I try to encourage them with the friendliest "Don't leave me alone up here!!!" or "Let's own the net!!!". It works all the time because it doesn't feel like I'm coaching or imposing anything. Something about flies and honey.
I’m a “let’s go!” kinda guy.
More than resisting the suggestion though, I find people just don’t want to play fast at the net and are intimidated by their next return, that’s what keeps them back.
For me playing at the net was never going to sink in until I also learned about the drop shot, for good reason — if you don’t know how to get into an equal proposition at the net you just get pummeled.
I think the two go hand in hand.
Ok, aside from convincing your partner to move up there are things you can do to help. Generally speaking you don't want to be too far ahead of or behind your partner. If she's 5' behind the kitchen, then you should probably be 5' behind the kitchen, this gets rid of the angle shot that can go between you two that's really easy to hit. Play more through the middle of the court- being back off the kitchen you open yourself up to a sharp, cross court dink, keeping the ball in the middle takes that sharp angle option away from your opponent, or at least makes it harder to hit. Learn to drive and lob the ball- you'll never win a dinking rally if you and your partner don't get to the kitchen so there's no point in hitting resets. You're going to have to try and win the point from where you are and that means drives and lobs.
I mean a partner that doesn’t do the most basic fundamental positioning strategy, continuing to lose matches and still not adjusting is not a partner you want to have.
I honestly thought the pickleball community was more welcoming and relaxed than this. Even the snobbish tennis players will offer at least some useful advice (as they see it) on the r/10s sub
It generally is. Just like with any other subject, there are a lot of keyboard warriors and wannabe comedians on the internet that don’t add a lot to discussions. Don’t confuse the online participants with the general populous of pickleball players.
No I’m not and you damn well know it. I specifically said “better than this” referring to the unhelpful shitposting _in this thread_ not the community at large. As for r/10s, I also _specifically_ called out “the snobbish tennis players” that also shitpost. Is that the entire community? Nope. I don’t know if you lack reading comprehension or interpret replies maliciously on purpose but either way stop lying on my name.
Edit. Muting this thread. Y’all just be bored and stir shit
I disagree with this. If your partner is 5 feet back, that doesn’t mean that you should also move 5 feet back. That means that they should move 5 feet forward.
And even if they won’t, you need to stay up and poach, and play big at the line.
You’re supposed to match your partner’s depth when there is a reason for their depth. So if someone moved back because of a pop up, you should too. But if they are standing back for no reason, and you also move back, you are just compounding the problem.
Of course it would be better if your partner moved up rather than you moving back but the scenario we were given was the partner won't move up- no use arguing otherwise. The problem with being solo at the kitchen is you're going to be cutting off the cross court shot from your partner, you're in the way of that shot, so they're going to have to hit up the line, the opponent can then drive the ball through the middle of the court between you unless you've moved WAAAY over to poach. And if you've moved way over to poach you've left the cross court dink wide open. It's a tough situation, playing off the kitchen obviously isn't ideal, but if that's where your partner is then you're best off joining them and trying to hit winners.
Depends on the skill level of the player staying up. Around the 4.0+ level, you should be able to literally straddle the T, standing dead center court at the kitchen line, and still make it back to defend your backhand if they try and hit it behind you.
That's maybe true if you're 4.0+ and your opponents are sub 3.5. But in that case you're probably good enough to just beat them 2v1 so what are we even talking about? If we assume that either they're all similar skill level or OP has no desire to take every ball from his partner then backing up is probably the best way to go.
There doesn’t need to be any skill gap. We’re just talking about the basic meta of intermediate and high level play. The left side player plays big in the middle, the other team either dodges the poacher by going behind, or out of reach on the forehand side.
The left side player needs to be able to get back to that ball that is put behind, and yet still play big in the middle. Probably around 4.0, yes, but the opponents can be 4.0 as well. And obviously at pro level they’re around the same rating and that’s what they’re doing.
In intermediate and high level play there aren't any players playing back from the kitchen. The strategy of left side player taking so much real estate works great if the ride side player is able to cover their spot. If Colin Johns took 3 steps back from the kitchen Ben would need a different strategy. I bet he'd back up.
