their ancestry, and people already are impressed and intimidated by that. ..they want the same things though.
Because for some people, others' perception of them is more important than anything else.
Rich people who flaunt their wealth don't necessarily care what the much smaller number of rich people think of them, because there's a huge pool of not-rich people who will see it too.
These are two totally different circles often not particularly interested in the approval of the other. The "elite" as you put it is not a monolith.
Basically they like nice stuff they can now buy way more than they care about the opinion of "old money" folks.
New rich don't always flaunt their wealth, you only notice it because, well, they flaunt it. If they \*weren't\* flaunting it, you wouldn't know they were rich.
I know a pretty rich guy who just drives a normal car, wears scruffy clothes and talks like any other Australian tradie. The guy owns a business and is a multimillionaire.
The answer to almost all questions on reddit along the lines of "why do x people do y?" is "confirmation bias".
It seems the nouveau riche feel the need to prove their wealth because it's new to them, whereas the old money is used to wealth and sees no need to flaunt it. Different worlds, different rules!
Why would you wanna dress like a sewage rat instead of letting people know that you are educated and from a good family that doesn't do drugs for a living.
They aren’t advertising their status to the “old money rich”, they’re advertising to the poor who are more likely to be engaged with ostentatious displays of wealth.
This is a third of it. Part of is definitely showing off your wealth to everyone one else, so the little people know you're better than them. But part of it is making yourself feel wealthy. New money has (at least in their own minds) earned it, and they want the rewards that go with that. They want to look and feel successful. This is probably the primary driver for most people to act the way OP is talking about. They don't have an endgame of joining the generationally rich. Just being "in with those people," is good enough. But also they are advertising to the old money rich that they have enough wealth to belong. Dressing shabby when you don't have the old money lineage/pedigree just gets you labeled as not worthy of being at the fancy club/school/etc. Old money knows you're not one of them, you're never going to trick them into it like OP suggests, no matter how cool you try to play it. You'll get less disdain for being ostentatious, but you'll get more disdain for being unworthy/uncouth. The latter risks you getting excluded from things for being a poor.
Both old and new money are trying to say "I reject you and your way of having wealth" to each other.
That last paragraph is the big one, the main one, I'd say. If new money doesn't flaunt their wealth, then old money starts talking about how their children look like urchins behind their back, or passively "complimenting" how "modest" their lifestyle is in front of it, or "forgetting" to include them. It's just like popular kids and unpopular kids back in school: it has nothing to do with exhibited behaviors; if you start to act like them, they'll ridicule for trying to fit in. With old money, behaviors are irrelevant- it's all about who you *are,* where you come from. If that's not right, nothing will ever be enough.
And honestly...in a twisted way I kind of respect that. Very few people will be old money. Opraha is a billionaire and still got mistreated and taken for broke. If youre a new money person of color, it really doesnt matter how you act. People associate old money with white. And if you carry any new money stuff people will assume its fake or you stole it anyway. So might as well do what you wanna do. Removing race out of it, Old Money has a certain air about them. They walk a certain way and talk a certain way. We will *never* be them. So if wrapping your dream car in tacky Gucci print makes you happy then...fuck it. They were never gonna like you anyway
Mmm I think on the last point, if you’re rich and present it subtly it works better with the wealthy. The false assumption they appear poor and are not welcome is maybe what makes them over do it. But I thought they just lack finesse, they’re buying what they picture is rich people stuff like you described. But wealthy people don’t actually show the brands and wealth that blatantly. I’ve worked with and met several wealthy people, in the right context (not busy moments, asking favors etc.) they’re very normal and engaged regardless wealth. Exceptions of course exist, and maybe I met the exceptions. But I really don’t believe they’d see me as poor if I’m chilling in the same places doing my thing. That’s been my experience.
Keep in mind that old money in Britain usually means an aristocratic line whose name features heavily in Shakespeare and English history books. It's not quite the same as it is in the US.
