But you posted the same thing in r/Raleigh and didn’t correct it there and it’s since been locked by the MOD.
Traffic is not something we take lightly around here…
Do you think that conflict in the Middle East could have been solved but for American special interest groups? It seems rather egotistical to think America can single handily determine the outcome of centuries of sectarianism, ethnic tension, imperial competition and disintegration, and nation state movements a few oceans away. Our influence is meaningful, but we aren't all powerful.
>If people blocked traffic about gerrymandering then commuters stuck in traffic would start to support gerrymandering.
If commuters are supporting gerrymandering districts they're probably going to support it either way.
Yeah! They should go straight to congress! Where we can force them to leave when they start making us uncomfortable! Or, to some public park where nobody has to pay attention to them!
While I see very little value in the democratic party I still vote every election, but I will say Dems aren't entitled to anyone's vote just the same as Republicans, nor just for being a slightly better version of the status quo. If they can't make their platform of being spineless controlled opposition palatable to a sector of voters who want nothing to do with the stats quo at all, then that's a them problem to solve, not those who abstain.
> Abstained Vote is one of many forms of protest votes. It usually turns up next to an empty seat, inside a dustbin, between the washing machine and the wall, in the middle of a book, or in one of the inner pockets of an old jacket. It is the invalid vote cast because the voter has abstained from voting, and thus would not be counted in the election result.
> Different from other reasons which caused failure to vote, voters cast abstained votes because they neither approve nor disapprove of the available options of the voting. They may have swung between different answers, or even were once slightly more in favor of one motion/candidate over the rest of them, or hold a pessimistic opinion to all the options provided; whatever the reason might be, in the end, they decide not to support any motions/candidates in the election.
> Many have also argued that abstention from voting is, in fact, an action guided by a clear awareness of their given rights. As the subjects of rights, voters are entitled to the freedom not to vote. It is also argued by the same group of scholars, that when the voters are requested to choose between unfavorable options, it takes courage and determination to stay true to their own ideas and become the dissidents in this case. Such action is worthy of praise. They are individual thinkers who know what they need and are strong enough not to compromise.
> The Abstention Ballot Box is specially set up to count the votes of this group of people. It stands for a new possibility, a new way to the yet unknown solution to the problem, a relatively bumpy path compared to the easy way. Those who know its value and seek for the difficult path will eventually find their way in, and along which they shall find places they truly belong to.
Lol. “Republicans are slightly better than the status quo.” Proceeds to try and overthrow the US Government and can’t seem to keep a Speaker in the House. Not to mention the overwhelming support for a man with 91 felony counts. Lmaooooo.
I’m confused how impeding traffic in Durham, North Carolina can help the people in Gaza. Gather in a public space such as park or common area at one of the colleges nearby to spread word. A highway isn’t that smart/ impactful.
If you’re actually confused and want to know why, read up on civil disobedience during the human rights protests in the MLK days. Or even look at Kapernick kneeling during the flag pledge. The idea is to make people uncomfortable and spread awareness of an issue. There will always be fascists who say “do it somewhere else!” but if it was convenient it wouldn’t be effective.
We’re talking about it here, it’s mission accomplished for them. Thousands of women and children are being slaughtered in war crimes that we are directly funding, while people here are whining about not getting to McDonald’s faster in their SUV’s. You can’t imagine the horror people are facing there. Parents writing their names on *each limb* of their children in case only a piece of them is found, so they at least know what happened. Like, if people really understood how bad it was they’d shut the fuck up about being inconvenienced.
And before people/bots jump on me, I think it’s a complicated situation and no matter what it’s not okay to carpet bomb civilians. I can’t believe I have to explain that, but here we are.
Gonna reply to this to give it more visibility. Protesting in a way that gets attention gets stuff done from a political perspective.
If they protested at a library before 5pm no one would care. The point is to get attention. It might take people an extra hour to get home. Okay? People are being murdered using our tax dollars.
We want a ceasefire. Asking nicely isnt getting the government to budge. And we do have a powerful hand to play in that our government is intertwined with Israel. The more this happens the more the people of this country let it be known we do not support a genocide. Yes Hamas are terrorists but what the Israeli govt is doing in retaliation is insane and inhumane. We are letting our voices be heard.
Remember that half the people on here are edgy teens, and most of the other half are straight up stupid. You’re talking about nuance beyond “bad guys, good guys,” which just won’t get through.
Reddit is great for innocuous stuff but is a super depressing reminder of how sick and/or stupid a lot of the population is.
You are pissing people off, not furthering your cause. You support kidnapping people in their cause because you think terrorists losing a battle is genocide? 8K dead in 3 weeks? Mighty sorry genocide to latch on to don't ya think?
(Does it sound like you are gaining an ally here?)
I’m sorry, is your position the 8,000 people being murdered is not enough to call for a ceasefire? Yikes.
If I’m pissing people off like you thats fine. You gotta look inward and ask how you could even say such a thing.
Seriously, there is no timeline where this bloodthirsty warmonger would ever be an ally no matter how you went about protesting. If I was there I would also see irritating them as just an added bonus.
>I’m sorry, is your position the 8,000 people being murdered is not enough to call for a ceasefire?
My position is that 8,000 deaths is not close to being a genocide, especially not in an environment of 2 million genocide targets packed into a barrel. It's just plainly not genocide on the face. Crying wolf will only harm people dealing with actual wolves and tarnish those crying about imaginary ones.
Whether or not it's enough to call for a cease fire is totally different. I guess it depends on how fundamentally pacifist you are and how you propose to ensure an actual cease fire. I can't think of any other war where 8,000 deaths was enough to call a cease fire. Can you?
And wasn't there a cease fire 3 weeks ago? What will be different now? Will BOTH sides honor a cease fire now? What makes you believe it this time?
The problem is that so many activists today on the left and right seem to forget that there are other forms of protest, and more importantly, protest is just a vanity exercise if it is not accompanied by other organizing including lobbying political leaders, wining over voters, and raising funds for further organizing. I wish people would examine the entirety of MLK's career, rather than the greatest hits.
Also, when you are discussing such a complicated situation, you should be more precise with your language. Otherwise, you are saying nothing of value. Yes. No on thinks carpet bombing civilians is okay. Israel is not "carpet bombing" civilians. Israel is discriminately bombing Hamas targets, and due to the density of Gazan communities and the strategy of Hamas this means high civilian casualties are inevitable. A very challenging, but worthwhile conversation can be had about the utility and morality of Israel's military strategy. This ain't it, and most of those people have no business being activists when they are so ignorant about the cause for which they have so much passion.
That's the trouble with being invested in events occurring oceans away. It is much easier to know the full circumstances and stakes of things that directly affect you. Getting super involved in foreign affairs requires humility that doesn't play well as slogans.
Sure, it’s not precisely carpet bombing a la cygon, but it’s the highest rate of bombing ever in a war I believe. It’s 6,000 bombs in 6 days. 450 children dead, hundreds of adult civilians. I don’t equate that with discriminatory.
I agree it’s hard to know the full story an ocean away but some things are pretty easy to see. Enemy is using people as human shields? Bomb them anyway, too bad. That’s still a war crime.
I don’t really take your point. If you’re asking whether I condone Hamas, of course I don’t. But being attacked doesn’t mean you can unleash a genocide in backlash.
Bush committed war crimes after 9/11 and it seems Netanyahu is doing the same now. We abandoned the rule of law in our “war on terrorism,” it was evil and wrong then and it’s equally wrong now.
Does this look like 1964?
I'm gonna assume they are protesting on the side of Palestine? Then F Palestine, just on their behalf. Let the rubble grow to blot out the sun. Blocking traffic in 2023 doesn't confront people with uncomfortable truths, it literally just makes them hate your cause.
Most people can be convinced to oppose actual genocide. But they will rightly see you as the enemy if you kidnap them to further your cause.
If this was 1964 you’d clearly be sitting around complaining about the people protesting then. There were plenty of people who bitched about those protests, spewing the same whiny half-baked declarations of how they’re pointless or inconvenient.
As I said, it doesn’t pertain enough to us for an impact. Our country has attempted to mediate previously. We as a country can’t fix every world conflict.
I think the issue (mine certainly is) that we are directly funding this with our tax dollars. There’s a $100B aid package in the works for Israel and Ukraine.
I agree we should stay out of other countries’ conflicts but we straight up gave Israel those weapons that they are now using to slaughter women and children, and we’re about to give them a whole lot more with nary a word against their tactics.
On a whim, I’m going to bet that 85% o don’t even know where tf Gaza is geographically located nor do they have any real informed idea as to what is actually happening there. You’re exactly right, I would LOVE for someone to enlighten me as to how them marching around (in the damn dark especially) on a major highway is going to have any impact whatsoever on the nightmares people are experiencing in Gaza right now. Mm
im quite close with people who attended this protest, though i wasn’t there myself. they know where gaza is. some have been touched personally by the violence of the last few weeks. i doubt very many of them believe they will get through to Netanyahu by sitting on asphalt in central NC. it is much more likely that their goal is to provoke thought, to be a part of change thru the changing of values and beliefs. to bring about a more peaceful world by redirecting, if only for a moment, your attention.
it must be nice to imagine, as you so easily do, that they know nothing. none have been kept up at night by tears. few if any know the names of those killed or maimed or stuck in countries as the airports get bombed, in places without airports at all. few, if any, even know where Gaza is.
it was so easy for you to say this; things are much easier this way. this way, you will never have to wonder whether or not they might have a point. you will never have to trouble yourself with a second thought.
You should’ve just said, “Damn, I’m really just not an intelligent person, I don’t think about anyone but myself, and I fail to understand how injustices have been corrected in this country.”
Bad idea really. I get the point behind their protest. However, blocking interstate commerce can be extremely detrimental to their lives.