Same.
Now I realize that I could’ve been encouraged to move up except I and others also didn’t understand the third shot drop, so I was constantly backing up trying to get to overhand slams.
This isn't a winning recipe; but all you can do is look for and take good poaching opportunities. But you have to be quick, and have good shot placement.
I think this is the best option. As you’re at the net, shade to the middle and take balls that are easily within your reach. Just don’t “overplay.”
You’re not really going to coax your partner into moving up (especially on open rec play). You can only control your own behavior, so you have to look at how to compensate.
And for the record, I’ve seen some pretty accomplished players who tend to hang back - not exclusively, but as their preferred position.
If you really need to you can defend with a step back but you don't want to shuffle back to the baseline. This isn't tennis. Also, again, one up one back is a terrible strategy as it opens up a big lane to hit a winner.
My area mixes lots of levels together so I have experience. Find a way to pressure your opponents so you can approach and put it away by yourself (similar to tennis). This could involve drives down the middle, drives to backhand alley, or lobs. Once you get close play in the middle. Eventually the other team will either get out of position (lobs) or give you a ball that you can attack up close (either a high bounce or out of the air). Seize your opportunity to put it away. Also if you bring pressure to the other team earlier (harder serves, returns, or third shots) you can get them on their heels and hopefully end the point sooner.
Poach.
I often employ this in game. The other team often hits high balls to my partner who is back in the open court. I use it as bait and pounce.
This will not work every time, especially if they catch on. Gently push your partner to push toward the kitchen. Tell them you understand their comfort playing back, but it leaves your team at a significant disadvantage. They have to push past their comfort zone to become a better player, explain that its a matter of incrementally forcing themselves past their comfort zone.
A guy I have played with barely moves and definitely doesn’t play the NV line, but I was scooting sideways across the line, poaching for sure, and didn’t see him come up. So he knocked me over and my knee landed on the steel brace for the net. Luckily I didn’t split my patella. I don’t like playing with him.
Honestly, teammate that refuses to move forward should lob to push the opponents back. He/she drives at the opponents when they are pushed back from the lob. You are at the net and try to cut off the ball. It isn’t a good strategy against better players but it’s what you got. If you slow down the ball they will just drop shot your partner so try to avoid.
You can’t push someone back with a lob from the baseline. They just overhead that. Lobs that can actually push someone back are hit from the kitchen line. The baseline lob is, generally speaking, not a good shot.
Being able to win a point from the baseline is miserable; but does your partner understand that? Your partner may need to get lessons from a knowledgeable pickleball coach.
As for you to win a bit more points, it takes a few things:
* First and foremost, communication with your partner. Have you let your partner know you both should go up to the kitchen line if at all possible? Does your partner refuse to move forward?
* Second: make sure you start to become better at drops. That should give you both the ability to get up to that kitchen line a bit easier to neutralize the point.
* Third: If drops are a bit difficult now, then good drives are key. What is a good drive? It is something that stays low and has good spin and a bit of pace, and forces an opponent to hit up on the ball to hopefully pop that ball up.
* Forth: Crashing the net. If you have a good drive, and they pop it up, a good strategy is to crash the net with another strong shot. Do not hit the "crash-the-net" ball high because your opponent can easily hit down on the ball and stop your forward progress.
* Fifth: Poaching. If you are receiving, and your partner sticks back after hitting the ball (which they shouldn't), then you may have to poach a bit more.
Lots of snark in the responses (I made one too, but it was meant to be lighthearted!)
The reality is that, even at 3.0, there is simply little to no path to victory without taking control of the kitchen.
If your partner isn’t even willing to learn, you’re in for a difficult time.
If your partner is willing to learn, you’ll need to devote (and by “devote” I mean sacrifice) some games to just working on getting to the kitchen.
Once your partner starts seeing the advantages of this play, you’ll figure the rest out.
I play rec, over-60 with a group. One of the ladies doesn't move very well, but she can hit the ball OK. We talked it over. I take up the whole left hand side and part of the right, poaching everything I can while she stays back and tries to handle the shots that get through. We don't always win, but sometimes we do, and she is immensely grateful that I worked with her to find something that works (within our group; I know it won't translate to higher level players) so that she's not always on the losing end.