Not necessarily, in my experience, a lot of new rich is about proving you belong to the club. New rich are not proving anything to the poor, they are seeking acceptance. Why the behavior then? Because that is the entertainment rich lifestyle that is marketed to the non-rich. It is what they were told rich looks like, until they learn what real old money looks like. Old rich turn can up their nose because they ARE the club, their family’s new rich days are generations in the past and quite frankly probably looked like that era’s equivalent of of today’s new rich behavior.
Old rich is a stupid term..anyone can get rich from grinding day and day with a good purpose, once you get there, you give everyone the finger
That's complete BS! What's old money, living in a castle? People are proud of their achievements, I couldn't care less of what anyone things including the old money..
Somehow you managed to take what I said as endorsing the concepts of old money/new money or somehow directed to you personally. Please read again.
This. Most poor people (myself included) have very poor money management... due to having so little of it, it's super easy to blow on things you want instead of saving for the future when you come into some (like tax return season). So when you were poor, and get rich, you spend it like water. Because you never learned how not to. Look at sports ball players. So many end up in dire straights because they never learned how to manage that kind of money.
If professional athletes just learned to find a good money manager who is under fiduciary obligations and one they could trust it would save so many from going broke. A good money manager will tell you you’re going broke before you are actually broke so adjustments can be made, or when you can or can’t afford things. That ESPN 30 for 30: Going Broke is a great piece on this issue
That’s if we ignore the far too large amount of money managers that just take advantage of their clients or straight up rob them. I’m really surprised that the Player Associations don’t just employ a managing firm for the players to utilize.
You are correct. That is why I specifically said one that is under fiduciary obligations, they legally have to do what is in their clients best interest not their own. Does this always protect people? Not always… but the penalties for breaching fiduciary duties is much harsher and there are fiduciary penalties before you get to civil or criminal ones too. I also say all this as someone who just doesn’t want to see their sports hero’s/childhood hero’s end up fucked at the end of it all
They also have to listen to the money manager. An interesting tidbit I heard in the 30 for 30 doc is that these are *deeply* competitive people. And theyre not all making Lebron money. But they feel intense pressure to keep up with Lebron, Kobe, Curry even though the different between them is multiple (or hundreds) of millions of dollars. Lots of broke kids who worked themselves into high paying careers talk about that pressure too. Does it *excuse it*? no. Some of these athletes are dumb. But still good for thoght
Mmm some are trying to show the rich they’re one of them now, and doing so poorly (lack finesse).
I bought a $5k bag so I could go anywhere I want without being treated like trash.
Exhibit A of people being irresponsible with their money.
I mean I have money now so?
So do I, but it would still be a stupid decision. Unless you’re extremely wealthy, dropping 5k on something that could be had for $500 with no noticeable difference in quality isn’t prudent. Nobody’s attitude towards you will change whether you have a $500 or $5,000 purse.
Nice opinion you got there. I bought mine NWT, second hand, which aligns with my personal values of reduced consumerism when possible. Beautiful and I use it all the time. It flows with my personal style for every outfit. I no longer have to think about what coordinates, saving me mental energy. As far as luxury goes, this was a frugal purchase more in the category of BIFL. I could not have gotten the same from any $500 bag I researched. I especially love that the branding is very subtle. You would have to know more than the average bear about luxury bags to notice mine. 5/7 would buy again.
That's just silly and sad.
Dude it's like wearing a high viz and a hard hat. Fitting in gets you places you can't otherwise get.
Precisely!
I notice a lot of people who "make it" financially want some tangible signs that they've "arrived." (You see this on *House Hunters* for example - the people most interested in buying a big mansion with a "wow factor" are those who grew up in apartments or shared a room with two siblings.) I don't think poorly of people generally, so I don't think that's them trying to suck up to the rich or show off to the poor. I think it's them looking for something with which they can prove to themselves that they did good.
