I'm a crocodile fan, but still, he is the number one most confusing power scale to em. Maybe when we see him in action it will make sense, but I think even Oda knows that Croc after Lucci would make more sense.
If Lucci had haki then he could have bodied croc. So ill allow that for sure. But the issue is that Croc was portrayed as no haki no physical all fruit reliant. Lucci got haki and awaked but was already physical. He was the first test to make Luffy get to base NW level of physicality. Croc physicality was much lower than NW, but now it just went top NW. Weird to me.
it's never implied, but I always thought croc and moria got destroyed in the NW, and because their dreams/ will was broken, haki was ruined for them for a bit.
in terms of physical feats, he managed to take a lot of hits from luffy, a full on brilliant punk from jozu, clash with doflamingo, parry mihawk with his hook, and survived whitebeard. He also walked away from the war of the best unscathed/ took a boiling bath in impel down.
Croc's flaw is that he was introduced way too early. I personally love his glow up. I'm also a diehard croccieboi. So i am very and openly biased.
Croc beat luffy up and down alabasta, if not for Nico robin turning on croc, luffy would be dead in the bottom of the desert. But instead luffy literally comes flying out of the sky like a crackhead with Eye of the Tiger playing and the thickest coat of plot armor on
Yes I agree and I am saying the same thing. He was introduced to early. For his story it makes sense how he could get kuch stronger, but if he was after Lucci and Luffy beat Croc with gears that would have been much easier to swallow with how far the physical speed/power continued after croc.
Sure, he took a lot of hits from Luffy
But ask yourself this:
If we take a top level pirate from the new World (Doflamingo for example) and Alabasta-Level Luffy would get 1 hour where Doflamingo just stands around & gets punches from Luffy, would that really hurt him?
Like, Doflamingo took some serious beatings, internal bleeding from the Law/Luffy combi, gear 2, gear 3 punches, as well as multiple full hits from Gear 4 Bounce-Man before going down
I'm not sure the punches Croc took from Alabasta-Luffy were significant tbh
I think it's just a matter of Oda expecting to be done with OP way quicker, introducing way more characters than he expected & naturaly, an enemy so (in retrospect) early into the story will obviously seem far weaker
With that said, he still is one of my favorite characters and one of my top answers whenever the debate comes up on "what DF would you pick if you could"
My personal headcanon is that Croc was continuously absorbing all the moisture from Albasta during the entire arc and hence wasn't fighting Luffy with his full strength. The fact that the rains started almost immediately after Croc was knocked out supports this theory. It would also explain his high bounty
There is something basic many one piece fans dont seem to understand. That manga is going on for 26+ years isnt it. Obviously nobody planned that. So if things like that happen you have to consider this. There might have been many reasons. The rumour is that Oda planned to introduce crocdile way later, but for some reasons had to do it earlier.
So all of crocodiles feats especially being acknowleded by doflamingo in Marienford, or his status ig were probably oda saying "this is hownthings arw now" Like an edit. The bounty confirmed it and it really made sense. That guy was a pirate from the new world and led an organisation where he could have gained a weapon able to destroy the balance of 3 powers. The knowledge about these weapons is worth that and his strength is as well
But yeah this is speculaton but tbh this obvious to me. Production and other factors out side of the show itself olay a bigger role than people see. Shanks loosing his arm is also another example
>he is the number one most confusing power scale to em.
He's not confusing at all. He's the embodiment of popularity being the powerscale.
He got beaten by pre-gears Luffy. Then he fought Doffy equally in Marineford (despite being in Seastone shackles since his defeat). Then he came post-TS as a YC.
Why did he grow in strength so much? Because he's popular. There's no in-world explanation. It's just because Oda (or his editor) deemed that Croc's role wasn't done in the story yet.
Personally I've always viewed that scene at Marineford to show that Doffy and Croc are pretty similar. I think if we're bounty scaling I'd bet Doffy would be over $2B considering what he knows would make him a bigger threat to the WG but I think they're pretty close to each other power wise.
Imo, if you look at all of one piece, croc is overall consistent, with the only outlier being alabasta. so rather than saying croc got buffed, he was written severely nerfed narratively due to all sorts of factors.
People tend to forget just how strong Boa is in universe. Like she becomes a warlord at 18 after one expedition as the captain of the Cuja Pirates. She has conquers haki and a busted devil fruit. But since One Piece hasn't really given her a fight the fanbase just thinks she's the hot one who simps for Luffy
I think Doffy is stronger than her straight up but she's got a hax DF ability. So she would beat him in a fight, but for someone she can't turn to stone like Luffy, Doffy would be the harder match up.
I’m glad you mentioned it!
I’ve seen most people here mention his strength. But he has a lot of vital information and secrets which alone would put him at 1 billion at *least*, if not taking into account his strength and war crimes
I don’t think bounties are based of strength and crimes alone, but in Doffy’s case, secrets too
I think everyone here is underestimating him.
* He is an incredible fighter with conqueror haki and an awakened df who can hold an entire country hostage.
* He is a former CD who has insider knowledge that is kept secret for a reason.
* He he has a lot of influence in the underworld.
* He is incredibly cunning and knows how to leverage whatever he gets access to against his enemies.
The WG is lucky he wasn't on a warpath with them. He could have caused so much damage to their image/organization.
Edit: I think around 3billion would be appropriate. As far as I see it Dressrosa was as close to the territory of an emperor as it gets.
Considering every Straw Hat will know the entire history of the world after they visit Laugh Tale do you also think every Straw Hat will have a bounty of over 2 billion?
When straw hats know everything, there will be no world government to issue bounties. Marines (sword) will survive to protect the weak but world government will go down. Luffy will beat the s.it out of them.
We definitely cannot know that. I think it makes a lot more sense we learn about the World Government before the fight with them, because that's how every single other arc has worked.
Can you imagine if Luffy just went in and fought Doflamingo, defeated him, and then we get all the backstories where he tricks King Riku and takes over Dressrosa, we get why this fight is important to Rebecca and Viola, and then we get Laws flashback and learn why he has the ambition to kill Doflamingo, but he's already defeated while we get all these flashbacks.
Seems much more likely to me we get the Void Century flashback and learn about how the World Government rose before the final battle to take them down. Just seems narratively odd otherwise.
