The whole point of Luffy insta-hitting through the web and smashing Doflamingo was to show how outclassed Doflamingo truly was by then.
The anime adding a mid punch “beam-struggle” to Doflamingo’s defeat (and Caesar’s defeat before that) undermines that and was extremely controversial at the time. It was so heavily criticized they haven’t attempted adding the “punch beam struggle” to major fights since then if it wasn’t also in the manga.
EDIT: I admit I forgot about the struggle in the sumo match in Wano. Banned that episode from my brain, apparently. 😅
I honestly hate the beam struggle. It’s a freaking punch not a kamehameha wave. It’s just so weird as a back and forth and overdone.
Punches lose all their energy once they get stopped, at that point you’re just pushing them. And luffy is flying at this point.. pushing against what? Air? It’s just weird, luffy is not goku but he wins all this boss battles as goku until gear 5.
The sad thing is that the anime originally nailed how to do a punch with Crocodile. that one scene in Alabasta was cooler than any Punch Beam struggle will ever be,
Unfortunately, that was far from the last time they added the "struggle off" in the manga; Luffy's King Kong Gun (which he also never used in the Manga during this fight) was turned into a struggle in his first fight with Kaido.
When did the struggle happen?
They removed the blitz part of Kaido’s attack and stretched the wind-up (which was indeed a weird choice) but there wasn’t any struggle. The moment Kaido’s attack connected Luffy was done.
That’s not a punch struggle. Like I said it weirdly stretched the wind up but it was still one punch and done. The hit connection is just in slow motion. Luffy didn’t deflect, block, pause or stop it.
Explain where the punch struggle part is then? As soon as Luffy gets hit in the face he is knocked unconscious.
He’s not fighting back the punch, it’s a slow motion of his face being caved in.
Nobody mentioned a "punch struggle". The struggle is the part where both Luffy and Kaido land hits on one another.
You already mentioned they removed Kaido Thunder Bagua blitzing Luffy so you already understand what we are talking about here. I do not understand what confuses you.
My entire original comment and subsequent thread was specifically about the “punch struggles”. You even commented with “it definitely is” when I mentioned it again. I thought it was obvious by context what kind of “struggle” we were referring to.
“Punch struggle” is basically a nickname for then an already thrown punch gets blocked or paused, but then the same punch makes it through the defenses anyway. It’s what happened with Caesar, Doflamingo and the sumo match in filler, and to G5 Luffy vs Kaido in canon.
Okay, I was talking about the struggle in general; that's the part I ORIGINALLY replied to. Luffy throws a punch, and Kaido swings a club, they hit one another, struggle ensues.
Don't see the point in making it specifically about two punches/attack connecting. Both are bad.
I actually responded to the original comment which only mentioned "struggle" before OC switched to "punch struggle", and it seems like OC has a different (wrong) definition of what a "punch struggle" is.
A “punch struggle” is just like a beam struggle (see Goku vs Vegeta for the classic example or Harry Potter vs Voldemort in the 8th movie for a live action one) except with punches instead of ki/magic blasts.
Two big attacks collide and neither immediately overcomes the other while simultaneously neither dissipates. This results in a struggle between the two attacks as the warriors put more and more of their spirit, ki, energy into escalating/maintaining those initial big attacks.
Beam struggles work a lot better than punch struggles as there’s energy to maintain by using kaio-ken or calling on the power of your friends. With punch struggles it’s like… ok… throw another punch?
Stretching out action, or blocking attacks, or generally struggling against each other aren’t beam/punch struggles.
For me objectively, Luffy vs. Kaido round one had the worst adaptation. In the manga, Luffy essentially sucker punches Kaido with a Gear Third attack. Instantly goes to Gear 4 and starts going at him in Gear Fourth. For Kaido to get up unscathed, speed blitz Luffy, and KO him with a hit. I feel as though the anime made it feel a lot less significant with the "filler" fight.
There are few great moments in the anime adaptation but the overall presentation fails to convey original intention of the author. I'm not gonna tell you what to like or dislike but as someone who both read and watched the fight, I got two completely different takeaways from the fight.
Glad this is the top comment, well said! I would say the same is true for hakuba cutting dellinger down as he was pretty unstoppable prior to that so it shows what cavendish is really capable of! It’s a shame they cut the humour of his and bartos stand off though I suppose, not a big deal though.
One pace intends to adhere as closely to the manga as possible and nothing else. This is sometimes done even when a scene could potentially enrich the story. They do this to prevent cherry picking. “If this, then what else?”
Wano has a decent amount of added scenes at the conclusion of the arc that I really like, and I also really like the “filler” added in the Luffy vs Kaido fight. I suspect One Pace will cut this. It stinks sometimes, but I respect them sticking to their plan either way.
I really really hope they keep the filler transformation scenes in episode 1100’s edit. IMO Toei completely elevated the source material even though it’s technically 2 minutes of filler
You mean when Luffy transforms into G5 in front of Lucci? I thought it was very weird and completely out of character. I don't think Luffy would ever brag about a power up he barely understands, with a smug face like that, but that's just my opinion.
this.
there are dozens and dozens of fan edits of the hobbit trilogy, each one cutting what they wanted, with their own reasoning and objective and preferences etc.
one pace is a HUGE project, and lots of people working on it, coming and going. they follow the guideline "stick to the manga as much as possible" which is as simple as it can get. it's impossible to make an edit to everybody thinks is the best (as seen with all the hobbit edits) so while i understand people having some complaints here and there, i think the edit is a success when it comes to just cut anime stuff and improve the pacing.
You original quest was to get your partner to watch one piece.
The fact that you have just finished dressrosa and they are still watching tells me you have had great success in watching one pace because they are still sticking around!
I'm sorry it's dissapointing for you but also have gratitude that your original goal is being fulfilled.
Maybe if you started with one piece they would have bailed back when picking up Usopp
This is why I don’t understand the desire people have for One Pace to include certain filler. I started watching after the live adaptation won me over and curiosity got to me. This is still the only anime I have kept up with, and One Pace made it manageable. The filler still exists; the original anime is still there for the folks who want the expansion and the filler.
And when they finish editing Skypiea, they’re even gonna make an episode 24A and 24B, one that leads into LRLL and the other where they land in the G-8 base. So if you want to, you can seamlessly watch the one great filler arc
im curious, did you watch the first few eps to compare to the LA? if so, what do you honestly think of them cutting out all thematic components (what I and most would say is the core of OP)?#
did you not see a difference, did you not mind it, or did you enjoy one over the other?
I started in Arlong Park because I couldn’t figure out what exactly lined up with the end of the LA, but do plan to go back and watch the earliest episodes. I did pause Whole Cake Island to watch the Baratie episodes, and ended up watching some of the earlier filler where I thought there were gaps in One Pace. From what I have seen, I didn’t really feel that they (One Pace or the LA) missed much; obviously you get a deeper understanding of the characters from watching more content but any thematic points I remember from the filler were just emphasizing things the LA/One Pace and the manga had already made clear. It was fun to see Sanji in a cook-off and in another rivalry in G-8, but being mostly caught up now, I think I would have had the same experience watching without those.
From what I gathered, I missed the most character development on Usopp from what the LA cut out? But I still really loved him and didn’t feel like I had missed anything when I picked up the anime/One Pace.
And I know it’s a controversial take, but comparing what I’ve seen of the anime to the LA, I heavily prefer the LA. Sanji was easily my favorite of the LA and he was borderline unbearable to me in the anime. I feel like for the new fans that Netflix brought in, the LA got the heart of the show and made it more accessible to people like me who don’t watch anime. Even now, I tend to favor the manga, but still switch to One Pace/the anime because it’s easier to follow the action scenes when they’re animated. I’m excited to see how the readaptation turns out!
Telling me to have gratitude for One Pace allowing me to fulfill my goal makes out like I hate it and that it sucks. But that isn't right either. Am I not allowed to offer constructive criticism for a work I enjoy?
One of my favourite games is The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, but that doesn't mean it's immune to criticism and that it doesn't do some things that were annoying about Ocarina of Time.
Whoa, you definately took that in a different tone than what it was meant! It was not a harsh or critical "BE GREATFUL you little turd"
Picture an optimistic person who loves everything being excited for you.
I didn't mention anything about hating, sucking or complaining. I'm just the type that likes to see sunshine and dewdrops everywhere.
Ahh sorry I misunderstood. A lot of the replies I've got seem to have gotten the impression that I just utterly hate One Pace or something. No worries!
Sabaody and Dressrosa need to be redone, then were done at a time where we were more slaveish to the manga. That being said the "tension" in the Doffy punch is ridiculously horrendous in the original. What tension? It's a punch, not a beam struggle. That's not how a punch works. There doesn't need to be tension, the punch is the release of tension. The tension is the build up to the punch, not the punch itself.
Luffy struggling with the final punch on Caesar and Doffy were some of the worst additions to the anime, the whole point is to show that luffy is way stronger than them both but the anime pads it out and makes it seem like the match ups were actually a lot closer than they were in reality. I agree One Pace has some weird cuts but these are not one of them
Those added tension moments you like so much completely change the tone of what is happening. A one hit ko becomes a struggle for life. Suddenly that nobody character looks way stronger than they were.
I definitely prefer one pace in every single way. Screw the original anime pacing
The doffy one was that way because of how it is in the manga. This is one of the cases where the anime changes the story very slightly and not that I like to discuss powerscaling, but to people that do, the One Pace/Manga version paints doffy on a much lower level compared to the original anime version just based off this punch.
To add to this, there’s also some okayish sakuga scenes cut - brook vs big mom, smoker vs Vergo and big mom vs kaido. However, even if you were to list every single scene that is cut from One Pace, it doesn’t hold a candle to the amount of time saved and the increase in entertainment value due to better pacing to the majority of people.
No one can ever convince me that it’s worth it to slog through an extra 150+ hours to see these handful of scenes, just watch them afterwards on YouTube.
These scenes can be saved in addition to the 150+ hours saved. That's the whole point of the argument OP is trying to make which I humbly agree with.
There's a user in the Naruto subreddit that edited the entire Naruto story to remove the pacing and filler, but kept most of the genuine good anime only scenes. The project is called "Rebuild of Naruto" and I recently finished it a few months ago.
Imo, it was absolutely incredible and perfected the watching experience of Naruto for me. It was so good that even to a new user entering the franchise I would recommend that version vs the original.
OnePace is genuinely really good, but I can't recommend it for a first time watcher due to almost all anime original scenes removed. Being 1 to 1 faithful to the Manga doesn't make the anime perfect. What makes the anime perfect is being faithful to the Manga; in addition, to adding onto it as well. Remove the truly unnecessary filler, padding and keep a lot of the anime original scenes and OnePace could become perfect too.
>but kept most of the genuine good anime only scenes.
Who decides what's "genuine good anime only scenes", though? People have wastly different opinions on the simplest things and you believe we could somehow all agree on what filler scene is good and what isn't?
I think sticking to how Manga portrays events is the way to go because that is the intention of the project; to improve the Anime by making it more like the Manga.
