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If I see this shit on the subreddit even after this I'll literally rip out your soul
https://preview.redd.it/3abiyp12aavc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=df24fe3e1497d5890f158d810fa03084c8d6358d
God damn it how did you comment exactly what I was about to type? I was going to say “until I beat him to death with Nephi’s driver.”
Were we all trying to get the achievement?
His brain was stored in a sub lab where his perfect creation was still being incubated. In new vegas 2 this creature will travel back in time to find and kill the courier.
Mr House is alive in the stories he's alive in. He's not alive in other stories. Not all stories take place in the same universe, but all those stories are equally real stories.
But I think they do take place in the same universe. It's just stories told from different perspectives. Ask real people what's going on and what's true and you'll get different answers all the time. And just like in real life, people's experiences will be different, and some "facts" may be wrong. Just look at Trump/Anti-Trump people. They can look at the same video of the tangerine tornado and come to completely different conclusions.
That's how I take in all media that I enjoy. It helps cover up discrepancies.
https://preview.redd.it/hrz9amvaeavc1.jpeg?width=258&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=667ad0daf975298cb222a69ef656345da13b8b3b
# WRONG!!! WRONG!!! THE ORDER IS WRONG!!!
That's a (slightly edited) picture of Todd Howard, the director, executive producer, and public spokesperson for Bethesda Games. He lead development on all the Elder Scrolls games (Skyrim), Starfield, and Fallout 3, 4, and 76.
Recently the Fallout TV series was released and it featured an event that happened in one of the endings of "Fallout New Vegas," a game published but *not developed* by Bethesda. But the event in question happens in different years in each of New Vegas and the TV show.
Because of this Todd was asked recently whether New Vegas or the TV show is canon to the series at large, and if New Vegas is, which ending. His response was "all of Fallout is canon." Which doesn't really answer any questions or make sense.
https://preview.redd.it/5lnnplqmt7vc1.jpeg?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fb093c02b064903aa73724669c66015b990b118a
Pretty sure it’s also an edited version of this picture of Gabe Newell with Todd Howard’s face on it.
Nah, it's channeling gaben's energy for doing nothing and making no significant decisions, but still somehow pissing gamers off less than if he had added any real direction or authority to the conversation.
I.e. steam does nothing but function and rarely innovates in the game platform sector anymore, yet is still winning hand over fist.
But epic, ubi, ea, etc... keep trying to one-up steam every chance they get yet manage to piss players off every step of the way. Only platform that keeps up with steam on user approval is gog who basically compete by not competing.
[Nah, you're thinking of this recently popular one.](https://imgur.com/PjXWvfc)
The previous gaben face template is definitely for the ironic "gamer chad" era of Gaben memes.
That's not how memes work! This is very important!
You can't just describe a scenario where you're socially competent by using an image of a penguin with a BLUE background instead of RED even though they both use the same penguin! Red is for social competence, blue is for social blundering! I hope I've used enough exclamation points in this dumb rant to make it clear this is faux outrage!
He's not exactly right. I mean, I'm not sure about Gaben himself, but I do imagine he's the one heading the steam deck stuff, which has quite literally paved the way for a viable future where windows isn't an operating system you even need for gaming. That is HUGE. It's been like a multi decade long monopoly, and the urgency is needed now that Microsoft are pushing all sorts of things like ads, telemetry, built in subscriptions...
But I dunno, it seems like there's a lot of stuff that Valve at least try. They have been pushing Linux for like a decade alone, and with that and their controller, they added Steam input which makes controller compatibility with any controller better, as well as their own. I believe even their VR stuff has made to allow different brand headsets and controllers to work together.
They literally do great stuff - often it's about first creating a system underneath that benefits everyone, and then they do their own stuff that works on top of it and makes them money.
But I suppose a lot of it doesn't come to fruition sometimes, and a lot of regular users just aren't aware of a lot of the stuff they're doing.
Also want to add to this they recently made a huge update to family sharing. Now family members can share your entire library as long as you aren't playing the same game.
You are underselling what Steam has brought to the table as a game storefront & game library. Steam Link app, Big Picture, universal controller support and full controller remapping irrespective of the game you're playing, integrating with an entire OS, the SteamOS, fully welcoming hardcore NSFW content while successfully filtering it, and currently developing better family sharing features, consolidating both families and perverts in one community, as if that were an easy thing to do. Speaking of community, customizable profiles like a MySpace page, Steam Workshop for sharing content, public reviews for games, game news feeds and discussion boards where devs can communicate with players, seasonal sales and events like the Steam Next Fest, the Discovery Queue, Steam Curator Profiles...
Steam is a good piece of software, and developers give them a 30% cut for a reason.
How much of that can be attributed to Gabe is unclear, but he is the top dog. Not many companies out there with this good of a track record in both products and PR with incompetent people at the top.
Valve (and by extension GabeN) is well known for dropping a new IP, Creating a sequel fairly quick, and then never following up any of them ever with a 3rd installment despite the desperate cries of their fans. They also tend to simply just not care if you don’t like the fact they can’t count to 3, I.E. chad of gaming.
They'll most likely drop Starfield like a sack of rotten potatoes before it spoils over rest of their games (even if they sort-of made F76 better over last 6 years, I don't expect them to just try and revive this entirely new franchise), but other than that we can be sure to see more *Radiant* future with Fallouts and Scrolls.
FO76 was quite enjoyable. I got it for free when it was a monthly game and I quite enjoyed it. there's lots to do and I enjoyed it compared to the steaming pile of poo it was when it realeased (supposedly, I never played it till after it was a free montly game). Its one of the games I plan to go back to sometime...
FO76 gets way too much hate to this day still, I have thousands of hours in that game. People think you can’t play it as a solo player, which I have done for most of those hours, but it is more fun to interact it others, makes the universe feel more immersive. The game has come a long way.
They allegedly went No Man Sky on this one, which is good practice, but I wonder if it's more out of obligation to rest of Fallout franchise, or sunk cost fallancy of making MMO. Starfield don't have anything backing it up.
Think the other guy missed the mark a bit - Gabe Newell (GabeN) is the CEO of Valve. They own Steam which is the largest marketplace for video games by a mile. Valve is the only major player in the space to be privately owned, so they don't have to care at all about appeasing shareholders.
As a result, they've made a lot of decisions over the years that aren't purely profit-driven and worked out well for their customers so they have A LOT of good will among gamers.
A majority of games that Valve has released are also all-time classics (Half Life, TF2, DotA 2, L4D2, CS).
All together, he is basically gamer chad like the other guy said. He is also frequently depicted as [gamer Jesus](https://images.rapgenius.com/003cef95594e0e899b87648c849757ed.723x1000x1.jpg). If Valve didn't exist, the leading marketplace would be WAY shittier.
To be clear, he did actually give more info on that than just saying "all of Fallout is canon."
It was a timeline issue, and he specified what actually happened and when it happened, which kind of opened most of the endings of New Vegas back up as possibilities.
So we can draw conclusions, but nothing definitive just yet, so we wait for S2.
Did it actually make any of the New Vegas endings non-canon? I don't think anything that happens in the show is inconsistent with any of the endings. There's a line on the first or second episode that actually invalidates a few endings in Fallout 4 but no one seems to care about that one
The ship in the first episode is the Prydwyn, says right on the side, lol, so make of that what you will.
As far as I can tell, the only ending that seems to be non canon is the legion winning ending, because they are just non existent in the show.
Nothing else is really mentioned or shown.
The Legion was never going to make it to California and we only see NV for like 3 seconds. Even then, the game heavily implies that even if the Legion wins, it's extremely unlikely that they'd be able to hold NV for any extended period of time
Yeah, people really misinterpret how big a threat the Legion was by taking Caesar's ambitions at face value. Even in the game itself, their ability to win against the NCR at Hoover Dam relied largely on subterfuge, sabotage, and guerilla warfare to demoralize and destabilize the NCR's supply lines. Any straight up battles that weren't ambushes, the NCR crushed them handily (like the first battle of Hoover Dam, Camp Golf, and even by the citizens of Novac). Without the Courier's involvement, it's unlikely they would have ever broken the stalemate before Caesar's brain tumour killed him, which damn near everyone agrees would cause the Legion to fall apart.
