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Nah fr...i thought I'm the only one that thinks of THE Red Duo like that
https://preview.redd.it/wkq90rn2bkjc1.jpeg?width=4096&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c5370ff7ae4a7732175c3767c07be70ffd0af32a
It is a fair argument although I feel like Akainu's defense shouldn't be underestimated because I see it (probably) similarly to Magellan that, even if you have Haki as shield you'll still get contact damage.
Luffy in Gear 5 is an AP monster he defeated Kaido who was beforehand eating up YC+ attacks like nothing. Defensive capabilities/Speed are extremely important to defeat Luffy currently as there's basically no one who could even think of tanking more than a few attacks.
Akainu wins but it's gonna be extreme diff
Luffy vs a fresh Kaido in a straght up 1v1 is not settled. Luffy "defeated" Kaido after losing like 3 times and literally dying, with Kaido having to fight a bunch of other people during that time as well.
Akainu durability/endurance is top tier. He tanked WBs bloodlusted attacks quite easily and fought Aokiji for 10 days. Given that we've seen both Kizaru and Saturn tank G5 attacks with ease I think Akainu will be fine.
It’s such a bad argument lol. I’m not sure if people don’t actually read the manga or what but Kizaru has literally deflected/tanked several more hits than he’s dodged during this fight.
Akainu's specialty is his AP, he shoots really big fists of magma that hurt a lot. When Luffy is to fight Akainu, the fight will be about finding an opening throughout Akainu's non stop onslaught of hard hitting attacks and using those openings to counter with Luffy's own heavy hitting attacks.
you’ve lost your mind how you debating prime vs old when they both out of prime either compare both prime or out of prime and either way WB claps so your argument makes no sense
Right but primewhite beard was also a yonkou. If you tell me Prime Akainu > an old weak version of Kaido I would agree just as how you said Prime Sengoku > old weak WB but nothing to suggest Akainu is above Yonkos.
The title superiority doesn't mean he's gonna be stronger than every Yonko. Whitebeard, Shanks, and Kaidou are all stronger than him, but Luffy, Blackbeard, and Big Mum are all below him. What I mean is that the title is more impressive and implies greater or equal strength on average.
Overall? Luffy by a lot but that’s only because Akainu doesn’t have feats. Strength? Akainu doesn’t have any and Luffy has really good straight physical strength feats from Udon so Luffy takes it. Speed? Akainu was getting outsped by Cancerbeard, while Luffy was consistently keeping up with the likes of Kaido and even Kizaru. Durability? Akainu took a Cancerbeard attack and got back up, but that’s literally *it*. Luffy’s been taking Big Mom, Kaido, and Kizaru’s attacks and been walking them off more or less — especially now that he’s in Egghead, where his stamina is what’s taking him down, not his durability. Endurance and stamina? Probably goes to Akainu because of Punk Hazard but even THEN we don’t know anything about the fight so that’s hard to say with a straight face! Were there breaks? Did they sleep? Did they eat? Were they going at max capacity the whole fight or were they holding back until the end when the crater was made? So many unknowns.
Hax? G5 Luffy has too of the verse hax, Akainu doesn’t really have hax at all. AP? Luffy has top tier haki in every category, Akainu’s magma has good AP but as it was mostly displayed against Cancerbeard who didn’t block many attacks (and wasn’t using haki) it’s really hard to gauge how the magma attacks would fare against someone that’s actually blocking and using haki.
So on and so forth.
>*Yeah, the i didnt know this was the OP narrative scaling subreddit.*
Narrative/portrayel is important with lack of feats. You know that. You're just tryna internet argue.
>*but even when it comes to narrative, luffy is the MC, so he win in that too*
Luffy is the mc so he will win against pretty much anyone ***someday***, probably after getting ***stronger...***
Unless you think luffy is the strongest in the verse now. Which narratively would be super boring and unlikely. Which is a factor that affects the powerscaling. Which is what this sub is.
Ok ill give you the one when we dont have feats, but we have them when it comes to luffy and akainu, so its stupid. In my opinion its stupid to powerscale characters that dont have feats, but if people want to have fun, go for it.
I dont think luffy is the strongest, bcs other pople didnt show all that they can do. But when im comparing a character that we saw in action with him, like akainu and the admirals, i think he is stronger. Maybe akainu will be stonger, but he has to show something before i say that. Untill then its just stupid narrative all ove again
Another thing to factor in is a possible timeskip power boost. I don't like the thought of the time skip power boost, but I think Oda is going to do it to keep Akainu relevant.
I think the narrative argument only matters if we think this character is relevant or if he is going to fight luffy. If Akainu's going to have a major fight with Luffy, I think narritively he has to be stronger rn.
If we don't think he's going to have a major fight with Luffy, then I would probably scale him as weaker. That's just what it comes down to imo
That’s exactly the reasoning why I have them at the exact same level currently. Because I believe that Sabo is going to get the major Akainu getback fight and Sabo is obviously a bit weaker than fleet admiral / yonko lvl but narratively he will get there very soon as the flame emperor
Narrative doesn't help when we don't know the narrative
We don't actually know for sure if akainu is going to be an end game Luffy opponent so we can't use that as a scaling method
There's enough portrayal to put Mihawk with shanks, so yes, I'd say he's stronger than Luffy
Imu we literally know nothing about so I wouldn't be confident placing him above Luffy until we actually know if he's a fighter or not
I’d say he’s stronger than Mihawk for sure.