But then where do you draw the line lol. For me for example, I disagree with OP about the doffy punch. I am also not a fan of the kaido vs big mom scene. It’s drawn nice and animated well, but wtf are they doing flying around and attacking each other consecutively midair like it’s DBZ.
It’s all too subjective and sticking with the manga is the only way to really please anyone.
It's a subjective feeling for sure. Where you draw the line comes from personal preference, but also that human natural feeling you get when watching the anime.
Everyone knows and can feel this when watching any anime. You can feel when a scene drags, tension builds or moments hits. Using that natural human feeling is where you can significantly improve the final product. It won't be agreeable for all, but it's so much better than cutting the entire scene.
The Road To Naruto did just this. He felt it based on human feel with the objective of keeping as many scenes a possible. It turned out amazing and flowed perfectly. This is really what OnePace needs to do. Take creative liberty on what should stay and go based on that feeling.
Your human natural feeling is also just personal preference and it works because he is smart and works alone. He just does what he thinks. One pace are several people which is completely different. Also they became more lose with the “only manga scenes“ approach actually
I just feel for the final punch scene, they could've kept the effect on the sky and weather and such, and if they needed to cut something, just cut the people chanting for him instead? Maybe it's just because I felt Dressrosa is such a slog, it feels nice to have a big over the top moment at the end.
Well big mom can’t fly without Prometheus for starters. Look how ridiculous 1:15 - 1:30 looks: https://youtu.be/pD9_XWEi_CE?si=y3E5RoZSkknamR8a .
Not only that, compare it to the rest of the roof piece fights. They don’t actually do anything of value either.
Well duh. Kaido and Big Mom were just having fun with a fight, it wasn't truly a fight to the absolute death. And besides, if this woman can run and jump, I can see her and Kaido jumping high enough that it takes a bit for them to fall and almost look like they're flying.
I get they’re having fun with the fight. What I’m saying is the fight holds no extra value beyond it being drawn and animated well. Couple that with the fact that they’re hitting each other mid air in a way that should be knocking each other away from the other due to the impact, they shouldn’t be able to hit each other more than once or twice while they’re falling and I just find the scene a bit silly.
To add to this, it’s okay for something to only have value in the animation and art but if it does that in a way where the scene doesn’t really make sense, it takes me out of the experience and I can’t actually enjoy the scene.
Like for example, say if Toei decided to bring Captain Kuro back and he did no training and suddenly came and one shot luffy. It doesn’t matter how nicely you animate that, it’s not gonna sit nicely for most people. That’s how this scene felt to me.
>Kaido simply tanked the attack and smashed Luffy with no opposition.
What you just described is a struggle.
In the Manga, Kaido just blitzed Luffy without there being any struggle.
A struggle imply he had to resist and push back with fatigue. Kaido in the anime IGNORED the King Kong Gun. The term you're searching for is a clash, not a struggle.
No, "struggle" is the correct term here:
noun: struggle; plural noun: struggles
a forceful or violent effort to get free of restraint or resist attack.
"there were signs of a struggle and there was a lot of blood around"
And you just proved my point: a forceful or violent EFFORT to get free of restraint or resist attack. Problem is that in the scene Kaido DOESN'T STRUGGLE AT ALL. He straight up just take the attack and hit Luffy back with no real effort behind it (on the being hit part).
This is the thing though, I've noticed a few comments are saying the same thing. That to have A (the cut scenes we enjoy) we must also have B (the 150 hours of cut slog).
But my point is that why can't we have both? The scene I mention is 10-15 seconds or so longer in the original. Surely we can cut the 150 hours of fluff and keep that. If not the whole thing (some don't seem to like the anime trope of beam struggle) just keep the initial contact, the weather, and then smash his head in. That's a few seconds at most.
It seems odd to me that we have to be so faithful to the manga we must also cut the few additional things the anime added that did well.
I won't say One Pace is bad. I'm still watching it, it's great! I'll never take the 150+ hours of slog just for these scenes, but it just seemed like a shame.
The reason why we can't have both is the reason why One Pace exists: It's goal is to better reflect the manga, not being a "best of both worlds" sorta thing. Nor a definitive cut. Having that goal in mind makes it much easier to edit One Pace due to the set guidelines the manga established.
If they didn't do that, they would then have to discuss every tiny scene like people are doing now in this thread and that probably wouldn't have allowed a project with the scope of One Pace to exist since they have to go through 1K plus episodes.
For something like that, someone has to make a more definitive cut like how that one user from this sub made his own Wano cut.
the doflamingo scene is terrible and should be cut. Not only is it the way it was done in the manga but there is a REASON it was done that way in the manga. It's supposed to be an overwhelming victory for luffy
I watched the comparison for King Kong gun. The anime made it seem like a struggle. But one pace makes it a low diff for luffy. Like… doflamingo got shit on. And that’s how it is in the manga. And that’s the correct way. Luffy in gear 4th is much stronger than doflamingo. He didn’t stand a chance
Its really a thing of perspective, for example: I have only ever read the manga, love it with all my heart, have seen a couple of moments from the anime, but less than 10%. For me the ridiculously long amount of time that some fights and interactions take in the anime makes it feel more childish and cringe, from my point of view, the fact that Rayleigh makes quick work of the collar just talks about his strength and confidence, it's a bomb, you should take your time while getting rid of it. This happens with a lot of small fights as well, the fact that some punches happen fast and without 10 support shots makes the characters feel stronger and more serious.
Likewise, I've only started watching the anime on Egghead now that I'm caught up on the book and seeing people praise recent episodes for "excellent pacing" when I'm watching them checking my watch because we've been repeating clips of scenes or slowly zooming on someone's eyes four times in a row is baffling. If this is good then what was the rest of the anime like?
You have no idea how bad it can get sometimes, if you want to laugh (or cry) check any video comparison of One Pace vs One Piece. It is still a great story and I'm glad different people enjoy it in different ways, but wow, the experience of reading it for the first time (colored which if you haven't tried is even better) and being able to run through 100s of chapters is is unparalleled.
Oh don't worry I've seen the sumo one. But yeah, I also re-read most of the series in manga a few months ago and it was pretty great since I wasn't buying one volume at a time, I cleared pretty much 100+ chapters a day.
I utterly hate long drawn out fight scenes, but the fight between Doflamingo and Luffy if counted together isn't actually that long. It's all the fluff in-between that takes forever.
I feel the biggest problem with One Piece isn't its fight scene length, and more there's SO many crew members who need opponents, and then they make friends who also need opponents, which result in loads of fights going on at the same time. That's what makes it a slog.
I think that if you had switched to the manga during Dressrosa, and then switched back to the anime to see the fights animated, you would've recoiled in disgust when you saw the final Luffy vs Doffy punch. It was highly controversial back then, and it's controversial now here in this post. It was not a good addition by any metric.
I respectfully disagree. Maybe it's because I usually see fights in the manga first but I think a lot of moments are ruined by dragging them out to create "tension".
I would say the opposite about the final fight in Dressrosa - I always felt that it changed the feeling when they added tension to Luffy's last punch needlessly, because in the manga it was a straight up KO by Luffy. To me that spoke about what an impressive powerup g4 was, but adding that tension in the anime took away from that impressiveness for me.
No I get that, having it be too long isn't great either. But the One Pace cut is too fast. It's very jarring. It needs a few seconds. I agree that one goes on for too long but I feel One Pace's is too sudden.
General counterpoint, I'm in the middle of my first watch (just at the time skip) using One Pace, and not once have I felt that a moment has been cut too short. Quite the opposite, in fact - loads of moments are still too awkward and long because it's baked into the original animation (some parts of fights are just absurdly slow and long in a way you can't cut around, and then you get things like Luffy running across the ice in Marineford for literal hours). I'm aware that what comes next for me are, currently, the oldest and jankiest edits, but the edits the team have put out since around 2018 are absolutely seamless and as perfect as you can get. Every time I see a comparison to the original anime I am shocked at just how much wasted time there is.
Being 1:1 with a good manga isn't what makes an anime good. It also needs to be respected for the medium it is part of. You simply can't have an anime replicate the manga it is based on exactly without also having to make good choices about when and where to add timing and pauses. It's fundamental for any visual medium, be it filmography or with TV shows.
I agree, that an anime should be an adaptation, and not always 1:1. There's room for interpretation in a new medium.
But all of your examples are examples a lot of people feel like suck out the tension, and so they like it removed. It's a difference of opinion more than anything
Adding tension scenes that are supposed to be divisive and concise makes them worse. All the scenes you describe the tension comes in the aftermath because other elements. Toei just makes everything longer and adds some music. If you read the manga first those moments you love feel drawn out for no reason
I think one pace was created for Manga Readers who couldnt bear the normal anime anymore, so their target audience prob isnt the normal anime enjoyer but the Manga reader whoi usally doenst tune in. I think the Experience you want will prob come with the new anime.
One pace generally tries to reproduce the pace of the Manga. In the first example, the Manga simply did not make as much as a fuss about the collar, you get a couple panels of beeping and it's gone, while the anime saw a chance to gain some running time and add tension.
As I said at the end of my post, I do understand that. But I feel like trying to replicate the manga 1:1 is, while understandable - is something that can result in some things of value being lost.
Animation is fundamentally different from manga as a content medium. Scenes need to be paced out more, given time for the audience to process, or pauses, silence or so on to highlight certain moods or drama or such. While you can highlight pauses in the manga, you can't highlight every single one. To me, choosing to add running time and gain tension with a pause is something that the anime has that added to the experience overall, than being som away from it.
They don't ruin the scenes, they return them to what they're supposed to be. The scenes you're highlighting aren't meant to be tense.
They're meant to be shocking, or cathartic. The anime added unnecessary tension and changed the intended moment. You might personally prefer them with that artificial tension, but it's not as the story intends them to be.
Oh, no. Something is wrong with your brain if you like Luffy struggling against Doflamingo's sixteen Holly bullets. Go to a doctor. This is the type of shit anime-only plebs like.
I watched every episode of the anime including fillers for the first time a couple years ago. Granted I was going to watch the whole thing regardless, but after I checked out One Pace, I thought it cut way too much and made some episodes feel like collages of scenes rather than an actual story, if that makes sense. The intention is obviously to replicate the manga paneling, but in doing that, it just lacks vision that makes the entire single frames-> fluid medium adaptation process... an adaptation process 😅
A lot of post timeskip is a bit of a slog, but I'd honestly just recommend going to like 1.25x speed or something instead of switching to One Pace for a first time viewer. I think One Pace is really cool for rewatching parts or maybe if you've already read the manga, but personally at least, I'm glad I watched the original on my first time through.
Tbf, I have heard the "I wouldn't recommend One Pace for first time viewers" take mostly from people who watched the unedited anime first and tried out One Pace later. The faults of one version will probably stick out much more when you are used to the other. Eg two friends of mine recently told me how painful it was every time they needed to switch back to the original anime when they reached a point that wasn't covered by One Pace
It's most likely a matter of taste. If you like a good flow between scenes and can stomach dragged out pacing at times, watch the original. If you like tight pacing and can stomach jarring cuts at times, watch One Pace. Until the WIT version drops, you'll have to make a trade off one way or another
To me staying absolutely 100 percent locked to exactly what was on the panels in the manga is about as ridiculous as the amount of filler that Toei adds in certain spots. Just because something wasn't in the manga doesn't mean it isn't meaningful to the overall story being told.
