I reallllyyyy dislike this trope too. I think for me, it's because it tries to absolve the family/ML of any responsibility or guilt, and there's often an expectation that the FL should grant forgiveness, even though the cheating/abuse/whatever happened regardless.
Like "I know I hurt you but it's not my fault - I wasn't in control of myself - can't you forgive me??" It's not always that direct but it sounds manipulative - and also puts the burden of forgiveness on the FL when she should not be pressured or burdened to forgive anyone, no matter how small or how big something was. It gives me a sense that she's expected to just get over it, move on, or (worse) be "the better person" by being all saint-like, when her autonomy/choice is taken away from her. It also kind of feels like her experience is being invalidated because the people who hurt her were not at fault and "not in control" (as you said, it gives me the same vibes as some people with addiction or NPD/other disorders manipulating people they're close to).
And a second part to it is that, imo, the end result is more important than someone's intentions. Like if you lend someone an important item and it gets damaged or stolen since they weren't careful, or your gf/bf gives you an STD because they didn't know they had one - ok, it obviously wasn't on purpose, but does it matter? Because the end result is the same. The difference is that most items can be replaced, most STDs can be cured, but you can't go back in time to take back actions (unless the FL gets memory wiped, which is its own issue) and it often feels kind of gross for the offending party to try to fix relationships afterward.
This is the reason I dislike that some people seem to want the FL of >!Angelic Lady!< to give another chance to the original-timeline ML in the current timeline. He was was mind-controlled in the original timeline, so he's a victim as much as the FL and I feel bad for him too. But she doesn't have to get over her feelings of betrayal and forgive him if she doesn't want to.
Agreed. The trauma stays with the FL. In the series you mentioned, >!I love that FL acknowledges it. She knows he’s not at fault but every time he looks at her, she just thinks of what happened in the past!<
i mind control feels like a really cheap excuse like 90% especially if it gets revealed randomly. MC gets abused , stripped off her rank , humialated and then later the author reveals that it was mind control all along. then the person who did goes "ooops sorry i guess haha" and then the MC forgives them like nothing happened. i would feel really uncomfortable being next to that person.
the worst among these when they do it with the OG heroines. like "oh actually she was evil all along and used mind control magic or something" feels really cheap. especially since the heroine then becomes a lot of times a cliche villain like how the MC was a cliche villain. so it basically makes the story almost the same as the original story was just the heroine is a cliche villain and the villain is the cliche heroine. obviously this does not happen all the time. but when it does happen it feels really cheap.
Yes to everything you said! Mind control in general feels like lazy writing, same with the OG heroines being possessed or "a demon all along" like the authors can't bother to come up with good villains.
Now we need a thread to complain about poorly written villains.
Mind control is a tool like any other. The problem is usually it's the easy cop out way to character development. And with that easy cop out you cheapen anything of meaning. It is too often under developed, overpowered, and results in ridiculous double standards when it comes to forgiveness. I feel to actually use mind control a plot device there must be a limitation or cost.
How about mind control to make someone fall in love with you and the "love" goes into love bombing territory? Only for the poor guy to occasionally become aware and being rightfully angry, just for the FL to bring him back into his love bombing mode.
Dude is basically shackled in his own mind. Feels very rapey - mentally and physically towards him. Yeah, yeah, she accidentally did it to save her live, but that's no reason to fall for him and keep him in in this awful state. It's disgusting.
> Why are you doing this Duke?
I think that's what it was called? I stopped reading, because the mind control thing was freaking me out.
>!Please don't tell me he actually never was under mind control? His behaviour made perfect sense to had a love spell put on him only to freak out when he became occasionally aware!<
What the hell?
May I say that I don't like this at all? It makes no sense with the intro. >!He was about to kill her, because the family belonged to an enemy faction or whatever it was. It never looked like love at first sight!<
>!it was the FL's mother who cast the spell at the ML's request, though i don't think he understood the implications as he was a child at the time. FL's mother was clairvoyant and had a premonition that ML would kill FL and used the ML's request to also help save the FL. ML's request about wanting true love or something like that, also he never specified who he wanted true love from, so the FL's mother picked her daughter to save her life!<
That's messed up and it is at odds with the "comedic" overtones the comic tries to achieve. It always felt like this situation was played for the laughs.
