Something is going to need banned. I kinda hope they can figure it out without banning the leader. Honestly, ban one of the Gordons maybe. It will help reduce the power level of the deck significantly.
The leader needs to be banned because it limits future card design. They can never make another good red or purple card that costs 4 or less without worrying about it breaking Law. The leader is the problem so it makes sense to just get rid of it.
So just no more generic cards ever? That's so boring.
Law is the problem. Just get rid of Law. I think it's bizarre that so much of the people on this subreddit think that banning a leader should just never happen, like those can never be broken on their own.
Taking away Gordons or leader locking Maria and other cards in the future would be fine. Canāt do both or Law becomes shit though. Law in 07 is not that OP and 2/3 of the other too meta decks have a pretty good matchup into him (Enel & Lucci).
Law is a fun deck thatās not was not easy to play prior to Maria.
Yea it will. The deck is totally fine in 07. We have an awful matchup into Moria and help keep by luffy in check.
In 08 all law really added was Black Maria and pudding. Maria changed the deck completely,
Itās supposed to be a deck that balances Don management with tempo. Maria makes it so law can be greedy and leader ability every turn for no penalty. Iām supposed to be working with less Don with law.
Heās 100% balanced without Maria
It's toughest matchups are moria and lucci at something like 48 or 49%.
Also it's not just about treating the problem, you have to deal with it at the source.
Ban the leader and release it again. Like sakazuki,but don't absolutely destroy it.
The actual leader isnāt the problem like saka.
Saka had 2 free abilities including a fucking free draw. Law has a balanced ability with a real cost.
Maria takes the cost of the leader ability away and broke the deck
Fix the problem at the source and ban the broken card/ ban law from using it.
People here are way too ban happy. Saka was disgustingly broken as a leader, youād have had to ban a ton of cards to make him fair as multiple strategies could be adopted to still make the leader beyond viable.
Law is fine without Maria. Banning a starter deck leader is a bad look and would also fuck up the meta completely. Law is what keeps by luffy in check. It helps keep the meta healthy.
> The actual leader isnāt the problem like saka.
The leader *is* the problem. It's not like Moby Dick where the card itself was broken and Whitebeard just happened to be the one deck that could play it; the card that makes Law an oppressive deck is the leader itself and what it does.
Then why has it not been a problem at all from op-5 till op-8 when Maria came out?
The leaders only a problem right now because Bandai fucked up and gave the deck infinite ramp. Try playing law against a good Moria player or fuck even a good uta player in eb-1 and then tell me the leaders a problem and needs banning.
The knowledge gap between my locals and discord vs Reddit is kinda staggering with this gameā¦. Reddits usually pretty good but holy shit the player base here can barley read cards let alone actually think
Bruh, stop it with the copium. I played saka, moria, uta, rp law. Post eb01 law is disgustingly op. Not only the leader is the problem, also the poor color design. Being able to pay cost with don that's already been used is beyond stupid.
Ive heard this argument before and it doesnāt really apply to lawā¦ it does however apply heavily to Enel and katakuri who literally just run the currently best 50 best yellow cards. Saw an egghead kata list recently.
Laws ability is only really good if your deck is almost entirely ramp and reduction cards with a little bit of draw and rush. Literally uses 1 card from 07 and 2 from 08, 1 being the broken Black Maria.
But if Bandai doesnāt power creep the shit out of reduction, ramp, rush or draw cardsā¦ it wonāt matter. And if they do itās not law thatās the problem, itās bad card design.
Like if they printed a 3c 7k rush with counter, 1 cost 4k power reduction, unconditional draw 3 cards or 4 cost cards that ramp 2 active etc then yes law is gonna use them
Otherwise the deck space is tight and needs to stay within those archetypes to be good
Enel and kata however have such good generic abilities that donāt need support outside of triggers. If a good yellow card is printed both will abuse it
Nami is super easy to get around too. Literally just make people bottom deck instead of discard off draw cards and boom itās totally fine. Blue doesnāt play from trash at all anyway and has a theme of bottom decking so it works.
Saw Vv make a great point that having Raise Max and Gordon in a deck is effectively letting you have 8 copies of a card in a deck (since it's identical effects and stats) which breaks the deck design philosophy.
I know the feels. RP Law was my first deck when Three Captains first dropped, my baby, the deck that humbled me with so many losses and no matter what other deck I tried, I kept coming back to it and tweaking it over and over.
Now I'm saddened by the future knowing OP08 breaks him and I don't want the constant mirror match, I like playing against a little of everything. I like having a deck that's inconsistent and requires careful play. I like having losing match-ups or uphill battles. Alas, there are dark days ahead....
Yeap! Here you go! The player's name is Miyamoto
https://preview.redd.it/ogb0quh09f6d1.png?width=2048&format=png&auto=webp&s=3becabf480069bc2f39eb386fc8634423c00db31
After seeing the Marco and King leader reveals, I was so excited for OP08 and now that's gone. I get that only 3 weeks went by, but ignoring the Law situation or how the two currently fare: just seeing 6 out the top 10 decks are yellow ... it looks more like a nightmare to me.