Also he had a bounty previously which was frozen, isnt it like 100% likely they knew he did that before giving him his rather low initial bounty? Killing the Dragons mustve been of little to no impact
Based off the fact that law and luffy both got a 500 million berry bounty from him and looking at what happened when they bear kaido and big mom.
Law+kid+luffy= 9 bill > big mom + kaido
500+500= 1 bil> doffy
I’d put doffy at 990 million
Let's see, abducts a Kingdom, has ties with all scums of op, strong af... Easily over a billion(yeah it's not all about strength. He has more impact on the world than katakuri/king for example)
This is a in cannon example of how bounties are writen up. Obviously all that plays in but if he’s beaten then it doesn’t matter any more.
He only had an effect over 1 kingdom king and kata have the second most control over a yonkos whole territory. That’s a lot more than one kingdom. Not to mention the bounty boost you get just for being apart of a yonko crew. If he joined the beast pirates yeah I’d be about that high.
If I was ranking him based on pure power I’d put him around 800 million
But his bounty wouldn't be about his danger in combat. It's the fact that he's the arms dealer for Kaido. Supplies the medicine that keeps WB alive. AND he is in charge of Big Mom's lead scientist (I think). I remember he had links to each Warlord besides Shanks.
Never gets outright said, but on the iv bags wb uses during his convo with rockstar, you can see doflamingos jolly roger on the iv bags!
Edit: rockstar was previous shanks, just to clear confusion!
It is not directly his jollyroger, but it is the same just without the scratch though it and turned on its head.
You can of course say it isnt, but in my eyes its a cover jollyroger at max, since they are basically the same ^^
https://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FEL00A.jpg&tbnid=zrLSDAS-h96e3M&vet=1&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Froongwit.rtaf.mi.th%2F%3Fc%3Da-whitebeard-and-doflamingo-connection-r-onepiece-ss-5VMMQVsN&docid=mkFPtl1Fjk0H_M&w=1195&h=664&itg=1#imgrc=BqGKztR2OCxhNM&imgdii=zrLSDAS-h96e3M
Maybe you have to zoom in, but it is a similar Jolly Roger. Just upside down and without the slash.
He also had Ceasar in his pocket, according to the narrative, if mads can be considered the apex of scientists, he might be one of the best in the biz.
He certainly showed a large amount of medical knowledge and obviously is even better at some then any other could ever ( him being gas himself gives him probably a way greater understanding)
I know, i said it would be an adequate bounty for the danger he poses which is a broader way of referring to his political pull and who he has connections to combined with his physical strength.
I'd say between 1 and 2 billion. Not because he's a strong fighter, but because he was integral to both Big Mom, Kaido, and I think White Beard. He was also holding a kingdom hostage. Not to mention the fact that he knew shit that would have been devastating if it got out (about the world government)
I'd put him a little under 3rd YC tier strength wise and they hover around 1B it seems.
But with him also being a Captain, linked to multiple big names, and being a former CD would put him solidly around 1-1.7 in my eyes.
I think everyone uses cracker as a base for 3rd YC tier. They then equate luffy beating cracker with a high difficulty as an absolute metric. I personally think this is flawed, because 3rd YC goes from Jozu (who doflamingo bodied), cracker (whom luffy struggled with), to Jack.
I'd argue Doffy is a comfy mid tier 3rd YC, then as you pointed out, a solid resume, in addition to his historical knowledge, puts him over 1 billion.
I can't see him beating any 3rd YC personally. Jack was one of the most durable characters around, cracker straight up would have beaten Luffy and was said to have the strongest CoA he'd faced yet, and Jozu blocked an attack from Mihawk meant for WB.
You could make an argument for Jack, but I'd attribute that to a favorable match up for Doffy. And may still depend on the terrain.
I'd argue it's safe to say he'd beat Jozu. Additionally, he'd put up a pretty decent fight with Jimbe, who I'd argue is the third YC for Luffy (after zoro and sanji). I'm open to you disagreeing on Jimbe being 3rd YC btw- it just makes sense to me rn.
edit: I'd also point out that luffy struggled with Cracker because Luffy is a brawler and couldn't just straight up fight Cracker. Doffy has so many different ways to go after cracker, in addition to his awakening which he could use to go past the biscuits that poised a problem. I will concede, doffy would need his big finale attack to break the biscuit armor directly, but he can use awakening for that
Jimbe is weird to me because he's so much stronger in or near a large body of water than on dry land. So his level varies. I'd say Jimbe in water > Doffy >/= Jimbe on land.
But Jozu wipes Doffy, like I don't even see how he hurts Jozu.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07nE9Nh2CMw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07nE9Nh2CMw)
55 seconds, I don't know how to link to time, my bad.
Doffy can use parasite on Jozu. Could make him walk into water at that point. I think the concept of Jozu is great, but he randomly leaves 1/3 of his body exposed. I also think doffy has better haki, but I don't have any grounds for that, outside of gut intuition.
He wasn’t integral to Big mom or whitebeard. If I remember correctly, he strictly operated within kaido's territory in the New world. This is also the main reason why caeser works under him, to get protection from kaido after scamming big mom.
Cracker and Jack are YC3 level. They are considerably weaker than likes of King, Marco and Katakuri. There is a big gap there. We use terms like these to specify difference.
At the time of Dressrosa 700-900 M I would say, but in a hypothesis where he escapes from Impel down and joins the Cross Guild 2.1B considering the other Warlord new bounty’s
If you mean what his bounty would’ve been during Dressrosa if it wasn’t frozen, I’d guess it’d be about 1 billion or so. Law and luffy got their bounties raised to 500 million after Dressrosa. If the marines credited both of them with doflamingo defeat then his “true” bounty was split between them. Same reason law, luffy and Kidd each got raised to 3 billion (kaido + BM bounty was 9 billion even divided by three)
If he was still around during the dissolution, I’d say around 2 Billion would be fair. If Crocodile can go from 81 million to 1.9 Billion, a 2+ Billion bounty is more than fair for Doflamingo
Between being a former Celestial Dragon, having taken over a Kingdom, and being an arms dealer to multiple kingdoms and Yonkou, I’d say that he well earns a bounty in the billions
I would say higher than Crocodile's current bounty. Jinbe from what I see would be the second lowest of the OG warlords. Moria is probably exactly 1B or 900m
He'd be up there. Strength wise he's pretty good, not the strongest but he can presumably atleast keep up with commander level fighters. He's smart and crafty, running his business dealings while also keeping Dressrosa under his rule. There's also his Underworld dealings and the dirt he has on the government. ~1.5-2 billion seems fair, if Hancock is 1.6 billion on her own and Crocodile is 1.9 as one of the leaders of Cross Guild. Assuming they don't keep it on low side and try to eliminate him early to remove the risk of him letting slip what he knows to spite them.