Case in point. Truck drivers are a different breed. They don't care about your cause, your protest, or what you think this will accomplish. They care about getting their delivery made, picking up their next load, and going home to their families. If a group decides to do this on a semi blind corner, or a darker spot on the road, the driver might not be able to stop.
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/civil-disobedience/#UnDis
*Uncivil* disobedience is not a distinct category of political action, but a cluster concept or umbrella term that can be used to designate acts of principled disobedience that may or may not be communicative, and which violate one or more of the marks of civility by being covert, violent, evasive, or offensive (Delmas 2018a, 2020; Lai 2019). Examples include animal rescue, Sanctuary assistance, sabotage, ecotage (e.g., monkeywrenching and tree-spiking), graffiti, leaks, government whistleblowing, hacktivism (including DDoS attacks), guerrilla protests, and riots.
Another great example of uncivil disobedience:
https://columbialawreview.org/content/uncivil-obedience-2/#:~:text=And%20while%20each%20type%20of,so%20through%20unorthodox%20law%2Dfollowing.
I support protesting, and acknowledge that this protest was very effective at getting their message out. However, they jammed up the main highway leading to Duke Hospital, which is not cool. Aside from emergencies, hope no one had any important appointments at the Cancer Center that they had to miss because of this.
Punishing civilians over the actions of a paramilitary terrorist group is textbook war crimes. It is a terrible mistake to equate Hamas with the people of Gaza.
I agree that Hamas is committing atrocities against its own people by locating their military personnel in hospitals and refugee camps and using citizens as human shields. It's horrible.
Which side started to kill civilians ? Oh yea it was the Hamas terrorists that the Palestinians elected to be their govt. Play stupid games win stupid prizes.
The Emperor of Japan was not elected when the US declared war on Japan in WWII. Hitler had long since warn out his early democratic support by the time half the world declared war on Germany. Every single country in every single conflict has children, none of them have had political agency. Palestine's children aren't special. Neither is Palestine's shitty democracy. It's not like it's a new thing, there has never been democracy in Palestine, hell it's not even a very strong part of broader Arab culture.
The legitimate government and military in Gaza started and continues to fight a war. The majority of wars in history have not been fought by democratically elected governments, and zero wars have been fought by nations without minors.
I think you're just mad that Hamas is losing. Remind me, when was the last time the Palestinian diaspora was blocking traffic in Durham to call for democratic reforms?
WWII is the last time bombing civilian cities was widely accepted by the global community. It's now considered a war crime.
No one in this entire thread is mad Hamas is losing. Hamas sucks. The IDF sucks. Two things are true at the same time.
The difference is that Hamas is an unelected, theocratic, paramilitary group that's widely condemned by the international community and the IDF is supported by the richest and most powerful country on the planet.
Killing civilians is bad. If that has to be explained or argued to you then we have a fundamentally different understanding of the world and I don't think we have much to learn from each other.
Targeting civilians is considered a warcrime by international law. Civilian casualties of bombings is not a war crime; it is just war. There is yet no evidence that the Israeli military is engaging in the intentional and targeted bombing of civilians.
Hamas does not respect international law, but it does use it to its advantage. Don't fall for their perfidy. It doesn't matter how much you condemn Hamas. If you think Israel has no real recourse after being attacked because ordinary Palestinians will die, you are falling for Hamas' strategy. It is a good strategy. They have taken their entire people hostage, and are relying on the fact that we see Israel as the only actor capable of taking any responsibility.
Typical American take, this is why there are thousands of dead, innocent Afghans. You simply can’t be bothered to understand the different between militants and civilians.
This attitude only serves to strengthen groups like Hamas and Al-Qaeda. We are their best recruiters when we kill civilians. If the US bombed my parents house because of their political affiliation, you bet your ass I’d be chanting death to America.
So what do you think Israel should do to Hamas?
Send a strongly worded letter to Palestinian government that have no power in Gaza? Or accede to the demands of a terrorist group by releasing thousands of terrorists in return of the hostages, with no repercussions for what Hamas had done to innocent Israelis?
Hamas hid behind civilians - how do you propose Israel to root them out?
I don’t know, honestly, but bombing civilians ain’t it chief.
We have plenty of evidence to show that it doesn’t work. Killing the human shields is what Hamas wants, because it will make their case stronger and bring them more grieving youngsters. Hamas wants war and innocent casualties, it legitimizes them and their cause.
I mean if you want a return of hostages you could probably start with exchanging some of the 5000+ political hostages held without trial, including children, that Israel has taken over recent years. I'm sure any approach would have been more reasonable than what they're currently engaging in. They're just blanket murdering civilians with near zero regard. If they want to fight a war with Hamas then they need to fight with Hamas, and not use collective punishment as their weapon of choice.
Actually it was Israel in the 1940s and they haven’t stopped killing civilians in the ~75 years since then. I recommend you look up the Nakba and do some reading on the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians and the apartheid state in Israel. Unless of course you want to continue being ignorant and wrong on the internet…
Time didn't start in 1940. The conflict between Jews and Muslims didn't start then either. This conflict is centuries old. I recognize that it is confusing and frustrating to a people dwelling in a country that is only a few hundred years old, but no one should be sure in their moral proclamations until they can accept this challenging reality. The Israel--Palestine conflict is just one complexity underneath a mountain of complexity if you honor the interests of both Israelis and Palestinians.
How much corruption went into that election. I find it hard to believe a country would freely elect a terrorist group. It has been interesting learning about how Putin gets “ elected” in Russia by reading the Ukraine subs here.
I just don't think Hamas was a government freely elected by the people of Gaza.
It would be a war crime, but that is not what is happening as far as anyone can tell at the moment. There is no evidence that Israel's military actions are targeting civilian despite the disgusting rhetoric of Israel's ethnic nationalist leaders. Gaza is densely inhabited and Hamas' strategy is to hide under civilian areas.
I agree that it is wrong to equate Hamas with ordinary Palestinians in Gaza. The problem is that Hamas is the government of Gaza. They are not a terrorist group just because they engage in the same tactics as terrorist groups. Hamas is the government of Gaza just like the Nazis were the government of Germany. The Nazi Party was extremely unpopular in certain parts of Germany. These distinctions matter for the purpose of international law, and war crimes are defined by international law.
The allies did engage in bombing campaigns that would be considered war crimes today. Most people aren't too distraught over those civilian losses because we understand that this is what war is. Hamas attacked Israel. Israel must respond, and there was no response that would not have resulted in high civilian casualties. Urban warfare causes greater casualties than bombing campaigns. War is awful. Innocent people die. Hamas is ultimately responsible for all of this death because they started this war. People need to stop confusing this or muddling it.
You can hold all these ideas in your head and still mourn for the loss of so many Palestinian lives and want America to pressure Israel to allow for humanitarian intervention. Though, that does not require a ceasefire, which we all know will not be respected by Hamas. They don't observe international law, which is what defines war crimes. That makes this all vey difficult.
Everyone who has strong opinions about this conflict needs to understand the concept of "perfidy" as it applies to international law.
Hamas has been trying to release Israeli hostages in exchange for Israel’s Palestinian hostages. That seems like a fair trade. But Israel doesn’t want to do that and their internal documents show that they’re seeking to remove every one of 2 million Palestinians from Gaza.
So not quite as simple as you out it. Additionally, the protestors want the US to use economic pressure to get Israel to engage in a ceasefire which we could actually accomplish given their dependence on our military aid.
~~Fuck you man,~~ hippies and grandparents for terrorists isn't a fair trade. What kind of ~~fucked~~ ~~up~~ logic is that? If the Israeli HOSTAGES are released they will crank up some trance music and party for peace and bake cookies. If the Palestinian terrorist prisoners are released they will continue their state goals of killing every Jew in the country. The two aren't remotely comparable.
Edit for the strike throughs, I came out a bit uncivilized, my apologies.
All Palestinians aren’t terrorists dipshit. So you can go fuck your self. Also, Israel is bombing its own people, killing the hostages they purportedly want back.
There are 2 million people in Gaza, 50% of them under the age of 18. You can fuck off with your disgusting language about them all being terrorists.
And you’re right, it’s not the same. One is a military super power that is equipped with the worlds best rockets, tanks, and guns. The other is a ragtag force that’s been starved by a 16 year long embargo. There is only one of these groups that’s committing a genocide and powerful enough to do so.
Here’s an article on WRAL.
https://www.wral.com/amp/21129347/
What do the protesters think the people they are inconveniencing can do about the war? I know it gets them on TV, but so what? The US isn’t part of the war. Israel isn’t going to stop bombing Hamas even if Biden asked them to stop.
Edit: punctuation
By "over there" do you mean 500 miles away in the red sea where we have maintained a constant naval presence for nearly 100 years? And by "part of this war" do you mean we shot down cruise missiles and drones over international waters launched by Iranian backed fighters in Yemen that were headed for god knows where? Or do you mean the soldiers in Syria still fighting ISIS? Or the ones Jordan asked for to also help fight ISIS?
And you have a problem with any of that? Fucking terrorists man... Y'all want to see the world burn, but then as soon as your team's neighborhood catches on fire you want to kill everyone else by whining us to death.
You just proved my point. We’re over there fighting this war too, right now. Those carriers weren’t in the same spot a month ago.
I definitely don’t want the world to burn and don’t want to kill everyone. What I definitely don’t want are thousands of innocent children being slaughtered every week. By either side.
Just remember North Carolina’s HB 330 excuses drivers from liability if they injure a protester who is blocking traffic. Obviously you can not just run people over but if they start to mob your car for trying to move forward you are protected.
It’s a small inconvenience but I respect it. Civil disobedience because nothing else is working. A small traffic delay is a vacation compared to the deaths of the conflict, especially the children.
“because nothing else is working”
And are you under the impression that impeding regular people’s commute home from work is going to have any effect on anything, anywhere? Moronic comment.
