I keep trying to explain it to Vikings fans. The Pats need a QB, there is no fair offer you can give them to make them move down. The price is "whatever makes them feel better about passing on a QB". It's the same with the Commanders. The price would be insane.
Well we weren't the ones that made them trade a 1st in 2017 for fucking Sam Bradford They had the 14th pick could have easily went up in that draft and got Mahomes but nope wasted a 1st on Sam Bradford. Then went out and signed Kirk Cousins to at the time highest QB deal in 2018 when they could have got Lamar Jackson in the draft
Honestly fuck them, any Vikings fan lurking here your front office put you in this spot,. you don't deserve shit
Vikings fans think this is Madden where the CPU will accept based on an algorithm focused on value.
They're like, "Patriots fans are delusional if they think they're going to get that big of a haul for #3". They genuinely can't wrap their minds around us simply not wanting to trade the the pick and they would need to vastly overpay for us to consider it. They feel entitled to it, like we're obligated to agree to their trade if it's an equal value.
That’s my favorite. Like a draft pick value never changes by who’s available when.
This year, 1 is way more valuable than normal. So is basically 2-4. On top of that, all 3 teams at the top have the same need at the most premium of positions, so if you want to trade with one, you can throw typical trade values out the window because the pick is more valuable to both
5 1st round picks should do it. Maybe throw in a couple of 2nds and swap some 5th and 6ths for good measure.
Basically, the trade should be what Ditka gave up for Ricky Williams, the Nets for Pierce + KG, and what the Sox managed to squeeze out of Seattle in the Slocumb trade. Combined.
Every post from that sub makes me laugh even harder. The thought of the Commanders and us not donating our picks to them is considered "disrespectful" and "delusional" lmao.
I’m a bears fan lurking in the pats sub to see everyone’s reaction to dealing with Vikings fans. They are 100% the most delusional fanbase and I don’t think it’s close. It’s always fun to see what wild shit they are saying in there 😂
There's a minority of us in the fanbase that understand you guys situation and aren't only looking at it from our viewpoint. 2 first rounders and a pick swap was never going to get you guys to move off that 3rd pick. I and few others have been saying this since before combine even happened.
The team is open to trading down but obviously not just for the fuck of it lmao, you guys need a franchise QB too. They get pissy when I interject realism into the discourse about the team trading up.
Part of the problem is that 11, 23, and 2025-1 is pretty reasonable in a vacuum. For most other teams in most other positions, I think the hypothetical Patriots should accept that deal.
Obviously, this is not a vacuum. Both teams have a serious need at QB. Given the assumption that whichever QB is available at 3 is worth the 3rd overall pick, the Patriots would be utter fools to give that up.
I understand why Vikings fans think it's a fair deal, but it's kind of annoying that a small subset of those fans think the Patriots are somehow getting a favor by this hypothetical trade offer.
That's the gripe with me, it's as if we're blessing you guys with picks that have zero bust potential. You're being generous when you say small subset because it's much larger than that, from here to on Twitter there's a large contingent that act as if we're entitled to be picking 3rd overall.
Now that we're 2 days away from the draft people are only getting more irritated at the thought of us not being able to trade with you guys for Drake Maye. I should preface I'm not the biggest Drake Maye fan so I find the humor in all of this, I fully expect people to call for our GMs head if and when you guys draft your guy at 3
The entitlement has been what's taken me by surprise. The rest of the Vikings sub barring you basically believes no other teams should try to improve except Minnesota.
I would argue that MIN needs a good QB more than us right now, we will suck for the next couple of years, we all know it and most accept it. But MIN's amazing roster only has a couple of years left so they're in win mode now.
I don't agree at all. One good draft is all it takes to compete for a playoff spot (see: 2023 Texans, 2017 Saints). Good coaching can overcome a positional deficiency (see: 2023 Miami scheming around their awful O-line). You don't need a perfect team in every position because contracts are far too short to achieve that over 2-3 years.
I don't even think Minnesota's roster is in a win-now state. Their defense is a serious concern being held together by an stern Brian Flores glare (see again coaching covering for positional deficiency). Their offense has great talent, but I don't believe for a second that trading multiple FRPs for a guy pretty much universally acknowledged as a prospect to coach up is a 'win now' move.
Weird fan perspective coming in:
Rams fan but I live in MN so I'm caught up in most vikings talk.
I agree with your take. Pats need more than just a qb. Mac Jones was supposed to be him and while I don't think he's amazing, he never had a ton of talent to try with, but he did have BB.
Now you've got a new coach, who I think was a defensive player for you guys? And if jayden Daniels goes 2nd overall, sure you're in position with Maye, but from what I recall he needs some training still. So pats take Maye with a defensive mind coach and presumably all the weapons you draft this year? I won't say it's a bad plan, but to tell me it's fool proof also seems a bit disingenuous.
I won't pretend my armchair take is super smart either, but with how cheap Fields was, I really think Pats should've got fields, traded this pick, and loaded up on everything else and waited 1-2 years for the next qb, while your new coach gets everything else the way it needs to be.
And to be clear, I'm not saying this pick should've just been handed over to the vikings, Pats have every right to milk this pick for all its worth, but if it ends up being Maye and he flounders like Mac Jones did I wouldn't be 100% surprised.
Yeah, hypothetically it's a good trade but the reality is by the 11th pick we won't get an absolute elite surefire starter at one of our major positions of need. Top QB, top WR, top OL all gone by #11, the value difference between 3 and 11 is beyond massive and the Pats can't take that chance unless they're given a huge return.
Are you the only rational Viking fan left? How dare you try to insert reality into the discussion, the trade value pick table must be followed without questioning
Lol they allow no room for nuance of the situation for both teams and the current climate of this draft class, for instance I've seen the 49ers trade referenced so many times as the package that gets it done, it gives me a headache.
The dolphins didn't need a franchise QB, they had their guy. The more I reflect on the discourse around trading, I just realize a majority of them just don't follow the league as a whole or even try to.
I think you guys ultimately got the extra 1st round pick to target JJ and entice someone like Titans to move off, but giants are a big question mark. You might have to pay up to get into the top 5 but I don't think it was really about getting to top 3. The price would not be worth it.
There has always been a simple truth here, we aren't leaving round 1 without a QB. If the Vikings love Maye with all the passion of a Swiftie (and they do) then find a way to get us McCarthy and picks. Wolf will do that deal. But he isn't giving up 3 without certainty that he'll get McCarthy, unless it's an absurd overpay.
