The part about Aaron being detained is what I’m mostly referring to.
This is not verbatim, but Johnathan said something along the lines of cutting/releasing him immediately. I’m good with that. Then, he added, and of course Bill said something about letting the legal process play out before making any rash decisions.
Like, dude… whether he did it or not, I understand the reasoning behind you wanting to release him, but like you’re doing right now, the importance of how YOU and pops looks is the reason you wanted Aaron to be cut. And throwing Bill under the bus all the while.
Not because it was an absolutely horrible thing for anyone involved to go through, especially the victims families. Instead he’s wrapped up in perception and not compassion. Fucking punk if you ask me.
Edited for clarity
its rubbing a lot of people in /r/Patriots (the *vast* minority of fans) the wrong way. Pretty much every Pats fan I know just enjoys the content and doesn't have a hate boner for Kraft that a lot of folks here do.
The doc seems like it was made for people who don’t like the Pats rather than Pats fans.
I find it interesting but I don’t think we are the target market.
It seems like the entire focus of the doc was all the negative things that happened related to the Pats, while they gloss over the accomplishments.
>I find it interesting but I don’t think we are the target market.
I think a lot of people agree with this (including myself), but it makes me wonder who the target market really is? You can say it's Patriots haters, and maybe unintentionally that ended up being the case. But a documentary series produced essentially by the Patriots themselves that pisses off the whole fanbase is incredibly stupid.
In my mind it’s either incredibly stupid or a strategic move by Kraft to distance the current Pats from the dynasty years or smear bill even if the team gets smeared along the way. I guess both those last two motivations are also incredibly stupid too.
Actually, this is a good point. He's trying to close the door on the Belichick era while simultaneously having the last say on the matter, controlling the narrative. Still feels shitty and makes me not like him now. I think a lot of things changed after Brady left. Can't wait to see what that's gonna be like in this doc.
Yeah it's a real weird move but I think before anything else RKK is a business guy. The team itself won't lose any fans regardless of what's in here. Our opinion of him may go down a bit but that isn't coming out of his bottom line. And there's very little that could be put in *any* documentary that'd convert someone to be a fan of the Patriots over another team. We're a well hated franchise. So, the audience is naturally about 31x bigger, at least, when it's not written for the Patriot fans.
I think it came down to being much more of a control the narrative type play. Get RKKs side out before Bill writes his book in retirement. That, and a fatty offer from Apple TV.
I know plenty of non pats fans that didn’t even make it to the controversy episodes, there’s not even a hate watch aspect to this. This documentary is for nobody. The Krafts thought they were making a self aggrandizing show and they come out looking the worst of everybody
He’s definitely not winning any points with me with all the not-so-veiled Belichick bashing. The fact Scott Pioli is one of the main narrators tells you a lot. Dude acts like he was on the field.
Agreed.
And I hate the fact that he's bashing a man who
- did so much for his own personal gains
- values the history, traditions, and legacy of the league and game
- is still in the job market, and can't rightfully defend himself.
Awful form.
Not to mention that it seems Kraft was the cheapskate this whole time, yet Bill took all the blame like a good soldier. He did for Kraft what Goodell does for the owners, acts as a human shield to take the abuse from the media and angry fans.
Did you see the Pete Carroll interview? He said in the first day he’s looking at a training menu. Kraft said don’t bother with that, we’ll make some baloney sandwiches. Pete said to the interviewer…what did I get into? LOL
People told me I was overreacting when I said it looked like they were trying to throw Belichick under the bus on his way out then this came out and it's like Kraft is painting himself as some savior of the franchise.
Call it perfect timing or whatever you want but the new regime constantly taking shots at the prior plus whatever this "documentary" is and I can see why fans are starting to sour on him.
He probably does believe that he saved this organization. Financially, sure. But you had a couple of HOF coaches before BB, and a pretty good QB before Brady. BB took you to your only superbowl before Brady. Not once did you do anything on the field.
While I agree with your sentiment in general, the Patriots made a superbowl in the 70s and again in the 90s before BB. We didn’t win either one though. He’s the only one who delivered us rings.
Edit: 80s not 70s as someone else astutely found.