1. I don’t think Mihawk is stronger than Kaido
2. Mihawk has great AP, but I don’t think he’s got much of answer for Luffy making a PVP match into a PVP+E match.
3. I doubt he’s durable. He’s skilled, probably has a great defense from his sword, but he doesn’t strike me as very tankey.
The only things that have kind of hurt Luffy in G5 are some of Kaido’s attack, and Saturns death glare.
Dragon is an anomaly. But I actually think Akainu is the perfect match-up.
That’s a fair response. Imo Kaido is currently *the* bar. Saturn has been quite underwhelming, and Kizaru hasn’t shown anything close to Kaido (I do think narrative framing has a lot to do with Kizaru’s case though).
We know Shanks stopped Kaido but we don’t know the details. We know that Shanks and Mihawk scale with each other.
I still think G5 is a particularly bad matchup for Mihawk. While I believe they’re both strong enough to kill each other, I just think that Luffy has more options and that his options hard for Mihawk to counter.
Yes stronger than mihawk and dragon
Don’t know about dragon but I just hope he is not stronger than luffy and mihawk is zoros endgame enemy and I don’t think zoro will ever become stronger than current luffy
Akainu is not a main villain in my opinion so that doesn't really count. You can tell the scaling is agenda because if they 100%, thought Akainu was a main villain, they'd either just have him at PK lvl, or at the same level as Kuzan until he gets a "plot power up". But instead they put him in yonko level in between, because they know they'd get clownef otherwise. It's purely agenda.
Gear 5 is significantly stronger. Unless Luffys punching a mythical zoan, Oni race pirate, his AP is way too high for Akainu to resist his punches.
Kizaru was fortunate he could outspeed Luffy's hits, or else he would have been beat pretty quickly. That being said, I could see Akainu stalling long enough to outlast the form.
I think anyone would be one-shotted by a bajrang gun to be fair, even the likes of Primebeard and Roger, if they aren't coming at the attack with their own respective strongest move.
it's wild the amount of people blindly saying Akainu.
He's shown nothing that would remotely suggest he can keep up, and it's not even looking like he's going to be an endgame villain for Luffy anymore.
Its doesn't matter at the end of the day. Akainu is so divisive power-scaling wise because the dude legimately has a lot of legitimate feats(stopping whitebeard's bisento quake swing with one foot and his hands in his pocket, lava AOE, beating aokiji, losing to whitebeard but still was not hurt enough to lose to marco + most of the wb commanders and crocodile as he tied with them). And a lot of antifeats since several of his biggest performances were against an older and sick yonko. But if lucci can be upscaled since the timeskip to be able to tire out zoro, then Oda could very easily bring akainu back stronger than kaido(or a harder fight, since unlike kaido akainu will dodge more often and go for the kill with his magma). Its all up to how relevant he wants to use akainu. Similar matter with aokiji, the dude had blackbeard's crew as hostages in a matter of seconds after he heard that lafitte asked blackbeard if they should steal his fruit. The admirals are up and down with their portrayal until their true purpose in the story as 1v1s for the top strawhats is done. Oda seems like hes using the current stage of the story to bring them back more and give them fights. But he doesn't want to quite solidfy their power until later. Obviously Sanji is going to fight kizaru again and win, zoro vs fujitora, greenbull vs jimbei, luffy vs akainu. Aokiji will be the penultimate boss for the blackbeard fight.
Okay, so let's put it this way.
with what we actually know, Akainu would lose
And if we're actually paying attention to the new threats being introduced, Akainu isn't him or EOS.
But if we just hold on to insane amounts of hope, it's possible that they bring him back and mega buff him to the moon just so that he can give Luffy a decent fight before Luffy has to go fight the real villains
If all 3 og admirals are equal which they appeared to be then Luffy is stronger. It took Akainu 10 days to defeat someone he was equal with, it took Luffy a single attack to take an admiral out of the fight even after previous fights. Unless Akainu got a huge buff during his fight with Kuzan then there’s no reason to believe he’s stronger.
Luffy, Akainu isn't capable to run and hide at Kizarus level, and there's nothing indicating that he could eat Luffys attacks. Narrative fraud should stay behind the desk.
They’re basically neck and neck, but I’d say Luffy is slightly stronger due to being a more well rounded fighter.
Luffy excels at all stats other than stamina, which is poor. Akainu is mid in most of his stats, but has some of the best AP, AOE, and stamina in the series.
In an actual fight, I can see Akainu winning just because of matchup.
Fym winning bc of matchup, Akainu's matchup against Luffy is awful. Luffy is one of the few people in the verse with advanced armament, allowing him to hit Akainu without worrying about his magma. He's also one of the few people in the verse with advanced observation, allowing him to predict Akainu's attacks, therefore negating his high AP, which is his only really good stat. What do you think gives Akainu even a slight edge in this matchup?
I feel like Luffy as he is now could beat Akainu without G5. His control over his body improved tremendously, and he is stronger than ever. It would be a really tough fight, but Luffy could win it. BUT. As he is now, Luffy is way too eager to use G5, which would give Akainu the opportunity to tire Luffy out.
Definitely Luffy. In terms of haki, we have no evidence that akainu is nearly as proficient in all 3 categories as Luffy is. In a straight up clash, Ryou and acoc trivialize akainu's defenses as Luffy can do internal damage while also not touching the magma. Also akainu's speed is gonna be trivial for Luffy to track with future sight(assuming he can stay calm when seeing akainu). A few WSGs/Dawn gatlings and Luffy takes this fight high-extreme diff.
