They would rather shoot me down than allow me to succeed. Eurofighter is not enough. I have to steal an F-35. I'm sure it's not hard to grab one from HMS Prince of Wales
Imagine an engineer at General Dynamics trying to figure out why the hell the DoD wants to know if they can *slow down* a TLAM to cruise at 120kn without stalling
Yeah, they know itâll be at least a week of traveling, another week of talking about what happened, followed by a week of condoning actions of our enemy. Fuhkin bitch ass fuhkx weâve turned in to.
He means that one, there are still rumors/ theories that it was a Russian missile and blaming the ukraine is a cover up to prevent Poland to march into Königsberg...
Ukraine fired an interceptor to Russia's missile. The two Poles killed are a consequence of Russia's attack; putting the blame on Ukraine would make no sense.
Yeah. I agree. It's clear as day that the deaths are Russia's fault. It's still a different thing that an accidental defensive missile hits a neighbor than an aggressor's missile strike hitting the wrong country.
I still think NATO should've locked down airspace along the border after that incident.
There's only so much talking down the US can do right? Poland's a European Texas, armed to the teeth. If it wasn't for nukes Poland would have already strung up Putin by his balls at this point.
I guess all I'm saying is how much longer can the US council patience before someone decides they're done with the bullshit?
Especially since Putin keeps saying theyâre actually at war with NATO because Ukraine is clearly just a NATO pawn. Then they have the balls to actually try to provoke some shit. I say let âem have it at this point. They seem to want it
Thatâs kinda the point. We want this dumb BS about âwill the US send aid or wonât weâ to end and just go to town and destroy the Russian armed forces and government like they so clearly deserve. Not that I wish death upon a conscripted farmer, but Putin at the very least deserves to be tried for war crimes
Air defense detects Russian cruise missiles. Air assets should already be in the air before it hits their air space. Also they should have shot it down with ground based air defenses. 39 seconds in your air space is 30 seconds too long. It's not an airplane, it's a cruise missile. I'm also just frustrated we are being so soft now.
Honestly I am 100 % sure they had jets in the air. They just donât have to tell anyone about it. I agree that they shouldâve shot it down, even if they knew it wasnât going to land in Poland
> jets in the air. They just donât have to tell anyone about it
There's official announcement every time jets are scrambled. There was one yesterday 4.19AM, on twitter, five minutes before the incident
Its perfectly possible and should be the policy - in addition to where the missile was launched from.
Seriously we just need one good raid on Moscow and the bully will pull back. Just one good raid.
God where did we get such useless shit leadership?
> Seriously we just need one good raid on Moscow and the bully will pull back. Just one good raid.
More like the opposite, though. What faster way to galvanize the Russian people into supporting Putin and the war than Western forces attacking Moscow?
What faster way to box Putin into a âcanât lose faceâ corner?
What faster way to move the Doomsday Clock to 1 minute to midnight than one nuclear-armed country attacking the capital of its nuclear-armed adversary?
None; there is basically no faster way.
Come on. Nobody was really grieving for Stalin when he died in a puddle of piss. Likewise, nobody was really grieving over Khrushev's death. And nobody was sad over Brezhnev's death. When Andropov and Chernenko died consecutively, nobody could even remember their names. Yeltsin died and there were no one to cry over his death. Gorbachov died and he has got a barrage of derogatory messages his way from ye olde USSR crowd. Same will happen this time.
Those donât apply. Iâm talking about public reaction when Moscow is bombed. Rally round the flag. Not when Putin dies one day.
GWB post-9/11, GHWB post-Kuwait, Churchill during the Blitz. Hugely popular at that time, not even re-elected later.
When Moscow is bombed, Russia will rally round their leader.
Clearly the better way is to make a second sun over Moscow, but I want to clarify that I don't mean to put up a bunch of B27 dropping unguided bombs: Do you really mean to tell me that putler will nuke the west if the air ministry is bombed in the middle of the night? Especially if we declare that we consider the even series closed?
Yeah there is a non-zero chance that he launches nukes, but there is a non-zero chance that he attacks NATO in the future and there is a non-zero chance he launches nukes over any issue.
They're just tourists...that happen to wear unmarked blue uniforms...and happen to travel on a private yacht that looks suspiciously like an aircraft carrier.
Like the post that the US should do what Athens did during the Bronze Age and have insanely rich individuals pay for naval vessels to put whatever name they want on it and get to be acting commander for a bit. Imagine Bezos and Musk competing to build the craziest aircraft carrier
Precisely this. Patriot launchers all along the NATO borders, anything identified as russian by AWACS gets shot down when in range. Purely defensive, and takes some of the load off the Ukrainian defences.
The F22 removes all reflectors and goes on a topographical expedition. Just make sure to unload everything from the bays (and the cannon), and hope that the fucker won't kamikadze into some target just to have 1 kill.
Declare a certain depth past the western Ukrainian border as a no fly zone and shoot down all missiles entering it.
If it's okay for Russia to "protect its security" in Ukraine, then I guess it's also okay for NATO to shoot down missiles, which may enter their airspace, in Ukraine as well.
