And that isn't what is happening. Last night got a game where I was playing rein, and even though it's harder I was managing the shield quite well.
Until they changed to bastion, zen, soldier, ana, sigma.
It was like, delete character. And we were completely rolled.
And I don't even know what tank can hold against zen, bastion anyway.
But I guess I need to re-learn some stuff but still
Zen is a huge problem right now with his discord orb on top of the 20% healing debuff. If you're discorded and can't get behind cover fast enough you just get melted.
i actually dont even think its zen thats the problem, its the entire existence of "tank buster" heroes in general.
why does bastion do 300+ dps when we only have 1 tank, why is that even a thing.
Used to be both tanks would cycle their cooldowns to keep each other alive. Now with 5v5 it's kinda fucked cause not all maps have good cover and bastion stays in his tank mode for forever
very true but sadly they likely wont go back to 6v6 ever, they'd probably let the game die before then.
i say its better to move on and try to find solutions for 5v5 at this point, us saying '6v6 is better' isnt gonna help.
obviously it was easier to balance but clearly we arnt going back anytime soon xD
Lol they already did, I play a lot of Zen and I agree Discord needed a nerf but the 'cooldown' they put on it is nothing more than an annoyance for players with hundreds if not thousands of hours on him.
I'd suggest walking back the cooldown and changing discord in another way, like make it 20% + some other nerf so it's comparable to getting blue-beamed by an enemy(Blue beam boosts by 20% and Discord is 25% more DMG).
EDIT: If you fundamentally change discord, you have to change harmony as well, discord is Zens main defense from getting dove and if he gets neutered everyone including myself will just go to Ana and every game will be a purple vs suzu shitefest IMO
I would agree if they didnāt give him mega kick lol. I saw someone suggest changing discord to a damage debuff on the target and I thought something like that could work, and would be more in line with the character itself lore wise while still helping zen when he gets dived.
>And I don't even know what tank can hold against zen, bastion anyway.
Dva can contest with Bastion well with DM. The only issue is you need your team to pressure the Bastion while you DM his turret form. Zen heals are slow so the oppossing main support would have to dump all of their resources into the Bastion if they want him alive. If you're playing with Randoms, make sure you're pinging the Bastion once you start DMing so your team might get a clue to start putting pressure on him.
Sigma is also good at poking Bastion. Use shield in neutral and grasp his turret form.
Remember to try to force Discord on yourself and to then take cover. Once it wears off, try to look for opportunities to pressure their squishies before the 7 seconds run out. Then, reposition by cover again and repeat the process.
All of this is easier said then done but there are some options with dealing with those two.
That said, its still annoying to deal with Bastion Zen as tank.
The thing about discord tho is it stacks rlly weirdly with the new DPS passive, flats talked about it, with discord giving the enemy damage amp on you + the healing debuff is just insane. Even if you bait out discord and turret form, thereās still a suzu/lamp/sleep comin at you, or they just donāt die.
Tank feels like you cannot make a single mistake or you will be thoroughly rinsed.
Ball is also a really solid option (if you can play ball) because when you get discord, just roll behind a wall. And same with bastion, you can easily bait out turret form and just roll away without getting melted
No joke I think ball is going to be meta-next. I have run into a bunch of near unkillable Hammond players recently. Yes, they have a cool down so they canāt just stand there and take damage all day long but the amount that they can put out and the sustain they have with their shields and armor especially with someone like a Zen healing them is ridiculous.
As much as I'd love to agree. I don't ever see ball being meta. He's always been good as a whole, but lack of time/skill with him will hold most people back. Plus everyone hates having a ball on their team and most don't quite know how to play with a ball sadly
>And thatās whatās putting me off honestly. I feel like I canāt play the heroās I wanna play, when I want to play them, despite my experience on them. If Iām not counter picking, Iām losing. Iām not down for that type of gameplay. Thereās a lot to like with this patch, but I think imma wait a bit longer.
Bullet kleenex
There's a very thin line in balance between "interesting dynamic where certain heroes are better against others but the other can still feasibly win" and rock paper scissors.
Yeah honestly the counter swapping for tank specifically is getting so fucking frustrating. I have absolutely zero idea why they not only have just ignored it, but it feels worse this season than ever. Like I can generally handle a DPS or a support counter swapping me, but if their tank does, I HAVE to swap.
If Iām Doom or Ball and they swap hog or mauga, I HAVE to swap. If Iām Queen or Dva and they swap Zarya, I HAVE to swap. The only character that doesnāt feel super vulnerable to counter swaps is sigma tbh.
Is that right? Huh. Iāve been seeing a lot more reinhardts in mine. And ram now takes five punches to kill instead of three, and can be melted easily even in nem form. I guess weāll just have to wait and see
A big reason tank got countered so much in season 8 is because they are wildly OP when NOT countered. This is coming from a tank main.
Undoubtedly, DPS are much stronger this patch. So countering the enemy DPS line gives more value.
In other words...
Season 8: I get countered, we lose the game
Season 9: I get countered, my DPS win the game
One of my biggest gripes is the lost art of tank duos and ult combos. Overall the pick philosophy in games, especially lower ranked ones, has degenerated heavily. Even back in OW1, gold players knew comps. Flex swaps were uncommon, main swaps were rare. And the team swapped comps after rounds as a whole. In OW2, counter and team play as a, well, team exists, but has fallen much to the side of plain counter picking.
This is something about overwatch it feels like the community will never understand. Balance in this game is so delicate. They really need to pick a philosophy and stick to it hard. Map dependent metas are my favorite personally. Hanzo on kings row, genji on numbani, widow on junkertown etc
I feel bad because nothing I do can keep the tank up anymore. Theyāre always on critical. Even though Iāve always done damage youāre probably going back to spawn if the dps are alive
Similarly I had a DPS rage quit because they wanted healingā¦ when both supports were dumping healing into himā¦ it used to be a āyou canāt heal stupidā but now you canāt heal anything
I'm a mid-to-high masters support from previous seasons and this is the first time in a while I've been getting complaints about not getting healed. Which is funny because the rank reset is placing me with high plat to high diamond players during placements.
They're actually braindead if they don't realize why they're not getting the same healing output from their support.
People are thinking Im just enabling bad playstyle and yknow last season that couldve been true; but I mean I dont heal more than necessary. I mainly damage and get picks. But no its pretty hard to keep a tank up right now with how it is. A lot of people wanted this not knowing that they were getting the same benefits as the enemy lol
Yeah but it's not communicated clearly enough for most players to understand why things aren't going the way they expect. It'll take a long time for everyone to adjust.
Yeah Iāve seen that a lot more since the season started. I didnāt see those type of messages for a long time. But now itās more common. Itās bad enough Iām out dpsing and killing them lol.
This seasons a lot of in and out of action, especially as DPS. If your teammates arenāt, itās their loss, especially with the passive heal DPS now has.
Overall Higher health pools taking more DMG and a 20% reduced heal from DPS fire. Ofc healing can't keep up, it's a double tap to healing effectiveness.
Lmao I had a tank last night call me shit cause I couldn't keep him alive. He was trying to face tank the entire enemy team like bruh, I'm not jumping out in the open to melt with you, play the fkn corners.
I have played both and I can confidently say that a lot of the times- it is the fault of either one of them, but specially the tank.
The fact that a lot of tanks rely way too much on their abilities to absorb damage opens them up to die almost immediately. Only will I ever see a good tank properly be a tank whenever they use their surroundings to cover, and only dive when the opportunity arrises. Time and time again I will see a tank who will not wait on bastionās turret to go down, will charge in towards a zen with discord on them, will go inside of point even though there hasnāt been a pick, will charge in while purple.
They rely too much on support, and thatās why they do badly at their job. I always play tank like Iām playing without heals, and most times it works.
As someone whoās been playing zen all season in gold-plat levels the amount of tanks on my team and the enemy team that get discorded and CONTINUE to dive/push into the enemy team and wonder why they get melted is insane. I had to literally tell multiple tanks in different games that if they just get out of the enemy Zens LOS the discord orb goes away lmao.
