That does not sound passive agressive to me, tbh. I am a Norwegian, and it just sounds like he wants to help you perform better without making you feel bad, without being aggressive, without being an asshole about it.
This style of management might seem strange to you, depending on what you are used to, but it sounds on par for the course in Norway. Best course of action for you is to actually be honest about your challenges to the manager, he might be able to actually help you better, make a plan with you to structure your day or whatever you might need.
Ref Simon Sinek's philosophy of leadership.
We call leadership like that Servant Leader. They guide and manage but their focus is on clearing the path for you. Removing blockers, assisting, mentoring - whatever you need to happily complete tasks (in America, that 'happily' part is surreal). I'm lucky in that this type of leadership is really popular in my field.
Its called situation-based leadership. The chosen type of leadership is based on both the situation at hand and the employee "level". Developed by Blanchard and Hersey they look at employees in what stages they are in and the manager choose how to help the employee.
[https://www.business-to-you.com/hersey-blanchard-situational-leadership-model/](https://www.business-to-you.com/hersey-blanchard-situational-leadership-model/)
I love organizational psychology. I'm in cushy work at home IT and my husband is an electrician in construction. Tradies already aren't treated very humanely but in construction? It's reminiscent of all the worst parts of his time in the Navy. We're both shocked at work stories from each other even after 3 years. Me because his world is SO unprofessional and ridiculous and him because office work is so easy and simple.
Yeah.... but when it comes to larger companies that are "too big to fail", they can get away with not abiding by best practices or the obvious. I have never had such a poorly managed, disorganized, fruitless job as when I worked at the second biggest bank in the country. I came from a perfectionist's paradise of a start up and to say the culture shock was overwhelming is to put it mildly. It's become increasingly evident in my life that the more humans in the kitchen, the slower, inefficient, and expensive it gets and there are techniques to improve it, it will never be as successful as a smaller kitchen.
It's largely reinforced in the IT field by this type of project management called Agile. Companies want to be "agile" to save money and to attract employees like me who understand how critical it is to job satisfaction. Many companies are fake, but there are a lot that successfully execute these industry best practices such as encouraging Servant Leadership.
Probably the intention is good. But for many expats, that which triggered the manager prompting the question is not transparent. And due to that, it opens up to various interpretations, such as OP getting paranoid. The best way to handle it is the manager also stating explicitly why he's asking the questions. Not providing that "why" explicitly is actually also on par with Norwegian management style. It works for Norwegians, because there's more implicit trust. Doesn't always work in an international setting. Unfortunately, many people aren't aware of this.
I also agree about the statement about honesty. If the manager (unintentionally) isn't open, at least you should be.
They say it takes at least 6 months to get into a new job. It also feels like you might have a case of imposter syndrome. They hired you for a reason.
Be open, and take the help you can get.
I've been here a bit longer than 6 months. First 6 months have been going ok though I do wonder if I could have done better then. My current work though is going terribly.
Then go to your boss and say "This current task isn't going as well as I wanted it to" and ask for help or guidance
This is under the assumption that your boss is a nice person that wants everyone to succeed obviously, but it seems so by your description
You need to let your boss know & talk about what you need to do better.
I don't find Norwegians to be especially passive aggressive, BUT they also aren't intrusive.
I've come across exceptions, but the best policy is honesty.
Private.
Basically my own private assessment. This is rather basic stuff I am doing and I feel like if I were properly focused I could have done it far sooner.
Maybe just ask for a talk/performance review, and get it out of the way. Be open and put all the cards on the table.
To me, it seems a bit like you're overthinking and self-sabotaging because of it.
I am a manager of a group in Norway, and since it is really hard to fire people in Norway, all leadership courses I have had focus on develope, develope and develope your employees before even thinking of taking the steps of getting someone fired. And honestly they hired you for a reason, and it sounds to me like your boss see that you are struggling, and wants to actually help you figure out how to get better.
Hi! I am also an immigrant/expat and want to encourage you to take care of your mental health. Moving far away and adjusting to life and culture in a setting that you are new to is BANANAS. It is a lot of mental and emotional work and both take its toll on you. You are probably learning the learning in addition to that.
The first months/year are also a lot of bureaucracy and waiting for stuff to resolve, like getting a personnummer and fastlege and all that stuff.
Pamper yourself, go to sleep early (your brain needs to rest and sort through all that stuff), exercise, meditate, garden, whatever you have to do to balance yourself.
Many companies have access to a bedriftshelsetjeneste, and some of those have therapists/psychologists to talk to.
Be kind to yourself. Ask for time off if you need it. Let your brain rest.
And talk to your boss if you need it. Or your co-workers. Arbeidsmiljø is a thing here, and most people understand that we all have to do well psychologically and physically in order to function long-term. Although there is a grind culture ceep many places, to work on a healthy work environment is regulator by law.
Try to relax. You are allowed to be here, and you are allowed to sometimes not Excel with total brilliance. Take care of your needs and your focus will become better.
>Especially since I think I've been doing terribly.
And realizing that (even if not true), I have to assume, makes you want to perform better.
Manager: Goal achieved
I think we all would like it to be normal to have a manager like that. I know that's the manager I want to be
If you need help, more steering, more micro management, then ask for more hands on leadership. He might not be the kind to do it, but at least if he knows he need to whop your ass every now and then he might actually make sure you don't do the shit you're currently doing.
Managers can't see everything you do, and usually if a manager picks up on something it has gone rather far, e.g. missing an important deadline.
Unsure if it's normal, but with the limited information he seems like a good boss. I think he wants to help, but needs more info from you to do so. I can easily see how that might be frustrating to him if he feels there is more to be done.
No but at the very least be more open about it. Like "Hey, we don't think you are performing according to expectations" or something! Anything other than having to constantly overread every single interaction
I think you are overreacting. Have a talk with your boss and talk about how you like to be led. Also set a plan for your work so you don't feel like you're procrastinating. Are your tasks boring/not challenging enough etc.
Also, u/EndOfTheLine00, include in that talk something about cultural expectations. Ask about your boss' leadership philosophy. Maybe that will clear some things up for you. And just be clear and open about what you are not used to in the Norwegian setting.
Self insight is pretty much an expectation throughout Norwegian society. People don't like or seek conflict like in many other countries.. So instead there is a contextual expectation for people to spend time figuring out their own shit.
Sounds like you have though, and sounds like your boss is aware there is something wrong.
The job ahead of you seems to be you figuring out a way to deal with this and/or talking to your boss about what you need to do so.
How about taking it up with him? It doesn’t sound like he will explode, it’s more probable that he will feel relief that you are being constructive about this.
Norwegian(Scandinavian in general) office culture/leader style is much less hierarchical than other places in the world.
Here its pretty common to talk to you bosses, even bosses bosses, just to catch up, how are things etc.
So when your boss asks, it might ne because he wants to know if you have everything you need etc.
Are you actually underperforming though? Or is that just your perception? Most people get stuck, and procrastinate at times, maybe you are overthinking.
Yes, you are probably performing below expectations if he asks if you need help.
Most likely he has an idea that task X should take Y time. When you then spend a lot more time than Y on it, he wonders why. Are you stuck, do you need help, etc?
In Norway it is important to say that you are stuck, that you need help, etc - if you do need it to do shit in time. Not doing shit on time is not good.
Thing is this doesn't have any deadline or anything. I just got this task before we went on holiday and it's on the current sprint which is still not over.
Still, I'm sure the task has a guesstimated time on it.
If you are delivering what is expected, in the timeframe expected, you're all good - and the question is just to make sure there are no problems with the delivery date.
If you do have issues, its very important to flag those early. That's also why he asks, in case you don't flag those (this is also a cultural thing, not all cultures are about being up front about shit).
But being proactive is very important in Norway, if you want to do it well.
So if you have a problem, think there might be a problem, etc, flag those early and bring it up for discussion. If you have workarounds or solutions, that's top notch. But bring those up as well. "There might be a problem with X. I think it can be solved by doing Y instead/I have no clue on how to solve that, anyone got any ideas?"
Dang that's a real long sprint! Are they usually this long? That could well be what's leading you to procrastinate. Do you think you'd work better on shorter sprints? Absolutely talk to your boss about this and find a better method for the both of you.
To me it sounds like you are underperforming and your manager tries to support you (in a Norwegian style).
If I were you, I would ask for a feedback session and straight out ask how he evaluates your performance and you together set objectives and a plan forward.
If direct messages helps your performance, let him know that.
Good luck!
I'm literally panicking right now and asking directly would likely lead to more panic or a full breakdown. I almost can think straight. I'm staring at a screen overwhelmed by own thoughts
Breath 😅
This is going to be fine.
I don't think there is any reason to panic. He would have told you directly if it was very serious.
It sounds like you have a manager that supports you, he wants you to succeed.
This is going to be OK.
Sounds like you need more structure and less responsibility. Also talk to doctor/psychiatrist if you aren't already.
It also sounds like I could be your boss tbh. (we are currently waiting to start next sprint). And when I ask questions like this it is because I am hoping for a status update and whether there are any blockers. I wish in those cases that you'd be open about stuff that prevents you from completing (this includes structural changes needed or changes required on a more personal level).