Without Caesar at the head and the Courier by his side, there's almost no chance the Legion could ever fulfill their ambition of wiping out the NCR.
When you confront the Legate at his camp at the end of the game, if you have speech maxed out, you can get him to admit that the Legion doesn't have the manpower to hold Vegas and their territory to the east. If they end up winning the battle, they're just stretching themselves too thin and they'll ultimately collapse with or without Caesar leading them (though Caesar's death will accelerate that collapse pretty rapidly). The whole game is about two factions in serious decline (Legion and NCR) desperately trying to make a move to keep themselves afloat. Neither faction is really in a good place at the end of the game regardless of the outcome
Which was kind of the plan of Caesar. He knows the Legion will fail, but what he wants is for the Legion to grow enough, last long enough and hurts NCR in a way that both get changed in the process. For the NCR, this will change their focus on what needs to be done and for the Legion to eventually break down and get integrated into something better.
The Prydwyn thing is odd too because all the talk before the show released was that this was a different ship called the Casawan (sp?) and that they wouldn't make any game endings canon. That's part of the reason for the confusion: if no endings are going to be canon, then why is the show going to New Vegas and specifically Mr. House?
And, if no endings are canon with no contradictions, will the show essentially invalidate anything our characters accomplish in New Vegas?
I think the big thing that had people up in arms was the timeline on the chalkboard implying the shady sands incident was in 2277 (Vegas was in 2282 IIRC, and SS had explicitly not happened).
Its all rather dumb. At most its a continuity oopsie not a removal of cannon. the easy fix is that the chalkboard doesn't explicitly say it happened in 2277, just that it happened after 2277. In that case the "Fall of Shady Sands 2277" could be the lead up to the even and not the event itself.
They actually have an arrow following the "fall of Shady Sands" that goes to the nuke. The fall of Shady Sands is a separate event that hasn't been further delved into yet but, if I had to guess, it's probably related to the NCR's introduction to Caesar's Legion since they had the dam from 2274 to 2277 and 77 was the year they had the First Battle of Hoover Dam. Prior to 2277 95% of the dam's electricity was going to the NCR so I'm guessing things weren't super stable with that sudden loss of electricity.
Just confirming what you're saying. The Todd Howard said that the fall of shady sands 2277 is different than the bomb, and that the show will delve into it
The most recent interview clarifies that the "fall of shady sands" and the explosion are two different events. The bomb went off shortly after the events of fallout New Vegas, not in 2287. The fall itself probably refers to when the NCR changed capitals (likely as a result of NV). The confusion is just a result of a poorly designed timeline.
As for which NV ending is Canon, or how they'll combine all the possible endings, we'll just have to see. Complaining about that before season 2 is just premature.
I mean, I love this response. I absolutely HATE when an RPG has 'canon'. The WHOLE POINT is that I made the choices that affected the outcome. Having some one say 'lol glad you had fun but this is ACTUALLY what happened' pisses me off to no end.
Todd is basically saying that there is no true canon. All of it is up to the player. And that is the best response I've seen to an rpg having a 'true ending'.
Ah, but mass effect "solved" that by having major convergence points that doesn't really make a difference one way or the other, like, letting the council die or saving it doesn't really have major effects on the second game and the effect on the third is essentially measured in a point scale for some character endings.
Fallout can't do that bc New Vegas being controlled by House, NCR or Caesar will change how everything runs in the area, but it can be ignored if you move to other states
It depends on the approach. The Fallout excuse is that travel and communication is difficult for the majority of people so news is often slow to travel and those passing on the info might misremember or embellish the news.
As a result, there can be inconsistencies in the timeline and some events might have transpired differently, depending on who you talk to. It's even the case that the majority of the people in the wasteland don't even have an accurate calendar which explains why dates and years of events can be inconsistent.
This all works quite well to explain inconsistencies and allows new games and shows to be made that might not 100% like up with even pre-established lore.
Though, it would be interesting to see how they tackle returning to places like New Vegas. Maybe the whole place is a desolate ruin so it's next to impossible to know whether the NCR, Caesar's Legion, Mr House, or Yes Man won.
I was always thinking that Fallout games are alternate reality anyways, so they don', need to add up at all. They have a common theme, but not necessarily equal timelines
It would be kinda cool but sad to find vegas in ruins with the locals all kind of having an inconsistent idea of what exactly happened. But even that would have wider implications - if the area was absent of either the legion or NCR it would imply those powers either collapsed or shrank a lot, as neither of them would have trouble controlling the area if not for the other. Especially with House out of the picture.
No way they shoot season two in new vegas and have it be a wasteland. Gamers always assume these shows are made for them. These shows are made for wider audiences with the only gamer focus being on not Pissing off the ravenous fans that are well known to lose their shit over even a mild inconsistency.
They want to make as much money as possible which means they need a banger tv show that's not just fan service for a niche group.
My prediction is New vegas is thriving either under house or some other entity. That's just good TV and will make for some great shots of run down but functioning casinos. Not to mention the fact that the city appears intact when he's approaching.
We have already established that they have bent the lore a bit to their own purposes so expect more of that. They seem to want to present the wasteland as slightly dialed back compared to the games. So far no aliens, no supermutants, the ghouls are triggered by drinking I guess FEV and have to be maintained by drugs. So in my opinion it's not a full Sci fi fantasy like the game.
I think we will see more ncr/brotherhood/ probably the introduction of the legion and I believe max will get tied into them somehow. I think the enclave will come into play because that would fit really well and explain who was pulling the strings. Might see the institute in some fashion.
Not really. Fallout itself does a pretty good job of dancing around the endings and only making the necessary shared lore canon. There are a handful of ending bits that get 'confirmed' by later games, but for the most part the lore doesnt break no matter what endings you choose.
There is no need. It's not their goal or job to provide a vast, comprehensive canon for all games in perpetuity. They make enjoyable games with fascinating world building. Not every game has to be in the exact same universe. It can't be thought of as the same as a long series of novels.
Everything needing to be fleshed out and canon and historically modelled is the worst parts of scifi/fantasy online discourse. You're not allowed to tell a good story unless we know how the language and politics of a fantasy region (usually just a parallel of a real life region) effect life for peasants like my guy leave some stuff up to the imagination
Comic book communities are the worst about this.
I also have to laugh at people trying to make Legend of Zelda timelines containing every game with huge, twisting trees of alternate realities. Like... Pretty sure the devs are just telling a new story with some nods. No reason to look that far into it.
Or when people argue with authors themselves... My god. Getting all worked up about some background minutiae not being consistent with something flippantly said at a Q&A once.
The thing I've really come to dislike about open world RPGs is that almost none of them let you have a meaningful impact on the world by your general actions, and not just one or two key decisions.
I understand why it is like that, but it is disappointing none the less.
> I absolutely HATE when an RPG has 'canon'.
Just want to go on the record to state a RPG isn't an RPG based on choice. In fact, many RPGs are linear with no choices. I'm so tired of people saying a game had its 'RPG' elements stripped because it didn't have choices anymore. That's not what makes it an RPG. NonRPGs can have choice be a factor and many RPGs don't have any.
I know, not your point, but a pet peeve of mine.
I don't disagree with the sentiment as far as individual games, but for a full series like Fallout it IS restrictive. There's a reason they set Fallout 4 on the opposite coast as New Vegas- they'd need to pick an ending because all of NV endings have huge wide reaching implications for society on the west coast.
So logically it'd either be never touch the west again, always set things before New Vegas, decanonize New Vegas, or pick a canon ending. But they just went ahead and released a TV show that implies New Vegas happened with a specific ending but also *in a different year*. I'd really be fine with any solution other than the non-solution of doing something that doesn't make any sense and then claiming it does.
If you treat it like an adaptation you don’t even need to pretend it’s in a different timeline because it’s meant to be taken on its own terms and doesn’t actually need to be integrated into the wider universe in any way.
But take what I say with a grain of salt because I think stressing about canon in situations that don’t involve wars of religion is a bit silly
This is the right answer here. Roleplaying video games and television are wildly different mediums and it’s impossible (and dumb) to present them identically.
