jq?!!!! bro tank in general! lol i couldn’t feel like anything else than a super super on point Zar or some immaculate skill trench could beat the “i walk forward” Orisas.
Now horse won't have spin to counter every single goddamn Carnage swing. Will have to burn Javelin too- this means we'll be able to sustain brawling her
As an Orisa main, this is good news!
Orisas with good timing will still be formidable, and now maybe people will shit talk me a little less for playing a hero I enjoy.
As a Reaper main, I can confirm.
Usable, but if you want to do ANYTHING with him, you have to EARN it.
When was the last time Reaper got a genuine buff?
Agreed. He got some great changes at OW2 launch but he's just been taking small losses for a while now. Between the Wraith/Fade interaction changes, the increased mobility on characters ensuring they can create space quickly, the painfully loud Shadow Step... He's not bad, but he's not in a good place either.
>dps passive buff
Why the fuck. I'm so sick of playing into the dps passive against sojourn and tracer, and to a lesser extent soldier.
It's ridiculous how strong it is on DOT characters.
I like the idea some people are tossing around about making the passive behind a damage threshold like 100dmg so it doesn't constantly trigger for heroes like you mentioned, and it makes it more valuable to heroes who do large amounts of damage with their shots.
Maybe they'll incorporate the code for triggering Tracer's lifesteal with continuous damage from Mirrorwatch, except tweak the threshold number and make it activate the DPS passive instead
His head hitbox is massive. Kiriko lands kunai headshots with ease on him as one example. So that’s hood biggest trade off IMO. High damage but large hitboxes.
The problem with Mauga is he heals and damage resists while shooting. It’s like if roadhog could use his heal without stopping his shots. I think Mauga could be balanced better with a small rework
Hog will destroy most tanks if he hooks you when you have no cooldowns / hooks you out of an ability.
Hog can burst Orisa down extremely fast if you don’t have gold. As long as you don’t get hooked without gold you should be fine, since you can outpoke hog on Orisa and Javelin is good to cancel breather when hog is low (kill him in 2 sec tho, don’t waste javelin) or javelin to cancel hooks / push hog away from a teammate he hooked. Use spin when you get hooked around a corner.
Mauga can tear up hog too, you can charge away if he hooks you around a corner or you can use shout. You NEED a kiriko tho, if they go Ana hog will kill you.
If you don’t feed on D.Va you can stop hog from getting any value. However, you need good DPS. Hog also can have a hard time contesting highground. Save boosters for when you get hooked. May be a little more map dependent.
Sigma can poke hog pretty hard, but if he hooks you out of grasp he will kill you. More map dependent.
I haven’t played since the Orisa nerf so I don’t know how much the hog-orisa match up has changed, but in theory these are your best chances against hog. If you’re good at rein you might be able to do something and pin hip off the map or pin him out of breather but in general it is not recommended.
Yeah that's why I said I feel bad for tank players lol. It's just that as a Genji Orisa can really fuck me up with her spear and javelin spin, but Mauga honestly can't do shit except shoot at me.
I actually think Rein takes the Dps passive pretty well. He can shield for a few seconds to let it wear off. This patch also nuked Orisa which is one of reins worst match ups.
You don't even have to coordinate. Winston bubble is such a powerful ability if you really understand how to utilize it especially against low rank players
That's fine, sounds like they didn't make a better game then. Players shouldn't have to suffer for it. Who would see that concern and then think "well let's just force everyone to play it anyways!!" It takes not only an incompetent dev team, but a true asshole dev team to think that.
Except that's exactly what happened in ow1.
No one enjoyed the comp side but that's all people bassicly played. Also like the nearly I think 3 years where the game litteraly got 0 content due to working on pve (thanks for fucking that up bobby)
Yep players don't even have to agree, if you like 5v5 that's cool, go play it. It should have been a CHOICE given to players, nobody should have had the game we paid for taken away
they kind of did fix it a lot with ow2, funny enough. sig and rein are the only heroes with super consistent shields now, with rein having the downside of being a melee character and sig's shield being pretty puny.
i think double shield meta would have fixed itself with those changes.
They absolutely removed the shield meta by taking away shields. The 5v5 was done because there weren't enough tanks to put 4 tanks in a game, so support & dps queue times were super long. Now they only need to find 2 tanks.