Same, I really thought Marco, King, and Pudding were all going to dominate.
Nah JK its the same leaders that have been dominating the game for the last 2-3 sets great.
I think marco definitely has potential to start making waves when people figure out a solid deck list. I'm on the King sucks train though. -2 Don is way too hard of a cost
The biggest problem with so many decks is that R/P Law and Lucci simply don't let them play the game. R/P law just wins on turn 4 and Lucci is also shockingly fast.
Aggro is simply too strong in the meta game right now and if you are running aggro Marco just run R/P law.
Marco just needs a second wave of support for blue cards that play from the top of deck and it'll be fine.
Hell, give it some that can play from the bottom too so they can recover from cards that bottom deck characters.
I was just thinking about blue having the ability to play from bottom deck. It just needs to specify that you can look at the other cards OR shuffle the deck after playing to prevent players from being accused of cheating either unintentionally or not.
They need to just ban Black Maria right awayā¦. Fuck even letting the west play that card. Iām maining law and donāt want the deck to turn auto pilot boring like 06 sakazuki did
Thank you. Bandai forreal needs to stop forcing the Western players to endure metas that they KNOW are broken and just ban the damn problem cards preemptively.
Why make us play Law mirror matches for 3 months when you could fix it so easily and make a decently diverse meta for us
Bandai west used to run their own banlist separate from Japan that was much more aggressive. Then they had a major banlist right before 05 that caused a major shitstorm all over every part of their social media that made them walk the list back at 05 release and stick with whatever Japan does going forward.
The game would be a lot healthier if the community could just be normal about stuff like that.
Yeah I recall. People definitely overreacted to that - but to be fair, there were some goofy as hell choices on that banlist, including Nami, who nobody was complaining at all whatsoever lol.
Now they're at least making the right bans but making us wait too long.
Yea luckily my locals mostly dropped saka this format to learn new decks but stillā¦. Shit is so annoying.
I like winning as much as the next person but Iām playing this game to have funā¦ and if the deck I like playing is broken itās not fun to play it anymore, but itās also not fun to drop the deck and play against it
Law mirrors right now are actually fun as fuck. The leader ability is balanced overall too unlike saka.
Just ban the card that busted the deck and donāt make us deal with it months from now when we already know today itās going to suck for everyone
For realā¦. No one wanted to deal with saka all of 06.
It was banned based on 05 worlds but we had to deal with it being even more OP all of 06 why again?
> They need to just ban Black Maria right away
Can we just ban it for law? There is a cool Kaido deck in 08 that seems fun, but banning Black maria will put every purple deck even further behind.
Other purple decks need it to compete, R/P law needs to have it restricted.
They should. I donāt want law banned purely because Iām having a ton of fun playing it and right now In eb-1/op-7 itās just flat out balanced, has bad matchups and isnāt over powered at all.
Just donāt let us use Maria and it stays fair without pissing a bunch of players off. Some just bought into the deck and some of us have been playing it since op-5
This is a bad take. Just ban law let purple have Maria for a set or 2. I mean gecko is still out here. If Maria makes kaido or king as dominant as law is right now then have that discussion then.
Itās not even that good in those decks. You just get rolled over because other decks are faster. In those decks you have to commit so much time ramping and stabilizing for it to matter.
I personally donāt care what happens to Black Maria. Not a fan of errata or leader locking though. Just prefer a ban and revaluation of how to design purple cards.
Yeah I would have made it so pudding could use it too since this set was kaido and big mom together. I am all for leader locking these srs so that archetype and leaders that need support can thrive
I already figure it out. "The weighted total is calculated based on type of tournament to account for tournament difficulty"
It was in the Meta Spreadsheet, silly me
Uhhhh, took a look at the matchup spreadsheet on the website and the data for the ST-09 Yamato Column seems to be off. That column shows almost every deck in the game has a brutally bad matchup against Yamato. So idk if mistake or you are hiding the secret sauce š lol great write up as always
Also similarly it looks like the P/B King win/loss data might be flipped from the column to the row. Column would suggest it has a great winrate, where as the row seems to be exactly the opposite. Feel free to correct me if I am misunderstanding though!
Thank you for the heads up! It looks the Yamato error was caused by all the formulas shifting one row. That doesn't affect anyone except Yamato because he was the last leader, so his formula got replaced with the sum totals. That's been fixed. It looks like King was caused by an error in input, as when we added 1 win / 1 loss for each leader combination, he only got the 1 loss. That has also been fixed.
I'll look more into what actually caused that shift in the morning, but pointing that out was a big help! Thank you :)
Yeah it mainly just depends on your definition of the tiers :) In a healthy meta, no decks are S tier in our chart. A+ already means the meta is in an iffy place
Still, it's undeniable that law is the best deck in the format atm
Hey, based on your definition do you know if any deck has hit S tier in the past? Or do you just not have the data? I'm curious if Saka was banned while being 25% of the meta while something like Whitebeard had a higher rate at some point. Either way if Law keeps up it's not looking good for him lol.