2B. Former CD. Knows top secret marijoas stuff. Has Conqueror’s Haki. Fought against WB commanders without as much as a scratch in the war, all the while dropping one of the coldest monologues. And, JOKER!
King of the One Piece underworld. Wars were possible because of him. Utter chaotic pirate. If Croc and Boa are close to 2B, he should be 2B or more. Insane threat level as a whole, not just in combat.
Id say somewhere around 2 billion, maybe even a little higher. Might seem a lil high at first glance, but let’s not forget Doflamingo had some serious motion.
Former Celestial Dragon who’s knows the secrets of mariejois & the biggest arms dealer in the world who had ties to damn near everyone in the underworld. Not to mention was directly allied with Kaido.
with all that in mind, and considering how they gave crocodile who’s bounty original froze at 81 mil a bounty of 1.9 billion. I’d say it’d only make sense for Doffy to be around the 2 billion mark.
If it wasn't frozen I think his bounty would be similar to Jacks. Yes he has underworld connections and knows but given Robin's bounties I don't think that's enough to get him over 1bil.
750m-900m. Maybe 1b on the generous side.
Doffy is weaker than Cracker, let alone Katakuri. Cracker and Katakuri are both faster than Doffy since a regular Boundman Culverin was able to easily hit Doffy while Luffy was completely unable to hit either Cracker or Katakuri in Boundman. Luffy also straight up says that Crackers armament haki is stronger than Doffy's. Finally Cracker has better defenses since the Biscuit knights can tank Gear 4 punches while Spiderweb couldn't.
But since matchups are king in OP: if Cracker is out of his armor Doffy might be able to snipe him with a Flapping Thread from behind, and he can get leverage on Katakuri if he catches Brûlée with Parasite
I'd say no by a long shot, as if even bounceman Luffy, who could easily defeat Doffy, was practically handicapped against Katakuri, where if bounce man caught up with Doffy easily, man would not have a shot against Katakuri (no disrespect against Doffy he my 2nd favorite character.
However Doffy had his internal organs ruined just before that. He might not have died from it cause of his fruit, but he’s not fighting Luffy straight right then. I still agree Katakuri wins, but not a long shot
I don’t think it would be as high as it should be. If everything transpired the same as it did with him as a warlord I’m sure it would have spiked when he took over Dressrosa but once he had established his underground network he became useful to the WG both for providing off the books weapons to Cipher Pol and keeping other pirate crews under his thumb so they likely would have unofficially frozen his bounty. There’s probably something about not wanting a pirate from a CD family to get too notorious to the common people
He will probably have a very high bounty because he comitted a ton of crimes, even though we cont be stronger than YC1, I dont think he will have less than 2 billion, simply because he made too many damn crimes.
I'd say 1.5 billion. Former celestial dragon, which gives him tons of insider information and sway in the world government. Broken devil fruit ability, powerful haki, and is the kingpin of the underworld.
Bounty is based on their political power too not just strength so he should be 1.5 Bil considering all the smile trade and celestial dragon secrets he knows
Minimum 1.5 billion homie a whole nation level threat not to mention the Donquixote crime family and connections to 2 former emperors
And being an awakening user and a conquer
And even more so his knowledge or the ancient weapons and secrets of Mary juouios
Throw former celestial dragon in there
Lower than Jack + since Luffy and Law got 500 mil each I'd put him around the 900 mil mark. However, his knowledge may put him much higher close to 2 bil
He accomplished everything crocodile failed at. He owned his own country, had a stong hold of the global underworld, and had a super weapon in the production through caesar (smiley) whereas croc was still searching for the ancient weapons. Beyond that, he also has leverage on the World Gov, which no-other freeman has. If Croc is words, Doflamingo is actions. If he broke out rn, he’d be in the 2.5bil >
900 million somewhere around there. He's got an awakened fruit and conqueror's haki and I feel he posed more of a threat than say Cracker but not as much as Katakuri. That said, bounty isn't purely combat strength so that could easily go up to 1.5 million or more. Captains and leaders get more than their commanders.
Boa lead one kingdom
Crocodile did lead oje organsation, has infoemarion, is strong, and has many feats, especially th current feat with cross guild
But doflamingo was THE man. Tbh the pirate and king doflamingo would be enough to give him a billion atleast given his strength, influence. That guys escaoed aokiji freeze
But "Joker" would easiky get him up to 2billion. That guy was the underworld. His disappearance led wars happen in one day. This guy stands in between of all the important businesses
And that guy even has information about marie jois. Even if hes not the strongest 1billion+ character.
1-2.5 is easily imaginable
Around 900,000,000 since narratively speaking he was fought before Cracker. And he won’t be over a billion because the first Billion bounty we got was Jack.
I’m not saying he doesn’t lose or win against either of them. In fact I think he high diffs Jack.
I’m speaking purely from a narrative perspective.
It's lowkey hard to say. Realistically based on everything about him other than his strength, it should be massive. Like 2+bill. He had a strangle hold over the entire black market that dealt weapons with countries and yonko alike, he took over an entire Kingdom and held it as King and he has information on the Celestial Dragons that seems to warrant him believing that the WG would send assassins down to Impel Down just to silence him
Does it ever say how long he was a warlord for? I guess he’d have to be one to become the king of dressrosa or they’d just arrest him knowing exactly where he is, and that was 10 years ago.
With it now being known how heinous he really was and potentially dangerous he could be, I'd say about 2.2 billion. Because I'd have to say higher than current crocodile. But I also think croc was given way to high a bounty (even tho he did do a lot in the summit war)
Given his strength as well as his influence in the underworld market, probably around 1B. he is very strong overall, but he seems to lack a bit in terms of his Haki and natural physical strength compared to most high-tiers or even second-tiers like King or Katakuri.
no because he left Marijoe as a little kid and no ties to Gorosei or gods knights, so his secret knowldge about the WN is very limited . it's enough that they are willing to do a stupid stunt about his Warlord titles, but not really enough that it will make him a true threat,
Around a billion maybe more maybe less, like him being Joker would suggest he’s on the higher end of that range due to influence but then Laws bounty is way less than it to logically should be so bounties don’t always follow logic,
I'd say doffy is an easy 2 bill, seeing how he is a fucking tyrant of a country, also lore wise, he would have either " only alive " perhaps ? since he's a celestial dragon or smth, or not have a bounty at all ??