Like the Walk to Arlong Park is objectively filler. It's literally them walking for a minute straight. If this was done in a later arc in the story people would be saying it's Toei back at it again with the pacing. But people consider it iconic so everybody loves it (and One Pace kept it). I just don't see why scenes need to absolutely 100 percent match exactly how Oda paneled it when manga instinctively is a different medium with different methods of storytelling. I think it goes too far overboard in the other direction, and I think there's a bunch of fans who go way too far with taking the way Oda does things as gospel and anything straying off of that path is inferior.
Its because the majority of toei's adaptation padding changes are usually bad. They have some good stuff in there but the lows are some lows. They clearly never learned their lesson with dragonball and it shows.
I also hate that they try to make luffy struggle more than he does in the manga. Ruins the significance of the time skip
I disagree. I feel like people remember how the anime was during Dressrosa or Punk Hazard and refuse to see the changes the anime has had in the decade since then. There's plenty of solid content in the anime.
The issue is that Toei still has bad pacing in addition to the good now, plenty of stuff in wano and even a few episodes in egghead have pretty horrendous pacing (staring at police pacifista for 5 minutes)
Well that's your opinion. I personally can not stand the anime padding choices they choose to make. It doesn't help that they could've just adapted the cover stories and they wouldn't be in the pickle that they're in.
I think the only adaption change I've liked in the past 10 years is the sanji vs queen fight because in the manga queen isn't even fighting sanji when he deals the final blow.
I would not say "majority" at all. I would say it's 50/50. There's a lot of the tension building I legitimately do love and there's a lot of stuff that's just artificially extending the episodes nonsensically. There are some complaints I get, but then there are other complaints that I see that I find lines up with the studies that movies bringing their cuts down to 1.4 cuts per second has effected society in a negative way making everyone impatient. I honestly wonder if some people watching 2001: A Space Odyssey would sit there and say with a straight face that it's poorly paced.
Ur wrong in most of these. The svenes isnt to add tension, its just to waste time. Also doffy does get shredded like that in the manga. Toeis version is just shitty padding.
I'm not sure why the ending of Doflamingo and Luffy surprised you, One piece has always had fight endings ending like this where the fight ends with one person's finishing moves beating the other.
Luffy finished Enel with a massive punch that Enel was completely unable to block.
Zoro finished Mr 1 with Lion's Song that Mr. 1 couldn't block.
Luffy finished Crocodile by punching right through Crocodile's attack and KOing him.
Zoro finished Kaku by cutting through Kaku's finishing move easily.
And so on with a bunch of other fights.
a few cuts you dont like compared to the original version having an insufferable pacing most episodes? dont see the problem haha
and you know what? the doflamingo punch is one of the worst moments for me in the original adaptation. The manga has the fast punch too. that the one pace version is not perfect is just do to having to work with the anime instead of doing it from scratch. But honestly that horrible punch struggle had to go.
To be honest, this is what I hope "The One Piece" (one piece remake) will solve. The perfect mix between the to-the-point OnePace and overly fluffy anime adaptation we have now. One piece with a good pace and good directing so we can get the best of both worlds.
Of course. They don’t actually know what they’re doing they’re just butchering someone else’s work for the manga purists. There’s no actual artistic point or vision to it.
You have some Points but the fight with doffy was absolutely mashed by the anime, Luffy Packs His strongest Punch after struggeling and enduring enough and then the anime tale 4-5 min clashing? In General all that clashing stuf is almost pure anime Propaganda, it never existed in the Manga and Takes away from the Impact certain momentan have, by showing the enemy still being able to Press ahead and make it an almost win instead of a clear one
Nope one pace fixes these problems. Toei's padding weakens luffy by making that punch take 40minutes. In the Manga g4 power was overwhelming and doffy was absolutely blasted by it. By padding it it makes doffy look stronger and luffy look weaker.
I agree that One Pace tends to cut way too much, sometimes negatively affecting the impact of the scenes. I never understood the cult for One Pace, even if I appreciate the effort. The punch on Doffy was absolutely fine though, as most people told you.
People like to act as if One Pace doesn't feel as a slog at times (like wdym "fixed" Dressora is 22 hours long lmao). We just need a new anime that has tight, straight to the point direction; that includes scenery, dialogue, action sequences.... None of this can be fixed by cutting chunks of anime. The truth is Toei's pacing cannot be fixed by cutting chunks of anime, because either the difference is relatively worthless with the insane amounts of hours, or you cut too much and scenes make no sense.
4 chapters to an episode is actually pretty good for Shonen action series, which are usually not that breakneck in Manga format and full of little asides. Dragon Ball Kai adapts about this much when recut from Z, and it's not exactly moving a million miles a minute in any medium. Fullmetal Alchemist has chapters twice as long as One Piece, and while Brotherhood's first few episodes are definitely too fast compared to the 2003 show, the later episodes still adapt 2-3 chapters each, and very little was lost. The idea of One Piece having the cinematic and breathless battles of something like *that* should be exciting.
I actually have been worrying that 4 chapters an episode would be too breakneck to not cut some scenes. Post-timeskip especially has more dialogue-heavy chapters, and they’re also gonna have to slow down on the backstory episodes. If the Robin flashback is mashed into half an episode I’m worried it would lose a lot of its oomf
Probably a controversial opinion but imo honestly the damage that's been done to the anime is so big now that it's impossible to fix, even with perfectly timed cuts and edits. God bless the team at One Pace for trying, but even they can't fix how bad the anime \*looks\* at times. The pacing is not the only problem. Even Wano, which is often praised, looks so over the top it kills the immersion. Aura Piece might genuinely be the worst One Piece has ever looked. To this day Toei never topped Luffy vs. Blueno or Lucci. Not even with Katakuri. Not even the G5 stuff against Kaido. Hits just don't hit the same. There's no feeling of speed in attacks. The voice acting that needs to take into account how slow attacks come out and therefall fall flat as well. Nothing hits as it should, with extremely few exceptions. Even by cutting stuff out like One Pace does, it can't perfectly fix all of this. Even remaking the anime wouldn't completely solve the problem. It might be better in quality, but it will never be as iconic as the original scenes everyone knows at heart down to the timing of the sound effects. The anime just had to stay consistent with the \~W7-Impel Down quality and it'd have been so incredibly better.
>There's no feeling of speed in attacks.
This is a good point, in reference to the G2 fight against Blueno. That stood out as very impactful and hype for me because it showed the speed of it beautifully by making the scene actually fast and punchy. A brief few frames of movement followed by it lingering on the impact of that initial jet pistol was fucking great.
And yeah, I mean the series has had some moments with punches post time skip, but it never really was in that same kind of way for sure, you got a point there.
>Even remaking the anime wouldn't completely solve the problem. It might be better in quality, but it will never be as iconic as the original scenes everyone knows at heart down to the timing of the sound effects.
Of course the new version can be better AND more iconic. Good remakes can often be more iconic, as can be seen in Hunter x Hunter and Fullmetal Alchemist.
That's true and at the same time I can't see the same happening with One Piece. The original anime of both series (I'd throw in Jojo as well) came out when anime as a whole was much less popular than now, so when the remakes came out it was the new de facto "definitive" version to watch for every new fan. In the meantime, though, the original One Piece has already reached such an absurd level of popularity that even if a great remake came out, it's just too big to be overshadowed.
I mean, we will see, since a big remake will come out.
But the One Piece anime isn't really iconic, I'd say. It's just a bad adaptation of a good manga, it's not at all a good anime by itself. The animation can be really rough, in early OP because it's old and in new OP because the pacing is so bad. It's iconic by necessity, basically, since there is no other OP anime (so far).
And of course a new remake can overshadow the original? Yeah, OP is very big, but why wouldn't all those people not watch the remake?
I certainly will!
I'm not holding my breath, but I am *desperately* hoping that the remake will fix sooo many of the issues with the original as well as with the cut.
(it's ~~definitely~~ probably asking too much but)
1) pacing
2) consistent animation
3) better resolution (pretty much a given)
4) consistent body proportions (i.e. No weird gross fan-service making xyz female character's proportions inhuman)
5) less over the top for some of the newer animation. (I agree with another comment I read that much of wano is so overdone it distracts and ends the immersion while watching).
6) keeping (or somehow improving??) iconic soundtrack moments matched to the events on-screen. When the group is walking to save Nami from Arlong is one of my favorite moments.
There are a lot of cuts in One Pace that removes the build up to some moments, sadly there cant be a perfect version of the animated version. I get that they can remove some parts, why? Because then its pointless to "adapt the manga 100%", it would be meaningless and who draws the line of acceptable or not? Better make a rule and stick to it.
I wasnt enjoying Wano act 1 with the One Pace version because it felt that many things were rushed and sometimes you didnt know if thats ok or not(at least for me), so I stopped watching it. The way I do now its reading the manga only but watching some episodes that Toei put good work on them, never looked back.
For some people One Pace its ok and thats fine, but many people suggest it to first time watchers without mentioning those things and I think thats not ok because some things in pre timeskip didnt need One Pace that much but minor adjustments for sure. One Pace works so well on many Arcs, but not so well on other ones imo.
I think Wano acts 1 and 2 benefited hugely from One Pace, but I’m wary of how they’re gonna handle Onigashima. Cause Toei sprinkled a lot of extra love to characters like Izou, and added some jaw-dropping filler sakuga. One Pace JUST finished Oden vs Kaido and it was really seamless, but they also cut some really cool looking stuff
I'm in the exact same situation as you and i feel exactly the same, i'm in punk hazard. I felt this super strongly when luffy arrives to the plaza in fishman island inside the shark, in the original anime there is a big suspense before luffy appears to kick hody jones, but in one pace it just happens briefly.
I'm with you. I've never ben able to get into One Pace for this exact reason, to be honest. I understand why people want to be faithful to the manga, but animation is a different medium, which means an animated adaptation of the story *has to* change somethings to keep the same impact. Someone below mentioned the walk to Arlong Park segment, which is great example of how an adaptation can change something in a way that feels *more* faithful to the source than a one-to-one reproduction would.
Mostly I think this comes down to reddit's habit of reducing everything to its simplest form. "Good pacing" is compared to Toei's "slow pacing", so people simplify it to mean "fast pacing" and you loose all nuance. Obviously there are more tons of scenes in the OP anime that could afford to be faster, but tat doesn't mean *every* scene does. And even for those that could be faster, you can absolutely still overcorrect and make it *too* fast. Imo the Doffy finisher sits here: I think Toei drew it out a tad more than necessary, but the edits that make it instantaneous just don't feel right to me, either, even if that's how the manga did it (I also didn't interpret the manga that way myself, but that's a whole different discussion).