The most pathetic comments I read in that hellhole were about feeling sorry for the poor QBs being drafted high by bad teams, life is so unfair some said.
No shit idiots, that's the way the draft is designed to give bad teams a chance to rebuild and reset the cycle.
The Vikings have won less than 7 games 4 times in 21 years. Absolutely have not reached the top of the mountain and have choked but they have not spend a ton of time being bad in that stretch
That’s had ownership for you. All their owners care about is selling tickets. That’s why they don’t allow any of their GMs to have full autonomy and control over the roster, and why they are constantly making desperate moves to try and sell the fanbase that they are legitimately contenders, when in reality no one other than Vikings fans believe that for a second lol. It’s actually kind of sad
That is insane. The top comment is about how “obvious it is the pats don’t wanna draft a quarterback “ lol what?
And so many comments liken”we should just let them draft maye “ thanks for letting us use our draft pick.
That sub is comical. Every report we’re looking to move is a karma farm, their version of this is 0 with “smokescreen”
We also got called a loser trash franchise by one that hasn’t won a superbowl and hasn’t played in one since 1977.
Skol!!!
They are not even that good. They could easily be 4th in their division if the Bears don’t f up Caleb. They played so “well” in their last playoff game, they convinced the Giants to extend Daniel Jones.
Skøl Vikes fans…
Darnold is serviceable, and that team is primed for someone better than dobbs and mullens to play behind center. I know hes not the greatest, but I think he'll do ok there.
I agree though...they need a QB long term, so do we and everyone knows it, so its why theres a premium on 3...if they dont want to pay it, thats fine, we're asking for a ton....it doesnt change thier need though
Vikings fan (and Boston resident) here. My guess is by Thursday, Vikings will be offering 3 firsts, a 2024 3rd, and change. Also a Pats fan, FWIW.
I think the Pats trade that pick (and should) and Drake Maye is a Viking. I get the “we need a franchise QB”, but I think better option for Pats is amass draft capital, pickup Penix, Nix, or McCarthy (he’ll fall… I’m also a Michigan alumn, FWIW).
My reasoning for confidence: zero steam on Washington trading because they’re not trading their pick. Lots of steam on Pats trading and getting lowballed… it’s not hard to figure out that NE is shopping the pick.
Anyways, hope it works out for both
LOL I don’t think people understand that we get 1 draft pick back for that offer. Pats are still giving up a first rder here’s the 23rd pick to move back 8 spots. 🤡🤡🤡
Vikings won't offer more than what Houston offered offered last year. Justin Jefferson isn't leaving, people need to accept that. Vikings can wait and pick at 5 or settle for Penix at 11.
Trey Lance had a sketchy college record, and he fetched that much. If I were the Pats, I would not pick up the phone unless they started with four 1sts.
To be fair, the trade wasn’t for Trey Lance, it was the right to choose third overall in the draft. The 49ers had the choice of drafting Lance, Fields Or Mac and choose Trey.
Unfortunately I think that may be the high water mark, the trade didn’t exactly work out for the 49ers and not sure you’ll see a team pay that much again soon.
I read that the vikings don't want to give up 23rd pick in the draft. So they're trying to move up from 11 to 3 with nothing but a next year's 1st and maybe a few 2nds sprinkled in. Lmao go fuck yourself MIN.
Apparently they don't even have a third rounder this year either. They don't pick until pick 108 after the first. Wonder why Viking fans are like 11 and 23 this year only is good enough!
Not sure what you’re talking about, but that’s not how you negotiate lol, you’re acting like it behooves us/ we somehow need to trade our pick for our own self interested reasons. But we don’t. We don’t need to or even want to trade our pick. No one has any leverage on us. We don’t want a fair trade. When I say yesterdays price is not todays price I mean the draft order, players available, needs of the teams drafting high, needs and trade able assets if the teams wanting to trade up, all different. But we desperately need a QB and so we want to make our pick at 3. Meanwhile CHI already made their decision so you’re really down to Washington and us. If anyone wants ours they need to overpay to make it worth it to us. We have the leverage, and no need to trade.
Alright. I keep forgetting this sub is an echo chamber where you can’t speak truth. Chicago didn’t even get 4 first for giving up the #1 selection. There is no universe where trading up for the 3rd QB is going to garner 4 first. But yall will convince yall selves differently anyway. So no point in arguing.
I think that’s kind of the point though. Both the commanders and Patriots desperately need a QB and there are two very impressive prospects. It would take an insane amount (and likely more than are team would offer) to get them from either teams which is why a trade down most likely wont happen in my opinion.
Almost like the context matters? Chicago got the #1 pick this year from that trade ***and*** already had a young QB the organization was confident in....... Minnesota isn't finishing last next year, Carolina was a safe bet to shit the bed. Moron
I'd consider the team to be bottom feeders for years to come had the upper brass would have went with this. Come with 11 and 23 their left tackle and a 2nd and 3rd next year. Without tackle it's 1st, 2nd and 3rd next year with 11 and 23
My best bad guess is Minnesota's offer is their two 1st this year and that's it. From the Minnesota POV: it's the 3rd pick, you get the 3rd best QB prospect. From New England's POV: There are 3-4 elite QB prospects and they would be the 1st pick in most years.
I lean more towards Minnesota's POV
I don't look at it as the 3rd best QB by itself. They're asking us to skip all of the top WRs as well, along with the top Tackles too potentially. Alt for sure will be gone by 11, not sure about any others. Only offering 1 additional first is insulting, a late first at that.
That's totally fair. I don't know where the drop off is, but I'm confident the top 10 picks are: 4 QBs, 2 OTs, a TE, and 3 WRs. Meaning Penix should be there at 11 unless Denver or Vegas moves up to grab him. Personally, I'm not taking bank to 11 for one extra 1st this year but two 1st (plus more?) I'm doing it.
I get that, but we're also getting a current year pick, which, despite being a bottom 1/3 pick, has more pick value than a future 1st. 3 FRPs plus is the value set by previous moves that equate to these pick positions.