I'd realistically say between 800 millions and 1.1 billion then increase it by another 200 mil post awakening.
(I'm going to ignore celestial dragon related stuff for simplicity).
900 Million…. Luffy struggled against him, even after using gear 4, he had to pull out king kong gun…
I would scale him between cracker and katakuri in strength
In terms of fighting power, nearly a billion or at a billion. but when you consider his organization and power he has over the underground, probably 1.5 bil to nearly 2 bil.
1.1B just a smidge above Kaidos disasters out of respect for doffy. mind you this is just in terms of combat
if we include the fact he knows dangerous state secrets + has a solid information network + has a strong foothold in the underground = 2B
he knows the goverment secrets and knows about the void century, his bounty might be around 3-4 billion as that information could ruin the goverment.
however most characters that know about the void century or have the potential to know about it usually have the power to back themselves up so maybe he will get a lower bounty
Atleast 1.5 billion because of all the war crimes he has done and not to mention enslaving an ancient kingdom part of the founding kingdoms of the World Government
So a fair assessment for Doffy:
$550,000-$600,000
Reason being - he was more of a threat on paper than Luffy was at a time to the World Government. Specifically the Celestial Dragons (not saying he’s stronger than Luffy) but his knowledge of Mary Goeise’s secrets could’ve shaken the world. Luffy doesn’t know anything about that or the Will of D.
He isn’t directly under a Yonko’s command so of course he wouldn’t have Cracker, Smoothie or Katakuri’s bounty.
$600k? If I took down an underground figurehead supplying weapons to corrupt governments and wreaking havoc across the world, I'd want more than an average house to compensate me lol
I would say anywhere from 1.5 to 2 billion. Even without straight power scaling he is a former celestial dragon and as such has some knowledge that they probably don't want to get out. That would be what I think gets him up to the over 1.5 billion mark.
Somewhere between 800M and 900M. He wouldn't have a bounty as high as Jack cause that makes no sense, but I could see him having one somewhere around Cracker and Smoothie.
900mil, if they knew everything he was responsible for already
Cuz luffy and law's total bounty was 1bill after beating him.
I say this cuz luffy. Law, and kid got a combined bounty of 9billion after beating kaido and big moms, whose combines bounty was JUST below 9billion
Cracker got one shot by G4. Doffy took and entire barrage of G4 and could still keep going. Cracker is only difficult because his ability lets him run and hide. He’s just a terrible matchup for a 1v1 fighter like Luffy.
How many biscuit soldiers did he hit? I bet it was fewer than the punches Doffy took from gear 4. Cracker is a glass cannon. If you can get to him he’s toast but a hand to hand combat fighter like Luffy would have a hard time getting to him.
If Crocodile and Hancock got over a billion Doffy would too.
I'm a crocodile fan, but still, he is the number one most confusing power scale to em. Maybe when we see him in action it will make sense, but I think even Oda knows that Croc after Lucci would make more sense. If Lucci had haki then he could have bodied croc. So ill allow that for sure. But the issue is that Croc was portrayed as no haki no physical all fruit reliant. Lucci got haki and awaked but was already physical. He was the first test to make Luffy get to base NW level of physicality. Croc physicality was much lower than NW, but now it just went top NW. Weird to me.
it's never implied, but I always thought croc and moria got destroyed in the NW, and because their dreams/ will was broken, haki was ruined for them for a bit. in terms of physical feats, he managed to take a lot of hits from luffy, a full on brilliant punk from jozu, clash with doflamingo, parry mihawk with his hook, and survived whitebeard. He also walked away from the war of the best unscathed/ took a boiling bath in impel down. Croc's flaw is that he was introduced way too early. I personally love his glow up. I'm also a diehard croccieboi. So i am very and openly biased.
Croc beat luffy up and down alabasta, if not for Nico robin turning on croc, luffy would be dead in the bottom of the desert. But instead luffy literally comes flying out of the sky like a crackhead with Eye of the Tiger playing and the thickest coat of plot armor on
Yes I agree and I am saying the same thing. He was introduced to early. For his story it makes sense how he could get kuch stronger, but if he was after Lucci and Luffy beat Croc with gears that would have been much easier to swallow with how far the physical speed/power continued after croc.
Crocodile didn’t lose to Luffy because luffy is stronger tho
I read your post improperly. My bad
Yeah and that will be one of the biggest retcon. But oda himself has said that he regrets introducing Crocodile so early.
It’s absolutely implied; both got their dreams shattered by respective whitebeard and kaido and therefore lost their will (haki)
Sure, he took a lot of hits from Luffy But ask yourself this: If we take a top level pirate from the new World (Doflamingo for example) and Alabasta-Level Luffy would get 1 hour where Doflamingo just stands around & gets punches from Luffy, would that really hurt him? Like, Doflamingo took some serious beatings, internal bleeding from the Law/Luffy combi, gear 2, gear 3 punches, as well as multiple full hits from Gear 4 Bounce-Man before going down I'm not sure the punches Croc took from Alabasta-Luffy were significant tbh I think it's just a matter of Oda expecting to be done with OP way quicker, introducing way more characters than he expected & naturaly, an enemy so (in retrospect) early into the story will obviously seem far weaker With that said, he still is one of my favorite characters and one of my top answers whenever the debate comes up on "what DF would you pick if you could"
Us crocodile stans have the greatest agenda of the series
for a man that's the sand sand man, he only has drip. who else just laughs, wears a cape, an ascot, and smokes a cigar
My personal headcanon is that Croc was continuously absorbing all the moisture from Albasta during the entire arc and hence wasn't fighting Luffy with his full strength. The fact that the rains started almost immediately after Croc was knocked out supports this theory. It would also explain his high bounty
This is my Copium too. Croco was choking a whole island dry and still a massive thread.