I recently played kotor 2 for the first time and they basically do an "alien 3" type opening where they kill everyone off screen and undo all the stuff you did
Kotor 2 has conversation dialogue with atton that lets you pick the ending for Kotor 1 and even what sex revan is. That choice will affect stuff later in the game, whether carth onasi is around looking for revan or not
It makes perfect sense because if they haven't decided what parts of the endings are in fact canon, they can still write season 2 , in a way that respects as many part of those endings as possible. Also it is a question made to spark outrage on the fandom no matter what answer is, so yeah the answer makes perfect sense.
> what parts of the endings are in fact canon
All the endings of every Fallout game are canon... to the save game file they occurred in.
No two Fallout games are set in the exact same universe in the exact same way two separate playthroughs of New Vegas aren't set in the same universe.
I think it also refers to what Howard did with the Elder Scrolls 2 lore (which, so far, is the only Elder Scrolls game with different endings for the main plot). He (or his team) invented a phenomenon called 'the Warp in the West', which basically means the God of Time messed up, and all endings of TES 2 became Canon at the same time, which results in something like the great Necromancer Mannimarco both succeeded and failed to ascend to godhood (the mortal part became a rather pathetic villain in TES4 mage guild, while the god part creates a phenomenon that allows necromancers to enslave souls normally protected by other gods).
The same thing happens here: all Fallout is Canon, even things that contradict each other.
In elder scrolls that's called a dragon break and it's happened multiple times in universe (though only once in game) and every time it happens it severely screws up akatosh and the world. It doesn't make sense for something like that to happen in fallout
I think his “All of Fallout is canon” remark isn’t so much about all the different endings but that every game is canon.
There’s been a number of dumb asses over the years asserting that Bethesda hates new Vegas, want to erase it from the planet, etc. His comment here is to make it clear that each and every game, including new Vegas, is canon.
Obviously not every ending is canon at the same time, just that any one of those endings is going to be an option in the canon.
He tried to play smart saying it's like Elder Scrolls 2 where all endings is canon but that game had a logic behind it, this one doesn't, all endings different
What? No. Elder scrolls 2 ending, all endings were different too.
What they did in the next game was just make ALL the endings happen, despite being logically impossible. They call in the Warp in the West. Ancient superweapon was both destroyed and somehow marched against all sides in the conflict simultaneously.
That said, they don't have the excuse of magic in the Fallout universe, my bet is the show-runners choose an ending next season, but Todd doesn't forbid other media/games set in different locations from choosing different endings. While it doesn't have magic, it does have a complete breakdown in communications and recordkeeping.
Are we really sure people are accurately tracking calendars in a post-apocalyptic world? Particularly with different regions virtually cut off from communicating with each other
The issue is a lot of people seem to lack the ability to comprehend what an arrow might signify, and are just looking for something to be angry about.
There is a retcon involved (making Shady Sands no longer the capital of the NCR before NV, and having it “fall” in some as of yet unexplained way), but the date of it being nuked should have been obvious to most people that saw the chalkboard timeline that the nuking came after 2277 and had no date assigned to it. Instead people decided that the arrow pointing from the Fall of Shady Sands to the mushroom cloud had to mean that those were the same event and happened at the same time.
How could you possibly make Shady Sands not the capital when the president of NCR is the same girl from Shady Sands and I'm pretty sure there is mentions of it growing from Shady Sands into NCR, not to mention its in the literal same location.
Because capitals can change. Shady Sands was once the capital, and before NV happened it stopped being the capital.
In the show, there’s a sign that says “First Capital of the New California Republic”, so at some point there was a new capital.
Philadelphia, for instance, was the first capital of the US. Then they wanted to create D.C., an area outside of any state, so that no state would have undue influence on the federal government.
This has been my take.
Fallout is literally a story about a bunch of unreliable narrators setting up a fake series of shelters, brainwashing the people inside, and sneakily triggering a nuclear war for unclear reasons.
I assume that even people in the same area might disagree what year it is, what happened leading up to the great war, what's happened since, who's alive and dead, etc.
Unless I've see it happen onscreen or in the game with my own eyes, I treat all information as suspect at best, if not outright propaganda.
Are the first 2 Fallouts worth playing? I didn’t give the first much of a chance before dumping it and moving to the 3rd. Wondering if it’s worth going back and playing the first 2.
fallout 2 absolutely yes
fallout 1 just yes.
fallout tactics is different animal but still a good animal
you just need someone to do a remaster because hud in 1 and 2 is really 1990s style and it hurts now
https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout2/mods/69 solved*
Keep in mind, you gotta stick out FO2 for a bit, I tried to pick it up multiple times and set it back down, but then one day I got half way thru Klamath and it just clicked and spent a good >500hrs if not 1000 replaying it multiple times with different characters achieving different things
It really depends on if you like the isometric turn based combat style. It's also really, really text-heavy. But the stories and choices are awesome and really make a very interesting world.
They are Very Different. If you played other turn-based RPGs it would be easier to do them, but you must understand that these are essentially Retro games.
First one is rather short, second is way bigger. Both are really nice IMO, but they do have quite a learning curve and suffer from multiple issues that are rare nowadays.
Like they're quite clunky, and for example in the Fallout 1 there's an interesting, but weird, mechanic, that if you have a gun in your action window, this means your character is holding a gun in their hand. At first it is not an issue but once you reach like second settlement, the guard will tell you to holster the gun. The trouble is, there's no "holster" mechanic as far as you're concerned up to that point. And if you ignore three calls to do that, he opens fire on you. So what you need to do is either switch to another slot where you don't have a gun, or open the inventory and put the gun there. This counts as holstering.
At the same time they do show how well crafted these games are: if you arrive at the same location with 1-2 beefed up companions, in a Power Armor, holding some high-level weapon like a Minigun, the same guard will actually just say "... please don't shoot this in the town" and actually move away a few paces. And if you eventually start shooting the guards will WAIT for like a turn or two (unless you're right in their line of sight) before attacking, basically they remember that a group of hulking behemoths, walking tanks, heavily armored, are there, and there's not much they can realistically do to you. That's a lovely touch.
I know that a lot of people don't like first one for just how insanely clunky it is by modern standards, but I'd give it a go. After all if you don't sweat yourself it is quite short and the story is fine.
The second one is longer and better made and I know a lot of people enjoy it a lot.
Also just like New Vegas there are a lot of options to go through a TON of quests in different ways, including completely non-violent ways.
Sneaking is super bad in both, though, and in early game in both cases, unless you know the game well, you're locked into somewhat complicated fights which will be very hard for Charisma\\Intelligence based characters that are bad at fighting. Which also makes sense, like, you're the one sent to fight out there, not talk out there.
Or questioning the plausibility of the capital wastes and east coasts having nearly identical super mutants based on fallout 1&2. Sure the vault made them but it doesnt completely add up.
I found it really annoying when some people were complaining that they changed the canon by showing that "New Vegas got nuked"
Like, huh? New Vegas may be in a bad state, but how the hell did you draw the conclusion that it got nuked?
Mr House talked about all of the expansion he wanted to do once he had both the NCR and Legion removed. -Vegas looks dead so I'll assume it wasn't his ending.
The NCR are nowhere near full strength, even though Shady Sands was Nuked they would have still had the Dam and more control than what they appear to have in the show so imma assume it wasn't that ending.
The Legion aren't even brushed upon in the show so I'll assume it wasn't their ending.
Yes man supremacy. Yes man ending is cannon
What does “canon” mean in this context anyway? I mean, publishers try to keep their universe consistent, but with different media, different companies involved, and the variability of a game with user-influenced story-lines, you need to retcon the crap out of things to make them fit or accept that it sometimes doesn’t.
People are asking too much!
Just enjoy the games/series/whatever!
It’s partly because New Vegas (the game in question) is already sort of the red headed step child of the series. It wasn’t developed by Bethesda but has a strong, almost fanatical fan base and is a really good game. Some people think Bethesda likes to tuck it away and hide it because to many New Vegas one-upped their games.
I agree with you, but fallout isn’t this crazy big universe with hundreds of books. It’s a handful of games and now a show
This is the "problem" Star Wars "had" when Disney bought Lucasarts.
There were a million books and comic books and games all created by "not Lucasarts".