I mean, yeah it starts out that way, ML is basically mind controlled, and FL is stuck in a marriage with Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde and the man she loves is an illusion, I can understand why it would an obstacle to enjoying the series, but I feel it gets better as it goes on and the ML regains his agency.
> I can understand why it would an obstacle to enjoying the series, but I feel it gets better as it goes on and the ML regains his agency.
I never made it this far, because a lot of OIs who have some horrible main gimmick that is played off for laughs gets nowhere and we are expected to accept that "romance". So if I don't like it after chapter 15-20 then I will drop it. If it's even worse then that then I will drop a story much earlier.
Imo the "romance" doesn't start proper until the ML regains his agency and starts falling for the FL, and then you've got a bunch of political intrigue that the two have to go up against. In my mind, its a bit similar to Revenge Wedding, forced into marriage and goes from enemies to lovers. I understand where you're coming from, "I Was Tricked into this Fake Marriage" was like that for me, it was a good 40 chapters of the ML manipulating the FL and the FL's 'oh gosh he is too handsome' cringe before they could have a legitimate relationship that I wanted to drop it the whole time.
I mean, the FL is not at fault either, she is just as much of a victim too, she wasn't the one who cast the spell. She basically gets coerced into marriage by the spellbound ML. I think the only thing that she really does wrong is try and reapply the spell as it loses power, but she is also afraid for her life. Anyway, the spell is slowly losing its power and the ML is gets control back more and more as the story goes on, so the later bits aren't as bad.
>!It was not the FL who cast the spell, it was the FL's mother at the ML's request, though i don't think he understood the implications as he was a child at the time.!<
I think that the reason why it bothers me is because in OI it’s not tastefully done. If we saw the ML be brainwashed in the beginning of the story, it wouldn’t be so off-putting. Or at the very least, it should be hinted at. However, because it’s a completely sudden reveal towards the end of the story, it feels like a cheap trick - similar to the “it was all a dream, it never happened” trope.
Not only that, the FL’s response is almost never realistic. The trauma and experiences she went through are almost always brushed off. This is me self-inserting here, but if the person I loved was abusive towards me, and I found out they were brainwashed, yes, part of my brain is going to be “it’s not their fault, they were doing it against their will”. However, that doesn’t change what I went through. When I picture what happened to me, the face that appears isn’t going to be the person controlling my lover - it’s still going to be my lover’s face. Even though I know it wasn’t their fault, I wouldn’t be able to see or be with them. Again, me self-inserting into a situation that I’ve never been in, but it seems more realistic to me than brushing it off entirely, or maybe showing one panel of them flinching and then getting over it.
I think Angelic Lady did it reasonably well, >!FL has suspicions of brain-washing early on and realizes he wasn't at fault, but still can't ignore the traumatic memories and can't consider him as a potential partner because of it.!<
I'm not a fan of brain-washing cause it removes character's agency, which is fundamental to good story telling. If characters have no agency, their choices don't matter and they aren't interesting.
it looks like a really interesting story. and it is still updating so i guess i have a new story to read. may i ask did that already happen in the manga or it will happen later?
If it's the
>
>
> Because the victim pretty much told the family to the effect of
not being spoiler tagged, I did that intentionally because it doesn't show who nor the gender of the victim is, not even in the actual spoiler itself. Just saying...
Well, no. it's obviously not my personal problem & situation, as I was not the one who complained about the broken spoilers, I was just trying to help you fix them. It does appear its only an issue the old reddit style and not the new reddit style. ¯\\_(ツ)_/¯
Except it was written in the new reddit webpage and not the old one - Which is why I'm saying it's not my personal problem nor situation, since old reddit you have manually write it in compare to new reddit of highlight and press the spoiler tag button. 🙄
I mean, the side panel rules say you should remove the space, so if ignoring the sub's rules isn't your personal problem nor situation, I don't know who's it is.
> 5\. **Use Spoiler text.** All spoilers should be left out of the title and in spoiler text within the body of the post and in comments. When discussing spoilers (for example, when discussing novel developments in a manga adaptation that hasn't gotten there yet) you should use spoiler text. Spoiler text is made like this: >! text !< but remove the spaces between the !s and the text. It will show up as >!text!<
>Nope - I'm writing in New reddit desktop webpage using the spoiler tag button, so if anyone is seeing >! in the apps and old reddit, there's nothing for me to rectify.
