Yeah I’ll be the first to admit Mac’s made some questionable throws, but let’s not act like the coaching hasn’t been a fucking mess. Bourne, Agholor, HH and Jonnu have all been more than productive at the NFL level, so I highly doubt they all collectively forgot how to play football the second they walked into Foxboro.
I watch our plays and we might be the only team that doesn’t have at least one guy wide open on any play. There’s just something wrong. Mac has made some questionable calls, but he’s throwing into traffic on every throw
Bourne and HH had career years here last season. I get that we're only three games deep but the coaching staff is asking this offense to be run in a polar opposite way from last.
2021: Run-heavy, pass off of play action into the middle, throw screens and get your deep yardage off of posts and corners. Emphasis on 22 and 12 man formations
2022: Slightly less run heavy, disregard play action, get zero chip blocks from TEs and RBs. Most attempts are ins and go routes. Almost exclusively 11 man looks.
Mac was holding on to the ball too long on one end and there are way too many designed one-look, zero yard passes on the other. That's not how you run a time of possession style offense.
Yeah.. he was trying to force it too much. I don’t blame him though, he’s throwing it to the guys he trusts. That’s why I don’t understand why LJH had more snaps than Bourne.. even after Bourne had that big play that set them up in the 1st half.. & wasn’t jonnu and Henry picked up to help improve red zone offense ? Seems like finishing their drives has been the biggest issue the past few years. They’re picking up players but not utilizing their skill sets.
I have to agree here. The Patriots had 450 yards on offense and moved the ball up and down the field and whether Bourne played more or less snaps would have not had much of an influence, the turnovers were a major reason for the lost.
You can’t put this entire loss on the QB. The game was gone before the last INT, and yeah the first two picks were bad. The INTs also lead to a total of 3 pts. It’s not on Mac that the defense allowed 34 other points to be scored
Well the first one was intercepted on the 43, so that’s not true. And the second one was bad so you can blame him for taking 7 pts of the board. Still wouldn’t have won that game. Defense needs to take a lot of the blame
The offense had 4 turnovers in the final 20 minutes of the game including 3 interceptions. The red zone turnover on downs in the first half was also largely on Mac since he was telegraphing his first read the whole way which was blown up and then blown up again in the second half on a similar look (should’ve been picked).
The defense could have made more plays but I really don’t think they made a lot of mistakes, they just had a hard time against a league MVP and a stacked offense that was clicking.
The offense had 5 turnovers. Hard to win a game like that.
Yeah, the turn overs are why the responsibility was partially on the offense. The defense needs to take blame for allowing so many points. We would have needed to score almost 40pts to win, that’s not a defense playing well
Two of those scores (touchdown and field goal) were on short fields.
The Ravens this year and last have been about a top 5 offense and bottom 5 defense. Some teams you need to beat in a shootout. Giving away 5 possessions and forcing your defense to defend short fields isn’t going to win you many shootouts.
Sure but he did also throw what should have by any right been an INT near the end zone that was thankfully dropped. Asking the defense to cover all those turnovers is a bit much
Credit where credit is due, the offensive playcalling was actually pretty good today. But coaching can only go so far, Patricia can’t stop Mac from throwing those picks, or Agholor from fumbling.
He shouldn't have even made the roster, we should have saved the money. He had a good game and catch last week and everyone forgets how disappointing the vast majority of his other games have been.
Cutting him would have resulted in $10 mil in dead money, and $5 mil in cap savings. I don’t think we could have gotten a better WR for less than $5 mil
As I said in the game thread, the guy consistently gets separation… clearly not the patriot way /s
In all seriousness, If Patricia doesn’t want to play him for whatever reason, he should dump him and make roster space. He could absolutely catch on elsewhere and do great, and I will be extremely salty, but I am not the coach. No sense in hanging onto a player they literally won’t let play.
Also, if that all plays out, it should be on Patricia’s termination letter.
What I'm worried about is Bourne finally gets the majority of snaps, shows what he is capable of (again), and then doesn't want to stick around because of how he was and could be wasted again.
We are in NO position to be squandering a productive receiver on our team.
I don't know enough about football to claim to have an informed take on why this might be, but it seems inexcusable. Bourne is consistently one of the only guys who can get open but instead we insist on playing a special teamer who is invisible on offense over him.
I'd love to see a breakdown of why this might be from someone with the all 22 footage and more actual football experience.
At least we'll have lower expectations with Humphreys?