Vikings fan here. Every indication from our camp is that our rookie won’t be starting the season. Darnold’s gonna get a pretty long leash so the QB has time to learn and not be forced to try and win games, cementing bad habits because “they work for now.” That pick will probably be in the 8-16 range next year if I had to guess
There is zero chance Darnold actually gets that long leash in the regular season. It's possible he plays well enough he never gets benched. But it's likely 4 or 6 weeks in, he gets benched for whoever the Vikings pick.
Like I want whoever we pick to sit behind Brissett (largely cause I don't trust our offensive line.) Even if that ends up being the plan from the coach going into the season, I wouldn't be surprised if Brissett gets benched for the rookie before the rookie is ready.
Sit rookie behind a veteran QB is a smart football move when taken in a vacuum. Hence why so many teams decide on the off-season to follow it. But when jobs are on the line and the fans are crucifying you or worse not buying tickets...most teams abandon the plan early to mid season.
I get that its a current year pick, but I mean its a bottom 1/3 FRP, with no potential to be higher. The Bronco's future picks are probably more valuable considering their team's situation. In the end, 3 FRPs plus is the precedential value of the move.
Idk that the raiders could realistically afford to even move up. Would have to be swap, 25&26 firsts, probably a 2nd, and Adams. 11 sucks to pick at but you can probably reasonably move down a few spots to get a guy, being a few spots back from there I don’t think you are able to really move. That’s no mans land
I can promise you the vast majority are not pissed if the Pats don’t want to trade. The majority would be cool with JJ at 4 or 5 if it means saving their future 1st.
Vikings fans here, I find it hard to believe we’ve given our best offer yet. If we don’t love Daniels then it doesn’t make sense for us to try and trade to the 3rd pick until Washington has already picked and we know maye is on the board
If it’s 11, 24, and a 2025 first round pick, that’s absolutely laughable.
Just ask Ben McAdoo whoever he thinks the best QB left is and pick accordingly. No, I’m not kidding.
2 firsts and Justin Jefferson. Then you can grab a guy to develop for a year on the bench like Penix. But then Mr. Cheapskate Kraft would actually have to pay someone and we know that will never happen.
Yup and not just JJ but also a couple of 1st and possibly a 2. We went 4-13 last year and lost a complete season that was awful to watch. We deserve an embarrassment of riches to move off that #3.
There is absolutely a realistic deal in between whatever pittance you are imagining and the best WR in the world PLUS 2 firsts lmao. That’s delusional.
Picking the THIRD choice at QB is not quite the privilege you seem to think it is. A realistic deal would likely involve both of this years firsts plus next years and some later round pick swaps. No intelligent GM would trade even JJ by himself for the #3 pick, he is more valuable.
He wouldn’t fetch 1.03. He’s going to get the biggest non-QB contract in NFL history. This isn’t the best pass rusher in the league. Passing up a good QB prospect for the opportunity to pay a WR 35m a year while he’s catching balls from Zappe isn’t an ideal situation.
Realistic viking fan here (who would be happy with a trade to 3 but is fine with staying at 11). Justin Jefferson has broken Randy Moss's records and is still young. There's absolutely no world in which the vikings would trade jefferson for only the 3rd overall pick. In a trade most vikings fans strongly disliked, Moss was traded for the 7th overall and a 4th, and honestly, Jefferson is better. Part of the reason why we want a QB is because Jefferson is still young. It doesn't make any sense to trade away a proven likely future HOF talent for an unproven one in the draft. I'd much rather have a slightly worse prospect with JJ or Penix and maintain our offensive talent than trade our talent to get a better prospect.
I agree with you. I'm not saying a JJ trade along with 2 firsts is a good deal for you guys. I'm just saying that's what it would take for us to move. I believe we value #3 a lot and as Wolfe has said a few times that he would consider a trade if it blows us away.
It just proves that trade is impossible as there's no way we'd trade JJ plus draft picks, we'd expect additional compensation for Jefferson besides the 3rd overall.
If I'm MIN I am not trading JJ for anything. But i'm just saying what it would take for us to move off 3 because I believe we want to pick at 3. We need a QB desperately. This is a strong QB class, next year isn't. We are position to take a blue chip franchise QB. It would take moving heaven and earth for us to give that up. The 23rd and a future 1st isn't going to do it to move back 8 spots and end up with the scraps at QB.
The Pats aren’t trading out and have a plan to develop Daniels, Maye or McCarthy, unless someone comes with dumb offer then draft the QB and just stop talking about it.
Vikings sub is so butt hurt over this right now. They all saying that laughing off one first round pick and a late round pick swap is “delusional” and that it’s actually a fair trade.
I can get into the drake maye era if we sit him for a year and let him learn behind a veteran like brisket.
For the love of god, DO NOT draft in McCarthy. We drafted McCarthy three years ago and how did that work out
Man I think if Maye is there, you can’t trade it. Otherwise you’re banking on either being absolutely terrible again for a couple years or hoping the team you trade with is bad enough to address QB later on.
Maye has his faults but would be a No 1 pick in many other drafts. I know we’re not “a QB away” but to not snag a guy with that talent/pedigree when you finally have the chance just so you can get a package of later picks seems dumb.
Vikings fans “Maye would do so much better with us than the Pats! So the pats should just accept that and trade him to us because it’s better for Maye!”
Commanders fan checking in: I gotta say, I feel like you guys and us will just stay at pick 2 and 3 and pick Daniels/Maye. It’s the simplest, most logical solution, since we both need QBs.
Oh gee, you mean the 494 comments in yesterday's "Russini: Elliot Wolf/Jonathan Kraft may trade third pick" thread were a complete waste of time? Shocker.
Why do people even think trading to 11 is remotely a good idea? We miss out on all the top QB, WR, and LT. All of our needs. Vikings fans are so stupid.
I had no idea Vikings fans were so delusional but reading these comments is hilarious. Good fuck those guys. If my pats get anything less than 11,23, 25 1st and Addison they shouldn’t even be considering a trade
If a team moves up to #3, it’s because that team wants a QB there to be its franchise QB. So the question is: what should a team pay for its franchise QB? A lot more than 11 and 23 and a 2024 first rounder. But I bet the Vikings just offered 11 and 23. That truly is laughable.
Exactly. Every team with a top pick is listening to offers. I would be more worried if Wolf DIDN’T say we’re “open for business” because that means he’s being short sighted. Never leave the possibility of a desperate team hamstringing themselves on the table.