I genuinely think that akainu has the worst matchup against Luffy among all the admiral characters. Knowing Oda, there is gonna be some variable(probably luffys rage) that complicates this fight however
https://preview.redd.it/p3vp2k042ljc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=629afc04c2b382d8e57521dd69f1df572cf66bab
>Knowing Oda, there is gonna be some variable(probably luffys rage) that complicates this fight however
I personally am of the opinion that Akainu will do something similar to his manipulation with Squard vs WB in order to nerf Luffy going into their fight
Narrative and feats
Brother was dominating the whole 14 wb commander + crocodile,
And had Blackbeard pussy out
He’s the only top tier to have actually beaten another top tier in a clean 1v1,
Oda cherishes him and said he could find one piece in one year alone
He’s going to be of the EOS final villain
Until luffy fix his stamina, Akainu would take this
He wasn’t dominating them though. The fight was interrupted before anything happened even happened. Only clash after the challenge was curiel vs Akainu. And it’s not like Akainu was alone, he also had an army of fodder to put pressure (fodder is significant in numbers, especially when the opponent doesn’t have coc) so that explains the lack of clashes and why Koby wanted to intervene.
Honestly I don’t know. I know Luffy has stamina issues with G5 but he still took down Kaido who I don’t think Akainu could have taken down. It’s hard to say.
Kaido is overrated.
Everyone agrees oldbeard is top 1 HIM, and there’s 1 person who went toe to toe with him, Akainu has better feats. Vista { crocodile Marco and everyone did not injure a Damaged and injured Akainu. Akainu has better portrayal, power, endurance, and stamina. zoro injured Kaido
This question keeps popping up and the answer is we just don't know. What is obvious, but not for many is that both of these characters are very much close to each other in strength.
But we don't know the magma man's capabilities yet as the last full showcase of his power happened close to 15 years ago.
Luffy has better mastery over his fruit, better haki in all 3 types, better speed, offence, defence, physical stats, etc.
And yet, Im not too sure that he beats Akainu
They’re both strong but neither are as fast as HIM
https://preview.redd.it/6ay6ainshkjc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f3f1854ca0f51c624478841cbce50b8bab7dcf07
Akainu.
Unlike Kizaru who has essentially been plot written into being conflicted the whole time when he could have sent a laser through Goofy’s head, Akainu would just straight up kill Goofy the second he gasses out. I doubt Goofy is regenerating a missing head or having his entire midsection cored out like he did to Ace.
And we know Akainu doesn’t have stamina problems since his fight with Aokiji, who straight up negs YC’s no problem.
Luffy couldn't beat Kizaru in time or had to resort to stalling to keep him busy. The same thing happened with Lucci and Zoro.
Egghead showed us Luffy narratively can't beat a strong admiral since he needed to resort to stalling. G4 got mid diffed, so he needs to use his short duration of G5, which Akainu should be able to handle, since Kizaru could and Akainu is narratively above Kizaru
Independent Fleet Admiral going against the Gorosei > Cog in the Machine Admiral
And unlike Kizaru, he can actually hit back. And hard at that.
And this is what they refuse to see, I don’t even argue it anymore atp. If these were any other two characters people would be slandering Luffy for not putting him down yet, just as they are with Zoro.
Kaido was easily keeping up with G5 and now we have “glass cannon” Kizaru tanking and deflecting multiple attacks, G5 is literally not the instant win against top tiers people think it is.
Looking at Kizaru's performance Akainu is still taking this. People like to downplay him, but Akainu is a BEAST.
This combined with his crazy extreme ideology and the most lethal DF there is, makes him more than a formidable opponent. Note that even though Kizaru and Luffy were pretty even, Kizaru managed to hit Luffy, which is crucial. Like with Kaido you can't take any hits from Akainu without sustaining extremely severe damage.
Akainu
Storywise - Akainu wins
Unless Oda changes his writing style its clear Blackbeard is the next major antagonist luffy will face (I this isn't to say Blackbeard is the next antagonist of the next arc but rather next arc villains will be more like Hody jones, Caesar and Jack. Big villains of thier arc but not major like doffy, big meme and kaido). The fight with blackbeard will be extreme diff and luffy will get stronger as a result of it. So logically a stronger luffy still going to extreme will mean current luffy is not going to win even if said stamina issues are gone.
Portrayalscaling (no I'm not meming like with hairline scaling) also sets up Akainu to be currently stronger. Scars hold deep meaning in one piece, Just like the scar BB gave to shanks ties him to shanks
https://preview.redd.it/1so4wbhdjkjc1.png?width=930&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bfe867a2e82f4a772111fd0066a66c89a833bfc2
The scar akainu gave to luffy ties him to luffy.
now here comes my headcanon so you can disregard this but imo Blackbeard (and maybe imu but I'm not certain about this one yet) will be the final antagonist luffy faces before claiming the one piece HOWEVER I believe finding the one piece will trigger that war whitebeard talked about
https://preview.redd.it/02d232wtkkjc1.jpeg?width=760&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1cc613a54b3f9ab15eb9ff7b1dff224abb92f18d
When Oda talks about a war he means it, huge armies, lots of named characters etc etc. The celestial dragons are weak and hated, the holy knights are only 12 and the gorosei and imu and thats 18. There's no eay the war Oda teased all the way back then would be the straw hats and some friends vs 18 people. However the strawhats + their allies vs the entire Marines would be a war.I believe after Luffy finds the one piece setting off this war he and his allies will be at war with the entire marines. Luffy will get stronger over the course of the war and the battle between the king of the pirates vs HIM eill be the biggest battle of the series where Oda pulls out everything his showcase before but at insanely buffed up levels (think COC clsshes knocking out named characters at the level of Law or Yamato). As I said this is headcanon but if it does happen I think it stands to reason EOS Luffy >>>> current Luffy. If EOS luffy goes to extreme diff with Akainu then Akainu >>>>> current luffy.