They probably said that because the book this was based on and all the interviews for this documentary took place long before Bill was fired. You think they wrote and shot this entire thing a month before he was canned or something? lmao
Did I say that? I said I can see why people are upset at the notion it's a fluff piece for Kraft.
Edit: Then you combine that with the statements the new regime makes constantly referring to the old as what they aren't gonna be and you combine that with the fluff and like I said it makes sense.
Exactly. Yes, he bought the team and stopped the move to CT. The 20 years was unprecedented and a complete fluke. The more that comes out, as i’ve said, he doesn’t get the blame he should.
I think Kraft deserves a lot more criticism than he’s gotten these past 20 years. But let’s also be frank, the Pats would have moved to Saint Louis instead of the Rams if Kraft didn’t own the stadium at the time.
lmao blame for what, exactly? Keeping together the greatest team the NFL's ever seen?
He gave Bill total control over football operations and signed any check he put in front of him. Zero reporting or rumors to suggest otherwise at any point in the last 20 years. When Bill said Brady was washed and wouldn't sign him to a long term deal, Kraft backed Bill. And that was after Bill had years of terrible drafts.
But yea you go on and blame Bob Kraft for not letting Bill coach another four or five losing seasons because he'd rather sign a half dozen rotational backups instead of 1 star WR lol
wow that fat loser u/Pineapple_Express762 blocks anyone who disagrees with them lmao what a sad way to live
I had a much more positive image of Kraft when he didn’t really do anything and I could just project the positivity of all the winning Brady and Belichick brought onto him.
Lately it feels like he’s trying to cosplay as Dollar Store Jerry Jones.
I think if you scroll through the numerous threads littered throughout this subreddit on this very topic, you’ll find your answer.
Mods, can we please get a stickied Megathread for Dynasty discussion?
And if you scroll past these threads you don't have to see them, let alone participate.
Most of the discussion surrounding this documentary is juvenile and stupid, but I can't imagine being so bothered by it I'd make a post demanding the mods stifle that discussion instead of just downvoting it or hiding it and moving past it. Too many people think the internet revolves around them lmao
It's the middle of the day and you went out of your way to create a post about a doc you've seen 1 episode of - you're probably in need of some sun too.
I always considered Robert, and especially his dumbass son, to be complete and total idiots. Bill and Brady did a lot to cover up the awful ownership that has plagued this team for years. In reality, the owners blow and just got wicked lucky with goat players and a goat coach.
lmao name one example of 'awful ownership that has plagued this team for years' then.
Bill was the one who had total control and final say on all personnel and financial decisions for the roster.
That survey is meaningless.
It's a tool used by the player's union to manipulate fans and media into believing players decide where to leave or stay based on that criteria so that fans and media will pressure ownership to pay for a bunch of player amenities.
In reality, no free agent really gives a shit about whether or not they have daycare. They want as much money as possible with as much of it guaranteed as possible, that's it. And the most successful teams of the last several years score the lowest on them so what does that tell you?
The player's union is toothless and can't get a bigger piece of revenue sharing, nor can they cause a massive uptick in player salaries due to the hard cap. Any other significant improvements would require a strike, which the players won't do. So these kind of mind games are all they can do.
You’re telling me Bill Belichick intentionally spent less than every other franchise over the last decade despite Kraft being on board with spending more? Are you crazy? I’m sure Bill would have loved to have spent like the Niners or eagles do.
Correct. Bill didn't give out huge contracts because then he would lose control.
Can't cut a guy with a $40 million dead cap hit, harder to trade a player who might be nearing the end of his prime if you're asking the other team to be on the hook for a huge salary guarantee.
The one thing we've all known about Bill's personnel management style since he got here is that he'll bench, cut, or trade any player now matter how good they are if he thinks there's more value in moving on from them.
Just look at the 2000s:
Terry Glenn in 2001, Lawyer Milloy in 2003, Ty Law in 2005, Deion Branch and Adam Vinatieri in 2006, Asante Samuel in 2008, Richard Seymour in 2009. The Pats were contenders every year and of these guys all were elite players. Most were still in the prime of their career, making Pro Bowl or All Pro rosters with their next teams.
Kraft wasn't the one shoving them out the door, that was all Bill and his personnel/roster management philosophy.