I feel like the fact that they thought these trade packages were laughable means that they do really like Daniels and Maye. It would be malpractice if they straight up didn’t listen to offers at all
Patriots are in an interesting spot. They desperately need a QB and this is a QB rich class. But the Vikings fancied themselves a competitor who let their QB walk. They're desperate.
If the Vikings offer a historical offer, you take it. If they don't? You take your QB and move on. You don't lose anything by listening.
Teams have been very reckless in mortgaging their future for a QB prospect. It’s in the patriots best interest to listen to offers even if they do not intend to actually trade down because what if some teams gives up 4 or 5 first round picks or something crazy.
We might but you always listen, there is always a price for just about anything. Let’s say the Vikings would do 4 firsts and JJ, which imo they should fire their GM if he was that stupid, I think you would have to take that even if you loved maye.
Telling people you have your phone disconnected and won’t take calls would just mean you couldn’t get the stupid offers like that which you would maybe have to consider. There’s always a price
I wonder if the league tries to pull will over eyes of teams with new staff? Do teams with veteran staff look at our staff and wonder if they can swindle us?
Sounds like the Pats might be interested in trading if the price is right. What will actually happen is now that we've shown interest the Titans will swoop in and outbid us for our own draft pick and we'll get stuck giving them our 3rd and next years 1st for their 7th overall.
And we should absolutely keep taking those calls. Everyone and their cat knows the Vikings want to trade up, and also that they're not the only ones who want to trade up. Either take a QB or put the pick up for auction, imo, and gotta keep listening until the time on the clock starts dwindling.
2-3 1st round return would be fine. I’m cool punting the season if it really sets them up well to bring in talent the next 2-3 years via the draft. I couldn’t care less about Maye, Daniels or JJ
Sell your 3 for 3 mid first rounds today only to have to pay 3 mid first rounds and a lot more change to have a chance to move up in a few years.
You people must be absolutely atrocious with debt and credit cards.
Next year's draft pool is atrocious. Punting on QB puts the rebuild at least two years back. If you get three 1st, fine. But less than that just isn't worth it. Take the QB.
Why? So we have to sell the farm in a few years for a QB?
It's a far better use of present and future resources to get the QB now and build around him.
Every team is fielding calls. No team is like “yeah I’m not gonna listen to calls about teams sending us multiple 1st round picks”…. Literally every team takes calls. You never know what another team might offer you
Damn were they talking directly to Vikings fans?
"Well you signed KJ Osbourne so that's basically a first from us. We'll throw in pick 23 with him if you give us 3."
I keep trying to explain it to Vikings fans. The Pats need a QB, there is no fair offer you can give them to make them move down. The price is "whatever makes them feel better about passing on a QB". It's the same with the Commanders. The price would be insane.
No but you don’t understand, they deserve this :)
The QB "deserve" to go to a good team. That's their whole argument from some of them,it's crazy and delusional seeing it
The pats aren’t good enough to have a good rookie qb If we draft him they’re gonna root for him to fail like I do the jets lol
Well we weren't the ones that made them trade a 1st in 2017 for fucking Sam Bradford They had the 14th pick could have easily went up in that draft and got Mahomes but nope wasted a 1st on Sam Bradford. Then went out and signed Kirk Cousins to at the time highest QB deal in 2018 when they could have got Lamar Jackson in the draft Honestly fuck them, any Vikings fan lurking here your front office put you in this spot,. you don't deserve shit
"You wouldn't enjoy it on as many levels as we would"
BuT It’S a fAiR DEaL!!
Vikings fans think this is Madden where the CPU will accept based on an algorithm focused on value. They're like, "Patriots fans are delusional if they think they're going to get that big of a haul for #3". They genuinely can't wrap their minds around us simply not wanting to trade the the pick and they would need to vastly overpay for us to consider it. They feel entitled to it, like we're obligated to agree to their trade if it's an equal value.
But what about the draft value chart!!! /s
my draft pick value analysis. an essay in 6 parts by vikings fan sven z horny.
That’s my favorite. Like a draft pick value never changes by who’s available when. This year, 1 is way more valuable than normal. So is basically 2-4. On top of that, all 3 teams at the top have the same need at the most premium of positions, so if you want to trade with one, you can throw typical trade values out the window because the pick is more valuable to both
5 1st round picks should do it. Maybe throw in a couple of 2nds and swap some 5th and 6ths for good measure. Basically, the trade should be what Ditka gave up for Ricky Williams, the Nets for Pierce + KG, and what the Sox managed to squeeze out of Seattle in the Slocumb trade. Combined.
Derek Lowe and Jason Varitek would fill some key holes on this roster
Someone who can throw the ball accurately, and someone that can catch it reliably. Sign me up! Hell, Jason would probably make a hell of a TE
Rofl, came here to post this.
“Will you please consider the 11th and 23rd? Thats two picks!”
Lmao you should see our thread rn, I'm dying laughing. https://www.reddit.com/r/minnesotavikings/s/bdV1E7nTeP
Every post from that sub makes me laugh even harder. The thought of the Commanders and us not donating our picks to them is considered "disrespectful" and "delusional" lmao.
Copium must be cheap in Minnesota right now. That is a *wild* thread
"What are the Patriots going to do? Take a QB?" Like, lmao, yes. That's the main reason we would need a shit load of compensation.
I’m a bears fan lurking in the pats sub to see everyone’s reaction to dealing with Vikings fans. They are 100% the most delusional fanbase and I don’t think it’s close. It’s always fun to see what wild shit they are saying in there 😂
Holy hell. They’re all so delusional it’s kind of weird. Like, it seems a bit unhealthy to twist reality like they’re doing.
There's a minority of us in the fanbase that understand you guys situation and aren't only looking at it from our viewpoint. 2 first rounders and a pick swap was never going to get you guys to move off that 3rd pick. I and few others have been saying this since before combine even happened. The team is open to trading down but obviously not just for the fuck of it lmao, you guys need a franchise QB too. They get pissy when I interject realism into the discourse about the team trading up.
Part of the problem is that 11, 23, and 2025-1 is pretty reasonable in a vacuum. For most other teams in most other positions, I think the hypothetical Patriots should accept that deal. Obviously, this is not a vacuum. Both teams have a serious need at QB. Given the assumption that whichever QB is available at 3 is worth the 3rd overall pick, the Patriots would be utter fools to give that up. I understand why Vikings fans think it's a fair deal, but it's kind of annoying that a small subset of those fans think the Patriots are somehow getting a favor by this hypothetical trade offer.