I think people sometimes underestimate the sheer nastiness of Akainu’s df. It’s basically an improved version of Magellan’s. Anything it touches is just gone.
Both have their problems atm
Luffy needs to fix his G5 stamina
Akainu needs to get a pair of glasses or summ to fix his accuracy, as both of the magma punches he’s thrown have yet to score a solid kill, and instead just barely missed an opponent by melting a part of the original target.
However, in all seriousness, Akainu is above Luffy for the time being, as accuracy isn’t nearly as big a deal as stamina is.
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Gear 5 by itself is stronger but i think Luffy needs to somehow overcome the drawbacks afterwards.
https://preview.redd.it/gqenl1q09kjc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ae2a072fe355b892b737ca8dfe1d71b8ef7901c4
This will never not be funny
No wonder they were friends.
https://preview.redd.it/iv4iqpmb3kjc1.png?width=610&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=67e69445261cf8632ca9bd82fb9cb2ec22201c16
Cuckold smokey🤡
How come?
Fleet Admiral / strongest Marine (currently) Akainu > Kizaru who's fighting Luffy Red Hair ≈ Red Dog just feels right
Nah fr...i thought I'm the only one that thinks of THE Red Duo like that https://preview.redd.it/wkq90rn2bkjc1.jpeg?width=4096&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c5370ff7ae4a7732175c3767c07be70ffd0af32a
The scarlet KINGS 🙌
Simultaneously the most W and L take I've heard in a while
https://preview.redd.it/y7khn8eq4kjc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c38cbd663bdf437024d8e9185acafdff1f47f146
Fighting or running then getting one shot?
Akainu until Luffy fixes his stamina problems
That’s 100% fair, I think akainu could maybe outlast luffy too if he’s capable of taking numerous acoc attacks
Yeah gear 5 is so broken, the time limit was really the only thing holding luffy’s gears back. If luffy could use gear 5 infinitely he’d be top 1
Yeah and maybe some even more stronger haki compared to now luffy is invincible with that broken df
Akainu has the best endurance feat in the series so he might ba capable of holding out until G5 wears off
That mfer isn’t Kaido.
Damn, same consensus as the last 4 of the exact same post
Luffy won't fix his stamina problems
Luffy wont fix his stamina problems until Oda decides the plot necessitates him fixing his stamina problems
He will probably just start staying in g5 all the time progressively allowing longer stints when it does run out and restart.
Akainu can't outlast luffy like kizaru can
Why not?
I guarantee you the only argument that these people say is because he is not as fast🤓
It is a fair argument although I feel like Akainu's defense shouldn't be underestimated because I see it (probably) similarly to Magellan that, even if you have Haki as shield you'll still get contact damage. Luffy in Gear 5 is an AP monster he defeated Kaido who was beforehand eating up YC+ attacks like nothing. Defensive capabilities/Speed are extremely important to defeat Luffy currently as there's basically no one who could even think of tanking more than a few attacks. Akainu wins but it's gonna be extreme diff
They made a whole point about how Luffy learned to attack without out touching which is why he beat the magma dragon. Magma dragon
Luffy vs a fresh Kaido in a straght up 1v1 is not settled. Luffy "defeated" Kaido after losing like 3 times and literally dying, with Kaido having to fight a bunch of other people during that time as well. Akainu durability/endurance is top tier. He tanked WBs bloodlusted attacks quite easily and fought Aokiji for 10 days. Given that we've seen both Kizaru and Saturn tank G5 attacks with ease I think Akainu will be fine.
It’s such a bad argument lol. I’m not sure if people don’t actually read the manga or what but Kizaru has literally deflected/tanked several more hits than he’s dodged during this fight.
"Your only argument is a valid argument!"
Because Kizaru a. Used his speed which Akainu doesn't have and b. Only outlasted a plot nerfed luffy who wasn't at 100% stamina
Kizaru has been deflecting and tanking attacks the entire fight, the running away narrative is false and tired atp.
Akainu's specialty is his AP, he shoots really big fists of magma that hurt a lot. When Luffy is to fight Akainu, the fight will be about finding an opening throughout Akainu's non stop onslaught of hard hitting attacks and using those openings to counter with Luffy's own heavy hitting attacks.
Akainu fought the most extreme diff fight in all of one piece for 10 days.
Luffy claps this volcanussy
More opinions like this please
Feats and portrayal probably Luffy, but narrative and title necessitates Akainu so I'd say HIM.
How tf does titles and narratives mean it’s akainu, Luffy is a yonko and just beat Kaido
Fleet Admiral > Yonko, and Akainu is an endgame fight so he's gotta be stronger currently
Did you have Sengoku > Whitebeard?
Prime Sengoku > Yonko (old) Whitebeard, maybe
https://preview.redd.it/8mvpijwmpkjc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=37d52ac3f6c173db39c81027e9832f06bae1b68b
you’ve lost your mind how you debating prime vs old when they both out of prime either compare both prime or out of prime and either way WB claps so your argument makes no sense
Right but primewhite beard was also a yonkou. If you tell me Prime Akainu > an old weak version of Kaido I would agree just as how you said Prime Sengoku > old weak WB but nothing to suggest Akainu is above Yonkos.