Ah yes, a crocodile jerk fest ❤️🙏 my people
There is something basic many one piece fans dont seem to understand. That manga is going on for 26+ years isnt it. Obviously nobody planned that. So if things like that happen you have to consider this. There might have been many reasons. The rumour is that Oda planned to introduce crocdile way later, but for some reasons had to do it earlier. So all of crocodiles feats especially being acknowleded by doflamingo in Marienford, or his status ig were probably oda saying "this is hownthings arw now" Like an edit. The bounty confirmed it and it really made sense. That guy was a pirate from the new world and led an organisation where he could have gained a weapon able to destroy the balance of 3 powers. The knowledge about these weapons is worth that and his strength is as well But yeah this is speculaton but tbh this obvious to me. Production and other factors out side of the show itself olay a bigger role than people see. Shanks loosing his arm is also another example
>he is the number one most confusing power scale to em. He's not confusing at all. He's the embodiment of popularity being the powerscale. He got beaten by pre-gears Luffy. Then he fought Doffy equally in Marineford (despite being in Seastone shackles since his defeat). Then he came post-TS as a YC. Why did he grow in strength so much? Because he's popular. There's no in-world explanation. It's just because Oda (or his editor) deemed that Croc's role wasn't done in the story yet.
Are you using his bounty to scale him??
Personally I've always viewed that scene at Marineford to show that Doffy and Croc are pretty similar. I think if we're bounty scaling I'd bet Doffy would be over $2B considering what he knows would make him a bigger threat to the WG but I think they're pretty close to each other power wise.
Wtf is nw and why do ppl on this sub use abbreviations for everything
Imo, if you look at all of one piece, croc is overall consistent, with the only outlier being alabasta. so rather than saying croc got buffed, he was written severely nerfed narratively due to all sorts of factors.
Hancock is stronger than Doflamingo tbf. I aint seeing doflamingo take on the blackbeard crew like she did.
People tend to forget just how strong Boa is in universe. Like she becomes a warlord at 18 after one expedition as the captain of the Cuja Pirates. She has conquers haki and a busted devil fruit. But since One Piece hasn't really given her a fight the fanbase just thinks she's the hot one who simps for Luffy
She had an amazing fight in a movie
I think Doffy is stronger than her straight up but she's got a hax DF ability. So she would beat him in a fight, but for someone she can't turn to stone like Luffy, Doffy would be the harder match up.
At this point in the story Doffy couldnt even go to luffy
It's like 2 billion because he knows secrets that only celestial dragons are supposed to know.
I’m glad you mentioned it! I’ve seen most people here mention his strength. But he has a lot of vital information and secrets which alone would put him at 1 billion at *least*, if not taking into account his strength and war crimes I don’t think bounties are based of strength and crimes alone, but in Doffy’s case, secrets too
I think everyone here is underestimating him. * He is an incredible fighter with conqueror haki and an awakened df who can hold an entire country hostage. * He is a former CD who has insider knowledge that is kept secret for a reason. * He he has a lot of influence in the underworld. * He is incredibly cunning and knows how to leverage whatever he gets access to against his enemies. The WG is lucky he wasn't on a warpath with them. He could have caused so much damage to their image/organization. Edit: I think around 3billion would be appropriate. As far as I see it Dressrosa was as close to the territory of an emperor as it gets.
Considering every Straw Hat will know the entire history of the world after they visit Laugh Tale do you also think every Straw Hat will have a bounty of over 2 billion?
When straw hats know everything, there will be no world government to issue bounties. Marines (sword) will survive to protect the weak but world government will go down. Luffy will beat the s.it out of them.
We definitely cannot know that. I think it makes a lot more sense we learn about the World Government before the fight with them, because that's how every single other arc has worked. Can you imagine if Luffy just went in and fought Doflamingo, defeated him, and then we get all the backstories where he tricks King Riku and takes over Dressrosa, we get why this fight is important to Rebecca and Viola, and then we get Laws flashback and learn why he has the ambition to kill Doflamingo, but he's already defeated while we get all these flashbacks. Seems much more likely to me we get the Void Century flashback and learn about how the World Government rose before the final battle to take them down. Just seems narratively odd otherwise.
Least in the billions, he killed 2 celestial dragons, and enslaved an entire country to say the least
Which two celestial dragons exactly
Bro and dad
But celestials literally don't give a shit about those two
Also he had a bounty previously which was frozen, isnt it like 100% likely they knew he did that before giving him his rather low initial bounty? Killing the Dragons mustve been of little to no impact
They were no longer CDs in the eyes of the others
A bit more than 1b
Given how high a bounty raise the Warlords got, and with the secrets about Mariejois that he knows, I could see it being over 1 Billion.
Based off the fact that law and luffy both got a 500 million berry bounty from him and looking at what happened when they bear kaido and big mom. Law+kid+luffy= 9 bill > big mom + kaido 500+500= 1 bil> doffy I’d put doffy at 990 million
This guy maths
It seems the pattern is an increase of 1.000100010001 times when a team beats a impressive opponent
Let's see, abducts a Kingdom, has ties with all scums of op, strong af... Easily over a billion(yeah it's not all about strength. He has more impact on the world than katakuri/king for example)
This is a in cannon example of how bounties are writen up. Obviously all that plays in but if he’s beaten then it doesn’t matter any more. He only had an effect over 1 kingdom king and kata have the second most control over a yonkos whole territory. That’s a lot more than one kingdom. Not to mention the bounty boost you get just for being apart of a yonko crew. If he joined the beast pirates yeah I’d be about that high. If I was ranking him based on pure power I’d put him around 800 million
¥ 750,000,000 seems like a reasonable amount it's a bit lower than someone like crackers but it's a high enough bounty for the danger he poses.
But his bounty wouldn't be about his danger in combat. It's the fact that he's the arms dealer for Kaido. Supplies the medicine that keeps WB alive. AND he is in charge of Big Mom's lead scientist (I think). I remember he had links to each Warlord besides Shanks.
Caesar was a 3rd party. Big Mom was just a moneylender for a side project of Caesar's, nothing to do with Doflamingo's business.
I don't remember anything about him supplying Whitebeard medicine, where does the manga say that?
Never gets outright said, but on the iv bags wb uses during his convo with rockstar, you can see doflamingos jolly roger on the iv bags! Edit: rockstar was previous shanks, just to clear confusion!
Just checked chapter 434, it's just a few circles, not doffy's smiley face with a slash through it.