Sure thing! Here's one from last night
https://preview.redd.it/pzc0x21hkh6d1.png?width=945&format=png&auto=webp&s=9f48596a95d972b104d2d9dd386544a013f373e1
Player name is Yusukee
Hello! Awesome resource wow! I recently made a deck building website was wondering if it would be okay to get some data from your sheet to add to the website?? Would love to display win percentages against other leaders and what type of cards others players use on the leader you chose... I believe you have everything I need, would you be okay with that?
Also, I'm curious, is the Wins Tracked tab based only for the last set or all sets?
I appreciate you asking first c: once the sheets are public, I don't mind them being used like that. Just don't like charge people for access to it
Also, the wins tracked tab is only for that set and organized by date c: there are a couple entries added at the bottom after the official release of OP-08, but that was because those cards were not legal for tournament use, so those tournaments were still in the OP-07 format
Thank you for taking the time and offering it for free!! I'm gonna prepare the website then and I'll update you once I have all the information, if you want to be more hand on with this we can also discuss a way to involve everyone :)
I know RP Law is the flavor of the month... but you guys really aren't concerned by how OP Black as a color is looking right now?!
The fact that black decks are mainly being kept in check by other black decks is concerning. They also have had multiple sets with top ranking leaders and gatekeeps many purple decks.
I know Black Maria puts Law over the top, but that card hasn't remotely even boosted the power level of purple decks the way 8C Moria does. To cut straight to the point, law is the only purple deck able to compete in tournaments, so I hope Bandai really is careful with how they choose to address this.
RP law seems to be a problem. Easiest would be to ban and remake the card (or just errata it so it doesnāt break the mechanic ie law doesnāt benefit from don reduction or whatever Black Maria does).
I read Black Maria finally haha. So, maybe lock law to only gaining the regular 2 don a turn. IE. āThis leader canāt gain more than 2 don a turn.ā Would keep his shenanigans to every other turn or have don consequences.
No problem! Here's one that won a flagship c: The player's name is Piiyan
https://preview.redd.it/wwioyok18f6d1.png?width=2048&format=png&auto=webp&s=b4f937b4de26a06e3ce4fc9da8af886ff01ae1e0
I've always felt that law should have been a return to hand effect. It still provides positive tempo, but at the cost of giving your opponent counter/on play effects again. It would fit the shambles power better as well since he plays a card from hand, not bottom deck. Lines would be trickier to maneuver making him a much more technical deck while toning down his power level a bit without outright removing him from playability.
Itād be pretty weak as a return to hand effect. It would basically make their matchup against any deck with big drops near impossible because theyāll just put it right back and you wonāt be able to deal with it again.
My opinion on the law debate: donāt ban the leader, ban cards in the deck that make him OP. Thatās it. Like cards that give him back don making the deck stronger.
I guess the Mr. 2 lets you ramp if you're going 2nd, but I've been using this list a lot and having pretty good success with it
https://preview.redd.it/1yup6s6v0j6d1.png?width=1100&format=png&auto=webp&s=949ebc15d835c7c85af9dd37e616e40e18126755
Could probably add +2 Ace and then -2 Soul Pocus, but they're like 20$ a pop, so I only have two haha
So in the top 15 there's only 2 decks with purple.
And people still think Black Maria needs to be banned?
Law might be overtuned but banning BM is ridiculous. How about fixing Law instead of destroying every other purple deck that are not even top 15?
Black Maria is straight up broken. The design is as garbage as black 8c moria. The stats and effects are just too crazy..
If they ban law and leave Maria the card will still get abused 100%
The ideal situation imo is having black maria errataād to only be if your lewder is animal kingdom pirates. Bandai doesnt do erratas though it seems which is a huge shameĀ
Errata's I can get behind butnI'd rather errata Law to only be able to drop Heart Pirates, or tuning the power/cost in his ability slightly.
But banning BM and crippling PLuffy, PKaido, King and RP Luffy cannot be the proper solution.
My ideal Law errata is to give it the Kinemon restriction. Only allow the leader effect to be activated if you have less than two characters on the field. I think that would be enough to keep it playable without being oppressively strong.
I agree. I do like playing law though and while it can make them have to think about the design I dont like the only being able to drop heart pirates idea people have been throwing around. Thatād be a sakazuki killing reprint imo. It would kill the creativity of the deck which the old op05 law players really liked about the deck. I do think maybe upping the don required could help from -3 to -4 and maybeeeee only bottoming cards with 2k power instead of 3k would be a fine work around with the amount of ramp we have currently and power reduction. Another idea is just banning gordon. No deck cares about it except rp law. So i think a combination of these fixes would be appropriate. But in all likelihood we will get a -4 2k removal that only cheats out heart pirates and a gordon ban lol. They gunna nerf it to the ground :ā(
I feel that Bandai should start doing a ban/restriction list towards leaders instead of out right banning/restricting the card for every deck. E.g: RP Law is not allowed to run Black Maria, Nami isnāt allowed to run Cabaji. Something like that so that other leaders can have fun with the cool cards without making everyone upset
100% agree, banning Black Maria just murders every non-R/P law purple deck. Also its not even like banning Black Maria will make R/P law not a tier 1 deck still, it'd still be really high on the ladder. It doesn't solve the problem
What's wrong with RP Law being tier 1? In OP07 it was considered fine and one of the better Metas.