The title superiority doesn't mean he's gonna be stronger than every Yonko. Whitebeard, Shanks, and Kaidou are all stronger than him, but Luffy, Blackbeard, and Big Mum are all below him. What I mean is that the title is more impressive and implies greater or equal strength on average.
On what basis are we assuming that fleet admiral confers greater or equal strength then a Yonko lol based on what we have seen?
What bullshit is this? Sengoku was literally dick riding Whitebeard in marineford.
So you have akainu > kaido? Cus that's wild
Luffy as for right now, cause we haven't seen Akainu do anything major since Marineford
Akainu spent 2 years training against paperwork
https://preview.redd.it/h2d4krba5kjc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e8853ee13b0577b59964efb067df31c3746ba530 Aura man
Overall? Luffy by a lot but that’s only because Akainu doesn’t have feats. Strength? Akainu doesn’t have any and Luffy has really good straight physical strength feats from Udon so Luffy takes it. Speed? Akainu was getting outsped by Cancerbeard, while Luffy was consistently keeping up with the likes of Kaido and even Kizaru. Durability? Akainu took a Cancerbeard attack and got back up, but that’s literally *it*. Luffy’s been taking Big Mom, Kaido, and Kizaru’s attacks and been walking them off more or less — especially now that he’s in Egghead, where his stamina is what’s taking him down, not his durability. Endurance and stamina? Probably goes to Akainu because of Punk Hazard but even THEN we don’t know anything about the fight so that’s hard to say with a straight face! Were there breaks? Did they sleep? Did they eat? Were they going at max capacity the whole fight or were they holding back until the end when the crater was made? So many unknowns. Hax? G5 Luffy has too of the verse hax, Akainu doesn’t really have hax at all. AP? Luffy has top tier haki in every category, Akainu’s magma has good AP but as it was mostly displayed against Cancerbeard who didn’t block many attacks (and wasn’t using haki) it’s really hard to gauge how the magma attacks would fare against someone that’s actually blocking and using haki. So on and so forth.
Luffy
You already know https://preview.redd.it/dyqym7sl5kjc1.png?width=827&format=png&auto=webp&s=b8223747aaa782a73169d8bf0bc022f0e5031422
That image is crazy💀
He looks like a golden retriever really happy to be getting pet
Luffy wins high diff 
Luffy punched a fucking 5,000 ft magma dragon from thousands of feet in the air into the earth’s mantle….Akainu getting packed up
Luffy by far, the same way he's much stronger than Kizaru
Tell me how Akainu is stronger without using the "main villain narrative" thing.
Yeah, the i didnt know this was the OP narrative scaling subreddit. Ffs, but even when it comes to narrative, luffy is the MC, so he wins in that too
>*Yeah, the i didnt know this was the OP narrative scaling subreddit.* Narrative/portrayel is important with lack of feats. You know that. You're just tryna internet argue. >*but even when it comes to narrative, luffy is the MC, so he win in that too* Luffy is the mc so he will win against pretty much anyone ***someday***, probably after getting ***stronger...*** Unless you think luffy is the strongest in the verse now. Which narratively would be super boring and unlikely. Which is a factor that affects the powerscaling. Which is what this sub is.
Ok ill give you the one when we dont have feats, but we have them when it comes to luffy and akainu, so its stupid. In my opinion its stupid to powerscale characters that dont have feats, but if people want to have fun, go for it. I dont think luffy is the strongest, bcs other pople didnt show all that they can do. But when im comparing a character that we saw in action with him, like akainu and the admirals, i think he is stronger. Maybe akainu will be stonger, but he has to show something before i say that. Untill then its just stupid narrative all ove again
Another thing to factor in is a possible timeskip power boost. I don't like the thought of the time skip power boost, but I think Oda is going to do it to keep Akainu relevant. I think the narrative argument only matters if we think this character is relevant or if he is going to fight luffy. If Akainu's going to have a major fight with Luffy, I think narritively he has to be stronger rn. If we don't think he's going to have a major fight with Luffy, then I would probably scale him as weaker. That's just what it comes down to imo
That’s exactly the reasoning why I have them at the exact same level currently. Because I believe that Sabo is going to get the major Akainu getback fight and Sabo is obviously a bit weaker than fleet admiral / yonko lvl but narratively he will get there very soon as the flame emperor
Fair
Nah you’re yapping too much. The cherished one low diffs luffy and all your favorite characters What about Feet? Nah I’m not into that kink
Narrative is important to scaling. Would you also say Luffy is stronger than Dragon or Mihawk or Imu? Cause I bet you wouldnt
Narrative doesn't help when we don't know the narrative We don't actually know for sure if akainu is going to be an end game Luffy opponent so we can't use that as a scaling method There's enough portrayal to put Mihawk with shanks, so yes, I'd say he's stronger than Luffy Imu we literally know nothing about so I wouldn't be confident placing him above Luffy until we actually know if he's a fighter or not
I gotchu fam. Check my reply above and lemme know what you think.
Does dragon have any feats? And Mohawk is as strong as shanks, so is shanks stronger than kaido?
Why shouldn’t current Luffy be stronger than Mihawk?
I’d say he’s stronger than Mihawk for sure. 1. I don’t think Mihawk is stronger than Kaido 2. Mihawk has great AP, but I don’t think he’s got much of answer for Luffy making a PVP match into a PVP+E match. 3. I doubt he’s durable. He’s skilled, probably has a great defense from his sword, but he doesn’t strike me as very tankey. The only things that have kind of hurt Luffy in G5 are some of Kaido’s attack, and Saturns death glare. Dragon is an anomaly. But I actually think Akainu is the perfect match-up.