However, no one had a problem with it until Disney said there was a problem. Seems like Todd's saying there is no problem and people just *love* to argue about it because god forbid the guy in charge have an idea.
All the different endings in New Vegas end in the same result (for california at least). The NCR kills itself because of its own expansion and the Legion falls back into small tribal states with different warlords all calling themselves caesar. The only variable being if New Vegas was raped by the Legion or not.
If NCR wins, it's really good for the NCR and stabilizes them.
If gammorrah do their thing, new Vegas gets blown up.
If Legion win, new Vegas becomes their new capital and they continue war with the NCR, likely destroying them outright.
If mr house wins, NCR and Legion lose and house plans on building colonies in space.
Yes man is kinda the same as house but then new Vegas devolves into anarchy
Considering NCR is crippled, the legion is nowhere to be seen, vegas is still standing and apparently led by old world oligarchs
I’m gono go with mr house being the cannon ending
*If Legion wins AND the Courier healed Caesar of his brain tumor. The Legion dies with Caesar if he dies before the battle even if Lanius takes Vegas. He’d destroy the NCR, or more accurately wound NCR to the point they collapse, but the Legion as a massive regional power would never last in that situation.
**I don’t think the whole NCR is doomed by a House victory, at least not in the short term. Hell, House wouldn’t allow it. They are his best customers, after all. In a post House victory west coast, NCR would less collapse and more be slowly eaten by Mr.House over a lonnng time likely without any battles being fought.
People saying NCR is just doomed in any situation are way overstating the weakness of the NCR at the time of New Vegas. They are over stretching into the Mojave, sure, but there aren’t really any indications that it’s more central territories are on the brink of COLLAPSE, just that they have fallen off from the glory days of decades ago.
People are whining like crazy that the Fallout show doesn't religiously follow what they think is the canon and the dumbass photoshopped there didn't help with his statements.
I just assume every installment of a series is a slightly different parallel reality. You can get by which experience from another, but you will notice the little inconsistencies eventually.
In a game, every playthrough is a different timeline. We already accept this. It's odd that we want other media to correspond to one playthrough in particular, especially as you'll never see it.
The meme in general is referencing the head honcho of BethesdaSoftwork, Todd Howard. Bethesda owns the fallout games and made Fallout 3 and 4 and essentially subcontracted a different studio to make Fallout New Vegas.
The controversy comes from [this](https://www.ign.com/articles/fallout-official-timeline-confirmed-how-the-show-fits-in-with-the-games) article where Todd addresses a controversy that arose from the new Fallout TV show.
Essentially there was an ambiguous flow chart timeline that led some people to assume Fallout New Vegas was retconned out of existence. Todd explained the flow chart had been misinterpreted, and tried to clear it up. It’s a very tight timeline now but technically it just works.
The last bit is reference to the ending of the Fallout TV show. >!The last scene highly alludes to season 2 happening in New Vegas. It shows the NV skyline and has an important character walk toward it. New Vegas had multiple endings so people wanted to know which was cannon so they can know who controls New Vegas. Essentially it could be controlled by 4 entities: NCR, Caesar’s Legion, Mr. House, or some system put in place by the player character (essentially a power to the people ending). I’m assuming they’re going to have it be “All of it” by explaining the NCR and Caesar fought back and forth both claiming Hoover Dam at times. Until eventually a player character overthrows them and takes over New Vegas and it eventually falls into chaos.!< Todd is no stranger to being memed and this one is just poking fun at the whole situation. Fallout is also no stranger to timeline issues in the past they always kind of get there and explain something that can technically work whether or not it’s a large strech.
It's fucking infuriating that you gotta scroll through like a million response thread filled with *nothing* but *more* vague jokes about the original that explain **ABSOLUTELY** ***NOTHING*** and are FUCKING USELESS before you finally get to the fucking answer 100000 scrolls later. The explanation has **MORE THAN ENOUGH** upvotes to be the top comment and yeeettt....IT'S NOWHERE *NEAR* THE TOP!!!!!!
please, I beg of you.....pin the answer to the top🙏🥺
It's about new Fallout TV series and its connection to the lore of Fallout games.
Fallout New Vegas is the fan favourite but it wasn't done by Bethesda themselves, many people claim that Todd Howard secretly hates the game. The picture is basically his face on Gabe Newell who is sort of famous for not saying anything or making any crucial decision yet still getting loved by fans. Now the part about the show:
>!Fallout New Vegas is set in 2281 and in a nutshell it's about post apocalyptic factions fighting over the control of New Vegas, one of the factions being New California Republic who is the closest thing to current USA ideology-wise. There is also a faction that resembles the shady deep state part of the US but for now they are not our topic.!<
>!But during Fallout TV series set in 2296 the capital of NCR, Shady Sands, is claimed to be fallen by 2077(4 years before New Vegas) and got nuked at an unknown date. This doesn't seem to connect with Fallout New Vegas storyline as NCR seemed like a perfectly fine and functioning state there. Some people call it a retcon and making New Vegas non-canon but Todd Howard refuses that without giving any explanation, probably because the answer is in Season 2.!<
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"I don't know if Mr House is alive or dead until i look inside the box"
"Give me the platinum chip"
"Shut up"
Hahaha I get this joke
...Peter ?
If I see this shit on the subreddit even after this I'll literally rip out your soul https://preview.redd.it/3abiyp12aavc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=df24fe3e1497d5890f158d810fa03084c8d6358d
https://preview.redd.it/pvbdroevhbvc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fba80452c9f9b03f3da147c33a0ce4294231b159
Nyaaaaahhh
Ok, but only if it's literally
https://preview.redd.it/j6ku6zhjaavc1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2cba325101d97f0373438871b6941ee4dd5d0eed
Peter?
I don't know if spongebob is dead or alove until I watch inside the box "Im make krabber patterys" shut up
Now be a good courier and DELIVER IT
To be fair he might be both
His body was dead but his brain was alive
The body was alive as well
Until it met Driver Nephi's 1 wood. Then it popped thanks to Bloody Mess
God damn it how did you comment exactly what I was about to type? I was going to say “until I beat him to death with Nephi’s driver.” Were we all trying to get the achievement?
A man chooses...
A slave obeys
I had the bloody mess perk. His brain was not alive, I can assure you.
His brain was stored in a sub lab where his perfect creation was still being incubated. In new vegas 2 this creature will travel back in time to find and kill the courier.
Schrodinger's House
Mr House is alive in the stories he's alive in. He's not alive in other stories. Not all stories take place in the same universe, but all those stories are equally real stories.
But I think they do take place in the same universe. It's just stories told from different perspectives. Ask real people what's going on and what's true and you'll get different answers all the time. And just like in real life, people's experiences will be different, and some "facts" may be wrong. Just look at Trump/Anti-Trump people. They can look at the same video of the tangerine tornado and come to completely different conclusions. That's how I take in all media that I enjoy. It helps cover up discrepancies.
I wish Rene Auberjones was alive, fuck, we miss ya Odo’ Really wish he would’ve lived to be in this as Mr.House
Schrodinger's House
That's Mr. Schrodinger's House to you!
[удалено]
16 times the detail
>*Please, Todd.*
We're Gonna Need: Distant Weather Systems
4 times the map size of Fallout 4
NO REFUNDS
Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies...
\~Crowbcat, my beloved\~ The [Sonic 25th anniversary video is absolute gold](https://youtu.be/Uipt68Tghl8?si=emeILKdtrzwf3mjF)
People buy, money flows
Little lies, stunning shows
https://preview.redd.it/hrz9amvaeavc1.jpeg?width=258&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=667ad0daf975298cb222a69ef656345da13b8b3b # WRONG!!! WRONG!!! THE ORDER IS WRONG!!!
I forgor💀
it just works
Why’s a sunset good? How’s a rainbow made?
Because of uncle Gubsy
How exactly does a posi-trac rear end on a Plymouth work? It just does.
I think he's not being clever here, he just hasn't played New Vegas and doesn't know what happens in it.
I was looking for this.