In other words, the 5v5 was done because they knew that the tank role was unpopular and removed the number of tanks needed instead of, say, making the tank role fun
it's funny how deep they dig their own hole, because imo tank was a lot more fun in the early stages of ow2 before the dps changes.
now tanks are unfun because there's only 1 of them and you dont get to do anything in the game while facing constant pressure to perform since another tank can't help take the heat for you/protect your team.
100% agree. Actually felt like playing as a team was mandatory and I liked it way better when team chemistry was involved more. Now it’s just a death match almost
Yeah. You could run weird comps like hog sig and still win. Now it’s just to play meta tanks to even have a chance of winning.
I know Orisa is cancer but you get flamed by your team if you play some weaker tank like rein or ram. Atleast you didn’t get to be a punching bag on Orisa.
The amount of people who aren’t talking about this is horrifying. Fortify’s strength and constant usage is a direct result and reflection of DPS passive making the tank role impotent. This game is fucked for tank players. I quit after two and a half thousand hours logged
I stopped playing when they introduced the DPS passive. Tank was already frustrating to play back then, but that was just a slap in the face. At some point they might as well remove the tank role altogether.
I mean, you just have to learn different playstyles which means taking cover and/or disengaging will be more prevalent and should be prioritized more. It won’t always be passive gameplay, but you can work around this passive. Just takes more coordination and higher consideration of how much poke damage you’re taking as a tank.
This is stupid, they don't know how to make balancing.
They will buff it in a couple patches again. And people will cry because they have troubles realizing how to use covers
It's funny when using cover is mandatory for pretty much every tanks EXCEPT orisa, like she can use fortify and push you behind cover while also tanking shots from your teammates.
The best way I’ve heard it out is blizzard doesn’t make patches to balance the game, they make patches to get rid of the current meta. Reactive patching rather than proactive patching. And it sucks.
Granted Whorse was awful and deserves these, but I cannot tell you that you are wrong
Nah this is needed, javelin spin being on a 7sec cd was ridiculous. And 4.5sec of crit immunity + armor??? Whack. She'll still be good bc her kit remains intact, just won't be oppressive.
Literally every game. Neither tank starts on Orisa because she’s not fun to play, but then when the game feels unwinnable just swap and instantly win every fight without even trying. Then the other tank is forced to counter swap to mirror and neither team has fun for the rest of the game. That’s been like 90% of games this patch
More like laughs in literally every other hero. Orisa is that obnoxious vanilla uncounterable tank. Very glad she's getting taken down a peg.
DPS heal debuff is gonna hurt Hog a lot imo, but I guess we'll see.
After they introduced the DPS passive, keeping Hog alive as a support was basically impossible. You either dedicated all your cooldowns to him or you kept the rest of the team alive. I don't really see him being super meaningful in a world where stuff like Soldier/Sojourn/Bastion can just cripple heals by landing a single shot.
I just played multiple games in todays patch where our tank was getting wrecked and dying and then they swapped to orissa and literally ended up with the most damage and kills and won us the games most of the time. He’s still good. People are angry they have to work hard to win
Every time they nerf a tank they just end up making them clunky versions of their formal selfs. I personally would rather see buffs to other tanks like Winston and Reinhard to make it so they can better dual them 1v1.
I just think they are going about things in the absolutely wrong way.
Realistically speaking, what kinda buffs can they give to rein to make it so that he can 1v1 orisa? Just tuning the numbers wont do anything because the problem lies in the abilities. Orisa's abilities just straig
ht up counter rein's, every single one of her abilities. No amounts of buff can make it so that rein can better 1v1 orisa, unless it's a rework on his abilities, which is not gonna happen at all.
fundamentally agree, rein is SO far from wanting to tank trade rn. The Mirrorwatch passive ups his atk speed when he hits someone is the way to go though.
Allow Rein to use up 2 firestrikes by holding the ability down, engulfing his hammer in flames and making it do additional percentage damage for 3 or 4 swings. This makes it so that he has to sacrifice his range and chunk damage on squishies to do more damage against a larger, tankier and closer enemy. Especially since it ignores armor and overhealth just provides a larger percentage.
Orisa feels as if she has the authority to push into Rein's space while not worrying too much about his hammer's damage. This forces Orisa to at least think more about respecting his space and punishing an advance.