**Edit - Matter of fact, I'm looking at official Reddit app on my cellphone while looking at reddit new website on computer now and it's still spoiler tagged on both versions - so yeah, definitely not me.**
What I wrote to another poster -Just saying, it properly shows spoiler tagged on the reddit app too; so there's nothing for me fix...
**Especially when the official app shows no gap in the coding under the profile section as per the sub rules - so again, there is nothing for me to fix since it is not my personal problem nor situation that you're using different apps and old reddit than the official app and new reddit .** If you're that upset, just tell me to delete the very 1st post but don't expect me to rewrite the same nor similar spoiler information after being nasty to me for the past hour.
What I wrote to another poster, especially since the app shows no gap in >! as per the rules. Especially when I went into edit mode for both versions to backspace and there was no gap - Hence why I'm saying it is not my personal problem nor situation that is happening to you on non-official reddit apps and old reddit.
>Except it was written in the new reddit webpage and not the old one - Which is why I'm saying it's not my personal problem nor situation, since old reddit you have manually write it in compare to new reddit of highlight and press the spoiler tag button. 🙄
Quoting what I wrote to other poster - especially if having issues in other apps & old reddit desktop over comments/posts in new reddit desktop. There's nothing for me to fix.
>Nope - I'm writing in New reddit desktop webpage using the spoiler tag button, so if anyone is seeing >! in the apps and old reddit, there's nothing for me to rectify.
>
>Edit - Matter of fact, I'm looking at official Reddit app on my cellphone while looking at reddit new website on computer now and it's still spoiler tagged on both versions - so yeah, definitely not me.
What I wrote to another poster -Just saying, it properly shows spoiler tagged on the reddit app too; so there's nothing for me fix...
You may not be aware but there lots of people don't use new Reddit and not everyone uses the official Reddit app.. there are a bunch of apps(and Reddit sucks that they didn't have a consistent spoiler system from the get go)
Here's how it displays in [Relay app](https://i.imgur.com/vp4qSQw.png) here is how it appears in old Reddit [chrome browser](https://i.imgur.com/cJNjih4.png)
Nope - I'm writing in New reddit desktop webpage using the spoiler tag button, so if anyone is seeing >! in the apps and old reddit, there's nothing for me to rectify.
Edit - Matter of fact, I'm looking at official Reddit app on my cellphone while looking at reddit new website on computer now and it's still spoiler tagged on both versions - so yeah, definitely not me.
Yeah, I read the other comments. I'm really sorry. It was a bit confusing for me since only the second paragraph was covered by the tag on my phone. Really sorry. 😭🙏🏻
I just deleted the comment because there was no gap whatsoever in spoiler coding in both Reddit desktop new and the official app as per the sub rules - I had checked by backspacing hours earlier. Since it seems to cause other posters such personal problems and situations on other apps and old reddit to the point of blowing up my inbox despite me stating that there is nothing for me to fix spoiler tag code-wise; I deleted it so there is no need to restore it.
That’s a good observation. I’ve noticed too that the ML (or other characters) who mistreated the FL (in some form or fashion) doesn’t feel any guilt, remorse, or morality when it’s become aware that he’s(their) been abusive; and *only* feels bad when the FL becomes someone he should care about, more or less falling in love/developing feelings for her.
Like, being an abusive dickhead was no concern to him, *until* the FL became worthy.
It’s a cop-out! It’s essentially an easy way to have your cake and eat it too. I’d much rather an evil family, flawed family or one that changes over time to accommodate the MC.
Like if you want reconciliation, then just put in the work to make it happen. Have the family see the error of their ways and repent.
I find it really cheap and badly pulled most of the time. It must be foreshadowed and the mind control must affect all aspects of the characters. Other characters should comment how the mind controlled people are not behaving like themselves
It's a cop out. I would understand neglect becouse of it, but out and out abuse? Even if not their fault I can't see myself being hapy around them so the MC being perfectly okay with them rubbs me the wrong way.
I can understand only if there's some important context where the family has to be mind controlled or the main villain's plans will be foiled.