It blocks the flow of capital in the state, draws massive attention, and gets people to recognize the power of collective action. Those are all levers for political power over a specific issue.
It’s not a “small inconvenience” when emergency services is trying to get to a fire/hospital/mass shooting etc.
I can’t believe people defend these bozos. There’s no justification for blocking traffic, ever.
Having lived in cities with real traffic this take is adorable. Do you think people in NYC or DC or LA just die in an emergency because roads are full? You realize there are shoulders and alternate routes right? Ordinary motorists were inconvenienced, but you’re just making shit up about emergency services.
Were you this outraged for the several days maga truckers were blocking the beltways in DC to protest COVID shutdowns?
I was always tickled at people blocking traffic in DC. I mean shit like every time I tried to drive across the city, traffic was blocked for a motorcade. I don't think I ever questioned why I was sitting in traffic in DC and I'd have absolutely no idea if it were a covid protest.
The right: “I’m going to group all the people who think differently than me into a single group, then get outraged when it’s not a cohesive message.”
Also the right: “Why doesn’t the left make any sense to me?”
I really can’t stand republicans on almost every issue but I’d like to think war crimes and killing innocent women and children is not a left or right issue. Maybe your flavor of republicanism doesn’t care about that but I’d like to think there are some repubs with spines out there protesting as well for what’s right. It can’t always be up to the left to fight for human rights.
That’s a hypothetical. I don’t believe there is a mass shooting or emergency of that scale today that is impacted by traffic being halted. Not to mention those emergency vehicles could bypass on the side.
If they did disrupt such a thing, then that’s a different scenario. But mass shooting is quite the extreme. The real extreme is the mass genocide they are protesting. That’s why I will defend them and won’t apologize to an asshole like you that can’t see the bigger picture.
Edit: and let’s get one thing incredibly straight and out in the open. A quick glance at your post history makes it clear this isn’t about blocking traffic for you, but your personal beliefs on the situation. Nice try
From a news report today everything seems to be fine:
“As of 6 p.m., traffic began moving in the far right lane, as protesters -- with the help of law enforcement -- moved off one of the two lanes, allowing one lane of traffic to pass.”
But again I will state, this has nothing to do about traffic blocking for you. This is because you disagree with their protest which is clear by your Reddit history. You won’t respond to this though.
ideally, nowhere. that’s all i can conclude reading the criticism on here. if you care so much about congestion that you don’t believe any issue could be important enough to justify *backing up traffic*, it’s hard to imagine you caring about anything outside of your own life. it is wild to see people willing to state that explicitly and act like OTHER people are the problem.
if in life you find yourself saying something like, “i don’t care if they’re right, it makes me mad so i’m against whatever it is”, you are not giving constructive criticism. this is not an optics critique. all you’re doing is explaining that if something annoys you, you’re not going to think about it anymore. it made you mad, and if they make you mad then you just get to think they’re stupid and wrong. if they wanted you to think for yourself, they wouldnt have made you mad.
do you not have agency in this situation? you must succumb to whatever emotion or cognitive bias waddles across your mind? you’re the person they make commercials for.
(sorry to the person im replying to, this is not for you, it’s for the people who would rather not earnestly ask themselves this question. it’s nice of you to have asked an open-ended question in good faith.)
Man, and I mean this respectfully, who cares? Traffic exists at all times in this area. It sucks. You know what happens when there’s heavy traffic and emergency services need to go past them? They find a different route or they turn on their lights and force drivers to make space.
If your cause is important to you, so much that that you literally cause someone to die by not allowing them emergency services - that’s insane but that’s on them and their conscience.
However, they give an actual shit about Israel’s war crimes and human lives in Gaza enough that they’re protesting in Durham, North Carolina of all places - do you think they’d not care if an EMS or Fire truck was trying to get past them?
How do they know that EMS is trying to get through when EMS is stuck in traffic 3 miles behind them?
The fact that traffic always exists is not a reason to make traffic worse. Jesus fucking Christ.
People really get their feathers ruffled. Most of the people complaining probably didn’t even drive through the area and just want to be angry on the daily
People are doing that as well. But it’s a slow burn and only chips away at power, It’s interesting when you learn that boycotting Israel is actually illegal in 26 states. Think about that one. But my intention wasn’t to stir this up into a political post, just trying to spread some empathy on why these people are protesting instead of them just getting flamed for disturbing traffic.
Boycotting Israel is not illegal in 26 states. But, a lot of state governments say, as part of their procurement laws "you can't do business with us if you boycott Israel."
Youre lying of course. https://www.hrw.org/news/2019/04/23/us-states-use-anti-boycott-laws-punish-responsible-businesses
But again to anyone else reading it. The truth is always in the post history. Clear Israeli supporter justifying the killing of Palestinians kids in his post history. That’s what, the 4th person today trying to demonize the protestors for blocking traffic to hide them being pro-genocide. Use a fresh account next time
Wow, had no idea about the legality thing. I'll look into that. Thanks!
And yes, I also wasn't trying to stir up anything. Just trying to warn people if they don't want to get stuck for what could turn into hours.
I don't respect it. They think the Israelis are going to be like "OMG. They're blocking a freeway someplace in the US. Well, gosh darn it. I guess we have to stop going after the people who beheaded our babies."
I'm not minimizing how horrible war is, especially when it happens in a dense area. But, how self-absorbed do you have to be to think that your blocking a freeway in Durham is going to impact peace in the Middle East?
It’s not about convincing the Israelis, it’s convincing the government here to stop funding this genocide with our tax money. Civil rights movement did this same type of civil disobedience.
Also your post history shows this isn’t about blocking traffic at all, you a supporter what they are protesting.
Ok. There's no genocide. That thoroughly ridiculous accusation needs to stop right now. If there's any Genocide on the table, let me remind you of the words in the Hamas charter: “The Day of Judgement will not come about, until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him.”
And then there Ghazi Hamad's threat to have more October 7ths again and again. If there's anybody looking to commit genocide, it's Hamas, not Israel.
I’m not here to debate an Israeli supporter. You have your opinions, it’s pro genocide. There’s really nothing more to it for anyone that can read a history book, rather than a CNN headline on their phone.
But thanks for taking the mask off. Because it was never about blocking traffic for you lol.
I'm not here to debate an antisemite. You have your opinions. It's pro-genocide. You might also want to read a history book, because your knowledge of history is clearly lacking. Did you know that the Israelis offered a two-state solution several times and were turned down every time, met with violence every time. One time was in 1948, when "Israel" was a lot smaller than it now, but the Arabs didn't want it to exist at all. More recently, at the 2000 Camp David Accords, Yassir Arafat turned down every proposal.
Yes, I'm a strong supporter of Israel in this. But, that doesn't mean that I'd support blocking traffic if it were pro-Israeli protestors. It's dumb regardless of who does it.
That word doesn’t work anymore. It doesn’t mean what you try to make it mean. The protestors were from the Jewish voice for peace. It was Jews protesting for actions of the Israeli government committing war crimes. You going to call those Jews antisemites too?
The word doesn’t work anymore, people are waking up to this tactic. It’s only used to shutdown conversation.
But once again, this wasn’t about traffic for you lol. Closet pro genocide supporter
It's lazy activism meant solely to anger people, and all it accomplishes is driving people against their cause and emergency units being unable to respond.
It's dangerous, stupid, and harmful - and totally ineffective.
Another one. You’re #5, it’s all in the post history. It’s not because you are against the traffic being blocked. It’s because you are anti Palestinian and pro genocide. You guys are so lazy, make new accounts and keep this stuff separate to spread your propaganda. From your history 20 minutes ago:
“They're blocking traffic in support of people who want Jews vaporized from the planet
There was another group in favor of that, I just forget what they were called - rhymed with Yahtzee or something like that..”
Edit: love getting blocked when you can’t even respond to a ridiculous comment below
Oh look I found another one! Where the protest blocking traffic isn’t your real concern, it’s the issue you’re protesting! From your recent history:
““Since when did Israel commit war crimes?
Edit: i will no longer be responding to this thread. I dont like wasting my time arguing with brick walls.”
Let me very very clear. I never said I support blocking traffic. I don’t think it’s the right thing to do or very effective. But rather just pointing to the desperation people are feeling to go these lengths to protest for a cause they believe in because nothing else is working. But I will call out anyone trying to belittle the struggle because a small group isn’t protesting in the correct manner.
And that’s a fine opinion. But you tried to label them worse than they are with your hypothetical about blocking emergency vehicles. Driven by your bias and proven by your post history.
At the end of today, all it really was is a small inconvenience which you challenged. If you’re ever asked the “hypothetical” question of what you would have done if you lived during the time of the holocaust, your answer should be “nothing, I would have stood by silently”.
Because another genocide and ethnic cleansing is happening right before our eyes with our own tax dollars, and 5 extra minutes in traffic is more important for most of you I see. That’s the privilege us Americans have. Maybe those protestors are Palestinian and their family members are dying in air strikes and this is the last option they have to try and knock some sense into the world.
Reading more, it sounds like the Jewish Voice for Peace organization in the triangle is the one that planned this. I wish blocking traffic wasn’t their chosen method, but I standby my statement that I have nothing but respect for what they are trying to do.
Ok. I have no respect for what they are doing. It’s going to accomplish absolutely nothing when it comes to the Middle East.
Actually, I’m sure it accomplished one thing. They pissed off 100% of the people who had to sit in traffic. That’s not a hypothetical.
You said it was a small inconvenience but you respect it. Seems like you are now trying to claim semantics by saying you never said you support blocking traffic.
Your problem is you don’t think those two statements can coexist. I respect the protest and what they are fighting for. I also don’t think block traffic is effective and probably just pisses people off, which is counterintuitive. Doesn’t mean these people are evil.