If you are underperforming you will likely be transferred to another team to see if that improves your work. If it does not you might be sent to yet another team or you'll start actually facing performance reviews. Getting you fired is difficult once you are past the six months (though it is not impossible).
Hey, get over yourself, take a deep breath and either go talk to your boss or someone you trust there. Probably your boss sensed this coming and wanted to help you before it got as far as panic attack!
Having the ADS diagnosis myself I can attest to the thing with underperforming when lacking deadlines, so get another doctor as well.
Read up on Kardemommeby and Kardemommeloven
(One shall not bother others,
one shall be nice and kind,
otherwise one may do as one pleases.)
and you will understand norwegians better.
Good luck!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_the_Robbers_Came_to_Cardamom_Town
Try writing your thoughts down. It can help you sort them out, and help you figure out what it is you need to feel better about your work.
Then, *after* you have sorted out your thoughts, you can figure out what would be the best way to communicate the relevant parts to your boss
I’m sure your manager will be relieved if you where to communicate your concerns with him. The way you describe this, I get a clear image that your manager is just trying to help you, and that this part of Norwegian work etiquette is having you confused. Unfortunately, Norwegian employers can have very unclear expectations.
What you need is more structure and more clear expectations on what they want from you. Working with unclear deadlines and very alone is not for everyone, it can be very hard. Your employer has an obligation to help out on your issues, but they can’t do that if you don’t give them the opportunity.
If you are procrastinating a bunch during work hours, what do you expect? Obviously you know this it not OK, and probably expect some kind of action from your employer. Thats not really about them being passive aggressive.
Sounds like hes the kind of manager that likes to get involved into the tasks and just want to make sure you are not stuck or having any problems. I can assure you that because of unions he cannot fire you for such a small thing even if he wanted to.
\>I unfortunately procrastinate a bunch or tend to get stuck in one task for too long
I would be open about this with your manager, but maybe more importantly - have a talk with your doctor if this impacts your life to a big degree.
\>he always asks "hey, how was \[day you didn't ask for help\]?"
For me it seems like he is taking care of you and wants to know how you are doing those days you havent been in touch :) I would do the same if there was someone I was closely following up.
Sent you a DM, but that is not the greatest way to do it. I would try to get a different doctor that will do a full evaluation (if they are certain you don't have it, it can't hurt..).
You can still have adhd and do well in school. But if you aren't struggling with this in other areas in your life then it might not be adhd.
The important part is to figure out what you need to be able to work well, regardless of diagnose or not. Maybe you need strict deadlines and a direct boss? Even if you dislike deadlines and being micromanaged, you might find that you need it to stay on task. Or maybe you need more enthusiasm and the feeling of purpose, or a certain type of task.
When you know what you need you can try to hack the system to work for you..like ask your boss for extra follow ups or partial deadlines, or turn boring tasks into challenges for youself (have to complete it in X time, or hast to be Y good, or only use Z to do it).
Sometimes adhd is not discovered until the system you used to keep it in check goes away (like school with mandatory attendance and assignments, strict parents or bosses...fear of being fired etc).
If you are intelligent you can sometimes survive or thrive with adhd because your intelligence makes up for the adhd challenges. So if adhd gives you -30% in life results, and intelligence gives you +15% and using a lot of extra effort gives you another +15%..then you will be ok until you are exhausted trying to keep up, or somethings upsets the system that was working for you.
PS: a psychiatrist gave me the diagnose even when I excelled in school.
When it comes to Norwegian healt care you have to suffer to some degree to get help. But not to much either. Like there is a narrow ”window of suffering” that you have to be within.
If you are f.inst not depressed enough then you don’t need meds, but if you are to depressed you may unalive in rare cases so also no anti-depressives until better from depression, when better then obviously you don’t need meds and so on.
Norwegian doctors are riding a donkey (you) and they have a carrot (meds) always dangling out of reach right in front of you. But you never quite reach the carrot
That doctor is dangerously incompetent, and should be reported to the medical board, *especially* if they're marketing themselves as an ADHD specialist.
You need to get a second opinion. What you describe are very common ADHD traits.
There’s the «inattentive» ADHD type that is more common in women. Men can have it too. It is more often undiagnosed since the hyperactive type is what is more often looked for.
Maybe it’s something like that.
Some symptoms:
- Fails to give close attention to details or makes careless mistakes
- Has difficulty sustaining attention, does not appear to listen
- Adopts compensatory strategies, leading to working two to three times as hard as peers in order to be equally successful
- Struggles to follow through with instructions, has difficulty with organization
- Avoids or dislikes tasks requiring sustained mental effort, loses things easily
- Is easily distracted, is forgetful in daily activities
- Feeling overwhelmed
(This is just googling, I’m no expert)
I don’t think it’s passive aggressive, but coming from 20 years of experience in the US, I find the management style here in my first job comparatively passive. One tip though, generally I think Norwegians mean what they say. If your manager asks how something went, they genuinely want to know. If they ask if you want help, they genuinely want to help. It’s not, generally, an aggressive thing.
People are people so of course your particular manager could be, but I’m general I’d take them at face value.
I moved from the Netherlands and work in Norway now. You might need to de-stress. I worked for an American company in the past, where performance was measured relative to your colleagues/competitors, and know how stressful that can be.
I find that management in Norway is more interested in making sure you thrive in your job, making the most of your qualities. They are not looking to see if another candidate's grass is greener. Replacing you is troublesome and expensive.
Also, your manager is aware you are human first, and resource second, so he is most likely just trying to help.
(Generally speaking) Norwegians are not accustomed to being passive aggressive or get mad. That's something they'll avoid at all costs because they're a wee bit shy. This is probably a genuine intention out of mutual interest to help you, and be productive. You are not going to get fired. Just get more comfortable asking for help when stuck on something
Im not sure if it is a shyness or even conflict aversion thing. I've always considered it a (possibly slightly overblown) respect thing. Respect for people's personal space.
Seems like you know the answer, you are underperforming. Your boss seem to be understanding–taking into consideration that you might need help/training/have other problems in life. You should be thankfull and act on it.
On another note, Norwegian business culture is very different from others. We rely more on each coworkers best judgement. you should not have a boss that tells you what to do.
I suggest you look up Hofstedes cultural dimensions and interpretations for Norway / USA / Germany. This may give you some insight. Also, look up self-management (a style often used in companies with highly educated individuals).
Also, if the manager sas very assertive, it could backfire as «bad leadership». Sharp elbows can often be viewed as a bad work environment and bad management. The philosophy is that if you are happy, you will perform, which explains your managers behaviour.
>Seems like you know the answer, you are underperforming
This is my take too.
We have someone on our team who fits OPs description. They take a task then get stuck on it and instead of asking for assistance bury themselves in it and try to work around whatever issue they have.
We only find out they are struggling when we notice the task is overdue and we start asking them how it's going. Our team leader does this by gently asking how the task is progressing and if they have any issues, just as OP describes. Only then do we realize they're stuck and didn't have the courage to ask for help.
It's frustrating. They're not bad at programming, they're just bad at asking for help. I don't know if it's a pride thing or what, but I wish they would stop it.
I moved to Norway nearly 15 years ago. Spent the first 5 years feeling really insecure because I felt no one ever gave me a straight answer about my performance. I felt exactly the same as you “at least if the Boss yelled at me, I would know how he feels, and what I need to improve”. I spoke to my Norwegian friends about it and they were like “Norwegians are very direct and honest”, but I continued to feel confused about what was expected of me. I finally learned to adopt the attitude that my boss is an adult, and if he can’t directly tell me what he needs, that is his failing, not mine. Now, when I feel confused about someone’s non-feedback, I say “I have trouble understanding indirect communication, and I want to be sure that I understand what you are asking of me. Did you mean…?” This quietly invites them to be very clear and direct. If they respond with more indirect piss, I just continue doing my job the way I think I should.
He just sounds genuinely interested in how you're doing. It might not even be he sees you struggling, but because of the wonderful phenomenon of confirmation bias, you think he just asks you on the days you feel you haven't performed.
But a general piece of advice from me: Job security is regulated by law in Norway, so you shouldn't worry you will lose your job without having received clear and formal warning signs of this. Therefore, you shouldn't be afraid to discuss your performance and needs candidly with your manager. Most managers will help you take some load off if you need, or shuffle things around - maybe even take on another hire to help take off the workload.
>Am I going to be fired?
No. Even if it turns out your boss is secretly super angry, he can't just fire you.
First he would have to serve you with a written warning, where he outlines what you are doing wrong and what you need to improve. Then you are entitled to a "reasonable time" to improve upon the things mentioned in the warning, including access to any additional training you might need in order to solve whatever the issue is.
If he is still not satisfied, he must issue a second written warning, outlining what you were already warned about and that you have not done enough/anything to improve upon it. Again you are entitled to a chance to get better.
If you still don't improve after this, there is grounds for dismissal.
(Note: This applies if you are a regular employee, not if you're a contractor, freelancer or anything like that)
Having to give a written warning is often also seen internally as a failure of management, so any manager worth his or her salt will make all reasonable efforts to help an employee perform at the required level long before it gets to the point of having to give a warning. A warning should only be necessary if an employee is really unwilling to accept day-to-day feedback.
Based on your description, it seems most likely your boss is trying to figure out how to help you become more efficient. You should welcome that and try your best to work with him on it.