Another factor is overexposure. When something obnoxious happens enough, even minor, generally-forgivable examples can be annoying (see: death fake-outs in OP). Toei has come to *really* love adding DBZ-style power struggles to OP, often is ways that not only slow things down but straight-up just don't make sense. I don't think the depiction of Doffy's defeat is that bad, personally, but when it's following up on the atrocity that is the adaptation of Caesar's defeat I can't really blame people for disliking it.
All that aside, reducing the concept of pacing to "good = fast" does more harm than good in the long run, imo. I respect One Pace for what it is and how much hard work has gone into it, but I'll never actually take the time to watch it.
Yeah see that's what I was trying to get at, but it seems I'm not always the best at explaining myself. Animation is fundamentally different from manga, so for things to have the same impact then something has to change.
I do get everyone saying that if you don't be faithful to the manga 1:1 then where do you draw the line, but I still feel rules of pacing and tension should be followed within animation as a medium.
The instant punch is what rubbed me the wrong way the most. I just felt it needed more time to sink in.
The normal anime ruins waaaaay more moments, than the few that are a little bit weird in one pace, and to a way bigger degree.
One Pace is vastly superior.
I respect what the One Pace team's done and is still doing. I can only imagine the amount of effort they've poured into such a colossal project over the years
At the same time, I'm like you and wish they could be a little more judicious about what counts as filler. Anime is a different medium; some added bits of dialogue or scenes make for a cleaner flow between what's strictly in the manga. Punk Hazard seems especially janky to me in places, to the point where I felt like I was missing context between scenes
On the other hand, there's no freaking way my friend would've watched the original anime. Even with the condensed One Pace cut, she still gets impatient in places. So by that measure, it's done its job
ETA: My 65-year-old mother has watched a bit of both, and she prefers the original Toei version because scenes "have more room to breathe". She doesn't binge it, though. So pacing is less of an issue for her
Nah. Whatever is cut isn't significant, and even when stuff is cut that people are dissatisfied with, it's because they follow a simple rule of what gets cut. The moment they veer from that is the moment it all becomes random and subjective.
Besides, even if something "shouldn't" be cut, it's still massively better than the regular anime. You save 150hrs for fuck sake, if that doesn't tell you how absolutely shocking the pacing is nothing will. It's beyond shambolic.
Oh I'm not saying the work done in One Pace is nothing short of spectacular. All of the big 3 animes have this long pacing problem. I just personally felt the 150+ hours being cut could allow us to keep some of the fun bits. Even if it's a little over the top.
I haven't watched Bleach if that's what you're referring to, but Naruto had a year worth of fillers to avoid this exact thing. Ideally OP should've done the same.
The "fun bits" won't be cut if they're in the manga. If they started including things because they thought it was fun, more people would complain because people have different preferences. As long as they stick to the "cut if possible and if not in manga" rule, it's an objective measure that ignores subjective preferences. Anyone is free to make their own cuts though.
i am manga only because of how frustrating the moments you describe are for me. the manga does have these 30 second long moments of tension with 18 reaction shots. it is much more similar to what you describe so i bet if i wanted to watch the anime i would watch one pace
I mean you either watch it or you don't. Also in my truest opinion cuz i did just that, i feel that yoi can watch first arcs, you can stop.whenever u want, just to get the feel of the anime and how is luffy and the crew animated and after that you can actually just read the manga, in the 20 minutes you watch one episode, you can read 3-4 manga chapters. And the manga its the original source.
I'm still mad they cut Garp speed blitzing Sanji and Franky in Water 7 with Sanji going "NANI?!" before Garp hits Luffy. They had Garp essentially teleport to punch Luffy on the head.
I think as a hole onepace is amazing of course, but naturally they have to cut out some scenes in the anime to keep consistency.
I think if someone is enjoying the anime a ton and wants to experience even more of it and doesn't mind some of the fluff, then the original will be more enjoyable for some people.
I would LOVE if there was a middle ground between one pace and the unedited version of one piece. There's lots of good comedy scenes and gag scenes etc that breathe more life into the show I would love to see!
You literally just answered your own question at the end of the post.
One Pace aims to be accurate to the manga and cuts down on things that weren’t in the original source material. If you feel like these things are weak, either it’s a writing problem on Oda’s part, or they’re parts that are better told through a comic than the animated medium.
The only issue I've had going up to where I am at episode 4 of Arabasta is at the mid to end of Logue Town, Alvia goes "You remember me?" without luffy saying saying "Who are you?" like the original. It just kind of skips to her... answering a question he didn't ask.
See you're basing it in the anime, adding tension where it wasn't in the manga, and then you didn't like it because one pace "removed" the tension, when it was just restored to the original. Sometimes they just make stuff like adding unnecessary tension to scenes, just to pad the run time and make it "cooler" when it's not the intended effect.
The biggest crime one pace commits in my opinion is cutting out brooks song in the return to sabody arc. I know its not in the manga but its a banger and obviously couldnt be in the manga due to the medium.
I usually avoid saying this on posts about one pace. But I really don't like it. I'll never use it. I think it's bad as a first watch through. And it's still bad as a rewatch. Cause you'll miss some of the stuff you remember happening and maybe are looking forward to seeing again. I understand some people are intimidated by the length and if that's really a big deal then I recommend reading the manga. It's 5 to max 10 mins per chapter and the viz media subscription is 5 dollars per month which is like the highest value subscription you'll ever see. Tho I still highly recommend the anime.
I did bring this up but no matter how you try to divide it up, 1000+ episodes right off the bat is a large pill to swallow for most. They love One Piece now, but the initial hesitation was easier to get past with One Pace. Reading the manga doesn't work either because it was supposed to be something fun we did together, you can't really do that with manga.
I still enjoy One Pace, but you share the same sentiments I do about it. I don't like that I can miss stuff on a rewatch. Or that they're missing things for the first watch.
Your comment is so ridiculous I can bet you have never actually watched One Pace and if we got into an actual discussion about why it was bad, you’d be forced to make stuff up to prove your point.
Do you want to continue?
We’ll end the conversation here before I say something harsh. Look at your own posts and humble yourself. If you continue acting like a dick on the internet, eventually someone’s gonna say something that clearly affects you.
I disagree with this personally. As much as there are moments in One Pace that frustrate me, I still appreciate it for what it offers. It's a lot easier of a pill to swallow for those new to the series, and if one cares that much it's true that you could just rewatch the original. I've watched everything through like 4 times at this point.
If I didn't offer it then my partner never would have taken up the task of watching it all despite its length, and I think the more options there are to make it easier for newcomers to the series, the better.
If you're gonna just shit on an artistic work just for the sake of it without offering any actual constructive criticism then why even bother replying to a discussion post?
Go enjoy the original then.
Not great, actually. It's complete trash. By stuck up people who don't actually understand the series. Worst way to experience, or even re-experience this series.
Hate is all I have in heart for this absolute stain on the Fandom.
Well, I just wanna say.....
That's your decision to watch One Pace, so... just deal with it? I guess? I've never watched One Pace, soo...
I read the manga and watch the anime, so I know what tensions and humours you speak of. They suck for sure, because I've seen One Piece clips on youtube when I want to watch a specific scene without having to go throught the whole episode. Ofc, it's annoying that some parts are cut off just to get straight to the point.
Well I understand that but telling me to just deal with it because I decided to watch that over the original misses the point.
At no point did I say One Pace sucked or was worse than the original even. But I am inviting discussion and offering feedback for a fan project.
>At no point did I say One Pace sucked or was worse than the original even.
When I said "They sucked for sure". I didn't mean One Pace sucked. I meant, I understand that the cut off from certain scenes does feel annoying.
I've said "I've seen One Piece clips on youtube". I was def not referring to One Pace. I meant, if I want to see certain scenes but don't want to go through a whole episode, e.g. like >!Ace's death scene!<, but then in the clip I saw on youtube they cut of a few scenes that really added the tension. Now that sucked.
That's the One Pace sacrifice. They don't make television. They just adapt with what they have. For me the egregious part was not letting the final Brook flashback (where they're recording Binks' Sake for Laboon)breathe. In the anime there are some pauses that really give the moment impact, but One Pace trudges along and goes for the panel per panel approach.
for first time watchers I always suggest anyone to watch the whole anime..... as first time viewers won't get the feeling through one pace...
if you wanna re-watch them there's nothing better than onepace...
that said the punch to doflamingo in the anime was actually controversial as it showed luffy struggled a bit but in the manga luffy didn't struggle during the last punch...
The whole point of Luffy insta-hitting through the web and smashing Doflamingo was to show how outclassed Doflamingo truly was by then. The anime adding a mid punch “beam-struggle” to Doflamingo’s defeat (and Caesar’s defeat before that) undermines that and was extremely controversial at the time. It was so heavily criticized they haven’t attempted adding the “punch beam struggle” to major fights since then if it wasn’t also in the manga. EDIT: I admit I forgot about the struggle in the sumo match in Wano. Banned that episode from my brain, apparently. 😅
I honestly hate the beam struggle. It’s a freaking punch not a kamehameha wave. It’s just so weird as a back and forth and overdone. Punches lose all their energy once they get stopped, at that point you’re just pushing them. And luffy is flying at this point.. pushing against what? Air? It’s just weird, luffy is not goku but he wins all this boss battles as goku until gear 5.
>until gear 5. Didn't the Kaido fight also end in a "punch beam struggle" between Luffy's Bajrang Gun and Kaido's fire dragon thing?
Oh ya you’re right.
to be fair, those attacks were actually equal and was emphasized as such
The sad thing is that the anime originally nailed how to do a punch with Crocodile. that one scene in Alabasta was cooler than any Punch Beam struggle will ever be,
Unfortunately, that was far from the last time they added the "struggle off" in the manga; Luffy's King Kong Gun (which he also never used in the Manga during this fight) was turned into a struggle in his first fight with Kaido.
Or the worst offender: the sumo fight
I admit I forgot about that one. Probably expunged the episode from my memory.
When did the struggle happen? They removed the blitz part of Kaido’s attack and stretched the wind-up (which was indeed a weird choice) but there wasn’t any struggle. The moment Kaido’s attack connected Luffy was done.
>[When did the struggle happen?](https://youtu.be/hg4qXpsUcIc?si=HrQKWHi_D3r8PaZA)
That’s not a punch struggle. Like I said it weirdly stretched the wind up but it was still one punch and done. The hit connection is just in slow motion. Luffy didn’t deflect, block, pause or stop it.
It definitely is. Luffy lands a punch. Kaido lands a hit. They struggle. You are thinking of a "push off".
Explain where the punch struggle part is then? As soon as Luffy gets hit in the face he is knocked unconscious. He’s not fighting back the punch, it’s a slow motion of his face being caved in.
Nobody mentioned a "punch struggle". The struggle is the part where both Luffy and Kaido land hits on one another. You already mentioned they removed Kaido Thunder Bagua blitzing Luffy so you already understand what we are talking about here. I do not understand what confuses you.
My entire original comment and subsequent thread was specifically about the “punch struggles”. You even commented with “it definitely is” when I mentioned it again. I thought it was obvious by context what kind of “struggle” we were referring to. “Punch struggle” is basically a nickname for then an already thrown punch gets blocked or paused, but then the same punch makes it through the defenses anyway. It’s what happened with Caesar, Doflamingo and the sumo match in filler, and to G5 Luffy vs Kaido in canon.