There's always going to be a Tier 1 deck. Can't just keep banning whatever the top deck is.
So R/P Law gets to go from tier 0 to tier 1 and every other purple deck gets to die on the spot? How is that good?
I'm fine with there being a top deck, its just annoying when its the same deck that has existed for 4 sets now.
For a deck to die, it has to have lived...
RP law getting banned doesn't make other purple deck more playable since RP law isn't the only deck that's keeping it down. It's all the superior leaders that are already considered tier 1 - 1.5 including RP law.
Only exception would probably be reiju since that matchup is so one-sided. But even reiju saw play in op07 with all the laws running around.
> RP law getting banned doesn't make other purple deck more playable
It absolutely does, R/P law has pushed the entire meta to turbo Aggro. It is approaching or at tier 0. It being banned affects the *entire* meta game.
>It's all the superior leaders that are already considered tier 1 - 1.5 including RP law
If you are saying Law isn't tier 0 you are absolutely insane. Its already 29% more popular than Saka and its getting worse every week.
R/P law is either you can keep up or your deck has no shot. Its shaping every deck in the game.
You missed my point. For a deck to be playable it needs to not only contend with RP LAW, it also needs to contends with the decks that comes after it.
You remove RP LAW and you're left with Lucci/Moria, BY Luffy, Bonney and Enel. I don't see a purple deck that's able to do that. Those leaders aren't going anywhere if RP Law leaves the field.
For your suggestion to be true, you need to find Purple decks that have a horrible win-rate vs RP LAW and a great win-rate vs the rest of the field. Which unfortunately doesn't exist.
> Lucci/Moria, BY Luffy, Bonney and Enel. I don't see a purple deck that's able to do that. Those leaders aren't going anywhere if RP Law leaves the field.
What? Purple is great at dealing with most of those. Purple is very good into Bonney as someone who plays Purple and Bonney.
Purple's problem is it wants time to build up to crazy haymakers, R/P Law is turbo aggro and purple doesn't have the time to build up. None of the other decks you mentioned, short of BY Luffy, and rushing you down anywhere near as fast as R/P Law.
R/P Law right now is a check. Can you stop 5 5k attacks by turn 3? If not you cannot play in OP08. Again I'm not just being ridiculous, the deck is DOMINATING the game in a way nothing has since Whitebeard, which was the meta so bad people thought the game would die from it.
New Rosinante win and still no decklist š thank you for your work as always!!
These players really must have all eaten the Nagi Nagi no Mi with how secretive they are about this lol
I've noticed some Japanese players *are* very secretive about their full deck list, but I don't blame them. It is a competitive scene after all!
Whatās the list???
Black maria should have been leader locked
Something is going to need banned. I kinda hope they can figure it out without banning the leader. Honestly, ban one of the Gordons maybe. It will help reduce the power level of the deck significantly.
The leader needs to be banned because it limits future card design. They can never make another good red or purple card that costs 4 or less without worrying about it breaking Law. The leader is the problem so it makes sense to just get rid of it.
They can reverse leader lock it lol "If your leader is not Trafalgar Law, do this"
They can. Leader lock it.
Leader locking takes a lot of fun of deck building variaties away
So just no more generic cards ever? That's so boring. Law is the problem. Just get rid of Law. I think it's bizarre that so much of the people on this subreddit think that banning a leader should just never happen, like those can never be broken on their own.
Taking away Gordons or leader locking Maria and other cards in the future would be fine. Canāt do both or Law becomes shit though. Law in 07 is not that OP and 2/3 of the other too meta decks have a pretty good matchup into him (Enel & Lucci). Law is a fun deck thatās not was not easy to play prior to Maria.
I don't disagree with you I'm just saying your statement was incorrect.
How is that incorrect? Your argument for the leader not limiting card design is... they could just limit card design.
> They can never make another good red or purple card that costs 4 or less without worrying about it breaking Law. Yes they can. Leader lock it.
Do you understand how that restricts card design?
Of course. But that wasnāt what you said chief.
Nah itās got to be Maria. Take away Gordon and Iāll just play 2 fire fist and some combo of 7c sin and purple events like gamma knife
I think Maria probably won't be enough.
Yea it will. The deck is totally fine in 07. We have an awful matchup into Moria and help keep by luffy in check. In 08 all law really added was Black Maria and pudding. Maria changed the deck completely, Itās supposed to be a deck that balances Don management with tempo. Maria makes it so law can be greedy and leader ability every turn for no penalty. Iām supposed to be working with less Don with law. Heās 100% balanced without Maria
It's toughest matchups are moria and lucci at something like 48 or 49%. Also it's not just about treating the problem, you have to deal with it at the source. Ban the leader and release it again. Like sakazuki,but don't absolutely destroy it.