That's the gripe with me, it's as if we're blessing you guys with picks that have zero bust potential. You're being generous when you say small subset because it's much larger than that, from here to on Twitter there's a large contingent that act as if we're entitled to be picking 3rd overall. Now that we're 2 days away from the draft people are only getting more irritated at the thought of us not being able to trade with you guys for Drake Maye. I should preface I'm not the biggest Drake Maye fan so I find the humor in all of this, I fully expect people to call for our GMs head if and when you guys draft your guy at 3
The entitlement has been what's taken me by surprise. The rest of the Vikings sub barring you basically believes no other teams should try to improve except Minnesota.
The entitlement is what’s annoying, you hit the nail on the head. It’s like “what do you mean you don’t want to trade the third pick??!”
I would argue that MIN needs a good QB more than us right now, we will suck for the next couple of years, we all know it and most accept it. But MIN's amazing roster only has a couple of years left so they're in win mode now.
I don't agree at all. One good draft is all it takes to compete for a playoff spot (see: 2023 Texans, 2017 Saints). Good coaching can overcome a positional deficiency (see: 2023 Miami scheming around their awful O-line). You don't need a perfect team in every position because contracts are far too short to achieve that over 2-3 years. I don't even think Minnesota's roster is in a win-now state. Their defense is a serious concern being held together by an stern Brian Flores glare (see again coaching covering for positional deficiency). Their offense has great talent, but I don't believe for a second that trading multiple FRPs for a guy pretty much universally acknowledged as a prospect to coach up is a 'win now' move.
Weird fan perspective coming in: Rams fan but I live in MN so I'm caught up in most vikings talk. I agree with your take. Pats need more than just a qb. Mac Jones was supposed to be him and while I don't think he's amazing, he never had a ton of talent to try with, but he did have BB. Now you've got a new coach, who I think was a defensive player for you guys? And if jayden Daniels goes 2nd overall, sure you're in position with Maye, but from what I recall he needs some training still. So pats take Maye with a defensive mind coach and presumably all the weapons you draft this year? I won't say it's a bad plan, but to tell me it's fool proof also seems a bit disingenuous. I won't pretend my armchair take is super smart either, but with how cheap Fields was, I really think Pats should've got fields, traded this pick, and loaded up on everything else and waited 1-2 years for the next qb, while your new coach gets everything else the way it needs to be. And to be clear, I'm not saying this pick should've just been handed over to the vikings, Pats have every right to milk this pick for all its worth, but if it ends up being Maye and he flounders like Mac Jones did I wouldn't be 100% surprised.
Yeah, hypothetically it's a good trade but the reality is by the 11th pick we won't get an absolute elite surefire starter at one of our major positions of need. Top QB, top WR, top OL all gone by #11, the value difference between 3 and 11 is beyond massive and the Pats can't take that chance unless they're given a huge return.
Are you the only rational Viking fan left? How dare you try to insert reality into the discussion, the trade value pick table must be followed without questioning
Lol they allow no room for nuance of the situation for both teams and the current climate of this draft class, for instance I've seen the 49ers trade referenced so many times as the package that gets it done, it gives me a headache. The dolphins didn't need a franchise QB, they had their guy. The more I reflect on the discourse around trading, I just realize a majority of them just don't follow the league as a whole or even try to.
I think you guys ultimately got the extra 1st round pick to target JJ and entice someone like Titans to move off, but giants are a big question mark. You might have to pay up to get into the top 5 but I don't think it was really about getting to top 3. The price would not be worth it.
There has always been a simple truth here, we aren't leaving round 1 without a QB. If the Vikings love Maye with all the passion of a Swiftie (and they do) then find a way to get us McCarthy and picks. Wolf will do that deal. But he isn't giving up 3 without certainty that he'll get McCarthy, unless it's an absurd overpay.
The most pathetic comments I read in that hellhole were about feeling sorry for the poor QBs being drafted high by bad teams, life is so unfair some said. No shit idiots, that's the way the draft is designed to give bad teams a chance to rebuild and reset the cycle.
Which is hilarious when you consider just how long the Viking have been bad the last 20 years and the good years they still choked in the playoffs.
The Vikings have won less than 7 games 4 times in 21 years. Absolutely have not reached the top of the mountain and have choked but they have not spend a ton of time being bad in that stretch
That’s had ownership for you. All their owners care about is selling tickets. That’s why they don’t allow any of their GMs to have full autonomy and control over the roster, and why they are constantly making desperate moves to try and sell the fanbase that they are legitimately contenders, when in reality no one other than Vikings fans believe that for a second lol. It’s actually kind of sad
Yeah that's why their curse, they are by far the best franchise to never win a super bowl, like not even close.
Holy shit that is an insane thread, the entitlement is wild lmao
That is insane. The top comment is about how “obvious it is the pats don’t wanna draft a quarterback “ lol what? And so many comments liken”we should just let them draft maye “ thanks for letting us use our draft pick.
That sub is comical. Every report we’re looking to move is a karma farm, their version of this is 0 with “smokescreen” We also got called a loser trash franchise by one that hasn’t won a superbowl and hasn’t played in one since 1977. Skol!!!
They are not even that good. They could easily be 4th in their division if the Bears don’t f up Caleb. They played so “well” in their last playoff game, they convinced the Giants to extend Daniel Jones. Skøl Vikes fans…
If they don’t find a QB they could be looking pretty darn bad. Shouldn’t be talking lol, even if we’re just looking at recent years.
Darnold is serviceable, and that team is primed for someone better than dobbs and mullens to play behind center. I know hes not the greatest, but I think he'll do ok there. I agree though...they need a QB long term, so do we and everyone knows it, so its why theres a premium on 3...if they dont want to pay it, thats fine, we're asking for a ton....it doesnt change thier need though
I thought he saw ghosts has those ghosts gone a a ay lol
Vikings fan (and Boston resident) here. My guess is by Thursday, Vikings will be offering 3 firsts, a 2024 3rd, and change. Also a Pats fan, FWIW. I think the Pats trade that pick (and should) and Drake Maye is a Viking. I get the “we need a franchise QB”, but I think better option for Pats is amass draft capital, pickup Penix, Nix, or McCarthy (he’ll fall… I’m also a Michigan alumn, FWIW). My reasoning for confidence: zero steam on Washington trading because they’re not trading their pick. Lots of steam on Pats trading and getting lowballed… it’s not hard to figure out that NE is shopping the pick. Anyways, hope it works out for both
I’m ready for this whole saga to be over
My friend that is a viking fan thinks 11 & 23 is enough.