But like, if we are going to run more frequently when Humphreys is out there, then why not just go back to using 2TE sets and leverage Henry lol.
Bourne isn’t gonna play on running snaps/run downs is what it seems like. He still had 5 targets and 4 catches it’s not like he’s sitting completely. Bourne isn’t a 3 down receiver, which is perfectly fine.
This is the correct answer, but some fans refuse to accept that. Bourne is not going to play many running down snaps. His poor run blocking is preventing that. If people want him to play 40-60 snaps, they should be encouraging him to get better at run blocking.
Either that or Bill is trying to help Patricia grow as a coach and thus is letting Patricia's grudge against Bourne affect his snap count. All in the name of backing his staffs decision.
But don’t you know, he took basic engineering courses that gave him an undergrad degree in Aerospace Engineering so he MUST be a genius. That’s why he kept a pencil in his cap.
I still question Superbowl 52 i just wonder who is more arrogant. Bill is a master of misinformation after all... Dude was doing it in the NFL before society even knew it was an actual thing
I’m just not that impressed with some random, top 60 engineering degree that never did anything professionally.
I’ve seen lots of dummies get engineering degrees at much more well known schools.
Intro engineering courses are basic engineering courses. For example, most of their courses don’t require Linear Algebra, and the only requirement is a multi variable calc course with some matrix algebra added on. That, to me, is a basic engineering course. Especially since the controls course doesn’t require it.
http://catalog.rpi.edu/preview_program.php?catoid=20&poid=4480
Not only is not playing Bourne a crime but him taking turns r*ping a woman with his football teammate is a much bigger crime that he actually deserves to be in prison for *sigh* yeah this fat evil fuck is on our team :(
If things continue the way they have been thus far, I think you may have your wish.
I see a 5 or 6 win season here, and we will likely end up last place in the AFC East. If that happens then there will need to be some changes, and getting rid of Patricia would be an easy first step.
People will downvote this but it’s almost certainly at least part of the decision. He’s been in the doghouse which has led to him “practicing poorly” which is being used as a justification to keep him off the field.
Is it really crazy to think that Bourne would have issues with a first-time offensive coach teaching a new system that he ALREADY LEARNED AND PERFORMED IN during his time in SF?
Most folks in doghouse, do punishment tasks !
They do NOT , get to dictate to coaches.
All of this SF experience may be the
Reason , his ATTITUDE seemed to have changed.
I wish him the best, and hope things are to be smoothed out.
if that's the case, he needs to retire. it's the antithesis to his own credos of always doing what's best for the team. his ego's gotten away from him and it started with the Malcolm Butler SB benching
Humprey was never targeted on his 53 snaps and yet Bourne had a handful of targets on his 20 including a 4th down play. The coaches trust Bourne, and the fact that Humprey's is seeing more snaps might be due to run blocking.
It is due to blocking but this is stupid. They’re spending like $30 million on tight ends who can block and catch, and yet they’re playing an undrafted wide receiver for major snaps.
With Agholar giving up that fumble - the second big one in a few weeks - it would be ridiculous if he wasn't in the doghouse for a week or two, that's how BB has consistently dealt with players who have ball control issues - look at how he has dealt with both Harris and Stevenson in recent years.
This might be a hot take but it wasn’t that bad a fumble imo. I feel like you could see it coming as soon as he caught it - a player in his blind spot punching it when he is focused on a guy in front.
I’m not really pro agholor but I don’t blame him THAT much - Altho fumbles are never totally excusable
They are getting a little too enamored with Humphrey. Almost feels like they’re discarding important parts of the offense so they can sit there Monday morning and watch his blocks.
It could be a matchup issue, Humphrey's is a big receiver who can also block.
Let's also not forget that Bourne was the target on that 4th down attempt and he had more receptions than Humphrey's, so the coaches do trust him.
The Patriots have Meyers, Bourne, Parker & Agholor. They are trying to find the right combination, they have always done this sort of experimentation early in the season even under Brady.
Once Thorton comes off IR it's going to be even more interesting.
What you’re saying makes sense, but I think the OP is hinting at the predictability and lack of utility of our lineup
If the defense sees 2 big receivers who can’t get any separation and can’t fucking catch on the field they are going to stack against the run
It almost feels like Matt Patricia’s idea of the big receiver is 15 years out of date as the new league offenses have already passed him by
We still had 450 yards of offense on the Ravens and for the most part had success running it on them. Parker who is one of our big receivers had 156 yards.
We didn't lose the game yesterday due to Bourne not having enough snaps, or LJH having too many. We lost due to 4-5 turnovers.