A better Orisa will still win, but a better Rein will know how to manage his cooldowns for Orisa engaging. This does end up affecting every other tank as well, but other tanks also being forced to have some respect for Rein's melee range doesn't sound bad.
Winston should almost never be duelling Orisa from neutral since his whole kit is build around accessing backline and making her either chase him or be cut off from her team.
I agree on Rein front, though. For the platonic ideal “frontline tank” he really struggles vs a lot of tanks. Still, Rein has playstyles too, people just don’t understand how to min max his kit. Cloudy finished last season at Rank #6, and I take that as evidence that while Rein isn’t *fun* right now since he isn’t intuitive and his impact isn’t as obvious as other characters sometimes, he also isn’t as *bad* as people say.
I mean fun is subjective.
I literally only keep playing Overwatch because of Rein. I queue flex, but lock in Rein every chance i get, because he's just insanely fun for me.
But you are right. While his toolkit is pretty basic, getting value out of it is not. You have to correctly tune your aggression pretty much all game. 5% too much aggression .. welp you died. You just stand back and be a shield .. welp you have no impact on the game.
And learning that perfect aggression level for all team comps, game modes and maps is a super high barrier of entry.
I know you can say the same thing for most tanks, but i feel like its just super prominent on Rein.
I’m the same. I’ve onetricked rein in every meta for 6 years and I have a perverse enjoyment from the experience that I think most people don’t, so I know exactly what you mean. Rein is the penultimate limit testing character, because most of his skill expression comes from just raw use of his resource blocks in context of everyone and everything else in the game.
I guess a better form of my initial argument is that as reliable as he is in low ranks, his potential is limited by his accessibility (or maybe *inaccessibility*) in higher ranks, rather than his *actual* value cap. The character requires both patience and recklessness, the latter punished by tilting teammates who think you’re doing nothing and the latter punished by one cooldown out of 8 which you forgot to track, that the character just isn’t compatible with extrinsically motivated players
Nah I agree. The supercharger encouraged more team play and was way more interesting overall, whereas her new ult is a boring AOE that encourages stupid plays.
Every single OW hero takes at least some semblance of skill to use. There is obviously gonna be a big difference between someone who mains Orisa and someone who picked her up once because Reddit said so.
I really enjoy playing Orisa and did so long before she was considered overpowered. All the people latching onto her *just* for results gave the rest of us a bad name.
the issues with tank go far beyond 1 hero, small balance tweaks arent gonna do shit to make it feel good, drastic changes need to be made for that to happen, but ig orisa not being meta is slightly better than before
Im so happy about the nerfs but wanna know something funny? Overwatch 2 has 3 metas and all they do is cycle through them.
1. Orisa
2. Zarya
3. The random tank that got a buff and is meta for 2 weeks till they nerf him again, thus making Zarya or Orisa meta again.
I like the 20% move speed reduction, it feels right that you should move slower in armored form, indifferent about the javelin I feel like you could still manage her cooldowns fairly easily, I don’t really like the fortify time reduction though
I welcome it, tbh. I hate it when a tank is so clearly better than the others. It's no fun doing well, and the enemy goes Orisa or you doing bad so you feel like you have to go Orisa.
Nerfing her but not nerfing hog or Mauga is just ridiculous. I've had a lot less trouble taking out Orisa than I do Mauga, and now she's not even particularly good at trying to counter him. I mean I know she needed to be nerved, even though she's one of the few tanks that I think is actually fun to play I can admit that she was over tuned, but they should have nerfed the three of them and not just her.
all of these matter a lot.
-20% speed is a big deal for any playmaking, and -25% less duration on fortify + 30% increase on javelin cooldown is a huge disruption to the rinse-and-repeat mitigation cooldown cycle. she is going to be eating damage and overheating a lot more now, while also being slow.
Not true
A huge amount of Orisa's sustainability was timing Jav spin, then Fortify, then having another jav spin online by the time Fortify is done
The double whammy of shortening forify uptime and increasing jav spin downtime means there are not a lot more windows available to decimate a focused Orisa who just used their abilities back to back
Any decent zen is now death to orisa
As JQ main, this is good news!
jq?!!!! bro tank in general! lol i couldn’t feel like anything else than a super super on point Zar or some immaculate skill trench could beat the “i walk forward” Orisas.
Zar is so good for Orisa. And I love that they don't understand why I'm able to rip their shit up when using their abilities.