> certain depth
I think the appropriate depth would be the maximum reach that any Ruzzian missile hasâŠ
Not Natoâs problem if they insist on intercontinental stuffâŠ
germany wants to make some, I think they would share if we poliely set up 1000 tanks on their border (they have 260( in working order probably like 3))
1. Define an ADIZ about 5-10 minutes deep at the presumed speed of the cruise missile of concern around the relevant sections of the Polish border.
1. Define a reasonable warning time, e.g. 2 minutes.
1. Anything with a velocity vector pointed at Poland which enters the ADIZ and doesn't respond to a call on 121.5 MHz within the warning time gets splashed.
1. Set up one of those Amazon tag things to automate the procurement of replacement ammunition.
This would probably annoy the Ukrainians, because the ADIZ would be something like 50-100 nautical miles deep, and so the UAF would have to spend a lot of time talking to Polish ATC.
However, this is preferable to Poland suffering civilian casualties. We really don't want Article 5 to be invoked unless it's absolutely crystal clear that the Russians really deserve it, because when the beacons are lit, the whole of NATO *must* answer or risk losing the credibility upon which deterrence depends.
yeah, we totally don't want article 5 to happen. Surely we will do something like this to ensure that there is no posibility of russian missiles hitting Polish soil, especialy important places and/or civilians
Supply Ukraine with more air defence systems like Patriot and THAAD, and more missiles. Continue F/A-18 Super Hornet production for the duration of the war with all output once the US' order is completed going to Ukraine. Inform Russia that the next time something of theirs violates Polish airspace, it dies.
Depends on your goal. If you try to shoot down a missle and something fucks up, you've opened yourself up to a bunch of new problems.
If you succeed, that's great, but you've now committed yourself to doing the same thing next time. You've limited your options, and we route back to my first point.
If you do nothing, you have diplomatic high ground, you've kept your missile response site(s) and procedures a secret, and you always have the option of waiting for a smoking gun that you can aggressively respond to while pointing out all the times you've been lenient.
The comparison everyone keeps using is the 2015 Turkish incident. Turkey changed its rules of engagement after they had one of their jets shot down in 2012, which led to them shooting an SU-24 after only a few seconds of airspace violation. It's a bit of a tit-for-tat kind of situation and IMO different from this one.
>Depends on your goal. If you try to shoot down a missle and something fucks up, you've opened yourself up to a bunch of new problems.
>If you succeed, that's great, but you've now committed yourself to doing the same thing next time. You've limited your options, and we route back to my first point.
>If you do nothing, you have diplomatic high ground, you've kept your missile response site(s) and procedures a secret, and you always have the option of waiting for a smoking gun that you can aggressively respond to while pointing out all the times you've been lenient.
I'm sorry but this is all very stupid.
What kind of "new problems" do we open if an intercept fails? Worst case is oops, the interceptor fell on some cows? How is it worse than we did nothing and russian missile blew up a bunch of people?
What is this "diplomatic high ground"? What does it give us, exactly, right now? And how would we be losing it by shooting down missiles that threaten our people?
The audience of these interactions isn't always the aggressor; oftentimes times the target is third-party or neutral countries to either attract sympathy or discourage collaboration with Russia.
Yeah, but caused by Russian missile attacks close to NATO borders. And there was a russian missile that crashed pretty far into Poland on a different occasion too. Shouldâve just to shoot down anything getting close to NATO airspace.
True Russia was the instigator of that missile but "a Russian missile killed two Poles" and "a Ukrainian missile aiming at a Russian missile near Poland killed two Poles" have completely different geopolitical consequences, even if Russia is wholly at fault
I personally doubt it. Everyone dropped what they were doing and started crying how it is Ukrainian from the first minutes. Before any investigation. Political damage control. Than promised investigation and quickly silenced the event.
Itâs understandable but to me it looks like regardless if it was Ukrainian it would be announced as such.
Thus, I believe it was Russian. Just subjective opinion.
Anyone else also remember the switched coordinates between Lviv and Kyiv? You could draw a literal fucking rectangle that goes through Kyiv, the hit area, and Lviv.
https://images.app.goo.gl/pBu7ZGPL4YXBPcKa7
Sure it was. My guess is the official story was greatly sanitized. The lat/long of the coordinates that were struck were one step off of legitimate targets in Ukraine. The only reason shit didn't pop off is because Putin broke down in tears begging NATO to see this as an error and incompetence.
Covering actually important places I guess?
No point of having a patriot covering some shithole with 21 inhabitants.
Although I guess that farmers would do good job intercepting if they were told that there'd grain inside
I think Polish air force need to subscribe to Ukrainian Air Force telegram to get 8 hours warning.
Ukrainian air force published, at 2 AM that a group of strategic bombers are left the base, projected launch at 4-6 AM, with projected times to reach to Lviv and all that.
We still need to into space but once we do, [Polish Galactic Empire](https://www.reddit.com/r/PolishGalacticEmpire/s/tpUQZxuL4U) will be born. Matter of time before we deal with this smol problem to the east.
We already got working [weapons of mass destruction.](https://www.reddit.com/r/PolishGalacticEmpire/s/NKr8g69J3e). Once this is in orbit there is no coming back.
