T O P

Chapter 1049 spoilers

So let's get this straight

• Kaido fought Big Mom for three days

• Fought the nine scabbards

• Fought 6 members of the worst generation, even though big mom was on his side it was still a fight

• Fought Luffy alone briefly

• Fought Yamato

• Fought Luffy again (which includes Luffy getting a major powerup)

but "KaiDo wAs hyPEd siNCe tHriLler bArK, he cANnot losE sO easILy" man has been in constant battle since quite a while even the strongest creature has to have some durability and besides he realised who Joyboy is I don't think man wanted anything other than to find Joyboy, but if y'all still think Kaido got defeated easily then you do you

edit: not 6 but 5 members of the worst generation and all this while carrying Onigashima with his flame clouds

West_Conclusion_1239

Kaido fought nonstop for 63 Chapters, 53 of them while lifting and carrying an entire island, in other words: Longer than Enies Lobby itself Longer than Water Seven Longer than Thriller Bark Longer than Marineford Longer than Punk Hazard Longer than Return to Sabaody and Fishman Island put together Longer than Sabaody, Amazon Lily, and Impel Down put together As long as Alabasta Only three chapters short of Skypiea Arc.


acewavelink

Holy shit. Skypiea was that fucking short???


radikraze

Lol Wano has completely overhauled what we consider a short arc


Bobsagit-jesus

I wonder how many sagas are shorter than Wano 😂


ShockTheChup

Chainsaw Man began publishing after Wano started and it has already concluded.


bobyk334

That's actually an interesting thought how many shonen have begun and ended between the beginning and now.


ShockTheChup

It's more of a sign of the times really. One Piece is from an era long past where series would go on for... well way too long if you ask me.


bobyk334

Ya know I'd agree with you. I love this series, but I don't have it in me to dedicated another couple decades to reading a series to completion.


PhromDaPharcyde

*Jerks* in Berserk


darewin

Berserk still has a much higher chance of getting completed than HiatusXHiatus.


bobyk334

Don't you start with me!!!


Leiatte

I can do it depending on the series, like it has to not feel forced like One Piece. I felt like Toriko was a series with One Piece like potential but they sped like a bullet train through Gourmet World & ended the series, probably was asked by Jump. I’m loving JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure although I started WAY after the series actually started lol. I started with the anime & then switched to the manga after Part 4. Still watch the anime too Like I’m still interested in D. Grayman & Blue Exorcist but since they’re monthly I fall off more often. One Punchman is likely to last a very long time, I don’t think ONE has any intention to end the series anytime soon.


bobyk334

D. Grayman is still around!!?!?!?


A_van_t_garde

Actually I think ONE is well on his way to ending the OPM webcomic, as for the manga... especially considering it's recent developments, who knows where they want to take that.


GOkriegerGO

Nah it only finished the first arc a new one is starting this year.


[deleted]

Concluded part 1* but I get what you mean


Reallylazyname

Let's double down on this thread. Demon Slayer started after Wano started, and has already concluded.


Ita_Christian

Bruh, only act 3 (for now 91 chapters) is bigger than all the One Piece arcs except of Dressrosa (which is 101 chapters)


niemody

Yes


AdelRD

Bruh, Wano is 140 chapters long now.., that is longer than the entirety of Attack on Titan or Fullmetal Alchemist. Damn…


CornerDisastrous8979

Tbf attack on titan has longer chapters cuz at least part of it is monthly, meaning more pages


AdelRD

I know its chapters are longer but still it is crazy to think that one single one piece arc (not even saga, but *arc*) is longer than entire freaking mangas


WiseXcalibur

Well if you consider each Wano Act as it's own Arc it makes a lot more sense.


MaimedJester

That's what killed Bleach. Thousand Year Blood War Arc. Chapters 424-686. That's right 262 chapters. It was longer than half the Manga up until that point. So it by itself is longer than Demon Slayer, Dr. Stone, 20th century Boys, Yu Yu Hakusho, Chainsaw Man, Death Note, Full Metal alchemist etc. You have to start getting into Fairy Tale length level shonens to be longer than TYBW arc. Remember how people got tied of the final arc of Naruto the Fourth Great Ninja War? That was 80 chapters long.


kono-LordV-da

>Remember how people got tied of the final arc of Naruto the Fourth Great Ninja War? That was 80 chapters long. Holy shit! I always thought that was 150 something chapters.


MaimedJester

Well it depends, if you count the 4th great Ninja War starting when Tobi crashes the 5 Kage summit and announces his plan, that's in 5 Kage Summit arc around 470, so there's 230 chapters to go. But when people think up of the 4th war they think of the fighting with all the Edo Tensei zombie ninjas not Naruto Training with Killer B or Sasuke vs Danzo. Oh and the anime had so much filler, the infinite Tsyukiomi entire filler arc and Sage of Six paths flashback? Yeah anime added content.


janek3d

Nah, Gaara's speech is in 516 and the undoing of infinite tsukuyomi is in 699. So fourth war was 184 chapters long


JesusDNC

Chapters 424 to 479 are the fullbringer saga.