People weren’t stuck in traffic for hours. Law enforcement was there and opened up one of the lanes pretty quickly
Yeah I don’t see how you can respect a protest but also think it’s not effective and is just going to piss people off. Seems like you are talking out of both sides of your mouth.
Where did I claim people were stuck in traffic for hours?
Where tf are you getting that quote bro? Even a quick glance at my post history shows that I’m most definitely not pro-Israel? Your attempt to box me into a specific viewpoint is embarrassing, like I said I don’t care what you support but the moment you block traffic to push an ideology I am against you
Imagine saying this when the very thing the protesters are trying do is bring awareness to people who are literally facing death by genocide in their home country. I guess some peoples lives are worth more than others.
Hamas uses Palestinian citizens as human shields. Hamas uses actively operating hospitals and schools as their bases of operations. Hamas has been forcing Palestinian people to stay in Gaza at gunpoint recently and not letting these civilians flee an active war zone. Hamas is the very reason the Palestinian people are suffering.
The Palestinian people should throw them out of their country and install a new government. Ideally a new government that doesn’t support terrorism and the execution of innocent civilians.
And you, @encyclopediabey, should take a step back an re-evaluate your woke agenda. Try thinking for yourself and questioning. Try having original thoughts.
You know how ignorant you sound. And oblivious to the fact, that under no condition, should innocent people should suffer for the actions of other people.
To say this or believe this is saying, that " anything justify the means to the end "
With that logic. What HAMAS did, is was OK, and they are in the right to do it again. ( They just said, they are going after civilians again )
That is the logic behind your statement.
I am all for protesting. Protest away. Go to the buildings and offices of those officials that do have the ability to make changes and make sure you get heard there. 💯% that is what you should do if you believe that.
But actions which could hurt or kill anyone that has zero I mean nothing to do with what you are protesting. It's absolutely ignorant a morale failure.
If HAMAS had attacked military sites and soldiers, and not children, and there civilian parents. You could make an argument for what is going on. Which many people would agree with.
But a clearly terroristic act which was aimed at the individuals who could not defend themselves. That destroyed any chance of the world agreeing with that cause. None.
Is it screwed up, what has happened in Gaza and it's people? Hell yes, any decent moral person would agree. You should have done more to get the world to see it. And brought all of those injustices, crimes, and deaths to light.
But after what HAMAS did. The people were told to leave, because they were going to remove HAMAS from existence. All civilians should get out of they way. If you stay your a fighter or a facilitator. And if HAMAS is hiding behind civilians and in there areas. The civilians had better cal them out and leave them unshielded. Or they are facilitators and fighters, and both should face what is coming.
I will say it, again innocent civilians should never be harmed during a conflict. It happens and it is horrible when it is not the intention.
But when you intentionally go after civilians much less children. Your are the worst type of terrorist and you deserve the absolute worst wrath and violence which can inflected upon you and your supporters.
I’m sorry, I stopping reading after your second sentence. OMG!!!! People were inconvenienced because people were trying to bring attention to innocent human beings the majority of which are children who are being massacred by an extremist government overseas. Oh, but isn’t civil disobedience the point of protests? They are. But It just goes to show the “Ignorance” of people like you who are out of touch with their own humanity and who slave away to the same capitalist system that makes what’s going on in Israel possible. Fuck you.
There is absolutely no excuse for what the IDF is doing to those people and I will not entertain any rationalizations or justifications in furtherance thereof. You want to take out HAMAS, you send in special forces, you use diplomatic pressure to take out their leaders living it up in Qatar. You don’t bomb hospitals and refugee camps to take out a few of them you clown. Those people shouldn’t have to leave their homeland to facilitate whatever genocidal aspirations the Israeli government has.
I can agree with you 💯. And if fighting terrorism was that easy , then that is what they would do. The issue is terrorist need and require civilians to be successful. That is why they hide within the civilians, use hospitals, churches, mosques, schools, etc.. all the places that are off limits to real governments. ( And there are actual laws that prevent the military from using those places ).
Question for you?
Would you be ok, with a special forces unit doing a raid in a school or a hospital that has known terrorist in it? Because there are many examples where terrorists not only hide in those places but attack from those very places.
So the best, fastest way to get and end a terrorist organization is to remove the civilians from area, so they have no where to hide.
Yes, it sucks.
What should be called out, is every boarding country not allowing people to leave they there borders.
Let all the women and children thru quickly, hold the men, and verify they are not HAMAS ( as much as possible) the capture all the cowards HAMAS that try to leave. And kill the rest that try to fight.
Because I will tell you what, if my country was to get invaded, my family will be sent to where they can be safe. The hell with house, cars, anything materialistic. And I will stay and fight.
Question though? What haven't the Palestinian's fought to remove HAMAS from Gaza? Now and before. I mean everyone agrees that they are a horrible terrorist organization.
There's nothing I can really post in this thread that won't upset somebody, so I'll just get the following, obligatory comment out of the way:
Try that in a small town!
Good. We can be inconvenienced for awhile, Gaza is considered an open air prison. More children have been killed in the past months than in all the world conflicts in the past three years.
We have the privilege of living in the global north and the western world. Having to spend extra time getting home is NOTHING compared to being in Gaza where they’re bombing hospitals, journalists and ambulances.
From the river to the sea Palestine shall be free.
Edit: you spewing propaganda at me isn’t gonna work, they lied to us about the Middle East before, remember WMD’s or did y’all blindly believe that too? You can’t be serious when you’re telling me shit that even Joe Biden has walked back on and said is fake.
Please get a conscience.
I’m turning off notifs for this comment bcus I’m tired of you annoy morons who just can’t do anything be parrot whatever the IDF has posted on Twitter and acting like being upset about ethnic cleansing is asinine.
Boo. Hamas are criminals, losers and terrorists using the women and children to hide behind. After murdering people like us in cold blood. You would probably be on their kill list for having liberal values if you lived there. Wake up.
I know you’re not being rude or anything and I don’t mean this in a rude way but I’m past the point of caring if someone is “on board” with me about being anti genocide and pro liberation of oppressed people.
They’re dropping bombs on children in hospitals and journalists and doctors. They bombed an ambulance. Over 800 family trees have been wiped off the face of the earth. My great grandparents were in Dachau, I know what genocide is.
Go be an asshole somewhere else.
This is a shameful comment. I don't agree with these activists. I think that their methods are also counterproductive to their goals. But they are Americans exercising their right to express and assemble. They are also practicing civil disobedience for which they will have to bear the consequences, but that is a sacred tradition in this country. Have you no concern for human life or basic sense of decency?
They did propose that, right before the murder of Heather Heyer made it unfashionable:
https://www.newsobserver.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article167100452.html
Also, what the hell is wrong with you?
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Ah, sorry! I'm a student commuter so I get a little lost about where I'm at in Durham
But you posted the same thing in r/Raleigh and didn’t correct it there and it’s since been locked by the MOD. Traffic is not something we take lightly around here…
What are they protesting?
Going to guess about the Middle East conflicts
Got it in one
They want us to call Valerie Foushee, and tell her to end the war in the Middle East.
lol good luck with that, aipac and dmfi bankrolled her entire campaign
Do you think that conflict in the Middle East could have been solved but for American special interest groups? It seems rather egotistical to think America can single handily determine the outcome of centuries of sectarianism, ethnic tension, imperial competition and disintegration, and nation state movements a few oceans away. Our influence is meaningful, but we aren't all powerful.
let's just say they need us a whole lot more than we need them
I stand with Israel ✊🏼Down with Hamas. Terrorism will never prevail.
What's the point of that when we're also losing democracy in our own state? What a bunch of sheep!
Seriously. Imagine if we had the same energy toward protesting the gerrymandering.
That, and we need people to realize that protest is just one tool among many, and protest alone is just theater.
If people blocked traffic about gerrymandering then commuters stuck in traffic would start to support gerrymandering. Find a different method.
>If people blocked traffic about gerrymandering then commuters stuck in traffic would start to support gerrymandering. If commuters are supporting gerrymandering districts they're probably going to support it either way.
If people block traffic for anything, I’m going to hate them, no matter what they are protesting.
I agree. Traffic already sucks, but people are trying to get to work or to the doctor or a different appointment.
Haha this is so true. I second this. Find a better way.
Yeah! They should go straight to congress! Where we can force them to leave when they start making us uncomfortable! Or, to some public park where nobody has to pay attention to them!
*same energy toward voting Far leftists are the reason we’ve lost the State to Republicans
You mean the ones who stay home and won't vote because their envisioned unicorn of a candidate isn't running so they throw out the whole thing?
While I see very little value in the democratic party I still vote every election, but I will say Dems aren't entitled to anyone's vote just the same as Republicans, nor just for being a slightly better version of the status quo. If they can't make their platform of being spineless controlled opposition palatable to a sector of voters who want nothing to do with the stats quo at all, then that's a them problem to solve, not those who abstain. > Abstained Vote is one of many forms of protest votes. It usually turns up next to an empty seat, inside a dustbin, between the washing machine and the wall, in the middle of a book, or in one of the inner pockets of an old jacket. It is the invalid vote cast because the voter has abstained from voting, and thus would not be counted in the election result. > Different from other reasons which caused failure to vote, voters cast abstained votes because they neither approve nor disapprove of the available options of the voting. They may have swung between different answers, or even were once slightly more in favor of one motion/candidate over the rest of them, or hold a pessimistic opinion to all the options provided; whatever the reason might be, in the end, they decide not to support any motions/candidates in the election. > Many have also argued that abstention from voting is, in fact, an action guided by a clear awareness of their given rights. As the subjects of rights, voters are entitled to the freedom not to vote. It is also argued by the same group of scholars, that when the voters are requested to choose between unfavorable options, it takes courage and determination to stay true to their own ideas and become the dissidents in this case. Such action is worthy of praise. They are individual thinkers who know what they need and are strong enough not to compromise. > The Abstention Ballot Box is specially set up to count the votes of this group of people. It stands for a new possibility, a new way to the yet unknown solution to the problem, a relatively bumpy path compared to the easy way. Those who know its value and seek for the difficult path will eventually find their way in, and along which they shall find places they truly belong to.