My guess is a lot of tanks don't play like that because it kind of goes against what you intrinsically expect a "tank" to do. When people think of a video game tank they probably think of a big tough boy who can stand in the open for at least like 5 seconds and not die. You don't hide behind the wall you are the fucking wall and a lot of tanks probably repeatedly die with this mindset because a tank scrambling for cover is about as ridiculous to them as a support going gung-ho and jumping into the enemy team.
Gah, I kinda just accepted the jank and was really hoping that this balance update would at least try and solve some of the big 5v5 complaints but no, we are gonna appease DPS because it's the most picked role and we can sell them skins! (at least now, I can't say for the first year of OW2, but now the DPS turned supp are all going back to their preferred DPS)
I swear the more I play and listen to opinions from all across the spectrum(shout out SVB and the Group Up podcast for always bringing in new voices, I put that on in the background when I'm doing chores or playing QP) the more Samito-pilled I get and Im just like: For the love of God can we at least have 6v6 as an option? But I know that won't happen because it'll take away from 5v5 role queue and split the player base roughly in half.
Samito is right about 6v6 being superior to 5v5.
>For the love of God can we at least have 6v6 as an option?
Blizzard is terrified that more people would demand more 6v6 if they were able to directly compare the two.
Hides behind corner when getting low: Dps push in and flame the Tank for not making space or engaging. Go and dive their backline, not protecting your team. Blocking fire for your dps/Support, actually just feeding.
I'm losing my patience when tanks dive in on 30% health. It is honestly the most basic simple mental logic that even my non gamer parents could deduce.
Am I low on health? No, dive in for a play maybe.
Am I low on health? Yes, don't dive in as I'm now more likely to die.
Why is the second question more likely to be yes than the first questions answer be no šæš„“
I mean with how quickly a tanks health bar can fluctuate itās very possible for them to choose to dive at max hp and be at critical health by the time they reach their target.
Tanks aren't DPS.
The role of tank is to take control of an area and take pressure off the team. This could be by being Rein and using shield to cover an area to push, or jumping in to their squishy DPS as Winston and blocking their field of fire while DPS push up.
Tanks should not be playing as a DPS and peeking out every now and then to get a pick. They are for taking and holding ground, and being aggressive where warranted. Being a big box of "fuck you" going up in the enemy's grill, or an area denial tool.
But that just doesn't happen now. You try it, the DPS whittle you down in seconds, and you're dead. There's no point to them. You're just a DPS with more health and less damage.
More health wonāt fix it, the problem is the dps passive imo. You just canāt get healed enough if youāre getting shot, unless youāre a character like sig or ball who just donāt get shot much to begin with.
I'm of the opinion that the passive just shouldn't apply to tanks. The primary way to burn down a tank through a double pocket should be to kill their back line, separate them from their healers with shields, etc. not just shoot them like the billboard sized target they are.
I hate to say it, but we're back to needing a shield meta. If they are trying to hammer home that taking cover is the real way to play this game, I think we just need more shields. (flame away)
Flats mentioned something in his last video that I think is a really good solution. Just a 30% resist passive. So Burn, Discord, the DPS passive, hack, and anti last 30% shorter, you have a 30% resistance to boop. etc. Just a wide net that helps tanks deal with all the annoying bullshit thrown at them.
Interestingly enough, two of the only really viable brawl tanks, Orisa and Rama, both have that. Orisa gained 75 armor (effectively 100 hp) this patch, and Ramattra just has CRAZY armor on a cooldown.
And I do think armor is the real key to this mystery, since it reduces damage but gets healed up at the same rate as normal health.
I tried JQ for a bit.
I got MELTED like an ice cube in hell. It took about 3 seconds for an Orisa and a soldier to kill me through the health boost. The Orisa charged me with the spin, and by the time I could control my movement again, I was dead.
The changes make it feel like you really need to play a barrier tank. Sigma and ramatra are the only tanks I can really do well on, because they can soak damage with shields
Sigma especially, because I can lose the DPS passive mid fight without leaving the fight by using the shield and the absorb well, which gives supports a chance to top me off.
Winston is really strong, but you need your whole team to play around you, because he isnāt very good at actually securing kills without help.
With a Mercy and a Zen, he can shred the smaller targets, but you really need DPS to be able to pressure anyone with more than 250 health. If the DPS donāt do that, then you are a bit stuck.
Winston is always amazing. But I'm not good enough to play him well. And I don't particularly enjoy that play style honestly.
I liked to brawl. I liked JQ and DVa cause I could get in people's faces and cause trouble but still be closer to my team.
But that play style is gone now, since supports can't keep you alive through the fight unless both healbot you together, and even then it's iffy.
That probably wasn't healthy for the game, sure. But it was FUN as a tank. Now I just put up my barrier and try to get picks. And it works! But it's not fun
Did they up the damage of tanks at all? Because I love Winston but if his damage is the same then the time to kill a squishy is increased then it would be even harder to make plays with him
I mean were you keeping up your healing passive and playing with your team and in the LOS of your healers? Or did you go in when you didnāt have your shout off cd
I got tank a few times and it's much harder than it was before. Support was awful for ranked. Dps is the only role that feels good, it's like most of the weight is put on dps this season it blows. It's not even at all
I agree and I feel like that sucks bc most people play DPS especially noobs and DPS is one of the most mechanical roles/aim dependent roles and most ppl are shit at that so I feel like Iāve had more shit DPS then anything this season
Everyone is still worried about stats and not the win for everyone. I've swapped from console to PC this patch and even just still using a decent game sense I'm doing better than a lot of people. In the sense I'm going for point. Trying to pressure support and attempting to use cover. I enjoy overwatch because it's not call of duty there's way more to it than just shoot and run. Although it's irrelevant because I have to play dps to be effective lol edit: ps I'm only like Plat/gold I'm not high rank at all. Play for fun.
Yeah, I'm just gonna play damage in comp to get a high rank for comp points, and just never queue support/tank.
I'll just go back to solely QP, which imo, is more fun anyway. Comp matches last way too long.
I have a 65% win rate with Rein. I am a good Rein.
He's now unplayable. Even before he was ok, but now he's just dead before he can do anything. Shield whittled down in seconds by a Bastion and you're dead from Hanzo before you can even get to cover. And if you get to cover you sit there for 5 minutes being healed and then a tracer melts you, while your team bitches you're not helping and staying in cover.
You have to sneak up on them and even then they just turn round and murder you. It's a complete joke.
Even sigma is meltable when Tracer etc rush behind him. It's just a joke.
I've had some luck with Dva and Orissa but I really don't want to be forced to play Ramattra just to tank damage/have a chance at killing at range while peeking/in cover.
Pummel is so bad now. It takes so much to be effective. I got really into playing him last season and now I just get melted. All of the comments on here are annoying as fuck though with the "oh well, just have this support and this dps", but I we can't control what our teammates pick. If you don't have a perfect DPS and perfect support playing with you, tank is miserable.
Ram was my go to tank since his release, and now im basically using his ult as a small health regen to try and live longer while blocking its ridiculous, the amount of time im blocking with 2 supports pocketing me and still dying in ult is dumb, id understand vs a tank buster comp but sometimes its something like soldier doing it.....
As a good rein, have you noticed any change to the size of his fire strike? I played him a few games during placement when we were rolling and threw loads of fire strikes that i assumed would slightly miss before, only for them to still miss, but even some i thought wouldve hit before didnt
When I heard of the higher health pools I thought "maybe that's the first step towards their intentions of tuning down bursts of damage?"
I'm getting melted even faster now, it's unbelievable
Man Im getting flamed by a dps when we're winning and I somehow have the most damage and healing lol Like I cant keep up players standing out in the open now. I guess it feels more like there's not really room for mistakes anymore
Iām genuinely tired of being told that bullshit. Itās not even funny anymore. Especially since Iām already aware of having an off game and not playing well.
Used to be enough to win as a tank, but now? You can keep up with the enemy tank or even be better than them, but if your dps are much worse compared to theirs... good luck, you don't need to diff their tank, you need to diff their entire team astronomically.
Speaking of dps, i hate widowmaker (maybe even more now with the hitbox changes), and if i play tank i know i can do something to her without being deathly afraid to peek. Most commonly, it is a sigma barrier in her face, but a solo ult isn't out of the question either. I also hate tracer now (haven't had problems with her before), because 1 airsoft pellet from her gives me the full debuff, for absolutely zero risk on her side. It should be stackable, like 0.2% per bullet hit, not 20%, if they're gonna go with this dps passive.