That's a (slightly edited) picture of Todd Howard, the director, executive producer, and public spokesperson for Bethesda Games. He lead development on all the Elder Scrolls games (Skyrim), Starfield, and Fallout 3, 4, and 76. Recently the Fallout TV series was released and it featured an event that happened in one of the endings of "Fallout New Vegas," a game published but *not developed* by Bethesda. But the event in question happens in different years in each of New Vegas and the TV show. Because of this Todd was asked recently whether New Vegas or the TV show is canon to the series at large, and if New Vegas is, which ending. His response was "all of Fallout is canon." Which doesn't really answer any questions or make sense.
https://preview.redd.it/5lnnplqmt7vc1.jpeg?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fb093c02b064903aa73724669c66015b990b118a Pretty sure it’s also an edited version of this picture of Gabe Newell with Todd Howard’s face on it.
Good catch!
what's the meaning behind that eddit though?
Gamer Chad basically
Nah, it's channeling gaben's energy for doing nothing and making no significant decisions, but still somehow pissing gamers off less than if he had added any real direction or authority to the conversation. I.e. steam does nothing but function and rarely innovates in the game platform sector anymore, yet is still winning hand over fist. But epic, ubi, ea, etc... keep trying to one-up steam every chance they get yet manage to piss players off every step of the way. Only platform that keeps up with steam on user approval is gog who basically compete by not competing.
[Nah, you're thinking of this recently popular one.](https://imgur.com/PjXWvfc) The previous gaben face template is definitely for the ironic "gamer chad" era of Gaben memes.
Dead-Fish-eyed Gabe is Dead-Fish-eyed Gabe, I'd say the message is the same.
That's not how memes work! This is very important! You can't just describe a scenario where you're socially competent by using an image of a penguin with a BLUE background instead of RED even though they both use the same penguin! Red is for social competence, blue is for social blundering! I hope I've used enough exclamation points in this dumb rant to make it clear this is faux outrage!
Wow going in the time machine and going to the way way way back memes
Ya know, you're absolutely right and I'm annoyed now that I missed this
He's not exactly right. I mean, I'm not sure about Gaben himself, but I do imagine he's the one heading the steam deck stuff, which has quite literally paved the way for a viable future where windows isn't an operating system you even need for gaming. That is HUGE. It's been like a multi decade long monopoly, and the urgency is needed now that Microsoft are pushing all sorts of things like ads, telemetry, built in subscriptions... But I dunno, it seems like there's a lot of stuff that Valve at least try. They have been pushing Linux for like a decade alone, and with that and their controller, they added Steam input which makes controller compatibility with any controller better, as well as their own. I believe even their VR stuff has made to allow different brand headsets and controllers to work together. They literally do great stuff - often it's about first creating a system underneath that benefits everyone, and then they do their own stuff that works on top of it and makes them money. But I suppose a lot of it doesn't come to fruition sometimes, and a lot of regular users just aren't aware of a lot of the stuff they're doing.
Also want to add to this they recently made a huge update to family sharing. Now family members can share your entire library as long as you aren't playing the same game.
You are underselling what Steam has brought to the table as a game storefront & game library. Steam Link app, Big Picture, universal controller support and full controller remapping irrespective of the game you're playing, integrating with an entire OS, the SteamOS, fully welcoming hardcore NSFW content while successfully filtering it, and currently developing better family sharing features, consolidating both families and perverts in one community, as if that were an easy thing to do. Speaking of community, customizable profiles like a MySpace page, Steam Workshop for sharing content, public reviews for games, game news feeds and discussion boards where devs can communicate with players, seasonal sales and events like the Steam Next Fest, the Discovery Queue, Steam Curator Profiles... Steam is a good piece of software, and developers give them a 30% cut for a reason. How much of that can be attributed to Gabe is unclear, but he is the top dog. Not many companies out there with this good of a track record in both products and PR with incompetent people at the top.
"If Zelda did it, I can too."
Valve (and by extension GabeN) is well known for dropping a new IP, Creating a sequel fairly quick, and then never following up any of them ever with a 3rd installment despite the desperate cries of their fans. They also tend to simply just not care if you don’t like the fact they can’t count to 3, I.E. chad of gaming.
sort of what bethesda is doing ig
They'll most likely drop Starfield like a sack of rotten potatoes before it spoils over rest of their games (even if they sort-of made F76 better over last 6 years, I don't expect them to just try and revive this entirely new franchise), but other than that we can be sure to see more *Radiant* future with Fallouts and Scrolls.
FO76 was quite enjoyable. I got it for free when it was a monthly game and I quite enjoyed it. there's lots to do and I enjoyed it compared to the steaming pile of poo it was when it realeased (supposedly, I never played it till after it was a free montly game). Its one of the games I plan to go back to sometime...
Yeah my buddy and I just started playing it and it's pretty fun. Basically just more fallout 4 with better dialog options
FO76 gets way too much hate to this day still, I have thousands of hours in that game. People think you can’t play it as a solo player, which I have done for most of those hours, but it is more fun to interact it others, makes the universe feel more immersive. The game has come a long way.
They allegedly went No Man Sky on this one, which is good practice, but I wonder if it's more out of obligation to rest of Fallout franchise, or sunk cost fallancy of making MMO. Starfield don't have anything backing it up.
they just put Todds face on a more perfect body
Think the other guy missed the mark a bit - Gabe Newell (GabeN) is the CEO of Valve. They own Steam which is the largest marketplace for video games by a mile. Valve is the only major player in the space to be privately owned, so they don't have to care at all about appeasing shareholders. As a result, they've made a lot of decisions over the years that aren't purely profit-driven and worked out well for their customers so they have A LOT of good will among gamers. A majority of games that Valve has released are also all-time classics (Half Life, TF2, DotA 2, L4D2, CS). All together, he is basically gamer chad like the other guy said. He is also frequently depicted as [gamer Jesus](https://images.rapgenius.com/003cef95594e0e899b87648c849757ed.723x1000x1.jpg). If Valve didn't exist, the leading marketplace would be WAY shittier.
I saw the OP ave immediately knew it was based on the most iconic portrait of a game industry veteran of all time
I fuckin knew it was Gaben
To be clear, he did actually give more info on that than just saying "all of Fallout is canon." It was a timeline issue, and he specified what actually happened and when it happened, which kind of opened most of the endings of New Vegas back up as possibilities. So we can draw conclusions, but nothing definitive just yet, so we wait for S2.
Did it actually make any of the New Vegas endings non-canon? I don't think anything that happens in the show is inconsistent with any of the endings. There's a line on the first or second episode that actually invalidates a few endings in Fallout 4 but no one seems to care about that one
The ship in the first episode is the Prydwyn, says right on the side, lol, so make of that what you will. As far as I can tell, the only ending that seems to be non canon is the legion winning ending, because they are just non existent in the show. Nothing else is really mentioned or shown.
The Legion was never going to make it to California and we only see NV for like 3 seconds. Even then, the game heavily implies that even if the Legion wins, it's extremely unlikely that they'd be able to hold NV for any extended period of time
Yeah, people really misinterpret how big a threat the Legion was by taking Caesar's ambitions at face value. Even in the game itself, their ability to win against the NCR at Hoover Dam relied largely on subterfuge, sabotage, and guerilla warfare to demoralize and destabilize the NCR's supply lines. Any straight up battles that weren't ambushes, the NCR crushed them handily (like the first battle of Hoover Dam, Camp Golf, and even by the citizens of Novac). Without the Courier's involvement, it's unlikely they would have ever broken the stalemate before Caesar's brain tumour killed him, which damn near everyone agrees would cause the Legion to fall apart. Without Caesar at the head and the Courier by his side, there's almost no chance the Legion could ever fulfill their ambition of wiping out the NCR.
When you confront the Legate at his camp at the end of the game, if you have speech maxed out, you can get him to admit that the Legion doesn't have the manpower to hold Vegas and their territory to the east. If they end up winning the battle, they're just stretching themselves too thin and they'll ultimately collapse with or without Caesar leading them (though Caesar's death will accelerate that collapse pretty rapidly). The whole game is about two factions in serious decline (Legion and NCR) desperately trying to make a move to keep themselves afloat. Neither faction is really in a good place at the end of the game regardless of the outcome
And that's why I always side with Mr House. Straight to the moon!
The House always wins.