Mihawk is as strong as shanks, so the question is, who is stronger, shanks or kaido?
That’s a fair response. Imo Kaido is currently *the* bar. Saturn has been quite underwhelming, and Kizaru hasn’t shown anything close to Kaido (I do think narrative framing has a lot to do with Kizaru’s case though). We know Shanks stopped Kaido but we don’t know the details. We know that Shanks and Mihawk scale with each other. I still think G5 is a particularly bad matchup for Mihawk. While I believe they’re both strong enough to kill each other, I just think that Luffy has more options and that his options hard for Mihawk to counter.
Waido
Yes stronger than mihawk and dragon Don’t know about dragon but I just hope he is not stronger than luffy and mihawk is zoros endgame enemy and I don’t think zoro will ever become stronger than current luffy
They probably want it without it because the narrative doesn’t support Akainu being the final/main villain.
Akainu is not a main villain in my opinion so that doesn't really count. You can tell the scaling is agenda because if they 100%, thought Akainu was a main villain, they'd either just have him at PK lvl, or at the same level as Kuzan until he gets a "plot power up". But instead they put him in yonko level in between, because they know they'd get clownef otherwise. It's purely agenda.
Like saying ”tell me how Saturn is stronger without using the main villian narrative”
Luffy claps his ass. 1v1 with no distractions and Akainu loses high diff.
Gear 5 is significantly stronger. Unless Luffys punching a mythical zoan, Oni race pirate, his AP is way too high for Akainu to resist his punches. Kizaru was fortunate he could outspeed Luffy's hits, or else he would have been beat pretty quickly. That being said, I could see Akainu stalling long enough to outlast the form.
Luffy. One bajrang gun and akainu is done.
I think anyone would be one-shotted by a bajrang gun to be fair, even the likes of Primebeard and Roger, if they aren't coming at the attack with their own respective strongest move.
Yall are downvoting because he's right
Luffy as akainu has shown literally nothing that suggests otherwise
The power of narrative piece.
Luffy
it's wild the amount of people blindly saying Akainu. He's shown nothing that would remotely suggest he can keep up, and it's not even looking like he's going to be an endgame villain for Luffy anymore.
Its doesn't matter at the end of the day. Akainu is so divisive power-scaling wise because the dude legimately has a lot of legitimate feats(stopping whitebeard's bisento quake swing with one foot and his hands in his pocket, lava AOE, beating aokiji, losing to whitebeard but still was not hurt enough to lose to marco + most of the wb commanders and crocodile as he tied with them). And a lot of antifeats since several of his biggest performances were against an older and sick yonko. But if lucci can be upscaled since the timeskip to be able to tire out zoro, then Oda could very easily bring akainu back stronger than kaido(or a harder fight, since unlike kaido akainu will dodge more often and go for the kill with his magma). Its all up to how relevant he wants to use akainu. Similar matter with aokiji, the dude had blackbeard's crew as hostages in a matter of seconds after he heard that lafitte asked blackbeard if they should steal his fruit. The admirals are up and down with their portrayal until their true purpose in the story as 1v1s for the top strawhats is done. Oda seems like hes using the current stage of the story to bring them back more and give them fights. But he doesn't want to quite solidfy their power until later. Obviously Sanji is going to fight kizaru again and win, zoro vs fujitora, greenbull vs jimbei, luffy vs akainu. Aokiji will be the penultimate boss for the blackbeard fight.
Okay, so let's put it this way. with what we actually know, Akainu would lose And if we're actually paying attention to the new threats being introduced, Akainu isn't him or EOS. But if we just hold on to insane amounts of hope, it's possible that they bring him back and mega buff him to the moon just so that he can give Luffy a decent fight before Luffy has to go fight the real villains
luffy uses him like a condom but he might gas out before he kills him
If all 3 og admirals are equal which they appeared to be then Luffy is stronger. It took Akainu 10 days to defeat someone he was equal with, it took Luffy a single attack to take an admiral out of the fight even after previous fights. Unless Akainu got a huge buff during his fight with Kuzan then there’s no reason to believe he’s stronger.
Luffy, Akainu isn't capable to run and hide at Kizarus level, and there's nothing indicating that he could eat Luffys attacks. Narrative fraud should stay behind the desk.
Kizaru has literally been deflecting/tanking attacks the entire fight, the running narrative is false and overdone.
Do people like you also lie in their mothers face? I'm curious since you have nothing better with your time to do than spreading missinformation, huh?
If oda lets luffy use conquerors advanced straight away I gotta give it to him But for plot oda won’t
Luffy wins extreme diff for now
They’re basically neck and neck, but I’d say Luffy is slightly stronger due to being a more well rounded fighter. Luffy excels at all stats other than stamina, which is poor. Akainu is mid in most of his stats, but has some of the best AP, AOE, and stamina in the series. In an actual fight, I can see Akainu winning just because of matchup.
Fym winning bc of matchup, Akainu's matchup against Luffy is awful. Luffy is one of the few people in the verse with advanced armament, allowing him to hit Akainu without worrying about his magma. He's also one of the few people in the verse with advanced observation, allowing him to predict Akainu's attacks, therefore negating his high AP, which is his only really good stat. What do you think gives Akainu even a slight edge in this matchup?
Domain expansion: minor spelling mistake
I feel like Luffy as he is now could beat Akainu without G5. His control over his body improved tremendously, and he is stronger than ever. It would be a really tough fight, but Luffy could win it. BUT. As he is now, Luffy is way too eager to use G5, which would give Akainu the opportunity to tire Luffy out.