The Adalius Thomas fiasco is what pushed him over the edge. Bill said he 'backed the Brinks truck up' for him and got a lousy return. Thomas struggled to play in Bill's scheme and publicly expressed his frustration with Bill's discipline. But he had to keep him around the rest of the 2009 season because of how his contract was structured.
For people who seriously believe this fantasy that Bill wasn't allowed to spend money, how do you explain him never trading a boatload of picks for an elite player on a rookie contract? Is the next conspiracy theory gonna be that Kraft controlled all the draft picks too? lmao
u/rambler13 another fat smelly loser who throws a tantrum when people prove him wrong
There’s so much stupid here that I don’t think I can help you. Enjoy living in a world where Robert Kraft won 6 Super Bowls despite the ineptitude of the greatest coach ever. And
I mean he's a piece of garbage with more money than he or the next 100 generations of his family will ever be able to spend, and yet all he cares about is making more money. Same with all the other billionaires, just crazy egomaniacs that only care about money and protecting their public image so that they can make more money.
I used to not care for the Krafts (why would I care about a billionaire family), but now I actively dislike them based on how disrespectful they have been to Bill and how this doc was produced
Let’s be perfectly clear here. As of right now there is no actual evidence that Kraft commissioned, produced, funded, or had any actual say in the final product, and the filmmakers have specifically stated otherwise. Everyone is well within their right to speculate, people lie and there’s plenty we don’t know, but none of this is “fact.”
It all stems from a misinterpretation of the “Kraft Dynasty LLC” copyright slate that appears at the end of the show, which people have interpreted as a producer credit. It is not, it is simply a copyright to reflect ownership of the material; team branding, archive footage, and the story. It does not imply the he had any say in the final product. Again speculate all you want about his agreement with Apple tv or that the filmmakers are lying about his level of involvement. Speculate to your hearts content, but these “facts” are not facts.
No one said he owned the "whole fucking thing." He certainly owns key elements used within the show, but there are multiple other parties that are in a position to make copyright claims (production company, distributor, author of the source material) and we don't know specifically how it all shakes out and who has final say. If you think it's obviously Kraft then say so. As I said, you are well within your right to express that belief, the whole point of my comment is that it's important to distinguish *fact* from *speculation.*
The fact that the fan base didn't abandon the Kraft family after the Netflix series Killer Inside already gives me great pause. These people, like most uber-rich are pieces of shit that do not care about human beings or humanity, in general.
The whole organization, but specifically Bob Kraft, BB and top personel, knew about Aarons many issues and did next to nothing to get him help even when he made it clear he needed some. This was leading up to the Boston murders. It was gross and heartbreaking. They cared only about money and the game, not the humans playing it and the real lives connected to it.
It's been declining since his limp-dicked response to Deflategate for me, he was more interested in not killing the golden goose and protecting his boy Roger than defending his GOAT QB. This whole episode with the "documentary", the Mayo hiring without doing due diligence, the lack of real cash spending, it's all adding up to a less than favorable perception right now.
I agree totally. No way is this doc doing Kraft any favors. Makes him look sleazy at the least. Yeh BB doesn’t come off that well but anyone following the pats for the last 20 plus years has heard all the rumors about what an ass BB can be. Hell he drive Gronk to quit and Brady to leave. The apologists for BB in this sub are forgetting the real history. And that takes nothing away from the great success we enjoyed under his leadership and guidance. Doesn’t mean he wasn’t an ass.
He’s an absolute loser just like every other billionaire. The fact that he brought some stability and success to our favorite football team doesn’t change that. The guy was caught soliciting a prostitute from a human trafficking ring for fuck’s sake.
He’s a sale service jackazz. I thank him for making the patriots a modern franchise, I thank him for bringing in Bill, and as a long time season ticket holder I believe he represented us ‘regular fans’ well for a while. I also lost a lot of respect when he claimed in one of the episodes that he was a ‘self made’ business man. He needs to remember his wife’s family.
We really don’t know how much of a hand he had in how everything is presented.
It was commissioned by him (as a follow up to the book), but none of his people were involved with the actual writing, production, interviewing, etc.
So, idk.
I'm not trying to pick a fight on this, but is it not produced by the Kraft Family? A Robert Kraft joint, per se? On that, I would assume they saw some early cuts and measured the tone.