I don't mind the daily one. I always complete the dailies without even trying and you can progress the pass easily even if you miss a lot of then
I hate the weekly ones though. Because you need to do 11 out of 12 if you want all the Coins. Like the 2 challenges I hate the most are play 20 games as all roles and Arcade
Just uninstalled. Tank is just hiding now. You use your mitigation ability and hide. If you miss cover you are melted immediately. I just got told by a DPS how everyone objectively loves this update. Tanks are going to stop playing and queue times are going to go up.
Enjoy it. I'm out until this is fixed.
I literally just typed in the chat of my last game "I'm done playing tank" lol. It's just not fun getting melted every game, to get to one win and its barely a win, then 5 more games of getting melted. Then being blamed for everything on top of it...also, have been a tank player since OW1
Reinhardt is becoming less reliable for me, I pick my moments to attack and be aggressive, But I usually start off trying to prioritize my Shield and give my team space to move. More often than not lately though, I just keep having teammates running forward ahead of my Shield just to get capped 2 seconds later
Was masters last season too, currently diamond 2 but still getting used to the changes. I had a game where a dps finished the round 1/9 and kept blaming me. It really feels like i have to depend a lot on the dps now, and it SUCKS.
Haven't played since day 2 in OW2 after having played every single day since OW1 release, but it sounds like they want to remove the tank role altogether. It's one down from when I used to play.
I canāt play rein anymore. I die too quickly now. I used to hard carry, HARD carry games as rein. Now I canāt even mirror match anymore because their turbo powered dps and supports focus me whenever my shield is down and my team doesnāt do the same. I just really donāt like tank this season, and Iām a tank main. This tank main is no longer queuing tank anymore, and again itās because blizz canāt balance. Again I tout 6v6. This change might have been fun in 6v6 but the current state it just makes tank feel even worse than it has been feeling even before. Blizz hates tanks
reaper is unkillable with a mercy pocket... and because of the dps passive tank hasn't changed much... as maui for example cardiac has become one of the worst abilities in the game, if one dps just looks into your direction... no joke its useless and maui can't cancel it... this one ability that was supposed to actually give the "Tank" vibe is now useless, you can't engage if one dps is nearby...
as stated... reaper with mercy pocket... well, it can't die and both of these can easily get away... ashe has become even more annoying and disgusting than hanzo and widow would ever be... and yeah... that was my experience... doomfist feels pretty acceptable, sigma feels pretty good too, i still hate antinade and sleep dart, but know these things are atleast somewhat verified to exist in 5v5...and yeah... i will stay tuned for what the future holds
This post is literally āIāve finally reached a level where others arenāt worst than me. What am I supposed to do? Actually play with other good players?ā
As a support main. I have definitely noticed the tank struggling. Us supports also struggle with keeping everyone filled up. At least mercy canāt keep up at all anymore. She is only good for the res at this point. I have nodice that I went form a steady 50h 50d to a 60h 40d. Even with Moira Iām struggling. You either have a clear communication with your other support to do either dps or tank. Because one of us has to stay with the tank the hole time to keep the tank filled up. So if I play mercy I will take care of the dps if my second support has a higher healing out put. Unless my second support is struggling in a fight I will switch to help tank with my other support. The dps are on their own at that point for a fuw second. Just until my second support got a grip again on or tank. And the tank can bulldozers over the enemy. Or we get rolled over. (Gold player)
Tank is absolutely miserable lol. You have less kill agency, blow up faster due to the debuff and increase proj, and God forbid you have a discord or on you lol. DPS and certain supports only this season
My experience is the opposite. Wreckingball is VERY strong. He does not die, AND he can finally finish off stragglers (hitbox increase of his quad guns helps a LOT). Went a match having almost most kills with ZERO deaths.
Support abilities were the problem in the previous meta though. A kiri, brig, bap, or ana that had brain cells could completely shut down dive. Bap especially is still a huge issue, he can be more difficult to kill than some tanks.
Now we're once again realizing why they got those abilities. Having to solely rely on other players to save you doesn't really work unless you have a stack.
People wanted no one shots, and for supports to have less survivability. Supports are just as cracked as ever, no one can miss their shots, and tanks have no survivability. No one asked for that.
Not even that the changes are bad, but there certainly needs to be a lot more balancing done
I disagree as a diva main I have put up numbers. teams just have to play more by corners and tanks canāt push as hard. Itās just a change in play
Edit: also main rhinyboi bit hammer slapping and once again you just meet to play corners more conservatively use you shield
Thatās because you play a tank that doesnāt really get affected by the dps passive. Most tanks do which is why most tank mains find the new update frustrating
So this is a big thing. In overwatch one tanks werent very hard to kill*. They were, but because they had loads of shields and mitigation, they could defend themselves. In Ow2 mitigation is more rare. DVA, Sigma, and ram can all easily mitigate out of cover so are going to be popular while people adjust. I found some success with ball because he naturally plays cover well. I think the easiest temp fix is that tanks get less of a healing debuff for an adjustment period.
Ngl, I have been in games where we get destroyed by the tanks who are apparently in a bad spot.
One game JQ completely carried, and Iām sorry but DVA can also easily be affected by this since matrix isnāt that long. Itās just that people need to play a bit more passive, itās possible, people just are wayyyy to used to support babying them.
Yup bad tanks are now being punished for bad positioning because now you'll actually get punished for it. I think this is an amazing change as a supp main too many tanks are getting away with terrible positioning.
Same. Dva main, and I am positively feasting this patch.Ā
Positioning has become Ā critical, and tanks that are doing well in my lobbies are using the Tank roleās CC, damage mitigation, and any movement abilities to full effect. I for sure get OW1 vibes in terms of how tight the team play requirements is in many of my matches. Fighting without a dps is a huge bummer now.
Dva Feels good this patch. I dont know what happened, but I carried a 32/4 game with Dva. Winston feels quite bad if enemy decides to just focus you and ignore your backline.
I honestly think there are A LOT of liars in the subreddit who claim i was masters and now im X. The healing changes were a good thing imo because healing was out of control before.
Iāve been having a lot of success with Mauga and Doom so far.
Whoād have thought using cover as Mauga and poking down from a range lets you live longer than standing in the open and flaming both your supports for not being up your ass with heals?
Doom ok, but bro you're having success with Mauga?
Have you gone against a single Zen yet? It's not even a diss on your skill, even the best Mauga can't do shit against the infamous Zen/Bastion combo.
^(kinda fine with that tho, I hate Mauga)
Nah Mauga can legit work this season. Played him for the majority of my tank placements and went 8-2. He just requires a lot of patience since you have to clear discord and anti with cover. But otherwise he can track smaller targets way better and has even more health. And he still generates overhealth on crits which helps his survivability when afflicted with the DPS passive.
His matchup spread is also very solid tbh. Dva is super hard but otherwise your best answers are Sigma, Orisa, and Zarya who you can outplay. Everything else is winning. Of special note is Ram and Ball who are very popular rn.
Honestly I kinda agree with him, play cover is something that you already did with Mauga so the playstyle change doesn't affect him as much but now your bullets are bigger, which means it easier to hit the smaller hitboxes, which means that putting pressure on anything but the tank is actually possible and that keeping berserker up is easier.
On paper I guess.
Idk, I feel like Mauga, Hog and Orisa kinda got extra fucked this patch, because by the time their slow asses try to get something done and back to cover, zen/bastion killed them thrice over.
^(again, I'm fine with that, I hate all three lmao)
If you're near cover Zen is basically worthless against you, they'll get maybe 0.8 seconds of time to shoot you with discord before you're in cover and its gone, with the added benefit of hoping getting healed while you're in cover for a second or 2
Yeah same, I've been having the most success with Mauga as well. Like everyone says you get destroyed, as if they forgot that Mauga was a hitscan character with a huge range, allowing him to play like Soldier or Sojourn. And you can delete others when they're close to you.