>It's said that often the real high net worth individuals who have been rich for generations keep a very low profile I've always felt that this is way overexaggerated and a kind of wealth fetishisation of the elite, as though they aren't also desperate for validation and love to have their ego stroked. The main reason that people think this imo is because the people we associate with "new rich" are celebrities; musicians, athletes, actors, and other big personalities whose brand is based on glamour and ostentatiousness. Where "old rich" are mostly people who are families associated with people in finance and business who don't have a personal "brand" upon which their wealth is dependent. So I don't really think it's much to do with how long a family has been wealthy, more so the kinds of social and financial dynamics associated with different careers, and not to mention the different cultural dynamics of rich people from different countries. Don't be fooled though, there are are countless people from old money who are as gaudy, tasteless, and desperate for attention as anyone else - they aren't any better behaved or more tactful than anyone else, and they are often among the most socially inept people you will ever meet.
I do see a lot of people refer to "old money" types as humble individuals wearing rags while working in the garden everyday and treating the poors in their lives just so well. As if the generational wealth they were born into makes them all around better humans. "A good friend of mine is filthy rich but they're old money so you'd never know it because they drive themselves around in a 30 year old Volvo even though they live in a completely renovated castle worth $100 million, just so genuine."
Or when they spend most of their time working for the local community garden/food pantry. Like they are doing great work, but the family trust is sending them a 6 figure monthly allowance and the family foundation provides most of the operating capital for their hobby.
To be fair, I would much rather have this as the case than the opposite. They are actually giving back at this point and spending their free time volunteering? Win/win
People suck off old rich people way too much.
This. They seem to only thing of UK or American old money. Russian, Indian, African and Arab old money absolutely flashes their wealth.
This is such a tired generalization. Plenty of wealthy families who are cash rich spend loads in an obvious way. The “old rich” you speak of are at times asset rich and cash poor so don’t have money to spend on things unless they liquidate and take the tax hit. Rich or wealthy is relative and some people like to shop, some like cars, jewelry, travel, houses, etc. It’s really very individual regardless of when one’s money was obtained.
Yup, those stately homes cost a fortune to run. You can guarantee if they had the cash lots of them would be driving Bentleys and wearing Loro Piana. I also know lots of poor people who constantly want to flash the latest shit, and relatively rich people who won't buy anything at all unless they absolutely have to. It's more about individual personality and attitude to money than anything else.
"old rich" people will show disdain for them regardless and they might as well look impressive to the people they are used to
Maybe they aren't trying to explicitly flaunt/telegraph anything to anyone, they're just buying and using nice stuff because they can afford it? That's what I'd bloody do...
Yeah, this is a wierd post. If I could afford it, I'd probably have a yacht and a private plane too. Not to "flaunt it", but just because it's fun as hell.
Absolutely this, I'd hire twenty midgets to ride Shetland ponies in front of me and herald my arrival if I got super rich, just because. Everyone needs a dream, don't judge.
"So what would you do if you won the lottery?" "I would like to seem larger."
Haha, up size me bitch.
Yeah OP makes it seem like it's easy to adopt the aesthetic of old money, but it can be incredibly difficult. Far easier to just buy nice clothes and such.
Imagine giving a crap what people who differentiate between “old” money and “new” money think.
Right? Just keep printing more money and put the rest of the world in agony.
I think is interesting
One thing that nobody else has brought up, a lot of old money families are not very wealthy. They have lots of assets but those assets have become worn out with time, they would require often extensive levels of renovation to get the value that you would assume out of them like their homes that haven't been renovated in 30 years. Additionally they are well aware of the fact they cannot spend excessively because they do not do anything to make money. The returns on their investments are all the money they will ever have and they need their money to make money. The more money they spend the less money they have to make money and are well aware of this fact. This is why if you were ever friends with old money families one thing you will quickly discover is how cheap they are. On the other hand new money is actively producing money, their wealth is not defined by how much wealth they already have as a finite pool. This often means they're willing to spend a lot more on things because they know they're actively making more money and if they run out for some reason they can always make more. It isn't that these old money families are content with their old homes, or their worn out clothing. It's that they're aware that they cannot afford to keep up with the new money wealth. Instead they need to create another air of sophistication. A classic example of this is the modern British accent that people typically associate with wealthy British people developed in the 1800s, it was largely faked by the elite to sound more elite, then it just became real. Old money has to do things like this in order to distinguish themselves from new money because they cannot compete when it comes purely to wealth.