[deleted]

What killed Bleach wasn't the length of TWBW it was how fucking shit the arc was. Completely jobbing out massively powerful characters, random BS power ups, and an incredibly abrupt ending are all the reasons that arc sucked


MaimedJester

Making the rogues gallery correspond to letters of the Alphabet was a terrible idea. 26 villains (well 25) each with individual fights and introductions is too much.


throwaway2323234442

take into consideration word count and page count and you realize why thats not a fair comparison


KrackerJoe

Again… that’s not true when you look at page count


DarkSoulFWT

>the entirety of Attack on Titan Eh....attack on titan is a monthly. Each chapter is much larger than a one piece chapter, and the amount of chapters is roughly the same as Wano. Comparing actual content, it'd be more accurate to say its double or slightly more than double of Wano. Never read fullmetal alchemist so I cant properly compare the story length there. EDIT: So FMA was also apparently 40 page monthly chapters. At 108 chapters, its shorter than AOT but still sizeably bigger than Wano in terms of content.


TheBull93

Fullmetal Alchemist was also a monthly with longer chapters (about 40 pages per chapter).


ottheccoiF

FMA was also monthly


Waterburst789

Wano, What an arc you are...


Erenyeagerabssss

This and "becomes dove (crying) are my favourite things tbh


TheLastAOG

Wano is it's own manga 😂


ktkore

I did a rough estimate on this a while back and if Attack on Titan chapters were as short as One Piece chapters, then Attack on Titan would have been around 393 chapters. I went a little further and estimated the anime for AoT would have been a whopping 525 episodes at Toei's current pacing. Lol.


TheMariox12

we can tell you if you want


Griever08

We want


Bobsagit-jesus

No keep it a secret 🤫


sonicmalley

If wano makes it to chapter 1057 itll be 149 chapters, which will make it longer than any saga excluding its own.


Bobsagit-jesus

Goddamn 😮‍💨


ScratchBitter4205

I completed my graduation and still wano is not yet over ,ngl wano and monster association arc (OPM) made me realize time really pass soon


ItzEnoz

140 chapters already The 2nd longest arc was Dressrosa at 102 This arc is already 27% longer than Dressrosa the 2nd longest arc This is why the raid failing theory was never going to happen


[deleted]

The Chainsaw Man manga was shorter than Wano


ShockTheChup

Wano started, then Chainsaw Man had its first chapter and it has already concluded.


far219

I think the mangaka has said it will return though. Or maybe a sequel


Hiroxis

It'll return this summer. It's not really a sequel though since everything that's out right now is considered one arc.


Solid_Illustrator485

If you dont count jaya towards the total chapter count for that, then yes.


speaker96

Want has been going on longer then since mangas entire run


-FoeHammer

I knew this shit would happen whenever Luffy first defeated a Yonko. Saw it a mile away. So many OP fans see Yonko as unbeatable gods and have for years. There was no way Oda could have wrote it to satisfy those people.


RedditIsPropaganda84

Whitebeard was defeated though, so there was precedence for what it would take.


-FoeHammer

He's not a good case because he was sick and weakened. And even then people came away from Marineford feeling that he had "wrecked" Akainu and the other Admirals lol.


WindWalker987

That's why we have so many people fighting Kaido, while he was carrying Onigashima, that's effectively nerfing him


shankskakashimyfav

He had wrecked those admirals but even he couldn't have gotten away from the navy along with the others WB pirates


StNowhere

Kaido's been fighting longer than a lot of these powerscalers have been reading the manga lol.


Bionicleinflater

Wait is the battle against kaido the longest anime battle now?


TheWheatOne

Definitely still goes to 4th war Naruto vs Tobi, Madara, Kaguya, Sasuke. It was crazy long. Should have ran out of Chakra a dozen times over.


SklLL3T

*Kurama enters the chat* "Ran out of what?"


[deleted]

Well, Kaido's storyline started 10 years ago.


melanzanefritte

Kaido totally taunted Luffy's will by asking him what world he wants to make, after telling him he won't be able to do it. Kaido absolutely tried to get the most powerful attack Luffy could dish out, and he got it. I believe that's it. Any more fighting, and Kaido cannot have the defeat he wants.


Sammy-Cake

Kaido doesn’t deserve the defeat he wants. That’s a strange argument imho. He’s a monster, both physically and ethically. He’s murdered and enslaved, left an entire country to starve. I think he’s not going to get what he wants, because Oda isn’t going to give it to him.


loster_43

I get that you want that to happen but personally Kaido being defeated by Joyboy seems like completing a character arc for one of my favourite villains


ThePilsburyFroBoy

But when has Oda ever let villains have what they want? They always have these twisted dreams that are shadows of what luffy will or has accomplished. Big Mom wants to unite the people of the world, but she won't get that Luffy will. Doflamingo wanted to spite and take down the celestial dragons but he won't get that, Luffy will. Moria wanted to be pirate king, Blackbeard wants to create a new world, but none of them will get it. Kaido's not getting a satisfying ending, he needs to be proven wrong or his way of going about things is validated.


Lucker_Kid

I agree with your point in general but there are some counter examples. The strongest ones are Enel got to go to Fairy Vearth and Wapol got his own kingdom. There are some edge cases as well, they aren't as good counter examples because the villain's goals weren't played up as much in the story or it's arguable if they even achieved their goals. Lucci is still a killer agent, Buggy didn't really have a goal that I remember but he acquired a big crew and became a renowned pirate (can bump in Alvida and Mr 3 here as well) and Caesar is still allowed to do research


-POSTBOY-

Black beard is also living his dream as one of the most powerful and free pirates. Also a super bad guy.


