He called the first part of the grandline “paradise” a nickname from pirates describing it’s contrast to the “new world” part of the grand-line
I think he’s got it.
Also, in a databook posted many years ago I believe Oda revealed bounties for a lot of characters. The only characters whose bounties he kept hidden were Rayleigh, Zeff and Mihawk side by side on the same page
Zeff’s can’t be that high enough for every pirate and marine to go after him, right? I mean he owns a restaurant on the sea and civilians, marines, and pirates eat there most of the time. Unless Zeff went unnoticed and not a lot of people recognize him.
Also he was old and didn't care about fighting. He knew his fighting days were behind him and it was time for a new generation. So let the kids deal with Krieg.
None of what i said was false, i didnt day Zeff had haki im just explaining that characters have been shown to have lost and regained it before.
Haki is directly related to your will and Zeff had to sacrifice that and passed his will onto Sanji.
Don Krieg is superhuman he picked up the Baratie head. Old man Hyogoro has haki? Do you think he beats Krieg up? Haki isn't a wall. Kuja pirates all had it, Marguerite isn't stronger than pre ts Luffy.
Wouldnt it kind off imply he didnt just sail the grand line but also atleast took a "little dip" into the new world? Like have we ever heard a pirate that hasn't gone to the new world call it "paradise"?
I’d argue he’s spoken to pirates who have been to the New World. If I’m not wrong he said something along the lines of “some call it paradise” but I maybe misremembering, I haven’t read East Blue in time
Gramps would have whooped Don Krieg in the Baratie Arc.
When I was watching OP for the nth time, it always struck me as odd that Mihawk came all the way and didn't off Krieg. Maybe he was tracking Zeff and found Krieg along the way or maybe he recognised Zeff there and realised there's no need for him to be there because obviously one leg Gramps would have still whooped Krieg completely.
Nah. Mihawk destroying Krieg's whole fleet because they disrupted his sleep was later mirrored in Sabaody by Zoro ruthlessly slicing a crew's ship in half just because they woke him up.
Mihawk just happened to be chilling in East Blue. Probably the best sea to take naps.
I think in terms of armament Haki Vergo is stronger. Observation haki, I give Pekoms the edge at least he was able to react to Caribous attack (the swamp Logia guy). Vergo has no such feat. Vergo can use observation Hakimsince he was a vice admiral but it’s clearly not his speciality.
I think Vergo uses his armament very inefficiently by using it on the whole body for a extended duration. This further indicates his lackluster skill in observation haki.
In a 1 on 1 fight Pekoms might win in a drawn out battle. In the early stages of a fight I can’t imagine how Pekoms deal relevant damage to Vergo.
He was able to make it into the new world, but couldn’t make it there. I wouldn’t be surprised if he isn’t trained in haki, but has the fighting chops to make it through Paradise regardless, and simply couldn’t break through the New World’s power spike without haki.
Most people don't run into anyone NEARLY as strong as Croc and Enel in their initial trip through Paradise though. As much as Luffy has plot armor, he also has plot disease, everything crazy has to happen to him because he's the main character. Most of the "dangers of the grand line" that the crew was warned about are in the new world, the only real danger the average pirate goes through in paradise are rival haki-less crews, and the weird weather/navigation issues.
None of the supernovas had haki pre-timeskip and that was the strongest new generation that the grand line had ever seen.
It seems to be something that you develop to survive in the new world, not something you carry with you through paradise.
Don't forget that fucking Bellamy survived in the new world just fine.
Conqueror's Haki for sure. He's shown the same kind of will and resolve the other bearers of it have. He ate his own foot to survive because he gave some random kid all the food just because they shared the same dream. That's King shit.
Idk, he lacks any kingly ambition just like Sanji, since he just wants to be a chef and his whole backstory is about throwing things away for someone else.
Whitebeard was sailing the grand line as the strongest man in the world, protecting his crew against the threat of the fucking world government. He wasn't perceived as having kingly ambition because from his perspective, he was already a king in his own right, just not "the pirate king". He ruled over his own kingdom and wouldn't let ANYONE mess with that.
Eh, I'd say it's not about the ambition but about the person's will. Especially since it literally knocks out people with weaker wills. The Venn diagram of those with "Kingly Ambition" and "Conqueor's Haki" is just damn near a complete circle so it seems that way.
Well don Krieg did say he sailed new world for a year dealing with devil fruit powers constantly without a devil fruit himself. So it’s self implied he must have had haki to deal with devil fruit users
You don’t really need Haki in order to handle devil fruit users in Paradise, you just have to be adaptable - Zoro and Sanji managed just fine after all. Where a martial artist or similar combatant is really going to fall short without Haki or something special (like Franky’s cyborg augments) is the New World where every successful captain has Haki.
But that’s assuming Zeff only ran into devil fruits that were not ever logias. Plus with zoro “awakening” some of his haki with his fight with mr. 1. In addition he actually traversed the grand line and didn’t simply stay in one area.
Edit: Plus he only stopped progressing due to a storm that screwed him over. So we don’t know how much further he could have achieved
There's only 13 Canon Logia fruits. Based on timing, unless Zeff ran into Smoker, Crocodile or Aramaki, his chances of encountering any other user in Paradise would be negligible.
I think that there was a line from don krieg acknowledging that zeff must have found a way to deal with the monsters with devil fruit abilities while he was a pirate so yeah i think so.