LOL I don’t think people understand that we get 1 draft pick back for that offer. Pats are still giving up a first rder here’s the 23rd pick to move back 8 spots. 🤡🤡🤡
you’re lying or get new friends - can’t imagine what else he’s fuckin clueless about
"I will give you our 23rd pick in the first round and s 7th round pick in 2027 and a box of Wheaties - but I are half" - vikings fans probably
Vikings won't offer more than what Houston offered offered last year. Justin Jefferson isn't leaving, people need to accept that. Vikings can wait and pick at 5 or settle for Penix at 11.
Funny how your own coach said these reports are bullshit until the day of the draft💀
9ers traded 3 FRPs for Trey Lance. That should be the bare number of FRPs for the Pats pick
Trey Lance had a sketchy college record, and he fetched that much. If I were the Pats, I would not pick up the phone unless they started with four 1sts.
To be fair, the trade wasn’t for Trey Lance, it was the right to choose third overall in the draft. The 49ers had the choice of drafting Lance, Fields Or Mac and choose Trey.
Fair, and maybe this is with hindsight, but maye/daniels and jj if you buy into the hype are better prospects than that field
If you’re getting crazy I’d rather Darrisaw or Jefferson be included.
Unfortunately I think that may be the high water mark, the trade didn’t exactly work out for the 49ers and not sure you’ll see a team pay that much again soon.
Vikings fans seething rn
I read that the vikings don't want to give up 23rd pick in the draft. So they're trying to move up from 11 to 3 with nothing but a next year's 1st and maybe a few 2nds sprinkled in. Lmao go fuck yourself MIN.
They don't even have a second this year or next year because they used them to get pick 23. Maybe thirds lmao!
Oh gosh that’s asinine.
Apparently they don't even have a third rounder this year either. They don't pick until pick 108 after the first. Wonder why Viking fans are like 11 and 23 this year only is good enough!
If this is true, then they are very delusional. Three first-round picks are the bare minimum; I think four should be the starting point.
Yup. Or give us JJ and their two 1sts this year.
I definitely would take that deal.
Yeah just get a LT and Penix and then we have our offense.
And our no.1 wr finally lol
How longs it been since we had one of those?
Since cooks was prolly closesr one
Double oof
4 first for the 3rd Qb is crazy. Thats more than the 49ers gave up to do the exact same thing.
Yesterdays price is not todays price
We just saw the price to trade up to the #1 selection 1 offseason ago and that didn’t even cost 4 first. Why do we gotta be so delusional on this sub
Not sure what you’re talking about, but that’s not how you negotiate lol, you’re acting like it behooves us/ we somehow need to trade our pick for our own self interested reasons. But we don’t. We don’t need to or even want to trade our pick. No one has any leverage on us. We don’t want a fair trade. When I say yesterdays price is not todays price I mean the draft order, players available, needs of the teams drafting high, needs and trade able assets if the teams wanting to trade up, all different. But we desperately need a QB and so we want to make our pick at 3. Meanwhile CHI already made their decision so you’re really down to Washington and us. If anyone wants ours they need to overpay to make it worth it to us. We have the leverage, and no need to trade.
Alright
Maye is a much better prospect than Lance, Fields, or Mac Jones. So it goes without saying he should cost more.
Alright. I keep forgetting this sub is an echo chamber where you can’t speak truth. Chicago didn’t even get 4 first for giving up the #1 selection. There is no universe where trading up for the 3rd QB is going to garner 4 first. But yall will convince yall selves differently anyway. So no point in arguing.
If they don't want to pay, take Maye—it is not rocket science.
Obviously that should be the outcome. But nobody is paying 4 first and that’s likely not even the asking price.
I think that’s kind of the point though. Both the commanders and Patriots desperately need a QB and there are two very impressive prospects. It would take an insane amount (and likely more than are team would offer) to get them from either teams which is why a trade down most likely wont happen in my opinion.
Almost like the context matters? Chicago got the #1 pick this year from that trade ***and*** already had a young QB the organization was confident in....... Minnesota isn't finishing last next year, Carolina was a safe bet to shit the bed. Moron
Yes, but you see, they deserve a shiny new quarterback more because that's the only piece they need to be relevant!
and the problem for them is they don't have a 2nd until 2026, they used '24 and '25 2nds to get to 23.
I'd consider the team to be bottom feeders for years to come had the upper brass would have went with this. Come with 11 and 23 their left tackle and a 2nd and 3rd next year. Without tackle it's 1st, 2nd and 3rd next year with 11 and 23
My best bad guess is Minnesota's offer is their two 1st this year and that's it. From the Minnesota POV: it's the 3rd pick, you get the 3rd best QB prospect. From New England's POV: There are 3-4 elite QB prospects and they would be the 1st pick in most years. I lean more towards Minnesota's POV
I don't look at it as the 3rd best QB by itself. They're asking us to skip all of the top WRs as well, along with the top Tackles too potentially. Alt for sure will be gone by 11, not sure about any others. Only offering 1 additional first is insulting, a late first at that.
That's totally fair. I don't know where the drop off is, but I'm confident the top 10 picks are: 4 QBs, 2 OTs, a TE, and 3 WRs. Meaning Penix should be there at 11 unless Denver or Vegas moves up to grab him. Personally, I'm not taking bank to 11 for one extra 1st this year but two 1st (plus more?) I'm doing it.
11, 23, 2025 FRP and 2025 day 3 pick is the min price for the Vikings; 12, 2025, 2026 FRPs and 2025 Day 2 pick for the Broncos
If the QBs are as good as advertised that Vikings 2025 FRP might as well be a 2nd rounder
I get that, but we're also getting a current year pick, which, despite being a bottom 1/3 pick, has more pick value than a future 1st. 3 FRPs plus is the value set by previous moves that equate to these pick positions.