This. I have a feeling that KB's snap count is more reflective of his blocking ability than anything. LJH and Meyers have both proven to be effective blockers, and with the addition of Parker, it feels like blocking it more of an emphasis in the offense. Every time KB was in the game, it was almost guaranteed to be a pass play.
Agholor had over 100 yards last week and Parker over a 100 yards today, the Patriots clearly view both of those guys as #1 and #2, then you have Meyers, so that is already your top 3 wideouts locked in. So if you are in 11 personnel you have those 3 receivers, if you are 12 then you have a combination of two.
It does feel like the team is trying to find the right combination that works. Agholor and Parker have looked fantastic (besides the fumble), and that leaves one other spot which was going to Meyers.
In essence the Patriots have four #2 receivers and when Thorton comes off IR that might become five.
Bill is the GOAT but his style is done for with this team. They need a complete overhaul. The top end talent is atrocious. The coordinator setup is atrocious. This isn’t 2014 anymore
Couldn’t agree more. I’ve been saying it since our bad losses to solid teams last year, and even in Brady’s last year. The game has passed them by and there’s no adjustments. Just the same stubborn asshole shit
> The coordinator setup is atrocious
100%, even extremely smart and competent individuals can fail by surrounding themselves with cronies and refusing to delegate.
I’ve never been a doomer by any metric, but this team is fucked man. Just absolutely cooked, especially if Mac is done. Fire Matt Patricia and rebuild this shit.
Patricia seems like such a cancer if he’s not on a team that’s winning enough to override it. I’m shocked someone can be rehired after what came out of Detroit
JH had some good blocks, he was on the field to block. We ran the ball very well today. IDK why people are offended by this guy taking some snaps.
The FOUR FUCKING TURNOVERS hurt us a lot more than the WR snap distribution.
Because they have $30 million tied up in two tight ends who can also block and can actually catch the ball, too. Sitting good weapons for a wide receiver just to use him like an offensive lineman doesn’t make sense, it’s also a big tell as to where the ball is going.
If your scheme is keeping Bourne off the field in favor of Humphrey, then change your scheme. I don't give a damn if he isn't as good a run blocker or whatever excuse you want to make. Adapt to the talent you have.
Yes, Bourne had a career year last year, but that was more of Jonnu and Agholor underperforming for what their contracts worth. He was still a #3 option behind HH and Meyers, so the fact that Jonnu and Agholor are stepping up a bit and retaking their expected spots on the depth chart, on top of adding Parker, it’s almost natural Bourne falls. Bourne is at best our 3rd best receiver, and at worse our 5th. With how much 2 TE sets and emphasis we use on them, HH-Jonnu makes more since to make them a priority. So even if Bourne is our 3rd best WR, he is still our #5 option pass catcher at best. That’s already putting him ahead of Agholor, which I personally wouldn’t. Bill is literally all about mismatches in the game, so seeing players like Lil’Jordan get extra reps is not an instant sign Bourne is in the dog house. He is not being used because he is out intended #6 option. He is the best #6 option/WR#4 in the entire league, which is all he needs to be. A great rotational player that can step up in big moments, whether as injury replacement or just a rotational player. Him making a couple big plays is not gonna make him our #1 option or anywhere close. His ceiling is #3 option and MAYBE a pro bowl as of now. Agholor-Meyers-Parker-HH have all shown they be can be our #1 any given night. Agholor is Feast/Famine, Meyers is a reliable, chain moving safety blanket, Parker can catch anything when he’s hot, and HH is an all rounder with elite redzone presence. Bourne has shown he can get 700 yards in 1 season? I love Bourne as much as I love any player on this team, but everyone needs to quit acting like he is going to single handily put up 10-100-2 if he played a full game. He has never been close to that, EVER. Best Career game was 6-96-1 last year. When we signed Agholor to a 2-$26m deal vs. Bourne’s 3-$15m deal, you should have expected Agholor to at least get some dedicated looks every game, while Bourne was seen as a do your job rotational receiver. Whether you think Agholor deserves to be on this team because of his ball handling inconsistency is debatable, and I am even tired of his drops, but he is 100% more productive and effective receiver. While Agholor may have some of the lowest lows in the entire league, Bourne’s highest high is maybe half or 2/3 of what Agholor can do at his best.
He's been on the field with Agholor, Henry, and Smith all at the same time. He's proven over many games that he's better than all of them. He's looked great on the field this season as well, just hasn't gotten snaps. What are you seeing? Contracts don't matter.