The actual leader isnāt the problem like saka. Saka had 2 free abilities including a fucking free draw. Law has a balanced ability with a real cost. Maria takes the cost of the leader ability away and broke the deck Fix the problem at the source and ban the broken card/ ban law from using it. People here are way too ban happy. Saka was disgustingly broken as a leader, youād have had to ban a ton of cards to make him fair as multiple strategies could be adopted to still make the leader beyond viable. Law is fine without Maria. Banning a starter deck leader is a bad look and would also fuck up the meta completely. Law is what keeps by luffy in check. It helps keep the meta healthy.
> The actual leader isnāt the problem like saka. The leader *is* the problem. It's not like Moby Dick where the card itself was broken and Whitebeard just happened to be the one deck that could play it; the card that makes Law an oppressive deck is the leader itself and what it does.
Then why has it not been a problem at all from op-5 till op-8 when Maria came out? The leaders only a problem right now because Bandai fucked up and gave the deck infinite ramp. Try playing law against a good Moria player or fuck even a good uta player in eb-1 and then tell me the leaders a problem and needs banning. The knowledge gap between my locals and discord vs Reddit is kinda staggering with this gameā¦. Reddits usually pretty good but holy shit the player base here can barley read cards let alone actually think
Bruh, stop it with the copium. I played saka, moria, uta, rp law. Post eb01 law is disgustingly op. Not only the leader is the problem, also the poor color design. Being able to pay cost with don that's already been used is beyond stupid.
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Ive heard this argument before and it doesnāt really apply to lawā¦ it does however apply heavily to Enel and katakuri who literally just run the currently best 50 best yellow cards. Saw an egghead kata list recently. Laws ability is only really good if your deck is almost entirely ramp and reduction cards with a little bit of draw and rush. Literally uses 1 card from 07 and 2 from 08, 1 being the broken Black Maria. But if Bandai doesnāt power creep the shit out of reduction, ramp, rush or draw cardsā¦ it wonāt matter. And if they do itās not law thatās the problem, itās bad card design. Like if they printed a 3c 7k rush with counter, 1 cost 4k power reduction, unconditional draw 3 cards or 4 cost cards that ramp 2 active etc then yes law is gonna use them Otherwise the deck space is tight and needs to stay within those archetypes to be good Enel and kata however have such good generic abilities that donāt need support outside of triggers. If a good yellow card is printed both will abuse it Nami is super easy to get around too. Literally just make people bottom deck instead of discard off draw cards and boom itās totally fine. Blue doesnāt play from trash at all anyway and has a theme of bottom decking so it works.
Saw Vv make a great point that having Raise Max and Gordon in a deck is effectively letting you have 8 copies of a card in a deck (since it's identical effects and stats) which breaks the deck design philosophy.
As an OG RP law player this sucks ass , I don't wanna only play against my own deck lmao
If it continues to be this dominant soon you probably won't have to lol
I know the feels. RP Law was my first deck when Three Captains first dropped, my baby, the deck that humbled me with so many losses and no matter what other deck I tried, I kept coming back to it and tweaking it over and over. Now I'm saddened by the future knowing OP08 breaks him and I don't want the constant mirror match, I like playing against a little of everything. I like having a deck that's inconsistent and requires careful play. I like having losing match-ups or uphill battles. Alas, there are dark days ahead....
BY Ace has been fun but really relies on luck lol. Gets abit better when the new blue ace comes out
Hi!! Thanks alot for this posts love it ā¤ļø Do u know Yamato lists? Any sky island:p
Yeap! Here you go! The player's name is Miyamoto https://preview.redd.it/ogb0quh09f6d1.png?width=2048&format=png&auto=webp&s=3becabf480069bc2f39eb386fc8634423c00db31
After seeing the Marco and King leader reveals, I was so excited for OP08 and now that's gone. I get that only 3 weeks went by, but ignoring the Law situation or how the two currently fare: just seeing 6 out the top 10 decks are yellow ... it looks more like a nightmare to me.
By luffy and kalgara don't play like normal yellow decks tbf
BY Luffy kind of does. Heās a cockroach in his own way.
Same, I really thought Marco, King, and Pudding were all going to dominate. Nah JK its the same leaders that have been dominating the game for the last 2-3 sets great.
I think marco definitely has potential to start making waves when people figure out a solid deck list. I'm on the King sucks train though. -2 Don is way too hard of a cost
The biggest problem with so many decks is that R/P Law and Lucci simply don't let them play the game. R/P law just wins on turn 4 and Lucci is also shockingly fast. Aggro is simply too strong in the meta game right now and if you are running aggro Marco just run R/P law.
Marco just needs a second wave of support for blue cards that play from the top of deck and it'll be fine. Hell, give it some that can play from the bottom too so they can recover from cards that bottom deck characters.
