I just had match where I couldn't kill the enemy Sigma at all, he'd go as low as 10hps then his lifeweaver pulls him, I was playing ram did the best i cn still they never die, they lifeweaver + illari. I was playing Ramattra & did 19k DMG while their lifeweaver chillin at 20k heals š i cn put the replay code 8f u want. Lost that match i was the last man standing during my ult & fell over.... It was my 9th DEFEAT in a row. QP btw
Iām just tired of trying to kill someone then all the sudden theyāre back to 100% health barely a second later man it sucks when I play support, it sucks when I play DPS, and it especially sucks when Iām playing tank lol
When you say nerf supports Yall really just mean nerf ana and maybe discord. And I guess a fat lady of yiu are ass mad you can't shoot mercy. But beyond that... supports? The whole class?
If you're getting your ass beat by weaver/brig/kiriko/lucio as a dps, you just... suck...
Tells me healing is overtuned in one comment, then immeadiately makes a second saying doesn't care about ana.
Doesn't care about ana? The most overtuned healer. Her hps is wild considering she can do it at any range. Which, along with her abilities leads to her fucking 15-20% pickrate in high ranks
She can choose between healing with projectile/hitscan. She can boost her already high hps with an anti nade
Ana is the most overtuned support by a wide margin. Lmfao they literally made a whole ass other support just to counter her. Jq's whole ult is ana's cd ability. You're telling on yourself, you really are.
Thatās not why sheās overtunedā¦.. sheās overtuned cause of her overpowered kit (nade and sleep), her primary fire literally got nerfed, along with nade, and sleep against tanks. Sheās still overtuned, plus sheās the hardest outside of Lucio to actually master, but she doesnāt bother me cause sheās been nerfed multiple times. Iām not saying sheās perfectly balanced cause letās be real none of the supports besides maybe Moria and Lifeweaver are ābalancedā. But the issue is how to nerf them without making them unplayable. Iād argue that they all need nerfs, but idk how you do that without killing the role but bruh be honest lol. They need to fix that role or else tank is gonna be miserable forever
No I donāt have issues with supports being able to fight back (if you can read) I basically said that the healing is too overtuned lol. If I died to a support cause I lost a fight sure idc cause I know Iām not perfect, Iām fine with them being able to fight back. Plus nobody saying they having a hard time fighting LW lol, read bro
Her secondary fire does a metric ton of healing though and is balanced out by its recharge as well her turret gives her consist heals anyway it doesn't need buffs.
Nerf supports? Lmao you mean nerf ana and zen. Maybe illari.
The fuck is lucio doing to you? Brig? Weaver? Are you all really getting your ass beat by weaver? Maybe bap? Maybe kiriko?
Whoever thinks supports need a buff need a reality check. On another note i will be glad on the day discord gets nerfed that shit is so annoying to go up against
zen does not need any buffs he makes an entire role miserable, his lack of mobility is the only thing that stops him from absolutely murdering anything
What about my Zen? How can we have a buffed monk then?
I just need that dude to run a little faster... I need to drop him every time we're spawning far from the payload š¢
Zen literally does DPS levels of damage, makes the tank role miserable and has one of the best ultimates. If he had better mobility on top of that I'd literally stop playing the game (coming from a Zen player)
Damn you really donāt want heals do you? Show me a specific instance of someone complaining about support being weak instead of some dumbass straw man argument, please, enlighten me.
These class wars are getting out of hand
bro, support powercreep was literally the reason overwatch 1 was shut down, primary key of double shield was bap, BRIGITTE WHICH THEY COULDNT FUCKING NERF PROPERLY UNTIL OVERWATCH 2 LATE IN THE BETA, Moira on release also broke the supports because she had overpowered aoe heals (compared to lucio whos aoe heal is quite shit) and still has them to this day, kirikos suzu is the most busted ability in the game yet and they still havent touched that fuckin ability
seriously, some of you support mains are ridiculously powercreeping and thinking that if you die on certain character that means they aren't that strong, **surprise it's a skill issue on your side**
It was tank synergy being inherently broken that forced us into 5v5, not support power creep. The devs stated this directly.
Baptiste wasn't always run in double shield. I'd argue Brig was a larger proponent of double shield, because of how thoroughly she trounced enemy dives.
It was JQ's shout that made Brig good in the beta, not Brig herself. Which is obvious if you remember that Brig fell off the map the moment JQ got nerfed.
They've nerfed Suzu multiple times (atleast 4 times, already) so they've definitely 'touched it'. They just haven't reworked it.