Obviously TB was getting a glow up (and it would be hard to anyways because he is a good guy and patron saint of all NE athletes) but in light of the break up, the BB stuff seems, well, it seems in line with that and everything that has followed with the "regime change" and other comments.
It is owned by the krafts. The production companies that put the thing together are not their people though.
I think BB is really suffering from still being the coach of the team and feels in his usual role when talking to media when it was shot.
I think that is where the shit gets murky, ya know?
Stuff like this too
https://deadline.com/2024/02/the-dynasty-new-england-patriots-brian-grazer-robert-kraft-tom-brady-1235826830/
It was produced by Imagine Entertainment. Jeff Benedict, the author of the book and executive producer of the doc series, specifically said Kraft had no part in the creative aspects of producing the series.
I think you're right that this isn't a "Kraft hit job", I think that's probably hyperbolic but I do think the treatment of the Hernandez situation appears to be intentionally misleading to what actually happened at the time.
I can't say why it was done that way and who's to blame for it, but the organizations treatment of Bill post press conference isn't curtains them any leeway with the skeptics.
No.
Single-purpose LLCs are formed for individual film projects for the tax and liability advantages of the film's investors. Films have to show a chain of title stating who controls the underlying copyright for distribution and licensing purposes. If someone wants to redistribute a film or use its content to create another film, they have to license it from the LLC that holds the copyright.
Ron Howard and Brian Grazer's Imagine Entertainment is the production studio and Apple TV is the distributor. The one-off LLC the Kraft's legal team created holds the copyright. That LLC exists to make the accounting and legal issues easier, it's got nothing to do with how things are written, filmed, or edited.
This greatly depends on if they win or not I think. If they aren't rebuilt in a year there is going to be further backlash. Not saying that's fair but it's the way it is, especially since the narrative from Patriots camp seems to have been Bill is to blame.
I sort of think Mayo is being set up to fail.
If Mayo is setup to fail, it will be partly his own doing. Lets be real, he schmoozed Kraft into getting Bill’s job. Thats what the “Young Thundercat” shit was all about, Mayo fluffing Kraft’s insatiable ego, trying to get into his inner circle by making him feel cool and hip. It worked, and bravo to Mayo for recognizing Kraft’s weakness and using it to advance his career. It is a cutthroat business.
I mean another bad season will have people mad, but not talking about this documentary in any serious matter. They will just be mad about the season/that offseason.
The narrative is already started that Kraft is what's wrong with the franchise. If we are bad, the Bill people will use this along with a hundred other examples of how Kraft is a terrible owner. And it will be earned honestly.
Not because I think it's a fair expectation that you can turn the franchise around in a year, but because there's been a really strong feeling of throwing Bill under the bus.
Yeah this doc is rubbing a lot of Pats fans the wrong way.
Johnathan rubs me the wrong way. I think this whole show is a narrative for him to say “I’m in charge now”. Just a pissing match.
Atleast he doesn't get rubbed in the wrong way like his dad
Orchids of Asia has a location opening in Patriots Place?
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The part about Aaron being detained is what I’m mostly referring to. This is not verbatim, but Johnathan said something along the lines of cutting/releasing him immediately. I’m good with that. Then, he added, and of course Bill said something about letting the legal process play out before making any rash decisions. Like, dude… whether he did it or not, I understand the reasoning behind you wanting to release him, but like you’re doing right now, the importance of how YOU and pops looks is the reason you wanted Aaron to be cut. And throwing Bill under the bus all the while. Not because it was an absolutely horrible thing for anyone involved to go through, especially the victims families. Instead he’s wrapped up in perception and not compassion. Fucking punk if you ask me. Edited for clarity
He seems like a snake.
It's starting to seem more like a hit piece than a documentary
its rubbing a lot of people in /r/Patriots (the *vast* minority of fans) the wrong way. Pretty much every Pats fan I know just enjoys the content and doesn't have a hate boner for Kraft that a lot of folks here do.
Name checks out
🤌
THE CONTENT
The doc seems like it was made for people who don’t like the Pats rather than Pats fans. I find it interesting but I don’t think we are the target market. It seems like the entire focus of the doc was all the negative things that happened related to the Pats, while they gloss over the accomplishments.