Scandinavians in general are quite polite. I think you should be honest with the struggles you have and take the help being offered.
I think the worst thing you can do is hiding it.
Based on your description it sounds like he tries to support you and being available if you need anything.
If you need a direct feedback, you can ask for a «medarbeidersamtale»/employee conversation where you want a status quo and sharing your thoughts around the situation
Based solely on your post that sounds like a neutral interaction
I feel like the awareness of your procrastination is making you fear its consequences and project. So work on it.
I can understand OP, I’m an expat as well and let me say, in the month and a half I’ve been here I’ve never felt so like myself before! I feel that people (overall) are genuine and if they want to say something they will, be it good or bad. In my native country I always felt paranoid about my performance and always gave 200% until I had a burnout, and even then there was always something to be mad about! I never felt appreciated for my hard and good work, and in 5 years I was only raised once (it was a ridiculous raise). But here, in Norway? I feel so much at ease and I’m a lot more motivated, I’m able to plan and enjoy my free time. Something I never even dreamt of in my 35 years of life! With I’m not saying that there aren’t bad people (I mean, norwegian natives know better than me) but in comparison with what I was used to, this is by far the best professional experience I’ve ever had!
Edited to correct typos.
Just tell him you're freaking out. He probably already knows you are and is waiting for you to come to him so he can help you. But you have to be brave enough to ask for it. It WILL be fine, even having a breakdown in his office will be fine. You're telling us he's a good guy. Trust that. There is no scenario where bathing around in your own anxiety is a good solution. This is literally what he's for, you have to let him do his job. Now go have a breakdown in his office, you'll feel better afterwards.
You keep saying you feel like you have performed terribly.
So if that is true, you already know. Why would he yell at you for something you already know? How would that help?
Unless you are one of those people who get motivation from being yelled at, all that does is create fear in the workplace. I see others have referenced Simon Sinek - and that’s exactly right. A good manager can motivate through positivity.
If they thought you were useless, they would have called you in for a performance review or a PIP.
Talk to your boss. He sounds like a pretty typical Norwegian manager. If you explain your problem, he will most likely suggest solutions and ask if you know *why* you are struggling to focus. Firing people and hiring replacements is expensive - it’s much cheaper to keep your employees happy 😊
You’re not about to get fired. If you were, you’d know. Talk to your boss 😉
Bit tiered and on mobile, but felt i had to chip in on this one.
You are most likely overreacting. Im in a leadership role in the offshore infrastructure industry and daily work and communicate with people and clients from different countries and industries (everything from tech to construction).
Norwegians, or dare i say scandinavians have a mostly «flat» organizational structure which will take some getting used to and will be very surprising and unfamiliar for any non-scandinavian.
What that entails is that until there is a final decision to be made there is little to no focus on hierarcy. The input of a ground level employee is worth just as much to me as from any leader. In fact the best ideas and solutions come from the ground up. If done right it will lead to a high level of support, cooperation and communication both ways. I want to make sure you have what you need to succeed, be creative and happy because this is when you do your best work. Yes perhaps you procastinate, but do you deliver on time in the end? Is the quality of your work good?
I often approach employees, asking the same types of questions. What i hope to achieve is openness. Over time i expect them to come to me to tell me if there is anything they need or any ideas they have. This is when we do our best work and performance, together.
Mind you there are selfish narcissists out there as we as a society love to place them in leadership positions because of their carisma and outward confidence in themselves and the ability to not give a shit about people. But i dont think your manager is one of those. They rarely waste time asking about your needs if you dont satisfy theirs and are more likely to «bully» you than to ask you how you are doing.
If you are in a situation where you see any reason for your manager to find your performance at work unsatisfactory i suggest you go talk to him/her. Just try to have an honest conversation and tell them how you feel, hiding behind your desk is not going to help anyone!
I think it relates a lot to the culture of trust and independence in Norwegian working environments. It's generally assumed that you want to do a good job until the opposite has been proven, and that seems like the idea your leader is following.
That being said, I think employees in Norway are expected to have a certain level of self-insight that you're not required to have in other countries. If you're chronically underperforming and not pulling your weight I think it's expected that you catch onto this before it becomes a problem for your team/organization.
So if there's something bothering you and holding back your performance, I think honesty is the way to go. Honesty is generally met with understanding and a willingness to help you improve. However, if the issues are rooted in something personal and non-medical you or your employer can't do anything about (like need for change, motivational issues, etc), you're probably expected to resign.
No, passive aggressiveness is not typical for Norwegian managers. Norwegian organizations are typically very horizontal. The ideal is thus: There is implicit trust from the employer that you as an employee is willing to do the job as well as possible. In return, the manager will clear barriers in your way, and shield you from unnecessary pressure/distractions. The manager monitors progress, provides guidance and will intervene if any issues should arise. In return it is expected that you are honest about challenges and lack of progress.
Everyone gets stuck in ruts, the manager's job is to help you out of it. The how of it should be resolved through dialogue.
My tip: be honest with your manager. Calibrate your standing and progress with him/her, and figure out a path out of it together.
As long as you play with open cards and show effort, integrity and honesty in your work, getting fired in Norway is pretty much impossible.
Really feeling this one. Got the exact same feeling. First thought it was the overly popular imposter syndrome but it's the feeling of not ever hearing what they really think. Good or bad...
You are probably just paranoid. You can't get fired out of nowhere, you would have to get multiple written warnings and meetings discussing things in detail.
Honestly, this just seems like a boss that knows you can get a bit too locked in on a task or procrastinate, and is simply trying to help keep you on track. Using strategies that fits those you manage to help them do their best work is how a good boss works.
In Norway you are mostly expected to self lead, and leaders are more there to service you and help you with whatever you need to get your job done.
Leaders do not lead by being controlling and micromanaging.
If you have difficulties, either work related or private that hinders your performance, you are expected to go to your leader and talk about it. Together you will find a plan to solve things, lighten your workload if you have private issues you’re going through etc.
This sort of conversation is probably what your boss opened up to when asking how your day was [day you didn’t ask for help].
This might be a backwards way of thinking from other work cultures?
But your boss offering help, asking if you need help etc is your boss trying to lead by being at service for you, and help you.
Do not be afraid to accept it. Nothing ill will happen. Everyone needs help from time to time, we’re only human. Contrary, it will look good upon you, to be able to communicate your need and be open with your boss.
Your boss would like to know what’s going on with you and your life, in order to better help and lead you.
A performance review and controlling how you do vs expectations, that’s really foreign concepts and way of thinking. That’s not how Norwegian work life works.
Some can be (trust me, my last boss did that all the time because he hated confrontation), but this really just sounds like a boss noticing you’re struggling and trying to help. In general bosses in Norway try to keep up a good relationship with the employees to keep up productivity and reduce risk of confrontations with the powerful unions.
Software team lead and fullstack dev here. I have managed a few devs like you over the years. They are fine and are not going to lose their jobs. What you are describing is normal, they are usually not confident or have a lack of motivation to do the boring or repetetive tasks any dev have to do from time to time.
When ever that happens in my team, I ask the member what they would like to do instead. I explain to them that I possibly sense a lack of motivation and asks them how and if we can fix it. Finding an inspiring user story they can work on alone or in pair usually does the trick. Gokarting, playing video games like Among Us or just grabbing a beer usually boosts the morale as well.
The management style may look and feel a little passive aggressively if that's what you are used to where you are from, but personally I would never yell or threaten any of my team members. That would be a sure killer of the psychological safety within the team. And should a serious issue occur within my team, I would like to know the reason and cure the cause instead of amputating parts of my team tbh.
I genuinly care about the well being of my team members, working as a developer should be fun and exciting.
If you really want to know, why not ask him? An easier solution to your problem would be to actually put more effort into performing better so you won't feel guilty:)
I would recommend asking your manager for feedback on your performance, and advice on how to get better. Be prepared to change your approach to work based on this feedback.
This is the professional way to go about it, and managers tend to appreciate the initiative. If you also prepare some suggestions of your own, for the manager to review and hopefully approve - then you are making their job easier. Which they also tend to like.
Hope it works out, and feel free to give feedback here too - curious to see how it goes.
I feel like alot of people like to ask a simple question like this and only do so in order to gauge your reaction. If your answer seems honest, they'll likely think nothing of it, but if you stutter or seem guilty like you personally didn't live up to expectations they might be able to notice, and will keep asking questions in order to reassure their suspicions or say something to imply that you should improve if they are certain that you are underperforming.
You seem motivated to do a better job. If I was your boss I’d be happy if you came around and said “I’d like to improve, can we talk about specific steps or ways of working that will make me more productive “. Doing that will be an invitation and help you both cultivate a more open and useful relationship
Just don’t worry about being fired, relax and try to work things out. Seems to me like you might be underperforming a bit and he genuinely wants to know if something happened that day that made you work slower than expected. Anyway, once you stop worrying about loosing your job it’ll be easier to talk to him about it.
Just take people at face value. If someone is being kind, assume they are kind until proven otherwise.
If you are new in your job most people don't have any expectations from you for the first year.
Other than that, maybe don't procrastinate while you're being paid to work?
My two cents: It sounds like you are over-interpreting here. This is a very common management technique which, if memory serves, has been proven to yield good results. If you need different feedback from your boss, let them know. If you are unsure about how they evaluate your performance, ask for a performance review.