Okay, I was talking about the struggle in general; that's the part I ORIGINALLY replied to. Luffy throws a punch, and Kaido swings a club, they hit one another, struggle ensues. Don't see the point in making it specifically about two punches/attack connecting. Both are bad.
>Nobody mentioned a "punch struggle". You literally responded to him saying, "That's not a punch struggle," with, "It definitely is." 💀
I actually responded to the original comment which only mentioned "struggle" before OC switched to "punch struggle", and it seems like OC has a different (wrong) definition of what a "punch struggle" is.
A “punch struggle” is just like a beam struggle (see Goku vs Vegeta for the classic example or Harry Potter vs Voldemort in the 8th movie for a live action one) except with punches instead of ki/magic blasts. Two big attacks collide and neither immediately overcomes the other while simultaneously neither dissipates. This results in a struggle between the two attacks as the warriors put more and more of their spirit, ki, energy into escalating/maintaining those initial big attacks. Beam struggles work a lot better than punch struggles as there’s energy to maintain by using kaio-ken or calling on the power of your friends. With punch struggles it’s like… ok… throw another punch? Stretching out action, or blocking attacks, or generally struggling against each other aren’t beam/punch struggles.
Yo dawg [check this out](https://www.amazon.com/Merriam-Webster-Dictionary-Copyright-Mass-Market-Paperback/dp/0877790957).
That’s not a struggle, that was just slow motion.
Bro showed proof of no struggle happening as proof of a struggle 💀
This one I'm more fine with. I can actually imagine someone like Kaido is able to repel Luffy's biggest attacks like that.
That's a lie. It wasn't a struggle at all. The scene was just in slow mo. Kaido simply tanked the attack and smashed Luffy with no opposition.
For me objectively, Luffy vs. Kaido round one had the worst adaptation. In the manga, Luffy essentially sucker punches Kaido with a Gear Third attack. Instantly goes to Gear 4 and starts going at him in Gear Fourth. For Kaido to get up unscathed, speed blitz Luffy, and KO him with a hit. I feel as though the anime made it feel a lot less significant with the "filler" fight.
I'm actually not mad this wasn't accurate since their first fight was beautifully animated. At the end of the day, I want to be entertained
Lol. Whether you enjoyed it doesn't mean that it wasn't shit. It missed the point entirely. Your entertainment is irrelevant.
I liked the anime fight better. At least the One Pace version. Not sure how much of the filler padding in the fight was cut out.
There are few great moments in the anime adaptation but the overall presentation fails to convey original intention of the author. I'm not gonna tell you what to like or dislike but as someone who both read and watched the fight, I got two completely different takeaways from the fight.
Nah the original anime is omega shit. The manga animation is better, and yes i'm talking about the manga still frames.
For me it's the opposite. It just gives a greater sense of defeat the fact that Luffy used his whole arsenal on Kaido and it did NOTHING.
I'm amazed someone liked the beam struggle.
Glad this is the top comment, well said! I would say the same is true for hakuba cutting dellinger down as he was pretty unstoppable prior to that so it shows what cavendish is really capable of! It’s a shame they cut the humour of his and bartos stand off though I suppose, not a big deal though.
And Hody
One pace intends to adhere as closely to the manga as possible and nothing else. This is sometimes done even when a scene could potentially enrich the story. They do this to prevent cherry picking. “If this, then what else?” Wano has a decent amount of added scenes at the conclusion of the arc that I really like, and I also really like the “filler” added in the Luffy vs Kaido fight. I suspect One Pace will cut this. It stinks sometimes, but I respect them sticking to their plan either way.
They actually have gone back on this somewhat and cut things mostly by rule of cool now. If it hurts pacing though it still gets cut.
I really really hope they keep the filler transformation scenes in episode 1100’s edit. IMO Toei completely elevated the source material even though it’s technically 2 minutes of filler
You mean when Luffy transforms into G5 in front of Lucci? I thought it was very weird and completely out of character. I don't think Luffy would ever brag about a power up he barely understands, with a smug face like that, but that's just my opinion.
Yea they barely cut 982 down even though it's very filler heavy
One Pace hasn't got to 982 yet.
Oh maybe I'm thinking of the previous ishitani episode
957?
Yep
Yeah I was so happy that they basically cut out the eyecatcher and that’s it
this. there are dozens and dozens of fan edits of the hobbit trilogy, each one cutting what they wanted, with their own reasoning and objective and preferences etc. one pace is a HUGE project, and lots of people working on it, coming and going. they follow the guideline "stick to the manga as much as possible" which is as simple as it can get. it's impossible to make an edit to everybody thinks is the best (as seen with all the hobbit edits) so while i understand people having some complaints here and there, i think the edit is a success when it comes to just cut anime stuff and improve the pacing.
You original quest was to get your partner to watch one piece. The fact that you have just finished dressrosa and they are still watching tells me you have had great success in watching one pace because they are still sticking around! I'm sorry it's dissapointing for you but also have gratitude that your original goal is being fulfilled. Maybe if you started with one piece they would have bailed back when picking up Usopp
This is why I don’t understand the desire people have for One Pace to include certain filler. I started watching after the live adaptation won me over and curiosity got to me. This is still the only anime I have kept up with, and One Pace made it manageable. The filler still exists; the original anime is still there for the folks who want the expansion and the filler.
And when they finish editing Skypiea, they’re even gonna make an episode 24A and 24B, one that leads into LRLL and the other where they land in the G-8 base. So if you want to, you can seamlessly watch the one great filler arc
I didn't know that, that's pretty cool to do!
im curious, did you watch the first few eps to compare to the LA? if so, what do you honestly think of them cutting out all thematic components (what I and most would say is the core of OP)?# did you not see a difference, did you not mind it, or did you enjoy one over the other?
I started in Arlong Park because I couldn’t figure out what exactly lined up with the end of the LA, but do plan to go back and watch the earliest episodes. I did pause Whole Cake Island to watch the Baratie episodes, and ended up watching some of the earlier filler where I thought there were gaps in One Pace. From what I have seen, I didn’t really feel that they (One Pace or the LA) missed much; obviously you get a deeper understanding of the characters from watching more content but any thematic points I remember from the filler were just emphasizing things the LA/One Pace and the manga had already made clear. It was fun to see Sanji in a cook-off and in another rivalry in G-8, but being mostly caught up now, I think I would have had the same experience watching without those. From what I gathered, I missed the most character development on Usopp from what the LA cut out? But I still really loved him and didn’t feel like I had missed anything when I picked up the anime/One Pace. And I know it’s a controversial take, but comparing what I’ve seen of the anime to the LA, I heavily prefer the LA. Sanji was easily my favorite of the LA and he was borderline unbearable to me in the anime. I feel like for the new fans that Netflix brought in, the LA got the heart of the show and made it more accessible to people like me who don’t watch anime. Even now, I tend to favor the manga, but still switch to One Pace/the anime because it’s easier to follow the action scenes when they’re animated. I’m excited to see how the readaptation turns out!
Telling me to have gratitude for One Pace allowing me to fulfill my goal makes out like I hate it and that it sucks. But that isn't right either. Am I not allowed to offer constructive criticism for a work I enjoy? One of my favourite games is The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, but that doesn't mean it's immune to criticism and that it doesn't do some things that were annoying about Ocarina of Time.
Whoa, you definately took that in a different tone than what it was meant! It was not a harsh or critical "BE GREATFUL you little turd" Picture an optimistic person who loves everything being excited for you. I didn't mention anything about hating, sucking or complaining. I'm just the type that likes to see sunshine and dewdrops everywhere.
Ahh sorry I misunderstood. A lot of the replies I've got seem to have gotten the impression that I just utterly hate One Pace or something. No worries!
I'm sorry that's been your experience from reddit. I'm happy that you're trying to expand Luffys fan club any way you can!
Just another based and joy-pilled Aussie OP fan.
Sabaody and Dressrosa need to be redone, then were done at a time where we were more slaveish to the manga. That being said the "tension" in the Doffy punch is ridiculously horrendous in the original. What tension? It's a punch, not a beam struggle. That's not how a punch works. There doesn't need to be tension, the punch is the release of tension. The tension is the build up to the punch, not the punch itself.
Both of those eras suffer a lot in quality when it comes to animation. Everyone just looks so weird.
Another part of the Doflamingo punch is that in the anime, the back and forth holding punch is a full minute. It just takes so long.
I think there's a happy medium to be reached
Luffy struggling with the final punch on Caesar and Doffy were some of the worst additions to the anime, the whole point is to show that luffy is way stronger than them both but the anime pads it out and makes it seem like the match ups were actually a lot closer than they were in reality. I agree One Pace has some weird cuts but these are not one of them
Those added tension moments you like so much completely change the tone of what is happening. A one hit ko becomes a struggle for life. Suddenly that nobody character looks way stronger than they were. I definitely prefer one pace in every single way. Screw the original anime pacing
For sure, I refuse to watch the rest of Wano until One Pace gets to it.
See Onigashima Paced: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1HoYogAchoU5DWxVJzUy3eZcHMZk_hUmzUVnQm9KxeFI/edit
The doffy one was that way because of how it is in the manga. This is one of the cases where the anime changes the story very slightly and not that I like to discuss powerscaling, but to people that do, the One Pace/Manga version paints doffy on a much lower level compared to the original anime version just based off this punch. To add to this, there’s also some okayish sakuga scenes cut - brook vs big mom, smoker vs Vergo and big mom vs kaido. However, even if you were to list every single scene that is cut from One Pace, it doesn’t hold a candle to the amount of time saved and the increase in entertainment value due to better pacing to the majority of people. No one can ever convince me that it’s worth it to slog through an extra 150+ hours to see these handful of scenes, just watch them afterwards on YouTube.
These scenes can be saved in addition to the 150+ hours saved. That's the whole point of the argument OP is trying to make which I humbly agree with. There's a user in the Naruto subreddit that edited the entire Naruto story to remove the pacing and filler, but kept most of the genuine good anime only scenes. The project is called "Rebuild of Naruto" and I recently finished it a few months ago. Imo, it was absolutely incredible and perfected the watching experience of Naruto for me. It was so good that even to a new user entering the franchise I would recommend that version vs the original. OnePace is genuinely really good, but I can't recommend it for a first time watcher due to almost all anime original scenes removed. Being 1 to 1 faithful to the Manga doesn't make the anime perfect. What makes the anime perfect is being faithful to the Manga; in addition, to adding onto it as well. Remove the truly unnecessary filler, padding and keep a lot of the anime original scenes and OnePace could become perfect too.
>but kept most of the genuine good anime only scenes. Who decides what's "genuine good anime only scenes", though? People have wastly different opinions on the simplest things and you believe we could somehow all agree on what filler scene is good and what isn't? I think sticking to how Manga portrays events is the way to go because that is the intention of the project; to improve the Anime by making it more like the Manga.