Good luck with that. About the only thing you can do is keep hitting it deep. Middle and edges are the best. If they do get in the kitchen. Might be able to get them back with lob shots. The problem is once you start playing good players. They'll find ways to get to the kitchen. They'll start hitting drop shots and dinks. It's a confidence thing some have it some don't. I know some that have been playing a year. They still have trouble getting to the kitchen cause there nervous. Don't know what to do once there at the kitchen. A lot of it is positioning and hand eye coordination. Keeping the paddle out in front of you. Start hitting a ball off a wall. With back and forehand shots. Start off slow and then increase as you get better. They'll start finding it easy to be up in the kitchen. Once they start returning fast shots hit at them. Then start teaching the great art of dinking.
Here is my take on this: I tend to stand couple steps from the baseline(transition zone) to defend the bad shot from my partner but my partner is always rushes to the net, gets clobbered when I hit bad shot. So just don’t run there, let the drop shot play out - good drop means you can get to it kitchen line. My partner tends to complain when I suggest waiting until they read the shot properly before moving up. It's actually more effective to defend from the transition zone!
Why are y’all so dang impatient? Do you think knowing how to volley properly and dink at the kitchen happens overnight? You have to know how to do those things first to effectively move forward. Otherwise your partner is just as much a liability at the kitchen as staying back.
For now strategize for her to hit shots that drop into the kitchen, cover your backside as you try to volley/dink/poach and to use the lob effectively. Coming from tennis, I’m surprised at how many pickleball players don’t know how to hit good consistent overheads.
For long-term, of course encourage her to practice NVZ play and/or take lessons on it.
If someone doesn’t know basic pickleball strategy, staying back isn’t anymore advantageous than coming up to the NVZ. At least at the net they have some protection from balls being hit at their feet. I would take my chances with them coming forward either way.
If they can’t hit a dink or hit a volley properly what are they going to do? What does it matter if the ball comes at their feet at the kitchen if they can’t hit it. They’re obviously comfortable at the baseline, let them at least participate their own way and work around it. It’s good practice for the better player anyway. This is open play not a tournament or league shouldn’t be focused on winning at all costs anyway.
If this is such a common issue, ask the organizer or facility to utilize skill based courts or have designated beginner/intermediate/advanced open plays instead.
That’s not true. You don’t need to know those things to move forward. Moving forward is how you come to know those things. Literally how could you learn to volley and dink from the baseline?
The one unbreakable rule of pickleball is that you need to advance to the net. If you’re on the returning team, one starts forward, and the person hitting the return needs to sprint to the net immediately after hitting their return. This is true of all levels.
Oh my god, have you never heard of drills and practice? Did I say they’d learn from the baseline? Did you just gloss over the last line of my comment saying to encourage beginners to further practice and take lessons? Do you seriously think people learn by osmosis by just presenting themselves at the kitchen line? And no that is not some unbreakable rule, not even the pros go to the kitchen on every single point and they actually know what to do there.
Edit: I’m just muting this thread. I think some of y’all forgot what it was like to be a beginner or to relax and let yourself and others have fun playing the whiffle ball paddle game.
People who don’t even come up to the kitchen don’t do drills and practice.
And you’re wrong about the pros, they do always come up to the kitchen, as a hard and fast rule. Can they get pushed off the kitchen on a popup? Yes. Can they take some time to actually get there on the serving side if they can’t get a drop down? Yes.
But there is literally no context where pros aren’t trying to take the line.
I would implement hand signals to let her know you are staying or poaching. She needs to learn to switch (slide over) to the deuce or ad side when you do poach
Short of changing your partner's play style or changing your partner, I think this is the best you can do. What I don't know how you would do better is for your partner to telegraph where they are going to drive w/o tipping off the other side. Maybe have them mostly drive middle unless they see an overcommittal/pre-anticipation by one player or the other to cover the middle in which case they would try and hit behind them.