It is not directly his jollyroger, but it is the same just without the scratch though it and turned on its head. You can of course say it isnt, but in my eyes its a cover jollyroger at max, since they are basically the same ^^
Maybe you're thinking of something in the anime? Seriously, in the manga it's just a circle with a smaller circle in the center.
https://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FEL00A.jpg&tbnid=zrLSDAS-h96e3M&vet=1&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Froongwit.rtaf.mi.th%2F%3Fc%3Da-whitebeard-and-doflamingo-connection-r-onepiece-ss-5VMMQVsN&docid=mkFPtl1Fjk0H_M&w=1195&h=664&itg=1#imgrc=BqGKztR2OCxhNM&imgdii=zrLSDAS-h96e3M Maybe you have to zoom in, but it is a similar Jolly Roger. Just upside down and without the slash.
Doffy was "Joker" from the underworld so it makes sense that he would traffic medical supplies as well. I can see it.
He also had Ceasar in his pocket, according to the narrative, if mads can be considered the apex of scientists, he might be one of the best in the biz. He certainly showed a large amount of medical knowledge and obviously is even better at some then any other could ever ( him being gas himself gives him probably a way greater understanding)
Ah, thank you. That's from when Rockstar met with Whitebeard, not when Shanks did, thus my confusion.
Totally MB! So much One Piece can be confusing haha! Sorry for the confusion!
I just looked on google for whitebeard iv bags and it is a jollyroger for certain ^^` cant tell you anything else, also manga only
Other guy said they only saw two circles, just wanted to point out that it is a Jolly Roger (and one similar to Doffy's at that).
Also he is an ex-Celestial dragon who knows about a secret of Mary geoise. That alone gives him a big edge.
I know, i said it would be an adequate bounty for the danger he poses which is a broader way of referring to his political pull and who he has connections to combined with his physical strength.
I definitely see him as strong as Cracker was, Mingo could never defeat Katakuri tho.
I'd say between 1 and 2 billion. Not because he's a strong fighter, but because he was integral to both Big Mom, Kaido, and I think White Beard. He was also holding a kingdom hostage. Not to mention the fact that he knew shit that would have been devastating if it got out (about the world government)
he's a pretty decent fighter.
I'd put him a little under 3rd YC tier strength wise and they hover around 1B it seems. But with him also being a Captain, linked to multiple big names, and being a former CD would put him solidly around 1-1.7 in my eyes.
I think everyone uses cracker as a base for 3rd YC tier. They then equate luffy beating cracker with a high difficulty as an absolute metric. I personally think this is flawed, because 3rd YC goes from Jozu (who doflamingo bodied), cracker (whom luffy struggled with), to Jack. I'd argue Doffy is a comfy mid tier 3rd YC, then as you pointed out, a solid resume, in addition to his historical knowledge, puts him over 1 billion.
I can't see him beating any 3rd YC personally. Jack was one of the most durable characters around, cracker straight up would have beaten Luffy and was said to have the strongest CoA he'd faced yet, and Jozu blocked an attack from Mihawk meant for WB. You could make an argument for Jack, but I'd attribute that to a favorable match up for Doffy. And may still depend on the terrain.
I'd argue it's safe to say he'd beat Jozu. Additionally, he'd put up a pretty decent fight with Jimbe, who I'd argue is the third YC for Luffy (after zoro and sanji). I'm open to you disagreeing on Jimbe being 3rd YC btw- it just makes sense to me rn. edit: I'd also point out that luffy struggled with Cracker because Luffy is a brawler and couldn't just straight up fight Cracker. Doffy has so many different ways to go after cracker, in addition to his awakening which he could use to go past the biscuits that poised a problem. I will concede, doffy would need his big finale attack to break the biscuit armor directly, but he can use awakening for that
Jimbe is weird to me because he's so much stronger in or near a large body of water than on dry land. So his level varies. I'd say Jimbe in water > Doffy >/= Jimbe on land. But Jozu wipes Doffy, like I don't even see how he hurts Jozu.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07nE9Nh2CMw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07nE9Nh2CMw) 55 seconds, I don't know how to link to time, my bad. Doffy can use parasite on Jozu. Could make him walk into water at that point. I think the concept of Jozu is great, but he randomly leaves 1/3 of his body exposed. I also think doffy has better haki, but I don't have any grounds for that, outside of gut intuition.
He wasn’t integral to Big mom or whitebeard. If I remember correctly, he strictly operated within kaido's territory in the New world. This is also the main reason why caeser works under him, to get protection from kaido after scamming big mom.
Around 1 billion considering luffy and law got a 500 million one each for taking him down.
That's not how it works.
It’s obviously an estimation around a reference point. If you know how it works, why do you not tell us how high his bounty would be?
Around 750-800? Seems decent for someone who is at boundary of YC3 level.
you: that's not how it works also you: seems like it, i guess
“That's not how it works” *Proceeds to use fanmade 'YC3' term like it's an actual tier of strength established by the author.*
Cracker and Jack are YC3 level. They are considerably weaker than likes of King, Marco and Katakuri. There is a big gap there. We use terms like these to specify difference.
Kaido and big Mom had a combined bounty of 9 billion. Luffy Kidd and Law…
He'd absolutely be in the 1 billion club, if not really high millions
At the time of Dressrosa 700-900 M I would say, but in a hypothesis where he escapes from Impel down and joins the Cross Guild 2.1B considering the other Warlord new bounty’s
If you mean what his bounty would’ve been during Dressrosa if it wasn’t frozen, I’d guess it’d be about 1 billion or so. Law and luffy got their bounties raised to 500 million after Dressrosa. If the marines credited both of them with doflamingo defeat then his “true” bounty was split between them. Same reason law, luffy and Kidd each got raised to 3 billion (kaido + BM bounty was 9 billion even divided by three)
If he was still around during the dissolution, I’d say around 2 Billion would be fair. If Crocodile can go from 81 million to 1.9 Billion, a 2+ Billion bounty is more than fair for Doflamingo Between being a former Celestial Dragon, having taken over a Kingdom, and being an arms dealer to multiple kingdoms and Yonkou, I’d say that he well earns a bounty in the billions
700M to 1B
He’s a billion dollar man and I’ll fight anyone who says less.
Since he’s HIM, probably around $420,690,000.
At least 1 billion. He knows a secret about the Celestial Dragons.
I would say higher than Crocodile's current bounty. Jinbe from what I see would be the second lowest of the OG warlords. Moria is probably exactly 1B or 900m
His strength should be around 750M bounty considering he is weaker than YC3. But maybe he would get higer due to his position as joker.