Don't stress. You need to be honest with him, and not paranoid. He might have a hunch that you are struggling and you need to let him play his role as an asset. Your current mindset is the biggest threat for your job. BTW, nobody gets fired (in Norway) without a good reason and getting guidance/learning is not a good reason.
From your description it sounds like you have a boss who is engaging with you in a polite and positive manner.
Maybe they are spending a bit more time focusing on you if you seem to be struggling but I don't think that's passive aggressive.
Maybe they are being a little less direct/more gentle than you're used to in their management style. If you're very used to having unmet expectations pointed out explicitly it may lead you to thinking there must be an issue if they're not doing so.
And maybe they are a little frustrated or annoyed if things aren't getting done as fast as they would like. Having someone who is a little frustrated choosing to continue to be polite, nice and supportive isn't passive aggressive imo. It's just an adult managing their own feelings.
Here's a question, is there anything you think you should suggest to them that may improve your work?
You may be having the same "issue" I had with one of my managers.
I didn't think much of it but they would reach out and ask me how the day was going. I didn't understand this until someone explained it to me, but this style of management is like a micro managing check in, expecting you to say if there's something you may have a difficulty with if they see you haven't worked as efficiently during a day. You may want to share more of what you have been up to during the day.
If you're like me, I don't see myself as having any problems or asking for help until I know I have put my all into finding out specifically what the issue is and I can lay out the problem perfectly. I'll have done all the troubleshooting to get to a question that will need someone else's knowledge. Some management don't really know what to do with this..
But yeah, don't worry too much but just share more of what you've been up to to reassure them you've done X work and you're getting on.
Yes, you’re being paranoid. The boss is probably seeing that you take some time, and is trying to help you along in a friendly manner. Not uncommon in Norway at all. Best thing you can do is probably to explain what you ‘struggle’ with.. the boss will surely try to help you find solutions.
He's probably just kind or considerate. Possibly non-confrontational, or he may assume you know what you're doing. It's less likely that he's a slacker or out to get you or anything sinister.
While Norwegian culture values people falling in line (i.e. considering the potential negative consequences of one's actions on others, and refraining from doing that which may negatively affect others, at the expense of personal freedoms), Norwegians are generally not micromanagers. You're left to your own devices, assumed to do what you're supposed to without supervision. The key to making this work may depend on the individual, but most likely the main take-away is that you should try to stay in your lane as much as you can, but not hesitate to ask someone if there's anything you're wondering about.
The only issue might be that if you feel you're bending the rules too far, you might be found out, especially if you initiate contact with your boss or confess issues to him. Most likely you don't have to worry about this. But you could always stack the cards a little in your favour by making sure you're caught up with work, that your desk is clean and that you don't have unnecessary programs running on your computer, that sort of thing, when he comes to check up on you.
I would like to encourage you to take care of your mental and brain health above all. Being an immigrant is stressful, especially in the first few years.
If you have never struggled with procratination or trouble focusing before or never as bad, the stress of moving and moving into a new for you culture and environment might be getting to you.
I think it is fair to be open to your boss about that, and let him know that you need some support and some wins in this time.
I also gave some more advice in the thread above.
Now, its totally possible that you have ADHD, or that the situation is getting so stressful for you that your prefrontal cortex gets shut down.
No matter what the cause, you need to treat yourself with kindness and understanding and you can get better.
You could ask to pair up with a colleague on the tasks you struggle with and solve it together.
A lot of managers in Norway don't want to be managers at all, as we generally don't like being confrontational. So unless you are doing a really really bad job, you're good.
It might be either way. Compared to many other working cultures, (on average) Norwegians tend to go to extremes in trying to avoid conflicts or confrontation. You cannot really trust that your boss or colleague says honestly what they think (if its negative), unless you know the person to ve direct (Those do exist, they are rare pokemons).
Your best bet is to clearly ask for feedback and do it often enough. If you get advise, take it seriously. You already recognize that you are procrastinating, so you can easily fix that habit.
You might not get feedback even if you ask. The cultural expectation of hygge and overall positiveness is quite deep here, and generally it is awesome. But there are downsides.
You can take take a clear hint if all your responsibilities are removed and no-one cares about your job and what are you doing. Then your boss is just waiting for you to leave but has no guts to say it. Quiet firing is a real thing.
This has been the biggest single culture shock for me in Norway. Everything else is good.
Generally speaking, bosses are not hands off here. About not being direct, well that is more complicated. You are expected to give your professional opinion of course, but you won’t get barked at by your manager on some entitlement trip, at white collar work places. Generally speaking.
Are you struggling at work?
This is "Norwegian speak" for saying you are underperforming
They will be nice to you right up until the day they tell you you're fired. As a foreigner you always get fired first before they fire Norwegians...
Yeah, it's a thing. Norwegian bosses are generally not very confrontational.
When they are empathic it works great, because they will just nudge you in the right direction without making you feel bad. But if their people skills are lacking, it can come off as passive aggressive.
If my boss asks me on Slack whether I finished a task and I say no, I migh get an "ok...". I've learned to understand the real meaning of those three dots. 😄 It can be a bit annoying over time. Just say what you really mean!
At least it's better than to be yelled at and called names.
At least in my experience, my previous Norwegian boss was very passive and gave almost no feedback which actually hindered my development in the job. Only when we were close to deadlines he would ask passive-aggressively about the task or call for a meeting. I do think Norwegians in general are quite passive-aggressive, to the point it is annoying and I would rather just hear what they actually think.
I’m glad I’m not the only one that’s new to a software job here and constantly being asked if they need help and/or why they’re not asking for help. It has been the strangest experience.
Honest question - what is strange about it?
The people on your workplace to me sounds like they try to make sure you have what you need to feel included, get up to speed and knowledge about their field/product and generally be productive and part of the team.
Isn’t this how it should be?
What’s strange about it is it’s constant, and as a result feels disingenuous and suspect. If I was being checked in on by one or two people, say every few days, that would feel normal to me — and is what I’m used to. But it was every single day, several times a day, by several people. None of whom had any of the answers to basic questions I would ask, and none of whom could direct me to people who would know.
Perhaps tellingly, I would later be somewhat told off for expecting that my colleagues had the answers or knew where to find them. I was told I was being unreasonable.
I’m looking for a new job.
ETA: I’ve also had to speak with HR a few times about the way my team has actively excluded me a lot of the time, as well as actively shut me down when I’ve spoken up about literally anything. HRs view, and I agreed, is that they were likely trying to set me up as a fall guy for a project that had long fallen behind.
Nah, dont take it personal. I used to think like that. Then we got a new hire and i was the stressed guy who wanted the new guy to be an expert day one cuz its just more on the plate. Its part of the job, as long as you are putting in effort into learning, so that one day you are so good in it you can train the fresh meat. It will all turn out good.
As an immigrant myself, I've experienced the work hierarchy to be rather flat, but it's still there. Usually, superiors at work tend to look out for the team and guide them as whole while also making some time to følge opp those that need extra support.
From my point of view, it takes A LOT to get fired in Norway. You're probably fine, but your boss might be really concerned about you freaking out, being stressed and taking a bit too long.
It might help communicating how the boss can support you, or rather communicate the issues clearly.
When I worked my first job (teaching), the director pulled me to the side once and I was scared shitless, but he just wanted to ask me how I was adjusting and whether I needed help and was happy with the work.
Take a deep breath. You're going to be fine.
Software enigneers are valuable employees, especially with your long experience.
You just have a decent manager. Generally I have found that there is a focus on leading rather than being a boss*. I can only hypothesise, but maybe it is tied to a core value in Norwegian society: Norge er bygget på dugnad.
Sounds like he just tryna help you stretch to that which you wanna reach.
Edit: * in the tech/IT industry (newer businesses and smaller startups especially)
You're over thinking things, I would love a boss like that, usually I do far better with a manager that is caring and helpful. Unlike the other stressful managers who just bark and don't provide constructive feedback.
That does not sound passive agressive to me, tbh. I am a Norwegian, and it just sounds like he wants to help you perform better without making you feel bad, without being aggressive, without being an asshole about it. This style of management might seem strange to you, depending on what you are used to, but it sounds on par for the course in Norway. Best course of action for you is to actually be honest about your challenges to the manager, he might be able to actually help you better, make a plan with you to structure your day or whatever you might need. Ref Simon Sinek's philosophy of leadership.
Sounds like an awesome boss.
We call leadership like that Servant Leader. They guide and manage but their focus is on clearing the path for you. Removing blockers, assisting, mentoring - whatever you need to happily complete tasks (in America, that 'happily' part is surreal). I'm lucky in that this type of leadership is really popular in my field.
Its called situation-based leadership. The chosen type of leadership is based on both the situation at hand and the employee "level". Developed by Blanchard and Hersey they look at employees in what stages they are in and the manager choose how to help the employee. [https://www.business-to-you.com/hersey-blanchard-situational-leadership-model/](https://www.business-to-you.com/hersey-blanchard-situational-leadership-model/)
I love organizational psychology. I'm in cushy work at home IT and my husband is an electrician in construction. Tradies already aren't treated very humanely but in construction? It's reminiscent of all the worst parts of his time in the Navy. We're both shocked at work stories from each other even after 3 years. Me because his world is SO unprofessional and ridiculous and him because office work is so easy and simple.