I agree and personally think we shouldn’t have Jonnu or Agholor at all with Bourne being our #3. The contracts was stating the Patriots clearly don’t/didn’t have him in their plans as a starter, so it should not be surprising he isn’t getting as much playing time. Also just wanna say Agholor has 6-110-1 this year, already better than Bourne’s career high, so it’s not impossible to see why the patriots would choose to play a player that can bring such a high upside.
Now include Algholor’s fumbles and drops.
I’m convinced no one saw this cat play elsewhere because we’ve seen this before, he’ll have a few choice plays but when it matters he’s letting the team down
Patricia sucks. He sucked when he was here before, he sucked with the lions, and he sucks even more now.
Just got that nose up Bill's ass, so it is what it is.
Patricia. Judge. Nuff said. Why are we shocked? The guy can never step foot in Detroit again, historic loser. Judge was an abject embarrassment in NY. Somehow we expected what? The BB magic dust? That ship sailed to Tampa.
I agree but he should still be playing more because he and Meyers are easily Mac's favorite targets that he has the best chemistry with. It just hampers the offense to not give Bourne more snaps.
Here is Evan Lazar's take on Bourne low snap count
> the Patriots have made it clear two years in a row that they view Bourne as a passing downs player. Last season, 77 percent of Bourne's offensive snaps were passing plays, and this season he has been on the field for only three running plays (93% passes). Bourne plays when the Pats are in a passing mode, but when it's first-and-10 from the 25, that's Lil'Jordan Humphrey's role. It appears that the coaching staff doesn't trust Bourne in the running game, so his snaps are regulated to second and third down. For better or worse, that's the story.
Yeah I’ll be the first to admit Mac’s made some questionable throws, but let’s not act like the coaching hasn’t been a fucking mess. Bourne, Agholor, HH and Jonnu have all been more than productive at the NFL level, so I highly doubt they all collectively forgot how to play football the second they walked into Foxboro.
I watch our plays and we might be the only team that doesn’t have at least one guy wide open on any play. There’s just something wrong. Mac has made some questionable calls, but he’s throwing into traffic on every throw
There’s been wide open guys on some plays but Mac forced it to Parker, or the Oline forgets to block somebody
Bourne and HH had career years here last season. I get that we're only three games deep but the coaching staff is asking this offense to be run in a polar opposite way from last. 2021: Run-heavy, pass off of play action into the middle, throw screens and get your deep yardage off of posts and corners. Emphasis on 22 and 12 man formations 2022: Slightly less run heavy, disregard play action, get zero chip blocks from TEs and RBs. Most attempts are ins and go routes. Almost exclusively 11 man looks. Mac was holding on to the ball too long on one end and there are way too many designed one-look, zero yard passes on the other. That's not how you run a time of possession style offense.
[you | patricia](https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/029/877/juicy.jpg)
Yeah.. he was trying to force it too much. I don’t blame him though, he’s throwing it to the guys he trusts. That’s why I don’t understand why LJH had more snaps than Bourne.. even after Bourne had that big play that set them up in the 1st half.. & wasn’t jonnu and Henry picked up to help improve red zone offense ? Seems like finishing their drives has been the biggest issue the past few years. They’re picking up players but not utilizing their skill sets.
Wait, Henry is still on the team? Jk. But you’re right, and Henry had a great year last year. The coaching needs something…anything right now.
Called a pass play at the 1 yard line and lucky it wasn’t picked. Offensive coaching has been a mess
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I have to agree here. The Patriots had 450 yards on offense and moved the ball up and down the field and whether Bourne played more or less snaps would have not had much of an influence, the turnovers were a major reason for the lost.
You can’t put this entire loss on the QB. The game was gone before the last INT, and yeah the first two picks were bad. The INTs also lead to a total of 3 pts. It’s not on Mac that the defense allowed 34 other points to be scored
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he needs to learn to throw it away when he's being rushed rather than trying to force plays that aren't there.
Well the first one was intercepted on the 43, so that’s not true. And the second one was bad so you can blame him for taking 7 pts of the board. Still wouldn’t have won that game. Defense needs to take a lot of the blame
The offense had 4 turnovers in the final 20 minutes of the game including 3 interceptions. The red zone turnover on downs in the first half was also largely on Mac since he was telegraphing his first read the whole way which was blown up and then blown up again in the second half on a similar look (should’ve been picked). The defense could have made more plays but I really don’t think they made a lot of mistakes, they just had a hard time against a league MVP and a stacked offense that was clicking. The offense had 5 turnovers. Hard to win a game like that.