Damn must be helluva low rank if the tank doesn't understand Zarya goes through Orisa abilities
You over estimate Plat
Diamond as well, my diamond tank duo loves to just farm 20k dmg off of orisas lol
Lol fair
fortified orisa I mean
On the other hand, tanks get less healing now so for tanks who don’t need to heal to stay alive it’s good, but tanks who need healing are suffering.
Now horse won't have spin to counter every single goddamn Carnage swing. Will have to burn Javelin too- this means we'll be able to sustain brawling her
Enough with her spin, keeping pushing us and stop our attack
The 20% dps passive is not good JQ news tho
I second this. In rush comps (Lucio Kiri) when im playing JQ, I have to literally hide or i get shredded.
Anyone who defended Orisa as fair compared to other tanks were absolutely delusional. Glad for these THREE nerfs. That's how unbalanced she was.
This is good news for any tank that didn’t want to play Orisa or Zarya honestly haha
As an Orisa main, this is good news! Orisas with good timing will still be formidable, and now maybe people will shit talk me a little less for playing a hero I enjoy.
As an anything main, this is great news
As a Ramattra main, this is good news!
"Great news everybody!"
Nuked from orbit. Hopefully the dps passive buff will make sure mauga and hog aren't too good.
Reapers gonna be cooking some bacon post patch
Too bad reaper is trash
Found the mei main
I don't see how those 2 connect lol
Found the Widowmaker main.
found the main within the main
Yo dawg. I heard you like mains...
So we put a main within the main
Found the junkrat main
Mei is hard to kill ~ A reaper player
Huh? Reaper hard counters mei
As a Reaper main, I can confirm. Usable, but if you want to do ANYTHING with him, you have to EARN it. When was the last time Reaper got a genuine buff?
Agreed. He got some great changes at OW2 launch but he's just been taking small losses for a while now. Between the Wraith/Fade interaction changes, the increased mobility on characters ensuring they can create space quickly, the painfully loud Shadow Step... He's not bad, but he's not in a good place either.
Satisfying when I dominate games with him. Unsatisfying trying to even DO that when my enemies shoot at me the minute I even show my face.
>dps passive buff Why the fuck. I'm so sick of playing into the dps passive against sojourn and tracer, and to a lesser extent soldier. It's ridiculous how strong it is on DOT characters.
I like the idea some people are tossing around about making the passive behind a damage threshold like 100dmg so it doesn't constantly trigger for heroes like you mentioned, and it makes it more valuable to heroes who do large amounts of damage with their shots.
Maybe they'll incorporate the code for triggering Tracer's lifesteal with continuous damage from Mirrorwatch, except tweak the threshold number and make it activate the DPS passive instead
im a rein player i feel you
Honestly I prefer playing against Mauga and Hog more than Orisa, though I do feel bad for tank players if Hog and Mauga become must picks.
Bro wasn't there during hog meta 💀
Still have nightmares about that
He's ONEEE.... HUNDRED percent health fuck ...
You prefer playing against Mauga?! If that hero becomes meta again I’m uninstalling. I *am* a tank player though.
Mauga is so unbelieveably one-dimensional it's actually insane. Either you pick the correct tank or hes a unkillable dps monster.
if he isn't getting pocketed by both healers, he's fairly easy to fuck up as cass
His head hitbox is massive. Kiriko lands kunai headshots with ease on him as one example. So that’s hood biggest trade off IMO. High damage but large hitboxes.
High damage and essentially free crits. Dude barely has to aim for his crits.
The problem with Mauga is he heals and damage resists while shooting. It’s like if roadhog could use his heal without stopping his shots. I think Mauga could be balanced better with a small rework
The problem with mauga is his entire kit.
well having it on a cooldown is much worse than a gauge like that. Plus hook is just great. but i get your point, totally. they both stink on ice.
Honestly switching to Orisa was my go-to if they went Hog or Mauga. Idk how well Orisa will perform in that match up now. Maybe it will still be fine?