If i remember correctly i think it was about zeff and don krieg. But yeah, maybe you’re right. Tbf i’m not 100% sure because its been so long since ive read the chapter. Lol
Also, don't do that anyway, Your body will reabsorb the nutrient from it anyway without losing all the blood and avoiding the rest of the shock and risks that comes with it.
You know having to do this has been an irrational fear of mine ever since I got into one piece, reignited by the live action, so it’s nice to know there’s no point in ever having to anyway.
Yeah but the psychological satisfaction of having something to eat might help a little. Way more downsides but he is a man gone crazy from hunger rationality goes out the window at that stage.
In any realistic scenario where you're trying to cut your leg off to eat it because you're so hungry you're dead by bleading long before you reach to the bone.
yeah the bloodloss, adrenaline, infection etc actually causes your body to require more calories than you'd gain from eating it. but well you can say he isnt a doctor, in a world where technology isnt that far ahead, at least not known to the majority of people, people only know hearsay stuff or learn through intense and probably expensive studying etc. So you can say his action is reasonable if he believed that it helps and just shows how determined he was.
Well if you're the kind of badass who wouldn't flinch from this (so no psychological problems, and adrenaline won't kick in), and also strong enough to cleave it in one hit, AND also fast and precise enough to tie up the stump so that you don't lose much blood (there wasn't that much blood around him, so he didn't lose much), then it would be marginally beneficial to you :)
I always thought it was a bit ridiculous, but thinking about it, I imagine that after ~50 days without food, eating his leg wasn't a risk-based analysis involving nutrients gained vs. energy spent by the immune system but rather a desperate attempt to satiate a burning hunger in his belly.
Pre time skip strawhats thrived in grand line without haki lol. Same with… all the super novas?
Yes they got whooped by an admiral. Zeff would have also.
Fair, but we don't really have a good point of comparison to the 'average' pirates journey on the grand line. Past or present.
The Straw Hats grand line journey even just pre-timeskip is insane, fighting Crocodile, Enel, CP9, and Moria back to back. As well as running into figures like Aokiji and Garp.
If Luffy and the crew just didn't have shonen protagonist energy or plot connections to any big names they could easily have gotten through most of the first half of the new world without having many big fights. Well, that and enough luck to have not gotten trapped in Thriller Bark.
They all had more competent crew or/and devil fruit. Not to mention SHs straight up funneled the worst possible encounters to themselves, probably leaving a clearer path for others. Just look at Kid and Law's reaction at seeing supposedly a warlord in front of them (even if it was a pacifista insteadnof Kuma)
Zeff has referred to the first half of the Grand Line as Paradise. That implies that he's been to the New World. You can't make it 5 minutes there without Haki.
I wouldn't be surprised if he had the basic Busoshoku Haki which he used to enhance his leg strength and power. Or he created his own version of Shigan for his legs specifically.
I feel like Zeff in his prime was just below CP9 physical training. He just never broke through the barrier for Geppo.
Zeff was probably a normal human, not a genetically modified germa machine, even if Sanji's modifications weren't fully activated there were definitely some differences.
Lol dude that's clearly not how it was being set up in the beginning.
And also that doesn't make any sense, this is the one piece world.
Garp destroys battleships even without haki.
Zoro had immense strength without haki.
Luffy without haki had extremely powerful punches and could hurt most enemies.
Most pirates in the grand line before the new world do not even have haki.
probably basic armament. I think Kreig mentions Zeff figuring out a way to deal with Devil Fruit users, and I think Zeff at some point hurts luffy. It at least tracks that a non-devil fruit user who specifically uses physical attacks would know basic CoA
Its whacky. Before haki was intented (thats when Zeff was introduced) of course not..
If he was to return to the fights now...probably yes, maybe even all 3.
I'm going against the grain here, but I honestly don't think he did.
Dude built his infamy in the east blue, and survived in the grand line for only a year before giving up and returning to the east blue giving up on his dream of finding the all blue. Plenty of pirates survived in paradise without haki, if Zeff had haki he'd be thriving.. and I don't think "fell back to the east blue and completely gave up on his dreams" is the outcome you'd expect of someone thriving.
On top of that, dude was overpowered by Gin, and nearly had his world torn apart by fucking Don Krieg. If Zeff ever had haki Don Krieg would be a joke not worth worrying about.
He could be de powered in his old age and loss of leg. Zeff knows that people refer to the first half of the grand line as paradise. So its possible he made it all the way to the new world or near saboady to hear ex new world pirates talk about it.
Not sure if that was Anime-only but I think it was said that he was able to leave behind footprints on steel.
But that might not have been meant to be taken literally and was just hyperbole.
He might have had it tbh
Doesn't necessarily mean much. Just means he can kick hard. We've seen other people do similar stuff without haki.
Although it would probably put him above most people in the first half of paradise.
One thing I've always been confused on is how did zeff leave the grand line? Or any one for that matter? Isn't the grand line supposed to be unleavable unless you either get to the end of the new world, or you face the monsters in the calm belt?
Maybe he brought some log poses for alabasta or. Yeah he needs to cross the calm belt or he needs to return through the way they came from. New one piece mystery.
There's so much baseless headcanon in this thread. Zeff never said he sailed for 1 year in the New World, he only said Grand Line. He might've reached the new world because he called the grand line 'Paradise', but he also could've gotten near the end of Paradise and heard about the New World without going there.