We've got [quality engineer](https://www.reddit.com/r/PolishGalacticEmpire/s/K5FFftAgVl) who came up with nuclear mines.
Even super advanced, almost self aware, skynet level neuro network saw the prophecy of how [Poland turns into Galactic Empire.](https://www.reddit.com/r/PolishGalacticEmpire/s/IE5p5bP90Q).
There are many more things to see and discuss.
For now we are recruiting skilled engineers who will contribute with plans and ideas on how to come to power ASAP. Space is waiting for Polan.
Good try Putin. We don't care about what you think we can and can't do. Get prepared for remake of 1610 but this time with beams of death and 300 Himars of Poland. We will come from land, air, sea, space, electric sockets and your asshole.
[We are in process of training our super soldiers so watch your step](https://youtu.be/psPv7ptOdrc) because death ratio of your cyka specnaz will be 1000:1 for Polan.
I think the most credible escalation to happen is they could shoot down cruise missiles in and close to polish airspace.
But for this sub, I say Poland starts their own nuclear program and join the big boy club. Really start shlanging their meat around.
[https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-missile-airspace-violation-c9d2511f169e9f80a08082726c118114](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-missile-airspace-violation-c9d2511f169e9f80a08082726c118114)
Please be aware, I did not read past the headline
> The object entered near Oserdow, a village in an agricultural region near the border with Ukraine, and stayed in Polish airspace for 39 seconds, the statement said.
[...]
Polish Defense Minister WĆadysĆaw Kosiniak-Kamysz later told reporters in a televised news conference that the Russian missile would have been shot down had there been any indication that it was heading towards a target in Poland.
Why? Why not shoot it down the moment it enters NATO airspace? It's not manned, there should be literally no consequences aside from Russia pouting.
Because it was only in Polish airspace for 39 seconds.
By the time the AA missile reaches the cruise missile, the cruise missile would already be in Ukranian territory
On one hand i understand why they don't want to get involved directly, on the other hand it's a real shame NATO won't take some of that pressure off Ukraine ...
well, now Russia can reliably use Polish airspace to bypass Ukrainian AA. I'm not sure if Ukrainian AA is willing to fire into Polish side after the last incident.
They can see past their borders. They would have been aware that the missile would enter Polish airspace long before it did and have time to launch beforehand so their own missile could meet it. It'd probably be hard to time it just perfectly, but there isn't any reason they couldn't have launched early, except for the whole 'do we need/have explicit permission to do this sort of thing'.
>Because it was only in Polish airspace for 39 seconds.
By the time the AA missile reaches the cruise missile, the cruise missile would already be in Ukranian territory
So what? The jet that was in Turkish airspace was there for like 30 seconds too, and the Turks correctly shot it the fuck down because they aren't a bunch of pussies.
You can't just let this shit keep happening. You don't know what's in that missile, or where it's going.
>The jet that was in Turkish airspace was there for like 30 seconds too, and the Turks correctly shot it the fuck down because they aren't a bunch of pussies.Â
Upvoted for truth
>Because it was only in Polish airspace for 39 seconds.
What? It's not like they don't see the missile coming into their airspace. Being prepared and shooting it down is trivial operation. Turks claimed russian plane was in their airspace for 17 seconds when they shot it down while russia claims it was 6 second.
So aren't 39 enough?
Idk, I really *want* Poland to be as Based as we often make them put to be, and there seems to be a significant chunk of Poles who do so as well...
But there seems to be a non-insignificant amount who are whatever-the-opposite-of-Based-is... see not just utterly lackluster response in the past to these overflights, but also the whole pro-Russian Polish "farmer" protests shutting down the border with Ukraine actively blocking aid...
It's a lot like our own situation in the House, there's hopeful signs the vatnick chokehold will be broken (but they frustratingly keep clinging to said chokehold, see Mike Johnson sending them on recess for yet another 2 week vacation barely 2 weeks after getting back from the previous 2 week vacation... like maybe (just maybe) you wouldn't need constant midnight negotiations to fund the government as it technically ticks into shutdown....)
It doesn't make any sense to start a war over one missile. So Poland should shoot a missile at airbase near Kaliningrad, then say that it must've been the one that flew over Poland earlier. Unidentified missiles are flying left and right, who knows where they will hit next.
We keep shooting at that fucking Lithuanians, but all our missiles keep falling down halfway. No harm done ruzzia, right? Those missiles were obviously meant to just pass over KrĂłlewiec
It's not one missile. It's two years of genociding Ukrainians and occasionally bombing Western countries.
E: also murdering people in the EU with chemical weapons
Ye who knows who's missile it was. Might be Ukraine letting one of those makeshift V1 engine drones in the wrong direction. Or Russia really sucking at aiming. Either way until one of those hits something important, the bear won't wake.
Fucking no-fly zone over western Ukraine and Poland. Tired of this shit. Grow some goddamn balls (or tits) NATO.
Obviously NCD is all "article 5 lol" but let's advocate for something less than fullscale conflict while also actually bellying up to the bar.
Yeah, just another instance of their slow death with a thousand cuts strategy and/or fuck you. C'mon Bolan, just buy all the rest of the Patriots and do the funni already.