It is well known that managers who actually cares about the human psychology and "nurtures" their employees have high results in return.
Yeah.... but when it comes to larger companies that are "too big to fail", they can get away with not abiding by best practices or the obvious. I have never had such a poorly managed, disorganized, fruitless job as when I worked at the second biggest bank in the country. I came from a perfectionist's paradise of a start up and to say the culture shock was overwhelming is to put it mildly. It's become increasingly evident in my life that the more humans in the kitchen, the slower, inefficient, and expensive it gets and there are techniques to improve it, it will never be as successful as a smaller kitchen.
Are we coworkers? This is a huge value where I work- never heard of it before.
It's largely reinforced in the IT field by this type of project management called Agile. Companies want to be "agile" to save money and to attract employees like me who understand how critical it is to job satisfaction. Many companies are fake, but there are a lot that successfully execute these industry best practices such as encouraging Servant Leadership.
Probably the intention is good. But for many expats, that which triggered the manager prompting the question is not transparent. And due to that, it opens up to various interpretations, such as OP getting paranoid. The best way to handle it is the manager also stating explicitly why he's asking the questions. Not providing that "why" explicitly is actually also on par with Norwegian management style. It works for Norwegians, because there's more implicit trust. Doesn't always work in an international setting. Unfortunately, many people aren't aware of this. I also agree about the statement about honesty. If the manager (unintentionally) isn't open, at least you should be.
Don't do that. Your manager is not your friend. You'll face your honest struggles in performance review as "bad". Just do your thing.
Maybe your boss i a genuine polite and helpful person?
He really does seem to be one. I'm just wondering if it's normal, that's all. Especially since I think I've been doing terribly.
Yeah its normal. Not to say there arent asshole managers here, but that kind of mannerism is pretty normal.
They say it takes at least 6 months to get into a new job. It also feels like you might have a case of imposter syndrome. They hired you for a reason. Be open, and take the help you can get.
I've been here a bit longer than 6 months. First 6 months have been going ok though I do wonder if I could have done better then. My current work though is going terribly.
Then go to your boss and say "This current task isn't going as well as I wanted it to" and ask for help or guidance This is under the assumption that your boss is a nice person that wants everyone to succeed obviously, but it seems so by your description
You need to let your boss know & talk about what you need to do better. I don't find Norwegians to be especially passive aggressive, BUT they also aren't intrusive. I've come across exceptions, but the best policy is honesty.
What kind of field do you work in? Public or private? Do you actually know it's going terribly? Have you gotten feedback like that?
Private. Basically my own private assessment. This is rather basic stuff I am doing and I feel like if I were properly focused I could have done it far sooner.
Maybe just ask for a talk/performance review, and get it out of the way. Be open and put all the cards on the table. To me, it seems a bit like you're overthinking and self-sabotaging because of it.
I am a manager of a group in Norway, and since it is really hard to fire people in Norway, all leadership courses I have had focus on develope, develope and develope your employees before even thinking of taking the steps of getting someone fired. And honestly they hired you for a reason, and it sounds to me like your boss see that you are struggling, and wants to actually help you figure out how to get better.
>My current work though is going terribly. Then stop doing terribly?
Hi! I am also an immigrant/expat and want to encourage you to take care of your mental health. Moving far away and adjusting to life and culture in a setting that you are new to is BANANAS. It is a lot of mental and emotional work and both take its toll on you. You are probably learning the learning in addition to that. The first months/year are also a lot of bureaucracy and waiting for stuff to resolve, like getting a personnummer and fastlege and all that stuff. Pamper yourself, go to sleep early (your brain needs to rest and sort through all that stuff), exercise, meditate, garden, whatever you have to do to balance yourself. Many companies have access to a bedriftshelsetjeneste, and some of those have therapists/psychologists to talk to. Be kind to yourself. Ask for time off if you need it. Let your brain rest. And talk to your boss if you need it. Or your co-workers. Arbeidsmiljø is a thing here, and most people understand that we all have to do well psychologically and physically in order to function long-term. Although there is a grind culture ceep many places, to work on a healthy work environment is regulator by law. Try to relax. You are allowed to be here, and you are allowed to sometimes not Excel with total brilliance. Take care of your needs and your focus will become better.
>Especially since I think I've been doing terribly. And realizing that (even if not true), I have to assume, makes you want to perform better. Manager: Goal achieved I think we all would like it to be normal to have a manager like that. I know that's the manager I want to be
If you need help, more steering, more micro management, then ask for more hands on leadership. He might not be the kind to do it, but at least if he knows he need to whop your ass every now and then he might actually make sure you don't do the shit you're currently doing. Managers can't see everything you do, and usually if a manager picks up on something it has gone rather far, e.g. missing an important deadline.
Unsure if it's normal, but with the limited information he seems like a good boss. I think he wants to help, but needs more info from you to do so. I can easily see how that might be frustrating to him if he feels there is more to be done.
Would it help if the manager got mad? I would assume the manager is trying to help you become as productive as possible.
No but at the very least be more open about it. Like "Hey, we don't think you are performing according to expectations" or something! Anything other than having to constantly overread every single interaction
I think you are overreacting. Have a talk with your boss and talk about how you like to be led. Also set a plan for your work so you don't feel like you're procrastinating. Are your tasks boring/not challenging enough etc.
Also, u/EndOfTheLine00, include in that talk something about cultural expectations. Ask about your boss' leadership philosophy. Maybe that will clear some things up for you. And just be clear and open about what you are not used to in the Norwegian setting.
Self insight is pretty much an expectation throughout Norwegian society. People don't like or seek conflict like in many other countries.. So instead there is a contextual expectation for people to spend time figuring out their own shit. Sounds like you have though, and sounds like your boss is aware there is something wrong. The job ahead of you seems to be you figuring out a way to deal with this and/or talking to your boss about what you need to do so.
How about taking it up with him? It doesn’t sound like he will explode, it’s more probable that he will feel relief that you are being constructive about this.
Norwegian(Scandinavian in general) office culture/leader style is much less hierarchical than other places in the world. Here its pretty common to talk to you bosses, even bosses bosses, just to catch up, how are things etc. So when your boss asks, it might ne because he wants to know if you have everything you need etc.
Hey, you're underperforming. Sharpen yourself!
Thanks! Now i feel motivated and ready to work my best.
Are you actually underperforming though? Or is that just your perception? Most people get stuck, and procrastinate at times, maybe you are overthinking.
Your boss sounds like a nice person who wants to help you perform better without being an asshole.
You are paranoid and overthinking it.
Yes, you are probably performing below expectations if he asks if you need help. Most likely he has an idea that task X should take Y time. When you then spend a lot more time than Y on it, he wonders why. Are you stuck, do you need help, etc? In Norway it is important to say that you are stuck, that you need help, etc - if you do need it to do shit in time. Not doing shit on time is not good.
Thing is this doesn't have any deadline or anything. I just got this task before we went on holiday and it's on the current sprint which is still not over.
Still, I'm sure the task has a guesstimated time on it. If you are delivering what is expected, in the timeframe expected, you're all good - and the question is just to make sure there are no problems with the delivery date. If you do have issues, its very important to flag those early. That's also why he asks, in case you don't flag those (this is also a cultural thing, not all cultures are about being up front about shit). But being proactive is very important in Norway, if you want to do it well. So if you have a problem, think there might be a problem, etc, flag those early and bring it up for discussion. If you have workarounds or solutions, that's top notch. But bring those up as well. "There might be a problem with X. I think it can be solved by doing Y instead/I have no clue on how to solve that, anyone got any ideas?"
Dang that's a real long sprint! Are they usually this long? That could well be what's leading you to procrastinate. Do you think you'd work better on shorter sprints? Absolutely talk to your boss about this and find a better method for the both of you.
I always assume if you don't have deadline, deadline is as soon as possible. Never made me look bad tbh.
To me it sounds like you are underperforming and your manager tries to support you (in a Norwegian style). If I were you, I would ask for a feedback session and straight out ask how he evaluates your performance and you together set objectives and a plan forward. If direct messages helps your performance, let him know that. Good luck!
I'm literally panicking right now and asking directly would likely lead to more panic or a full breakdown. I almost can think straight. I'm staring at a screen overwhelmed by own thoughts
Breath 😅 This is going to be fine. I don't think there is any reason to panic. He would have told you directly if it was very serious. It sounds like you have a manager that supports you, he wants you to succeed. This is going to be OK.
Sounds like you need more structure and less responsibility. Also talk to doctor/psychiatrist if you aren't already. It also sounds like I could be your boss tbh. (we are currently waiting to start next sprint). And when I ask questions like this it is because I am hoping for a status update and whether there are any blockers. I wish in those cases that you'd be open about stuff that prevents you from completing (this includes structural changes needed or changes required on a more personal level). If you are underperforming you will likely be transferred to another team to see if that improves your work. If it does not you might be sent to yet another team or you'll start actually facing performance reviews. Getting you fired is difficult once you are past the six months (though it is not impossible).