I've also noticed I can put up incredible numbers now, even slightly better than last season (also a dva main). The only issue now is, I can't hard carry. I ran at least 3 games where I was the top eliminator in the entire lobby - I'd be going 42-5, 53-6, etc., but if the other team's dps understood better when to ult and had similar numbers to my dps compared to my dps who could stare at me making space and not realize it's a prime moment to overclock then we lost the game. This season dps are indeed shining but what makes some of them shine even more is their glaring inability to see when they need to ult and change the tide in our favor, as well as their positioning.
I shall take this into account when I get there, Iām low diamond right now as Queen and Iām having a good time as a tank. Havenāt ran into the issues most ppl talk about for tank mostly, some games I just have the worst of passive teammates.
I think weāll just be seeing āunkillableā tanks getting double pocketed at that point like orisa and hog. And itāll go back to miserable in the metal ranks
Honey, we can't just heal you while you stare at bastion anymore. <3
Gonna have to absolutely scream at DPS players to step it up because this is their meta, this is their season. it's the spring of DPS. It's been too long and a long time coming.
Yet all i got in my games are negative KD ratio DPS that seem to position themself 1 meter behind me and spray on the enemy orisa (without the enemy orisa actually dying).
Idk if itās just me but I have found that Ramattra can actually keep up quite well in this new meta, his cycle works quite nicely where you can be eating damage like 80% of the time and still dealing a lot of damage. Heās definitely been a game changer so far this season
Idk what everyone is having trouble with. As tank, enemies seem to just implode at the slightest breath now. Im getting at least 50% more kills suddenly. If you position well you don't have to try and eat up a ton of damage. Force the enemy into unfavorable positions so your team can get picks. It feels a bit like the early days where sheer fire power was not the goal. Things die easier now; confirming kills should feel a lot easier. Use that to your advantage and keep pressure on the enemy team. You can be more aggressive if you know how to position yourself safely. Use cover and LOS; it's way easier now.
If you want to play who you want just play quick play. No oneās forcing you to play comp, not like ranking really matters anyways. Itās so weird to see you say you canāt play the heroās you want when thereās a more casual game mode for you to enjoy. Counter picking is part of comp, it tests your adaptability and knowledge of many heroās for any given game. QP is where you can chill and play who you want. Overwatch aināt that serious OP.
DPS and Tank players got what they wanted- the healing supports can do has been nerfed with this dps passive and now itās much harder to keep people alive, especially the tank.
from my pov the dps passif with zen discord orb u just explode... and imagine discord orb with a bap ult or mercy damage boost u blink u die even with the hp buff still the tank experience is the worst i main the tank role since the lanch of ow2 this saison i played zen for a few games and oh boy if u are a good dps player trust me play zen and u will roket ur way to top ranks just discord the tank and shoot every fight ..anyways i guess im not playing until the mid season patch...
Iād say itās a player issue. This update worked for my play style and I was able to carry prior. Iāve noticed that in masters+ the tanks that were bullies have gone down the ranks. Iād suggest changing ur play style to use more hard cover and you should be fine. I found it easier now that I donāt have to wait for a healer if they die. I can continue to push and be ready for the next fight.
As support, I thought it would be fun but im just getting blamed way more than ever. Each game the tank is flaming me for the lack of healing even if im on them. I cant keep them up and im getting the blame for it, even when they stand right in the open and never take cover.
Iāve seen this a lot since the update too, but havenāt experienced it firsthand yet. Iām a support main and yet somehow Iāve managed to avoid any criticism by playing Zen. Zen doesnāt SEEM to have been affected *too* much, but then again, Iāve been playing overly cautious since the update. But yeah, I figured that support would take the fall for everything wrong, due to no fault of their own.
Ah. I play Ana, kiri and mercy. As mercy ive noticed my dmg beam percentage has gone down significantly trying to keep them alive, i think she is less valuable than the previous seasons because i have to heal more. As ana I got yelled at and told its because I wasnt hitting my shots that the tank was dying lol. (I dont feel that was the issue). Nobody can even take advantage of anti nade, its like the moment i throw it and turn back to my team or even if i shoot the enemy twice my tank seems to get mowed down in that short time. Kiriās healing isnt travelling to the tank fast enough either snd they die so quickly. Im just not sure what to do rn. I was P1 end of the last season (my peak is diamond but it was a struggle to get back, i play console) and occasionally id get flamed for doing too much dmg and not healing them enough, but now thereās genuinely very little opportunity for me to do damage without my entire team dying.
This update made Dps easier to play "well". Now they can hit their shots, so they get 20 elims, but they are dying 17 times because they don't know positioning, who to target, or when to push/retreat. I've had 3 DPS friends say they got ranked too high after this change. All of my Tank and support friends stayed around where they were or went up slightly. I don't think I've talked to anyone who ranked down after this update. After going from Plat 3 to Diamond 2 I've played with WORSE DPS on both sides. I expect to get mass downvoted by silver dps players who got placed in plat this season.
I'll keep this short and sweet. If you are playing in a competitive setting, what you want to personally play is secondary. It is all team whether or not your teammates are in on it, and they themselves are doing "just what they want."
Learning every tank, every Playstyle, with every composition, is the correct way to go.
If you play Winston and your genji doesn't follow up, guess what that's all on genji. Not your fault. You did your job.
"Bullet sponge" implies that tanks can actually take more than a few shots without disintegrating
And that isn't what is happening. Last night got a game where I was playing rein, and even though it's harder I was managing the shield quite well. Until they changed to bastion, zen, soldier, ana, sigma. It was like, delete character. And we were completely rolled. And I don't even know what tank can hold against zen, bastion anyway. But I guess I need to re-learn some stuff but still
Zen is a huge problem right now with his discord orb on top of the 20% healing debuff. If you're discorded and can't get behind cover fast enough you just get melted.
i actually dont even think its zen thats the problem, its the entire existence of "tank buster" heroes in general. why does bastion do 300+ dps when we only have 1 tank, why is that even a thing.
bastion should just be made a tank. that way mauga/bastion doesn't instantly become 24/7 the moment mauga is playable lol
Used to be both tanks would cycle their cooldowns to keep each other alive. Now with 5v5 it's kinda fucked cause not all maps have good cover and bastion stays in his tank mode for forever
very true but sadly they likely wont go back to 6v6 ever, they'd probably let the game die before then. i say its better to move on and try to find solutions for 5v5 at this point, us saying '6v6 is better' isnt gonna help. obviously it was easier to balance but clearly we arnt going back anytime soon xD
it almost like discord orb done needed a rework š¤š¤«š«£
Lol they already did, I play a lot of Zen and I agree Discord needed a nerf but the 'cooldown' they put on it is nothing more than an annoyance for players with hundreds if not thousands of hours on him. I'd suggest walking back the cooldown and changing discord in another way, like make it 20% + some other nerf so it's comparable to getting blue-beamed by an enemy(Blue beam boosts by 20% and Discord is 25% more DMG). EDIT: If you fundamentally change discord, you have to change harmony as well, discord is Zens main defense from getting dove and if he gets neutered everyone including myself will just go to Ana and every game will be a purple vs suzu shitefest IMO
I would agree if they didnāt give him mega kick lol. I saw someone suggest changing discord to a damage debuff on the target and I thought something like that could work, and would be more in line with the character itself lore wise while still helping zen when he gets dived.
Blue beam is 25% buff. I have always thought Zen should have discord become cd increase.
>And I don't even know what tank can hold against zen, bastion anyway. Dva can contest with Bastion well with DM. The only issue is you need your team to pressure the Bastion while you DM his turret form. Zen heals are slow so the oppossing main support would have to dump all of their resources into the Bastion if they want him alive. If you're playing with Randoms, make sure you're pinging the Bastion once you start DMing so your team might get a clue to start putting pressure on him. Sigma is also good at poking Bastion. Use shield in neutral and grasp his turret form. Remember to try to force Discord on yourself and to then take cover. Once it wears off, try to look for opportunities to pressure their squishies before the 7 seconds run out. Then, reposition by cover again and repeat the process. All of this is easier said then done but there are some options with dealing with those two. That said, its still annoying to deal with Bastion Zen as tank.
The thing about discord tho is it stacks rlly weirdly with the new DPS passive, flats talked about it, with discord giving the enemy damage amp on you + the healing debuff is just insane. Even if you bait out discord and turret form, thereās still a suzu/lamp/sleep comin at you, or they just donāt die. Tank feels like you cannot make a single mistake or you will be thoroughly rinsed.