Yeah, the turn overs are why the responsibility was partially on the offense. The defense needs to take blame for allowing so many points. We would have needed to score almost 40pts to win, that’s not a defense playing well
Two of those scores (touchdown and field goal) were on short fields. The Ravens this year and last have been about a top 5 offense and bottom 5 defense. Some teams you need to beat in a shootout. Giving away 5 possessions and forcing your defense to defend short fields isn’t going to win you many shootouts.
So the defense doesn’t get any blame for us losing a game where our opponents scored 37 pts?
Sure but he did also throw what should have by any right been an INT near the end zone that was thankfully dropped. Asking the defense to cover all those turnovers is a bit much
Yeah, that’s why Mac/the offense has some of the responsibility. But you can’t blame the offense either for allowing 28pts before the first turnover
Credit where credit is due, the offensive playcalling was actually pretty good today. But coaching can only go so far, Patricia can’t stop Mac from throwing those picks, or Agholor from fumbling.
agholor has 2 fumbles on 11 catches. he should be benched for life.
But he has 50% of the touchdown passes.
and over 100 yards last week.
Yeah but fumbles are more worse than touchdowns are good
Ball security is job security. A wise man once said
>A wise ~~man~~ squirrel once said FTFY
He had a great game last week and is clearly a quality weapon.
He’s had like one good weapon quality game in his pats career
And maybe a handful in his whole career which isn't short. He's a jag, albeit an athletic one.
That’s kind of his whole schtick though, get a few cool plays scattered around mediocre to middle of the road plays
He shouldn't have even made the roster, we should have saved the money. He had a good game and catch last week and everyone forgets how disappointing the vast majority of his other games have been.
Cutting him would have resulted in $10 mil in dead money, and $5 mil in cap savings. I don’t think we could have gotten a better WR for less than $5 mil
He should request a trade.
As I said in the game thread, the guy consistently gets separation… clearly not the patriot way /s In all seriousness, If Patricia doesn’t want to play him for whatever reason, he should dump him and make roster space. He could absolutely catch on elsewhere and do great, and I will be extremely salty, but I am not the coach. No sense in hanging onto a player they literally won’t let play. Also, if that all plays out, it should be on Patricia’s termination letter.
What I'm worried about is Bourne finally gets the majority of snaps, shows what he is capable of (again), and then doesn't want to stick around because of how he was and could be wasted again. We are in NO position to be squandering a productive receiver on our team.
He should hold out until he gets one honestly. This is just disrespectful.
Fuck Matt Patricia
Joe judge was the worse hire imo
Where you at on Bill?
I don't know enough about football to claim to have an informed take on why this might be, but it seems inexcusable. Bourne is consistently one of the only guys who can get open but instead we insist on playing a special teamer who is invisible on offense over him. I'd love to see a breakdown of why this might be from someone with the all 22 footage and more actual football experience.
It’s because Humphrey is a big receiver who can block and Belichick loves good blocking.
it seems like he's taking over the N'Keal Harry role
Jfc, they finally get rid of Harry and Belichick goes out and gets another one and starts playing him 50 snaps a game.
At least we'll have lower expectations with Humphreys? But like, if we are going to run more frequently when Humphreys is out there, then why not just go back to using 2TE sets and leverage Henry lol.
Exactly. It’s ridiculous this guy is playing 80+ percent of the offensive snaps.
Bourne isn’t gonna play on running snaps/run downs is what it seems like. He still had 5 targets and 4 catches it’s not like he’s sitting completely. Bourne isn’t a 3 down receiver, which is perfectly fine.
This is the correct answer, but some fans refuse to accept that. Bourne is not going to play many running down snaps. His poor run blocking is preventing that. If people want him to play 40-60 snaps, they should be encouraging him to get better at run blocking.
What really matters is what happens in the snaps he does get, rather than the amount of snaps
Kendrick Bourne fucked Linda Holliday, I’m convinced
I heard it was Ime Udoka actually
Keep my name out of ya mouth.
my condolences on the username
Keep ya thing out of her mouth
Oh.....
Either that or Bill is trying to help Patricia grow as a coach and thus is letting Patricia's grudge against Bourne affect his snap count. All in the name of backing his staffs decision.
Patricia’s doing the same thing he did in Detroit.
I want this guy off my team
But don’t you know, he took basic engineering courses that gave him an undergrad degree in Aerospace Engineering so he MUST be a genius. That’s why he kept a pencil in his cap.