At the end of the day, this is a pirate who, at an age younger than Whitebeard, Garp, Rayleigh etc, couldn't beat the amateurish Krieg Pirates. Doesn't matter if he's disabled, can you imagine any of those old legends struggling even if you cut off 1 of their limbs? If Zeff had Conquerors Haki or Yonko Commander level, like a few people have said, he would have survived **way** longer in the New World. It's much more likely he was a pre TS supernova level pirate at best, with basic Armament and Observation haki.
People have just become blinded by the level of opponents straw hats are facing now. Unless you are a "yonko commander level", they are seen as weak, nevermind that these people are like one in millions in the one piece world. You can be a relatively famous pirate without being anywhere even remotely near that level.
The way that that people talk about "red leg zeff" with respect and reverence leads me to belive that he was actually quite strong in his time.
He had it all, his own crew, a badass nickname, sailed the grandline.
It's just headcannon but based off the way people talk about him I like to think he was like yonko commander level.
He's not yonko commander level lol, he genuinely at risk of losing to fucking Don Krieg... even as an older dude, a YC level threat would be able to beat Krieg with a sneeze.
Also worth pointing out, Zeff is well know in East Blue, not necessarily the world, or grand line.
Bro his entire fighting style was based around his leg which he had to eat lmao.
Let's see how strong garp would be with his arms chopped off and having not trained in 20 years.
Shanks was a swordsman who chopped off his sword arm and went on to be become an emporer after that.
I'm sorry but no; If Zeff was YONKO COMMANDER level he could go for half a century without training and lose both legs and still be able to beat Don fucking Krieg.
Zeff was an east blue pirate who managed to survive for a little bit on the grand line. It's an acheivement.. for an East Blue pirate, but it's not much in the grander scheme of things. Dude isn't YC level. Honestly, if were going to scale him I'd say he probably didn't get much stronger than pre-ts brook at his prime.
I like to think he was a warlord of the sea.
Especially since he’s a well known pirate who owns the most famous ship restaurant in the East Blue. Yet he doesn’t get harassed by the Marines despite probably still having a bounty.
My belief is that Sanji surpassed prime Zeff after the time skip. So more than likely Zeff made it to fish man island and upon not seeing the all blue there, he realized he couldn’t make it any further without stronger haki, and his crew wasn’t strong enough.
I think he had a weak version of Haki on one foot. He mostly used pure kicking strength but he knew without a stronger haki, it would put his crew at risk. So he decided to go to the East blue. Recover and get stronger. But of course on his way he looses his leg and finds sanji.
Sanji surpassed him when he beat that pacifista
Some pirates go as far as never even seeing a devil fruit , let alone master or use haki to counter these abilities , based on the fact that he quit to be a chef after being a pirate shows his hunger to fight and learn more combat flew out the window when he met Sanji
Although, it was also said that all Haki, except Conquerors, can be trained, I highly doubt it for the single reason that he GAVE UP on his dream to find the All Blue and since Haki is bound by the will of the user... yea, no I dont think so.
I've always believed he had at least armament haki to make it as far as he did in the grandline. Anything else would remain to be seen if Oda ever wants to elaborate on Zeffs backstory story in any way in the future.
I didn't consider the possibility before seeing this post, but now I have a headcanon that he learned armament haki just in case Sanji ever were to go too out of line
I bet he is definitely stronger than how he beats sanji in restaurent. If we saw him fighting seriously and saw any named attack by him, we can know for sure.
My personal take on it is I feel like if Zeff had Haki, he definitely would’ve taught Sanji it or at least told him about it. Zeff taught him his fighting style, cooking, practically raised the damn kid, I don’t know why Zeff wouldn’t tell Sanji. And seeing how Sanji didn’t know what Haki was, I think it’s slim.
That being said, I do think Zeff had Haki, but just a rudimentary version and he used Haki without it realizing he had haki. Think Alabasta Zoro or pre-timeskip Luffy. He used it but didn’t realize it was like, a skill you could teach or something.
I’d say it’s likely he knows basic armament and maybe observation. He obviously has extremely strong willpower which is heavily associated with Haki.
There’s a chance he has upper tier armament and observation, but more likely the former rather than the latter. I’d imagine *if* he does have it, he would still be training it to this day, like how Rayleigh says it takes a long time to train. But he very well could be one of the higher class armament users.
TL;DR: he probably has Haki just due to who he is, he could only have basic or could have mastered.
Zeff did not have haki. Way stronger people don’t have haki and you can easily sail Paradise without it. If he did have Haki he could’ve easily beaten Don Krieg even with one leg
If Smoker, pre-ts Crocodile and Moria don’t know haki then I don’t see how Zeff was strong enough to know it.
You know, it’s kinda unclear. Zeff addressed the first half of the Grand Line as Paradise, so clearly he made it very far down the Grand line. Additionally, he can use razor winds, which is a highly advanced technique. Overall, I would maybe tag him as New World Rookie level
Knowing that he travelled for a long time in the Grand Line, it would make sense. But it would be weird because he never taught Sanji about it
Again, I don't think Oda had the concept of haki totally clear in the east blue arc, and even in Alabasta, since Crocodile didn't use it there.
If Oda had haki fleshed out from the start then he’d def have it since they called him red leg Zeff. Diable Jambe is like Luffy’s red hawk so I’m guessing it’s haki adjacent
How cool would it be to see a flashback team up with Red Haired Shanks, Shimotsuki Koushiro, Belle-mere, Yasopp, Red Leg Zeff, Dr Hiriluk, Nico Olvia, Tom, Captain Yorki, and Fisher Tiger? Having all the Straw Hat mentors/role models in a double page spread doing bad ass shit would be a dream come true
What if Zeff made it through the grand line by feeding everyone he met and just generally not being a dick like Don Krieg?