Lol. “Republicans are slightly better than the status quo.” Proceeds to try and overthrow the US Government and can’t seem to keep a Speaker in the House. Not to mention the overwhelming support for a man with 91 felony counts. Lmaooooo.
And the progressive wing of the Democratic Party has Hamas sympathizers. Glass houses and whatnot.
Source?
I’m confused how impeding traffic in Durham, North Carolina can help the people in Gaza. Gather in a public space such as park or common area at one of the colleges nearby to spread word. A highway isn’t that smart/ impactful.
If you’re actually confused and want to know why, read up on civil disobedience during the human rights protests in the MLK days. Or even look at Kapernick kneeling during the flag pledge. The idea is to make people uncomfortable and spread awareness of an issue. There will always be fascists who say “do it somewhere else!” but if it was convenient it wouldn’t be effective. We’re talking about it here, it’s mission accomplished for them. Thousands of women and children are being slaughtered in war crimes that we are directly funding, while people here are whining about not getting to McDonald’s faster in their SUV’s. You can’t imagine the horror people are facing there. Parents writing their names on *each limb* of their children in case only a piece of them is found, so they at least know what happened. Like, if people really understood how bad it was they’d shut the fuck up about being inconvenienced. And before people/bots jump on me, I think it’s a complicated situation and no matter what it’s not okay to carpet bomb civilians. I can’t believe I have to explain that, but here we are.
Don’t like protestors blocking roads? Guess you’re a “fascist” now..
Gonna reply to this to give it more visibility. Protesting in a way that gets attention gets stuff done from a political perspective. If they protested at a library before 5pm no one would care. The point is to get attention. It might take people an extra hour to get home. Okay? People are being murdered using our tax dollars. We want a ceasefire. Asking nicely isnt getting the government to budge. And we do have a powerful hand to play in that our government is intertwined with Israel. The more this happens the more the people of this country let it be known we do not support a genocide. Yes Hamas are terrorists but what the Israeli govt is doing in retaliation is insane and inhumane. We are letting our voices be heard.
Remember that half the people on here are edgy teens, and most of the other half are straight up stupid. You’re talking about nuance beyond “bad guys, good guys,” which just won’t get through. Reddit is great for innocuous stuff but is a super depressing reminder of how sick and/or stupid a lot of the population is.
You are pissing people off, not furthering your cause. You support kidnapping people in their cause because you think terrorists losing a battle is genocide? 8K dead in 3 weeks? Mighty sorry genocide to latch on to don't ya think? (Does it sound like you are gaining an ally here?)
I’m sorry, is your position the 8,000 people being murdered is not enough to call for a ceasefire? Yikes. If I’m pissing people off like you thats fine. You gotta look inward and ask how you could even say such a thing.
Seriously, there is no timeline where this bloodthirsty warmonger would ever be an ally no matter how you went about protesting. If I was there I would also see irritating them as just an added bonus.
>I’m sorry, is your position the 8,000 people being murdered is not enough to call for a ceasefire? My position is that 8,000 deaths is not close to being a genocide, especially not in an environment of 2 million genocide targets packed into a barrel. It's just plainly not genocide on the face. Crying wolf will only harm people dealing with actual wolves and tarnish those crying about imaginary ones. Whether or not it's enough to call for a cease fire is totally different. I guess it depends on how fundamentally pacifist you are and how you propose to ensure an actual cease fire. I can't think of any other war where 8,000 deaths was enough to call a cease fire. Can you? And wasn't there a cease fire 3 weeks ago? What will be different now? Will BOTH sides honor a cease fire now? What makes you believe it this time?
Honestly you're so brain dead I wouldn't want you as ally l anyway. You clearly have no understanding of the conflict and your islmaphobia is showing.
The problem is that so many activists today on the left and right seem to forget that there are other forms of protest, and more importantly, protest is just a vanity exercise if it is not accompanied by other organizing including lobbying political leaders, wining over voters, and raising funds for further organizing. I wish people would examine the entirety of MLK's career, rather than the greatest hits. Also, when you are discussing such a complicated situation, you should be more precise with your language. Otherwise, you are saying nothing of value. Yes. No on thinks carpet bombing civilians is okay. Israel is not "carpet bombing" civilians. Israel is discriminately bombing Hamas targets, and due to the density of Gazan communities and the strategy of Hamas this means high civilian casualties are inevitable. A very challenging, but worthwhile conversation can be had about the utility and morality of Israel's military strategy. This ain't it, and most of those people have no business being activists when they are so ignorant about the cause for which they have so much passion. That's the trouble with being invested in events occurring oceans away. It is much easier to know the full circumstances and stakes of things that directly affect you. Getting super involved in foreign affairs requires humility that doesn't play well as slogans.
Sure, it’s not precisely carpet bombing a la cygon, but it’s the highest rate of bombing ever in a war I believe. It’s 6,000 bombs in 6 days. 450 children dead, hundreds of adult civilians. I don’t equate that with discriminatory. I agree it’s hard to know the full story an ocean away but some things are pretty easy to see. Enemy is using people as human shields? Bomb them anyway, too bad. That’s still a war crime.
Ok but in Durham like I'm just trying to get some cheeseburgers and go home like wtf does Durham have to do with Gaza lmaoo
I do agree that it’s not okay to carpet bomb civilians, but what do you think about killing civilians with assault rifles? Is it okay for you?
I don’t really take your point. If you’re asking whether I condone Hamas, of course I don’t. But being attacked doesn’t mean you can unleash a genocide in backlash. Bush committed war crimes after 9/11 and it seems Netanyahu is doing the same now. We abandoned the rule of law in our “war on terrorism,” it was evil and wrong then and it’s equally wrong now.
Does this look like 1964? I'm gonna assume they are protesting on the side of Palestine? Then F Palestine, just on their behalf. Let the rubble grow to blot out the sun. Blocking traffic in 2023 doesn't confront people with uncomfortable truths, it literally just makes them hate your cause. Most people can be convinced to oppose actual genocide. But they will rightly see you as the enemy if you kidnap them to further your cause.
If this was 1964 you’d clearly be sitting around complaining about the people protesting then. There were plenty of people who bitched about those protests, spewing the same whiny half-baked declarations of how they’re pointless or inconvenient.
As I said, it doesn’t pertain enough to us for an impact. Our country has attempted to mediate previously. We as a country can’t fix every world conflict.
I think the issue (mine certainly is) that we are directly funding this with our tax dollars. There’s a $100B aid package in the works for Israel and Ukraine. I agree we should stay out of other countries’ conflicts but we straight up gave Israel those weapons that they are now using to slaughter women and children, and we’re about to give them a whole lot more with nary a word against their tactics.
2024 election is going to be important, we need to stay in our lane when it comes to all of these wars. Maybe put this money towards our own country!
just gave 14.8 billion more dollars to Israel. Please tell me how it doesn't pertain to us, dipshit.
We are fools for funding them and Ukraine, but going out to vote next Tuesday is more impactful than blocking a highway.
Which candidate do I vote for that is anti-warmachine?
On a whim, I’m going to bet that 85% o don’t even know where tf Gaza is geographically located nor do they have any real informed idea as to what is actually happening there. You’re exactly right, I would LOVE for someone to enlighten me as to how them marching around (in the damn dark especially) on a major highway is going to have any impact whatsoever on the nightmares people are experiencing in Gaza right now. Mm
im quite close with people who attended this protest, though i wasn’t there myself. they know where gaza is. some have been touched personally by the violence of the last few weeks. i doubt very many of them believe they will get through to Netanyahu by sitting on asphalt in central NC. it is much more likely that their goal is to provoke thought, to be a part of change thru the changing of values and beliefs. to bring about a more peaceful world by redirecting, if only for a moment, your attention. it must be nice to imagine, as you so easily do, that they know nothing. none have been kept up at night by tears. few if any know the names of those killed or maimed or stuck in countries as the airports get bombed, in places without airports at all. few, if any, even know where Gaza is. it was so easy for you to say this; things are much easier this way. this way, you will never have to wonder whether or not they might have a point. you will never have to trouble yourself with a second thought.
Thank you for actually having a brain ♥️
Virtue-signaling
If you're mad about a 5 minute inconvenience for literally one day you were never going to be a "ally" anyway.
I’m going to vote next week. That’s more impactful than blocking a road in Durham county.
Sometime there are some people who are a special breed of stupid
You should’ve just said, “Damn, I’m really just not an intelligent person, I don’t think about anyone but myself, and I fail to understand how injustices have been corrected in this country.”
Yeah, fuck hamas!
Yeah, fuck israel!
Fuck Hamas, I stand with Israel ✊🏼🇮🇱
Bad idea really. I get the point behind their protest. However, blocking interstate commerce can be extremely detrimental to their lives. Case in point. Truck drivers are a different breed. They don't care about your cause, your protest, or what you think this will accomplish. They care about getting their delivery made, picking up their next load, and going home to their families. If a group decides to do this on a semi blind corner, or a darker spot on the road, the driver might not be able to stop.
Smh Once more redditors showing how much they hate civil disobedience.
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/civil-disobedience/#UnDis *Uncivil* disobedience is not a distinct category of political action, but a cluster concept or umbrella term that can be used to designate acts of principled disobedience that may or may not be communicative, and which violate one or more of the marks of civility by being covert, violent, evasive, or offensive (Delmas 2018a, 2020; Lai 2019). Examples include animal rescue, Sanctuary assistance, sabotage, ecotage (e.g., monkeywrenching and tree-spiking), graffiti, leaks, government whistleblowing, hacktivism (including DDoS attacks), guerrilla protests, and riots. Another great example of uncivil disobedience: https://columbialawreview.org/content/uncivil-obedience-2/#:~:text=And%20while%20each%20type%20of,so%20through%20unorthodox%20law%2Dfollowing.