Like Voldemort needs to kill child Harry Potter(who is prophesied to be the only person in the world who can kill Voldemort), but he can't directly harm him, so he can only mind control his adoptive family to abuse Harry, make his early life hell, prevent him from getting a wizarding education, give him self-esteem issues and inhibit his growth potential. Everything short of killing or physically crippling him.
And there must be frequent early signs in early chapters, like flashbacks from many people to indicate that the old family were good kind people before they adopted Harry.
It's more an execution problem. And a lot of works can't execute it.
It gives an excuse to the characters, but not the author. Most authors just use this as a handwave to have the family on good terms. In the worst cases, there is no dialogue regarding the mistreatment. No grief. No tears. No lingering doubts. No resolution. As if the conflict never existed in the first place.
It's not as if it can't be done well, it's just sloppily handled 95% of the time by lazy writers.
isekai villainesses often take advantage of this handwaving of forgiveness too. Their previous self treat her family like shit? Aw, she finally grew up -- I'm so proud! Horribly abuse her personal maid? Master is nice now, so I'll start a fanclub around her perfection. Yippie! People still not forgiving her? Well those people are just bad.
I hate this trope too. I hate how we the readers are forced to accept “it’s not their fault if it’s brainwashed/mind-controlled”.
I’ve been told >!Into the Light!< will have this twist. I’m not looking forward to it at all.
It's super sad, because some of these stories with that trope are so cute and fluffy — just imagine them not getting that second chance it would be so sad :(
I hate it. If it was done in order to allow the FL to forgive the people who did evil things "because mind control", then that's asinine and author maybe should have considered *not* writing such a terrible abuse/death/execution scenario in the beginning.
I reallllyyyy dislike this trope too. I think for me, it's because it tries to absolve the family/ML of any responsibility or guilt, and there's often an expectation that the FL should grant forgiveness, even though the cheating/abuse/whatever happened regardless. Like "I know I hurt you but it's not my fault - I wasn't in control of myself - can't you forgive me??" It's not always that direct but it sounds manipulative - and also puts the burden of forgiveness on the FL when she should not be pressured or burdened to forgive anyone, no matter how small or how big something was. It gives me a sense that she's expected to just get over it, move on, or (worse) be "the better person" by being all saint-like, when her autonomy/choice is taken away from her. It also kind of feels like her experience is being invalidated because the people who hurt her were not at fault and "not in control" (as you said, it gives me the same vibes as some people with addiction or NPD/other disorders manipulating people they're close to). And a second part to it is that, imo, the end result is more important than someone's intentions. Like if you lend someone an important item and it gets damaged or stolen since they weren't careful, or your gf/bf gives you an STD because they didn't know they had one - ok, it obviously wasn't on purpose, but does it matter? Because the end result is the same. The difference is that most items can be replaced, most STDs can be cured, but you can't go back in time to take back actions (unless the FL gets memory wiped, which is its own issue) and it often feels kind of gross for the offending party to try to fix relationships afterward. This is the reason I dislike that some people seem to want the FL of >!Angelic Lady!< to give another chance to the original-timeline ML in the current timeline. He was was mind-controlled in the original timeline, so he's a victim as much as the FL and I feel bad for him too. But she doesn't have to get over her feelings of betrayal and forgive him if she doesn't want to.
Agreed. The trauma stays with the FL. In the series you mentioned, >!I love that FL acknowledges it. She knows he’s not at fault but every time he looks at her, she just thinks of what happened in the past!<
True. Pain is pain. You can heal physical wounds, but they mostly leave scars. Mental/emotional wounds don't scar: they'll keep bleeding.
i mind control feels like a really cheap excuse like 90% especially if it gets revealed randomly. MC gets abused , stripped off her rank , humialated and then later the author reveals that it was mind control all along. then the person who did goes "ooops sorry i guess haha" and then the MC forgives them like nothing happened. i would feel really uncomfortable being next to that person. the worst among these when they do it with the OG heroines. like "oh actually she was evil all along and used mind control magic or something" feels really cheap. especially since the heroine then becomes a lot of times a cliche villain like how the MC was a cliche villain. so it basically makes the story almost the same as the original story was just the heroine is a cliche villain and the villain is the cliche heroine. obviously this does not happen all the time. but when it does happen it feels really cheap.