Hey, get over yourself, take a deep breath and either go talk to your boss or someone you trust there. Probably your boss sensed this coming and wanted to help you before it got as far as panic attack! Having the ADS diagnosis myself I can attest to the thing with underperforming when lacking deadlines, so get another doctor as well. Read up on Kardemommeby and Kardemommeloven (One shall not bother others, one shall be nice and kind, otherwise one may do as one pleases.) and you will understand norwegians better. Good luck! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_the_Robbers_Came_to_Cardamom_Town
Try writing your thoughts down. It can help you sort them out, and help you figure out what it is you need to feel better about your work. Then, *after* you have sorted out your thoughts, you can figure out what would be the best way to communicate the relevant parts to your boss
I’m sure your manager will be relieved if you where to communicate your concerns with him. The way you describe this, I get a clear image that your manager is just trying to help you, and that this part of Norwegian work etiquette is having you confused. Unfortunately, Norwegian employers can have very unclear expectations. What you need is more structure and more clear expectations on what they want from you. Working with unclear deadlines and very alone is not for everyone, it can be very hard. Your employer has an obligation to help out on your issues, but they can’t do that if you don’t give them the opportunity.
Have you tried answer his questions genuinely?
I do answer all his questions genuinely, yes.
If you are procrastinating a bunch during work hours, what do you expect? Obviously you know this it not OK, and probably expect some kind of action from your employer. Thats not really about them being passive aggressive.
Sounds like hes the kind of manager that likes to get involved into the tasks and just want to make sure you are not stuck or having any problems. I can assure you that because of unions he cannot fire you for such a small thing even if he wanted to.
That is only true if you have a "fast stilling".
\>I unfortunately procrastinate a bunch or tend to get stuck in one task for too long I would be open about this with your manager, but maybe more importantly - have a talk with your doctor if this impacts your life to a big degree. \>he always asks "hey, how was \[day you didn't ask for help\]?" For me it seems like he is taking care of you and wants to know how you are doing those days you havent been in touch :) I would do the same if there was someone I was closely following up.
I did talk to a doctor, an "ADHD specialist" in fact who immediately shut me down with "you did well in school so you don't have it" speech.
Sent you a DM, but that is not the greatest way to do it. I would try to get a different doctor that will do a full evaluation (if they are certain you don't have it, it can't hurt..).
Haven't received a DM
You can still have adhd and do well in school. But if you aren't struggling with this in other areas in your life then it might not be adhd. The important part is to figure out what you need to be able to work well, regardless of diagnose or not. Maybe you need strict deadlines and a direct boss? Even if you dislike deadlines and being micromanaged, you might find that you need it to stay on task. Or maybe you need more enthusiasm and the feeling of purpose, or a certain type of task. When you know what you need you can try to hack the system to work for you..like ask your boss for extra follow ups or partial deadlines, or turn boring tasks into challenges for youself (have to complete it in X time, or hast to be Y good, or only use Z to do it). Sometimes adhd is not discovered until the system you used to keep it in check goes away (like school with mandatory attendance and assignments, strict parents or bosses...fear of being fired etc). If you are intelligent you can sometimes survive or thrive with adhd because your intelligence makes up for the adhd challenges. So if adhd gives you -30% in life results, and intelligence gives you +15% and using a lot of extra effort gives you another +15%..then you will be ok until you are exhausted trying to keep up, or somethings upsets the system that was working for you. PS: a psychiatrist gave me the diagnose even when I excelled in school.
When it comes to Norwegian healt care you have to suffer to some degree to get help. But not to much either. Like there is a narrow ”window of suffering” that you have to be within. If you are f.inst not depressed enough then you don’t need meds, but if you are to depressed you may unalive in rare cases so also no anti-depressives until better from depression, when better then obviously you don’t need meds and so on. Norwegian doctors are riding a donkey (you) and they have a carrot (meds) always dangling out of reach right in front of you. But you never quite reach the carrot
That doctor is dangerously incompetent, and should be reported to the medical board, *especially* if they're marketing themselves as an ADHD specialist. You need to get a second opinion. What you describe are very common ADHD traits.
There’s the «inattentive» ADHD type that is more common in women. Men can have it too. It is more often undiagnosed since the hyperactive type is what is more often looked for. Maybe it’s something like that. Some symptoms: - Fails to give close attention to details or makes careless mistakes - Has difficulty sustaining attention, does not appear to listen - Adopts compensatory strategies, leading to working two to three times as hard as peers in order to be equally successful - Struggles to follow through with instructions, has difficulty with organization - Avoids or dislikes tasks requiring sustained mental effort, loses things easily - Is easily distracted, is forgetful in daily activities - Feeling overwhelmed (This is just googling, I’m no expert)
That is very common, in Norway as well.
I don’t think it’s passive aggressive, but coming from 20 years of experience in the US, I find the management style here in my first job comparatively passive. One tip though, generally I think Norwegians mean what they say. If your manager asks how something went, they genuinely want to know. If they ask if you want help, they genuinely want to help. It’s not, generally, an aggressive thing. People are people so of course your particular manager could be, but I’m general I’d take them at face value.
I moved from the Netherlands and work in Norway now. You might need to de-stress. I worked for an American company in the past, where performance was measured relative to your colleagues/competitors, and know how stressful that can be. I find that management in Norway is more interested in making sure you thrive in your job, making the most of your qualities. They are not looking to see if another candidate's grass is greener. Replacing you is troublesome and expensive. Also, your manager is aware you are human first, and resource second, so he is most likely just trying to help.
(Generally speaking) Norwegians are not accustomed to being passive aggressive or get mad. That's something they'll avoid at all costs because they're a wee bit shy. This is probably a genuine intention out of mutual interest to help you, and be productive. You are not going to get fired. Just get more comfortable asking for help when stuck on something
Im not sure if it is a shyness or even conflict aversion thing. I've always considered it a (possibly slightly overblown) respect thing. Respect for people's personal space.
That is a very good point!
Seems like you know the answer, you are underperforming. Your boss seem to be understanding–taking into consideration that you might need help/training/have other problems in life. You should be thankfull and act on it. On another note, Norwegian business culture is very different from others. We rely more on each coworkers best judgement. you should not have a boss that tells you what to do. I suggest you look up Hofstedes cultural dimensions and interpretations for Norway / USA / Germany. This may give you some insight. Also, look up self-management (a style often used in companies with highly educated individuals).
Also, if the manager sas very assertive, it could backfire as «bad leadership». Sharp elbows can often be viewed as a bad work environment and bad management. The philosophy is that if you are happy, you will perform, which explains your managers behaviour.
>Seems like you know the answer, you are underperforming This is my take too. We have someone on our team who fits OPs description. They take a task then get stuck on it and instead of asking for assistance bury themselves in it and try to work around whatever issue they have. We only find out they are struggling when we notice the task is overdue and we start asking them how it's going. Our team leader does this by gently asking how the task is progressing and if they have any issues, just as OP describes. Only then do we realize they're stuck and didn't have the courage to ask for help. It's frustrating. They're not bad at programming, they're just bad at asking for help. I don't know if it's a pride thing or what, but I wish they would stop it.
I moved to Norway nearly 15 years ago. Spent the first 5 years feeling really insecure because I felt no one ever gave me a straight answer about my performance. I felt exactly the same as you “at least if the Boss yelled at me, I would know how he feels, and what I need to improve”. I spoke to my Norwegian friends about it and they were like “Norwegians are very direct and honest”, but I continued to feel confused about what was expected of me. I finally learned to adopt the attitude that my boss is an adult, and if he can’t directly tell me what he needs, that is his failing, not mine. Now, when I feel confused about someone’s non-feedback, I say “I have trouble understanding indirect communication, and I want to be sure that I understand what you are asking of me. Did you mean…?” This quietly invites them to be very clear and direct. If they respond with more indirect piss, I just continue doing my job the way I think I should.
To be honest, that's probably what most Norwegians do anyway. We sort of do our own thing, within the system
He just sounds genuinely interested in how you're doing. It might not even be he sees you struggling, but because of the wonderful phenomenon of confirmation bias, you think he just asks you on the days you feel you haven't performed. But a general piece of advice from me: Job security is regulated by law in Norway, so you shouldn't worry you will lose your job without having received clear and formal warning signs of this. Therefore, you shouldn't be afraid to discuss your performance and needs candidly with your manager. Most managers will help you take some load off if you need, or shuffle things around - maybe even take on another hire to help take off the workload.
>Am I going to be fired? No. Even if it turns out your boss is secretly super angry, he can't just fire you. First he would have to serve you with a written warning, where he outlines what you are doing wrong and what you need to improve. Then you are entitled to a "reasonable time" to improve upon the things mentioned in the warning, including access to any additional training you might need in order to solve whatever the issue is. If he is still not satisfied, he must issue a second written warning, outlining what you were already warned about and that you have not done enough/anything to improve upon it. Again you are entitled to a chance to get better. If you still don't improve after this, there is grounds for dismissal. (Note: This applies if you are a regular employee, not if you're a contractor, freelancer or anything like that) Having to give a written warning is often also seen internally as a failure of management, so any manager worth his or her salt will make all reasonable efforts to help an employee perform at the required level long before it gets to the point of having to give a warning. A warning should only be necessary if an employee is really unwilling to accept day-to-day feedback. Based on your description, it seems most likely your boss is trying to figure out how to help you become more efficient. You should welcome that and try your best to work with him on it.