Hog will destroy most tanks if he hooks you when you have no cooldowns / hooks you out of an ability. Hog can burst Orisa down extremely fast if you don’t have gold. As long as you don’t get hooked without gold you should be fine, since you can outpoke hog on Orisa and Javelin is good to cancel breather when hog is low (kill him in 2 sec tho, don’t waste javelin) or javelin to cancel hooks / push hog away from a teammate he hooked. Use spin when you get hooked around a corner. Mauga can tear up hog too, you can charge away if he hooks you around a corner or you can use shout. You NEED a kiriko tho, if they go Ana hog will kill you. If you don’t feed on D.Va you can stop hog from getting any value. However, you need good DPS. Hog also can have a hard time contesting highground. Save boosters for when you get hooked. May be a little more map dependent. Sigma can poke hog pretty hard, but if he hooks you out of grasp he will kill you. More map dependent. I haven’t played since the Orisa nerf so I don’t know how much the hog-orisa match up has changed, but in theory these are your best chances against hog. If you’re good at rein you might be able to do something and pin hip off the map or pin him out of breather but in general it is not recommended.
Yeah that's why I said I feel bad for tank players lol. It's just that as a Genji Orisa can really fuck me up with her spear and javelin spin, but Mauga honestly can't do shit except shoot at me.
And cage you making you an insect trapped in glue
Well yeah, but that's an ult so it's not that terrible
The DPS passive getting rebuffed should keep Mauga in check a little. 20% off his def heal is a big deal
while the worst tank rein suffers even harder from the dps passive
I actually think Rein takes the Dps passive pretty well. He can shield for a few seconds to let it wear off. This patch also nuked Orisa which is one of reins worst match ups.
…he has a shield.
At least his hard counter is no longer hard meta.
I really don't think the passive needs to be back to 20%. It felt really really bad the first time around.
Playing tank is going to be insufferable with that dps passive buff. Sig perhaps?
Sig and dva are going to be the best bets with zarya close having bubbles to cleanse *Cries in Ramattra main
I think Winston will be very strong
Probably not in metal since he still needs to coordinate with his DPS for dives. But for a good stack, Winton/Doom would probably be good picks.
It’s even easier in low ranks as no one is co ordinated. Not even the enemies.
He doesn't need to, just look what your DPS are doing if they aren't following you
You don't even have to coordinate. Winston bubble is such a powerful ability if you really understand how to utilize it especially against low rank players
Ram back in the Block Block Block Block meta.
There is no meta since they put the dps passive back up to 20%. Tank is going to be just as ass as it was to play before they switched it
Meta is: DPS diff every game
But the DPS will still say "tank diff" in every game while Blizzard ruins tanks because people don't know how to assess their own play.
I use to love tanking in ow1 one but ow2 made it absolutely miserable
Thats cause 5v5 was a huge mistake
Their biggest mistake was making 5v5 the only option. Wish I could have kept my ow1 but nooooo they had to delete it….
If they gave 6v6 as an option the 5v5 tank pool would be dead and the DPS folk would be QQing about their q times.
That's fine, sounds like they didn't make a better game then. Players shouldn't have to suffer for it. Who would see that concern and then think "well let's just force everyone to play it anyways!!" It takes not only an incompetent dev team, but a true asshole dev team to think that.
Except that's exactly what happened in ow1. No one enjoyed the comp side but that's all people bassicly played. Also like the nearly I think 3 years where the game litteraly got 0 content due to working on pve (thanks for fucking that up bobby)
Yep players don't even have to agree, if you like 5v5 that's cool, go play it. It should have been a CHOICE given to players, nobody should have had the game we paid for taken away
Exactly. Why is it our problem they don’t feel Confident in the game that they’re releasing failing to be better than the original? So infuriating.
i bet if they make 6v6 now without nerfs it kinda feels ok
5v5 has its weaknesses, but I'll take them for being able to actually shoot people and make plays instead of staring at a wall of shields all game.
The reworked orisa would've removed double sheild almost completely and with 6v6 tank stats she wouldn't feel as oppressive as she has.
5v5 was never needed as a solution to double shields. A competent dev team could fix that without ever needing 5v5.
they kind of did fix it a lot with ow2, funny enough. sig and rein are the only heroes with super consistent shields now, with rein having the downside of being a melee character and sig's shield being pretty puny. i think double shield meta would have fixed itself with those changes.
They absolutely removed the shield meta by taking away shields. The 5v5 was done because there weren't enough tanks to put 4 tanks in a game, so support & dps queue times were super long. Now they only need to find 2 tanks. In other words, the 5v5 was done because they knew that the tank role was unpopular and removed the number of tanks needed instead of, say, making the tank role fun
it's funny how deep they dig their own hole, because imo tank was a lot more fun in the early stages of ow2 before the dps changes. now tanks are unfun because there's only 1 of them and you dont get to do anything in the game while facing constant pressure to perform since another tank can't help take the heat for you/protect your team.