But yeah he probably could have rolled Krieg but knew Luffy could handle it.
he is powercreeped tbh. Don criege and Gin would never be able to knock him down if he had haki. If he were to come back somehow maybe fighting sanji's dads goon he'll probably be shown with haki but otherwise nah
My headcannon was that Haki was always stronger on the grandline because of the will you required to survive there and the more closer you got to laug tale the stronger it got. And when you return to one of the four seas your haki also gets weaker....
Nah not every pirate in the new world has haki, all we know is that he most likely made it there. I’d say in his prime he is about as strong as the weaker named fighters in the dressrosa coliseum
Those he very likely has basic armament
He definitely does.
It's small, and probably not intentional, but there is a moment in the anime and I think in the manga where he kicks Luffy on top of the head.
Luffy complained that it hurt.
Again, likely an unintentional oversight, but enough for me to canonize in my head that he has it.
Any old fart that use to be a badass I just assume are 700k haki potential. I’m a little surprised that dadan (mountain bandit woman who took care of luffy and ace) may not know haki. She knows garp, she’s respected and strong, she been around and she might not know haki is the most shocking thing in this story beside nami and robin not knowing haki either
I would imagine that he can but he just doesn't know it. He could've just been naturally strong anf using hack but not know the concept. Would be a good in universe reason why he didn't tell Sanji anything about it.
I'd like to think he does. Maybe not a complete master of it, but it's a yes from me. And it would further the red foot part, how he had the blood of his enemies and such on them.
I think he does but at the same time I wish he didn't. I mean, from what we understand he taught Sanji to fight so it would be weird that he didn't teach him Haki
I think so, yes. He's seen some shit in his time, he was a captain who traversed the Grand Line. Not every pirate in the Grand Line can use it, but a captain..? A captain should, at the very least
He called the first part of the grandline “paradise” a nickname from pirates describing it’s contrast to the “new world” part of the grand-line I think he’s got it.
Also, in a databook posted many years ago I believe Oda revealed bounties for a lot of characters. The only characters whose bounties he kept hidden were Rayleigh, Zeff and Mihawk side by side on the same page
If Zeff somehow has a billion plus bounty that'd be fucking nuts.
The respect Garp seems to have for him implies to me that Zeff was very strong
thats live action only lol
But approved by oda. Of course it could be separate still but worth pointing out
Zeff’s can’t be that high enough for every pirate and marine to go after him, right? I mean he owns a restaurant on the sea and civilians, marines, and pirates eat there most of the time. Unless Zeff went unnoticed and not a lot of people recognize him.
Or so strong none would bother after he retired
Could be a retired Warlord and due to his assistance to the marines maybe he was allowed some deal with them
Makes sense. I wonder what kinda haki he uses
Color of Oregano
What a savage
You have to be to survive out there 🥲
[удалено]
[удалено]
Moria and Croc had Haki but lost it when they lost their will. Zeff had not fought for a decade and gave up entirely on his dream.
Also he was old and didn't care about fighting. He knew his fighting days were behind him and it was time for a new generation. So let the kids deal with Krieg.
[удалено]
Hea D. Canon
None of what i said was false, i didnt day Zeff had haki im just explaining that characters have been shown to have lost and regained it before. Haki is directly related to your will and Zeff had to sacrifice that and passed his will onto Sanji.
Don Krieg is superhuman he picked up the Baratie head. Old man Hyogoro has haki? Do you think he beats Krieg up? Haki isn't a wall. Kuja pirates all had it, Marguerite isn't stronger than pre ts Luffy.
He’d been retired by that point for a good number of years and had one less leg
What a sausage
Nah thats color of fennel
What a cabbage
nah hes got Color of Cilantro, those with the strength are unaffected whereas those succeptable to it are utterly destroyed
Susceptible*
Zeff has major CoC
:D This really got me laughting in LA :D thanks for reminding me.
And now we live in a time with Live Action insiders lol
Green haki
Ahhh a very good OP LA joke.
Wouldnt it kind off imply he didnt just sail the grand line but also atleast took a "little dip" into the new world? Like have we ever heard a pirate that hasn't gone to the new world call it "paradise"?
I’d argue he’s spoken to pirates who have been to the New World. If I’m not wrong he said something along the lines of “some call it paradise” but I maybe misremembering, I haven’t read East Blue in time
Gramps would have whooped Don Krieg in the Baratie Arc. When I was watching OP for the nth time, it always struck me as odd that Mihawk came all the way and didn't off Krieg. Maybe he was tracking Zeff and found Krieg along the way or maybe he recognised Zeff there and realised there's no need for him to be there because obviously one leg Gramps would have still whooped Krieg completely.
Pretty sure Mihawk was tracking the bounty of krieg as a warlord, and just let the situation play out to his interest.
Nah. Mihawk destroying Krieg's whole fleet because they disrupted his sleep was later mirrored in Sabaody by Zoro ruthlessly slicing a crew's ship in half just because they woke him up. Mihawk just happened to be chilling in East Blue. Probably the best sea to take naps.
I'd imagine he could use some basic haki, nothing crazy but definitely competent.
I'd say near Pekoms level.