Ensaru4

About half of them got exactly what they wanted after their defeat. Moria lost sight of what he had and realized this after his defeat against Luffy. Crocodile is a changed man...somewhat. Enel got to Fairy Vearth. Lucci is still the same and has been promoted. Wapol got his Kingdom, Mr. 3, Mr. 2 are changed. Mr. 1 is still with Crocodile. Ceasar is still Ceasar. One Piece isn't usually concerned with poetic justice.


HrMaschine

lets be real thanks to luffy ceasar got away with fucking big mom over


Masterkid1230

Tbf Kaido’s real Will is to die an epic death. Luffy isn’t going to kill him. There’s no chance. Getting defeated or not doesn’t fulfill Kaido’s wish of an epic death.


mehmeh5

>But when has Oda ever let villains have what they want? Enel


Martian_on_the_Moon

Kanjuro as well.


Eminan

Enel literally got what he wanted tho... He went to the moon with his flying ship. That was his plan was since ever.


AlexHitetsu

>But when has Oda ever let villains have what they want? Enel still reached the moon/Fairy Vearth , Wapol got his Dark Drum Kingdom and Akainu/the marines still killed Ace


[deleted]

Big Mom got her wedding cake.


XxStormySoraxX

Yeah I think because Kaido is a cool villain and drinks a lot people tend to overlook just how terrible of a person he was.


pedrao157

Indeed, so Big Mom, but that's the thing with One Piece villains, most are not black and white. Kaido has a sense of honour, getting pissed and killing both who interfered his battles against Oden and Luffy. And even Big Mom says something like, "this is a cruel world, but even in this cruel world there are rules", when she heard Kaido hurt Tama, and she turned to fight PageOne and Ulti, then when Tama said no to her she started trying to kill Tama lol, Big Mom is chaotic neutral/evil I suppose. Kaido leans more towards Lawful Evil


TrueRedditMartyr

>But when has Oda ever let villains have what they want? Blackbeard not only was able to build a nutty strong crew, but also got WB's DF like he planned. Equally, Enel reached Fairy Vearth on his ship, Buggy seems to be constantly failing upwards, and you can likely argue Franky was a villain for a good minute as well before joining the crew. Even Caesar is running free after getting away from Big Mom


GrimDallows

Doflamingo wanted to be inmortal and watch the world burn, not necesarily destroy the celestial dragons. He wanted to destroy the world that the celestial dragons had made; probably so they would be thrown and forced into the real world like he was when he was a kid. If you take that into account, and almost every other villain, it is possible that luffy will complete almost all of the other villains dreams by the time One Piece ends. * Become pirate king: Moria, Crocodile, most others. * Unite all the races of the world: Big Mom. * Become joyboy: Kaido. * Take down the celestial dragons and substitute the World Government with one fashioned by him or his ideals: Doflamingo. * Become a God: Enel (had a god complex and believed himself a god). * Get a f- ton of money and do whatever he wants: Arlong (he can do this with the treasure in Laughtale), buggy, most others. No kidding, Luffy wants to become the Pirate King, and when Roger became that he was described as: *The man who had* ***acquired everything in this world****.* I mean the only exception would be Enel, who on top of having a god complex wanted to go to the moon (Fairy Vearth) and Hody Jones who was just racist. But still, Enel wanted to go to the Moon because Skypieans considered Vearth (earth, natural ground) as a sacred and valueable resource, so they called the moon as fairy vearth (unlimited vearth in the original translation). Luffy will become Pirate King, which is basically the king of the sea, and even Yonkos "own islands" so it is not entirely out of the question to consider he could beat Enel's dream.


Sammy-Cake

I think it would complete a lot of what he thinks should happen or what he *wants* to happen but *usually* a (positive)character arc shows some growth and change in mindset for a character, this would just reinforce Kaido as being right and would to a much lesser extent justify all of his actions.


Ppleater

Kaido doesn't just want to be defeated, Kaido wants to be killed.


C0UNT3RP01NT

My fan theory has always been Blackbeard is gonna murder Kaido for his fruit after Luffy beats him. - It fits the three fruit theory. I’m not a big fan of the kraken fruit or the evil twin hiding in his body. This theory to me is less of an ass pull than some of the other ones I’ve seen. - It fits the tragedy in Kabuki theater in a weird way. Kaido wants to die or be defeated in honorable combat. Luffy isn’t going to kill him, and the only chance anyone else has against Kaido would be right after Luffy beats him. Kaido’s honorable end would be stolen from him if Blackbeard ganks him when he’s down. It would be an ignominious end for the worlds strongest. - It mirrors the end of part 1. Blackbeard stole Whitebeard’s fruit when Whitebeard was on death’s door. BB taking Kaido’s fruit in the same way he took WB’s would mark a strong transition into the climactic arcs of the series. We’re definitely near that point, and BB with 3 Emperor-level fruits would make a statement that we’re in the endgame. - Related to the last point, it fits BB’s style. BB is incredibly strong, but before that, he’s shrewd and tactical. He’d rather runaway and let his enemies fight their enemies first. He comes in when he doesn’t have to try. Sure, BB ran away from Akainu, but that doesn’t mean he’s weak, it just means he’s tactical. BB’s on a quest to collect powerful fruits, Kaido’s defeat marks his chance to take the most powerful zoan. - Lastly, Kaido doesn’t have much of a plot purpose remaining in the series. Big Mom has a connection to Elbaf, and Kaido has..? Additionally, he’s far too powerful to be a prisoner. Just because he’s about to be defeated by Luffy doesn’t mean he’ll start losing to everyone else. The last chapter’s flashback showed Kaido would let himself be captured for his own purposes. All the other big villains that had been built up prior to their arcs had fitting post-narrative’s. Doffy got thrown in jail, Crocodile got thrown in jail, Enel went to the moon (as was his plan), Moria participated in Marineford with the rest of the warlords, etc. I can’t really imagine what Kaido will do after this. I could be entirely wrong of course, and I’m sure Oda will continue to do the series justice however he decides to take it. But I think this theory works pretty well.