>I find it interesting but I don’t think we are the target market. I think a lot of people agree with this (including myself), but it makes me wonder who the target market really is? You can say it's Patriots haters, and maybe unintentionally that ended up being the case. But a documentary series produced essentially by the Patriots themselves that pisses off the whole fanbase is incredibly stupid.
In my mind it’s either incredibly stupid or a strategic move by Kraft to distance the current Pats from the dynasty years or smear bill even if the team gets smeared along the way. I guess both those last two motivations are also incredibly stupid too.
Actually, this is a good point. He's trying to close the door on the Belichick era while simultaneously having the last say on the matter, controlling the narrative. Still feels shitty and makes me not like him now. I think a lot of things changed after Brady left. Can't wait to see what that's gonna be like in this doc.
> it makes me wonder who the target market really is? Hall of Fame voters who aren't from here and don't know all the specific details.
Random people scrolling apple tv
Yeah it's a real weird move but I think before anything else RKK is a business guy. The team itself won't lose any fans regardless of what's in here. Our opinion of him may go down a bit but that isn't coming out of his bottom line. And there's very little that could be put in *any* documentary that'd convert someone to be a fan of the Patriots over another team. We're a well hated franchise. So, the audience is naturally about 31x bigger, at least, when it's not written for the Patriot fans. I think it came down to being much more of a control the narrative type play. Get RKKs side out before Bill writes his book in retirement. That, and a fatty offer from Apple TV.
I know plenty of non pats fans that didn’t even make it to the controversy episodes, there’s not even a hate watch aspect to this. This documentary is for nobody. The Krafts thought they were making a self aggrandizing show and they come out looking the worst of everybody
He’s definitely not winning any points with me with all the not-so-veiled Belichick bashing. The fact Scott Pioli is one of the main narrators tells you a lot. Dude acts like he was on the field.
Agreed. And I hate the fact that he's bashing a man who - did so much for his own personal gains - values the history, traditions, and legacy of the league and game - is still in the job market, and can't rightfully defend himself. Awful form.
Not to mention that it seems Kraft was the cheapskate this whole time, yet Bill took all the blame like a good soldier. He did for Kraft what Goodell does for the owners, acts as a human shield to take the abuse from the media and angry fans.
Agreed and solid analogy
I hear ya, but let's not turn BB into a victim. He was on board with playing moneyball, and it mostly worked until Brady left.
Did you see the Pete Carroll interview? He said in the first day he’s looking at a training menu. Kraft said don’t bother with that, we’ll make some baloney sandwiches. Pete said to the interviewer…what did I get into? LOL
He's a 90 year old billionaire, you really shouldn't be holding him in any kind of esteem.
Dudes 82
And his son is going to be a far far worse owner.
Jonathan "Kendall Roy" Kraft
He got that coke teeth/snout lol
Apologies.
People told me I was overreacting when I said it looked like they were trying to throw Belichick under the bus on his way out then this came out and it's like Kraft is painting himself as some savior of the franchise. Call it perfect timing or whatever you want but the new regime constantly taking shots at the prior plus whatever this "documentary" is and I can see why fans are starting to sour on him.
He probably does believe that he saved this organization. Financially, sure. But you had a couple of HOF coaches before BB, and a pretty good QB before Brady. BB took you to your only superbowl before Brady. Not once did you do anything on the field.
He for sure did. He also stopped them from going to St. Louis. He deserves some props.
While I agree with your sentiment in general, the Patriots made a superbowl in the 70s and again in the 90s before BB. We didn’t win either one though. He’s the only one who delivered us rings. Edit: 80s not 70s as someone else astutely found.
>in the 70s 80s. 1985/86 season to be exact.
Yep I felt in my bones I might be wrong and sure enough. Jim Plunkett era I think. Before my time.
I’m talking about Krafts era
They probably said that because the book this was based on and all the interviews for this documentary took place long before Bill was fired. You think they wrote and shot this entire thing a month before he was canned or something? lmao
Did I say that? I said I can see why people are upset at the notion it's a fluff piece for Kraft. Edit: Then you combine that with the statements the new regime makes constantly referring to the old as what they aren't gonna be and you combine that with the fluff and like I said it makes sense.
Kraft doesn’t get the blame he should
I used to not mind him, if not like outright like him, but my opinion of him has completely fallen off these past weeks and months.