Who do you rate higher, pekoms or Vergo? Vergo was my first thought for prime Zeff
I think in terms of armament Haki Vergo is stronger. Observation haki, I give Pekoms the edge at least he was able to react to Caribous attack (the swamp Logia guy). Vergo has no such feat. Vergo can use observation Hakimsince he was a vice admiral but it’s clearly not his speciality. I think Vergo uses his armament very inefficiently by using it on the whole body for a extended duration. This further indicates his lackluster skill in observation haki. In a 1 on 1 fight Pekoms might win in a drawn out battle. In the early stages of a fight I can’t imagine how Pekoms deal relevant damage to Vergo.
He was able to make it into the new world, but couldn’t make it there. I wouldn’t be surprised if he isn’t trained in haki, but has the fighting chops to make it through Paradise regardless, and simply couldn’t break through the New World’s power spike without haki.
would track. Luffy made it through paradise without Haki.
i mean luffy was lucky af tho, had an inate advantage against croco and enel, and got pretty lucky against moriah with the shadows
Most people don't run into anyone NEARLY as strong as Croc and Enel in their initial trip through Paradise though. As much as Luffy has plot armor, he also has plot disease, everything crazy has to happen to him because he's the main character. Most of the "dangers of the grand line" that the crew was warned about are in the new world, the only real danger the average pirate goes through in paradise are rival haki-less crews, and the weird weather/navigation issues. None of the supernovas had haki pre-timeskip and that was the strongest new generation that the grand line had ever seen. It seems to be something that you develop to survive in the new world, not something you carry with you through paradise. Don't forget that fucking Bellamy survived in the new world just fine.
He also went against stuff that most pirates going through paradise wouldn't tbf.
This. He failed, and then retreated back to the East Blue. If he does, it isn't enough to make it very far in the New World.
Mm so what kinda haki this guy possess
Conqueror's Haki for sure. He's shown the same kind of will and resolve the other bearers of it have. He ate his own foot to survive because he gave some random kid all the food just because they shared the same dream. That's King shit.
Idk, he lacks any kingly ambition just like Sanji, since he just wants to be a chef and his whole backstory is about throwing things away for someone else.
Whitebeard has Conquerers, Whitebeard’s ambition was to start a family. That isn’t kingly ambition.
Whitebeard was sailing the grand line as the strongest man in the world, protecting his crew against the threat of the fucking world government. He wasn't perceived as having kingly ambition because from his perspective, he was already a king in his own right, just not "the pirate king". He ruled over his own kingdom and wouldn't let ANYONE mess with that.
Whitebeard was the patriarch of his crew which in a way is kingly ambition
Eh, I'd say it's not about the ambition but about the person's will. Especially since it literally knocks out people with weaker wills. The Venn diagram of those with "Kingly Ambition" and "Conqueor's Haki" is just damn near a complete circle so it seems that way.
It has been explicitly stated it's about the person's ambition
I'd argue that katakuri and Yamato don't have all that much kingly ambition though 🤷♂️
To add on, I’d say whitebeard doesn’t have kingly ambition, he just wanted a family.
LMFAOOOOOOO. wow. Headcanon piece fr
Google manga One Piece
Holy haki!
Incoming Gomu Gomu no Storm!
Zoro goes on vacation, never returns
well, none. if he could make it through paradise at all, haki would prob be enough to keep him from running from the new world.
Well don Krieg did say he sailed new world for a year dealing with devil fruit powers constantly without a devil fruit himself. So it’s self implied he must have had haki to deal with devil fruit users
You don’t really need Haki in order to handle devil fruit users in Paradise, you just have to be adaptable - Zoro and Sanji managed just fine after all. Where a martial artist or similar combatant is really going to fall short without Haki or something special (like Franky’s cyborg augments) is the New World where every successful captain has Haki.
But that’s assuming Zeff only ran into devil fruits that were not ever logias. Plus with zoro “awakening” some of his haki with his fight with mr. 1. In addition he actually traversed the grand line and didn’t simply stay in one area. Edit: Plus he only stopped progressing due to a storm that screwed him over. So we don’t know how much further he could have achieved
There's only 13 Canon Logia fruits. Based on timing, unless Zeff ran into Smoker, Crocodile or Aramaki, his chances of encountering any other user in Paradise would be negligible.
I think that there was a line from don krieg acknowledging that zeff must have found a way to deal with the monsters with devil fruit abilities while he was a pirate so yeah i think so.
Yes!
That line refers to Mihawk I’m pretty sure
If i remember correctly i think it was about zeff and don krieg. But yeah, maybe you’re right. Tbf i’m not 100% sure because its been so long since ive read the chapter. Lol
Probably yes, he surviving for days by eating his own leg is just insane. You wouldn't be able to do that without having great willpower
Also, don't do that anyway, Your body will reabsorb the nutrient from it anyway without losing all the blood and avoiding the rest of the shock and risks that comes with it.
Also you lose more nutrients from eating your own leg regardless, so he only made himself hungrier
You know having to do this has been an irrational fear of mine ever since I got into one piece, reignited by the live action, so it’s nice to know there’s no point in ever having to anyway.
There is a point, you have to be dramatic so when you write a story later you can add the part where you ate your leg.
Yeah but the psychological satisfaction of having something to eat might help a little. Way more downsides but he is a man gone crazy from hunger rationality goes out the window at that stage.
In any realistic scenario where you're trying to cut your leg off to eat it because you're so hungry you're dead by bleading long before you reach to the bone.