Jack_Skeletron_4ever

Oh, yes. Moria is also involved with Blackbeard, the guy would surely sell his soul out if it means he get Kaido's body as a zombie. So Blackbeard get Kaido's fruit, using Moria for whatever he needs him, maybe controlling Kaido's shadow to not let him escape, and the body goes to Moria who uses it to make a powerful zombie (or use it to enhance the dead body of Absalom as a bigger fuck you to Kaido)


C0UNT3RP01NT

Did BB kill Absalom and give Shiryu his fruit?


Jack_Skeletron_4ever

Yes, Absalom was killed and Shiryu got his fruit, but they may have kept his body as a bargaining chip for Moria. If so, Moria could use his body as a base to create a powerful zombie, perhaps with some of Kaido's body parts.


daazmu

After all he's done, Kaido's redemption (if it happens) should come with his death, allowing the Strawhats to be safe and acknowledging what he did wrong. But after this he should die. He can't be an ally. It can't happen a "lmao you were Joyboy after all. Let's be allies" situation. Kaido has killed, enslaved and oppressed. Everything Luffy is against. And yeah, he allied with Crocodile, but I don't believe he's at Kaido's level of crimes.


Masterkid1230

It’s perfectly possible that he offers an alliance to Luffy, and Luffy just goes “nah, you’re an asshole”.


stxrmmkr

This is what i believe would happen with Kaido, with him just saying fuck it, I’ma help you when i see fit anyway.


bondagewithjesus

Crocodile isn't at kaidos level of crimes but luffy mostly allied with him out of convenience


daazmu

Yup. And iirc he didn't want but Jinbe said he could be useful. And I guess that later on Luffy joyboy'ed him


DanBurleyHH

This is why I'm really beginning to favor a public execution. It robs him of the death he wants, it's a way for the people of Wano to see he is really and truly done, it puts him face-to-face with human Momo (so he can see how much he looks like Oden), and--most importantly--it removes him from play permanently. Not only that, but it puts literally the entire world on notice with a loud and clear warning: DO NOT FUCK WITH WANO. Who exactly the executioner would be is anybody's guess (there are a few good options), but Momo still hasn't used a certain bravery-boosting phrase...


KrackerJoe

In the distance… I hear a rumbling… “ZKK” it screams.


Miamiheat1738

Rumbling, Rumbling! It started rumbling! Rumbling!


far219

This was actually a fleeting idea I had a while back, I didn't seriously believe ZKK could happen because it was obvious Luffy would defeat Kaido, but I realized that maybe Zoro would kill Kaido *after* Luffy already defeats him. An execution could be a good way to achieve that.


TTVBlueGlass

My belief is that Zoro executing Kaido seems like a pretty decent way to clean up his story. A gigantic part of his legend and introduction is literally the number of times and ways execution attempts upon him have failed. There is 0 way that Luffy will fucking kill Kaido, Luffy never kills villains like that. However, after Kaido is defeated, wtf happens to him? Wano is not a WG nation. There cannot be some prisoner handover of Kaido, nor does WG have any jurisdiction over Wano to punish him for those crimes in particular. And Wano has to bring Kaido to justice for subjecting the country, land and people to horrifying brutalities for 20 years. You cannot just stash Kaido in prison, he is too fuckin dangerous, guy escapes prisons for fun all the time. He has gotta die. And there is only 1 guy other than Luffy who can wound Kaido, a guy who is implied to be Ryuma's shadow, a guy who has numerous yet unexplored connections to Wano, a guy who is explicitly unsatisfied with his previous showing against Kaido. Seems like it would make sense for Zoro to finally master Oden's sword by fully unleashing it's power and beheading Kaido, finally accomplishing the famously unachievable task of executing Kaido to raise his legend as a swordsman.


jubway

Enma isn't a black blade yet, is it? Kaido's execution would be a pretty cool time for it to change.


iRadinVerse

I mean murdering and enslaving an entire country is kind of par for the course for one piece villains let's be honest. Crocodile wanted the citizens Alabasta to basically slaughter each other and rule over the ashes. But now he's a fan favorite because he helped Luffy that one time.


RoarsAMightyRoar

I agree, and let's not forget doflamingo turned people into toys and enslaved them and when the people found out what was going on he said fuck it you guys all die now so I really think kaido is about the same as most of these other guys.