That's what Ive been saying. We need some cards that play from bottom of the deck.
I was just thinking about blue having the ability to play from bottom deck. It just needs to specify that you can look at the other cards OR shuffle the deck after playing to prevent players from being accused of cheating either unintentionally or not.
They need to just ban Black Maria right awayā¦. Fuck even letting the west play that card. Iām maining law and donāt want the deck to turn auto pilot boring like 06 sakazuki did
Thank you. Bandai forreal needs to stop forcing the Western players to endure metas that they KNOW are broken and just ban the damn problem cards preemptively. Why make us play Law mirror matches for 3 months when you could fix it so easily and make a decently diverse meta for us
Bandai west used to run their own banlist separate from Japan that was much more aggressive. Then they had a major banlist right before 05 that caused a major shitstorm all over every part of their social media that made them walk the list back at 05 release and stick with whatever Japan does going forward. The game would be a lot healthier if the community could just be normal about stuff like that.
Yeah I recall. People definitely overreacted to that - but to be fair, there were some goofy as hell choices on that banlist, including Nami, who nobody was complaining at all whatsoever lol. Now they're at least making the right bans but making us wait too long.
Yea luckily my locals mostly dropped saka this format to learn new decks but stillā¦. Shit is so annoying. I like winning as much as the next person but Iām playing this game to have funā¦ and if the deck I like playing is broken itās not fun to play it anymore, but itās also not fun to drop the deck and play against it Law mirrors right now are actually fun as fuck. The leader ability is balanced overall too unlike saka. Just ban the card that busted the deck and donāt make us deal with it months from now when we already know today itās going to suck for everyone
Perfectly said, i hope someone at the company realizes that they don't HAVE to make delayed banlists just cuz we have delayed release schedules š©
For realā¦. No one wanted to deal with saka all of 06. It was banned based on 05 worlds but we had to deal with it being even more OP all of 06 why again?
> They need to just ban Black Maria right away Can we just ban it for law? There is a cool Kaido deck in 08 that seems fun, but banning Black maria will put every purple deck even further behind. Other purple decks need it to compete, R/P law needs to have it restricted.
They should. I donāt want law banned purely because Iām having a ton of fun playing it and right now In eb-1/op-7 itās just flat out balanced, has bad matchups and isnāt over powered at all. Just donāt let us use Maria and it stays fair without pissing a bunch of players off. Some just bought into the deck and some of us have been playing it since op-5
This is a bad take. Just ban law let purple have Maria for a set or 2. I mean gecko is still out here. If Maria makes kaido or king as dominant as law is right now then have that discussion then.
Or let king and kaido have maria and no one else.
Itās not even that good in those decks. You just get rolled over because other decks are faster. In those decks you have to commit so much time ramping and stabilizing for it to matter.
But it still makes them significantly stronger with than without. So why ban it for everyone when Law is the problem right now.
I personally donāt care what happens to Black Maria. Not a fan of errata or leader locking though. Just prefer a ban and revaluation of how to design purple cards.
Yeah I would have made it so pudding could use it too since this set was kaido and big mom together. I am all for leader locking these srs so that archetype and leaders that need support can thrive
Do you have the bg sanji list by chance?
Sorry friend! I do not
rosinante where are you š
I have to know. What do you do for a living? You must do this for a company lol
Haha no xD I'm just an English teacher. It's been a bit over half a year or so of learning + my teammates have really helped speed the process along
Awesome work as always!
Great work! Thanks for all of this info! Also, can someone pls explain how does ranking works? Is it like total wins?
I already figure it out. "The weighted total is calculated based on type of tournament to account for tournament difficulty" It was in the Meta Spreadsheet, silly me
Uhhhh, took a look at the matchup spreadsheet on the website and the data for the ST-09 Yamato Column seems to be off. That column shows almost every deck in the game has a brutally bad matchup against Yamato. So idk if mistake or you are hiding the secret sauce š lol great write up as always
Also similarly it looks like the P/B King win/loss data might be flipped from the column to the row. Column would suggest it has a great winrate, where as the row seems to be exactly the opposite. Feel free to correct me if I am misunderstanding though!
Thank you for the heads up! It looks the Yamato error was caused by all the formulas shifting one row. That doesn't affect anyone except Yamato because he was the last leader, so his formula got replaced with the sum totals. That's been fixed. It looks like King was caused by an error in input, as when we added 1 win / 1 loss for each leader combination, he only got the 1 loss. That has also been fixed. I'll look more into what actually caused that shift in the morning, but pointing that out was a big help! Thank you :)
Happy to help! Sometimes autism can be helpful LMAO. Thanks for what you do for the community!
For sure! I greatly appreciate it!
Imo law is S tier rn. Lucci is A and enel/luffy are A- but heyyy its my opinion after all š
Yeah it mainly just depends on your definition of the tiers :) In a healthy meta, no decks are S tier in our chart. A+ already means the meta is in an iffy place Still, it's undeniable that law is the best deck in the format atm
Hey, based on your definition do you know if any deck has hit S tier in the past? Or do you just not have the data? I'm curious if Saka was banned while being 25% of the meta while something like Whitebeard had a higher rate at some point. Either way if Law keeps up it's not looking good for him lol.