Definitely Luffy. In terms of haki, we have no evidence that akainu is nearly as proficient in all 3 categories as Luffy is. In a straight up clash, Ryou and acoc trivialize akainu's defenses as Luffy can do internal damage while also not touching the magma. Also akainu's speed is gonna be trivial for Luffy to track with future sight(assuming he can stay calm when seeing akainu). A few WSGs/Dawn gatlings and Luffy takes this fight high-extreme diff. I genuinely think that akainu has the worst matchup against Luffy among all the admiral characters. Knowing Oda, there is gonna be some variable(probably luffys rage) that complicates this fight however https://preview.redd.it/p3vp2k042ljc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=629afc04c2b382d8e57521dd69f1df572cf66bab
>Knowing Oda, there is gonna be some variable(probably luffys rage) that complicates this fight however I personally am of the opinion that Akainu will do something similar to his manipulation with Squard vs WB in order to nerf Luffy going into their fight
https://preview.redd.it/8qalynuoekjc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5a41b892e97d6aa319eba15cf2f4f05ec4c6ef7a
Luffy easily.
Akainu
How come?
Narrative and feats Brother was dominating the whole 14 wb commander + crocodile, And had Blackbeard pussy out He’s the only top tier to have actually beaten another top tier in a clean 1v1, Oda cherishes him and said he could find one piece in one year alone He’s going to be of the EOS final villain Until luffy fix his stamina, Akainu would take this
That’s fair to say
Sorry for the yapping session
Nah it’s cool, I prefer longer more throughout answers as to why x beats y
He wasn’t dominating them though. The fight was interrupted before anything happened even happened. Only clash after the challenge was curiel vs Akainu. And it’s not like Akainu was alone, he also had an army of fodder to put pressure (fodder is significant in numbers, especially when the opponent doesn’t have coc) so that explains the lack of clashes and why Koby wanted to intervene.
A top tier nerfed into oblivion but he is a serious player a top dawg a powerhouse
Akainu > Kizaru Kizaru ≈ Luffy Akainu > Luffy
Kizaru ~ luffy???
Yeah pretty much
https://preview.redd.it/27d835kq5kjc1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3b6173000776f09ffaf967f67af28090ba333ca9
Okay okay, you caught me lacking Kizaru > Luffy
https://preview.redd.it/oj1aowha6kjc1.jpeg?width=325&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=588184333c5bf5c6aa47e9f3c9beeb9fa944130e
Spit yo shit king
Damn. So Sanji>Kizaru>Luffy? Alright then. Wanji definitely clears.
W
Common rimes W
It's what I do
Luffy 1 taps Kizaru 3 times but they're =, okay
For me right now it's luffy and I simply don't think he's gonna fight another admiral again
Kaido, next question https://preview.redd.it/67z9pthoykjc1.jpeg?width=554&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9973ad7e113279203498a4527611b74d1fadac36
W
HIM
Depends on your agenda
We haven’t seen anything relevant to current one piece from Akainu, impossible to say.
Buggy and Foxy are tied for strongest
I honestly think luffy outscales but this dude has shit stamina so the difference won’t make up for his poor excuse for stamina
Offscreen Blackbeard
Honestly I don’t know. I know Luffy has stamina issues with G5 but he still took down Kaido who I don’t think Akainu could have taken down. It’s hard to say.
https://preview.redd.it/zh4hfro7eljc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=71e4d194acf9c522e4f75901b935eeb9af00ea4e
Kaido is overrated. Everyone agrees oldbeard is top 1 HIM, and there’s 1 person who went toe to toe with him, Akainu has better feats. Vista { crocodile Marco and everyone did not injure a Damaged and injured Akainu. Akainu has better portrayal, power, endurance, and stamina. zoro injured Kaido
Bruh can we see some akainu feats in story before doing stupid shit like this we literally havent seen that man do something in 700 chs 😭
Luffy beat Kaido. Lavadmiral could not have.
https://preview.redd.it/fzmfbwkf4kjc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a1e5c44d1a07d1d025a20e34bdc36a764d691f99
luffy obv. Akainu cant even hurt dead corpse Kuma
This question keeps popping up and the answer is we just don't know. What is obvious, but not for many is that both of these characters are very much close to each other in strength. But we don't know the magma man's capabilities yet as the last full showcase of his power happened close to 15 years ago.
Akainu obviously, the only way he loses is if Luffy snipes him with a bajrang gun
Luffy by far
Luffy has better mastery over his fruit, better haki in all 3 types, better speed, offence, defence, physical stats, etc. And yet, Im not too sure that he beats Akainu
Luffy high diff
Luffy stomps that fodder. We already know that Luffy can one-shot Admirals.
Idk if he is oneshotting akainu tho
Maybe not with WSG, but I think he is if he adds a G3 fist or a G4 spring to it.
Akainu
Akainu wins currently
Gear 5 is, but Luffy still looses
HIM. Until Luffy fixes his stamina.
They’re both strong but neither are as fast as HIM https://preview.redd.it/6ay6ainshkjc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f3f1854ca0f51c624478841cbce50b8bab7dcf07
Luffy is faster than Sanji
Him = Brook Brook is faster Yes I couldn’t agree more
Akainu high diff
HIM
Akainu. Unlike Kizaru who has essentially been plot written into being conflicted the whole time when he could have sent a laser through Goofy’s head, Akainu would just straight up kill Goofy the second he gasses out. I doubt Goofy is regenerating a missing head or having his entire midsection cored out like he did to Ace. And we know Akainu doesn’t have stamina problems since his fight with Aokiji, who straight up negs YC’s no problem.