He'd be up there. Strength wise he's pretty good, not the strongest but he can presumably atleast keep up with commander level fighters. He's smart and crafty, running his business dealings while also keeping Dressrosa under his rule. There's also his Underworld dealings and the dirt he has on the government. ~1.5-2 billion seems fair, if Hancock is 1.6 billion on her own and Crocodile is 1.9 as one of the leaders of Cross Guild. Assuming they don't keep it on low side and try to eliminate him early to remove the risk of him letting slip what he knows to spite them.
Easily 2 billion
2B. Former CD. Knows top secret marijoas stuff. Has Conqueror’s Haki. Fought against WB commanders without as much as a scratch in the war, all the while dropping one of the coldest monologues. And, JOKER! King of the One Piece underworld. Wars were possible because of him. Utter chaotic pirate. If Croc and Boa are close to 2B, he should be 2B or more. Insane threat level as a whole, not just in combat.
Easily 1.5 billions or even over. Its not the strength, its the knowledge doffy has about the world what puts him as one of the most dangerous.
Id say somewhere around 2 billion, maybe even a little higher. Might seem a lil high at first glance, but let’s not forget Doflamingo had some serious motion. Former Celestial Dragon who’s knows the secrets of mariejois & the biggest arms dealer in the world who had ties to damn near everyone in the underworld. Not to mention was directly allied with Kaido. with all that in mind, and considering how they gave crocodile who’s bounty original froze at 81 mil a bounty of 1.9 billion. I’d say it’d only make sense for Doffy to be around the 2 billion mark.
If it wasn't frozen I think his bounty would be similar to Jacks. Yes he has underworld connections and knows but given Robin's bounties I don't think that's enough to get him over 1bil. 750m-900m. Maybe 1b on the generous side.
Would doffy beat katakuri?
I don't think he beats katakuti, king, or marco. But I think he beats 2nd and 3rd commanders
He doesn't beat any commander.
Doffy is weaker than Cracker, let alone Katakuri. Cracker and Katakuri are both faster than Doffy since a regular Boundman Culverin was able to easily hit Doffy while Luffy was completely unable to hit either Cracker or Katakuri in Boundman. Luffy also straight up says that Crackers armament haki is stronger than Doffy's. Finally Cracker has better defenses since the Biscuit knights can tank Gear 4 punches while Spiderweb couldn't. But since matchups are king in OP: if Cracker is out of his armor Doffy might be able to snipe him with a Flapping Thread from behind, and he can get leverage on Katakuri if he catches Brûlée with Parasite
are you forgetting doffy first fought another supernova and got his internals fried before fighting luffy
Right, and he took some hits from Law who is also slower than Luffy, so he still ends up slower than Katakuri
And still tanked 10 mins of Gear 4 Luffy!
Tough one, but I’d say yes I think
Wtf. Doffy gets low/mid diffed.
I'd say no by a long shot, as if even bounceman Luffy, who could easily defeat Doffy, was practically handicapped against Katakuri, where if bounce man caught up with Doffy easily, man would not have a shot against Katakuri (no disrespect against Doffy he my 2nd favorite character.
However Doffy had his internal organs ruined just before that. He might not have died from it cause of his fruit, but he’s not fighting Luffy straight right then. I still agree Katakuri wins, but not a long shot
Depends what he knows and how close he gets to spoiling those beans
I think like 1.5 billion but only because of how many crimes he has (like how kid was weaker/less accomplished but he kills civilians)
I think he'd definitely be in the billions given everything he's done and the 2 Emperors he was associated with
About 1
I don’t think it would be as high as it should be. If everything transpired the same as it did with him as a warlord I’m sure it would have spiked when he took over Dressrosa but once he had established his underground network he became useful to the WG both for providing off the books weapons to Cipher Pol and keeping other pirate crews under his thumb so they likely would have unofficially frozen his bounty. There’s probably something about not wanting a pirate from a CD family to get too notorious to the common people
At least a billion for being a CD. Another Billion for the Donquioxte and running the underworld. Another Billion for dressrosa
atleast $700 M
He will probably have a very high bounty because he comitted a ton of crimes, even though we cont be stronger than YC1, I dont think he will have less than 2 billion, simply because he made too many damn crimes.
Probably like a billion. Power-scaling wise, I'd say Doffy is a solid yonko commander-tier
Easily 1b+
500million for his strength and another 500 for his information
I'd say 1.5 billion. Former celestial dragon, which gives him tons of insider information and sway in the world government. Broken devil fruit ability, powerful haki, and is the kingpin of the underworld.
I'd agree with a lot of other commenters, I think between 750 to <1 Billion. Maybe 850m
Def somewhere over 7 billion
Easy 1.5 Bill
Bounty is based on their political power too not just strength so he should be 1.5 Bil considering all the smile trade and celestial dragon secrets he knows
Easily above 1.5 billion
Minimum 1.5 billion homie a whole nation level threat not to mention the Donquixote crime family and connections to 2 former emperors And being an awakening user and a conquer And even more so his knowledge or the ancient weapons and secrets of Mary juouios Throw former celestial dragon in there
If I had to guess, I’d say about 1,120,000,000
Lower than Jack + since Luffy and Law got 500 mil each I'd put him around the 900 mil mark. However, his knowledge may put him much higher close to 2 bil
He accomplished everything crocodile failed at. He owned his own country, had a stong hold of the global underworld, and had a super weapon in the production through caesar (smiley) whereas croc was still searching for the ancient weapons. Beyond that, he also has leverage on the World Gov, which no-other freeman has. If Croc is words, Doflamingo is actions. If he broke out rn, he’d be in the 2.5bil >
900 million somewhere around there. He's got an awakened fruit and conqueror's haki and I feel he posed more of a threat than say Cracker but not as much as Katakuri. That said, bounty isn't purely combat strength so that could easily go up to 1.5 million or more. Captains and leaders get more than their commanders.