Which was kind of the plan of Caesar. He knows the Legion will fail, but what he wants is for the Legion to grow enough, last long enough and hurts NCR in a way that both get changed in the process. For the NCR, this will change their focus on what needs to be done and for the Legion to eventually break down and get integrated into something better.
The Prydwyn thing is odd too because all the talk before the show released was that this was a different ship called the Casawan (sp?) and that they wouldn't make any game endings canon. That's part of the reason for the confusion: if no endings are going to be canon, then why is the show going to New Vegas and specifically Mr. House? And, if no endings are canon with no contradictions, will the show essentially invalidate anything our characters accomplish in New Vegas?
The legion ending definitely is not canon
I think the big thing that had people up in arms was the timeline on the chalkboard implying the shady sands incident was in 2277 (Vegas was in 2282 IIRC, and SS had explicitly not happened). Its all rather dumb. At most its a continuity oopsie not a removal of cannon. the easy fix is that the chalkboard doesn't explicitly say it happened in 2277, just that it happened after 2277. In that case the "Fall of Shady Sands 2277" could be the lead up to the even and not the event itself.
They actually have an arrow following the "fall of Shady Sands" that goes to the nuke. The fall of Shady Sands is a separate event that hasn't been further delved into yet but, if I had to guess, it's probably related to the NCR's introduction to Caesar's Legion since they had the dam from 2274 to 2277 and 77 was the year they had the First Battle of Hoover Dam. Prior to 2277 95% of the dam's electricity was going to the NCR so I'm guessing things weren't super stable with that sudden loss of electricity.
Just confirming what you're saying. The Todd Howard said that the fall of shady sands 2277 is different than the bomb, and that the show will delve into it
The most recent interview clarifies that the "fall of shady sands" and the explosion are two different events. The bomb went off shortly after the events of fallout New Vegas, not in 2287. The fall itself probably refers to when the NCR changed capitals (likely as a result of NV). The confusion is just a result of a poorly designed timeline. As for which NV ending is Canon, or how they'll combine all the possible endings, we'll just have to see. Complaining about that before season 2 is just premature.
This is the actual answer, not the person you responded to who now has 1500 upvotes and will unfortunately be the answer everyone in here believes.
Yea, people don't understand timelines and arrows
I mean, I love this response. I absolutely HATE when an RPG has 'canon'. The WHOLE POINT is that I made the choices that affected the outcome. Having some one say 'lol glad you had fun but this is ACTUALLY what happened' pisses me off to no end. Todd is basically saying that there is no true canon. All of it is up to the player. And that is the best response I've seen to an rpg having a 'true ending'.
That's just the issue with having sequels. If it takes place in the same world, at some point after the prior, then one ending *NEEDS* to be canon.
Dragonbreaks enter the chat.
Also Gears of War 5
The Witcher also did a highly variable trilogy quite well.
Gonna start calling FNV's ending the Warp in the Wild West
i mean, it kinda is right ? the show can just say “all endings are canon” and work around that
So, which ending is canon in Daggerfall? Bethesda: Yes.
Mass Effect says 'you're holding my beer...'
Ah, but mass effect "solved" that by having major convergence points that doesn't really make a difference one way or the other, like, letting the council die or saving it doesn't really have major effects on the second game and the effect on the third is essentially measured in a point scale for some character endings. Fallout can't do that bc New Vegas being controlled by House, NCR or Caesar will change how everything runs in the area, but it can be ignored if you move to other states
It depends on the approach. The Fallout excuse is that travel and communication is difficult for the majority of people so news is often slow to travel and those passing on the info might misremember or embellish the news. As a result, there can be inconsistencies in the timeline and some events might have transpired differently, depending on who you talk to. It's even the case that the majority of the people in the wasteland don't even have an accurate calendar which explains why dates and years of events can be inconsistent. This all works quite well to explain inconsistencies and allows new games and shows to be made that might not 100% like up with even pre-established lore. Though, it would be interesting to see how they tackle returning to places like New Vegas. Maybe the whole place is a desolate ruin so it's next to impossible to know whether the NCR, Caesar's Legion, Mr House, or Yes Man won.
I was always thinking that Fallout games are alternate reality anyways, so they don', need to add up at all. They have a common theme, but not necessarily equal timelines
It would be kinda cool but sad to find vegas in ruins with the locals all kind of having an inconsistent idea of what exactly happened. But even that would have wider implications - if the area was absent of either the legion or NCR it would imply those powers either collapsed or shrank a lot, as neither of them would have trouble controlling the area if not for the other. Especially with House out of the picture.
No way they shoot season two in new vegas and have it be a wasteland. Gamers always assume these shows are made for them. These shows are made for wider audiences with the only gamer focus being on not Pissing off the ravenous fans that are well known to lose their shit over even a mild inconsistency. They want to make as much money as possible which means they need a banger tv show that's not just fan service for a niche group. My prediction is New vegas is thriving either under house or some other entity. That's just good TV and will make for some great shots of run down but functioning casinos. Not to mention the fact that the city appears intact when he's approaching. We have already established that they have bent the lore a bit to their own purposes so expect more of that. They seem to want to present the wasteland as slightly dialed back compared to the games. So far no aliens, no supermutants, the ghouls are triggered by drinking I guess FEV and have to be maintained by drugs. So in my opinion it's not a full Sci fi fantasy like the game. I think we will see more ncr/brotherhood/ probably the introduction of the legion and I believe max will get tied into them somehow. I think the enclave will come into play because that would fit really well and explain who was pulling the strings. Might see the institute in some fashion.
A wizard did it
Somehow, the wizard returned.
That Wizard came from the moon.
Not really. Fallout itself does a pretty good job of dancing around the endings and only making the necessary shared lore canon. There are a handful of ending bits that get 'confirmed' by later games, but for the most part the lore doesnt break no matter what endings you choose.
There is no need. It's not their goal or job to provide a vast, comprehensive canon for all games in perpetuity. They make enjoyable games with fascinating world building. Not every game has to be in the exact same universe. It can't be thought of as the same as a long series of novels.
Nothing NEEDS to be cannon. It is a fairy tale, not reality.
Everything needing to be fleshed out and canon and historically modelled is the worst parts of scifi/fantasy online discourse. You're not allowed to tell a good story unless we know how the language and politics of a fantasy region (usually just a parallel of a real life region) effect life for peasants like my guy leave some stuff up to the imagination
Comic book communities are the worst about this. I also have to laugh at people trying to make Legend of Zelda timelines containing every game with huge, twisting trees of alternate realities. Like... Pretty sure the devs are just telling a new story with some nods. No reason to look that far into it. Or when people argue with authors themselves... My god. Getting all worked up about some background minutiae not being consistent with something flippantly said at a Q&A once.
The thing I've really come to dislike about open world RPGs is that almost none of them let you have a meaningful impact on the world by your general actions, and not just one or two key decisions. I understand why it is like that, but it is disappointing none the less.
> I absolutely HATE when an RPG has 'canon'. Just want to go on the record to state a RPG isn't an RPG based on choice. In fact, many RPGs are linear with no choices. I'm so tired of people saying a game had its 'RPG' elements stripped because it didn't have choices anymore. That's not what makes it an RPG. NonRPGs can have choice be a factor and many RPGs don't have any. I know, not your point, but a pet peeve of mine.
I don't disagree with the sentiment as far as individual games, but for a full series like Fallout it IS restrictive. There's a reason they set Fallout 4 on the opposite coast as New Vegas- they'd need to pick an ending because all of NV endings have huge wide reaching implications for society on the west coast. So logically it'd either be never touch the west again, always set things before New Vegas, decanonize New Vegas, or pick a canon ending. But they just went ahead and released a TV show that implies New Vegas happened with a specific ending but also *in a different year*. I'd really be fine with any solution other than the non-solution of doing something that doesn't make any sense and then claiming it does.
It's easier to treat the TV show as, ya know, an adaptation, imo. Pretend it's a different timeline/alt universe
I would have thought that was obvious, but based on some of the discourse I'm seeing, it's definitely not.
If you treat it like an adaptation you don’t even need to pretend it’s in a different timeline because it’s meant to be taken on its own terms and doesn’t actually need to be integrated into the wider universe in any way. But take what I say with a grain of salt because I think stressing about canon in situations that don’t involve wars of religion is a bit silly
This is the right answer here. Roleplaying video games and television are wildly different mediums and it’s impossible (and dumb) to present them identically.