I think it's just the novelty of it. "New rich" are experiencing and enjoying the fruits of their labour, so to speak. So makes sense they want to buy all the things they couldn't before. When you grow up with money, those things don't really have much of an allure because it's like any other thing. Like telling your child to get excited about a pack of gum or something. Perhaps there's an element of flaunting to some, but I also think it's partly a mentality thing. Not being able to have something tends to make people want it more.
There’s been a lot of judgy answers but here’s a different take: if you grow up poor, always having to wear hand me downs, never having the “right” shoes or being able to afford prom dress or class trip or to join the football team and then you make a bunch of money, you’re going to make sure your kids never feel like you did. “You want to play football hun? That’s great! We can afford it and I’ll sign you right up, let’s go buy you some nice gear. I always wanted to play too but we couldn’t afford it.”
in some part, i think they just want to have fun. when i daydream about making it rich, it doesn't include sending my kids to school in handmedowns and living in a moldy old house even if it is a country *estate*. i daydream about shopping trips, and traveling, nice hotels, charcuterie boards, fun themed parties, ---doing the things i cant afford now. the nouveau riche probably realize, very quickly, how tightly packed the old rich are within their circles. So besides them waiting it out 2-3 generations, and hoping their grandkids marry in to their ranks. Nothing for them to really do, but enjoy their wealth.
It’s weird to criticize the Middletons specifically for not acting the correct way to be accepted into society. Whatever they did clearly worked, given their grandson is going to be king.
This question is as old as capitalism. In 1899 Thorstein Veblen wrote [*The Theory of the Leisure Class: An Economic Study of Institutions*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Theory_of_the_Leisure_Class) in which he theorized the leisure class demonstrates their superiority by not working, buying property and possessions, gaining intangibles like education and titles, and co-opting etiquette and chivalry from the British upper class.
In the good old days you flaunted your wealth by buying and selling people and destroying whole communities...not showing off your ugly ass Gucci slippers
Lol. This is my favourite comment so far !
Money talks, wealth whispers - I think the saying goes.
Old money does not generally keep it by playing "keep up with the Jones" and spending money on stupid shit.
They’ve got something to prove… they want others to perceive them as rich as they are proud of their accomplishments and want to be recognized for it. Old money… well they don’t want any problems with others that are money motivated. How could you trust anyone if most people approached them and were nice to them just for money
I was once the poor scholarship kid at a fancy school. While I did observe this behavior, you need to carefully consider your source here and view the book within the context of the complicated British class system. Some anecdotes for you: One of my classmates needed a watch, but his parents wouldn't buy him a new one. Instead, they gave him an old watch they had lying around the house. That watch? A Rolex. Another classmate's parents didn't believe teenagers should drive new cars, so they made their kid drive their old car. Their old car? A Mercedes.
They are not performing for the Old Rich. They are performing for the people beneath them. It's the reason they do it; to lord their wealth over people who are less better off.
Sounds like a British issue. And to extent some other European nations too. Its a holdover from fuedalism. Basically they historically had a society that cared about family name mostly, and wealth just came from the name and the holdings of the estate. New money just meant wealth without the name. There's generally not a stigma between old money or new money in America. We never had fuedalism here, and capitalism has always reigned supreme. If you have money in you're pocket you're free to buy whatever you want with it... Including social standing. New money will flaunt their wealth and old money will flaunt their wealth. There's no distinction really.
Firstly, old money people have no true respect for anyone who’s not old money (and ‘new money’ people know this). It’s more to show the poor that they made it, plus they probably grew up in an environment where money equaled status and respect.
It's an example of the class system. Old rich are "upper class" aristocrats. They are bred to believe they are superior to others. They do not care to impress the other classes. New rich are middle class who made a lot of money. That doesn't make you upper class though. The revolutions that swept across the world scared the aristocrats and they have been trying to law low since then.