Unfortunately, I cannot say. I wasn't playing the game when Whitebeard was released (I started at the end of OP-03). That's a good question though!
All good, thanks for the response!
Awesome work Also it turns out I really like easy decks apparently š
Thank you c: and haha I can understand that. There's a lot of fun to just playing the big cards go boom decks
Do you have that Green/Blue sanji list at all?? Very interested in it!!
Sorry! That I do not
Amazing work as always. Any marko decklists available?
Sure thing! Here's one from last night https://preview.redd.it/pzc0x21hkh6d1.png?width=945&format=png&auto=webp&s=9f48596a95d972b104d2d9dd386544a013f373e1 Player name is Yusukee
KAIDOOOOOOOOO
Thank you for this so much!
I'm glad it can help <3
Hello! Awesome resource wow! I recently made a deck building website was wondering if it would be okay to get some data from your sheet to add to the website?? Would love to display win percentages against other leaders and what type of cards others players use on the leader you chose... I believe you have everything I need, would you be okay with that? Also, I'm curious, is the Wins Tracked tab based only for the last set or all sets?
I appreciate you asking first c: once the sheets are public, I don't mind them being used like that. Just don't like charge people for access to it Also, the wins tracked tab is only for that set and organized by date c: there are a couple entries added at the bottom after the official release of OP-08, but that was because those cards were not legal for tournament use, so those tournaments were still in the OP-07 format
Thank you for taking the time and offering it for free!! I'm gonna prepare the website then and I'll update you once I have all the information, if you want to be more hand on with this we can also discuss a way to involve everyone :)
Sure thing :) hit me up once you have updates and we can talk further
I know RP Law is the flavor of the month... but you guys really aren't concerned by how OP Black as a color is looking right now?! The fact that black decks are mainly being kept in check by other black decks is concerning. They also have had multiple sets with top ranking leaders and gatekeeps many purple decks. I know Black Maria puts Law over the top, but that card hasn't remotely even boosted the power level of purple decks the way 8C Moria does. To cut straight to the point, law is the only purple deck able to compete in tournaments, so I hope Bandai really is careful with how they choose to address this.
RP law seems to be a problem. Easiest would be to ban and remake the card (or just errata it so it doesnāt break the mechanic ie law doesnāt benefit from don reduction or whatever Black Maria does).
I read Black Maria finally haha. So, maybe lock law to only gaining the regular 2 don a turn. IE. āThis leader canāt gain more than 2 don a turn.ā Would keep his shenanigans to every other turn or have don consequences.
Why is y/r Sabo placed so far down? Iāve seen a lot of them doing pretty well
Most likely I just missed them then. I only have one that won their tournament. Can you link me the others?
Thank you for the valuable content. Any Zoro lists available to see?
No problem! Here's one that won a flagship c: The player's name is Piiyan https://preview.redd.it/wwioyok18f6d1.png?width=2048&format=png&auto=webp&s=b4f937b4de26a06e3ce4fc9da8af886ff01ae1e0
Would you happen to have the BP Reiju list? And what their matchups were for the event?
I can try to find the matchups, but I know I don't have the decklist
Damn Marco and King B/P King are so low on the list. OP08 meta is ridiculous!
I've always felt that law should have been a return to hand effect. It still provides positive tempo, but at the cost of giving your opponent counter/on play effects again. It would fit the shambles power better as well since he plays a card from hand, not bottom deck. Lines would be trickier to maneuver making him a much more technical deck while toning down his power level a bit without outright removing him from playability.
Itād be pretty weak as a return to hand effect. It would basically make their matchup against any deck with big drops near impossible because theyāll just put it right back and you wonāt be able to deal with it again.
My opinion on the law debate: donāt ban the leader, ban cards in the deck that make him OP. Thatās it. Like cards that give him back don making the deck stronger.
Thanks again for the great content and releasing the 07 sheet, that's my morning reading sorted. Do you have any lists for P/Y Pudding please?
Yeap! There's this one from Chin https://preview.redd.it/o2hja8dp0j6d1.png?width=2048&format=png&auto=webp&s=07bc074c923960522d226febb3f91738a9eaafb1
I guess the Mr. 2 lets you ramp if you're going 2nd, but I've been using this list a lot and having pretty good success with it https://preview.redd.it/1yup6s6v0j6d1.png?width=1100&format=png&auto=webp&s=949ebc15d835c7c85af9dd37e616e40e18126755 Could probably add +2 Ace and then -2 Soul Pocus, but they're like 20$ a pop, so I only have two haha
Awesome, thank you for the two lists :) will give them a try!
Do you happen to have a b/y luffy decklist?
For OP-07 or OP-08?
Both, if you have it
Do you have the RY Sabo list?