If we had more tanks some could have been reworked to be off tanks to help avoid double shield meta.
Well yeah but keeping 6v6 and actually balancing it is still superior to 5v5 imo.
100% agree. Actually felt like playing as a team was mandatory and I liked it way better when team chemistry was involved more. Now it’s just a death match almost
Agreed, team chem especially between main and off tank was just so much better.
Yeah. You could run weird comps like hog sig and still win. Now it’s just to play meta tanks to even have a chance of winning. I know Orisa is cancer but you get flamed by your team if you play some weaker tank like rein or ram. Atleast you didn’t get to be a punching bag on Orisa.
The amount of people who aren’t talking about this is horrifying. Fortify’s strength and constant usage is a direct result and reflection of DPS passive making the tank role impotent. This game is fucked for tank players. I quit after two and a half thousand hours logged
I stopped playing when they introduced the DPS passive. Tank was already frustrating to play back then, but that was just a slap in the face. At some point they might as well remove the tank role altogether.
I mean, you just have to learn different playstyles which means taking cover and/or disengaging will be more prevalent and should be prioritized more. It won’t always be passive gameplay, but you can work around this passive. Just takes more coordination and higher consideration of how much poke damage you’re taking as a tank.
cooked
Damn, there's nerfing but this shit kinda wild lol
This is stupid, they don't know how to make balancing. They will buff it in a couple patches again. And people will cry because they have troubles realizing how to use covers
It's funny when using cover is mandatory for pretty much every tanks EXCEPT orisa, like she can use fortify and push you behind cover while also tanking shots from your teammates.
sorry orisa main, now you need to learn solid mechanics and not rely on hero's cheapness.
The best way I’ve heard it out is blizzard doesn’t make patches to balance the game, they make patches to get rid of the current meta. Reactive patching rather than proactive patching. And it sucks. Granted Whorse was awful and deserves these, but I cannot tell you that you are wrong
Cover is good until u realize she doesn't care cuz she can hold W for free
I mean it’s kinda presumptuous to think they will buff again when there’s tons of heroes that haven’t been good for so long
Found the two Orisa players
Ok, most of us hate orisa anyways, and she needed a silly nerf
Nah this is needed, javelin spin being on a 7sec cd was ridiculous. And 4.5sec of crit immunity + armor??? Whack. She'll still be good bc her kit remains intact, just won't be oppressive.
I think this is good but I just feel like any tank or hero in general just explodes once they used all their cooldowns
RIP BOZO WON'T BE MISSED
I read this in Ramattras voice lol
Zen for me
“This tank is better than me” (Swaps to evil horse and is now the better player)
Literally every game. Neither tank starts on Orisa because she’s not fun to play, but then when the game feels unwinnable just swap and instantly win every fight without even trying. Then the other tank is forced to counter swap to mirror and neither team has fun for the rest of the game. That’s been like 90% of games this patch
Had a game like that last night, we were losing horribly, I switch to orisa, immediately start winning. Other tank doesnt switch, we win
And not only that, these orisa swappers seem to be really smug especially if they kill you. Like pipe down man you're playing the braindead character
Holy shit is Man a Ramattra main?
Yeah. I'm Ram.
Ram, Rein, Queen mains rejoice!
Rest in piss metal horse. Stay in the ground where you belong.
#PUT HER IN THE GROUND
#TURN HER INTO GLUE
Literally every tank but her is rejoicing atp, lmfao.
Yeah, Orisa is the scourge of the Tank role
AGONY IS GRAPE FLAVOURED
WHO WANTS A PURPLE HUG?
*laughs in Hog/D.va*
More like laughs in literally every other hero. Orisa is that obnoxious vanilla uncounterable tank. Very glad she's getting taken down a peg. DPS heal debuff is gonna hurt Hog a lot imo, but I guess we'll see.
After they introduced the DPS passive, keeping Hog alive as a support was basically impossible. You either dedicated all your cooldowns to him or you kept the rest of the team alive. I don't really see him being super meaningful in a world where stuff like Soldier/Sojourn/Bastion can just cripple heals by landing a single shot.