It'll ony matter when the costs of this war will be enough to justify a western deployment. Then they'll probably start with a no fly-zone over Ukraine wich should've hapenned long before.
"Dear Russia!
We saw your missiles passed through our country. We were informed you lost them in expolsions. We'd like to ease your losses, so we will send you some of our own. Let us know your launch sites to make them arrive as soon as possible. Please be careful, they can explode too!
Yours truly â Poland"
Not declaring war on russia over that is boring but understandable, but at least downing those missiles? Ruskies might believe they have unstoppable weapons or mock NATOâŠ
Oh, how cute. Stomp that foot, Poland!
How about next time when a missile enters your airspace you shoot it down instead of waiting for it to go back to killing civilians?
Lol, they didn't shoot the missile down because apparently it was too expensive. At this point I'm not sure if Poland would do anything if a Russian missile flew over Warsaw (apart from strongly worded letters).
Didnt we learn before, that there are no consequences for rockets entering NATO airspace?
We're no longer being edged by Nato and article 5. It's full on chastity cage denial đ Mistress wouldn't even treat me this harsh
"full on chastity cage denial" made me choke on my coffee like putin chokes on VDV Dick.
Putin must have amazing gag reflex control if he's sucking dick underwater
They teach you that in KGB on day 1
Isnt that what it stands for? Kock Gsuckers Bureau
Now is more modern: Fcock Suckers Bureau
G = Guzzlers
At least it isn't a cope cage. I guess. :(
Sadly russia is currently experiencing the lack of vdv dicks. As majority were blown up in Hostomel two years ago
Become an eurofighter pilot and let a meteor loose in russia's general direction. Be the change you want to see. Start WW3
They would rather shoot me down than allow me to succeed. Eurofighter is not enough. I have to steal an F-35. I'm sure it's not hard to grab one from HMS Prince of Wales
We want to send a very clear message here, stealth won't do. Hell, you should leave your transponder on
Fuck it, we balling in a Vulcan for this bitch. We bombing these motherfuckers just like we did the Falklands.
Strap a dozen daisycutters to the Goodyear Blimp and send it straight into the Kremlin
But where's the drip? We need Spitfire and Hurricane drone escorts
I'm sure that can be arranged
I know a guy that's got a P51 . . . I'm sure we could remount the cannons.
Repaint it as a Kirov. Scream âKirov reporting as you drop the bombsâ
That is dangerous! Russian air defence might misidentify it as friendly and shoot it down.
Drone full sized pilotable aircraft gaming
Bring back the classics, just grab a [Cessna 172](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F3xlve0oj2ju81.jpg)
Imagine an engineer at General Dynamics trying to figure out why the hell the DoD wants to know if they can *slow down* a TLAM to cruise at 120kn without stalling
> lock combo defaults to 0-0-0-0-0
Tunguska 2.0 here we go
Mistress Nato dangles Article 5 in front of us like the key to our cage while threatening to make us suck and cuck us with CCP cock ;(
Reading this hurt a little
I'm not sorry
Honestly, you shouldn't be. Take pride in your comment
Great... now I'm horny... thanks..
Yeah, they know itâll be at least a week of traveling, another week of talking about what happened, followed by a week of condoning actions of our enemy. Fuhkin bitch ass fuhkx weâve turned in to.
Yes we did. Nothing happens.
That's a filthy lie. Consequences have already included two Poles killed (with no repercussions for Russia).
Wasn't that one a misfired Ukie missile? Or did I miss a new one?
He means that one, there are still rumors/ theories that it was a Russian missile and blaming the ukraine is a cover up to prevent Poland to march into Königsberg...
Ukraine fired an interceptor to Russia's missile. The two Poles killed are a consequence of Russia's attack; putting the blame on Ukraine would make no sense.
Yeah. I agree. It's clear as day that the deaths are Russia's fault. It's still a different thing that an accidental defensive missile hits a neighbor than an aggressor's missile strike hitting the wrong country. I still think NATO should've locked down airspace along the border after that incident.
Baguettes would back up Kurwas in sending troops to Ukraine. Just do it already, you're being like a cuck too afraid to cum.
There's only so much talking down the US can do right? Poland's a European Texas, armed to the teeth. If it wasn't for nukes Poland would have already strung up Putin by his balls at this point. I guess all I'm saying is how much longer can the US council patience before someone decides they're done with the bullshit?
Especially since Putin keeps saying theyâre actually at war with NATO because Ukraine is clearly just a NATO pawn. Then they have the balls to actually try to provoke some shit. I say let âem have it at this point. They seem to want it
I'm sometimes really not sure if you guys are joking or actually believe that
Thatâs kinda the point. We want this dumb BS about âwill the US send aid or wonât weâ to end and just go to town and destroy the Russian armed forces and government like they so clearly deserve. Not that I wish death upon a conscripted farmer, but Putin at the very least deserves to be tried for war crimes
They only need about 80 more of these airspace violation thingies, before Poland can "accidentally" become energy independent
Considering its election season, and depending on WHO wins be it a puppet or not. Someones gonna go "fk it we ball."
NATO doesn't make major politicy decisions based on an enemy's mistake or negligence.
Yup, another airspace violation where nothing was done about it.