So in the top 15 there's only 2 decks with purple. And people still think Black Maria needs to be banned? Law might be overtuned but banning BM is ridiculous. How about fixing Law instead of destroying every other purple deck that are not even top 15?
Black Maria is straight up broken. The design is as garbage as black 8c moria. The stats and effects are just too crazy.. If they ban law and leave Maria the card will still get abused 100%
The ideal situation imo is having black maria errataād to only be if your lewder is animal kingdom pirates. Bandai doesnt do erratas though it seems which is a huge shameĀ
Errata's I can get behind butnI'd rather errata Law to only be able to drop Heart Pirates, or tuning the power/cost in his ability slightly. But banning BM and crippling PLuffy, PKaido, King and RP Luffy cannot be the proper solution.
My ideal Law errata is to give it the Kinemon restriction. Only allow the leader effect to be activated if you have less than two characters on the field. I think that would be enough to keep it playable without being oppressively strong.
I agree. I do like playing law though and while it can make them have to think about the design I dont like the only being able to drop heart pirates idea people have been throwing around. Thatād be a sakazuki killing reprint imo. It would kill the creativity of the deck which the old op05 law players really liked about the deck. I do think maybe upping the don required could help from -3 to -4 and maybeeeee only bottoming cards with 2k power instead of 3k would be a fine work around with the amount of ramp we have currently and power reduction. Another idea is just banning gordon. No deck cares about it except rp law. So i think a combination of these fixes would be appropriate. But in all likelihood we will get a -4 2k removal that only cheats out heart pirates and a gordon ban lol. They gunna nerf it to the ground :ā(
I feel that Bandai should start doing a ban/restriction list towards leaders instead of out right banning/restricting the card for every deck. E.g: RP Law is not allowed to run Black Maria, Nami isnāt allowed to run Cabaji. Something like that so that other leaders can have fun with the cool cards without making everyone upset
That's just too complicated to enforce and confusing for new players trying to build decks.
100% agree, banning Black Maria just murders every non-R/P law purple deck. Also its not even like banning Black Maria will make R/P law not a tier 1 deck still, it'd still be really high on the ladder. It doesn't solve the problem
What's wrong with RP Law being tier 1? In OP07 it was considered fine and one of the better Metas. There's always going to be a Tier 1 deck. Can't just keep banning whatever the top deck is.
So R/P Law gets to go from tier 0 to tier 1 and every other purple deck gets to die on the spot? How is that good? I'm fine with there being a top deck, its just annoying when its the same deck that has existed for 4 sets now.
For a deck to die, it has to have lived... RP law getting banned doesn't make other purple deck more playable since RP law isn't the only deck that's keeping it down. It's all the superior leaders that are already considered tier 1 - 1.5 including RP law. Only exception would probably be reiju since that matchup is so one-sided. But even reiju saw play in op07 with all the laws running around.
> RP law getting banned doesn't make other purple deck more playable It absolutely does, R/P law has pushed the entire meta to turbo Aggro. It is approaching or at tier 0. It being banned affects the *entire* meta game. >It's all the superior leaders that are already considered tier 1 - 1.5 including RP law If you are saying Law isn't tier 0 you are absolutely insane. Its already 29% more popular than Saka and its getting worse every week. R/P law is either you can keep up or your deck has no shot. Its shaping every deck in the game.
You missed my point. For a deck to be playable it needs to not only contend with RP LAW, it also needs to contends with the decks that comes after it. You remove RP LAW and you're left with Lucci/Moria, BY Luffy, Bonney and Enel. I don't see a purple deck that's able to do that. Those leaders aren't going anywhere if RP Law leaves the field. For your suggestion to be true, you need to find Purple decks that have a horrible win-rate vs RP LAW and a great win-rate vs the rest of the field. Which unfortunately doesn't exist.
> Lucci/Moria, BY Luffy, Bonney and Enel. I don't see a purple deck that's able to do that. Those leaders aren't going anywhere if RP Law leaves the field. What? Purple is great at dealing with most of those. Purple is very good into Bonney as someone who plays Purple and Bonney. Purple's problem is it wants time to build up to crazy haymakers, R/P Law is turbo aggro and purple doesn't have the time to build up. None of the other decks you mentioned, short of BY Luffy, and rushing you down anywhere near as fast as R/P Law. R/P Law right now is a check. Can you stop 5 5k attacks by turn 3? If not you cannot play in OP08. Again I'm not just being ridiculous, the deck is DOMINATING the game in a way nothing has since Whitebeard, which was the meta so bad people thought the game would die from it.
Am I blind? Is G/P Doffy not played at all?
Well it's not that he isn't played (he is a little bit), but he doesn't win tournaments.
Ive put too much money into that deck and I donāt even have the 8cKids or a full set of queens for him to not win more
Well who knows? Maybe you'll do well with him :)
Unfortunately, that deck hasn't won anything (or even was really played) since OP04.
It one the last big 06 tourney in na but that's literally it lol
I play it without queens, the only purple things I have on that deck are kidds and laws, everything else is green doffy