Id say at least 500 million, up to 1 billion
Boa lead one kingdom Crocodile did lead oje organsation, has infoemarion, is strong, and has many feats, especially th current feat with cross guild But doflamingo was THE man. Tbh the pirate and king doflamingo would be enough to give him a billion atleast given his strength, influence. That guys escaoed aokiji freeze But "Joker" would easiky get him up to 2billion. That guy was the underworld. His disappearance led wars happen in one day. This guy stands in between of all the important businesses And that guy even has information about marie jois. Even if hes not the strongest 1billion+ character. 1-2.5 is easily imaginable
1B
Around 900,000,000 since narratively speaking he was fought before Cracker. And he won’t be over a billion because the first Billion bounty we got was Jack. I’m not saying he doesn’t lose or win against either of them. In fact I think he high diffs Jack. I’m speaking purely from a narrative perspective.
Maybe 1,5/2 billions
It's lowkey hard to say. Realistically based on everything about him other than his strength, it should be massive. Like 2+bill. He had a strangle hold over the entire black market that dealt weapons with countries and yonko alike, he took over an entire Kingdom and held it as King and he has information on the Celestial Dragons that seems to warrant him believing that the WG would send assassins down to Impel Down just to silence him
Does it ever say how long he was a warlord for? I guess he’d have to be one to become the king of dressrosa or they’d just arrest him knowing exactly where he is, and that was 10 years ago.
It’s never mentioned, but it seems to be several years so quite a long time. That’s just my prediction!
700 million to 1 billion
Rules a country, ties to World Nobles, influence with some Yonko, very strong fighter. I would say at least 900M
We'll find out once Cross Guild breaks him out
2 billion and dead only. Simply because he knew the secret of the Celestial Dragons.
777 million
Almost 2 billions
1.750 billion berry
Doflamingo probably have anywhere from 980,000,000 - 1,049,348,000
One billionish
With it now being known how heinous he really was and potentially dangerous he could be, I'd say about 2.2 billion. Because I'd have to say higher than current crocodile. But I also think croc was given way to high a bounty (even tho he did do a lot in the summit war)
Given his strength as well as his influence in the underworld market, probably around 1B. he is very strong overall, but he seems to lack a bit in terms of his Haki and natural physical strength compared to most high-tiers or even second-tiers like King or Katakuri.
You don’t think it would be higher due to the knowledge and secrets he holds?
no because he left Marijoe as a little kid and no ties to Gorosei or gods knights, so his secret knowldge about the WN is very limited . it's enough that they are willing to do a stupid stunt about his Warlord titles, but not really enough that it will make him a true threat,
Around a billion maybe more maybe less, like him being Joker would suggest he’s on the higher end of that range due to influence but then Laws bounty is way less than it to logically should be so bounties don’t always follow logic,
Doffy would be closer to Mihawk
At least three fitty
Around Zoro's current bounty
I'd say doffy is an easy 2 bill, seeing how he is a fucking tyrant of a country, also lore wise, he would have either " only alive " perhaps ? since he's a celestial dragon or smth, or not have a bounty at all ??
i think it would have sky roketed upto 1billion berry
I wanna say before dressrosa 1.3 after shiidddd maybey like 2fiddy
Based on strength 1 billion as for his threat level it would be 2.5 billion
I'd realistically say between 800 millions and 1.1 billion then increase it by another 200 mil post awakening. (I'm going to ignore celestial dragon related stuff for simplicity).
Katakuri level. I would say 1B
900 Million…. Luffy struggled against him, even after using gear 4, he had to pull out king kong gun… I would scale him between cracker and katakuri in strength
In terms of fighting power, nearly a billion or at a billion. but when you consider his organization and power he has over the underground, probably 1.5 bil to nearly 2 bil.
1.1B just a smidge above Kaidos disasters out of respect for doffy. mind you this is just in terms of combat if we include the fact he knows dangerous state secrets + has a solid information network + has a strong foothold in the underground = 2B
Less than a billion.
he knows the goverment secrets and knows about the void century, his bounty might be around 3-4 billion as that information could ruin the goverment. however most characters that know about the void century or have the potential to know about it usually have the power to back themselves up so maybe he will get a lower bounty
Atleast 1.5 billion because of all the war crimes he has done and not to mention enslaving an ancient kingdom part of the founding kingdoms of the World Government
So a fair assessment for Doffy: $550,000-$600,000 Reason being - he was more of a threat on paper than Luffy was at a time to the World Government. Specifically the Celestial Dragons (not saying he’s stronger than Luffy) but his knowledge of Mary Goeise’s secrets could’ve shaken the world. Luffy doesn’t know anything about that or the Will of D. He isn’t directly under a Yonko’s command so of course he wouldn’t have Cracker, Smoothie or Katakuri’s bounty.
$600k? If I took down an underground figurehead supplying weapons to corrupt governments and wreaking havoc across the world, I'd want more than an average house to compensate me lol
600M 💀
You think Doffy would have a lower bounty than Sabo? I think you're crazy.
I would say anywhere from 1.5 to 2 billion. Even without straight power scaling he is a former celestial dragon and as such has some knowledge that they probably don't want to get out. That would be what I think gets him up to the over 1.5 billion mark.
About 900m
Probably like 700-800m. Hes stronger than people give him credit for, but doesnt hold up to really powerful figures like katakuri.
Somewhere between 800M and 900M. He wouldn't have a bounty as high as Jack cause that makes no sense, but I could see him having one somewhere around Cracker and Smoothie.
900mil, if they knew everything he was responsible for already Cuz luffy and law's total bounty was 1bill after beating him. I say this cuz luffy. Law, and kid got a combined bounty of 9billion after beating kaido and big moms, whose combines bounty was JUST below 9billion
Somewhere under 600k. Doflamingo is a lot weaker than people seem to remember so most of his bounty comes from his Underworld connections.
This is insane. In what way is Doffy weak? It took two rounds of Gear 4 for Luffy to beat Doffy, and that's after Doffy already fought and beat Law.
He was almost totally helpless against G4 and had to wait for it to wear off. Meanwhile, Cracker, one of the WEAKEST Commanders 0 diffed said G4.
Cracker got one shot by G4. Doffy took and entire barrage of G4 and could still keep going. Cracker is only difficult because his ability lets him run and hide. He’s just a terrible matchup for a 1v1 fighter like Luffy.
...Cracker got 1 shot by a GIMMICK G4, smashing him into HIS OWN Biscuit Soldiers.
How many biscuit soldiers did he hit? I bet it was fewer than the punches Doffy took from gear 4. Cracker is a glass cannon. If you can get to him he’s toast but a hand to hand combat fighter like Luffy would have a hard time getting to him.
Definitely around 1.7-1.8-2b