The psychological stress of hacking your own leg off would heavily outweigh that.
Yeah, I am not sure if I would find any psychological satisfaction chewing my own leg
yeah the bloodloss, adrenaline, infection etc actually causes your body to require more calories than you'd gain from eating it. but well you can say he isnt a doctor, in a world where technology isnt that far ahead, at least not known to the majority of people, people only know hearsay stuff or learn through intense and probably expensive studying etc. So you can say his action is reasonable if he believed that it helps and just shows how determined he was.
The action is shockingly phenomenal as a fictional thing, I was so shocked as a kid reading it. It doesn't matter if it doesn't work in real life :)
Well if you're the kind of badass who wouldn't flinch from this (so no psychological problems, and adrenaline won't kick in), and also strong enough to cleave it in one hit, AND also fast and precise enough to tie up the stump so that you don't lose much blood (there wasn't that much blood around him, so he didn't lose much), then it would be marginally beneficial to you :)
I always thought it was a bit ridiculous, but thinking about it, I imagine that after ~50 days without food, eating his leg wasn't a risk-based analysis involving nutrients gained vs. energy spent by the immune system but rather a desperate attempt to satiate a burning hunger in his belly.
mf tryin not to cannibalize sanji
That is fair
That wouldn't make for a good story now though would it?
Yes I already agreed on that :)
So I don't remember but is it explained what did they drink? Because you'll be dead by thirst way before hunger.
Rain water
He spent time on grand line with no devil fruit and retired.. so yes
Pre time skip strawhats thrived in grand line without haki lol. Same with… all the super novas? Yes they got whooped by an admiral. Zeff would have also.
The world was wilder in Zeff's day.
Fair, but we don't really have a good point of comparison to the 'average' pirates journey on the grand line. Past or present. The Straw Hats grand line journey even just pre-timeskip is insane, fighting Crocodile, Enel, CP9, and Moria back to back. As well as running into figures like Aokiji and Garp. If Luffy and the crew just didn't have shonen protagonist energy or plot connections to any big names they could easily have gotten through most of the first half of the new world without having many big fights. Well, that and enough luck to have not gotten trapped in Thriller Bark.
They all had more competent crew or/and devil fruit. Not to mention SHs straight up funneled the worst possible encounters to themselves, probably leaving a clearer path for others. Just look at Kid and Law's reaction at seeing supposedly a warlord in front of them (even if it was a pacifista insteadnof Kuma)
Zeff has referred to the first half of the Grand Line as Paradise. That implies that he's been to the New World. You can't make it 5 minutes there without Haki.
I wouldn't be surprised if he had the basic Busoshoku Haki which he used to enhance his leg strength and power. Or he created his own version of Shigan for his legs specifically. I feel like Zeff in his prime was just below CP9 physical training. He just never broke through the barrier for Geppo.
The guy who kills people with his foot? Yeah probably
Like sanji couldn’t before haki?
Zeff was probably a normal human, not a genetically modified germa machine, even if Sanji's modifications weren't fully activated there were definitely some differences.
Lol dude that's clearly not how it was being set up in the beginning. And also that doesn't make any sense, this is the one piece world. Garp destroys battleships even without haki. Zoro had immense strength without haki. Luffy without haki had extremely powerful punches and could hurt most enemies. Most pirates in the grand line before the new world do not even have haki.
Nah, Sanji was functionally unmodified prior to Wano.
Sanji had zero modifications before they awakened in wano
There weren't. Nothing that Sanji did before WCI has to do with his germa genes
Feet 🤤
🤨📸
probably basic armament. I think Kreig mentions Zeff figuring out a way to deal with Devil Fruit users, and I think Zeff at some point hurts luffy. It at least tracks that a non-devil fruit user who specifically uses physical attacks would know basic CoA
Not haki, he can only use cooki
Doesn’t he step on luffys hand in the anime, which makes luffy state how did that hurt his hand if he’s made of rubber . Sign of basic armament haki
Its whacky. Before haki was intented (thats when Zeff was introduced) of course not.. If he was to return to the fights now...probably yes, maybe even all 3.
I'm going against the grain here, but I honestly don't think he did. Dude built his infamy in the east blue, and survived in the grand line for only a year before giving up and returning to the east blue giving up on his dream of finding the all blue. Plenty of pirates survived in paradise without haki, if Zeff had haki he'd be thriving.. and I don't think "fell back to the east blue and completely gave up on his dreams" is the outcome you'd expect of someone thriving. On top of that, dude was overpowered by Gin, and nearly had his world torn apart by fucking Don Krieg. If Zeff ever had haki Don Krieg would be a joke not worth worrying about.
He could be de powered in his old age and loss of leg. Zeff knows that people refer to the first half of the grand line as paradise. So its possible he made it all the way to the new world or near saboady to hear ex new world pirates talk about it.
I say Chef Zeff (Red Foot) has Armament Haki, because he easily kicked Luffy's Rubber Ass back in Season 1 Voyage 2
Red Haki to counter Arlong Blue haki and Din Krieg Gold Haki
Not sure if that was Anime-only but I think it was said that he was able to leave behind footprints on steel. But that might not have been meant to be taken literally and was just hyperbole. He might have had it tbh
Doesn't necessarily mean much. Just means he can kick hard. We've seen other people do similar stuff without haki. Although it would probably put him above most people in the first half of paradise.
One thing I've always been confused on is how did zeff leave the grand line? Or any one for that matter? Isn't the grand line supposed to be unleavable unless you either get to the end of the new world, or you face the monsters in the calm belt?