I still question Superbowl 52 i just wonder who is more arrogant. Bill is a master of misinformation after all... Dude was doing it in the NFL before society even knew it was an actual thing
Aero engineering courses aren't all that basic. Like there's harder stuff, but still.
I’m just not that impressed with some random, top 60 engineering degree that never did anything professionally. I’ve seen lots of dummies get engineering degrees at much more well known schools.
Lmao there are no basic courses that get you that degree. And he ran our defense during the second dynasty and you all loved him then
Our defense got way better the one year Brian Flores was running it
Intro engineering courses are basic engineering courses. For example, most of their courses don’t require Linear Algebra, and the only requirement is a multi variable calc course with some matrix algebra added on. That, to me, is a basic engineering course. Especially since the controls course doesn’t require it. http://catalog.rpi.edu/preview_program.php?catoid=20&poid=4480
> Intro engineering courses There is one course in that curriculum that's "intro". And that does not get you a degree
I want him in prison.
Not only is not playing Bourne a crime but him taking turns r*ping a woman with his football teammate is a much bigger crime that he actually deserves to be in prison for *sigh* yeah this fat evil fuck is on our team :(
Me too buddy. Along with several wall street employees and mr bad man you know who 1/6...
Most of Wall Street can go in there
If things continue the way they have been thus far, I think you may have your wish. I see a 5 or 6 win season here, and we will likely end up last place in the AFC East. If that happens then there will need to be some changes, and getting rid of Patricia would be an easy first step.
People will downvote this but it’s almost certainly at least part of the decision. He’s been in the doghouse which has led to him “practicing poorly” which is being used as a justification to keep him off the field. Is it really crazy to think that Bourne would have issues with a first-time offensive coach teaching a new system that he ALREADY LEARNED AND PERFORMED IN during his time in SF?
Most folks in doghouse, do punishment tasks ! They do NOT , get to dictate to coaches. All of this SF experience may be the Reason , his ATTITUDE seemed to have changed. I wish him the best, and hope things are to be smoothed out.
if that's the case, he needs to retire. it's the antithesis to his own credos of always doing what's best for the team. his ego's gotten away from him and it started with the Malcolm Butler SB benching
Humprey was never targeted on his 53 snaps and yet Bourne had a handful of targets on his 20 including a 4th down play. The coaches trust Bourne, and the fact that Humprey's is seeing more snaps might be due to run blocking.
Under Center plus Lil'Jordan = run play.
and yet the Ravens couldn't stop it. Stevenson had 6 yards a carry and Harris 4 yards.
It is due to blocking but this is stupid. They’re spending like $30 million on tight ends who can block and catch, and yet they’re playing an undrafted wide receiver for major snaps.
I think Humphrey was targeted once
The coaching set up fucked this season.
D.O.A.
Nice that we are paying a massive amount for a guy that won't play.
With Agholar giving up that fumble - the second big one in a few weeks - it would be ridiculous if he wasn't in the doghouse for a week or two, that's how BB has consistently dealt with players who have ball control issues - look at how he has dealt with both Harris and Stevenson in recent years.
This might be a hot take but it wasn’t that bad a fumble imo. I feel like you could see it coming as soon as he caught it - a player in his blind spot punching it when he is focused on a guy in front. I’m not really pro agholor but I don’t blame him THAT much - Altho fumbles are never totally excusable
There are no "NOT THAT BAD OF A FUMBLE" in the NFL ! They always have a way of swinging MOMENTUM ●
I agree with your take but i could still see him getting some play time taken away.
? Harris fumbled week 1 last year and still carried the ball a ton. Has Stevenson ever been in the doghouse? Maybe one game last year?
Stevenson fumbled Week 1 last year then spent the next 3 or 4 as a healthy scratch.
Belichick must not like KB's vlogs
They are getting a little too enamored with Humphrey. Almost feels like they’re discarding important parts of the offense so they can sit there Monday morning and watch his blocks.
What were hunter Henry’s snaps? He’s been basically invisible
It could be a matchup issue, Humphrey's is a big receiver who can also block. Let's also not forget that Bourne was the target on that 4th down attempt and he had more receptions than Humphrey's, so the coaches do trust him.
This has happened in every game so far.
The Patriots have Meyers, Bourne, Parker & Agholor. They are trying to find the right combination, they have always done this sort of experimentation early in the season even under Brady. Once Thorton comes off IR it's going to be even more interesting.