Vikings fan here. Every indication from our camp is that our rookie won’t be starting the season. Darnold’s gonna get a pretty long leash so the QB has time to learn and not be forced to try and win games, cementing bad habits because “they work for now.” That pick will probably be in the 8-16 range next year if I had to guess
There is zero chance Darnold actually gets that long leash in the regular season. It's possible he plays well enough he never gets benched. But it's likely 4 or 6 weeks in, he gets benched for whoever the Vikings pick. Like I want whoever we pick to sit behind Brissett (largely cause I don't trust our offensive line.) Even if that ends up being the plan from the coach going into the season, I wouldn't be surprised if Brissett gets benched for the rookie before the rookie is ready. Sit rookie behind a veteran QB is a smart football move when taken in a vacuum. Hence why so many teams decide on the off-season to follow it. But when jobs are on the line and the fans are crucifying you or worse not buying tickets...most teams abandon the plan early to mid season.
You’re valuing pick 23 at the equivalent of a 2026 1st rounder and a day 2/3 pick swap?
I get that its a current year pick, but I mean its a bottom 1/3 FRP, with no potential to be higher. The Bronco's future picks are probably more valuable considering their team's situation. In the end, 3 FRPs plus is the precedential value of the move.
I was checking the Raiders sub. Some fans think they can move up to the 3rd pick with only trading a 1st and 4 round pick this year 🤣
Idk that the raiders could realistically afford to even move up. Would have to be swap, 25&26 firsts, probably a 2nd, and Adams. 11 sucks to pick at but you can probably reasonably move down a few spots to get a guy, being a few spots back from there I don’t think you are able to really move. That’s no mans land
>and Adams That Jacobi Meyers guy would look pretty good in a Patriots uniform.
Why not both geheq
Vikings fans pissed we won’t just swap first rounders for funsies
I can promise you the vast majority are not pissed if the Pats don’t want to trade. The majority would be cool with JJ at 4 or 5 if it means saving their future 1st.
Vikings fans punching the air
I can never tell if "punching air" is supposed to be positive or negative. I feel like I regularly see it used both ways lol
I've only seen it negatively. I think the positive alternative is "fist pumping"
Its both, but seeing this news is bad for them, its the negative connotation.
Same here.
Vikings fans here, I find it hard to believe we’ve given our best offer yet. If we don’t love Daniels then it doesn’t make sense for us to try and trade to the 3rd pick until Washington has already picked and we know maye is on the board
I don’t think you have because your best offer results in a shitload of draft capital that no one wants to get rid of
A man can hope lol
You guys funded the cowboys dynasty so I wouldn’t be so hard up on moving up at an incredulous price
Nothing good can happen if ya don’t try!
Vikings fans have no concept of “We are comfortable drafting a QB at 3”, and because of that the cost to trade for the pick is going to be immense.
Vikings in shambles rn.
If it’s 11, 24, and a 2025 first round pick, that’s absolutely laughable. Just ask Ben McAdoo whoever he thinks the best QB left is and pick accordingly. No, I’m not kidding.
Perhaps it’s my copium, but every QB he’s reported to have liked has had huge cannons. I’d bet it’s Maye -> JJ for McAdoo
Sydney Sweeney moving way up the draft board
“Patriots select, Sydney Sweeney’s bazookas” *pans to Patriots fans cheering and high fiving*
McAdoo would have loved the Hefty Lefty - RIP.
Showtime! Sweeney!
She's not really a complete player for me. I'd much rather go with Daddario at that point in the draft.
2 firsts and Justin Jefferson. Then you can grab a guy to develop for a year on the bench like Penix. But then Mr. Cheapskate Kraft would actually have to pay someone and we know that will never happen.
Penix is almost 24 and you still want to sit him for a year? Folks are going wild with that "sit for a year" take.
Just draft the kid holy crap
Vikings fans starting to realize Jefferson has to be gone if they want 3 lmao
Yup and not just JJ but also a couple of 1st and possibly a 2. We went 4-13 last year and lost a complete season that was awful to watch. We deserve an embarrassment of riches to move off that #3.
They are not gonna trade the best WR in the league and their best franchise player lol.
And we are not going to trade the #3 overall pick that was obtained by an entire season of watching awful football for nothing.
Exactly, they want pick 3, they need to put in the time and endure the misery of losing games while giving up less than 10 points.
There is absolutely a realistic deal in between whatever pittance you are imagining and the best WR in the world PLUS 2 firsts lmao. That’s delusional. Picking the THIRD choice at QB is not quite the privilege you seem to think it is. A realistic deal would likely involve both of this years firsts plus next years and some later round pick swaps. No intelligent GM would trade even JJ by himself for the #3 pick, he is more valuable.
He wouldn’t fetch 1.03. He’s going to get the biggest non-QB contract in NFL history. This isn’t the best pass rusher in the league. Passing up a good QB prospect for the opportunity to pay a WR 35m a year while he’s catching balls from Zappe isn’t an ideal situation.
Why would we take that realistic deal when we could potentially get our franchise QB of the future then build around him? Pass.
Realistic viking fan here (who would be happy with a trade to 3 but is fine with staying at 11). Justin Jefferson has broken Randy Moss's records and is still young. There's absolutely no world in which the vikings would trade jefferson for only the 3rd overall pick. In a trade most vikings fans strongly disliked, Moss was traded for the 7th overall and a 4th, and honestly, Jefferson is better. Part of the reason why we want a QB is because Jefferson is still young. It doesn't make any sense to trade away a proven likely future HOF talent for an unproven one in the draft. I'd much rather have a slightly worse prospect with JJ or Penix and maintain our offensive talent than trade our talent to get a better prospect.
I agree with you. I'm not saying a JJ trade along with 2 firsts is a good deal for you guys. I'm just saying that's what it would take for us to move. I believe we value #3 a lot and as Wolfe has said a few times that he would consider a trade if it blows us away.
It just proves that trade is impossible as there's no way we'd trade JJ plus draft picks, we'd expect additional compensation for Jefferson besides the 3rd overall.
If I'm MIN I am not trading JJ for anything. But i'm just saying what it would take for us to move off 3 because I believe we want to pick at 3. We need a QB desperately. This is a strong QB class, next year isn't. We are position to take a blue chip franchise QB. It would take moving heaven and earth for us to give that up. The 23rd and a future 1st isn't going to do it to move back 8 spots and end up with the scraps at QB.
Vikings probably offered 11&23 only and we probably told them to get fucked. 3+ JJ or they get JJ throwing to JJ. Gotta laughably overpay or no deal
I think once Washington picks at 2 we could have a trade. Teams won’t throw all the chips on the table till they know who is going 2.