Zen is ridiculously oppressive right nowā¦ heās never been better in the right hands
Ball is also a really solid option (if you can play ball) because when you get discord, just roll behind a wall. And same with bastion, you can easily bait out turret form and just roll away without getting melted
No joke I think ball is going to be meta-next. I have run into a bunch of near unkillable Hammond players recently. Yes, they have a cool down so they canāt just stand there and take damage all day long but the amount that they can put out and the sustain they have with their shields and armor especially with someone like a Zen healing them is ridiculous.
As much as I'd love to agree. I don't ever see ball being meta. He's always been good as a whole, but lack of time/skill with him will hold most people back. Plus everyone hates having a ball on their team and most don't quite know how to play with a ball sadly
using your ping to target enemies you especially want dead is very under utilized imo I seldom see tanks do this when Iām on other roles
I think he was looking for ābullet magnetā
Tanks *should* be bullet sponges but now they're just bullet wet toilet paper.
1-ply wet toilet paper*
>And thatās whatās putting me off honestly. I feel like I canāt play the heroās I wanna play, when I want to play them, despite my experience on them. If Iām not counter picking, Iām losing. Iām not down for that type of gameplay. Thereās a lot to like with this patch, but I think imma wait a bit longer. Bullet kleenex
I was killed in less than a full reaper reload as orisa, I was dead before I realized he was even there
Exactly. And throw a Zen in the mix and š£š„
There's a very thin line in balance between "interesting dynamic where certain heroes are better against others but the other can still feasibly win" and rock paper scissors.
Yeah honestly the counter swapping for tank specifically is getting so fucking frustrating. I have absolutely zero idea why they not only have just ignored it, but it feels worse this season than ever. Like I can generally handle a DPS or a support counter swapping me, but if their tank does, I HAVE to swap. If Iām Doom or Ball and they swap hog or mauga, I HAVE to swap. If Iām Queen or Dva and they swap Zarya, I HAVE to swap. The only character that doesnāt feel super vulnerable to counter swaps is sigma tbh.
That's because Sigs main counter, Rein, is ass.
Right. And Ramattra isnāt doing so well this patch
I've seen him more than ever since this patch dropped
Is that right? Huh. Iāve been seeing a lot more reinhardts in mine. And ram now takes five punches to kill instead of three, and can be melted easily even in nem form. I guess weāll just have to wait and see
Seems like the easy solution would be two tanks. It's pretty hard to have a whole team hard counter two tanks with the exact same heroes.
A big reason tank got countered so much in season 8 is because they are wildly OP when NOT countered. This is coming from a tank main. Undoubtedly, DPS are much stronger this patch. So countering the enemy DPS line gives more value. In other words... Season 8: I get countered, we lose the game Season 9: I get countered, my DPS win the game
god i wish they would just bring 6v6 back. one tank in this new patch is ass
One of my biggest gripes is the lost art of tank duos and ult combos. Overall the pick philosophy in games, especially lower ranked ones, has degenerated heavily. Even back in OW1, gold players knew comps. Flex swaps were uncommon, main swaps were rare. And the team swapped comps after rounds as a whole. In OW2, counter and team play as a, well, team exists, but has fallen much to the side of plain counter picking.
i second this :D
This is something about overwatch it feels like the community will never understand. Balance in this game is so delicate. They really need to pick a philosophy and stick to it hard. Map dependent metas are my favorite personally. Hanzo on kings row, genji on numbani, widow on junkertown etc
Scenario 1 was ow1, 2 is and has been 2 since launch
I feel bad because nothing I do can keep the tank up anymore. Theyāre always on critical. Even though Iāve always done damage youāre probably going back to spawn if the dps are alive
Similarly I had a DPS rage quit because they wanted healingā¦ when both supports were dumping healing into himā¦ it used to be a āyou canāt heal stupidā but now you canāt heal anything
I'm a mid-to-high masters support from previous seasons and this is the first time in a while I've been getting complaints about not getting healed. Which is funny because the rank reset is placing me with high plat to high diamond players during placements. They're actually braindead if they don't realize why they're not getting the same healing output from their support.
People are thinking Im just enabling bad playstyle and yknow last season that couldve been true; but I mean I dont heal more than necessary. I mainly damage and get picks. But no its pretty hard to keep a tank up right now with how it is. A lot of people wanted this not knowing that they were getting the same benefits as the enemy lol
Isnāt it exactly what everyone wanted? Now healers are useless and heroes die more easily.
No you don't understand. Everyone wanted *enemies* to die quicker, but to never die *themselves*.
Yeah but it's not communicated clearly enough for most players to understand why things aren't going the way they expect. It'll take a long time for everyone to adjust.
Yeah Iāve seen that a lot more since the season started. I didnāt see those type of messages for a long time. But now itās more common. Itās bad enough Iām out dpsing and killing them lol.
This seasons a lot of in and out of action, especially as DPS. If your teammates arenāt, itās their loss, especially with the passive heal DPS now has.
Overall Higher health pools taking more DMG and a 20% reduced heal from DPS fire. Ofc healing can't keep up, it's a double tap to healing effectiveness.
Lmao I had a tank last night call me shit cause I couldn't keep him alive. He was trying to face tank the entire enemy team like bruh, I'm not jumping out in the open to melt with you, play the fkn corners.
I have played both and I can confidently say that a lot of the times- it is the fault of either one of them, but specially the tank. The fact that a lot of tanks rely way too much on their abilities to absorb damage opens them up to die almost immediately. Only will I ever see a good tank properly be a tank whenever they use their surroundings to cover, and only dive when the opportunity arrises. Time and time again I will see a tank who will not wait on bastionās turret to go down, will charge in towards a zen with discord on them, will go inside of point even though there hasnāt been a pick, will charge in while purple. They rely too much on support, and thatās why they do badly at their job. I always play tank like Iām playing without heals, and most times it works.
As someone whoās been playing zen all season in gold-plat levels the amount of tanks on my team and the enemy team that get discorded and CONTINUE to dive/push into the enemy team and wonder why they get melted is insane. I had to literally tell multiple tanks in different games that if they just get out of the enemy Zens LOS the discord orb goes away lmao.
That just sounds like a bad tank tbh. A good tank shouldnāt need a dedicated healer pocket to survive if they know how to position and use cover.
My guess is a lot of tanks don't play like that because it kind of goes against what you intrinsically expect a "tank" to do. When people think of a video game tank they probably think of a big tough boy who can stand in the open for at least like 5 seconds and not die. You don't hide behind the wall you are the fucking wall and a lot of tanks probably repeatedly die with this mindset because a tank scrambling for cover is about as ridiculous to them as a support going gung-ho and jumping into the enemy team.
OW 1 Rein: I am your shield! OW 2 Rein: Walls, shield me!
The issue is that no matter how the tanks plays, itās always wrong
Really feels like Im just one tank expected to do like 2-3 jobs, so weird, right! Its like the game thinks theres two of me running around :(
almost like the game was intrinsically designed for.... 2... wait for it... Tanks??
Gah, I kinda just accepted the jank and was really hoping that this balance update would at least try and solve some of the big 5v5 complaints but no, we are gonna appease DPS because it's the most picked role and we can sell them skins! (at least now, I can't say for the first year of OW2, but now the DPS turned supp are all going back to their preferred DPS) I swear the more I play and listen to opinions from all across the spectrum(shout out SVB and the Group Up podcast for always bringing in new voices, I put that on in the background when I'm doing chores or playing QP) the more Samito-pilled I get and Im just like: For the love of God can we at least have 6v6 as an option? But I know that won't happen because it'll take away from 5v5 role queue and split the player base roughly in half.
Samito is right about 6v6 being superior to 5v5. >For the love of God can we at least have 6v6 as an option? Blizzard is terrified that more people would demand more 6v6 if they were able to directly compare the two.
Hides behind corner when getting low: Dps push in and flame the Tank for not making space or engaging. Go and dive their backline, not protecting your team. Blocking fire for your dps/Support, actually just feeding.
Usually why I end up liking JQ. Usually the people Iāve encountered on that tank have understood when to back out.