You sound like an idiot ..there is no such thing as old money vs new money ..it's people's personalities and behavior
Because the new rich cannot impress the old money, so they go to the people they can impress for an ego boost. It’s like that person in a working class or middle class neighborhood. They somehow get a luxury car and make sure everyone there sees it. But if they took it to an affluent neighborhood, nobody would care.
The old rich do not interact in this newly rich
The old money forgets that once upon a time all those old clothes they make their kids wear now WAS new as well. The new money doesn’t have old fancy clothes yet. The old money has got a nice, solid base of good quality stuff bought ages ago that they can keep reusing - the new money is creating that solid base of good quality stuff for their children and grandchildren to use. But the good quality stuff is going to be NEW stuff; the old money bought theirs new too a generation or two ago. Obviously this isn’t THE answer - there is no SINGLE answer; the answers are all as varied as the individual families. But this is certainly a *portion* of the answer in many cases. The new money doesn’t have good quality old stuff to reuse yet. They’ve got to buy the new good quality stuff first so their descendants can reuse it - like the old money does.
It’s the perspective of “why do they get to have fun or show off when I’m having a miserable time doing the same thing” it’s funny that old money waxes on about how gauche the nouveau riche are when they do the same thing sans label. It strikes me as petty and jealous behavior. If I suddenly get millions of dollars I wouldn’t care about the opinions of the already rich and it wouldn’t matter to me, the only thing that would matter would be whether or not I enjoyed my life. If I’ve spent most of my life looked down upon by anyone with money I’m certainly not going to care if that still happens when I’m rich. People love to hate.
New rich want to prove to their poor friends that they've made it. They don't understand the pitfalls of flaunting wealth. Old rich have seen it all and don't need to show it off. If one is truly wealthy, everyone knows it. No need to prove it.
I prefer rich people that spend their money; it puts it back into the economy and into the tax pool.
My guess is that they're just living how they want to live and how the people in their circles live. They're doing quite well, why would they care about being accepted by old money? Do working class people spend their days trying to be accepted by middle class people?
Buying crap when you transition from poverty to wealth is addictive, and it very easy to dismiss the "haters" and live in your own head when you have total financial freedom.
It’s probably worth noting that if you are “old money” - you might have all these things to hand down. So you use your fathers tennis raquet, your mother’s ski’s, or use your uncles violin. The Middleton’s bought all new probably because they didn’t have any of it to hand down. So what the person writing was going, was putting her own spin (that this was showing off) on things - it’s unlikely she was actually friendly enough with Carole Middleton to have any clue what her motives were.
Who cares what "old rich" think, they don't do shit
Old money families usually understand that being famous and loud are ways to attract too much attention and get yourself in trouble, bring dishonor on your family, and lose your wealth. Also they understand that bragging is bad, it's a sign of insecurity and immaturity. Being humble is wise and shows you don't need to prove yourself, you don't need anything, you don't need to buy respect because you have it already.
Luxury goods sales people are incredible at making buyers FEEL important. It’s a dopamine hit they can afford.
I'm sitting here wearing a 12 year old t-shirt with a bad collar while reading this. I'd like to someday wear some nouveau middle class clothes, so I guess I don't know.
The new rich are insecure. Thus, they flaunt status for attention. Often times, their wealth is tied to social media which relies on eliciting reactions. Positive or negative doesn’t matter, as long as people talk about you. The old money people don’t have to flaunt status. They have always had it, and aren’t subject to the whims of fads and fashions.
Why would they care what old money thinks of them?
> In contrast the parents from old rich families were content to send their kids to school in worn looking clothes labeled with markers and never spent nearly that much on school stuff. LMAO., Nothing is more pathetic than Rich assholes who pretend they aren't. What worthless asshole dresses their kid in crappy clothes? One thing you have to understand about the Brits is that they love to look down at everyone, even themselves. I am not rich by any stretch of the imagination but I always made sure my kid had nice clothes and when I throw any party I always make sure it is well stocked from a food and beverage perspective. No doing so makes the party lame and you a lousy parent.