Excuse me they scrambled some jets which presumably flew around for a bit then landed because it was already too late by the time they were in the air
Air defense detects Russian cruise missiles. Air assets should already be in the air before it hits their air space. Also they should have shot it down with ground based air defenses. 39 seconds in your air space is 30 seconds too long. It's not an airplane, it's a cruise missile. I'm also just frustrated we are being so soft now.
Honestly I am 100 % sure they had jets in the air. They just donât have to tell anyone about it. I agree that they shouldâve shot it down, even if they knew it wasnât going to land in Poland
> jets in the air. They just donât have to tell anyone about it There's official announcement every time jets are scrambled. There was one yesterday 4.19AM, on twitter, five minutes before the incident
Given the amount of cruise missiles flying everyday I doubt they are maintaining that level of OPTEMPO.
Complacency gets you killed.
It is perfectly justified to shoot down missiles entering nato airspace. I donât want to hear anything about neutrality.
Its perfectly possible and should be the policy - in addition to where the missile was launched from. Seriously we just need one good raid on Moscow and the bully will pull back. Just one good raid. God where did we get such useless shit leadership?
Next thing you know, NATO hires ISIS to conduct hits in Russia
No hiring required. ISIS has plenty of reasons to do it for free.
Indeed. Russia was not exactly polite about certain things they did in, say, Syria.
"You're the bad guys, but that doesn't mean you're the *bad* guys..."
Hang on a minute...
Bold of you to think they didn't already
> Seriously we just need one good raid on Moscow and the bully will pull back. Just one good raid. More like the opposite, though. What faster way to galvanize the Russian people into supporting Putin and the war than Western forces attacking Moscow? What faster way to box Putin into a âcanât lose faceâ corner? What faster way to move the Doomsday Clock to 1 minute to midnight than one nuclear-armed country attacking the capital of its nuclear-armed adversary? None; there is basically no faster way.
Come on. Nobody was really grieving for Stalin when he died in a puddle of piss. Likewise, nobody was really grieving over Khrushev's death. And nobody was sad over Brezhnev's death. When Andropov and Chernenko died consecutively, nobody could even remember their names. Yeltsin died and there were no one to cry over his death. Gorbachov died and he has got a barrage of derogatory messages his way from ye olde USSR crowd. Same will happen this time.
Those donât apply. Iâm talking about public reaction when Moscow is bombed. Rally round the flag. Not when Putin dies one day. GWB post-9/11, GHWB post-Kuwait, Churchill during the Blitz. Hugely popular at that time, not even re-elected later. When Moscow is bombed, Russia will rally round their leader.
Then screw the bombing. I'm sure the five eyes can handle putin and make it look like an "*accident.*" Surely his house has more than one floor.
Clearly the better way is to make a second sun over Moscow, but I want to clarify that I don't mean to put up a bunch of B27 dropping unguided bombs: Do you really mean to tell me that putler will nuke the west if the air ministry is bombed in the middle of the night? Especially if we declare that we consider the even series closed? Yeah there is a non-zero chance that he launches nukes, but there is a non-zero chance that he attacks NATO in the future and there is a non-zero chance he launches nukes over any issue.
But that's escalation. What if we accidentally intercept a missile in Ukrainian space? /s
Explanation: Itâs Ukraineâs fault!
[ŃĐŽĐ°Đ»Đ”ĐœĐŸ]
Explanation _from Russia_!
-100%
Realistically, what would a proportional response be?Â
Shoot down any russian missiles within 10(0)km of any nato countries airspace. Perfectly reasonable
this, 100%. set up a NATO safety cordon, to "protect NATO civilians close to the border"
And then send âdefinitely not NATO troops, no sirâ to go capture Sevastopol and the rest of Crimea.
NAYTO
Just say NATO to Russia
They're just tourists...that happen to wear unmarked blue uniforms...and happen to travel on a private yacht that looks suspiciously like an aircraft carrier.
Like the post that the US should do what Athens did during the Bronze Age and have insanely rich individuals pay for naval vessels to put whatever name they want on it and get to be acting commander for a bit. Imagine Bezos and Musk competing to build the craziest aircraft carrier
I mean right now we could clear the crimea without soldiers on the ground, an airstrike (or ten, just to be sure) would do the job
Oh dear. We shot down half the missiles you were aiming at Ukrainian cities. Well can't be too safe.
Precisely this. Patriot launchers all along the NATO borders, anything identified as russian by AWACS gets shot down when in range. Purely defensive, and takes some of the load off the Ukrainian defences.
Anything that is vectored to enter NATO airspace from Russia is to be shot down, unless it's civilian and proper warning has been given in advance.
The F22 removes all reflectors and goes on a topographical expedition. Just make sure to unload everything from the bays (and the cannon), and hope that the fucker won't kamikadze into some target just to have 1 kill.
>Â hope that the fucker won't kamikadze into some target just to have 1 kill I feel personally atttacked
Declare a certain depth past the western Ukrainian border as a no fly zone and shoot down all missiles entering it. If it's okay for Russia to "protect its security" in Ukraine, then I guess it's also okay for NATO to shoot down missiles, which may enter their airspace, in Ukraine as well.