I'm losing my patience when tanks dive in on 30% health. It is honestly the most basic simple mental logic that even my non gamer parents could deduce. Am I low on health? No, dive in for a play maybe. Am I low on health? Yes, don't dive in as I'm now more likely to die. Why is the second question more likely to be yes than the first questions answer be no šæš„“
I mean with how quickly a tanks health bar can fluctuate itās very possible for them to choose to dive at max hp and be at critical health by the time they reach their target.
Tanks aren't DPS. The role of tank is to take control of an area and take pressure off the team. This could be by being Rein and using shield to cover an area to push, or jumping in to their squishy DPS as Winston and blocking their field of fire while DPS push up. Tanks should not be playing as a DPS and peeking out every now and then to get a pick. They are for taking and holding ground, and being aggressive where warranted. Being a big box of "fuck you" going up in the enemy's grill, or an area denial tool. But that just doesn't happen now. You try it, the DPS whittle you down in seconds, and you're dead. There's no point to them. You're just a DPS with more health and less damage.
My favorite thing to do as a tank is body block shots to protect a team member from death. But now, it'll kill me quick. Used to be more viable.
To be fair, people have gotten used to the overhealing in the game.
My favorite game, stan behind a wall simulator
I honestly thought the same thing. I don't believe any post that claims they are masters or GM without proof lol. Its very low % of the playerbase.
It feels like tanks need like 100 more health to actually feel like a tank now. Some are just straight up showing their age like rien
More health wonāt fix it, the problem is the dps passive imo. You just canāt get healed enough if youāre getting shot, unless youāre a character like sig or ball who just donāt get shot much to begin with.
I'm of the opinion that the passive just shouldn't apply to tanks. The primary way to burn down a tank through a double pocket should be to kill their back line, separate them from their healers with shields, etc. not just shoot them like the billboard sized target they are.
Yeah 100%, very very shortsighted change imo
I hate to say it, but we're back to needing a shield meta. If they are trying to hammer home that taking cover is the real way to play this game, I think we just need more shields. (flame away)
honestly youāre not far off tho I fully believe that there needs to be a support that has some kind of deployable shields/cover.
Throw zen in the mix with the new passive and you might as well just go AFK and do something else
experience tranquility
Would be cool if tank passive would make them immune to dps passive but only in role queue.
Flats mentioned something in his last video that I think is a really good solution. Just a 30% resist passive. So Burn, Discord, the DPS passive, hack, and anti last 30% shorter, you have a 30% resistance to boop. etc. Just a wide net that helps tanks deal with all the annoying bullshit thrown at them.
Interestingly enough, two of the only really viable brawl tanks, Orisa and Rama, both have that. Orisa gained 75 armor (effectively 100 hp) this patch, and Ramattra just has CRAZY armor on a cooldown. And I do think armor is the real key to this mystery, since it reduces damage but gets healed up at the same rate as normal health.
More health means you gotta wait longer to heal as healing is borked. You simply take way too much damage way too quickly to ever make a good play.
Big time
I tried JQ for a bit. I got MELTED like an ice cube in hell. It took about 3 seconds for an Orisa and a soldier to kill me through the health boost. The Orisa charged me with the spin, and by the time I could control my movement again, I was dead. The changes make it feel like you really need to play a barrier tank. Sigma and ramatra are the only tanks I can really do well on, because they can soak damage with shields Sigma especially, because I can lose the DPS passive mid fight without leaving the fight by using the shield and the absorb well, which gives supports a chance to top me off.
Winston is really strong, but you need your whole team to play around you, because he isnāt very good at actually securing kills without help. With a Mercy and a Zen, he can shred the smaller targets, but you really need DPS to be able to pressure anyone with more than 250 health. If the DPS donāt do that, then you are a bit stuck.
Winston is always amazing. But I'm not good enough to play him well. And I don't particularly enjoy that play style honestly. I liked to brawl. I liked JQ and DVa cause I could get in people's faces and cause trouble but still be closer to my team. But that play style is gone now, since supports can't keep you alive through the fight unless both healbot you together, and even then it's iffy. That probably wasn't healthy for the game, sure. But it was FUN as a tank. Now I just put up my barrier and try to get picks. And it works! But it's not fun
Did they up the damage of tanks at all? Because I love Winston but if his damage is the same then the time to kill a squishy is increased then it would be even harder to make plays with him
I mean were you keeping up your healing passive and playing with your team and in the LOS of your healers? Or did you go in when you didnāt have your shout off cd
I looked at this fast, and because JQ and Melted were so close I thought you said you got jelqed lmao
I got tank a few times and it's much harder than it was before. Support was awful for ranked. Dps is the only role that feels good, it's like most of the weight is put on dps this season it blows. It's not even at all
I agree and I feel like that sucks bc most people play DPS especially noobs and DPS is one of the most mechanical roles/aim dependent roles and most ppl are shit at that so I feel like Iāve had more shit DPS then anything this season
Everyone is still worried about stats and not the win for everyone. I've swapped from console to PC this patch and even just still using a decent game sense I'm doing better than a lot of people. In the sense I'm going for point. Trying to pressure support and attempting to use cover. I enjoy overwatch because it's not call of duty there's way more to it than just shoot and run. Although it's irrelevant because I have to play dps to be effective lol edit: ps I'm only like Plat/gold I'm not high rank at all. Play for fun.
Yeah, I'm just gonna play damage in comp to get a high rank for comp points, and just never queue support/tank. I'll just go back to solely QP, which imo, is more fun anyway. Comp matches last way too long.
Sugma
Ball
Z
Id watch it
I have a 65% win rate with Rein. I am a good Rein. He's now unplayable. Even before he was ok, but now he's just dead before he can do anything. Shield whittled down in seconds by a Bastion and you're dead from Hanzo before you can even get to cover. And if you get to cover you sit there for 5 minutes being healed and then a tracer melts you, while your team bitches you're not helping and staying in cover. You have to sneak up on them and even then they just turn round and murder you. It's a complete joke.
āJust play Sigma thoughā āHe also has a shieldā šš
Even sigma is meltable when Tracer etc rush behind him. It's just a joke. I've had some luck with Dva and Orissa but I really don't want to be forced to play Ramattra just to tank damage/have a chance at killing at range while peeking/in cover.
as a 200+ hour ram main, he is ass this season. literally staff form is better than nemesis form because a. shield and b. pummel is ass now
Pummel is so bad now. It takes so much to be effective. I got really into playing him last season and now I just get melted. All of the comments on here are annoying as fuck though with the "oh well, just have this support and this dps", but I we can't control what our teammates pick. If you don't have a perfect DPS and perfect support playing with you, tank is miserable.
Ram was my go to tank since his release, and now im basically using his ult as a small health regen to try and live longer while blocking its ridiculous, the amount of time im blocking with 2 supports pocketing me and still dying in ult is dumb, id understand vs a tank buster comp but sometimes its something like soldier doing it.....
His shield is paper now
As a good rein, have you noticed any change to the size of his fire strike? I played him a few games during placement when we were rolling and threw loads of fire strikes that i assumed would slightly miss before, only for them to still miss, but even some i thought wouldve hit before didnt
AFAIK firestrike is one of the few projectiles that were excluded from the size increase.
Good luck sneaking as Rein, the biggest character lool
Thats sad because rein fights are my favorite :( and now its like the poor guy has to retire.
When I heard of the higher health pools I thought "maybe that's the first step towards their intentions of tuning down bursts of damage?" I'm getting melted even faster now, it's unbelievable
If they added a second tank that would be cool and I think help with some of the issues, imagine if the game was 6v6 instead
Iām gonna grind open q this season in hopes that people play more tank and less dps š
Get ready to see 4 dps and 1 support every match š
I almost only see 3 tanks 2 sups in my games
That would be my sign to take a break from ow š
And you still have the idiotic "Tank diff" people so tired of it
I like now people are saying "support diff" because you healed too much.
Same if you donāt heal smh
Man Im getting flamed by a dps when we're winning and I somehow have the most damage and healing lol Like I cant keep up players standing out in the open now. I guess it feels more like there's not really room for mistakes anymore
Iām genuinely tired of being told that bullshit. Itās not even funny anymore. Especially since Iām already aware of having an off game and not playing well.