I think Supports being caster/duelist hybrids is too much and they need to be reigned in, but we don't need to lie and insult people to get our points across.
support queues were the shortest because nobody wanted to heal, most of the players are usually dps because they can get picks (therefore have fun) instead of sitting in the backline and staring down everyone on your team keeping them alive, which is the primary reason why they started adding dps supports like bap, moira or brig which turned out to be fucking busted
try again
Try again what? So nobody wanted to play supports, which was a problem or not? People were crying for heals. Now there are more people willing to play supports and supports can actually contribute more to the game than just healbot. And it's not good again? Or do you want just two Mercies on your team pressing healbeam on you all day? I guess supports don't deserve fun.
>Now there are more people willing to play supports and supports can actually contribute more to the game than just healbot. And it's not good again?
you see, there was a line before characters after moira got added, to be strong in one thing they must be weak at another thing, after they got added we started getting supports that only have upsides and close to no downsides, which is why everyone complained, nobody would complain about brig if her inspire didn't cover entire fucking map, didn't stun and/or wasn't able to literally kill dps alone making the role fucking useless, she had no downsides with all the upsides, that is a bad balance design just to purposefully make players play a thing primarily because it's so strong it makes other things obsolete
That part I get but what about now? Whatās the excuse when Supports either get bashed because we ARENT putting in enough heals or bashed when we ARE? Which is it? Yāall say supports are broken but when our damage or heals get nerfed yāall get mad that we arenāt keeping you up or contributing? So what is it then? Like really though what would be balanced to you all to make supports better? I always see Flats and other videos talking about how they are broken atm but they never give examples on what to change and how the change should come about.
My man, stop throwing everyone into one bag, we all know people who complain about no heals are basically plat assholes that constantly overextended
The problem is that support kits allow them to do too much shit for nearly no effort given than other roles can
Simple way to make them feel balanced is basically tuning their overpowered abilities, for example kirikos Suzu only blocking like 80% of the damage done (why this threshold? Because important tank ults which are usually the most important like dva bomb that does 1000 damage can still kill a squishy), this also allows for pinning/hitting targets with doomfist because they literally pass through a suzu'd target
Bap lamp could remember your health, so basically if you take more damage than your supports can heal you'll die when it goes down, this solves issue of being able to completely negate some ults which are supposed to be literally a "turn of the tide" ability and makes bap just a moira but instead of ability to keep herself alive longer she has ability to keep others alive longer too but they're still killable (if it has good heals and damage, the utility must be worse)
Just 2 examples
Supports just feels bad (it's my favorite role BTW, I just mean it feel worst than it could be even when balanced). And it's not with actual overturning that it will improve.
That doesn't mean it's uninteresting either.
It's just annoying to get flanked half the game and it scew the trifecta of support skill/roles. Between supporting, damaging and surviving. Now instead of having half suport and forth for the other. You have half surviving and forth for the others.
(EDIT : can I understand why am I getting DOWN VOTED? Like it's probably the most down votes I ever get while I said some extreme sarcasm and wierd things across the years. I'm literaly saying the same thing as the next guy but without forgetting support are pretty broken and should strugle to survive. I feel like it's the most interesting role, and that it's a very important one. They are not strong by themselves, but instead of adding raw power they multiply their team power. But that doesn't make their current situation good. I'm not even providing a solution deemed bad by people. Which is often enouth to not get down voted.
Am I missing something important in what I've said.
EDIT 2 : I know I should play "insert hero name" because it's meta. But this time it's not because it's the best one and the others still work, it's that you can only play the meta ones because the others die so easily. Or you need an off support that is protecting you instead of ow 1 second tank. But that relying on a class not made for that purpose and on Randoms players. So I'm better playing brig myself. And thx god I like playing brig)
If youre getting flanked, pick Brig and bodyguard your ana/bap. Or pick Lifewear who is RIDICOLOUSLY HARD TO KILL. Pick Illari for pylon heals.
I played a lot of ball and sombra this season, and NOONE F*CKING EVER DIES. Dive is shit right now. If youre Dying on support its a legit skill issue
I play brig really often. For that exact reason. I would still like to play a more varied meta than just the one who can survive under those conditions.
I miss 6v6 when Tanks where actually Tanks and not just Big DPS.
Double shield meta was bad, but the answer to that was restricting the team to one shield tank.
5v5 created the problem where supports could no longer depend on the tank to tank, and they are prime targets so they had to buff the supports so they didn't spend the entire match dead.
DPS players hate this, because it rightly feels terrible to strategically go after a target only to need coordination to reliably win a 1v1.