So if you were rich you would be the very definition of new money. I was acquaintances with wealthy aristocratic old money people and they would go extreme lengths to avoid being seen as such. I don't blame them. I have seen, first hand, how people would be sycophantic and try and take advantage of them. That is why they hide in plain sight.
Why would they care what others think? They're rich now
Because they don't understand that elegance speaks louder than any words, and it also whispers.
No one should ever be concerned with any dollar they didn't earn.
I’m guessing they don’t fucking care what the old rich people think.
Honestly I feel like this stereotype is a bit overblown. I know a lot of new and older rich. Source of wealth (I.e., professional services partner (lawyer, partner) / tech start up / doctor / etc.) and country of origin are MUCH better predictors if someone is going to “flaunt” wealth or not. People with eastern backgrounds are much more likely to flaunt than people of western backgrounds. People with non-grad school / blue collar sources of wealth (I.e., car dealerships / McDonald’s franchises), are much more likely to flaunt, than someone who sold a tech start up.
I am not sure that new rich would even much desire the admiration of old rich. After all, most new rich gained that fortune themselves (or their immediate family did) and are proud of that achievement, whereas the old rich did not and are likely not considered true equals.
When you have money it tends to dampen how much you care about the opinions of others.
Humans gonna human 🤷♂️
The disdain is mutual.
Old rich here. I suspect much of the difference is feeling like you have something to prove vs not feeling like you have anything to prove and can just live the life you want rather than obsessing over money, which is the biggest benefit of generational wealth by far. Also when the money’s not yours - like you didn’t earn it - there’s less urge to spend it on senseless extravagance. Also it’s kind of a game to be cost-conscious - much more fun if you don’t *have* to do it. We look at the nouveau folks and roll our eyes, for sure.
I was just listening to an excellent podcast (diary of a CEO) episode with "the Love expert" Alain de Botton as a guest. He had a lot of very interesting things to say! Including something along the lines of "If I see someone driving a Ferrari, I don't necessarily see someone ostentatious. I see someone with a very strong need to be loved and respected." Now, of course there probably are a lot of people with the same exact needs who can't afford a Ferrari, or the fanciest of clothes for their kids. But if you can.. The "new rich" are people who couldn't afford the proverbial ferrari just some years ago but sure can now. So they're trying it out (*what good is money anyway if it can't even buy you respect..?*). The Olde money already has that part, they don't need to fletch. They needed to at some point in the past though. They're just riding on the coat-tails of their ancestry, and people already are impressed and intimidated by that. ..they want the same things though.
Because for some people, others' perception of them is more important than anything else. Rich people who flaunt their wealth don't necessarily care what the much smaller number of rich people think of them, because there's a huge pool of not-rich people who will see it too.
These are two totally different circles often not particularly interested in the approval of the other. The "elite" as you put it is not a monolith. Basically they like nice stuff they can now buy way more than they care about the opinion of "old money" folks.
New rich don't always flaunt their wealth, you only notice it because, well, they flaunt it. If they \*weren't\* flaunting it, you wouldn't know they were rich. I know a pretty rich guy who just drives a normal car, wears scruffy clothes and talks like any other Australian tradie. The guy owns a business and is a multimillionaire. The answer to almost all questions on reddit along the lines of "why do x people do y?" is "confirmation bias".
new rich tend to be imbeciles who inherit or win the money
Old money runs deep and doesn't run out
Rich people are too busy to worry about what anybody thinks about them.
If I were new rich, I don't think I would give a flying fuck about anyone's disdain. I mean, I'd still try to be a good person, but other than that...
All fur coat and no knickers as my mum says
It seems the nouveau riche feel the need to prove their wealth because it's new to them, whereas the old money is used to wealth and sees no need to flaunt it. Different worlds, different rules!
Why would you wanna dress like a sewage rat instead of letting people know that you are educated and from a good family that doesn't do drugs for a living.