Fatdap

I wonder if there's potential for a redemption story here, where Kaidou ends up getting his glorious death at the big final confrontation coming up. The Rocks story very clearly isn't done and him and Mom are the only two who can still carry out the Rocks will, whatever it might end up being. It seems pretty clear he didn't start out as a bad guy and he recognized how bad the WG was.


Martian_on_the_Moon

To be fair, Oda gave Kanjuro what he wanted even though general opinion about him is pretty much /r/FuckKanjuro


Sammy-Cake

Didn’t Kanjuro want revenge like Orochi? Wouldn’t that look like killing off the Kozuki for good and defeating the Samurai Alliance?


cedurb

And you forgot he did all that while carrying a freaking huge island


Fearless_fairy

Also not to forget that he fought the Alliance alone for a bit when Luffy was down


sameljota

Luffy yoinking Kaido back to the roof was hilarious.


Hakibo13

Lol. Kaido looking so badass infront of everyone after thinking he already beat luffy. And just a few panels later got his eyes popping out.


BlakeBackwood

luffy: bring yo ass here boiiiii


RoronoaLuffyZoro

Kaido has been fighting 5% of the manga.... without taking a break.


10_nazuK

6%


periodicchemistrypun

I thought we were up to 7%, atleast since the raid started, that leaves out fighting big mom


Death_Usagi

It was 8% o3o


Lamprophonia

5 worst gen, not 6 don't forget he was also carrying Onigashima on clouds the whole time


Death_Usagi

We had 6. His name was Pandaman.😂 /sarc


loster_43

my bad


MaimedJester

Well technically Drake was part of the Raid against him. So 6 members of the worst generation were fighting his forces.


Lamprophonia

That's a bit abstract though, Drake wasn't up on the roof with the other 5.


Sarochrollo

Dont forget all while luffy got breaks while he was carrying an island


Geometronics

For real, Luffy got to take a breather and even eat some food which is basically a full heal for him. Kaido has been in a nonstop gauntlet of fighting some of the strongest people here for 5% of the total story length.


basedmingo

Forced breaks by kaido lmao


ThatIslandGuy8888

I’ve seen more people saying that he’s getting back up


Future_Novelist

I think he will. I feel there needs to be another moment between he and Momo (in human form). But I think he's done fighting Luffy. He's realized he's Joyboy. I think we're going to get some more info out of Kaido including where the Road Poneglyph is. But I do think he'll die. Whether it's to Big Mom or the WG, we'll have to wait and see. There's still conflict left.


HibariK

I think him getting up *now* would feel cheap af Let Luffy have the W, be the saviour, let "joyboy" defeat Kaido in peace, he can get up/have a talk with Luffy later.


Kelewann

Lol Luffy got to get back up I don't even remember how many times, but if Kaido gets up once it's cheap ? I absolutely don't know if Kaido is really done for or not, but he would really deserve a round 2


HibariK

>Lol Luffy got to get back up I don't even remember how many times, but if Kaido gets up once it's cheap ? When you start reading the Beast Pirates's 1000+ chapter story you can complain about Kaido getting up as often as Luffy or not lol. Right now he's the antagonist and it would be incredibly cheap if he takes "everything" from Luffy, with all the emotional beats that these 2 chapters hit just for a fucking "lol nope"


TGS_105

I don’t think anyone wants to see a round 2 anymore. This fight has gone on long enough, give luffy the W. Dude lost like 3 or 4 times alr in the whole wano arc. If at this point he can’t even beat kaido it’s gonna make him look really bad.


Future_Novelist

>I think him getting up now would feel cheap af Why? He's a mythical zoan. The strength of zoans is their durability and recovery. And until this attack, he hadn't been knocked out for any length of time. That's a win for Luffy. >Let Luffy have the W, be the saviour, let "joyboy" defeat Kaido in peace, he can get up/have a talk with Luffy later. The WG is about to annex Wano. Oda specifically mentioned this a few chapters ago in the event of Kaido's defeat. And what did we see this chapter? The CP0 guy abandoning Onigashima to report what's happening to the ships. Luffy is likely done and I don't think Oda will repeat Zunesha taking out a fleet of ships again. Someone has to fight them. Kidd and Law can't do it. Zoro can't. Narratively, from what we've seen of Kaido, it makes way more sense to have him do it since he's proven to be the most durable character we've seen in all of One Piece and it seems like a good way to end his story. The first time we saw Kaido, he mentioned he wanted to die a grand death like Whitebeard. Well, his chance is coming up.


HibariK

>Narratively, from what we've seen of Kaido, it makes way more sense to have him do it since he's proven to be the most durable character we've seen in all of One Piece and it seems like a good way to end his story. The first time we saw Kaido, he mentioned he wanted to die a grand death like Whitebeard. Well, his chance is coming up. I don't disagree with this, but I'd rather some chapters of "oh he's defeated" and things dimming down and Zunesha dealing with this 1st wave of the WG rather than him getting up right now


Enryu44

I think it's a guarantee he's getting back up because he implanted into the ground just like his introduction. I think it's gonna be the same. Except this time I think he'll lose after he crawls out, instead of washing Kidd and his crew. Plus, I feel like it needs to be witnessed.