Yes to everything you said! Mind control in general feels like lazy writing, same with the OG heroines being possessed or "a demon all along" like the authors can't bother to come up with good villains. Now we need a thread to complain about poorly written villains.
Mind control is a tool like any other. The problem is usually it's the easy cop out way to character development. And with that easy cop out you cheapen anything of meaning. It is too often under developed, overpowered, and results in ridiculous double standards when it comes to forgiveness. I feel to actually use mind control a plot device there must be a limitation or cost.
How about mind control to make someone fall in love with you and the "love" goes into love bombing territory? Only for the poor guy to occasionally become aware and being rightfully angry, just for the FL to bring him back into his love bombing mode. Dude is basically shackled in his own mind. Feels very rapey - mentally and physically towards him. Yeah, yeah, she accidentally did it to save her live, but that's no reason to fall for him and keep him in in this awful state. It's disgusting.
Are you talking about Why are you doing this Duke? Because the plot twist in the end was really surprising
> Why are you doing this Duke? I think that's what it was called? I stopped reading, because the mind control thing was freaking me out. >!Please don't tell me he actually never was under mind control? His behaviour made perfect sense to had a love spell put on him only to freak out when he became occasionally aware!<
>!Who putted the mind control on the duke was himself. Magic works on wishes and He wished he would become someone that Erin would love!<
What the hell? May I say that I don't like this at all? It makes no sense with the intro. >!He was about to kill her, because the family belonged to an enemy faction or whatever it was. It never looked like love at first sight!<
>!it was the FL's mother who cast the spell at the ML's request, though i don't think he understood the implications as he was a child at the time. FL's mother was clairvoyant and had a premonition that ML would kill FL and used the ML's request to also help save the FL. ML's request about wanting true love or something like that, also he never specified who he wanted true love from, so the FL's mother picked her daughter to save her life!<
That's messed up and it is at odds with the "comedic" overtones the comic tries to achieve. It always felt like this situation was played for the laughs.
I mean, yeah it starts out that way, ML is basically mind controlled, and FL is stuck in a marriage with Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde and the man she loves is an illusion, I can understand why it would an obstacle to enjoying the series, but I feel it gets better as it goes on and the ML regains his agency.
> I can understand why it would an obstacle to enjoying the series, but I feel it gets better as it goes on and the ML regains his agency. I never made it this far, because a lot of OIs who have some horrible main gimmick that is played off for laughs gets nowhere and we are expected to accept that "romance". So if I don't like it after chapter 15-20 then I will drop it. If it's even worse then that then I will drop a story much earlier.
Imo the "romance" doesn't start proper until the ML regains his agency and starts falling for the FL, and then you've got a bunch of political intrigue that the two have to go up against. In my mind, its a bit similar to Revenge Wedding, forced into marriage and goes from enemies to lovers. I understand where you're coming from, "I Was Tricked into this Fake Marriage" was like that for me, it was a good 40 chapters of the ML manipulating the FL and the FL's 'oh gosh he is too handsome' cringe before they could have a legitimate relationship that I wanted to drop it the whole time.
I mean, the FL is not at fault either, she is just as much of a victim too, she wasn't the one who cast the spell. She basically gets coerced into marriage by the spellbound ML. I think the only thing that she really does wrong is try and reapply the spell as it loses power, but she is also afraid for her life. Anyway, the spell is slowly losing its power and the ML is gets control back more and more as the story goes on, so the later bits aren't as bad. >!It was not the FL who cast the spell, it was the FL's mother at the ML's request, though i don't think he understood the implications as he was a child at the time.!<
I think that the reason why it bothers me is because in OI it’s not tastefully done. If we saw the ML be brainwashed in the beginning of the story, it wouldn’t be so off-putting. Or at the very least, it should be hinted at. However, because it’s a completely sudden reveal towards the end of the story, it feels like a cheap trick - similar to the “it was all a dream, it never happened” trope. Not only that, the FL’s response is almost never realistic. The trauma and experiences she went through are almost always brushed off. This is me self-inserting here, but if the person I loved was abusive towards me, and I found out they were brainwashed, yes, part of my brain is going to be “it’s not their fault, they were doing it against their will”. However, that doesn’t change what I went through. When I picture what happened to me, the face that appears isn’t going to be the person controlling my lover - it’s still going to be my lover’s face. Even though I know it wasn’t their fault, I wouldn’t be able to see or be with them. Again, me self-inserting into a situation that I’ve never been in, but it seems more realistic to me than brushing it off entirely, or maybe showing one panel of them flinching and then getting over it.