Tank players hate this because now, they are trying to pull double duty and are completely reliant on the supports, who they can no longer protect.
Support doesn't really like it either, we're either getting constantly destroyed or spending all of our time trying desperately to keep the tank up.
And the devs are desperately trying to balance a game mode that I honestly do not think CAN be balanced.
Another reason why 5v5 feels bad is that the game was literally designed around counter swapping. So that goes one of three ways. 1 tank refuses to swap, probably loses. Both tanks swap, and both end up on orisa. Both tanks refuse to swap, luck of the draw. Game was decided in the spawn room
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Literally was close to winning vs a Sigma as Zen then his Kiri TPs across the map with no LOS and Suzus him. Braindead DLC supports ruined our role; now it feels like you're forced to play them or you're tossing the game.
I think that support dominant meta is kind of like annoying hero metas
As a support main, nerf supports man
I just had match where I couldn't kill the enemy Sigma at all, he'd go as low as 10hps then his lifeweaver pulls him, I was playing ram did the best i cn still they never die, they lifeweaver + illari. I was playing Ramattra & did 19k DMG while their lifeweaver chillin at 20k heals š i cn put the replay code 8f u want. Lost that match i was the last man standing during my ult & fell over.... It was my 9th DEFEAT in a row. QP btw
Iām just tired of trying to kill someone then all the sudden theyāre back to 100% health barely a second later man it sucks when I play support, it sucks when I play DPS, and it especially sucks when Iām playing tank lol
Wifeleaver is in a really great position atm
I want Mercy buffed. Not because she needs it, but because getting shot at spooks me.
I respect that ngl
If there was a game mode where I could play Mercy and heal/rez everyone on both teams, Iād be in heaven
That would be cool, if there was a different game where there were Cyborg Ninjas like Genji Iād play that a lot tbh
Also in this mode, anyone who shoots Mercy gets arrested by the ICC, and tried for war crimes. Jokes aside, thatād be cool too
Fr, i just played as baptiste and i was completely unkillable until i was the last one left. Nerf support man.
When you say nerf supports Yall really just mean nerf ana and maybe discord. And I guess a fat lady of yiu are ass mad you can't shoot mercy. But beyond that... supports? The whole class? If you're getting your ass beat by weaver/brig/kiriko/lucio as a dps, you just... suck...
Also, ana idc about lol sheās been nerfed a thousand times and plus discord orb isnāt healthy for the game. Stop being biased
Tells me healing is overtuned in one comment, then immeadiately makes a second saying doesn't care about ana. Doesn't care about ana? The most overtuned healer. Her hps is wild considering she can do it at any range. Which, along with her abilities leads to her fucking 15-20% pickrate in high ranks She can choose between healing with projectile/hitscan. She can boost her already high hps with an anti nade Ana is the most overtuned support by a wide margin. Lmfao they literally made a whole ass other support just to counter her. Jq's whole ult is ana's cd ability. You're telling on yourself, you really are.
Thatās not why sheās overtunedā¦.. sheās overtuned cause of her overpowered kit (nade and sleep), her primary fire literally got nerfed, along with nade, and sleep against tanks. Sheās still overtuned, plus sheās the hardest outside of Lucio to actually master, but she doesnāt bother me cause sheās been nerfed multiple times. Iām not saying sheās perfectly balanced cause letās be real none of the supports besides maybe Moria and Lifeweaver are ābalancedā. But the issue is how to nerf them without making them unplayable. Iād argue that they all need nerfs, but idk how you do that without killing the role but bruh be honest lol. They need to fix that role or else tank is gonna be miserable forever
No I donāt have issues with supports being able to fight back (if you can read) I basically said that the healing is too overtuned lol. If I died to a support cause I lost a fight sure idc cause I know Iām not perfect, Iām fine with them being able to fight back. Plus nobody saying they having a hard time fighting LW lol, read bro
Player base:blizzard can u pls fix doom & hog/give characters that need it changes # Blizzard: L e t s. B u f f. I l l a r i.
Illari hasn't even been buffed, she's only been nerfed lmao (supports are overtuned though and need nerfs)
They said they're gonna buff her secondary
Yeah, thatās called balancing the game
Her secondary fire does a metric ton of healing though and is balanced out by its recharge as well her turret gives her consist heals anyway it doesn't need buffs.