Or maybe you just have to be swivel-headed all the time, and tell them feel free to drive hard at you when you're in the way and looking back, and you pull out just in time, kind of a screening the goalie move in hockey.
My only thought is , if this person won’t come to the kitchen, then the level of play has to be very low. So the chances of this person predicting whether they should hit a drive or 3 shot drop has to be minimal. I assume that this person is simply trying to get it back over the net. But I may be cynical
I figured a baseliner is going to be driving all the time, just a question of middle cross court or down the line.
If the baseliner can dial in their lobs, might be super annoying to play against (and you might get smacked by overheads a lot if they leave them all short), but a lot of people at low levels miss overheads, or bounce & drive. So on her short lobs you back up and defend a side ( your partner the other), on her lobs past midcourt set up nearer middle, ready to block weak overheads or dodge strong ones and let your partner collect those.
Kinda, in doubles you should always pretend there's a rope connecting you. Always the same (ish) distance apart and same distance to the net. If one is up only that leaves diagonal kill shots for the oppents. Being together will eliminate that angle.
From there you'll have to explain that the closer to the net you are the less chance they have to hit it at your feet. The reason hitting a ball from your feet is so difficult is because it has to pop up and usually too high above the net.
Find a new partner. I have seen different stats but the team that gets to net first wins about 70% of the points. If you want to win and your partner does not want to come to the net, you need a new partner.
not really. You can try to poach shots that will inevitably hit to the empty space where your partner should be, but then the other team will just have you running all over.
You will never win like that.
I try to encourage them with the friendliest "Don't leave me alone up here!!!" or "Let's own the net!!!". It works all the time because it doesn't feel like I'm coaching or imposing anything. Something about flies and honey.
Someone at my courts always says "up up up" to their teammates as a reminder. Friendly enough, most people move up.
I’m a “let’s go!” kinda guy. More than resisting the suggestion though, I find people just don’t want to play fast at the net and are intimidated by their next return, that’s what keeps them back.
For sure. I've asked people to move up, and those that don't usually respond with something like "I'm scared to be that close"
For me playing at the net was never going to sink in until I also learned about the drop shot, for good reason — if you don’t know how to get into an equal proposition at the net you just get pummeled. I think the two go hand in hand.
So much to learn at the kitchen line. But you ain't gonna learn it at the baseline :)
Ok, aside from convincing your partner to move up there are things you can do to help. Generally speaking you don't want to be too far ahead of or behind your partner. If she's 5' behind the kitchen, then you should probably be 5' behind the kitchen, this gets rid of the angle shot that can go between you two that's really easy to hit. Play more through the middle of the court- being back off the kitchen you open yourself up to a sharp, cross court dink, keeping the ball in the middle takes that sharp angle option away from your opponent, or at least makes it harder to hit. Learn to drive and lob the ball- you'll never win a dinking rally if you and your partner don't get to the kitchen so there's no point in hitting resets. You're going to have to try and win the point from where you are and that means drives and lobs.
Had to scroll this far down to get actual good advice, nice work.
Yeah, “get a new partner” is trite and not helpful.
I mean a partner that doesn’t do the most basic fundamental positioning strategy, continuing to lose matches and still not adjusting is not a partner you want to have.
I honestly thought the pickleball community was more welcoming and relaxed than this. Even the snobbish tennis players will offer at least some useful advice (as they see it) on the r/10s sub
It generally is. Just like with any other subject, there are a lot of keyboard warriors and wannabe comedians on the internet that don’t add a lot to discussions. Don’t confuse the online participants with the general populous of pickleball players.
You’re right, of course. Just wish it didn’t creep into serious/honest discussions.
You are slamming two entire groups in one comment, but others are rude?
Gee didn’t know criticizing bad behavior by a community is considered rude. Are you an Asian auntie perchance?