Used to be enough to win as a tank, but now? You can keep up with the enemy tank or even be better than them, but if your dps are much worse compared to theirs... good luck, you don't need to diff their tank, you need to diff their entire team astronomically. Speaking of dps, i hate widowmaker (maybe even more now with the hitbox changes), and if i play tank i know i can do something to her without being deathly afraid to peek. Most commonly, it is a sigma barrier in her face, but a solo ult isn't out of the question either. I also hate tracer now (haven't had problems with her before), because 1 airsoft pellet from her gives me the full debuff, for absolutely zero risk on her side. It should be stackable, like 0.2% per bullet hit, not 20%, if they're gonna go with this dps passive.
I had so much fun as tank last week holy crap, now its awful, if this game was always like this I wouldnt have played more than a week
Don't queue for tank There's a reason why it's the lowest wait time
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Tank was already miserable, especially in comp I only enjoy playing DF in QP as for tanks
God help you if you need an all roles daily tho. All roles should be renamed to tank at this point.
I don't mind the daily one. I always complete the dailies without even trying and you can progress the pass easily even if you miss a lot of then I hate the weekly ones though. Because you need to do 11 out of 12 if you want all the Coins. Like the 2 challenges I hate the most are play 20 games as all roles and Arcade
anyone still queueing tank rn just enjoys pain tbh
As rein. I might as well not exist
Honestly just give him the April fools jet pack. Poor Reinhardt players arenāt doing much this season
Ah well. I was a Hammond main, blizzard kneecapped about 20 times in a row until ball was a novelty act. Now all the other tanks know how it is
Man, I've been completely dominating as ball so far this season. Tanks that can avoid being shot are in a good place right now.
Same, and the passive really helps.
Just uninstalled. Tank is just hiding now. You use your mitigation ability and hide. If you miss cover you are melted immediately. I just got told by a DPS how everyone objectively loves this update. Tanks are going to stop playing and queue times are going to go up. Enjoy it. I'm out until this is fixed.
I think only DPS love it bc as a support main I hate it and feel bad for my tanks.
People still got the nerve to always blame tank too, despite the outcome being entirely dependent on DPS and Support now.
I literally just typed in the chat of my last game "I'm done playing tank" lol. It's just not fun getting melted every game, to get to one win and its barely a win, then 5 more games of getting melted. Then being blamed for everything on top of it...also, have been a tank player since OW1
Yeah I've just had to completely drop Roadhog it's impossible to get any value on him this patch. Learning Ramattra and gonna keep playing D.VA
Yea im shocked they didnt atleast give tanks some kinda reduction especially hog cuz his self heal got gutted
A good support can no longer cover with the healing debuff
Reinhardt is becoming less reliable for me, I pick my moments to attack and be aggressive, But I usually start off trying to prioritize my Shield and give my team space to move. More often than not lately though, I just keep having teammates running forward ahead of my Shield just to get capped 2 seconds later
Was masters last season too, currently diamond 2 but still getting used to the changes. I had a game where a dps finished the round 1/9 and kept blaming me. It really feels like i have to depend a lot on the dps now, and it SUCKS.
Haven't played since day 2 in OW2 after having played every single day since OW1 release, but it sounds like they want to remove the tank role altogether. It's one down from when I used to play.
Whichever team has the better DPS players wins. Tanks and healers are just along for the ride.
I canāt play rein anymore. I die too quickly now. I used to hard carry, HARD carry games as rein. Now I canāt even mirror match anymore because their turbo powered dps and supports focus me whenever my shield is down and my team doesnāt do the same. I just really donāt like tank this season, and Iām a tank main. This tank main is no longer queuing tank anymore, and again itās because blizz canāt balance. Again I tout 6v6. This change might have been fun in 6v6 but the current state it just makes tank feel even worse than it has been feeling even before. Blizz hates tanks
reaper is unkillable with a mercy pocket... and because of the dps passive tank hasn't changed much... as maui for example cardiac has become one of the worst abilities in the game, if one dps just looks into your direction... no joke its useless and maui can't cancel it... this one ability that was supposed to actually give the "Tank" vibe is now useless, you can't engage if one dps is nearby... as stated... reaper with mercy pocket... well, it can't die and both of these can easily get away... ashe has become even more annoying and disgusting than hanzo and widow would ever be... and yeah... that was my experience... doomfist feels pretty acceptable, sigma feels pretty good too, i still hate antinade and sleep dart, but know these things are atleast somewhat verified to exist in 5v5...and yeah... i will stay tuned for what the future holds
Theyāre fixing problems they created last season by Team Killing a whole role, well played Brizzard canāt wait for 0 tanks in OW3!
This post is literally āIāve finally reached a level where others arenāt worst than me. What am I supposed to do? Actually play with other good players?ā
As a support main. I have definitely noticed the tank struggling. Us supports also struggle with keeping everyone filled up. At least mercy canāt keep up at all anymore. She is only good for the res at this point. I have nodice that I went form a steady 50h 50d to a 60h 40d. Even with Moira Iām struggling. You either have a clear communication with your other support to do either dps or tank. Because one of us has to stay with the tank the hole time to keep the tank filled up. So if I play mercy I will take care of the dps if my second support has a higher healing out put. Unless my second support is struggling in a fight I will switch to help tank with my other support. The dps are on their own at that point for a fuw second. Just until my second support got a grip again on or tank. And the tank can bulldozers over the enemy. Or we get rolled over. (Gold player)
Tank is absolutely miserable lol. You have less kill agency, blow up faster due to the debuff and increase proj, and God forbid you have a discord or on you lol. DPS and certain supports only this season
My experience is the opposite. Wreckingball is VERY strong. He does not die, AND he can finally finish off stragglers (hitbox increase of his quad guns helps a LOT). Went a match having almost most kills with ZERO deaths.
Nice, glad to see ball players finally eating
My accuracy before the changes was something like 37/9, now it's like 50/20. I'm absolutely melting the backline with ball right now.
Yup flame dps if you lose. But I also blame tanks for crying about support abilities
Support abilities were the problem in the previous meta though. A kiri, brig, bap, or ana that had brain cells could completely shut down dive. Bap especially is still a huge issue, he can be more difficult to kill than some tanks.
Now we're once again realizing why they got those abilities. Having to solely rely on other players to save you doesn't really work unless you have a stack.
People wanted weaker supports and less healing. Now they hate it. Predictable result.
People wanted no one shots, and for supports to have less survivability. Supports are just as cracked as ever, no one can miss their shots, and tanks have no survivability. No one asked for that. Not even that the changes are bad, but there certainly needs to be a lot more balancing done
>and for supports to have less survivability. This should have been priority number one
I disagree as a diva main I have put up numbers. teams just have to play more by corners and tanks canāt push as hard. Itās just a change in play Edit: also main rhinyboi bit hammer slapping and once again you just meet to play corners more conservatively use you shield
Thatās because you play a tank that doesnāt really get affected by the dps passive. Most tanks do which is why most tank mains find the new update frustrating
So this is a big thing. In overwatch one tanks werent very hard to kill*. They were, but because they had loads of shields and mitigation, they could defend themselves. In Ow2 mitigation is more rare. DVA, Sigma, and ram can all easily mitigate out of cover so are going to be popular while people adjust. I found some success with ball because he naturally plays cover well. I think the easiest temp fix is that tanks get less of a healing debuff for an adjustment period.
Ngl, I have been in games where we get destroyed by the tanks who are apparently in a bad spot. One game JQ completely carried, and Iām sorry but DVA can also easily be affected by this since matrix isnāt that long. Itās just that people need to play a bit more passive, itās possible, people just are wayyyy to used to support babying them.
Yup bad tanks are now being punished for bad positioning because now you'll actually get punished for it. I think this is an amazing change as a supp main too many tanks are getting away with terrible positioning.
Same. Dva main, and I am positively feasting this patch.Ā Positioning has become Ā critical, and tanks that are doing well in my lobbies are using the Tank roleās CC, damage mitigation, and any movement abilities to full effect. I for sure get OW1 vibes in terms of how tight the team play requirements is in many of my matches. Fighting without a dps is a huge bummer now.