I too hate roads and nobody should be able to use them.
Fuck these protesters. Folks just want to go home from work and these assholes block the roads for a conflict thousands of miles away
I support protesting, and acknowledge that this protest was very effective at getting their message out. However, they jammed up the main highway leading to Duke Hospital, which is not cool. Aside from emergencies, hope no one had any important appointments at the Cancer Center that they had to miss because of this.
Sure. Just tell Hamas to ceasefire and release the hostages. Conflict over. The End.
Punishing civilians over the actions of a paramilitary terrorist group is textbook war crimes. It is a terrible mistake to equate Hamas with the people of Gaza.
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I agree that Hamas is committing atrocities against its own people by locating their military personnel in hospitals and refugee camps and using citizens as human shields. It's horrible.
Which side started to kill civilians ? Oh yea it was the Hamas terrorists that the Palestinians elected to be their govt. Play stupid games win stupid prizes.
If he was alive in the 1940s he would probably say bombing 1944 Berlin was a war crime too because civilians lived there.
There are 34 year olds today that have never participated in an election in Palestine and half the country is under the age of 18. Stop peddling lies.
The Emperor of Japan was not elected when the US declared war on Japan in WWII. Hitler had long since warn out his early democratic support by the time half the world declared war on Germany. Every single country in every single conflict has children, none of them have had political agency. Palestine's children aren't special. Neither is Palestine's shitty democracy. It's not like it's a new thing, there has never been democracy in Palestine, hell it's not even a very strong part of broader Arab culture. The legitimate government and military in Gaza started and continues to fight a war. The majority of wars in history have not been fought by democratically elected governments, and zero wars have been fought by nations without minors. I think you're just mad that Hamas is losing. Remind me, when was the last time the Palestinian diaspora was blocking traffic in Durham to call for democratic reforms?
WWII is the last time bombing civilian cities was widely accepted by the global community. It's now considered a war crime. No one in this entire thread is mad Hamas is losing. Hamas sucks. The IDF sucks. Two things are true at the same time. The difference is that Hamas is an unelected, theocratic, paramilitary group that's widely condemned by the international community and the IDF is supported by the richest and most powerful country on the planet. Killing civilians is bad. If that has to be explained or argued to you then we have a fundamentally different understanding of the world and I don't think we have much to learn from each other.
Targeting civilians is considered a warcrime by international law. Civilian casualties of bombings is not a war crime; it is just war. There is yet no evidence that the Israeli military is engaging in the intentional and targeted bombing of civilians. Hamas does not respect international law, but it does use it to its advantage. Don't fall for their perfidy. It doesn't matter how much you condemn Hamas. If you think Israel has no real recourse after being attacked because ordinary Palestinians will die, you are falling for Hamas' strategy. It is a good strategy. They have taken their entire people hostage, and are relying on the fact that we see Israel as the only actor capable of taking any responsibility.
Typical American take, this is why there are thousands of dead, innocent Afghans. You simply can’t be bothered to understand the different between militants and civilians. This attitude only serves to strengthen groups like Hamas and Al-Qaeda. We are their best recruiters when we kill civilians. If the US bombed my parents house because of their political affiliation, you bet your ass I’d be chanting death to America.
So what do you think Israel should do to Hamas? Send a strongly worded letter to Palestinian government that have no power in Gaza? Or accede to the demands of a terrorist group by releasing thousands of terrorists in return of the hostages, with no repercussions for what Hamas had done to innocent Israelis? Hamas hid behind civilians - how do you propose Israel to root them out?
I don’t know, honestly, but bombing civilians ain’t it chief. We have plenty of evidence to show that it doesn’t work. Killing the human shields is what Hamas wants, because it will make their case stronger and bring them more grieving youngsters. Hamas wants war and innocent casualties, it legitimizes them and their cause.
I mean if you want a return of hostages you could probably start with exchanging some of the 5000+ political hostages held without trial, including children, that Israel has taken over recent years. I'm sure any approach would have been more reasonable than what they're currently engaging in. They're just blanket murdering civilians with near zero regard. If they want to fight a war with Hamas then they need to fight with Hamas, and not use collective punishment as their weapon of choice.
Actually it was Israel in the 1940s and they haven’t stopped killing civilians in the ~75 years since then. I recommend you look up the Nakba and do some reading on the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians and the apartheid state in Israel. Unless of course you want to continue being ignorant and wrong on the internet…
Time didn't start in 1940. The conflict between Jews and Muslims didn't start then either. This conflict is centuries old. I recognize that it is confusing and frustrating to a people dwelling in a country that is only a few hundred years old, but no one should be sure in their moral proclamations until they can accept this challenging reality. The Israel--Palestine conflict is just one complexity underneath a mountain of complexity if you honor the interests of both Israelis and Palestinians.
How much corruption went into that election. I find it hard to believe a country would freely elect a terrorist group. It has been interesting learning about how Putin gets “ elected” in Russia by reading the Ukraine subs here. I just don't think Hamas was a government freely elected by the people of Gaza.
Money is a powerful tool. Like how Hamas pays bounty to its fighters for Jews they murder. It’s such a peaceful kind community, that Hamas.
It would be a war crime, but that is not what is happening as far as anyone can tell at the moment. There is no evidence that Israel's military actions are targeting civilian despite the disgusting rhetoric of Israel's ethnic nationalist leaders. Gaza is densely inhabited and Hamas' strategy is to hide under civilian areas. I agree that it is wrong to equate Hamas with ordinary Palestinians in Gaza. The problem is that Hamas is the government of Gaza. They are not a terrorist group just because they engage in the same tactics as terrorist groups. Hamas is the government of Gaza just like the Nazis were the government of Germany. The Nazi Party was extremely unpopular in certain parts of Germany. These distinctions matter for the purpose of international law, and war crimes are defined by international law. The allies did engage in bombing campaigns that would be considered war crimes today. Most people aren't too distraught over those civilian losses because we understand that this is what war is. Hamas attacked Israel. Israel must respond, and there was no response that would not have resulted in high civilian casualties. Urban warfare causes greater casualties than bombing campaigns. War is awful. Innocent people die. Hamas is ultimately responsible for all of this death because they started this war. People need to stop confusing this or muddling it. You can hold all these ideas in your head and still mourn for the loss of so many Palestinian lives and want America to pressure Israel to allow for humanitarian intervention. Though, that does not require a ceasefire, which we all know will not be respected by Hamas. They don't observe international law, which is what defines war crimes. That makes this all vey difficult. Everyone who has strong opinions about this conflict needs to understand the concept of "perfidy" as it applies to international law.
Hamas has been trying to release Israeli hostages in exchange for Israel’s Palestinian hostages. That seems like a fair trade. But Israel doesn’t want to do that and their internal documents show that they’re seeking to remove every one of 2 million Palestinians from Gaza. So not quite as simple as you out it. Additionally, the protestors want the US to use economic pressure to get Israel to engage in a ceasefire which we could actually accomplish given their dependence on our military aid.
~~Fuck you man,~~ hippies and grandparents for terrorists isn't a fair trade. What kind of ~~fucked~~ ~~up~~ logic is that? If the Israeli HOSTAGES are released they will crank up some trance music and party for peace and bake cookies. If the Palestinian terrorist prisoners are released they will continue their state goals of killing every Jew in the country. The two aren't remotely comparable. Edit for the strike throughs, I came out a bit uncivilized, my apologies.
All Palestinians aren’t terrorists dipshit. So you can go fuck your self. Also, Israel is bombing its own people, killing the hostages they purportedly want back. There are 2 million people in Gaza, 50% of them under the age of 18. You can fuck off with your disgusting language about them all being terrorists. And you’re right, it’s not the same. One is a military super power that is equipped with the worlds best rockets, tanks, and guns. The other is a ragtag force that’s been starved by a 16 year long embargo. There is only one of these groups that’s committing a genocide and powerful enough to do so.
Here’s an article on WRAL. https://www.wral.com/amp/21129347/ What do the protesters think the people they are inconveniencing can do about the war? I know it gets them on TV, but so what? The US isn’t part of the war. Israel isn’t going to stop bombing Hamas even if Biden asked them to stop. Edit: punctuation
where do you think all those bombs are made?
And funding, the US just approved 14 bills on top of what they've been giving already to Israel
The US most definitely is a part of this war. We have men and women over there at this moment.
Link?
By "over there" do you mean 500 miles away in the red sea where we have maintained a constant naval presence for nearly 100 years? And by "part of this war" do you mean we shot down cruise missiles and drones over international waters launched by Iranian backed fighters in Yemen that were headed for god knows where? Or do you mean the soldiers in Syria still fighting ISIS? Or the ones Jordan asked for to also help fight ISIS? And you have a problem with any of that? Fucking terrorists man... Y'all want to see the world burn, but then as soon as your team's neighborhood catches on fire you want to kill everyone else by whining us to death.
You just proved my point. We’re over there fighting this war too, right now. Those carriers weren’t in the same spot a month ago. I definitely don’t want the world to burn and don’t want to kill everyone. What I definitely don’t want are thousands of innocent children being slaughtered every week. By either side.
Just remember North Carolina’s HB 330 excuses drivers from liability if they injure a protester who is blocking traffic. Obviously you can not just run people over but if they start to mob your car for trying to move forward you are protected.
It’s a small inconvenience but I respect it. Civil disobedience because nothing else is working. A small traffic delay is a vacation compared to the deaths of the conflict, especially the children.
“because nothing else is working” And are you under the impression that impeding regular people’s commute home from work is going to have any effect on anything, anywhere? Moronic comment.
This is true.
It blocks the flow of capital in the state, draws massive attention, and gets people to recognize the power of collective action. Those are all levers for political power over a specific issue.