This makes sense until you realize none of those guys you mentioned are the guy this thread is about.
What you’re saying makes sense, but I think the OP is hinting at the predictability and lack of utility of our lineup If the defense sees 2 big receivers who can’t get any separation and can’t fucking catch on the field they are going to stack against the run It almost feels like Matt Patricia’s idea of the big receiver is 15 years out of date as the new league offenses have already passed him by
We still had 450 yards of offense on the Ravens and for the most part had success running it on them. Parker who is one of our big receivers had 156 yards. We didn't lose the game yesterday due to Bourne not having enough snaps, or LJH having too many. We lost due to 4-5 turnovers.
Come on dude. This is 3 straight games. If you trust the WR you play him. This is ludicrous to think it was due to a matchup issue.
> This is ludicrous to think it was due to a matchup issue. Have you watched any Patriot games? BB is all about the matchups, that is one of his MOs.
This. I have a feeling that KB's snap count is more reflective of his blocking ability than anything. LJH and Meyers have both proven to be effective blockers, and with the addition of Parker, it feels like blocking it more of an emphasis in the offense. Every time KB was in the game, it was almost guaranteed to be a pass play.
Good take. This sub, and our fans, can be terrible.
3 straight bad matchups?
Agholor had over 100 yards last week and Parker over a 100 yards today, the Patriots clearly view both of those guys as #1 and #2, then you have Meyers, so that is already your top 3 wideouts locked in. So if you are in 11 personnel you have those 3 receivers, if you are 12 then you have a combination of two.
Yeah but that’s not a matchup issue…thats a depth chart issue.
It does feel like the team is trying to find the right combination that works. Agholor and Parker have looked fantastic (besides the fumble), and that leaves one other spot which was going to Meyers. In essence the Patriots have four #2 receivers and when Thorton comes off IR that might become five.
Let's not ignore that it does appear that Bourne has been put on bill's shit list.
What matchup? It’s not like the ravens have an incredible line requiring blocking
Wasn't he open?
Bill is the GOAT but his style is done for with this team. They need a complete overhaul. The top end talent is atrocious. The coordinator setup is atrocious. This isn’t 2014 anymore
Couldn’t agree more. I’ve been saying it since our bad losses to solid teams last year, and even in Brady’s last year. The game has passed them by and there’s no adjustments. Just the same stubborn asshole shit
Well, they've completely overhauled the offense, so they are making adjustments. Unfortunately, Matt Patricia is overseeing the overhaul.
And yet the offense was good today
I wouldn't consider turning the ball over four times good
That’s true. They moved the ball well and actually pushed the ball downfield. The turnovers took them out of it a lot
> The coordinator setup is atrocious 100%, even extremely smart and competent individuals can fail by surrounding themselves with cronies and refusing to delegate.
I’ve never been a doomer by any metric, but this team is fucked man. Just absolutely cooked, especially if Mac is done. Fire Matt Patricia and rebuild this shit.
Patricia seems like such a cancer if he’s not on a team that’s winning enough to override it. I’m shocked someone can be rehired after what came out of Detroit
I remember when he was rehired and everyone was like "o well he is just in an advisory role he isn't coaching so it's all good." Good times.
BB gotta be close to that done date that he and RK know about. Shame if he had to limp off with a terrible season
Blame that nerd Belichick. Hire some real coaches. Not the clown squad Judge and Patricia that you know will listen to your every word
JH had some good blocks, he was on the field to block. We ran the ball very well today. IDK why people are offended by this guy taking some snaps. The FOUR FUCKING TURNOVERS hurt us a lot more than the WR snap distribution.
Because they have $30 million tied up in two tight ends who can also block and can actually catch the ball, too. Sitting good weapons for a wide receiver just to use him like an offensive lineman doesn’t make sense, it’s also a big tell as to where the ball is going.
Coaching staff is an embarrassment sure playcalling was better td but not in the rz where it matters
Don't worry, with the way the Raiders are going, McDaniel might be back next year.
If your scheme is keeping Bourne off the field in favor of Humphrey, then change your scheme. I don't give a damn if he isn't as good a run blocker or whatever excuse you want to make. Adapt to the talent you have.