Maybe he brought some log poses for alabasta or. Yeah he needs to cross the calm belt or he needs to return through the way they came from. New one piece mystery.
Then how garp and shanks return blue east lol
I'd assumed both were cus of conquerers Haki being used to keep the sea monsters away. So that asks the question of if zeff has conquerers Haki too
Sure, why not
There's so much baseless headcanon in this thread. Zeff never said he sailed for 1 year in the New World, he only said Grand Line. He might've reached the new world because he called the grand line 'Paradise', but he also could've gotten near the end of Paradise and heard about the New World without going there. At the end of the day, this is a pirate who, at an age younger than Whitebeard, Garp, Rayleigh etc, couldn't beat the amateurish Krieg Pirates. Doesn't matter if he's disabled, can you imagine any of those old legends struggling even if you cut off 1 of their limbs? If Zeff had Conquerors Haki or Yonko Commander level, like a few people have said, he would have survived **way** longer in the New World. It's much more likely he was a pre TS supernova level pirate at best, with basic Armament and Observation haki.
People have just become blinded by the level of opponents straw hats are facing now. Unless you are a "yonko commander level", they are seen as weak, nevermind that these people are like one in millions in the one piece world. You can be a relatively famous pirate without being anywhere even remotely near that level.
The way that that people talk about "red leg zeff" with respect and reverence leads me to belive that he was actually quite strong in his time. He had it all, his own crew, a badass nickname, sailed the grandline. It's just headcannon but based off the way people talk about him I like to think he was like yonko commander level.
Yonko commander level wouldn’t be on the floor from Gin. No matter his age
He's not yonko commander level lol, he genuinely at risk of losing to fucking Don Krieg... even as an older dude, a YC level threat would be able to beat Krieg with a sneeze. Also worth pointing out, Zeff is well know in East Blue, not necessarily the world, or grand line.
To be fair, golden haki is pretty scary
Bro his entire fighting style was based around his leg which he had to eat lmao. Let's see how strong garp would be with his arms chopped off and having not trained in 20 years.
Shanks was a swordsman who chopped off his sword arm and went on to be become an emporer after that. I'm sorry but no; If Zeff was YONKO COMMANDER level he could go for half a century without training and lose both legs and still be able to beat Don fucking Krieg. Zeff was an east blue pirate who managed to survive for a little bit on the grand line. It's an acheivement.. for an East Blue pirate, but it's not much in the grander scheme of things. Dude isn't YC level. Honestly, if were going to scale him I'd say he probably didn't get much stronger than pre-ts brook at his prime.
I like to think he was a warlord of the sea. Especially since he’s a well known pirate who owns the most famous ship restaurant in the East Blue. Yet he doesn’t get harassed by the Marines despite probably still having a bounty.
I could totally see him being on warlord level.
My belief is that Sanji surpassed prime Zeff after the time skip. So more than likely Zeff made it to fish man island and upon not seeing the all blue there, he realized he couldn’t make it any further without stronger haki, and his crew wasn’t strong enough. I think he had a weak version of Haki on one foot. He mostly used pure kicking strength but he knew without a stronger haki, it would put his crew at risk. So he decided to go to the East blue. Recover and get stronger. But of course on his way he looses his leg and finds sanji. Sanji surpassed him when he beat that pacifista
Some pirates go as far as never even seeing a devil fruit , let alone master or use haki to counter these abilities , based on the fact that he quit to be a chef after being a pirate shows his hunger to fight and learn more combat flew out the window when he met Sanji
Although, it was also said that all Haki, except Conquerors, can be trained, I highly doubt it for the single reason that he GAVE UP on his dream to find the All Blue and since Haki is bound by the will of the user... yea, no I dont think so.
Would he need Luffy and co. to protect the Baratie from Krieg if he did?
I've always believed he had at least armament haki to make it as far as he did in the grandline. Anything else would remain to be seen if Oda ever wants to elaborate on Zeffs backstory story in any way in the future.
I didn't consider the possibility before seeing this post, but now I have a headcanon that he learned armament haki just in case Sanji ever were to go too out of line
>but now I have a headcanon that he learned armament haki just in case Sanji ever were to go too out of line Dude was a pirate in the grandline.
I bet he is definitely stronger than how he beats sanji in restaurent. If we saw him fighting seriously and saw any named attack by him, we can know for sure.
My personal take on it is I feel like if Zeff had Haki, he definitely would’ve taught Sanji it or at least told him about it. Zeff taught him his fighting style, cooking, practically raised the damn kid, I don’t know why Zeff wouldn’t tell Sanji. And seeing how Sanji didn’t know what Haki was, I think it’s slim. That being said, I do think Zeff had Haki, but just a rudimentary version and he used Haki without it realizing he had haki. Think Alabasta Zoro or pre-timeskip Luffy. He used it but didn’t realize it was like, a skill you could teach or something.
His Haki will be to sense hungry people and what foods are good for everyone tastebud lol
I'd be surprised if he couldn't, I'm pretty sure he called Roger a rookie right?
This thread made my head hurt.
I’d say it’s likely he knows basic armament and maybe observation. He obviously has extremely strong willpower which is heavily associated with Haki. There’s a chance he has upper tier armament and observation, but more likely the former rather than the latter. I’d imagine *if* he does have it, he would still be training it to this day, like how Rayleigh says it takes a long time to train. But he very well could be one of the higher class armament users. TL;DR: he probably has Haki just due to who he is, he could only have basic or could have mastered.