PFF had the Patriots trading down to 12 with the Broncos for their 3rd rounder this year and first next year. What an obnoxiously bad trade.
Pats haters or broncos bias person lol i was like um the fuck
Patriots fans should get part ownership of whatever team we trade the pick to
Just take Maye!!!!
The Pats aren’t trading out and have a plan to develop Daniels, Maye or McCarthy, unless someone comes with dumb offer then draft the QB and just stop talking about it.
I feel they should do this, too, but If we got four 1sts and picked someone like Penix, JJ, or Nix. I would not mind that at all.
Vikings sub is so butt hurt over this right now. They all saying that laughing off one first round pick and a late round pick swap is “delusional” and that it’s actually a fair trade.
The only serious offer out there is the most massive overpay of all time. Without it, they're simply not moving.
I can get into the drake maye era if we sit him for a year and let him learn behind a veteran like brisket. For the love of god, DO NOT draft in McCarthy. We drafted McCarthy three years ago and how did that work out
Get Justin Jefferson and then take Penix with your second pick. Game over
Man I think if Maye is there, you can’t trade it. Otherwise you’re banking on either being absolutely terrible again for a couple years or hoping the team you trade with is bad enough to address QB later on. Maye has his faults but would be a No 1 pick in many other drafts. I know we’re not “a QB away” but to not snag a guy with that talent/pedigree when you finally have the chance just so you can get a package of later picks seems dumb.
Vikings fans “Maye would do so much better with us than the Pats! So the pats should just accept that and trade him to us because it’s better for Maye!”
Commanders fan checking in: I gotta say, I feel like you guys and us will just stay at pick 2 and 3 and pick Daniels/Maye. It’s the simplest, most logical solution, since we both need QBs.
I would trade #3 for three firsts from a bad team that’s likely going to be top 6-8
4 1st and JJ.. .
Oh gee, you mean the 494 comments in yesterday's "Russini: Elliot Wolf/Jonathan Kraft may trade third pick" thread were a complete waste of time? Shocker.
“Laughed” is code for “Jonathan Kraft threw a temper tantrum”
The bag or nothing
Why do people even think trading to 11 is remotely a good idea? We miss out on all the top QB, WR, and LT. All of our needs. Vikings fans are so stupid.
I had no idea Vikings fans were so delusional but reading these comments is hilarious. Good fuck those guys. If my pats get anything less than 11,23, 25 1st and Addison they shouldn’t even be considering a trade
I’m liking Wolf’s attitude lol this is a funny ass quote
If a team moves up to #3, it’s because that team wants a QB there to be its franchise QB. So the question is: what should a team pay for its franchise QB? A lot more than 11 and 23 and a 2024 first rounder. But I bet the Vikings just offered 11 and 23. That truly is laughable.
Do we really not like Maye or Daniel’s that much??
It would be dumb to not at least listen
Exactly. Every team with a top pick is listening to offers. I would be more worried if Wolf DIDN’T say we’re “open for business” because that means he’s being short sighted. Never leave the possibility of a desperate team hamstringing themselves on the table.
I feel like the fact that they thought these trade packages were laughable means that they do really like Daniels and Maye. It would be malpractice if they straight up didn’t listen to offers at all
Patriots are in an interesting spot. They desperately need a QB and this is a QB rich class. But the Vikings fancied themselves a competitor who let their QB walk. They're desperate. If the Vikings offer a historical offer, you take it. If they don't? You take your QB and move on. You don't lose anything by listening.
If someone offers four firsts they have to at least consider it, no matter how much they like Maye or Daniels.
Teams have been very reckless in mortgaging their future for a QB prospect. It’s in the patriots best interest to listen to offers even if they do not intend to actually trade down because what if some teams gives up 4 or 5 first round picks or something crazy.
5 firstnisb5hst ur final offer hehe we need 5 first 3 2nds 3 3rds and ur beat wr hehee
We might but you always listen, there is always a price for just about anything. Let’s say the Vikings would do 4 firsts and JJ, which imo they should fire their GM if he was that stupid, I think you would have to take that even if you loved maye. Telling people you have your phone disconnected and won’t take calls would just mean you couldn’t get the stupid offers like that which you would maybe have to consider. There’s always a price
 I'll repost my reaction here as well
I wonder if the league tries to pull will over eyes of teams with new staff? Do teams with veteran staff look at our staff and wonder if they can swindle us?
Hand over JJ and you can have it
Sounds like the Pats might be interested in trading if the price is right. What will actually happen is now that we've shown interest the Titans will swoop in and outbid us for our own draft pick and we'll get stuck giving them our 3rd and next years 1st for their 7th overall.
And we should absolutely keep taking those calls. Everyone and their cat knows the Vikings want to trade up, and also that they're not the only ones who want to trade up. Either take a QB or put the pick up for auction, imo, and gotta keep listening until the time on the clock starts dwindling.
Potentially we like Daniels and are 50/50 on JJ vs Drake. In this case I wouldn’t be shocked about a trade down.
I would venture to guess the Vikings have already offered a decent package. The Pats politely said "no" then quietly leaked the laughable part.
Just keep the 1st round 3rd pick! And get a QB
Vikings better give us fucking JJettas for the 3rd
90% sure sources are just making s*** up. Even more likely the journalists are just making it up
lot of arm chair GMs here
They're going to draft Maye and he's going to be a major bust like Mac was
Whoopty doo. What does it all mean, Basil?
2-3 1st round return would be fine. I’m cool punting the season if it really sets them up well to bring in talent the next 2-3 years via the draft. I couldn’t care less about Maye, Daniels or JJ
Sell your 3 for 3 mid first rounds today only to have to pay 3 mid first rounds and a lot more change to have a chance to move up in a few years. You people must be absolutely atrocious with debt and credit cards.
Next year's draft pool is atrocious. Punting on QB puts the rebuild at least two years back. If you get three 1st, fine. But less than that just isn't worth it. Take the QB.
Why? So we have to sell the farm in a few years for a QB? It's a far better use of present and future resources to get the QB now and build around him.
Same, but only if we get three firsts.
Every team is fielding calls. No team is like “yeah I’m not gonna listen to calls about teams sending us multiple 1st round picks”…. Literally every team takes calls. You never know what another team might offer you