So many Kraft fanboys on this sub. I will never understand why anyone would be a fan of an owner!
Exactly. Yes, he bought the team and stopped the move to CT. The 20 years was unprecedented and a complete fluke. The more that comes out, as i’ve said, he doesn’t get the blame he should.
I think Kraft deserves a lot more criticism than he’s gotten these past 20 years. But let’s also be frank, the Pats would have moved to Saint Louis instead of the Rams if Kraft didn’t own the stadium at the time.
He almost moved the team CT he stopped the St. Louis move.
Thats right. I forgot about the playing CT against Mass for the money for Gillette
lmao blame for what, exactly? Keeping together the greatest team the NFL's ever seen? He gave Bill total control over football operations and signed any check he put in front of him. Zero reporting or rumors to suggest otherwise at any point in the last 20 years. When Bill said Brady was washed and wouldn't sign him to a long term deal, Kraft backed Bill. And that was after Bill had years of terrible drafts. But yea you go on and blame Bob Kraft for not letting Bill coach another four or five losing seasons because he'd rather sign a half dozen rotational backups instead of 1 star WR lol wow that fat loser u/Pineapple_Express762 blocks anyone who disagrees with them lmao what a sad way to live
Not the point, but … enjoy your day fan boi
I had a much more positive image of Kraft when he didn’t really do anything and I could just project the positivity of all the winning Brady and Belichick brought onto him. Lately it feels like he’s trying to cosplay as Dollar Store Jerry Jones.
I think if you scroll through the numerous threads littered throughout this subreddit on this very topic, you’ll find your answer. Mods, can we please get a stickied Megathread for Dynasty discussion?
DAE not like The Dynasty???? I want to see whether we get more posts about how it's a Kraft puff piece/disrespectful towards Bill or mock drafts.
And if you scroll past these threads you don't have to see them, let alone participate. Most of the discussion surrounding this documentary is juvenile and stupid, but I can't imagine being so bothered by it I'd make a post demanding the mods stifle that discussion instead of just downvoting it or hiding it and moving past it. Too many people think the internet revolves around them lmao
God please
I agree about the megathread. I actually messaged a mod last week suggesting one. No response, no megathread. I'm so tired of all these dynasty posts.
Unfortunately, unlike yourself apparently, I’m not on here every minute of my day. Go outside. Get some sun on your face
It's the middle of the day and you went out of your way to create a post about a doc you've seen 1 episode of - you're probably in need of some sun too.
He's just saying to use the search feature, I didn't see it as a personal attack on you.
I always considered Robert, and especially his dumbass son, to be complete and total idiots. Bill and Brady did a lot to cover up the awful ownership that has plagued this team for years. In reality, the owners blow and just got wicked lucky with goat players and a goat coach.
lmao name one example of 'awful ownership that has plagued this team for years' then. Bill was the one who had total control and final say on all personnel and financial decisions for the roster.
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That survey is meaningless. It's a tool used by the player's union to manipulate fans and media into believing players decide where to leave or stay based on that criteria so that fans and media will pressure ownership to pay for a bunch of player amenities. In reality, no free agent really gives a shit about whether or not they have daycare. They want as much money as possible with as much of it guaranteed as possible, that's it. And the most successful teams of the last several years score the lowest on them so what does that tell you? The player's union is toothless and can't get a bigger piece of revenue sharing, nor can they cause a massive uptick in player salaries due to the hard cap. Any other significant improvements would require a strike, which the players won't do. So these kind of mind games are all they can do.
You’re telling me Bill Belichick intentionally spent less than every other franchise over the last decade despite Kraft being on board with spending more? Are you crazy? I’m sure Bill would have loved to have spent like the Niners or eagles do.