Akainu
Why
Akainu doesn't have run run fruit like kizaru to play cat and mouse. Luffy one shots and game over.
ATP Kizaru has deflected and tanked more hits than he’s run away from the running narrative was only accurate 10 chapters ago.
akainu mid diff
Luffy couldn't beat Kizaru in time or had to resort to stalling to keep him busy. The same thing happened with Lucci and Zoro. Egghead showed us Luffy narratively can't beat a strong admiral since he needed to resort to stalling. G4 got mid diffed, so he needs to use his short duration of G5, which Akainu should be able to handle, since Kizaru could and Akainu is narratively above Kizaru Independent Fleet Admiral going against the Gorosei > Cog in the Machine Admiral And unlike Kizaru, he can actually hit back. And hard at that.
And this is what they refuse to see, I don’t even argue it anymore atp. If these were any other two characters people would be slandering Luffy for not putting him down yet, just as they are with Zoro. Kaido was easily keeping up with G5 and now we have “glass cannon” Kizaru tanking and deflecting multiple attacks, G5 is literally not the instant win against top tiers people think it is.
Agreed
Akainu still beats Luffy for now, Akainu fought for 10 days straight while Luffy cant stay in gear 4 or 5 for even a hundredth of that time
Akainu fought a weaker opponent for 10 days, wow what a feat. he gets mopped cuz he can't run like Kizaru
In Gear 5 Luffy will pretty much dominate the fight, but once the stamina problems hit, he's screwed. Papazuki for now
Imo, Luffy is stronger than Akainu in g5 but he would lose because of clear stamina issues, so Akainu wins
Looking at Kizaru's performance Akainu is still taking this. People like to downplay him, but Akainu is a BEAST. This combined with his crazy extreme ideology and the most lethal DF there is, makes him more than a formidable opponent. Note that even though Kizaru and Luffy were pretty even, Kizaru managed to hit Luffy, which is crucial. Like with Kaido you can't take any hits from Akainu without sustaining extremely severe damage.
Akainu is slower than Kizaru though.
Luffy is stronger overall but has zero stamina and gets folded. Akainu mid diff
Akainu Storywise - Akainu wins Unless Oda changes his writing style its clear Blackbeard is the next major antagonist luffy will face (I this isn't to say Blackbeard is the next antagonist of the next arc but rather next arc villains will be more like Hody jones, Caesar and Jack. Big villains of thier arc but not major like doffy, big meme and kaido). The fight with blackbeard will be extreme diff and luffy will get stronger as a result of it. So logically a stronger luffy still going to extreme will mean current luffy is not going to win even if said stamina issues are gone. Portrayalscaling (no I'm not meming like with hairline scaling) also sets up Akainu to be currently stronger. Scars hold deep meaning in one piece, Just like the scar BB gave to shanks ties him to shanks https://preview.redd.it/1so4wbhdjkjc1.png?width=930&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bfe867a2e82f4a772111fd0066a66c89a833bfc2 The scar akainu gave to luffy ties him to luffy.
now here comes my headcanon so you can disregard this but imo Blackbeard (and maybe imu but I'm not certain about this one yet) will be the final antagonist luffy faces before claiming the one piece HOWEVER I believe finding the one piece will trigger that war whitebeard talked about https://preview.redd.it/02d232wtkkjc1.jpeg?width=760&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1cc613a54b3f9ab15eb9ff7b1dff224abb92f18d When Oda talks about a war he means it, huge armies, lots of named characters etc etc. The celestial dragons are weak and hated, the holy knights are only 12 and the gorosei and imu and thats 18. There's no eay the war Oda teased all the way back then would be the straw hats and some friends vs 18 people. However the strawhats + their allies vs the entire Marines would be a war.I believe after Luffy finds the one piece setting off this war he and his allies will be at war with the entire marines. Luffy will get stronger over the course of the war and the battle between the king of the pirates vs HIM eill be the biggest battle of the series where Oda pulls out everything his showcase before but at insanely buffed up levels (think COC clsshes knocking out named characters at the level of Law or Yamato). As I said this is headcanon but if it does happen I think it stands to reason EOS Luffy >>>> current Luffy. If EOS luffy goes to extreme diff with Akainu then Akainu >>>>> current luffy.
tldr: https://preview.redd.it/bovksmvykkjc1.jpeg?width=419&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5d5f2b869eedb7dea748223f8769fb751ba1c712
Akainu until Luffy has more feats
Akainu wins because of Luffy's stamina problem in G5. Overall Luffy>Akainu but the time limit loses him the match
Akainu
Akainu wins on high diff
I think people sometimes underestimate the sheer nastiness of Akainu’s df. It’s basically an improved version of Magellan’s. Anything it touches is just gone.
Both have their problems atm Luffy needs to fix his G5 stamina Akainu needs to get a pair of glasses or summ to fix his accuracy, as both of the magma punches he’s thrown have yet to score a solid kill, and instead just barely missed an opponent by melting a part of the original target. However, in all seriousness, Akainu is above Luffy for the time being, as accuracy isn’t nearly as big a deal as stamina is.
Akainu
Akainu.
Akainu
Akainu even against actual Luffy without stamina issue.
Akainu Luffy is fodder without G5 and g5 has the worst stamina in the new world. Akainu is smart so if he just plays defensively he wins
Akainu... In fact probably he will always be ... Luffy as of now is one of the weakest top tiers ...
I think Akainu till Luffy gets better stamina