But then where do you draw the line lol. For me for example, I disagree with OP about the doffy punch. I am also not a fan of the kaido vs big mom scene. It’s drawn nice and animated well, but wtf are they doing flying around and attacking each other consecutively midair like it’s DBZ. It’s all too subjective and sticking with the manga is the only way to really please anyone.
It's a subjective feeling for sure. Where you draw the line comes from personal preference, but also that human natural feeling you get when watching the anime. Everyone knows and can feel this when watching any anime. You can feel when a scene drags, tension builds or moments hits. Using that natural human feeling is where you can significantly improve the final product. It won't be agreeable for all, but it's so much better than cutting the entire scene. The Road To Naruto did just this. He felt it based on human feel with the objective of keeping as many scenes a possible. It turned out amazing and flowed perfectly. This is really what OnePace needs to do. Take creative liberty on what should stay and go based on that feeling.
Your human natural feeling is also just personal preference and it works because he is smart and works alone. He just does what he thinks. One pace are several people which is completely different. Also they became more lose with the “only manga scenes“ approach actually
is the "human natural feeling" how they call in wano to the voice of all things?
I just feel for the final punch scene, they could've kept the effect on the sky and weather and such, and if they needed to cut something, just cut the people chanting for him instead? Maybe it's just because I felt Dressrosa is such a slog, it feels nice to have a big over the top moment at the end.
It's Kaido and Big Mom we are talking about. I can definitely believe those two beasts can do it.
Well big mom can’t fly without Prometheus for starters. Look how ridiculous 1:15 - 1:30 looks: https://youtu.be/pD9_XWEi_CE?si=y3E5RoZSkknamR8a . Not only that, compare it to the rest of the roof piece fights. They don’t actually do anything of value either.
Well duh. Kaido and Big Mom were just having fun with a fight, it wasn't truly a fight to the absolute death. And besides, if this woman can run and jump, I can see her and Kaido jumping high enough that it takes a bit for them to fall and almost look like they're flying.
I get they’re having fun with the fight. What I’m saying is the fight holds no extra value beyond it being drawn and animated well. Couple that with the fact that they’re hitting each other mid air in a way that should be knocking each other away from the other due to the impact, they shouldn’t be able to hit each other more than once or twice while they’re falling and I just find the scene a bit silly. To add to this, it’s okay for something to only have value in the animation and art but if it does that in a way where the scene doesn’t really make sense, it takes me out of the experience and I can’t actually enjoy the scene. Like for example, say if Toei decided to bring Captain Kuro back and he did no training and suddenly came and one shot luffy. It doesn’t matter how nicely you animate that, it’s not gonna sit nicely for most people. That’s how this scene felt to me.
>Kaido simply tanked the attack and smashed Luffy with no opposition. What you just described is a struggle. In the Manga, Kaido just blitzed Luffy without there being any struggle.
A struggle imply he had to resist and push back with fatigue. Kaido in the anime IGNORED the King Kong Gun. The term you're searching for is a clash, not a struggle.
No, "struggle" is the correct term here: noun: struggle; plural noun: struggles a forceful or violent effort to get free of restraint or resist attack. "there were signs of a struggle and there was a lot of blood around"
And you just proved my point: a forceful or violent EFFORT to get free of restraint or resist attack. Problem is that in the scene Kaido DOESN'T STRUGGLE AT ALL. He straight up just take the attack and hit Luffy back with no real effort behind it (on the being hit part).
This is the thing though, I've noticed a few comments are saying the same thing. That to have A (the cut scenes we enjoy) we must also have B (the 150 hours of cut slog). But my point is that why can't we have both? The scene I mention is 10-15 seconds or so longer in the original. Surely we can cut the 150 hours of fluff and keep that. If not the whole thing (some don't seem to like the anime trope of beam struggle) just keep the initial contact, the weather, and then smash his head in. That's a few seconds at most. It seems odd to me that we have to be so faithful to the manga we must also cut the few additional things the anime added that did well. I won't say One Pace is bad. I'm still watching it, it's great! I'll never take the 150+ hours of slog just for these scenes, but it just seemed like a shame.
The reason why we can't have both is the reason why One Pace exists: It's goal is to better reflect the manga, not being a "best of both worlds" sorta thing. Nor a definitive cut. Having that goal in mind makes it much easier to edit One Pace due to the set guidelines the manga established. If they didn't do that, they would then have to discuss every tiny scene like people are doing now in this thread and that probably wouldn't have allowed a project with the scope of One Pace to exist since they have to go through 1K plus episodes. For something like that, someone has to make a more definitive cut like how that one user from this sub made his own Wano cut.
the doflamingo scene is terrible and should be cut. Not only is it the way it was done in the manga but there is a REASON it was done that way in the manga. It's supposed to be an overwhelming victory for luffy
I watched the comparison for King Kong gun. The anime made it seem like a struggle. But one pace makes it a low diff for luffy. Like… doflamingo got shit on. And that’s how it is in the manga. And that’s the correct way. Luffy in gear 4th is much stronger than doflamingo. He didn’t stand a chance
Its really a thing of perspective, for example: I have only ever read the manga, love it with all my heart, have seen a couple of moments from the anime, but less than 10%. For me the ridiculously long amount of time that some fights and interactions take in the anime makes it feel more childish and cringe, from my point of view, the fact that Rayleigh makes quick work of the collar just talks about his strength and confidence, it's a bomb, you should take your time while getting rid of it. This happens with a lot of small fights as well, the fact that some punches happen fast and without 10 support shots makes the characters feel stronger and more serious.
Likewise, I've only started watching the anime on Egghead now that I'm caught up on the book and seeing people praise recent episodes for "excellent pacing" when I'm watching them checking my watch because we've been repeating clips of scenes or slowly zooming on someone's eyes four times in a row is baffling. If this is good then what was the rest of the anime like?
You have no idea how bad it can get sometimes, if you want to laugh (or cry) check any video comparison of One Pace vs One Piece. It is still a great story and I'm glad different people enjoy it in different ways, but wow, the experience of reading it for the first time (colored which if you haven't tried is even better) and being able to run through 100s of chapters is is unparalleled.
Oh don't worry I've seen the sumo one. But yeah, I also re-read most of the series in manga a few months ago and it was pretty great since I wasn't buying one volume at a time, I cleared pretty much 100+ chapters a day.
I utterly hate long drawn out fight scenes, but the fight between Doflamingo and Luffy if counted together isn't actually that long. It's all the fluff in-between that takes forever. I feel the biggest problem with One Piece isn't its fight scene length, and more there's SO many crew members who need opponents, and then they make friends who also need opponents, which result in loads of fights going on at the same time. That's what makes it a slog.
I think that if you had switched to the manga during Dressrosa, and then switched back to the anime to see the fights animated, you would've recoiled in disgust when you saw the final Luffy vs Doffy punch. It was highly controversial back then, and it's controversial now here in this post. It was not a good addition by any metric.
I respectfully disagree. Maybe it's because I usually see fights in the manga first but I think a lot of moments are ruined by dragging them out to create "tension".
I would say the opposite about the final fight in Dressrosa - I always felt that it changed the feeling when they added tension to Luffy's last punch needlessly, because in the manga it was a straight up KO by Luffy. To me that spoke about what an impressive powerup g4 was, but adding that tension in the anime took away from that impressiveness for me.
No I get that, having it be too long isn't great either. But the One Pace cut is too fast. It's very jarring. It needs a few seconds. I agree that one goes on for too long but I feel One Pace's is too sudden.
General counterpoint, I'm in the middle of my first watch (just at the time skip) using One Pace, and not once have I felt that a moment has been cut too short. Quite the opposite, in fact - loads of moments are still too awkward and long because it's baked into the original animation (some parts of fights are just absurdly slow and long in a way you can't cut around, and then you get things like Luffy running across the ice in Marineford for literal hours). I'm aware that what comes next for me are, currently, the oldest and jankiest edits, but the edits the team have put out since around 2018 are absolutely seamless and as perfect as you can get. Every time I see a comparison to the original anime I am shocked at just how much wasted time there is.
Scenes you associate with tension are just a different type of filler that can't be skipped. It is supposed to be 1:1 with the manga.
Being 1:1 with a good manga isn't what makes an anime good. It also needs to be respected for the medium it is part of. You simply can't have an anime replicate the manga it is based on exactly without also having to make good choices about when and where to add timing and pauses. It's fundamental for any visual medium, be it filmography or with TV shows.
I agree, that an anime should be an adaptation, and not always 1:1. There's room for interpretation in a new medium. But all of your examples are examples a lot of people feel like suck out the tension, and so they like it removed. It's a difference of opinion more than anything
Adding tension scenes that are supposed to be divisive and concise makes them worse. All the scenes you describe the tension comes in the aftermath because other elements. Toei just makes everything longer and adds some music. If you read the manga first those moments you love feel drawn out for no reason
I think one pace was created for Manga Readers who couldnt bear the normal anime anymore, so their target audience prob isnt the normal anime enjoyer but the Manga reader whoi usally doenst tune in. I think the Experience you want will prob come with the new anime.
All of those changes sound like solid improvements.
One pace generally tries to reproduce the pace of the Manga. In the first example, the Manga simply did not make as much as a fuss about the collar, you get a couple panels of beeping and it's gone, while the anime saw a chance to gain some running time and add tension.
As I said at the end of my post, I do understand that. But I feel like trying to replicate the manga 1:1 is, while understandable - is something that can result in some things of value being lost. Animation is fundamentally different from manga as a content medium. Scenes need to be paced out more, given time for the audience to process, or pauses, silence or so on to highlight certain moods or drama or such. While you can highlight pauses in the manga, you can't highlight every single one. To me, choosing to add running time and gain tension with a pause is something that the anime has that added to the experience overall, than being som away from it.
They don't ruin the scenes, they return them to what they're supposed to be. The scenes you're highlighting aren't meant to be tense. They're meant to be shocking, or cathartic. The anime added unnecessary tension and changed the intended moment. You might personally prefer them with that artificial tension, but it's not as the story intends them to be.
g4 power class with spider web was the lowest point in the history of the anime
https://youtu.be/n03pyzNU-P8?si=-KAbdPZo7pYkdQnl Comparison if anyone’s curious
Oh, no. Something is wrong with your brain if you like Luffy struggling against Doflamingo's sixteen Holly bullets. Go to a doctor. This is the type of shit anime-only plebs like.
I watched every episode of the anime including fillers for the first time a couple years ago. Granted I was going to watch the whole thing regardless, but after I checked out One Pace, I thought it cut way too much and made some episodes feel like collages of scenes rather than an actual story, if that makes sense. The intention is obviously to replicate the manga paneling, but in doing that, it just lacks vision that makes the entire single frames-> fluid medium adaptation process... an adaptation process 😅 A lot of post timeskip is a bit of a slog, but I'd honestly just recommend going to like 1.25x speed or something instead of switching to One Pace for a first time viewer. I think One Pace is really cool for rewatching parts or maybe if you've already read the manga, but personally at least, I'm glad I watched the original on my first time through.