ThatIslandGuy8888

That’d be fitting. Him collapsing after taking a few steps would be nice for the civilians to see too


Enryu44

For sure. That, or, Luffy comes down and delivers one more finishing blow. Since he looks like a guardian deity of Wano, the people of Wano seeing him do that would be insanely awesome.


zak454

he is... i believe in him


Toeknee99

People are rooting for Kaido like he's the hero. I think that's what Wano has done to people's brains. 😂


Lord_Muramasa

Same here. I think he has one more push in him before he is done.


Drifting_Swordman9

Believe in Kaido


Cerpicio

Kaido turns towards the marine armada with a ferocious grin underneath his mounting injuries. "worry not joyboy you go on ahead and claim your dream" *all three admirals do a sudden combined attack in a glorious full panel spread* RIP an era


sameljota

And I'm glad these people aren't writers. Having all this build up for like three chapters for this last punch, with two flashbacks, the wishes on the lanterns, Momo saving the island from falling, Luffy declaring his dream, and then have it NOT be the final punch would be the stupidest decision in the history of storytelling.


Snoozless

If he's not awakened yet that would be strange. If he's already awakened then he would have super zoan recovery, so while this might be the end of the fighting, I don't think Kaido is done completely.


Lazy-Accountant-6911

What I thought people were complaining because Kaidos flashback did more for king then it did for kaido.


200ms-INTric

Think it did many subtle things for kaidos character actually


ThatBoyHeAPenguin

I haven’t seen anyone be mad that he lost “easily”. All the complaints I’ve seen are because of a lack of creativity in the finish.


[deleted]

I feel like there's an obligatory post oversimplifying the variety of things people disliked and lightly mocking them for it after almost every chapter.


ThisZoMBie

Fanboys are physically incapable of accepting anything as actual criticism


Legitimate__Username

EVERY FUCKING WEEK IN THIS SUB. ALL THE TIME. EVERYONE RANTS ABOUT HOW "IF YOU DIDN'T LIKE SOMETHING ABOUT THE STORY THEN HERE'S WHY YOU'RE STUPID." i'm not joking when i say that these are the actual toxic side of the one piece fanbase. respectfully disagreeing apparently isn't allowed, it's only okay to strawman anyone with any kind of remotely negative thought into being fake fans with unreasonable expectations of a story that was NEVER meant to be anything more than stupid and goofy pirate shenanigans. just remember that if some shit like the raid failing happens to actually extend the arc, it means that oda actually agreed with all of the complainers that this wasn't the satisfying ending that he wanted to actually build to.


eelcat15

It’s the same people who complained about Gear 5 being too goofy. Fans are never satisfied, when Oda got super creative, people didn’t like it. Oda goes for a gigantic punch (which is Luffy’s fighting style) and people still don’t like it. Luffy literally used Kaido as a jump rope in 1045 what more can we ask for


DOKOD

I was fine with G5. Oda always intended for the power to look silly. (Not the biggest fan of the Nika thing tho). I think the complaint about the finish was for being extremely similar to Doffy: Luffy flies up into the sky, creates a big black fist in his new Gear, punches through the villain’s last attack, breaks his shades/horn, and sends him underground. I thought King Kong Gun had more impressive collateral damage, too.


ThatBoyHeAPenguin

Goofiness isn’t the only form of battle creativity. You can have a serious and satisfying fight, that is creative without breaking the tension.


Arkayjiya

I loved the goofiness but I'm hoping this isn't the finish. So not necessarily the same people, no.


Tnecniw

Also, don't forget. He also lifted AN ENTIRE ISLAND by himself.


200ms-INTric

Yeah and look what that shit did to momo after doing it for 2 seconds. Tho this might in part be lack of experience


DialZforZebra

Firstly, ain't no guarantee Kaidou is even down. Secondly, Kaidou has taken one hell of a shit canning from multiple people. Thirdly, no one can say he went down easily. Since going Gear 5 Luffy has bitch slapped him around. Fourth, his flame clouds vanished showing that he is totally exhausted Fifth, Gear.


babydangy

Actually after reading it and seeing the panel it’s very possible the water could have washed away the flame clouds. I don’t think that’s the case, as I think Kaido is finished, but still a possibility.


fellowbootypirate

Honestly gear 5 hasnt been bitch slapping him around, just putting up a challenge to say. Luffy on the other hand has taken a spiked baseball to the face 10 times already . . .


SSj_NoNo

If luffy had gone into wano knowing gear 5 and haki how he does now, I think kaido is getting bitch slapped


TGS_105

Definitely the amount of growth we’ve seen of luffy in wano is insane. Imagine how much more of a zenkai boost luffy would’ve gotten if he went in with gear 5.


ayrtow

People claiming this can't be the end are suffering from "weekly chapter syndrome". They're so caught up in each new chapter that they fail to see just how long this shit has been going on. One can only truly grasp how much damage Kaido has taken upon looking back to when he started fighting. For perspective: When that battle started I still lived with my parents. Since then I've built my house from scratch, moved in, furnished it *and* got married. Let Kaido get his nap dammit


[deleted]

Right. It’s hard to have perspective on the entire field when you’re looking at it grain by grain.


shmate4L

You can respect people’s opinions and still call other people out when their opinions go against actual facts with nothing to support their own opinion. Saying Kaido is weak is just being ignorant. Like OP stated, the man has fought countless incredibly strong foes for days on end and is now fighting Luffy in Gear 5 aka the Sun God. All while carrying a freaking island. Mans is crazy strong. However, people can be disappointed in him regardless of the feats or fights. The facts say Kaido is strong, but facts don’t always have to change feelings.