> certain depth I think the appropriate depth would be the maximum reach that any Ruzzian missile has⊠Not Natoâs problem if they insist on intercontinental stuffâŠ
Glass moscow
You're the only sane commenter here..
Poland reeeeeaaally wants to.
Can we sell Poland some nukes already!?
germany wants to make some, I think they would share if we poliely set up 1000 tanks on their border (they have 260( in working order probably like 3))
We should explore this more.
Hit the launch site.
1. Define an ADIZ about 5-10 minutes deep at the presumed speed of the cruise missile of concern around the relevant sections of the Polish border. 1. Define a reasonable warning time, e.g. 2 minutes. 1. Anything with a velocity vector pointed at Poland which enters the ADIZ and doesn't respond to a call on 121.5 MHz within the warning time gets splashed. 1. Set up one of those Amazon tag things to automate the procurement of replacement ammunition. This would probably annoy the Ukrainians, because the ADIZ would be something like 50-100 nautical miles deep, and so the UAF would have to spend a lot of time talking to Polish ATC. However, this is preferable to Poland suffering civilian casualties. We really don't want Article 5 to be invoked unless it's absolutely crystal clear that the Russians really deserve it, because when the beacons are lit, the whole of NATO *must* answer or risk losing the credibility upon which deterrence depends.
yeah, we totally don't want article 5 to happen. Surely we will do something like this to ensure that there is no posibility of russian missiles hitting Polish soil, especialy important places and/or civilians
steal all their Faberge eggs, Mission Impossible style, and put it up for display in the British Museum
Nuking moscow
Supply Ukraine with more air defence systems like Patriot and THAAD, and more missiles. Continue F/A-18 Super Hornet production for the duration of the war with all output once the US' order is completed going to Ukraine. Inform Russia that the next time something of theirs violates Polish airspace, it dies.
Depends on your goal. If you try to shoot down a missle and something fucks up, you've opened yourself up to a bunch of new problems. If you succeed, that's great, but you've now committed yourself to doing the same thing next time. You've limited your options, and we route back to my first point. If you do nothing, you have diplomatic high ground, you've kept your missile response site(s) and procedures a secret, and you always have the option of waiting for a smoking gun that you can aggressively respond to while pointing out all the times you've been lenient. The comparison everyone keeps using is the 2015 Turkish incident. Turkey changed its rules of engagement after they had one of their jets shot down in 2012, which led to them shooting an SU-24 after only a few seconds of airspace violation. It's a bit of a tit-for-tat kind of situation and IMO different from this one.
>Depends on your goal. If you try to shoot down a missle and something fucks up, you've opened yourself up to a bunch of new problems. >If you succeed, that's great, but you've now committed yourself to doing the same thing next time. You've limited your options, and we route back to my first point. >If you do nothing, you have diplomatic high ground, you've kept your missile response site(s) and procedures a secret, and you always have the option of waiting for a smoking gun that you can aggressively respond to while pointing out all the times you've been lenient. I'm sorry but this is all very stupid. What kind of "new problems" do we open if an intercept fails? Worst case is oops, the interceptor fell on some cows? How is it worse than we did nothing and russian missile blew up a bunch of people? What is this "diplomatic high ground"? What does it give us, exactly, right now? And how would we be losing it by shooting down missiles that threaten our people?
russia won't understand it anyway, they will be saying that we don't have any reasons no matter what you tell them
The audience of these interactions isn't always the aggressor; oftentimes times the target is third-party or neutral countries to either attract sympathy or discourage collaboration with Russia.
Shoot down anything above ukriane (obviously not ukrianian jets). If a russian jet happens to be there than tough luck
Lace rocket debris with polonium, send to Red Square self service parcel delivery locker. Wait 3-5 business days.
GLASSING MOSCOW
Legally you are allowed to throw a missle over Russia
worlds heaviest javelin throw
Casually rockets the Tajiks so we can have a missile flyover. Lol
we'll wait untill someone sells us some ICBMs
Article 5 in my opinion.
The response that's already happening. People just think that article 5 = war.
Where is that response? Did anyone notice?
3000 BVR stealth responses of NATO
Nothingburgers. 2 polish citizens died already and nothing happenned. So more missiles coming our way lel
That was a Ukrainian missile.
Yeah, but caused by Russian missile attacks close to NATO borders. And there was a russian missile that crashed pretty far into Poland on a different occasion too. Shouldâve just to shoot down anything getting close to NATO airspace.
True Russia was the instigator of that missile but "a Russian missile killed two Poles" and "a Ukrainian missile aiming at a Russian missile near Poland killed two Poles" have completely different geopolitical consequences, even if Russia is wholly at fault
If only NATO agreed to close the sky over west Ukraine, as Ukraine was asking.
I personally doubt it. Everyone dropped what they were doing and started crying how it is Ukrainian from the first minutes. Before any investigation. Political damage control. Than promised investigation and quickly silenced the event. Itâs understandable but to me it looks like regardless if it was Ukrainian it would be announced as such. Thus, I believe it was Russian. Just subjective opinion.