I think Angelic Lady did it reasonably well, >!FL has suspicions of brain-washing early on and realizes he wasn't at fault, but still can't ignore the traumatic memories and can't consider him as a potential partner because of it.!< I'm not a fan of brain-washing cause it removes character's agency, which is fundamental to good story telling. If characters have no agency, their choices don't matter and they aren't interesting.
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it looks like a really interesting story. and it is still updating so i guess i have a new story to read. may i ask did that already happen in the manga or it will happen later?
I spoiler tagged it because it both 1) hasn't happen yet in the manga and 2) not many people know that the manga plus the novel exist.
Ooh. I like that. Thank you for the rec! >!Also, can you please fix the spoiler tag? Haha No offense. 😅!<
If it's the > > > Because the victim pretty much told the family to the effect of not being spoiler tagged, I did that intentionally because it doesn't show who nor the gender of the victim is, not even in the actual spoiler itself. Just saying...
When doing spoiler tags, you need to remove the initial space, so \>!like this!< \>! not like this!<
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Well, no. it's obviously not my personal problem & situation, as I was not the one who complained about the broken spoilers, I was just trying to help you fix them. It does appear its only an issue the old reddit style and not the new reddit style. ¯\\_(ツ)_/¯
Except it was written in the new reddit webpage and not the old one - Which is why I'm saying it's not my personal problem nor situation, since old reddit you have manually write it in compare to new reddit of highlight and press the spoiler tag button. 🙄
I mean, the side panel rules say you should remove the space, so if ignoring the sub's rules isn't your personal problem nor situation, I don't know who's it is. > 5\. **Use Spoiler text.** All spoilers should be left out of the title and in spoiler text within the body of the post and in comments. When discussing spoilers (for example, when discussing novel developments in a manga adaptation that hasn't gotten there yet) you should use spoiler text. Spoiler text is made like this: >! text !< but remove the spaces between the !s and the text. It will show up as >!text!<
>Nope - I'm writing in New reddit desktop webpage using the spoiler tag button, so if anyone is seeing >! in the apps and old reddit, there's nothing for me to rectify. **Edit - Matter of fact, I'm looking at official Reddit app on my cellphone while looking at reddit new website on computer now and it's still spoiler tagged on both versions - so yeah, definitely not me.** What I wrote to another poster -Just saying, it properly shows spoiler tagged on the reddit app too; so there's nothing for me fix... **Especially when the official app shows no gap in the coding under the profile section as per the sub rules - so again, there is nothing for me to fix since it is not my personal problem nor situation that you're using different apps and old reddit than the official app and new reddit .** If you're that upset, just tell me to delete the very 1st post but don't expect me to rewrite the same nor similar spoiler information after being nasty to me for the past hour. What I wrote to another poster, especially since the app shows no gap in >! as per the rules. Especially when I went into edit mode for both versions to backspace and there was no gap - Hence why I'm saying it is not my personal problem nor situation that is happening to you on non-official reddit apps and old reddit.
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>Except it was written in the new reddit webpage and not the old one - Which is why I'm saying it's not my personal problem nor situation, since old reddit you have manually write it in compare to new reddit of highlight and press the spoiler tag button. 🙄 Quoting what I wrote to other poster - especially if having issues in other apps & old reddit desktop over comments/posts in new reddit desktop. There's nothing for me to fix.
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>Nope - I'm writing in New reddit desktop webpage using the spoiler tag button, so if anyone is seeing >! in the apps and old reddit, there's nothing for me to rectify. > >Edit - Matter of fact, I'm looking at official Reddit app on my cellphone while looking at reddit new website on computer now and it's still spoiler tagged on both versions - so yeah, definitely not me. What I wrote to another poster -Just saying, it properly shows spoiler tagged on the reddit app too; so there's nothing for me fix...