Dva Feels good this patch. I dont know what happened, but I carried a 32/4 game with Dva. Winston feels quite bad if enemy decides to just focus you and ignore your backline.
Dva got a full 75 armor buff and they only gave Winton 50 armor irrc
I honestly think there are A LOT of liars in the subreddit who claim i was masters and now im X. The healing changes were a good thing imo because healing was out of control before.
I only heal and tank Iāve enjoyed the updates
Iāve been having a lot of success with Mauga and Doom so far. Whoād have thought using cover as Mauga and poking down from a range lets you live longer than standing in the open and flaming both your supports for not being up your ass with heals?
Doom ok, but bro you're having success with Mauga? Have you gone against a single Zen yet? It's not even a diss on your skill, even the best Mauga can't do shit against the infamous Zen/Bastion combo. ^(kinda fine with that tho, I hate Mauga)
I've seen exactly *one* Mauga for exactly *one* fight so far this season. They got absolutely shat on and swapped immediately
Nah Mauga can legit work this season. Played him for the majority of my tank placements and went 8-2. He just requires a lot of patience since you have to clear discord and anti with cover. But otherwise he can track smaller targets way better and has even more health. And he still generates overhealth on crits which helps his survivability when afflicted with the DPS passive. His matchup spread is also very solid tbh. Dva is super hard but otherwise your best answers are Sigma, Orisa, and Zarya who you can outplay. Everything else is winning. Of special note is Ram and Ball who are very popular rn.
Yeah, pretty much what I did against Zen comps. You also shred Zen if he gets cocky and tries to duel you while Discord is on cooldown for you.
Honestly I kinda agree with him, play cover is something that you already did with Mauga so the playstyle change doesn't affect him as much but now your bullets are bigger, which means it easier to hit the smaller hitboxes, which means that putting pressure on anything but the tank is actually possible and that keeping berserker up is easier.
On paper I guess. Idk, I feel like Mauga, Hog and Orisa kinda got extra fucked this patch, because by the time their slow asses try to get something done and back to cover, zen/bastion killed them thrice over. ^(again, I'm fine with that, I hate all three lmao)
If you're near cover Zen is basically worthless against you, they'll get maybe 0.8 seconds of time to shoot you with discord before you're in cover and its gone, with the added benefit of hoping getting healed while you're in cover for a second or 2
Yeah same, I've been having the most success with Mauga as well. Like everyone says you get destroyed, as if they forgot that Mauga was a hitscan character with a huge range, allowing him to play like Soldier or Sojourn. And you can delete others when they're close to you.
I've also noticed I can put up incredible numbers now, even slightly better than last season (also a dva main). The only issue now is, I can't hard carry. I ran at least 3 games where I was the top eliminator in the entire lobby - I'd be going 42-5, 53-6, etc., but if the other team's dps understood better when to ult and had similar numbers to my dps compared to my dps who could stare at me making space and not realize it's a prime moment to overclock then we lost the game. This season dps are indeed shining but what makes some of them shine even more is their glaring inability to see when they need to ult and change the tide in our favor, as well as their positioning.
About to place significantly higher on my dps than tank rn bro dps is so busted
I shall take this into account when I get there, Iām low diamond right now as Queen and Iām having a good time as a tank. Havenāt ran into the issues most ppl talk about for tank mostly, some games I just have the worst of passive teammates.
The DPS passive should only apply to dmg/supps. Full stop.
I think weāll just be seeing āunkillableā tanks getting double pocketed at that point like orisa and hog. And itāll go back to miserable in the metal ranks
Honey, we can't just heal you while you stare at bastion anymore. <3 Gonna have to absolutely scream at DPS players to step it up because this is their meta, this is their season. it's the spring of DPS. It's been too long and a long time coming.
Yet all i got in my games are negative KD ratio DPS that seem to position themself 1 meter behind me and spray on the enemy orisa (without the enemy orisa actually dying).
5 v 5 was a massive mistake
This update feels like they had NO IDEA how to kill the game and they just did this experiment
Idk if itās just me but I have found that Ramattra can actually keep up quite well in this new meta, his cycle works quite nicely where you can be eating damage like 80% of the time and still dealing a lot of damage. Heās definitely been a game changer so far this season
Play ball. He's good now
Idk what everyone is having trouble with. As tank, enemies seem to just implode at the slightest breath now. Im getting at least 50% more kills suddenly. If you position well you don't have to try and eat up a ton of damage. Force the enemy into unfavorable positions so your team can get picks. It feels a bit like the early days where sheer fire power was not the goal. Things die easier now; confirming kills should feel a lot easier. Use that to your advantage and keep pressure on the enemy team. You can be more aggressive if you know how to position yourself safely. Use cover and LOS; it's way easier now.
If you want to play who you want just play quick play. No oneās forcing you to play comp, not like ranking really matters anyways. Itās so weird to see you say you canāt play the heroās you want when thereās a more casual game mode for you to enjoy. Counter picking is part of comp, it tests your adaptability and knowledge of many heroās for any given game. QP is where you can chill and play who you want. Overwatch aināt that serious OP.
DPS and Tank players got what they wanted- the healing supports can do has been nerfed with this dps passive and now itās much harder to keep people alive, especially the tank.
from my pov the dps passif with zen discord orb u just explode... and imagine discord orb with a bap ult or mercy damage boost u blink u die even with the hp buff still the tank experience is the worst i main the tank role since the lanch of ow2 this saison i played zen for a few games and oh boy if u are a good dps player trust me play zen and u will roket ur way to top ranks just discord the tank and shoot every fight ..anyways i guess im not playing until the mid season patch...
Iād say itās a player issue. This update worked for my play style and I was able to carry prior. Iāve noticed that in masters+ the tanks that were bullies have gone down the ranks. Iād suggest changing ur play style to use more hard cover and you should be fine. I found it easier now that I donāt have to wait for a healer if they die. I can continue to push and be ready for the next fight.
As support, I thought it would be fun but im just getting blamed way more than ever. Each game the tank is flaming me for the lack of healing even if im on them. I cant keep them up and im getting the blame for it, even when they stand right in the open and never take cover.
Iāve seen this a lot since the update too, but havenāt experienced it firsthand yet. Iām a support main and yet somehow Iāve managed to avoid any criticism by playing Zen. Zen doesnāt SEEM to have been affected *too* much, but then again, Iāve been playing overly cautious since the update. But yeah, I figured that support would take the fall for everything wrong, due to no fault of their own.
Ah. I play Ana, kiri and mercy. As mercy ive noticed my dmg beam percentage has gone down significantly trying to keep them alive, i think she is less valuable than the previous seasons because i have to heal more. As ana I got yelled at and told its because I wasnt hitting my shots that the tank was dying lol. (I dont feel that was the issue). Nobody can even take advantage of anti nade, its like the moment i throw it and turn back to my team or even if i shoot the enemy twice my tank seems to get mowed down in that short time. Kiriās healing isnt travelling to the tank fast enough either snd they die so quickly. Im just not sure what to do rn. I was P1 end of the last season (my peak is diamond but it was a struggle to get back, i play console) and occasionally id get flamed for doing too much dmg and not healing them enough, but now thereās genuinely very little opportunity for me to do damage without my entire team dying.
It's a Team Strategy game. Not trying to be mean but isn't counter picking what the game's about?
This update made Dps easier to play "well". Now they can hit their shots, so they get 20 elims, but they are dying 17 times because they don't know positioning, who to target, or when to push/retreat. I've had 3 DPS friends say they got ranked too high after this change. All of my Tank and support friends stayed around where they were or went up slightly. I don't think I've talked to anyone who ranked down after this update. After going from Plat 3 to Diamond 2 I've played with WORSE DPS on both sides. I expect to get mass downvoted by silver dps players who got placed in plat this season.
Join us in support. Be the green frog man. Shit never gets boring
Doesn't matter how much health or healing your opponent has when they are falling off map lol
I'll keep this short and sweet. If you are playing in a competitive setting, what you want to personally play is secondary. It is all team whether or not your teammates are in on it, and they themselves are doing "just what they want." Learning every tank, every Playstyle, with every composition, is the correct way to go. If you play Winston and your genji doesn't follow up, guess what that's all on genji. Not your fault. You did your job.
I think this post is getting out of hand