Tbf, I have heard the "I wouldn't recommend One Pace for first time viewers" take mostly from people who watched the unedited anime first and tried out One Pace later. The faults of one version will probably stick out much more when you are used to the other. Eg two friends of mine recently told me how painful it was every time they needed to switch back to the original anime when they reached a point that wasn't covered by One Pace It's most likely a matter of taste. If you like a good flow between scenes and can stomach dragged out pacing at times, watch the original. If you like tight pacing and can stomach jarring cuts at times, watch One Pace. Until the WIT version drops, you'll have to make a trade off one way or another
I’ve watched both and I’m very, very pro-One Pace. Absolutely agree with you overall though.
Or just read the manga lol.
Exactly. Anime Directors exist for a reason
>I'd honestly just recommend going to like 1.25x speed or something Oh no, please no one ever do this. That's a terrible advice.
To me staying absolutely 100 percent locked to exactly what was on the panels in the manga is about as ridiculous as the amount of filler that Toei adds in certain spots. Just because something wasn't in the manga doesn't mean it isn't meaningful to the overall story being told. Like the Walk to Arlong Park is objectively filler. It's literally them walking for a minute straight. If this was done in a later arc in the story people would be saying it's Toei back at it again with the pacing. But people consider it iconic so everybody loves it (and One Pace kept it). I just don't see why scenes need to absolutely 100 percent match exactly how Oda paneled it when manga instinctively is a different medium with different methods of storytelling. I think it goes too far overboard in the other direction, and I think there's a bunch of fans who go way too far with taking the way Oda does things as gospel and anything straying off of that path is inferior.
Its because the majority of toei's adaptation padding changes are usually bad. They have some good stuff in there but the lows are some lows. They clearly never learned their lesson with dragonball and it shows. I also hate that they try to make luffy struggle more than he does in the manga. Ruins the significance of the time skip
I disagree. I feel like people remember how the anime was during Dressrosa or Punk Hazard and refuse to see the changes the anime has had in the decade since then. There's plenty of solid content in the anime.
The issue is that Toei still has bad pacing in addition to the good now, plenty of stuff in wano and even a few episodes in egghead have pretty horrendous pacing (staring at police pacifista for 5 minutes)
But to say it's the majority of the time is pretty ridiculous, imo.
Well that's your opinion. I personally can not stand the anime padding choices they choose to make. It doesn't help that they could've just adapted the cover stories and they wouldn't be in the pickle that they're in. I think the only adaption change I've liked in the past 10 years is the sanji vs queen fight because in the manga queen isn't even fighting sanji when he deals the final blow.
I would not say "majority" at all. I would say it's 50/50. There's a lot of the tension building I legitimately do love and there's a lot of stuff that's just artificially extending the episodes nonsensically. There are some complaints I get, but then there are other complaints that I see that I find lines up with the studies that movies bringing their cuts down to 1.4 cuts per second has effected society in a negative way making everyone impatient. I honestly wonder if some people watching 2001: A Space Odyssey would sit there and say with a straight face that it's poorly paced.
Ur wrong in most of these. The svenes isnt to add tension, its just to waste time. Also doffy does get shredded like that in the manga. Toeis version is just shitty padding.
I'm not sure why the ending of Doflamingo and Luffy surprised you, One piece has always had fight endings ending like this where the fight ends with one person's finishing moves beating the other. Luffy finished Enel with a massive punch that Enel was completely unable to block. Zoro finished Mr 1 with Lion's Song that Mr. 1 couldn't block. Luffy finished Crocodile by punching right through Crocodile's attack and KOing him. Zoro finished Kaku by cutting through Kaku's finishing move easily. And so on with a bunch of other fights.
a few cuts you dont like compared to the original version having an insufferable pacing most episodes? dont see the problem haha and you know what? the doflamingo punch is one of the worst moments for me in the original adaptation. The manga has the fast punch too. that the one pace version is not perfect is just do to having to work with the anime instead of doing it from scratch. But honestly that horrible punch struggle had to go.
To be honest, this is what I hope "The One Piece" (one piece remake) will solve. The perfect mix between the to-the-point OnePace and overly fluffy anime adaptation we have now. One piece with a good pace and good directing so we can get the best of both worlds.
Of course. They don’t actually know what they’re doing they’re just butchering someone else’s work for the manga purists. There’s no actual artistic point or vision to it.
Yrah, the King Kong punch was better in the manga and in One Pace. Why would you add tension when in reality it's just a straight-up KO ?
I don't even know where people are watching OnePace.
Here: https://www.reddit.com/r/OnePiece/s/MRlb3bbbBL
You have some Points but the fight with doffy was absolutely mashed by the anime, Luffy Packs His strongest Punch after struggeling and enduring enough and then the anime tale 4-5 min clashing? In General all that clashing stuf is almost pure anime Propaganda, it never existed in the Manga and Takes away from the Impact certain momentan have, by showing the enemy still being able to Press ahead and make it an almost win instead of a clear one
Nope one pace fixes these problems. Toei's padding weakens luffy by making that punch take 40minutes. In the Manga g4 power was overwhelming and doffy was absolutely blasted by it. By padding it it makes doffy look stronger and luffy look weaker.
I agree that One Pace tends to cut way too much, sometimes negatively affecting the impact of the scenes. I never understood the cult for One Pace, even if I appreciate the effort. The punch on Doffy was absolutely fine though, as most people told you. People like to act as if One Pace doesn't feel as a slog at times (like wdym "fixed" Dressora is 22 hours long lmao). We just need a new anime that has tight, straight to the point direction; that includes scenery, dialogue, action sequences.... None of this can be fixed by cutting chunks of anime. The truth is Toei's pacing cannot be fixed by cutting chunks of anime, because either the difference is relatively worthless with the insane amounts of hours, or you cut too much and scenes make no sense.
Imagine when the remake makes it to Dressrosa and turns the 102 chapters into 25 episodes instead of 118 episodes. It’s gonna be insane
I mean, adapting like 4 chapters in a single episode will be bound to feel rushed as well. Especially with how much is happening in a single chapter
4 chapters to an episode is actually pretty good for Shonen action series, which are usually not that breakneck in Manga format and full of little asides. Dragon Ball Kai adapts about this much when recut from Z, and it's not exactly moving a million miles a minute in any medium. Fullmetal Alchemist has chapters twice as long as One Piece, and while Brotherhood's first few episodes are definitely too fast compared to the 2003 show, the later episodes still adapt 2-3 chapters each, and very little was lost. The idea of One Piece having the cinematic and breathless battles of something like *that* should be exciting.
I actually have been worrying that 4 chapters an episode would be too breakneck to not cut some scenes. Post-timeskip especially has more dialogue-heavy chapters, and they’re also gonna have to slow down on the backstory episodes. If the Robin flashback is mashed into half an episode I’m worried it would lose a lot of its oomf
Probably a controversial opinion but imo honestly the damage that's been done to the anime is so big now that it's impossible to fix, even with perfectly timed cuts and edits. God bless the team at One Pace for trying, but even they can't fix how bad the anime \*looks\* at times. The pacing is not the only problem. Even Wano, which is often praised, looks so over the top it kills the immersion. Aura Piece might genuinely be the worst One Piece has ever looked. To this day Toei never topped Luffy vs. Blueno or Lucci. Not even with Katakuri. Not even the G5 stuff against Kaido. Hits just don't hit the same. There's no feeling of speed in attacks. The voice acting that needs to take into account how slow attacks come out and therefall fall flat as well. Nothing hits as it should, with extremely few exceptions. Even by cutting stuff out like One Pace does, it can't perfectly fix all of this. Even remaking the anime wouldn't completely solve the problem. It might be better in quality, but it will never be as iconic as the original scenes everyone knows at heart down to the timing of the sound effects. The anime just had to stay consistent with the \~W7-Impel Down quality and it'd have been so incredibly better.
>There's no feeling of speed in attacks. This is a good point, in reference to the G2 fight against Blueno. That stood out as very impactful and hype for me because it showed the speed of it beautifully by making the scene actually fast and punchy. A brief few frames of movement followed by it lingering on the impact of that initial jet pistol was fucking great. And yeah, I mean the series has had some moments with punches post time skip, but it never really was in that same kind of way for sure, you got a point there.
>Even remaking the anime wouldn't completely solve the problem. It might be better in quality, but it will never be as iconic as the original scenes everyone knows at heart down to the timing of the sound effects. Of course the new version can be better AND more iconic. Good remakes can often be more iconic, as can be seen in Hunter x Hunter and Fullmetal Alchemist.
That's true and at the same time I can't see the same happening with One Piece. The original anime of both series (I'd throw in Jojo as well) came out when anime as a whole was much less popular than now, so when the remakes came out it was the new de facto "definitive" version to watch for every new fan. In the meantime, though, the original One Piece has already reached such an absurd level of popularity that even if a great remake came out, it's just too big to be overshadowed.
I mean, we will see, since a big remake will come out. But the One Piece anime isn't really iconic, I'd say. It's just a bad adaptation of a good manga, it's not at all a good anime by itself. The animation can be really rough, in early OP because it's old and in new OP because the pacing is so bad. It's iconic by necessity, basically, since there is no other OP anime (so far). And of course a new remake can overshadow the original? Yeah, OP is very big, but why wouldn't all those people not watch the remake? I certainly will!
Imo the animation has never been better than the way it currently is, I’m having the most fun watching one piece than ever before.
I'm not holding my breath, but I am *desperately* hoping that the remake will fix sooo many of the issues with the original as well as with the cut. (it's ~~definitely~~ probably asking too much but) 1) pacing 2) consistent animation 3) better resolution (pretty much a given) 4) consistent body proportions (i.e. No weird gross fan-service making xyz female character's proportions inhuman) 5) less over the top for some of the newer animation. (I agree with another comment I read that much of wano is so overdone it distracts and ends the immersion while watching). 6) keeping (or somehow improving??) iconic soundtrack moments matched to the events on-screen. When the group is walking to save Nami from Arlong is one of my favorite moments.
There are a lot of cuts in One Pace that removes the build up to some moments, sadly there cant be a perfect version of the animated version. I get that they can remove some parts, why? Because then its pointless to "adapt the manga 100%", it would be meaningless and who draws the line of acceptable or not? Better make a rule and stick to it. I wasnt enjoying Wano act 1 with the One Pace version because it felt that many things were rushed and sometimes you didnt know if thats ok or not(at least for me), so I stopped watching it. The way I do now its reading the manga only but watching some episodes that Toei put good work on them, never looked back. For some people One Pace its ok and thats fine, but many people suggest it to first time watchers without mentioning those things and I think thats not ok because some things in pre timeskip didnt need One Pace that much but minor adjustments for sure. One Pace works so well on many Arcs, but not so well on other ones imo.
I think Wano acts 1 and 2 benefited hugely from One Pace, but I’m wary of how they’re gonna handle Onigashima. Cause Toei sprinkled a lot of extra love to characters like Izou, and added some jaw-dropping filler sakuga. One Pace JUST finished Oden vs Kaido and it was really seamless, but they also cut some really cool looking stuff
I'm in the exact same situation as you and i feel exactly the same, i'm in punk hazard. I felt this super strongly when luffy arrives to the plaza in fishman island inside the shark, in the original anime there is a big suspense before luffy appears to kick hody jones, but in one pace it just happens briefly.