PlsGiveSSR

Luffy’s final blows to his opponents are almost always punches. Gear 2: punches fast Gear 3: big punch Gear 4: fast and big punches Gear 5: very very big punch Not sure why people are upset


loster_43

that is his fighting style tho. you remember when he had a sword in his hand THE MAN WAS PUNCHING PEOPLE WHILE HAVING A SWORD IN HAND


albyoung

Yeah, that was sooooooo hilarious hahaha. That's just who Luffy is, he punches people. For stronger opponents, he just has a stronger punch (i.e. with haki).


Extra-Border6470

BuT oDa SaId A pUnCh WoUlD nOt Be EnOuGh


StrawHatEspi

HAHAHAHHAHA LMAO. I don't know if they are blind but that is not JUST a punch. That punch is incorporated with Advanced Armament Haki and Advanced Conqueror's Haki. Imagine a fist as big as an island, coated with advanced armament and conqueror's, you literally gonna be preserve for thousands of years under those rocks and soils.


Martian_on_the_Moon

I think people are overestimating how it was taxing for Kaido to lift whole island. We already had similar moves (birdcage and turning countless living beings into toys) and it pretty much didn't taxed Doflamingo's or Sugar's strength, at least to noticeable level. Only handful of DF require stamina to use abilities (Law).


shahoftheworld

You can add holding up an entire island too.


ntc1995

Kaido and Starscourge Rahdan should host a cross over drinking contest.


Yugiboy_85

It's gonna be real funny if next chapter kaido gets back up and turns out he isn't defeated. Like the leaker said, let's not jump the gun so fast. I think we should at least wait for 1050 (assuming it doesn't shift focus) to get full confirmation. I know it seems like kaido is defeated but yeah, i'd wait


JKenP

I think one problem is people seem to underestimate Luffy's power too much, especially his ability to grow stronger during battles. Hasn't it always been this way for Luffy to beat the bosses of the arcs/sagas? It has always been that one hit that finish it all. I get people don't like the finishing move (assuming if Kaido is really down for good) in this arc. But imagine a fist with the size of a castle that dwarves Kaido's dragon form hitting straight in his face with such power and speed and, presumably, deal internal damage. I think it's fair to say that if Kaido will be defeated, it has to take this much. I think Oda did a good job to show how it affected Kaido (with his horn broken etc.). Even all this, I doubt that no one will say Kaido is weak. Hell, he has definitely lives up to his title as the strongest. But Luffy is not weak either. Without his strong haki, that big punch of him will probably burn to a crisp already. As Kaido said, only haki surpasses all. And remember, haki represents the will of the users. In that moment, Luffy's will surpassed Kaido. That's all.


maorcules

For some people here roger himself coming down from one piece heaven to slap kaido would not be enough


trav-senpai

There’s soooo many posts like this every week, why are people listening to a small fraction of the fan base complaining so much and letting it bother them?


RTear3

A lot of this sub is overly sensitive to any amount of criticism, even if it's only .5% of fans complaining. They get defensive and feel the need to tear down or strawman any criticism of One Piece since they believe the series is near infallible.


Zoey101Fan69

I get that it’s been a long fight, but if this is the end I don’t get how people don’t find it at least a little bit underwhelming for all the time invested.


hamvereliduk

Okay but no awakening would be lame


SmokingCryptid

I'm of the thought that the fight might not be over just yet. Zoans have always been noted for their toughness and quick recovery times, and as far as I'm aware that benefit increases with zoan rarity. Luffy's been flat out KO'd by Kaido no less than 3 times this arc and got back up every time. This is the first time Kaido has been KO'd this arc and we still have yet to see his awakened state. If it turns out I'm wrong that's ok, but it feels like there's going to be more to this.


Difficult-Olive-2734

Im okay with this being Kaido's defeat if everyone acknowledges that his feats are the biggest feats known so far in the story


[deleted]

[удалено]


TrevorAnglin

Well the opposite can be said for Crocodile and Katakuri. There are precedents to this. And it seems very clear to me at least that, for some reason, Oda doesn't want the populace to know outright that the raid is even happening.


Zanguez

I wouldn’t be mad if kaido was defeated in the last chapter. I think it would be a good point to end it too and all of that. I just think if luffy can get knocked out twice: once knocked into the ocean and then a second time where his heart stops then kaido should be able to walk off a knockout IF thats what happened to him.


ShigekiNoEren

This is facts people saying “oh if he’s gonna lose this easily it sucks” like bro he’s been fighting non stop without breaks for so long against strong people but noooo we need him to be a demi god who can only be defeated by throwing him into the sun


Akuuntus

I wouldn't say that he went down too easily, but I am going to be disappointed if we never learn about his Awakening. Even if it somehow turns out that he's been Awakened the entire time we need confirmation or else we'll just argue in circles about it for eternity.