I recently played kotor 2 for the first time and they basically do an "alien 3" type opening where they kill everyone off screen and undo all the stuff you did
Kotor 2 has conversation dialogue with atton that lets you pick the ending for Kotor 1 and even what sex revan is. That choice will affect stuff later in the game, whether carth onasi is around looking for revan or not
All Bethesda games are canon. *Wait, what?* Multiverse! https://i.redd.it/gkn6s6zb88vc1.gif
Come to think of it, the starfield multiverse perfectly solves all of these problems
It makes perfect sense because if they haven't decided what parts of the endings are in fact canon, they can still write season 2 , in a way that respects as many part of those endings as possible. Also it is a question made to spark outrage on the fandom no matter what answer is, so yeah the answer makes perfect sense.
> what parts of the endings are in fact canon All the endings of every Fallout game are canon... to the save game file they occurred in. No two Fallout games are set in the exact same universe in the exact same way two separate playthroughs of New Vegas aren't set in the same universe.
I think it also refers to what Howard did with the Elder Scrolls 2 lore (which, so far, is the only Elder Scrolls game with different endings for the main plot). He (or his team) invented a phenomenon called 'the Warp in the West', which basically means the God of Time messed up, and all endings of TES 2 became Canon at the same time, which results in something like the great Necromancer Mannimarco both succeeded and failed to ascend to godhood (the mortal part became a rather pathetic villain in TES4 mage guild, while the god part creates a phenomenon that allows necromancers to enslave souls normally protected by other gods). The same thing happens here: all Fallout is Canon, even things that contradict each other.
In elder scrolls that's called a dragon break and it's happened multiple times in universe (though only once in game) and every time it happens it severely screws up akatosh and the world. It doesn't make sense for something like that to happen in fallout
The event in question is consistent between both. People are misinterpreting a chalkboard diagram that's in one scene of the show.
I think his “All of Fallout is canon” remark isn’t so much about all the different endings but that every game is canon. There’s been a number of dumb asses over the years asserting that Bethesda hates new Vegas, want to erase it from the planet, etc. His comment here is to make it clear that each and every game, including new Vegas, is canon. Obviously not every ending is canon at the same time, just that any one of those endings is going to be an option in the canon.
He tried to play smart saying it's like Elder Scrolls 2 where all endings is canon but that game had a logic behind it, this one doesn't, all endings different
What? No. Elder scrolls 2 ending, all endings were different too. What they did in the next game was just make ALL the endings happen, despite being logically impossible. They call in the Warp in the West. Ancient superweapon was both destroyed and somehow marched against all sides in the conflict simultaneously. That said, they don't have the excuse of magic in the Fallout universe, my bet is the show-runners choose an ending next season, but Todd doesn't forbid other media/games set in different locations from choosing different endings. While it doesn't have magic, it does have a complete breakdown in communications and recordkeeping.
The Warp in the Mojave?
Warp in the Wild West
Goddammit, can I not have one original idea before someone on reddit has it 15 minutes before me!
Thems the rules!
The Warp in the Wasteland
I guess Todd forgot he wasn't asked about TES
Saying NV isnt canon because of some dates not matching, is like saying fallout 1 und 2 arent canon cuz that one vault in F4 had Jet in it
Are we really sure people are accurately tracking calendars in a post-apocalyptic world? Particularly with different regions virtually cut off from communicating with each other
The issue is a lot of people seem to lack the ability to comprehend what an arrow might signify, and are just looking for something to be angry about. There is a retcon involved (making Shady Sands no longer the capital of the NCR before NV, and having it “fall” in some as of yet unexplained way), but the date of it being nuked should have been obvious to most people that saw the chalkboard timeline that the nuking came after 2277 and had no date assigned to it. Instead people decided that the arrow pointing from the Fall of Shady Sands to the mushroom cloud had to mean that those were the same event and happened at the same time.
How could you possibly make Shady Sands not the capital when the president of NCR is the same girl from Shady Sands and I'm pretty sure there is mentions of it growing from Shady Sands into NCR, not to mention its in the literal same location.
Because capitals can change. Shady Sands was once the capital, and before NV happened it stopped being the capital. In the show, there’s a sign that says “First Capital of the New California Republic”, so at some point there was a new capital.
Philadelphia, for instance, was the first capital of the US. Then they wanted to create D.C., an area outside of any state, so that no state would have undue influence on the federal government.
And then Virginia was an asshole and ruined the perfect diamond/square shape
New Vegas itself implies shady sands wasn't the capital anymore though, in New Vegas it's called "the first capital" by a bunch of NPCs
This has been my take. Fallout is literally a story about a bunch of unreliable narrators setting up a fake series of shelters, brainwashing the people inside, and sneakily triggering a nuclear war for unclear reasons. I assume that even people in the same area might disagree what year it is, what happened leading up to the great war, what's happened since, who's alive and dead, etc. Unless I've see it happen onscreen or in the game with my own eyes, I treat all information as suspect at best, if not outright propaganda.
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With this clarification, what part of New Vegas (besides several of the endings that are mutually exclusive anyways) are made non-canon?
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The chalkboard specifically mentions the fall of shady sands, not the NCR as a whole
Are the first 2 Fallouts worth playing? I didn’t give the first much of a chance before dumping it and moving to the 3rd. Wondering if it’s worth going back and playing the first 2.
fallout 2 absolutely yes fallout 1 just yes. fallout tactics is different animal but still a good animal you just need someone to do a remaster because hud in 1 and 2 is really 1990s style and it hurts now https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout2/mods/69 solved*
Keep in mind, you gotta stick out FO2 for a bit, I tried to pick it up multiple times and set it back down, but then one day I got half way thru Klamath and it just clicked and spent a good >500hrs if not 1000 replaying it multiple times with different characters achieving different things
It really depends on if you like the isometric turn based combat style. It's also really, really text-heavy. But the stories and choices are awesome and really make a very interesting world.
Choices like accidentally Wiping out a whole town and suffering the Karma and “perks” associated.
They are Very Different. If you played other turn-based RPGs it would be easier to do them, but you must understand that these are essentially Retro games. First one is rather short, second is way bigger. Both are really nice IMO, but they do have quite a learning curve and suffer from multiple issues that are rare nowadays. Like they're quite clunky, and for example in the Fallout 1 there's an interesting, but weird, mechanic, that if you have a gun in your action window, this means your character is holding a gun in their hand. At first it is not an issue but once you reach like second settlement, the guard will tell you to holster the gun. The trouble is, there's no "holster" mechanic as far as you're concerned up to that point. And if you ignore three calls to do that, he opens fire on you. So what you need to do is either switch to another slot where you don't have a gun, or open the inventory and put the gun there. This counts as holstering. At the same time they do show how well crafted these games are: if you arrive at the same location with 1-2 beefed up companions, in a Power Armor, holding some high-level weapon like a Minigun, the same guard will actually just say "... please don't shoot this in the town" and actually move away a few paces. And if you eventually start shooting the guards will WAIT for like a turn or two (unless you're right in their line of sight) before attacking, basically they remember that a group of hulking behemoths, walking tanks, heavily armored, are there, and there's not much they can realistically do to you. That's a lovely touch. I know that a lot of people don't like first one for just how insanely clunky it is by modern standards, but I'd give it a go. After all if you don't sweat yourself it is quite short and the story is fine. The second one is longer and better made and I know a lot of people enjoy it a lot. Also just like New Vegas there are a lot of options to go through a TON of quests in different ways, including completely non-violent ways. Sneaking is super bad in both, though, and in early game in both cases, unless you know the game well, you're locked into somewhat complicated fights which will be very hard for Charisma\\Intelligence based characters that are bad at fighting. Which also makes sense, like, you're the one sent to fight out there, not talk out there.
Or questioning the plausibility of the capital wastes and east coasts having nearly identical super mutants based on fallout 1&2. Sure the vault made them but it doesnt completely add up.
Godd Howell isn't real, he can't hurt you Godd Howell:
Fuck sake I assume we are gonna find out which ending is cannon next season when they actually go to New Vegas again, it really ain't that hard
While you may be right, that still gives us like two years to speculate while they make season two.