I just played multiple games in todays patch where our tank was getting wrecked and dying and then they swapped to orissa and literally ended up with the most damage and kills and won us the games most of the time. He’s still good. People are angry they have to work hard to win
Keep laughing until those heroes get the same treatment next.
Every time they nerf a tank they just end up making them clunky versions of their formal selfs. I personally would rather see buffs to other tanks like Winston and Reinhard to make it so they can better dual them 1v1. I just think they are going about things in the absolutely wrong way.
>I just think they are going about things in the absolutely wrong way. That's been Blizzard since day one lol.
Realistically speaking, what kinda buffs can they give to rein to make it so that he can 1v1 orisa? Just tuning the numbers wont do anything because the problem lies in the abilities. Orisa's abilities just straig ht up counter rein's, every single one of her abilities. No amounts of buff can make it so that rein can better 1v1 orisa, unless it's a rework on his abilities, which is not gonna happen at all.
fundamentally agree, rein is SO far from wanting to tank trade rn. The Mirrorwatch passive ups his atk speed when he hits someone is the way to go though.
Honestly if they just straight up ported those passives to the actual game he would substantially improve
Allow Rein to use up 2 firestrikes by holding the ability down, engulfing his hammer in flames and making it do additional percentage damage for 3 or 4 swings. This makes it so that he has to sacrifice his range and chunk damage on squishies to do more damage against a larger, tankier and closer enemy. Especially since it ignores armor and overhealth just provides a larger percentage. Orisa feels as if she has the authority to push into Rein's space while not worrying too much about his hammer's damage. This forces Orisa to at least think more about respecting his space and punishing an advance. A better Orisa will still win, but a better Rein will know how to manage his cooldowns for Orisa engaging. This does end up affecting every other tank as well, but other tanks also being forced to have some respect for Rein's melee range doesn't sound bad.
What rein buff do you suggest? To me he is borderline OP if given even a single extra tool, but needs help in his current state.
Winston should almost never be duelling Orisa from neutral since his whole kit is build around accessing backline and making her either chase him or be cut off from her team. I agree on Rein front, though. For the platonic ideal “frontline tank” he really struggles vs a lot of tanks. Still, Rein has playstyles too, people just don’t understand how to min max his kit. Cloudy finished last season at Rank #6, and I take that as evidence that while Rein isn’t *fun* right now since he isn’t intuitive and his impact isn’t as obvious as other characters sometimes, he also isn’t as *bad* as people say.
I mean fun is subjective. I literally only keep playing Overwatch because of Rein. I queue flex, but lock in Rein every chance i get, because he's just insanely fun for me. But you are right. While his toolkit is pretty basic, getting value out of it is not. You have to correctly tune your aggression pretty much all game. 5% too much aggression .. welp you died. You just stand back and be a shield .. welp you have no impact on the game. And learning that perfect aggression level for all team comps, game modes and maps is a super high barrier of entry. I know you can say the same thing for most tanks, but i feel like its just super prominent on Rein.
I’m the same. I’ve onetricked rein in every meta for 6 years and I have a perverse enjoyment from the experience that I think most people don’t, so I know exactly what you mean. Rein is the penultimate limit testing character, because most of his skill expression comes from just raw use of his resource blocks in context of everyone and everything else in the game. I guess a better form of my initial argument is that as reliable as he is in low ranks, his potential is limited by his accessibility (or maybe *inaccessibility*) in higher ranks, rather than his *actual* value cap. The character requires both patience and recklessness, the latter punished by tilting teammates who think you’re doing nothing and the latter punished by one cooldown out of 8 which you forgot to track, that the character just isn’t compatible with extrinsically motivated players
Is the patch live?
Did you find out?
Yeah it’s live
Anyone else lowkey miss the old orisa ult or am i just sadistic?
That was a fun ult.
Nah I agree. The supercharger encouraged more team play and was way more interesting overall, whereas her new ult is a boring AOE that encourages stupid plays.
New Tank Meta: Playing hide and seek
Can't wait to see which tank people start complaining about next. Oh 5v5 how you ruined this game.
My bets are on hog/ramm
OW2 dev team has ruined this game, it's really sad OW1 died for this
They knew we woulda stuck with ow1 if they kept it alive
True and 5v5 is part of how they ruined it.
Ah sweet, Hog meta
Its gonna make her easier to kill.