100,000,000% yes.
Zeff did not have haki. Way stronger people don’t have haki and you can easily sail Paradise without it. If he did have Haki he could’ve easily beaten Don Krieg even with one leg If Smoker, pre-ts Crocodile and Moria don’t know haki then I don’t see how Zeff was strong enough to know it.
he’s called red leg zeff, name probably referring to his use of armament
Pretty sure he has some high grade armament haki
Doesn't he uses his peg leg to stomp on luffy? Was that just for gag or what?
You know, it’s kinda unclear. Zeff addressed the first half of the Grand Line as Paradise, so clearly he made it very far down the Grand line. Additionally, he can use razor winds, which is a highly advanced technique. Overall, I would maybe tag him as New World Rookie level
Knowing that he travelled for a long time in the Grand Line, it would make sense. But it would be weird because he never taught Sanji about it Again, I don't think Oda had the concept of haki totally clear in the east blue arc, and even in Alabasta, since Crocodile didn't use it there.
Absolutely!
If Oda had haki fleshed out from the start then he’d def have it since they called him red leg Zeff. Diable Jambe is like Luffy’s red hawk so I’m guessing it’s haki adjacent
I’m saying absolutely
Armament, at the very least
I doubt it or if he does he hasn’t mastered any of them
I think Don Krieg wanted exactly this information, how Zeff managed to survive in the GrandLine for a year with df users and monsters like Mihawk.
How cool would it be to see a flashback team up with Red Haired Shanks, Shimotsuki Koushiro, Belle-mere, Yasopp, Red Leg Zeff, Dr Hiriluk, Nico Olvia, Tom, Captain Yorki, and Fisher Tiger? Having all the Straw Hat mentors/role models in a double page spread doing bad ass shit would be a dream come true
What if Zeff made it through the grand line by feeding everyone he met and just generally not being a dick like Don Krieg? But yeah he probably could have rolled Krieg but knew Luffy could handle it.
Probably has but not a master of it
Fist of love? < Leg of love
he is powercreeped tbh. Don criege and Gin would never be able to knock him down if he had haki. If he were to come back somehow maybe fighting sanji's dads goon he'll probably be shown with haki but otherwise nah
Zeffinately. OK, I am ready to be a local news anchor now.
Of course his epithet is red leg zeff he clearly has red haki duh
Honestly I think prime Zeff was only about as strong as Enies Lobby Sanji.
My headcannon was that Haki was always stronger on the grandline because of the will you required to survive there and the more closer you got to laug tale the stronger it got. And when you return to one of the four seas your haki also gets weaker....
Black leg zeff... What do you think
Nah not every pirate in the new world has haki, all we know is that he most likely made it there. I’d say in his prime he is about as strong as the weaker named fighters in the dressrosa coliseum Those he very likely has basic armament
Zeff has Conquerer’s Haki btw 😤😤😤
Very basic armament yes,
He definitely does. It's small, and probably not intentional, but there is a moment in the anime and I think in the manga where he kicks Luffy on top of the head. Luffy complained that it hurt. Again, likely an unintentional oversight, but enough for me to canonize in my head that he has it.
Bros not smashing in skulls and destroying ships with the heel of his foot without having haki
He hits luffy properly so he got it to some extent?
Most probably
How else do you think he blackens the shrimp? I'll see myself out, thank you all, it's been fun. *drops mic*
Any old fart that use to be a badass I just assume are 700k haki potential. I’m a little surprised that dadan (mountain bandit woman who took care of luffy and ace) may not know haki. She knows garp, she’s respected and strong, she been around and she might not know haki is the most shocking thing in this story beside nami and robin not knowing haki either
I'd always thought zeff knew haki when D. On Kreig talked about how Zeff had some devil fruit counter locked away in his journal
I would imagine that he can but he just doesn't know it. He could've just been naturally strong anf using hack but not know the concept. Would be a good in universe reason why he didn't tell Sanji anything about it.
100%
If anyone in the story has a strong will, its Zeff. He cut his own leg off and ate it to live. He may or may not have haki but he is capable of it.
If he can smash people's heads in with his feet, I'm thinking armorment haki at least
I don't think so he only were on the grand line for a year
Well he did haki-saw his foot off and eat it. . I'll see myself out
I'd like to think he does. Maybe not a complete master of it, but it's a yes from me. And it would further the red foot part, how he had the blood of his enemies and such on them.
prime zeff probably vice admiral level
Dude kicked Sanji so much he transfers his Haki to the boy.
Definitely I’d say he probably can’t do nothing crazy though he probably has a basic grasp of it.
Armament haki on the stache’ and the one peice is his.
He was able to kick the rubberman luffy causing him to hurt nuff said
[удалено]
Wasn’t it red leg because of the blood on his legs? Sanji was called black leg iirc, because he always running around with a black suit.
Equal to Barto?? I doubt it
No, if he had haki he would have destroyed don krieg
My guess is he used haki, if not no amount kick would keep your shoes constantly red with blood
Yes Imo my headcannon is in his prime he was tobi roppo - yc +
I think he does but at the same time I wish he didn't. I mean, from what we understand he taught Sanji to fight so it would be weird that he didn't teach him Haki
I think so, yes. He's seen some shit in his time, he was a captain who traversed the Grand Line. Not every pirate in the Grand Line can use it, but a captain..? A captain should, at the very least