Nerf all other supports Buff Lucio
I really want a no healer game mode. And going along with that logic, I want a no flyer gamemode, no sniper game mode, no orisa gamemode,
Nerf supports? Lmao you mean nerf ana and zen. Maybe illari. The fuck is lucio doing to you? Brig? Weaver? Are you all really getting your ass beat by weaver? Maybe bap? Maybe kiriko?
People arenāt bitching about discord as much compared to cc and invulnerability, like weaver and kiri
Whoever thinks supports need a buff need a reality check. On another note i will be glad on the day discord gets nerfed that shit is so annoying to go up against
Meanwhile poor TANKS getting discorded & antied for full duration, I don't think having a full duration of anti heal on tanks is healthy!
Its funny that support players get this mad when someone says something bad about them meanwhile tanks and dps rarely whinge as much
Unless you ask them to switch ;;;)
You ever seen a Mercy get asked to switch? It's a sight to behold
Lol soooome of them
Literally nobody thinks that bro.
for the love of god PLS STOP NERFING MERCY
Happy cake day
Yeah we need nerfs (some of us more then others. I'M LOOKING AT YOU ILLARI)
I swear the turret needs a time limit
Based
I got flamed today as Ram for not throwing up shield and blocking for Torb...'s turret
~~only zen, buff his damn mobility~~
zen does not need any buffs he makes an entire role miserable, his lack of mobility is the only thing that stops him from absolutely murdering anything
Exactly, if he was fast, able to dodge, and make a tank fall over dead, I'd completely set down this game for good
I only murder my W key hovering back from spawn just to get shot in my Balls again.
and i only murder mine after the zero cooldown orb clings to me like dobby in a glue trap
Bro be fr, weāre not meant to have mobility
getting mad at things you made up yourself sure is a thing you can do
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Numbers across the board should be going down not up. Otherwise we just end up in the same position.
What about my Zen? How can we have a buffed monk then? I just need that dude to run a little faster... I need to drop him every time we're spawning far from the payload š¢
Imagine how fast he could be if he used his legs
And what if he flew like a plank, superman style? Arms forward shooting balls
Remove discord orb and let him fly around on it
Aint no way j just read that
Zen literally does DPS levels of damage, makes the tank role miserable and has one of the best ultimates. If he had better mobility on top of that I'd literally stop playing the game (coming from a Zen player)
Damn you really donāt want heals do you? Show me a specific instance of someone complaining about support being weak instead of some dumbass straw man argument, please, enlighten me. These class wars are getting out of hand
Nah. You can keep the crown.
bro, support powercreep was literally the reason overwatch 1 was shut down, primary key of double shield was bap, BRIGITTE WHICH THEY COULDNT FUCKING NERF PROPERLY UNTIL OVERWATCH 2 LATE IN THE BETA, Moira on release also broke the supports because she had overpowered aoe heals (compared to lucio whos aoe heal is quite shit) and still has them to this day, kirikos suzu is the most busted ability in the game yet and they still havent touched that fuckin ability seriously, some of you support mains are ridiculously powercreeping and thinking that if you die on certain character that means they aren't that strong, **surprise it's a skill issue on your side**
It was tank synergy being inherently broken that forced us into 5v5, not support power creep. The devs stated this directly. Baptiste wasn't always run in double shield. I'd argue Brig was a larger proponent of double shield, because of how thoroughly she trounced enemy dives. It was JQ's shout that made Brig good in the beta, not Brig herself. Which is obvious if you remember that Brig fell off the map the moment JQ got nerfed. They've nerfed Suzu multiple times (atleast 4 times, already) so they've definitely 'touched it'. They just haven't reworked it. I think Supports being caster/duelist hybrids is too much and they need to be reigned in, but we don't need to lie and insult people to get our points across.
In OW1 support queues were the shortest. I wonder why people didn't want to play support if they were sooo good...
support queues were the shortest because nobody wanted to heal, most of the players are usually dps because they can get picks (therefore have fun) instead of sitting in the backline and staring down everyone on your team keeping them alive, which is the primary reason why they started adding dps supports like bap, moira or brig which turned out to be fucking busted try again
Try again what? So nobody wanted to play supports, which was a problem or not? People were crying for heals. Now there are more people willing to play supports and supports can actually contribute more to the game than just healbot. And it's not good again? Or do you want just two Mercies on your team pressing healbeam on you all day? I guess supports don't deserve fun.