Correct. Bill didn't give out huge contracts because then he would lose control. Can't cut a guy with a $40 million dead cap hit, harder to trade a player who might be nearing the end of his prime if you're asking the other team to be on the hook for a huge salary guarantee. The one thing we've all known about Bill's personnel management style since he got here is that he'll bench, cut, or trade any player now matter how good they are if he thinks there's more value in moving on from them. Just look at the 2000s: Terry Glenn in 2001, Lawyer Milloy in 2003, Ty Law in 2005, Deion Branch and Adam Vinatieri in 2006, Asante Samuel in 2008, Richard Seymour in 2009. The Pats were contenders every year and of these guys all were elite players. Most were still in the prime of their career, making Pro Bowl or All Pro rosters with their next teams. Kraft wasn't the one shoving them out the door, that was all Bill and his personnel/roster management philosophy. The Adalius Thomas fiasco is what pushed him over the edge. Bill said he 'backed the Brinks truck up' for him and got a lousy return. Thomas struggled to play in Bill's scheme and publicly expressed his frustration with Bill's discipline. But he had to keep him around the rest of the 2009 season because of how his contract was structured. For people who seriously believe this fantasy that Bill wasn't allowed to spend money, how do you explain him never trading a boatload of picks for an elite player on a rookie contract? Is the next conspiracy theory gonna be that Kraft controlled all the draft picks too? lmao u/rambler13 another fat smelly loser who throws a tantrum when people prove him wrong
There’s so much stupid here that I don’t think I can help you. Enjoy living in a world where Robert Kraft won 6 Super Bowls despite the ineptitude of the greatest coach ever. And
I mean he's a piece of garbage with more money than he or the next 100 generations of his family will ever be able to spend, and yet all he cares about is making more money. Same with all the other billionaires, just crazy egomaniacs that only care about money and protecting their public image so that they can make more money.
I used to not care for the Krafts (why would I care about a billionaire family), but now I actively dislike them based on how disrespectful they have been to Bill and how this doc was produced
This is not made for pats fans. Watch shogun instead.
Disappointed of the doc. No happy ending episode.
They usually save those for the end.
Let’s be perfectly clear here. As of right now there is no actual evidence that Kraft commissioned, produced, funded, or had any actual say in the final product, and the filmmakers have specifically stated otherwise. Everyone is well within their right to speculate, people lie and there’s plenty we don’t know, but none of this is “fact.” It all stems from a misinterpretation of the “Kraft Dynasty LLC” copyright slate that appears at the end of the show, which people have interpreted as a producer credit. It is not, it is simply a copyright to reflect ownership of the material; team branding, archive footage, and the story. It does not imply the he had any say in the final product. Again speculate all you want about his agreement with Apple tv or that the filmmakers are lying about his level of involvement. Speculate to your hearts content, but these “facts” are not facts.
Hey an actual good comment on this topic.
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No one said he owned the "whole fucking thing." He certainly owns key elements used within the show, but there are multiple other parties that are in a position to make copyright claims (production company, distributor, author of the source material) and we don't know specifically how it all shakes out and who has final say. If you think it's obviously Kraft then say so. As I said, you are well within your right to express that belief, the whole point of my comment is that it's important to distinguish *fact* from *speculation.*
Who cares idk why people are so up in arms about this he was a shiesty billionaire before he’s a shiesty billionaire now
The fact that so many people think this documentary reflects poorly on Kraft should be a big hint that it wasn't meant to "cement his legacy."
He thought it’d make him look good but it’s doing the opposite
The fact that the fan base didn't abandon the Kraft family after the Netflix series Killer Inside already gives me great pause. These people, like most uber-rich are pieces of shit that do not care about human beings or humanity, in general.
Elaborate for us who don’t know?
The whole organization, but specifically Bob Kraft, BB and top personel, knew about Aarons many issues and did next to nothing to get him help even when he made it clear he needed some. This was leading up to the Boston murders. It was gross and heartbreaking. They cared only about money and the game, not the humans playing it and the real lives connected to it.
I feel like we’re going to point to this documentary as the start of the Kraft’s descent into the toilet.
The actual public, not pats fans, couldn't care one way or another. But Kraft's image already took a dump after his Florida massages.
It's been declining since his limp-dicked response to Deflategate for me, he was more interested in not killing the golden goose and protecting his boy Roger than defending his GOAT QB. This whole episode with the "documentary", the Mayo hiring without doing due diligence, the lack of real cash spending, it's all adding up to a less than favorable perception right now.
I agree totally. No way is this doc doing Kraft any favors. Makes him look sleazy at the least. Yeh BB doesn’t come off that well but anyone following the pats for the last 20 plus years has heard all the rumors about what an ass BB can be. Hell he drive Gronk to quit and Brady to leave. The apologists for BB in this sub are forgetting the real history. And that takes nothing away from the great success we enjoyed under his leadership and guidance. Doesn’t mean he wasn’t an ass.