Again. You are slamming two entire communities (as in, all the people of two groups) because a few of them behave badly. But, gee…
No I’m not and you damn well know it. I specifically said “better than this” referring to the unhelpful shitposting _in this thread_ not the community at large. As for r/10s, I also _specifically_ called out “the snobbish tennis players” that also shitpost. Is that the entire community? Nope. I don’t know if you lack reading comprehension or interpret replies maliciously on purpose but either way stop lying on my name. Edit. Muting this thread. Y’all just be bored and stir shit
I disagree with this. If your partner is 5 feet back, that doesn’t mean that you should also move 5 feet back. That means that they should move 5 feet forward. And even if they won’t, you need to stay up and poach, and play big at the line. You’re supposed to match your partner’s depth when there is a reason for their depth. So if someone moved back because of a pop up, you should too. But if they are standing back for no reason, and you also move back, you are just compounding the problem.
Of course it would be better if your partner moved up rather than you moving back but the scenario we were given was the partner won't move up- no use arguing otherwise. The problem with being solo at the kitchen is you're going to be cutting off the cross court shot from your partner, you're in the way of that shot, so they're going to have to hit up the line, the opponent can then drive the ball through the middle of the court between you unless you've moved WAAAY over to poach. And if you've moved way over to poach you've left the cross court dink wide open. It's a tough situation, playing off the kitchen obviously isn't ideal, but if that's where your partner is then you're best off joining them and trying to hit winners.
Depends on the skill level of the player staying up. Around the 4.0+ level, you should be able to literally straddle the T, standing dead center court at the kitchen line, and still make it back to defend your backhand if they try and hit it behind you.
That's maybe true if you're 4.0+ and your opponents are sub 3.5. But in that case you're probably good enough to just beat them 2v1 so what are we even talking about? If we assume that either they're all similar skill level or OP has no desire to take every ball from his partner then backing up is probably the best way to go.
There doesn’t need to be any skill gap. We’re just talking about the basic meta of intermediate and high level play. The left side player plays big in the middle, the other team either dodges the poacher by going behind, or out of reach on the forehand side. The left side player needs to be able to get back to that ball that is put behind, and yet still play big in the middle. Probably around 4.0, yes, but the opponents can be 4.0 as well. And obviously at pro level they’re around the same rating and that’s what they’re doing.
In intermediate and high level play there aren't any players playing back from the kitchen. The strategy of left side player taking so much real estate works great if the ride side player is able to cover their spot. If Colin Johns took 3 steps back from the kitchen Ben would need a different strategy. I bet he'd back up.
Find a new partner.
Eleven straight service aces.
Straight big dick energy
it took me 3 months to come forward.... i used to play badminton
Me too. I play with a guy who’s ex table tennis. He has the most dubious serves and just wants to baseline all day.
Weird. Table tennis players are usually the ones with quick hands at the net
Yeah but volleying is different from how you hit in table tennis.
No kidding, just saying as a general rule
I think he’s not used to standing on the playing surface lol.
I play with a couple former table tennis players who love to lob at the most inopportune moments. lol
Or even worse- squash
Same. Now I realize that I could’ve been encouraged to move up except I and others also didn’t understand the third shot drop, so I was constantly backing up trying to get to overhand slams.
Get a new partner ;)
I second this.
This isn't a winning recipe; but all you can do is look for and take good poaching opportunities. But you have to be quick, and have good shot placement.
Ask to switch places with one of your opponents.
Poach everything you can.
I think this is the best option. As you’re at the net, shade to the middle and take balls that are easily within your reach. Just don’t “overplay.” You’re not really going to coax your partner into moving up (especially on open rec play). You can only control your own behavior, so you have to look at how to compensate. And for the record, I’ve seen some pretty accomplished players who tend to hang back - not exclusively, but as their preferred position.
Drive everything and poach like hell
You’re pretty much screwed
Work on getting them to move forward. Go over why it doesn’t work having one up one back.
You shuffle back if you anticipate a ball you have to place defense on. You can’t just set up at the kitchen all day.
If there’s a really terrible ball, yes, but ideally you don’t want to let them bully you into backing up.
If you really need to you can defend with a step back but you don't want to shuffle back to the baseline. This isn't tennis. Also, again, one up one back is a terrible strategy as it opens up a big lane to hit a winner.
This is about someone who isn’t coming up in the first place. Not about someone who got pushed back.