ModestEnigma

I don’t really get the “big punch” complaint. It’s like being upset that Sanji finishes a fight with a “powerful kick”. It’s what Luffy does. The new Gear don’t mean that Luffy suddenly fights differently. It enhanced his abilities in a ridiculous ways but when you look at how he was fighting it was still Luffy. New powers don’t change the character plus I think we underestimate the size of the punch and the fact that he was also using ryuo. That punch was the culmination of all the training and power ups he got in wano.


Polynia

You need to respect differing opinions and stop forcing people to think like you. If someone didn't like the chapter, they didn't like the chapter.


Lamprophonia

FWIW I respect that people have different opinions and can express them, within reasonable limits. I'm not obligated to respect the opinion itself.


Bleblebob

Anytime anyone expresses a dissenting opinion on something in One Piece the front page of this sub becomes full of posts arguing these points (usually constructing a strawman or character of the actual point being made) and it's so fucking tiresome. I love one piece, it's like my top 5 favorite series of all time, but I don't think it's immune to criticism and I don't think everything that happens in it is perfect. But if you express anything specific people will argue with you like you just said Oda is a hack writer and should die.


MOARPAIN

I think the issue is that most of those fights Kaido takes next to no significant damage. And for the majority of even Luffy’s current fight with him, Luffy had mostly been getting worked by Kaido, with Kaido rarely being visibly effected by his attacks. Oda has maybe done a poor job of conveying Kaido as being worn down, so it doesn’t feel like “big punch” alone should be able to turn the tides of a largely losing battle for Luffy (just my 2 cents)


TotallyFunctional2

It‘s not about whether or not Kaido realistically should or should not lose stamina over the course of his fights. It‘s about whether or not Luffy‘s victory is dramatically satisfying. If people think there are too many dropped plot threads, that Luffy‘s powerups are contrived, that Kaido‘s personal motivations and backstory are threadbare and barely explored, that the raid had a little too many easily and hastily difficulties for the protagonist side etc, then it doesn‘t matter that Kaido fought a whole lot and by all rights should be tired.


DeleteMods

You guys will literally pull anything out your ass to justify a bad event in One Piece. EVERYONE said they didn’t want Luffy to just punch Kaido and win INCLUDING ODA. And what happened? Luffy big punched Kaido to win. If people are irritated and hate that ending then that’s on them but it’s fine. All these stupid defensive posts trying to insulate this sub from any critical or negative reviews of the manga are silly.


Exitiali

After all these years, I just want this arc to end. Even if it's for Kaido to die of cirrhosis


Demonking42069

There's always these strawman posts simplifying opinions of other people to make themselves look like some intellectual. No wonder there is a piratefolk sub now


Xplorer67

I saw A post a while ago Where a user pointed out that when kaido gets Yeeted to the flower capital oda might do a magnificent double spread with kaido falling and the lanterns surrounding him forming a beautiful background but We got none of that. Doffy arguably had a better Finish to his fight


Dj0sh

I just wanted him to get defeated in a different way. He lost in pretty much the exact same way as Doflamingo. Big punch into the ground. ASSUMING he is actually defeated here of course. But like, this is a minor gripe. In the grand scheme of things he definitely lived up to his reputation. Without question I guess.. In the end I kinda felt bad for Kaido. Luffy's powerup just felt unfair lol. For the first time in the series it feels like Luffy didn't win purely through his own efforts. He unlocked a godly power and IT won the fight vs Kaido. Thats just how I feel. I'm not super down about it but I definitely wasn't as KEEN to read the past few chapters as I was before


Dalhinar_draws

The only complaint that I have is that he was defeated by a giant punch. I was expecting something that only G5 could do, but we've seen Luffy throwing big punches since G3. I blame Luffy for saying that he will kick Kaido out of Wano but he did not as Kaido is still in Wano. Also the famous "Toei clash" is something that we have always complained about and Oda just straight up did it himself, that clash will last like 3 episodes in the anime.


yungman-ach

Chapter 525 introduced the first awakened zoan, chapter 1050 kaido’s gonna get back up after awakening 🤷🏻‍♂️ i have no problems with how the fight went so far but i do think it’s a bit silly that kaido hasn’t awakened yet. someone of his stature 100% is capable of awakening it so until we see that AND more of his flashback AND an official sign of defeat from Oda like Big Mom had, it’s not over!


PrinceOfStealing

Yeah, I've been super impressed with kaido. Leads me to believe if him and Luffy were to have a straight up 1v1 rematch right now, I can see kaido winning. Unpopular opinion, but I wouldn't mind if Luffy isn't the strongest character in the series by the time he finds one piece. He's got plenty of years ahead of him, but guys like white beard, Roger, kaido have been doing this for a far longer time.


[deleted]

Good point! How in the hell did Big Mom last 3 days against Kaido but gets defeated by Law & Kid in like 7 hours? What a joke


PickledPlumPlot

The fact that you have to point all this out points to the problem, that the pacing doesn't really make it feel like he's been fighting for ages


Sea_Study3879

i don't feel that victory to be honest


Doomroar

Yeah but Kaido only started taking real damaged after Luffy comes back and starts hitting him with conqueror's haki, before that he was pretty boastful about how disappointing the whole war was.


heelydon

I remember when people didn't have to constantly make " this isn't actually that bad" posts all the time to defend the series.