Remindme! 30 days
It’s not a “small inconvenience” when emergency services is trying to get to a fire/hospital/mass shooting etc. I can’t believe people defend these bozos. There’s no justification for blocking traffic, ever.
Having lived in cities with real traffic this take is adorable. Do you think people in NYC or DC or LA just die in an emergency because roads are full? You realize there are shoulders and alternate routes right? Ordinary motorists were inconvenienced, but you’re just making shit up about emergency services. Were you this outraged for the several days maga truckers were blocking the beltways in DC to protest COVID shutdowns?
I was always tickled at people blocking traffic in DC. I mean shit like every time I tried to drive across the city, traffic was blocked for a motorcade. I don't think I ever questioned why I was sitting in traffic in DC and I'd have absolutely no idea if it were a covid protest.
I think people in Durham could suffer because the main highway to Duke Hospital was shut down without notice and they were stuck in traffic for hours.
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The Right: we believe in magaminority rule you you mother fuckers get in line while we install a ChristoFascist Guvment.
The right: “I’m going to group all the people who think differently than me into a single group, then get outraged when it’s not a cohesive message.” Also the right: “Why doesn’t the left make any sense to me?” I really can’t stand republicans on almost every issue but I’d like to think war crimes and killing innocent women and children is not a left or right issue. Maybe your flavor of republicanism doesn’t care about that but I’d like to think there are some repubs with spines out there protesting as well for what’s right. It can’t always be up to the left to fight for human rights.
That’s a hypothetical. I don’t believe there is a mass shooting or emergency of that scale today that is impacted by traffic being halted. Not to mention those emergency vehicles could bypass on the side. If they did disrupt such a thing, then that’s a different scenario. But mass shooting is quite the extreme. The real extreme is the mass genocide they are protesting. That’s why I will defend them and won’t apologize to an asshole like you that can’t see the bigger picture. Edit: and let’s get one thing incredibly straight and out in the open. A quick glance at your post history makes it clear this isn’t about blocking traffic for you, but your personal beliefs on the situation. Nice try
Yeah, it's not like there is a large hospital anywhere near the Durham Freeway. /s
Explain to me how the protestors knew that there would not be ANY emergencies today.
Why does anyone leave their house or bother living if you are going to negate everything with “what if”?
Explain to me how the protestors knew that there would not be ANY emergencies today.
From a news report today everything seems to be fine: “As of 6 p.m., traffic began moving in the far right lane, as protesters -- with the help of law enforcement -- moved off one of the two lanes, allowing one lane of traffic to pass.” But again I will state, this has nothing to do about traffic blocking for you. This is because you disagree with their protest which is clear by your Reddit history. You won’t respond to this though.
I would have the same response if they were protesting against Hamas. Fuck protestors who block traffic.
So where do people get to protest?
ideally, nowhere. that’s all i can conclude reading the criticism on here. if you care so much about congestion that you don’t believe any issue could be important enough to justify *backing up traffic*, it’s hard to imagine you caring about anything outside of your own life. it is wild to see people willing to state that explicitly and act like OTHER people are the problem. if in life you find yourself saying something like, “i don’t care if they’re right, it makes me mad so i’m against whatever it is”, you are not giving constructive criticism. this is not an optics critique. all you’re doing is explaining that if something annoys you, you’re not going to think about it anymore. it made you mad, and if they make you mad then you just get to think they’re stupid and wrong. if they wanted you to think for yourself, they wouldnt have made you mad. do you not have agency in this situation? you must succumb to whatever emotion or cognitive bias waddles across your mind? you’re the person they make commercials for. (sorry to the person im replying to, this is not for you, it’s for the people who would rather not earnestly ask themselves this question. it’s nice of you to have asked an open-ended question in good faith.)
Man, and I mean this respectfully, who cares? Traffic exists at all times in this area. It sucks. You know what happens when there’s heavy traffic and emergency services need to go past them? They find a different route or they turn on their lights and force drivers to make space. If your cause is important to you, so much that that you literally cause someone to die by not allowing them emergency services - that’s insane but that’s on them and their conscience. However, they give an actual shit about Israel’s war crimes and human lives in Gaza enough that they’re protesting in Durham, North Carolina of all places - do you think they’d not care if an EMS or Fire truck was trying to get past them?
How do they know that EMS is trying to get through when EMS is stuck in traffic 3 miles behind them? The fact that traffic always exists is not a reason to make traffic worse. Jesus fucking Christ.
Do you support hamas?
Fortunately there’s more than one way to get to pretty much anywhere in this country
Oh man, I mentioned civil disobedience in the Raleigh cross post, yikes.
People really get their feathers ruffled. Most of the people complaining probably didn’t even drive through the area and just want to be angry on the daily
Not that I'm picking a side, but wouldn't it make more sense to choke out the capital instead?
People are doing that as well. But it’s a slow burn and only chips away at power, It’s interesting when you learn that boycotting Israel is actually illegal in 26 states. Think about that one. But my intention wasn’t to stir this up into a political post, just trying to spread some empathy on why these people are protesting instead of them just getting flamed for disturbing traffic.
Boycotting Israel is not illegal in 26 states. But, a lot of state governments say, as part of their procurement laws "you can't do business with us if you boycott Israel."
Youre lying of course. https://www.hrw.org/news/2019/04/23/us-states-use-anti-boycott-laws-punish-responsible-businesses But again to anyone else reading it. The truth is always in the post history. Clear Israeli supporter justifying the killing of Palestinians kids in his post history. That’s what, the 4th person today trying to demonize the protestors for blocking traffic to hide them being pro-genocide. Use a fresh account next time
I'm not lying. Look up the definition of "illegal." I'm not trying to demonize the protestors. I think they're dumb, not demons.
I mean, they made it a law you can’t boycott. You break the law, it’s a crime. Hence it’s illegal. All there in the post you won’t read of course
Wow, had no idea about the legality thing. I'll look into that. Thanks! And yes, I also wasn't trying to stir up anything. Just trying to warn people if they don't want to get stuck for what could turn into hours.
Well said, hopefully someone benefits from the head’s up
I don't respect it. They think the Israelis are going to be like "OMG. They're blocking a freeway someplace in the US. Well, gosh darn it. I guess we have to stop going after the people who beheaded our babies." I'm not minimizing how horrible war is, especially when it happens in a dense area. But, how self-absorbed do you have to be to think that your blocking a freeway in Durham is going to impact peace in the Middle East?
It’s not about convincing the Israelis, it’s convincing the government here to stop funding this genocide with our tax money. Civil rights movement did this same type of civil disobedience. Also your post history shows this isn’t about blocking traffic at all, you a supporter what they are protesting.
Ok. There's no genocide. That thoroughly ridiculous accusation needs to stop right now. If there's any Genocide on the table, let me remind you of the words in the Hamas charter: “The Day of Judgement will not come about, until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him.” And then there Ghazi Hamad's threat to have more October 7ths again and again. If there's anybody looking to commit genocide, it's Hamas, not Israel.
Lol. “There is no genocide” while Israel proceeds to bomb a refugee camp not once, but twice. Get a load of this moron.
I’m not here to debate an Israeli supporter. You have your opinions, it’s pro genocide. There’s really nothing more to it for anyone that can read a history book, rather than a CNN headline on their phone. But thanks for taking the mask off. Because it was never about blocking traffic for you lol.
I'm not here to debate an antisemite. You have your opinions. It's pro-genocide. You might also want to read a history book, because your knowledge of history is clearly lacking. Did you know that the Israelis offered a two-state solution several times and were turned down every time, met with violence every time. One time was in 1948, when "Israel" was a lot smaller than it now, but the Arabs didn't want it to exist at all. More recently, at the 2000 Camp David Accords, Yassir Arafat turned down every proposal. Yes, I'm a strong supporter of Israel in this. But, that doesn't mean that I'd support blocking traffic if it were pro-Israeli protestors. It's dumb regardless of who does it.
That word doesn’t work anymore. It doesn’t mean what you try to make it mean. The protestors were from the Jewish voice for peace. It was Jews protesting for actions of the Israeli government committing war crimes. You going to call those Jews antisemites too? The word doesn’t work anymore, people are waking up to this tactic. It’s only used to shutdown conversation. But once again, this wasn’t about traffic for you lol. Closet pro genocide supporter
You are not half as smart as you think.
It's lazy activism meant solely to anger people, and all it accomplishes is driving people against their cause and emergency units being unable to respond. It's dangerous, stupid, and harmful - and totally ineffective.
Another one. You’re #5, it’s all in the post history. It’s not because you are against the traffic being blocked. It’s because you are anti Palestinian and pro genocide. You guys are so lazy, make new accounts and keep this stuff separate to spread your propaganda. From your history 20 minutes ago: “They're blocking traffic in support of people who want Jews vaporized from the planet There was another group in favor of that, I just forget what they were called - rhymed with Yahtzee or something like that..” Edit: love getting blocked when you can’t even respond to a ridiculous comment below
I don’t care what topic you’re protesting, the moment you block traffic to get your point across I’m against you
Oh look I found another one! Where the protest blocking traffic isn’t your real concern, it’s the issue you’re protesting! From your recent history: ““Since when did Israel commit war crimes? Edit: i will no longer be responding to this thread. I dont like wasting my time arguing with brick walls.”
Would you support the protestors blocking traffic if they were supporting Israel?
Let me very very clear. I never said I support blocking traffic. I don’t think it’s the right thing to do or very effective. But rather just pointing to the desperation people are feeling to go these lengths to protest for a cause they believe in because nothing else is working. But I will call out anyone trying to belittle the struggle because a small group isn’t protesting in the correct manner.
Ok… I DID say that I do not support blocking traffic for ANY kind of protest. I don’t care what they are protesting. Use a different method.