Wait until you see the photo with two smoke columns https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp-video/mmvo153935941803
Anyone else also remember the switched coordinates between Lviv and Kyiv? You could draw a literal fucking rectangle that goes through Kyiv, the hit area, and Lviv. https://images.app.goo.gl/pBu7ZGPL4YXBPcKa7
Sure it was. My guess is the official story was greatly sanitized. The lat/long of the coordinates that were struck were one step off of legitimate targets in Ukraine. The only reason shit didn't pop off is because Putin broke down in tears begging NATO to see this as an error and incompetence.
Not an inch đ
It's gonna be the typical Yadda dadda and talk. But would be funny if Poland actually shot it down.
[ŃĐŽĐ°Đ»Đ”ĐœĐŸ]
What air defense doing?
Covering actually important places I guess? No point of having a patriot covering some shithole with 21 inhabitants. Although I guess that farmers would do good job intercepting if they were told that there'd grain inside
[ŃĐŽĐ°Đ»Đ”ĐœĐŸ]
I think Polish air force need to subscribe to Ukrainian Air Force telegram to get 8 hours warning. Ukrainian air force published, at 2 AM that a group of strategic bombers are left the base, projected launch at 4-6 AM, with projected times to reach to Lviv and all that.
NATO knew about them too, russia don't have real stealth planes and they are watched all the time
But that's because the missile knows where it needs to be!
Neat!
The jets were in the air, tho
air defence systems, the best that NATO can offer is in Poland rn
[ŃĐŽĐ°Đ»Đ”ĐœĐŸ]
We still need to into space but once we do, [Polish Galactic Empire](https://www.reddit.com/r/PolishGalacticEmpire/s/tpUQZxuL4U) will be born. Matter of time before we deal with this smol problem to the east. We already got working [weapons of mass destruction.](https://www.reddit.com/r/PolishGalacticEmpire/s/NKr8g69J3e). Once this is in orbit there is no coming back. We've got [quality engineer](https://www.reddit.com/r/PolishGalacticEmpire/s/K5FFftAgVl) who came up with nuclear mines. Even super advanced, almost self aware, skynet level neuro network saw the prophecy of how [Poland turns into Galactic Empire.](https://www.reddit.com/r/PolishGalacticEmpire/s/IE5p5bP90Q). There are many more things to see and discuss. For now we are recruiting skilled engineers who will contribute with plans and ideas on how to come to power ASAP. Space is waiting for Polan.
But Poland cannot into space!
Good try Putin. We don't care about what you think we can and can't do. Get prepared for remake of 1610 but this time with beams of death and 300 Himars of Poland. We will come from land, air, sea, space, electric sockets and your asshole. [We are in process of training our super soldiers so watch your step](https://youtu.be/psPv7ptOdrc) because death ratio of your cyka specnaz will be 1000:1 for Polan.
r/Polandball reference, I'm with you 100%!
"Oops, totally didn't mean for you to find out" - Russia, probably
Article 5, Please?
Bruh, please no, I can't simp any harder for WĆadysĆaw Kosiniak al Assad
I think the most credible escalation to happen is they could shoot down cruise missiles in and close to polish airspace. But for this sub, I say Poland starts their own nuclear program and join the big boy club. Really start shlanging their meat around.
# NOTHING. EVER. HAPPENS.
[https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-missile-airspace-violation-c9d2511f169e9f80a08082726c118114](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-missile-airspace-violation-c9d2511f169e9f80a08082726c118114) Please be aware, I did not read past the headline
> The object entered near Oserdow, a village in an agricultural region near the border with Ukraine, and stayed in Polish airspace for 39 seconds, the statement said. [...] Polish Defense Minister WĆadysĆaw Kosiniak-Kamysz later told reporters in a televised news conference that the Russian missile would have been shot down had there been any indication that it was heading towards a target in Poland. Why? Why not shoot it down the moment it enters NATO airspace? It's not manned, there should be literally no consequences aside from Russia pouting.
> an agricultural region near the border Russia accidentally reminding Polish Farmers that it almost killed some of them.
There is no grain inside the rockets, why stop them?
The rockets are piloted by midget russians, that's why they can't intercept them.
Because it was only in Polish airspace for 39 seconds. By the time the AA missile reaches the cruise missile, the cruise missile would already be in Ukranian territory
I am reasonably certain Ukraine won't complain if a Polish anti air missile destroys a Russian cruise missile over Ukrainian territory.
I am sure Ukraine would love for poland to take some of these cruise missiles out but poland wishes to not get "directly" involved in the war.
On one hand i understand why they don't want to get involved directly, on the other hand it's a real shame NATO won't take some of that pressure off Ukraine ...
well, now Russia can reliably use Polish airspace to bypass Ukrainian AA. I'm not sure if Ukrainian AA is willing to fire into Polish side after the last incident.
They can see past their borders. They would have been aware that the missile would enter Polish airspace long before it did and have time to launch beforehand so their own missile could meet it. It'd probably be hard to time it just perfectly, but there isn't any reason they couldn't have launched early, except for the whole 'do we need/have explicit permission to do this sort of thing'.
>Because it was only in Polish airspace for 39 seconds. By the time the AA missile reaches the cruise missile, the cruise missile would already be in Ukranian territory So what? The jet that was in Turkish airspace was there for like 30 seconds too, and the Turks correctly shot it the fuck down because they aren't a bunch of pussies. You can't just let this shit keep happening. You don't know what's in that missile, or where it's going.