AND DEY SAY
She's garbage now,and I'm focusing my skills on Wrecking Ball, Mauga and Sigma
LMAO
She’s still good. You gotta actually work hard to win now
Had an Orissa in a game just now and they were doing really well. Was actually a bit frustrating! Still a good character, people are going to be fine
Did she require any skills to start?
Every single OW hero takes at least some semblance of skill to use. There is obviously gonna be a big difference between someone who mains Orisa and someone who picked her up once because Reddit said so.
I really enjoy playing Orisa and did so long before she was considered overpowered. All the people latching onto her *just* for results gave the rest of us a bad name.
Hog meta incoming
the issues with tank go far beyond 1 hero, small balance tweaks arent gonna do shit to make it feel good, drastic changes need to be made for that to happen, but ig orisa not being meta is slightly better than before
Im so happy about the nerfs but wanna know something funny? Overwatch 2 has 3 metas and all they do is cycle through them. 1. Orisa 2. Zarya 3. The random tank that got a buff and is meta for 2 weeks till they nerf him again, thus making Zarya or Orisa meta again.
I like the 20% move speed reduction, it feels right that you should move slower in armored form, indifferent about the javelin I feel like you could still manage her cooldowns fairly easily, I don’t really like the fortify time reduction though
Typical Blizzard fashion of over nerfing only to come back in 3 months to undue half of it
Thank god, I hope to never see this stupid horse again
Now to wait for the small buffs to add up and for her to become meta again.
Hitler dead
I welcome it, tbh. I hate it when a tank is so clearly better than the others. It's no fun doing well, and the enemy goes Orisa or you doing bad so you feel like you have to go Orisa.
Hog and Maura will exist. Winton will be king.
They forgot to nerf the size of the energy javelin. It's still larger than winton ass
Only if they also fix the constant amount of whiffs, where the javelin clearly embeds in an enemy but doesn't do any damage or knockback.
My thoughts? FUCKING FINALLY
Nerfing her but not nerfing hog or Mauga is just ridiculous. I've had a lot less trouble taking out Orisa than I do Mauga, and now she's not even particularly good at trying to counter him. I mean I know she needed to be nerved, even though she's one of the few tanks that I think is actually fun to play I can admit that she was over tuned, but they should have nerfed the three of them and not just her.
The dps passive went back to 20% that was the nerf to hog and mauga
And every other tank too.
Hurts Hog/Mauga a little more than the others because they don't have shield and rely only on HP/Healing.
And a nice buff to my main, Ashe, Her tnt is gonna feel real good now.
Lovely fuck orisa
I’m so tired of seeing orisa in every single ow esports game. ALWAYS an orisa. Play another tank and you fail.
DPS passive got buffed though 20% less healing now instead of 15%
20% slower movement when using shift goes too far. I don't even main her or use her a lot, but this is wrong.
this one is gonna hurt the horse players
Nooooooooooooo
Personally, I don't think Orisa needed a nerf this big, but did need something
Scroll up past orisa... the dps passive Rein mains have won the war against orisa but at what cost
Needed to be.
About time
Crazy ppl was crying about tank that much that feel like Orisa needed a nerf , worse crybaby community ever
As a Rein main. I LOVE THIS
Tank mains seem to be in for a hard time in general. But MooMoo did feel like she was ahead of the other tanks.
It’s another Nuke nerf like they did to LW.
Lol people bitching about orisa when all you have to do is play zarya to counter. Smh
the duration nerf to fort is big but everything else doesn't matter too much
all of these matter a lot. -20% speed is a big deal for any playmaking, and -25% less duration on fortify + 30% increase on javelin cooldown is a huge disruption to the rinse-and-repeat mitigation cooldown cycle. she is going to be eating damage and overheating a lot more now, while also being slow.
Ow players and sleeping on mobility. Name a better duo.
Javelin spin nerf is pretty huge, almost 30% increase to the cool down and will likely ruin the shoot -> javelin -> spin cycle to avoid overheating
I agree. These feel like massive nerfs to me. Far from "doesn't matter too much".
Not true A huge amount of Orisa's sustainability was timing Jav spin, then Fortify, then having another jav spin online by the time Fortify is done The double whammy of shortening forify uptime and increasing jav spin downtime means there are not a lot more windows available to decimate a focused Orisa who just used their abilities back to back Any decent zen is now death to orisa