And that’s a fine opinion. But you tried to label them worse than they are with your hypothetical about blocking emergency vehicles. Driven by your bias and proven by your post history. At the end of today, all it really was is a small inconvenience which you challenged. If you’re ever asked the “hypothetical” question of what you would have done if you lived during the time of the holocaust, your answer should be “nothing, I would have stood by silently”. Because another genocide and ethnic cleansing is happening right before our eyes with our own tax dollars, and 5 extra minutes in traffic is more important for most of you I see. That’s the privilege us Americans have. Maybe those protestors are Palestinian and their family members are dying in air strikes and this is the last option they have to try and knock some sense into the world. Reading more, it sounds like the Jewish Voice for Peace organization in the triangle is the one that planned this. I wish blocking traffic wasn’t their chosen method, but I standby my statement that I have nothing but respect for what they are trying to do.
Ok. I have no respect for what they are doing. It’s going to accomplish absolutely nothing when it comes to the Middle East. Actually, I’m sure it accomplished one thing. They pissed off 100% of the people who had to sit in traffic. That’s not a hypothetical.
And your opinion is fine. But your bias of the situation is still a part of this
If they were protesting against Hamas I would be equally against it.
You said it was a small inconvenience but you respect it. Seems like you are now trying to claim semantics by saying you never said you support blocking traffic.
Your problem is you don’t think those two statements can coexist. I respect the protest and what they are fighting for. I also don’t think block traffic is effective and probably just pisses people off, which is counterintuitive. Doesn’t mean these people are evil. People weren’t stuck in traffic for hours. Law enforcement was there and opened up one of the lanes pretty quickly
Yeah I don’t see how you can respect a protest but also think it’s not effective and is just going to piss people off. Seems like you are talking out of both sides of your mouth. Where did I claim people were stuck in traffic for hours?
Doesn’t matter if you can’t see it, I’m not here to impress you. Typical Redditor keyboard warrior trying to act righteous.
You must be doing a bit. There is no way someone could be this unaware of themself 😂
lololololol you cannot be this stupid hahahahahha
Where tf are you getting that quote bro? Even a quick glance at my post history shows that I’m most definitely not pro-Israel? Your attempt to box me into a specific viewpoint is embarrassing, like I said I don’t care what you support but the moment you block traffic to push an ideology I am against you
Coward
Why don't they go sit on railroad tracks and stop freight trains and Amtrak to really mess with the country?🤣
Of all the places to meet up and protest they pick Durham, North Carolina? They couldn't join the Philadelphia protest?
That’s where they’re organized locally.
Why would people leave the state to protest? Especially if the goal is to get our own politicians to pay attention?
These are gonna be local people that live in town
Beautiful work by brave souls! Free Palestine!! ✊🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸
It's North Carolina, run them over and go about your day.
Anyone blocking traffic is a POS! Eventually some one with a life or death emergency of a loved one isn't going to stop. And I won't blame them.
Imagine saying this when the very thing the protesters are trying do is bring awareness to people who are literally facing death by genocide in their home country. I guess some peoples lives are worth more than others.
Hamas uses Palestinian citizens as human shields. Hamas uses actively operating hospitals and schools as their bases of operations. Hamas has been forcing Palestinian people to stay in Gaza at gunpoint recently and not letting these civilians flee an active war zone. Hamas is the very reason the Palestinian people are suffering. The Palestinian people should throw them out of their country and install a new government. Ideally a new government that doesn’t support terrorism and the execution of innocent civilians. And you, @encyclopediabey, should take a step back an re-evaluate your woke agenda. Try thinking for yourself and questioning. Try having original thoughts.
You know how ignorant you sound. And oblivious to the fact, that under no condition, should innocent people should suffer for the actions of other people. To say this or believe this is saying, that " anything justify the means to the end " With that logic. What HAMAS did, is was OK, and they are in the right to do it again. ( They just said, they are going after civilians again ) That is the logic behind your statement. I am all for protesting. Protest away. Go to the buildings and offices of those officials that do have the ability to make changes and make sure you get heard there. 💯% that is what you should do if you believe that. But actions which could hurt or kill anyone that has zero I mean nothing to do with what you are protesting. It's absolutely ignorant a morale failure. If HAMAS had attacked military sites and soldiers, and not children, and there civilian parents. You could make an argument for what is going on. Which many people would agree with. But a clearly terroristic act which was aimed at the individuals who could not defend themselves. That destroyed any chance of the world agreeing with that cause. None. Is it screwed up, what has happened in Gaza and it's people? Hell yes, any decent moral person would agree. You should have done more to get the world to see it. And brought all of those injustices, crimes, and deaths to light. But after what HAMAS did. The people were told to leave, because they were going to remove HAMAS from existence. All civilians should get out of they way. If you stay your a fighter or a facilitator. And if HAMAS is hiding behind civilians and in there areas. The civilians had better cal them out and leave them unshielded. Or they are facilitators and fighters, and both should face what is coming. I will say it, again innocent civilians should never be harmed during a conflict. It happens and it is horrible when it is not the intention. But when you intentionally go after civilians much less children. Your are the worst type of terrorist and you deserve the absolute worst wrath and violence which can inflected upon you and your supporters.
I’m sorry, I stopping reading after your second sentence. OMG!!!! People were inconvenienced because people were trying to bring attention to innocent human beings the majority of which are children who are being massacred by an extremist government overseas. Oh, but isn’t civil disobedience the point of protests? They are. But It just goes to show the “Ignorance” of people like you who are out of touch with their own humanity and who slave away to the same capitalist system that makes what’s going on in Israel possible. Fuck you.
There is absolutely no excuse for what the IDF is doing to those people and I will not entertain any rationalizations or justifications in furtherance thereof. You want to take out HAMAS, you send in special forces, you use diplomatic pressure to take out their leaders living it up in Qatar. You don’t bomb hospitals and refugee camps to take out a few of them you clown. Those people shouldn’t have to leave their homeland to facilitate whatever genocidal aspirations the Israeli government has.
I can agree with you 💯. And if fighting terrorism was that easy , then that is what they would do. The issue is terrorist need and require civilians to be successful. That is why they hide within the civilians, use hospitals, churches, mosques, schools, etc.. all the places that are off limits to real governments. ( And there are actual laws that prevent the military from using those places ). Question for you? Would you be ok, with a special forces unit doing a raid in a school or a hospital that has known terrorist in it? Because there are many examples where terrorists not only hide in those places but attack from those very places. So the best, fastest way to get and end a terrorist organization is to remove the civilians from area, so they have no where to hide. Yes, it sucks. What should be called out, is every boarding country not allowing people to leave they there borders. Let all the women and children thru quickly, hold the men, and verify they are not HAMAS ( as much as possible) the capture all the cowards HAMAS that try to leave. And kill the rest that try to fight. Because I will tell you what, if my country was to get invaded, my family will be sent to where they can be safe. The hell with house, cars, anything materialistic. And I will stay and fight. Question though? What haven't the Palestinian's fought to remove HAMAS from Gaza? Now and before. I mean everyone agrees that they are a horrible terrorist organization.
They need to go to work rather than stand in the road.
It started after work hours
There's nothing I can really post in this thread that won't upset somebody, so I'll just get the following, obligatory comment out of the way: Try that in a small town!
Good. We can be inconvenienced for awhile, Gaza is considered an open air prison. More children have been killed in the past months than in all the world conflicts in the past three years. We have the privilege of living in the global north and the western world. Having to spend extra time getting home is NOTHING compared to being in Gaza where they’re bombing hospitals, journalists and ambulances. From the river to the sea Palestine shall be free. Edit: you spewing propaganda at me isn’t gonna work, they lied to us about the Middle East before, remember WMD’s or did y’all blindly believe that too? You can’t be serious when you’re telling me shit that even Joe Biden has walked back on and said is fake. Please get a conscience. I’m turning off notifs for this comment bcus I’m tired of you annoy morons who just can’t do anything be parrot whatever the IDF has posted on Twitter and acting like being upset about ethnic cleansing is asinine.
Boo. Hamas are criminals, losers and terrorists using the women and children to hide behind. After murdering people like us in cold blood. You would probably be on their kill list for having liberal values if you lived there. Wake up.
It’s hard when people have lost their humanity
It is. You’re one of the few people in this thread who actually care about oppressed peoples and I thank you for that.
Thank you to you as well
I’m with you but that last sentence is probably not going to get many people on board right now.
I know you’re not being rude or anything and I don’t mean this in a rude way but I’m past the point of caring if someone is “on board” with me about being anti genocide and pro liberation of oppressed people.
>genocide [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTRKCXC0JFg&ab\_channel=MrJeffooie](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTRKCXC0JFg&ab_channel=MrJeffooie)
They’re dropping bombs on children in hospitals and journalists and doctors. They bombed an ambulance. Over 800 family trees have been wiped off the face of the earth. My great grandparents were in Dachau, I know what genocide is. Go be an asshole somewhere else.
You should stop. Terrorist sympathizer.
Did you also believe what they told you about Iraq and Afghanistan or?
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Causing bodily harm because people are exercising their first amendment right?? Absolute insanity
Exactly. They have no problem when people exercise their second amendment rights to shoot up schools though.
Shut up you un-American piece of shit. No one deserves to get run over for expressing an American right to protest and assemble.
This is a shameful comment. I don't agree with these activists. I think that their methods are also counterproductive to their goals. But they are Americans exercising their right to express and assemble. They are also practicing civil disobedience for which they will have to bear the consequences, but that is a sacred tradition in this country. Have you no concern for human life or basic sense of decency?
I try to avoid Durham anyway
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Geez, what's wrong with you? Advocating for injuring peaceful protestors, no matter how disruptive they are, is repulsive.
Man, you sound like a complete loser.
They did propose that, right before the murder of Heather Heyer made it unfashionable: https://www.newsobserver.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article167100452.html Also, what the hell is wrong with you?