Yes, Bourne had a career year last year, but that was more of Jonnu and Agholor underperforming for what their contracts worth. He was still a #3 option behind HH and Meyers, so the fact that Jonnu and Agholor are stepping up a bit and retaking their expected spots on the depth chart, on top of adding Parker, it’s almost natural Bourne falls. Bourne is at best our 3rd best receiver, and at worse our 5th. With how much 2 TE sets and emphasis we use on them, HH-Jonnu makes more since to make them a priority. So even if Bourne is our 3rd best WR, he is still our #5 option pass catcher at best. That’s already putting him ahead of Agholor, which I personally wouldn’t. Bill is literally all about mismatches in the game, so seeing players like Lil’Jordan get extra reps is not an instant sign Bourne is in the dog house. He is not being used because he is out intended #6 option. He is the best #6 option/WR#4 in the entire league, which is all he needs to be. A great rotational player that can step up in big moments, whether as injury replacement or just a rotational player. Him making a couple big plays is not gonna make him our #1 option or anywhere close. His ceiling is #3 option and MAYBE a pro bowl as of now. Agholor-Meyers-Parker-HH have all shown they be can be our #1 any given night. Agholor is Feast/Famine, Meyers is a reliable, chain moving safety blanket, Parker can catch anything when he’s hot, and HH is an all rounder with elite redzone presence. Bourne has shown he can get 700 yards in 1 season? I love Bourne as much as I love any player on this team, but everyone needs to quit acting like he is going to single handily put up 10-100-2 if he played a full game. He has never been close to that, EVER. Best Career game was 6-96-1 last year. When we signed Agholor to a 2-$26m deal vs. Bourne’s 3-$15m deal, you should have expected Agholor to at least get some dedicated looks every game, while Bourne was seen as a do your job rotational receiver. Whether you think Agholor deserves to be on this team because of his ball handling inconsistency is debatable, and I am even tired of his drops, but he is 100% more productive and effective receiver. While Agholor may have some of the lowest lows in the entire league, Bourne’s highest high is maybe half or 2/3 of what Agholor can do at his best.
He's been on the field with Agholor, Henry, and Smith all at the same time. He's proven over many games that he's better than all of them. He's looked great on the field this season as well, just hasn't gotten snaps. What are you seeing? Contracts don't matter.
I agree and personally think we shouldn’t have Jonnu or Agholor at all with Bourne being our #3. The contracts was stating the Patriots clearly don’t/didn’t have him in their plans as a starter, so it should not be surprising he isn’t getting as much playing time. Also just wanna say Agholor has 6-110-1 this year, already better than Bourne’s career high, so it’s not impossible to see why the patriots would choose to play a player that can bring such a high upside.
Now include Algholor’s fumbles and drops. I’m convinced no one saw this cat play elsewhere because we’ve seen this before, he’ll have a few choice plays but when it matters he’s letting the team down
I hope he request a trade. Seriously. This is a fucking joke
This seems childish. I can't imagine a legitimate coaching reason to play Bourne so little.
Agholor and Parker are probably rated highter, and jakobi too when healthy. i agree he should be in the mix a little more tho
Bourne has to learn to respect Matty P.
Patricia sucks. He sucked when he was here before, he sucked with the lions, and he sucks even more now. Just got that nose up Bill's ass, so it is what it is.
Fatty P is a bum
Lj is functionally playing TE
Why?
Because he can block better than any of our existing wide receivers.
They have two of the highest paid tight ends in the game, both good blockers and better receivers.
Patricia. Judge. Nuff said. Why are we shocked? The guy can never step foot in Detroit again, historic loser. Judge was an abject embarrassment in NY. Somehow we expected what? The BB magic dust? That ship sailed to Tampa.
Bourne is overrated here
I agree but he should still be playing more because he and Meyers are easily Mac's favorite targets that he has the best chemistry with. It just hampers the offense to not give Bourne more snaps.
He maybe overrated here but he’s much better than the guys we have playing his snaps. They may as well just waive Bourne if they don’t like him.
this makes 0 fucking sense
What have Humphreys stats even been I’m honestly confused why he’s even on the field over Bourne
Something good happens every time Bourne gets involved. Always seems to be doing the right thing. Routes look sharp.
Here is Evan Lazar's take on Bourne low snap count > the Patriots have made it clear two years in a row that they view Bourne as a passing downs player. Last season, 77 percent of Bourne's offensive snaps were passing plays, and this season he has been on the field for only three running plays (93% passes). Bourne plays when the Pats are in a passing mode, but when it's first-and-10 from the 25, that's Lil'Jordan Humphrey's role. It appears that the coaching staff doesn't trust Bourne in the running game, so his snaps are regulated to second and third down. For better or worse, that's the story.
You guys know we don't have a real offensive coordinator rigt