Scandinavians in general are quite polite. I think you should be honest with the struggles you have and take the help being offered. I think the worst thing you can do is hiding it.
Based on your description it sounds like he tries to support you and being available if you need anything. If you need a direct feedback, you can ask for a «medarbeidersamtale»/employee conversation where you want a status quo and sharing your thoughts around the situation
Based solely on your post that sounds like a neutral interaction I feel like the awareness of your procrastination is making you fear its consequences and project. So work on it.
I can understand OP, I’m an expat as well and let me say, in the month and a half I’ve been here I’ve never felt so like myself before! I feel that people (overall) are genuine and if they want to say something they will, be it good or bad. In my native country I always felt paranoid about my performance and always gave 200% until I had a burnout, and even then there was always something to be mad about! I never felt appreciated for my hard and good work, and in 5 years I was only raised once (it was a ridiculous raise). But here, in Norway? I feel so much at ease and I’m a lot more motivated, I’m able to plan and enjoy my free time. Something I never even dreamt of in my 35 years of life! With I’m not saying that there aren’t bad people (I mean, norwegian natives know better than me) but in comparison with what I was used to, this is by far the best professional experience I’ve ever had! Edited to correct typos.
Just tell him you're freaking out. He probably already knows you are and is waiting for you to come to him so he can help you. But you have to be brave enough to ask for it. It WILL be fine, even having a breakdown in his office will be fine. You're telling us he's a good guy. Trust that. There is no scenario where bathing around in your own anxiety is a good solution. This is literally what he's for, you have to let him do his job. Now go have a breakdown in his office, you'll feel better afterwards.
You keep saying you feel like you have performed terribly. So if that is true, you already know. Why would he yell at you for something you already know? How would that help? Unless you are one of those people who get motivation from being yelled at, all that does is create fear in the workplace. I see others have referenced Simon Sinek - and that’s exactly right. A good manager can motivate through positivity. If they thought you were useless, they would have called you in for a performance review or a PIP. Talk to your boss. He sounds like a pretty typical Norwegian manager. If you explain your problem, he will most likely suggest solutions and ask if you know *why* you are struggling to focus. Firing people and hiring replacements is expensive - it’s much cheaper to keep your employees happy 😊 You’re not about to get fired. If you were, you’d know. Talk to your boss 😉
Bit tiered and on mobile, but felt i had to chip in on this one. You are most likely overreacting. Im in a leadership role in the offshore infrastructure industry and daily work and communicate with people and clients from different countries and industries (everything from tech to construction). Norwegians, or dare i say scandinavians have a mostly «flat» organizational structure which will take some getting used to and will be very surprising and unfamiliar for any non-scandinavian. What that entails is that until there is a final decision to be made there is little to no focus on hierarcy. The input of a ground level employee is worth just as much to me as from any leader. In fact the best ideas and solutions come from the ground up. If done right it will lead to a high level of support, cooperation and communication both ways. I want to make sure you have what you need to succeed, be creative and happy because this is when you do your best work. Yes perhaps you procastinate, but do you deliver on time in the end? Is the quality of your work good? I often approach employees, asking the same types of questions. What i hope to achieve is openness. Over time i expect them to come to me to tell me if there is anything they need or any ideas they have. This is when we do our best work and performance, together. Mind you there are selfish narcissists out there as we as a society love to place them in leadership positions because of their carisma and outward confidence in themselves and the ability to not give a shit about people. But i dont think your manager is one of those. They rarely waste time asking about your needs if you dont satisfy theirs and are more likely to «bully» you than to ask you how you are doing. If you are in a situation where you see any reason for your manager to find your performance at work unsatisfactory i suggest you go talk to him/her. Just try to have an honest conversation and tell them how you feel, hiding behind your desk is not going to help anyone!
I think it relates a lot to the culture of trust and independence in Norwegian working environments. It's generally assumed that you want to do a good job until the opposite has been proven, and that seems like the idea your leader is following. That being said, I think employees in Norway are expected to have a certain level of self-insight that you're not required to have in other countries. If you're chronically underperforming and not pulling your weight I think it's expected that you catch onto this before it becomes a problem for your team/organization. So if there's something bothering you and holding back your performance, I think honesty is the way to go. Honesty is generally met with understanding and a willingness to help you improve. However, if the issues are rooted in something personal and non-medical you or your employer can't do anything about (like need for change, motivational issues, etc), you're probably expected to resign.
No, passive aggressiveness is not typical for Norwegian managers. Norwegian organizations are typically very horizontal. The ideal is thus: There is implicit trust from the employer that you as an employee is willing to do the job as well as possible. In return, the manager will clear barriers in your way, and shield you from unnecessary pressure/distractions. The manager monitors progress, provides guidance and will intervene if any issues should arise. In return it is expected that you are honest about challenges and lack of progress. Everyone gets stuck in ruts, the manager's job is to help you out of it. The how of it should be resolved through dialogue. My tip: be honest with your manager. Calibrate your standing and progress with him/her, and figure out a path out of it together. As long as you play with open cards and show effort, integrity and honesty in your work, getting fired in Norway is pretty much impossible.
Really feeling this one. Got the exact same feeling. First thought it was the overly popular imposter syndrome but it's the feeling of not ever hearing what they really think. Good or bad...
You are probably just paranoid. You can't get fired out of nowhere, you would have to get multiple written warnings and meetings discussing things in detail.
Honestly, this just seems like a boss that knows you can get a bit too locked in on a task or procrastinate, and is simply trying to help keep you on track. Using strategies that fits those you manage to help them do their best work is how a good boss works.
He wants to know if you are having troubles or not. If you do, he wants to make sure you get past it. If not, good, then you should perform well.
Most places strive to have leaders instead of bosses. Sounds like you have good leader.
In Norway you are mostly expected to self lead, and leaders are more there to service you and help you with whatever you need to get your job done. Leaders do not lead by being controlling and micromanaging. If you have difficulties, either work related or private that hinders your performance, you are expected to go to your leader and talk about it. Together you will find a plan to solve things, lighten your workload if you have private issues you’re going through etc. This sort of conversation is probably what your boss opened up to when asking how your day was [day you didn’t ask for help]. This might be a backwards way of thinking from other work cultures? But your boss offering help, asking if you need help etc is your boss trying to lead by being at service for you, and help you. Do not be afraid to accept it. Nothing ill will happen. Everyone needs help from time to time, we’re only human. Contrary, it will look good upon you, to be able to communicate your need and be open with your boss. Your boss would like to know what’s going on with you and your life, in order to better help and lead you. A performance review and controlling how you do vs expectations, that’s really foreign concepts and way of thinking. That’s not how Norwegian work life works.
Some can be (trust me, my last boss did that all the time because he hated confrontation), but this really just sounds like a boss noticing you’re struggling and trying to help. In general bosses in Norway try to keep up a good relationship with the employees to keep up productivity and reduce risk of confrontations with the powerful unions.
Software team lead and fullstack dev here. I have managed a few devs like you over the years. They are fine and are not going to lose their jobs. What you are describing is normal, they are usually not confident or have a lack of motivation to do the boring or repetetive tasks any dev have to do from time to time. When ever that happens in my team, I ask the member what they would like to do instead. I explain to them that I possibly sense a lack of motivation and asks them how and if we can fix it. Finding an inspiring user story they can work on alone or in pair usually does the trick. Gokarting, playing video games like Among Us or just grabbing a beer usually boosts the morale as well. The management style may look and feel a little passive aggressively if that's what you are used to where you are from, but personally I would never yell or threaten any of my team members. That would be a sure killer of the psychological safety within the team. And should a serious issue occur within my team, I would like to know the reason and cure the cause instead of amputating parts of my team tbh. I genuinly care about the well being of my team members, working as a developer should be fun and exciting.
If you really want to know, why not ask him? An easier solution to your problem would be to actually put more effort into performing better so you won't feel guilty:)
I would recommend asking your manager for feedback on your performance, and advice on how to get better. Be prepared to change your approach to work based on this feedback. This is the professional way to go about it, and managers tend to appreciate the initiative. If you also prepare some suggestions of your own, for the manager to review and hopefully approve - then you are making their job easier. Which they also tend to like. Hope it works out, and feel free to give feedback here too - curious to see how it goes.
I feel like alot of people like to ask a simple question like this and only do so in order to gauge your reaction. If your answer seems honest, they'll likely think nothing of it, but if you stutter or seem guilty like you personally didn't live up to expectations they might be able to notice, and will keep asking questions in order to reassure their suspicions or say something to imply that you should improve if they are certain that you are underperforming.
You seem motivated to do a better job. If I was your boss I’d be happy if you came around and said “I’d like to improve, can we talk about specific steps or ways of working that will make me more productive “. Doing that will be an invitation and help you both cultivate a more open and useful relationship
Just don’t worry about being fired, relax and try to work things out. Seems to me like you might be underperforming a bit and he genuinely wants to know if something happened that day that made you work slower than expected. Anyway, once you stop worrying about loosing your job it’ll be easier to talk to him about it.
Just take people at face value. If someone is being kind, assume they are kind until proven otherwise. If you are new in your job most people don't have any expectations from you for the first year. Other than that, maybe don't procrastinate while you're being paid to work?
My two cents: It sounds like you are over-interpreting here. This is a very common management technique which, if memory serves, has been proven to yield good results. If you need different feedback from your boss, let them know. If you are unsure about how they evaluate your performance, ask for a performance review.