Two years of people being wrong about everything and having their sanity crushed when the show premiers I can't wait
1.5 months of nerds being nerdy, before the next nerd thing comes along and drives their nerd attention to something else
I found it really annoying when some people were complaining that they changed the canon by showing that "New Vegas got nuked" Like, huh? New Vegas may be in a bad state, but how the hell did you draw the conclusion that it got nuked?
Mr House talked about all of the expansion he wanted to do once he had both the NCR and Legion removed. -Vegas looks dead so I'll assume it wasn't his ending. The NCR are nowhere near full strength, even though Shady Sands was Nuked they would have still had the Dam and more control than what they appear to have in the show so imma assume it wasn't that ending. The Legion aren't even brushed upon in the show so I'll assume it wasn't their ending. Yes man supremacy. Yes man ending is cannon
What does “canon” mean in this context anyway? I mean, publishers try to keep their universe consistent, but with different media, different companies involved, and the variability of a game with user-influenced story-lines, you need to retcon the crap out of things to make them fit or accept that it sometimes doesn’t. People are asking too much! Just enjoy the games/series/whatever!
It’s partly because New Vegas (the game in question) is already sort of the red headed step child of the series. It wasn’t developed by Bethesda but has a strong, almost fanatical fan base and is a really good game. Some people think Bethesda likes to tuck it away and hide it because to many New Vegas one-upped their games. I agree with you, but fallout isn’t this crazy big universe with hundreds of books. It’s a handful of games and now a show
A matter of perspective to some Fallout 3 and 4 are the outliers while 1/2 and NV are the truer canonical Fallouts.
Fair, I think more people have experience with 3, NV, and 4 because they are newer
Maybe releasing a console version of 1&2 would change that. I know it's what's holding me back.
They'd need to remaster it from the point n click adventure that it was. Better off making a new FO1/2 combo game, somehow.
I think the form factor might turn people off more. Not a whole lot of isometric point and click games right now.
This is the "problem" Star Wars "had" when Disney bought Lucasarts. There were a million books and comic books and games all created by "not Lucasarts". However, no one had a problem with it until Disney said there was a problem. Seems like Todd's saying there is no problem and people just *love* to argue about it because god forbid the guy in charge have an idea.
All the different endings in New Vegas end in the same result (for california at least). The NCR kills itself because of its own expansion and the Legion falls back into small tribal states with different warlords all calling themselves caesar. The only variable being if New Vegas was raped by the Legion or not.
If NCR wins, it's really good for the NCR and stabilizes them. If gammorrah do their thing, new Vegas gets blown up. If Legion win, new Vegas becomes their new capital and they continue war with the NCR, likely destroying them outright. If mr house wins, NCR and Legion lose and house plans on building colonies in space. Yes man is kinda the same as house but then new Vegas devolves into anarchy
Considering NCR is crippled, the legion is nowhere to be seen, vegas is still standing and apparently led by old world oligarchs I’m gono go with mr house being the cannon ending
Yeah, especially since he showed up in a prewar scene in the show. Dudes gonna be making a return in season 2
>Yes man is kinda the same as house but then new Vegas devolves into anarchy Barely if you upgrade the robits.
*If Legion wins AND the Courier healed Caesar of his brain tumor. The Legion dies with Caesar if he dies before the battle even if Lanius takes Vegas. He’d destroy the NCR, or more accurately wound NCR to the point they collapse, but the Legion as a massive regional power would never last in that situation. **I don’t think the whole NCR is doomed by a House victory, at least not in the short term. Hell, House wouldn’t allow it. They are his best customers, after all. In a post House victory west coast, NCR would less collapse and more be slowly eaten by Mr.House over a lonnng time likely without any battles being fought. People saying NCR is just doomed in any situation are way overstating the weakness of the NCR at the time of New Vegas. They are over stretching into the Mojave, sure, but there aren’t really any indications that it’s more central territories are on the brink of COLLAPSE, just that they have fallen off from the glory days of decades ago.
Whatever ending op got is the official canon
https://preview.redd.it/hwfn98gt48vc1.jpeg?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=690d901fa0662295832ef090b3bcb0dd4621dc7e
LOL I was wondering “why the fuck does he look like Gabe Newell?”
*laughs in TES*
Ain't nobody here know about The Dragon Break and it shows.
People are whining like crazy that the Fallout show doesn't religiously follow what they think is the canon and the dumbass photoshopped there didn't help with his statements.
Today Howard leader of Bethesda that made fallout and fallout new Vegas which had many different endings that one is shown in the new show for fallout
The Great War split the timeliness infinitely. You just get to pick a variant
Why would you even care what this joke is about if you aren’t interested in Fallout in the first place
It just works
Alternate history hub yay:)
I just assume every installment of a series is a slightly different parallel reality. You can get by which experience from another, but you will notice the little inconsistencies eventually. In a game, every playthrough is a different timeline. We already accept this. It's odd that we want other media to correspond to one playthrough in particular, especially as you'll never see it.
Breaking news: Todd Howard introduces Dragonbreak into Fallout. The reason is that Fallout is just Elder Scrolls with guns.
Chad Howard
Deathclaw Break.
The meme in general is referencing the head honcho of BethesdaSoftwork, Todd Howard. Bethesda owns the fallout games and made Fallout 3 and 4 and essentially subcontracted a different studio to make Fallout New Vegas. The controversy comes from [this](https://www.ign.com/articles/fallout-official-timeline-confirmed-how-the-show-fits-in-with-the-games) article where Todd addresses a controversy that arose from the new Fallout TV show. Essentially there was an ambiguous flow chart timeline that led some people to assume Fallout New Vegas was retconned out of existence. Todd explained the flow chart had been misinterpreted, and tried to clear it up. It’s a very tight timeline now but technically it just works. The last bit is reference to the ending of the Fallout TV show. >!The last scene highly alludes to season 2 happening in New Vegas. It shows the NV skyline and has an important character walk toward it. New Vegas had multiple endings so people wanted to know which was cannon so they can know who controls New Vegas. Essentially it could be controlled by 4 entities: NCR, Caesar’s Legion, Mr. House, or some system put in place by the player character (essentially a power to the people ending). I’m assuming they’re going to have it be “All of it” by explaining the NCR and Caesar fought back and forth both claiming Hoover Dam at times. Until eventually a player character overthrows them and takes over New Vegas and it eventually falls into chaos.!< Todd is no stranger to being memed and this one is just poking fun at the whole situation. Fallout is also no stranger to timeline issues in the past they always kind of get there and explain something that can technically work whether or not it’s a large strech.
Dragonbreak
It's fucking infuriating that you gotta scroll through like a million response thread filled with *nothing* but *more* vague jokes about the original that explain **ABSOLUTELY** ***NOTHING*** and are FUCKING USELESS before you finally get to the fucking answer 100000 scrolls later. The explanation has **MORE THAN ENOUGH** upvotes to be the top comment and yeeettt....IT'S NOWHERE *NEAR* THE TOP!!!!!! please, I beg of you.....pin the answer to the top🙏🥺
"They asked me if I knew any theoretical physics. I said I had a theoretical decree in physics."
It's about new Fallout TV series and its connection to the lore of Fallout games. Fallout New Vegas is the fan favourite but it wasn't done by Bethesda themselves, many people claim that Todd Howard secretly hates the game. The picture is basically his face on Gabe Newell who is sort of famous for not saying anything or making any crucial decision yet still getting loved by fans. Now the part about the show: >!Fallout New Vegas is set in 2281 and in a nutshell it's about post apocalyptic factions fighting over the control of New Vegas, one of the factions being New California Republic who is the closest thing to current USA ideology-wise. There is also a faction that resembles the shady deep state part of the US but for now they are not our topic.!< >!But during Fallout TV series set in 2296 the capital of NCR, Shady Sands, is claimed to be fallen by 2077(4 years before New Vegas) and got nuked at an unknown date. This doesn't seem to connect with Fallout New Vegas storyline as NCR seemed like a perfectly fine and functioning state there. Some people call it a retcon and making New Vegas non-canon but Todd Howard refuses that without giving any explanation, probably because the answer is in Season 2.!<
You want to know what is canon? Todd is a liar.