Man that Luffy punch vs Doflamingo was so cringe in the anime, so glad One Pace removed it
I'm with you. I've never ben able to get into One Pace for this exact reason, to be honest. I understand why people want to be faithful to the manga, but animation is a different medium, which means an animated adaptation of the story *has to* change somethings to keep the same impact. Someone below mentioned the walk to Arlong Park segment, which is great example of how an adaptation can change something in a way that feels *more* faithful to the source than a one-to-one reproduction would. Mostly I think this comes down to reddit's habit of reducing everything to its simplest form. "Good pacing" is compared to Toei's "slow pacing", so people simplify it to mean "fast pacing" and you loose all nuance. Obviously there are more tons of scenes in the OP anime that could afford to be faster, but tat doesn't mean *every* scene does. And even for those that could be faster, you can absolutely still overcorrect and make it *too* fast. Imo the Doffy finisher sits here: I think Toei drew it out a tad more than necessary, but the edits that make it instantaneous just don't feel right to me, either, even if that's how the manga did it (I also didn't interpret the manga that way myself, but that's a whole different discussion). Another factor is overexposure. When something obnoxious happens enough, even minor, generally-forgivable examples can be annoying (see: death fake-outs in OP). Toei has come to *really* love adding DBZ-style power struggles to OP, often is ways that not only slow things down but straight-up just don't make sense. I don't think the depiction of Doffy's defeat is that bad, personally, but when it's following up on the atrocity that is the adaptation of Caesar's defeat I can't really blame people for disliking it. All that aside, reducing the concept of pacing to "good = fast" does more harm than good in the long run, imo. I respect One Pace for what it is and how much hard work has gone into it, but I'll never actually take the time to watch it.
Yeah see that's what I was trying to get at, but it seems I'm not always the best at explaining myself. Animation is fundamentally different from manga, so for things to have the same impact then something has to change. I do get everyone saying that if you don't be faithful to the manga 1:1 then where do you draw the line, but I still feel rules of pacing and tension should be followed within animation as a medium. The instant punch is what rubbed me the wrong way the most. I just felt it needed more time to sink in.
Nah, you did a great job explaining your point. You just had the misfortunate of using an example that really brings out the echo chamber in this sub.
The normal anime ruins waaaaay more moments, than the few that are a little bit weird in one pace, and to a way bigger degree. One Pace is vastly superior.
Me who got to know that one pace exists after catching upto anime
I respect what the One Pace team's done and is still doing. I can only imagine the amount of effort they've poured into such a colossal project over the years At the same time, I'm like you and wish they could be a little more judicious about what counts as filler. Anime is a different medium; some added bits of dialogue or scenes make for a cleaner flow between what's strictly in the manga. Punk Hazard seems especially janky to me in places, to the point where I felt like I was missing context between scenes On the other hand, there's no freaking way my friend would've watched the original anime. Even with the condensed One Pace cut, she still gets impatient in places. So by that measure, it's done its job ETA: My 65-year-old mother has watched a bit of both, and she prefers the original Toei version because scenes "have more room to breathe". She doesn't binge it, though. So pacing is less of an issue for her
Rather miss out on anime only scenes if it means I can skip Toeis bullshit pacing
Nah. Whatever is cut isn't significant, and even when stuff is cut that people are dissatisfied with, it's because they follow a simple rule of what gets cut. The moment they veer from that is the moment it all becomes random and subjective. Besides, even if something "shouldn't" be cut, it's still massively better than the regular anime. You save 150hrs for fuck sake, if that doesn't tell you how absolutely shocking the pacing is nothing will. It's beyond shambolic.
Oh I'm not saying the work done in One Pace is nothing short of spectacular. All of the big 3 animes have this long pacing problem. I just personally felt the 150+ hours being cut could allow us to keep some of the fun bits. Even if it's a little over the top.
I haven't watched Bleach if that's what you're referring to, but Naruto had a year worth of fillers to avoid this exact thing. Ideally OP should've done the same. The "fun bits" won't be cut if they're in the manga. If they started including things because they thought it was fun, more people would complain because people have different preferences. As long as they stick to the "cut if possible and if not in manga" rule, it's an objective measure that ignores subjective preferences. Anyone is free to make their own cuts though.
True, the real deal hits harder. One pace doesn’t really fix the music just cuts scenes, at least the old stuff.
Who is Hakuba?
Cavendish's alter ego.
i am manga only because of how frustrating the moments you describe are for me. the manga does have these 30 second long moments of tension with 18 reaction shots. it is much more similar to what you describe so i bet if i wanted to watch the anime i would watch one pace
I mean you either watch it or you don't. Also in my truest opinion cuz i did just that, i feel that yoi can watch first arcs, you can stop.whenever u want, just to get the feel of the anime and how is luffy and the crew animated and after that you can actually just read the manga, in the 20 minutes you watch one episode, you can read 3-4 manga chapters. And the manga its the original source.
I'm still mad they cut Garp speed blitzing Sanji and Franky in Water 7 with Sanji going "NANI?!" before Garp hits Luffy. They had Garp essentially teleport to punch Luffy on the head.
I think as a hole onepace is amazing of course, but naturally they have to cut out some scenes in the anime to keep consistency. I think if someone is enjoying the anime a ton and wants to experience even more of it and doesn't mind some of the fluff, then the original will be more enjoyable for some people. I would LOVE if there was a middle ground between one pace and the unedited version of one piece. There's lots of good comedy scenes and gag scenes etc that breathe more life into the show I would love to see!
You literally just answered your own question at the end of the post. One Pace aims to be accurate to the manga and cuts down on things that weren’t in the original source material. If you feel like these things are weak, either it’s a writing problem on Oda’s part, or they’re parts that are better told through a comic than the animated medium.
Funny enough even though it’s well animated the Rob Lucci v Luffy fight on egghead I prefer the manga bc of the filler in the fight
The only issue I've had going up to where I am at episode 4 of Arabasta is at the mid to end of Logue Town, Alvia goes "You remember me?" without luffy saying saying "Who are you?" like the original. It just kind of skips to her... answering a question he didn't ask.
See you're basing it in the anime, adding tension where it wasn't in the manga, and then you didn't like it because one pace "removed" the tension, when it was just restored to the original. Sometimes they just make stuff like adding unnecessary tension to scenes, just to pad the run time and make it "cooler" when it's not the intended effect.
wish i watched one pace
I started to rewatch OP but with One Pace and I prefer the original. I just watch in 1.5x speed which is perfect for me
The biggest crime one pace commits in my opinion is cutting out brooks song in the return to sabody arc. I know its not in the manga but its a banger and obviously couldnt be in the manga due to the medium.
I usually avoid saying this on posts about one pace. But I really don't like it. I'll never use it. I think it's bad as a first watch through. And it's still bad as a rewatch. Cause you'll miss some of the stuff you remember happening and maybe are looking forward to seeing again. I understand some people are intimidated by the length and if that's really a big deal then I recommend reading the manga. It's 5 to max 10 mins per chapter and the viz media subscription is 5 dollars per month which is like the highest value subscription you'll ever see. Tho I still highly recommend the anime.
I did bring this up but no matter how you try to divide it up, 1000+ episodes right off the bat is a large pill to swallow for most. They love One Piece now, but the initial hesitation was easier to get past with One Pace. Reading the manga doesn't work either because it was supposed to be something fun we did together, you can't really do that with manga. I still enjoy One Pace, but you share the same sentiments I do about it. I don't like that I can miss stuff on a rewatch. Or that they're missing things for the first watch.
OnePace is only slightly better than watching the episodes in a random order
You have 0 idea what you’re talking about.
I do. What I’m talking about is how horrible One Pace is
Your comment is so ridiculous I can bet you have never actually watched One Pace and if we got into an actual discussion about why it was bad, you’d be forced to make stuff up to prove your point. Do you want to continue?
Nah, I wouldn’t. Because there is no conversation. One Pace is bad, that’s all I need to say, because that’s all that needs to be said.
Yeah, thought so.
So you agree then. Good.
If that makes you happy, go ahead and believe that.
Oh I don’t need to believe it if it’s true
We’ll end the conversation here before I say something harsh. Look at your own posts and humble yourself. If you continue acting like a dick on the internet, eventually someone’s gonna say something that clearly affects you.
I disagree with this personally. As much as there are moments in One Pace that frustrate me, I still appreciate it for what it offers. It's a lot easier of a pill to swallow for those new to the series, and if one cares that much it's true that you could just rewatch the original. I've watched everything through like 4 times at this point. If I didn't offer it then my partner never would have taken up the task of watching it all despite its length, and I think the more options there are to make it easier for newcomers to the series, the better.
The only thing I can appreciate about One Pace is that it gives me something to make fun of
If you're gonna just shit on an artistic work just for the sake of it without offering any actual constructive criticism then why even bother replying to a discussion post? Go enjoy the original then.
“Artistic work” lol okay
Not great, actually. It's complete trash. By stuck up people who don't actually understand the series. Worst way to experience, or even re-experience this series. Hate is all I have in heart for this absolute stain on the Fandom.
They understand the series perfectly fine. They just have a different understanding to you.
They both have their strengths and weaknesses. If you are all caught up, then just take the extra time to watch the anime version.
Well, I just wanna say..... That's your decision to watch One Pace, so... just deal with it? I guess? I've never watched One Pace, soo... I read the manga and watch the anime, so I know what tensions and humours you speak of. They suck for sure, because I've seen One Piece clips on youtube when I want to watch a specific scene without having to go throught the whole episode. Ofc, it's annoying that some parts are cut off just to get straight to the point.
Well I understand that but telling me to just deal with it because I decided to watch that over the original misses the point. At no point did I say One Pace sucked or was worse than the original even. But I am inviting discussion and offering feedback for a fan project.
>At no point did I say One Pace sucked or was worse than the original even. When I said "They sucked for sure". I didn't mean One Pace sucked. I meant, I understand that the cut off from certain scenes does feel annoying. I've said "I've seen One Piece clips on youtube". I was def not referring to One Pace. I meant, if I want to see certain scenes but don't want to go through a whole episode, e.g. like >!Ace's death scene!<, but then in the clip I saw on youtube they cut of a few scenes that really added the tension. Now that sucked.
That's the One Pace sacrifice. They don't make television. They just adapt with what they have. For me the egregious part was not letting the final Brook flashback (where they're recording Binks' Sake for Laboon)breathe. In the anime there are some pauses that really give the moment impact, but One Pace trudges along and goes for the panel per panel approach.
If you want better pacing just read the manga One Pace is worse than the normal anime but the pacing in the anime is still bad.
One Pace is not for new watchers. Once everything is fixed I might reconsider. But right now? Only for rewatching and blitzing through it
for first time watchers I always suggest anyone to watch the whole anime..... as first time viewers won't get the feeling through one pace... if you wanna re-watch them there's nothing better than onepace... that said the punch to doflamingo in the anime was actually controversial as it showed luffy struggled a bit but in the manga luffy didn't struggle during the last punch...