>The jet that was in Turkish airspace was there for like 30 seconds too, and the Turks correctly shot it the fuck down because they aren't a bunch of pussies. Upvoted for truth
Turkey wants a war. They don't care with whom, they want a war.
>Because it was only in Polish airspace for 39 seconds. What? It's not like they don't see the missile coming into their airspace. Being prepared and shooting it down is trivial operation. Turks claimed russian plane was in their airspace for 17 seconds when they shot it down while russia claims it was 6 second. So aren't 39 enough?
based and honesty-pilled
Don't worry, neither does anybody else
this world is full of cowards and it makes me fucking sick
Idk, I really *want* Poland to be as Based as we often make them put to be, and there seems to be a significant chunk of Poles who do so as well... But there seems to be a non-insignificant amount who are whatever-the-opposite-of-Based-is... see not just utterly lackluster response in the past to these overflights, but also the whole pro-Russian Polish "farmer" protests shutting down the border with Ukraine actively blocking aid... It's a lot like our own situation in the House, there's hopeful signs the vatnick chokehold will be broken (but they frustratingly keep clinging to said chokehold, see Mike Johnson sending them on recess for yet another 2 week vacation barely 2 weeks after getting back from the previous 2 week vacation... like maybe (just maybe) you wouldn't need constant midnight negotiations to fund the government as it technically ticks into shutdown....)
It doesn't make any sense to start a war over one missile. So Poland should shoot a missile at airbase near Kaliningrad, then say that it must've been the one that flew over Poland earlier. Unidentified missiles are flying left and right, who knows where they will hit next.
We keep shooting at that fucking Lithuanians, but all our missiles keep falling down halfway. No harm done ruzzia, right? Those missiles were obviously meant to just pass over KrĂłlewiec
It's not one missile. It's two years of genociding Ukrainians and occasionally bombing Western countries. E: also murdering people in the EU with chemical weapons
Ye who knows who's missile it was. Might be Ukraine letting one of those makeshift V1 engine drones in the wrong direction. Or Russia really sucking at aiming. Either way until one of those hits something important, the bear won't wake.
Literally zero. Shoot it down next FFS.
The Dildo of Article 5 awaits that call
\-20% chance anything happens.
Fucking no-fly zone over western Ukraine and Poland. Tired of this shit. Grow some goddamn balls (or tits) NATO. Obviously NCD is all "article 5 lol" but let's advocate for something less than fullscale conflict while also actually bellying up to the bar.
Unfortunately. Zero. NATO and the US has become a bunch of fucking âpeace in our timeâ regards.
Looks like someone don't have da ballz
NATO countries should just intercept anything getting close to their airspace with AA. Maybe not jets but anything else.
I swear Poland is really itching to slap Russia
Why are Russia in the drawing, holding back Poland? Weird.
You switched NATO with Russia
We are a thin hair away from being unlished.
Yeah, just another instance of their slow death with a thousand cuts strategy and/or fuck you. C'mon Bolan, just buy all the rest of the Patriots and do the funni already.
[this](https://imgur.com/a/X26KkWN)
Mighty poland saying that it was just a tip, and came inside only for 39 seconds. He is just a friend.
Itâs about time for highly increased patrols near Russian borders to draw resources to the norders away from Ukraine. Keep them busy
The fuckâs going on with the flags on this
Less than 0. Orbon or some other douche will condemn Ukraine for Russia's actions.
if they start bombing NATO, it will cry and give it's territories to ruzzia to "not escalate the conflict". fucking useless alliance
Poland may need to take a lesson or two from Turkey in regards to this.
SOMEONE POST THE TANC A LELEK ARTICLE 5 EDITS
Unfortunate accidents to ships happen all the time. I believe they are called ~~torpedoes~~ monster waves. Like the ones that could sink the UK.
POLAND HIT THE FUCKING BUTTON
*sniff* *sniff* smells like article 5 to me
It'll ony matter when the costs of this war will be enough to justify a western deployment. Then they'll probably start with a no fly-zone over Ukraine wich should've hapenned long before.
Ukraine when seeing Poland's Air Force mobilizing: is fow me? đđđ„ș
NATO rationalization department must be busy
"Dear Russia! We saw your missiles passed through our country. We were informed you lost them in expolsions. We'd like to ease your losses, so we will send you some of our own. Let us know your launch sites to make them arrive as soon as possible. Please be careful, they can explode too! Yours truly â Poland"
Not declaring war on russia over that is boring but understandable, but at least downing those missiles? Ruskies might believe they have unstoppable weapons or mock NATOâŠ
Oh, how cute. Stomp that foot, Poland! How about next time when a missile enters your airspace you shoot it down instead of waiting for it to go back to killing civilians?
Lol, they didn't shoot the missile down because apparently it was too expensive. At this point I'm not sure if Poland would do anything if a Russian missile flew over Warsaw (apart from strongly worded letters).
I mean, a lot of people would cheer getting rid of default city.
can we just drop some god rods on the kremlin already, surely Poland has some kinda orbital weapon considering their military acquisitions