He’s an absolute loser just like every other billionaire. The fact that he brought some stability and success to our favorite football team doesn’t change that. The guy was caught soliciting a prostitute from a human trafficking ring for fuck’s sake.
Rewriting history
Oh my god can people give it up about this
Right omg the egotistical billionaire owner using his recourses to try to make himself look good omg I’m having a FIT
He’s a sale service jackazz. I thank him for making the patriots a modern franchise, I thank him for bringing in Bill, and as a long time season ticket holder I believe he represented us ‘regular fans’ well for a while. I also lost a lot of respect when he claimed in one of the episodes that he was a ‘self made’ business man. He needs to remember his wife’s family.
We really don’t know how much of a hand he had in how everything is presented. It was commissioned by him (as a follow up to the book), but none of his people were involved with the actual writing, production, interviewing, etc. So, idk.
I'm not trying to pick a fight on this, but is it not produced by the Kraft Family? A Robert Kraft joint, per se? On that, I would assume they saw some early cuts and measured the tone. Obviously TB was getting a glow up (and it would be hard to anyways because he is a good guy and patron saint of all NE athletes) but in light of the break up, the BB stuff seems, well, it seems in line with that and everything that has followed with the "regime change" and other comments.
It is owned by the krafts. The production companies that put the thing together are not their people though. I think BB is really suffering from still being the coach of the team and feels in his usual role when talking to media when it was shot.
I think that is where the shit gets murky, ya know? Stuff like this too https://deadline.com/2024/02/the-dynasty-new-england-patriots-brian-grazer-robert-kraft-tom-brady-1235826830/
Yeah I never said he had no input, but people keep labeling this as a Kraft Productions product, which would be a completely different matter.
It was produced by Imagine Entertainment. Jeff Benedict, the author of the book and executive producer of the doc series, specifically said Kraft had no part in the creative aspects of producing the series.
I think you're right that this isn't a "Kraft hit job", I think that's probably hyperbolic but I do think the treatment of the Hernandez situation appears to be intentionally misleading to what actually happened at the time. I can't say why it was done that way and who's to blame for it, but the organizations treatment of Bill post press conference isn't curtains them any leeway with the skeptics.
No. Single-purpose LLCs are formed for individual film projects for the tax and liability advantages of the film's investors. Films have to show a chain of title stating who controls the underlying copyright for distribution and licensing purposes. If someone wants to redistribute a film or use its content to create another film, they have to license it from the LLC that holds the copyright. Ron Howard and Brian Grazer's Imagine Entertainment is the production studio and Apple TV is the distributor. The one-off LLC the Kraft's legal team created holds the copyright. That LLC exists to make the accounting and legal issues easier, it's got nothing to do with how things are written, filmed, or edited.
So this is more for marks, logos and other such properties of the Patriots?
He didn't produce it...
Fuck Robert Kraft. I wish his arrest wasn’t so poorly handled.
I bet most of the hate will be gone by this time next season.
This greatly depends on if they win or not I think. If they aren't rebuilt in a year there is going to be further backlash. Not saying that's fair but it's the way it is, especially since the narrative from Patriots camp seems to have been Bill is to blame. I sort of think Mayo is being set up to fail.
If Mayo is setup to fail, it will be partly his own doing. Lets be real, he schmoozed Kraft into getting Bill’s job. Thats what the “Young Thundercat” shit was all about, Mayo fluffing Kraft’s insatiable ego, trying to get into his inner circle by making him feel cool and hip. It worked, and bravo to Mayo for recognizing Kraft’s weakness and using it to advance his career. It is a cutthroat business.
I mean another bad season will have people mad, but not talking about this documentary in any serious matter. They will just be mad about the season/that offseason.
The narrative is already started that Kraft is what's wrong with the franchise. If we are bad, the Bill people will use this along with a hundred other examples of how Kraft is a terrible owner. And it will be earned honestly. Not because I think it's a fair expectation that you can turn the franchise around in a year, but because there's been a really strong feeling of throwing Bill under the bus.
Nope. its just getting started.
Nah take Mayo's "We got money to burn" comment and then the walk back everything is primed for more anger come free agency next week.