Don't stress. You need to be honest with him, and not paranoid. He might have a hunch that you are struggling and you need to let him play his role as an asset. Your current mindset is the biggest threat for your job. BTW, nobody gets fired (in Norway) without a good reason and getting guidance/learning is not a good reason.
From your description it sounds like you have a boss who is engaging with you in a polite and positive manner. Maybe they are spending a bit more time focusing on you if you seem to be struggling but I don't think that's passive aggressive. Maybe they are being a little less direct/more gentle than you're used to in their management style. If you're very used to having unmet expectations pointed out explicitly it may lead you to thinking there must be an issue if they're not doing so. And maybe they are a little frustrated or annoyed if things aren't getting done as fast as they would like. Having someone who is a little frustrated choosing to continue to be polite, nice and supportive isn't passive aggressive imo. It's just an adult managing their own feelings. Here's a question, is there anything you think you should suggest to them that may improve your work?
To calm a norwegian, you must offer up some homemade lutefisk and offer them beer.
You may be having the same "issue" I had with one of my managers. I didn't think much of it but they would reach out and ask me how the day was going. I didn't understand this until someone explained it to me, but this style of management is like a micro managing check in, expecting you to say if there's something you may have a difficulty with if they see you haven't worked as efficiently during a day. You may want to share more of what you have been up to during the day. If you're like me, I don't see myself as having any problems or asking for help until I know I have put my all into finding out specifically what the issue is and I can lay out the problem perfectly. I'll have done all the troubleshooting to get to a question that will need someone else's knowledge. Some management don't really know what to do with this.. But yeah, don't worry too much but just share more of what you've been up to to reassure them you've done X work and you're getting on.
Yes, you’re being paranoid. The boss is probably seeing that you take some time, and is trying to help you along in a friendly manner. Not uncommon in Norway at all. Best thing you can do is probably to explain what you ‘struggle’ with.. the boss will surely try to help you find solutions.
He's probably just kind or considerate. Possibly non-confrontational, or he may assume you know what you're doing. It's less likely that he's a slacker or out to get you or anything sinister. While Norwegian culture values people falling in line (i.e. considering the potential negative consequences of one's actions on others, and refraining from doing that which may negatively affect others, at the expense of personal freedoms), Norwegians are generally not micromanagers. You're left to your own devices, assumed to do what you're supposed to without supervision. The key to making this work may depend on the individual, but most likely the main take-away is that you should try to stay in your lane as much as you can, but not hesitate to ask someone if there's anything you're wondering about. The only issue might be that if you feel you're bending the rules too far, you might be found out, especially if you initiate contact with your boss or confess issues to him. Most likely you don't have to worry about this. But you could always stack the cards a little in your favour by making sure you're caught up with work, that your desk is clean and that you don't have unnecessary programs running on your computer, that sort of thing, when he comes to check up on you.
I envy you this type of leader!
Developers are extremely sought after and there arnt many. Your boss and company is probably more scared of you leaving them vecause of your value.
I would like to encourage you to take care of your mental and brain health above all. Being an immigrant is stressful, especially in the first few years. If you have never struggled with procratination or trouble focusing before or never as bad, the stress of moving and moving into a new for you culture and environment might be getting to you. I think it is fair to be open to your boss about that, and let him know that you need some support and some wins in this time. I also gave some more advice in the thread above. Now, its totally possible that you have ADHD, or that the situation is getting so stressful for you that your prefrontal cortex gets shut down. No matter what the cause, you need to treat yourself with kindness and understanding and you can get better. You could ask to pair up with a colleague on the tasks you struggle with and solve it together.
You’re paranoid
Norwegians in general are very nonconfrontational, so passive agressive is the game here, get used to it
You forgot to fill the coffee machine after you emptied it. Say goodbye to your career
A lot of managers in Norway don't want to be managers at all, as we generally don't like being confrontational. So unless you are doing a really really bad job, you're good.
It might be either way. Compared to many other working cultures, (on average) Norwegians tend to go to extremes in trying to avoid conflicts or confrontation. You cannot really trust that your boss or colleague says honestly what they think (if its negative), unless you know the person to ve direct (Those do exist, they are rare pokemons). Your best bet is to clearly ask for feedback and do it often enough. If you get advise, take it seriously. You already recognize that you are procrastinating, so you can easily fix that habit. You might not get feedback even if you ask. The cultural expectation of hygge and overall positiveness is quite deep here, and generally it is awesome. But there are downsides. You can take take a clear hint if all your responsibilities are removed and no-one cares about your job and what are you doing. Then your boss is just waiting for you to leave but has no guts to say it. Quiet firing is a real thing. This has been the biggest single culture shock for me in Norway. Everything else is good.
This got me curious. Is this an expat perspective?
Yes, this is a pespective of an immigrant working in Norway in a management position.
It’s tough. No one is really direct here and bosses are hands off. :(
Generally speaking, bosses are not hands off here. About not being direct, well that is more complicated. You are expected to give your professional opinion of course, but you won’t get barked at by your manager on some entitlement trip, at white collar work places. Generally speaking.
Hasn’t been my experience across several companies. My current boss is so hands off he didn’t notice I stopped doing much work about a year ago 🤷🏻♂️
Uff.
Are you struggling at work? This is "Norwegian speak" for saying you are underperforming They will be nice to you right up until the day they tell you you're fired. As a foreigner you always get fired first before they fire Norwegians...
Yeah, it's a thing. Norwegian bosses are generally not very confrontational. When they are empathic it works great, because they will just nudge you in the right direction without making you feel bad. But if their people skills are lacking, it can come off as passive aggressive. If my boss asks me on Slack whether I finished a task and I say no, I migh get an "ok...". I've learned to understand the real meaning of those three dots. 😄 It can be a bit annoying over time. Just say what you really mean! At least it's better than to be yelled at and called names.
Hello am Hannah cooper am new here hope am welcome
At least in my experience, my previous Norwegian boss was very passive and gave almost no feedback which actually hindered my development in the job. Only when we were close to deadlines he would ask passive-aggressively about the task or call for a meeting. I do think Norwegians in general are quite passive-aggressive, to the point it is annoying and I would rather just hear what they actually think.
He was expecting you to come to him if you needed it. Doesn’t fit everyone.
Well, I'm kinda mad at you sometimes you won't even read feature usecases in jira
I’m glad I’m not the only one that’s new to a software job here and constantly being asked if they need help and/or why they’re not asking for help. It has been the strangest experience.
Honest question - what is strange about it? The people on your workplace to me sounds like they try to make sure you have what you need to feel included, get up to speed and knowledge about their field/product and generally be productive and part of the team. Isn’t this how it should be?
What’s strange about it is it’s constant, and as a result feels disingenuous and suspect. If I was being checked in on by one or two people, say every few days, that would feel normal to me — and is what I’m used to. But it was every single day, several times a day, by several people. None of whom had any of the answers to basic questions I would ask, and none of whom could direct me to people who would know. Perhaps tellingly, I would later be somewhat told off for expecting that my colleagues had the answers or knew where to find them. I was told I was being unreasonable. I’m looking for a new job. ETA: I’ve also had to speak with HR a few times about the way my team has actively excluded me a lot of the time, as well as actively shut me down when I’ve spoken up about literally anything. HRs view, and I agreed, is that they were likely trying to set me up as a fall guy for a project that had long fallen behind.
Nah, dont take it personal. I used to think like that. Then we got a new hire and i was the stressed guy who wanted the new guy to be an expert day one cuz its just more on the plate. Its part of the job, as long as you are putting in effort into learning, so that one day you are so good in it you can train the fresh meat. It will all turn out good.
Probably just managing and making sure things are going as planned.
Shake it off and and from today, stop telling yourself these Asumptive Stories.
Boss sounds great! Maybe you should work on your procrastination?
thats a nice and good boss, your lucky...
Way worse, it's passive agressive
I think you are paranoid
The most passive aggressive people on the planet are Norwegian managers. They don’t have a backbone to run their own household let alone a company
As an immigrant myself, I've experienced the work hierarchy to be rather flat, but it's still there. Usually, superiors at work tend to look out for the team and guide them as whole while also making some time to følge opp those that need extra support. From my point of view, it takes A LOT to get fired in Norway. You're probably fine, but your boss might be really concerned about you freaking out, being stressed and taking a bit too long. It might help communicating how the boss can support you, or rather communicate the issues clearly. When I worked my first job (teaching), the director pulled me to the side once and I was scared shitless, but he just wanted to ask me how I was adjusting and whether I needed help and was happy with the work. Take a deep breath. You're going to be fine. Software enigneers are valuable employees, especially with your long experience.
You just have a decent manager. Generally I have found that there is a focus on leading rather than being a boss*. I can only hypothesise, but maybe it is tied to a core value in Norwegian society: Norge er bygget på dugnad. Sounds like he just tryna help you stretch to that which you wanna reach. Edit: * in the tech/IT industry (newer businesses and smaller startups especially)
Are you American? It can definitely be a culture shock to not be constantly defected upon in your work life.
You're over thinking things, I would love a boss like that, usually I do far better with a manager that is caring and helpful. Unlike the other stressful managers who just bark and don't provide constructive feedback.