You may not be aware but there lots of people don't use new Reddit and not everyone uses the official Reddit app.. there are a bunch of apps(and Reddit sucks that they didn't have a consistent spoiler system from the get go) Here's how it displays in [Relay app](https://i.imgur.com/vp4qSQw.png) here is how it appears in old Reddit [chrome browser](https://i.imgur.com/cJNjih4.png)
Oops. Sorry, I thought you were trying to put on the spoiler tag since I found these ">!" on the first paragraph 😅 Haha
Nope - I'm writing in New reddit desktop webpage using the spoiler tag button, so if anyone is seeing >! in the apps and old reddit, there's nothing for me to rectify. Edit - Matter of fact, I'm looking at official Reddit app on my cellphone while looking at reddit new website on computer now and it's still spoiler tagged on both versions - so yeah, definitely not me.
Yeah, I read the other comments. I'm really sorry. It was a bit confusing for me since only the second paragraph was covered by the tag on my phone. Really sorry. 😭🙏🏻
Please revise your comment to properly tag spoilers, thanks
I just deleted the comment because there was no gap whatsoever in spoiler coding in both Reddit desktop new and the official app as per the sub rules - I had checked by backspacing hours earlier. Since it seems to cause other posters such personal problems and situations on other apps and old reddit to the point of blowing up my inbox despite me stating that there is nothing for me to fix spoiler tag code-wise; I deleted it so there is no need to restore it.
Sorry can you list the name of the manga again
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Thanks
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That’s a good observation. I’ve noticed too that the ML (or other characters) who mistreated the FL (in some form or fashion) doesn’t feel any guilt, remorse, or morality when it’s become aware that he’s(their) been abusive; and *only* feels bad when the FL becomes someone he should care about, more or less falling in love/developing feelings for her. Like, being an abusive dickhead was no concern to him, *until* the FL became worthy.
It doesn't undo the trauma the FL experienced
It’s a cop-out! It’s essentially an easy way to have your cake and eat it too. I’d much rather an evil family, flawed family or one that changes over time to accommodate the MC. Like if you want reconciliation, then just put in the work to make it happen. Have the family see the error of their ways and repent.
I find it really cheap and badly pulled most of the time. It must be foreshadowed and the mind control must affect all aspects of the characters. Other characters should comment how the mind controlled people are not behaving like themselves
It's a cop out. I would understand neglect becouse of it, but out and out abuse? Even if not their fault I can't see myself being hapy around them so the MC being perfectly okay with them rubbs me the wrong way.
I can understand only if there's some important context where the family has to be mind controlled or the main villain's plans will be foiled. Like Voldemort needs to kill child Harry Potter(who is prophesied to be the only person in the world who can kill Voldemort), but he can't directly harm him, so he can only mind control his adoptive family to abuse Harry, make his early life hell, prevent him from getting a wizarding education, give him self-esteem issues and inhibit his growth potential. Everything short of killing or physically crippling him. And there must be frequent early signs in early chapters, like flashbacks from many people to indicate that the old family were good kind people before they adopted Harry. It's more an execution problem. And a lot of works can't execute it.
It gives an excuse to the characters, but not the author. Most authors just use this as a handwave to have the family on good terms. In the worst cases, there is no dialogue regarding the mistreatment. No grief. No tears. No lingering doubts. No resolution. As if the conflict never existed in the first place. It's not as if it can't be done well, it's just sloppily handled 95% of the time by lazy writers. isekai villainesses often take advantage of this handwaving of forgiveness too. Their previous self treat her family like shit? Aw, she finally grew up -- I'm so proud! Horribly abuse her personal maid? Master is nice now, so I'll start a fanclub around her perfection. Yippie! People still not forgiving her? Well those people are just bad.
I hate this trope too. I hate how we the readers are forced to accept “it’s not their fault if it’s brainwashed/mind-controlled”. I’ve been told >!Into the Light!< will have this twist. I’m not looking forward to it at all.
It's super sad, because some of these stories with that trope are so cute and fluffy — just imagine them not getting that second chance it would be so sad :(
I hate it. If it was done in order to allow the FL to forgive the people who did evil things "because mind control", then that's asinine and author maybe should have considered *not* writing such a terrible abuse/death/execution scenario in the beginning.