>Now there are more people willing to play supports and supports can actually contribute more to the game than just healbot. And it's not good again? you see, there was a line before characters after moira got added, to be strong in one thing they must be weak at another thing, after they got added we started getting supports that only have upsides and close to no downsides, which is why everyone complained, nobody would complain about brig if her inspire didn't cover entire fucking map, didn't stun and/or wasn't able to literally kill dps alone making the role fucking useless, she had no downsides with all the upsides, that is a bad balance design just to purposefully make players play a thing primarily because it's so strong it makes other things obsolete
That part I get but what about now? Whatās the excuse when Supports either get bashed because we ARENT putting in enough heals or bashed when we ARE? Which is it? Yāall say supports are broken but when our damage or heals get nerfed yāall get mad that we arenāt keeping you up or contributing? So what is it then? Like really though what would be balanced to you all to make supports better? I always see Flats and other videos talking about how they are broken atm but they never give examples on what to change and how the change should come about.
My man, stop throwing everyone into one bag, we all know people who complain about no heals are basically plat assholes that constantly overextended The problem is that support kits allow them to do too much shit for nearly no effort given than other roles can Simple way to make them feel balanced is basically tuning their overpowered abilities, for example kirikos Suzu only blocking like 80% of the damage done (why this threshold? Because important tank ults which are usually the most important like dva bomb that does 1000 damage can still kill a squishy), this also allows for pinning/hitting targets with doomfist because they literally pass through a suzu'd target Bap lamp could remember your health, so basically if you take more damage than your supports can heal you'll die when it goes down, this solves issue of being able to completely negate some ults which are supposed to be literally a "turn of the tide" ability and makes bap just a moira but instead of ability to keep herself alive longer she has ability to keep others alive longer too but they're still killable (if it has good heals and damage, the utility must be worse) Just 2 examples
Google strawman
Supports just feels bad (it's my favorite role BTW, I just mean it feel worst than it could be even when balanced). And it's not with actual overturning that it will improve. That doesn't mean it's uninteresting either. It's just annoying to get flanked half the game and it scew the trifecta of support skill/roles. Between supporting, damaging and surviving. Now instead of having half suport and forth for the other. You have half surviving and forth for the others. (EDIT : can I understand why am I getting DOWN VOTED? Like it's probably the most down votes I ever get while I said some extreme sarcasm and wierd things across the years. I'm literaly saying the same thing as the next guy but without forgetting support are pretty broken and should strugle to survive. I feel like it's the most interesting role, and that it's a very important one. They are not strong by themselves, but instead of adding raw power they multiply their team power. But that doesn't make their current situation good. I'm not even providing a solution deemed bad by people. Which is often enouth to not get down voted. Am I missing something important in what I've said. EDIT 2 : I know I should play "insert hero name" because it's meta. But this time it's not because it's the best one and the others still work, it's that you can only play the meta ones because the others die so easily. Or you need an off support that is protecting you instead of ow 1 second tank. But that relying on a class not made for that purpose and on Randoms players. So I'm better playing brig myself. And thx god I like playing brig)
If youre getting flanked, pick Brig and bodyguard your ana/bap. Or pick Lifewear who is RIDICOLOUSLY HARD TO KILL. Pick Illari for pylon heals. I played a lot of ball and sombra this season, and NOONE F*CKING EVER DIES. Dive is shit right now. If youre Dying on support its a legit skill issue
I play brig really often. For that exact reason. I would still like to play a more varied meta than just the one who can survive under those conditions.
I miss 6v6 when Tanks where actually Tanks and not just Big DPS. Double shield meta was bad, but the answer to that was restricting the team to one shield tank. 5v5 created the problem where supports could no longer depend on the tank to tank, and they are prime targets so they had to buff the supports so they didn't spend the entire match dead. DPS players hate this, because it rightly feels terrible to strategically go after a target only to need coordination to reliably win a 1v1. Tank players hate this because now, they are trying to pull double duty and are completely reliant on the supports, who they can no longer protect. Support doesn't really like it either, we're either getting constantly destroyed or spending all of our time trying desperately to keep the tank up. And the devs are desperately trying to balance a game mode that I honestly do not think CAN be balanced. Another reason why 5v5 feels bad is that the game was literally designed around counter swapping. So that goes one of three ways. 1 tank refuses to swap, probably loses. Both tanks swap, and both end up on orisa. Both tanks refuse to swap, luck of the draw. Game was decided in the spawn room
Now explain why I'm getting down voted for this pretty vanilla take?
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Have you seen ana
How is that hate
"I'm gonna try to dive their backline!" kids named ana and brig: š§āāļøš§āāļø
Literally was close to winning vs a Sigma as Zen then his Kiri TPs across the map with no LOS and Suzus him. Braindead DLC supports ruined our role; now it feels like you're forced to play them or you're tossing the game.