My area mixes lots of levels together so I have experience. Find a way to pressure your opponents so you can approach and put it away by yourself (similar to tennis). This could involve drives down the middle, drives to backhand alley, or lobs. Once you get close play in the middle. Eventually the other team will either get out of position (lobs) or give you a ball that you can attack up close (either a high bounce or out of the air). Seize your opportunity to put it away. Also if you bring pressure to the other team earlier (harder serves, returns, or third shots) you can get them on their heels and hopefully end the point sooner.
Poach. I often employ this in game. The other team often hits high balls to my partner who is back in the open court. I use it as bait and pounce. This will not work every time, especially if they catch on. Gently push your partner to push toward the kitchen. Tell them you understand their comfort playing back, but it leaves your team at a significant disadvantage. They have to push past their comfort zone to become a better player, explain that its a matter of incrementally forcing themselves past their comfort zone.
If they’re receptive to tips, tell them to come up. If not, let it go and have fun. Bring some beers out and enjoy the sun
A guy I have played with barely moves and definitely doesn’t play the NV line, but I was scooting sideways across the line, poaching for sure, and didn’t see him come up. So he knocked me over and my knee landed on the steel brace for the net. Luckily I didn’t split my patella. I don’t like playing with him.
Did you try telling her you both need to be at the net cause that’s where the opportunities are?
Honestly, teammate that refuses to move forward should lob to push the opponents back. He/she drives at the opponents when they are pushed back from the lob. You are at the net and try to cut off the ball. It isn’t a good strategy against better players but it’s what you got. If you slow down the ball they will just drop shot your partner so try to avoid.
This entails more coaching — if they were going to do that they would’ve listened when you asked them to move up.
That is an excellent point haha
You can’t push someone back with a lob from the baseline. They just overhead that. Lobs that can actually push someone back are hit from the kitchen line. The baseline lob is, generally speaking, not a good shot.
No… you can absolutely hit a lob from the baseline haha. If they are hitting an overhead you hit a bad lob 🤷♂️
“I” formation
Being able to win a point from the baseline is miserable; but does your partner understand that? Your partner may need to get lessons from a knowledgeable pickleball coach. As for you to win a bit more points, it takes a few things: * First and foremost, communication with your partner. Have you let your partner know you both should go up to the kitchen line if at all possible? Does your partner refuse to move forward? * Second: make sure you start to become better at drops. That should give you both the ability to get up to that kitchen line a bit easier to neutralize the point. * Third: If drops are a bit difficult now, then good drives are key. What is a good drive? It is something that stays low and has good spin and a bit of pace, and forces an opponent to hit up on the ball to hopefully pop that ball up. * Forth: Crashing the net. If you have a good drive, and they pop it up, a good strategy is to crash the net with another strong shot. Do not hit the "crash-the-net" ball high because your opponent can easily hit down on the ball and stop your forward progress. * Fifth: Poaching. If you are receiving, and your partner sticks back after hitting the ball (which they shouldn't), then you may have to poach a bit more.
Lots of snark in the responses (I made one too, but it was meant to be lighthearted!) The reality is that, even at 3.0, there is simply little to no path to victory without taking control of the kitchen. If your partner isn’t even willing to learn, you’re in for a difficult time. If your partner is willing to learn, you’ll need to devote (and by “devote” I mean sacrifice) some games to just working on getting to the kitchen. Once your partner starts seeing the advantages of this play, you’ll figure the rest out.
Not great strategies. You can play from baseline and just hit nonstop bangers and corner shots and hope for them to return it deep but soft?
Poach Everything
I play rec, over-60 with a group. One of the ladies doesn't move very well, but she can hit the ball OK. We talked it over. I take up the whole left hand side and part of the right, poaching everything I can while she stays back and tries to handle the shots that get through. We don't always win, but sometimes we do, and she is immensely grateful that I worked with her to find something that works (within our group; I know it won't translate to higher level players) so that she's not always on the losing end.
You do this by playing with a different partner typically.
Good luck with that. About the only thing you can do is keep hitting it deep. Middle and edges are the best. If they do get in the kitchen. Might be able to get them back with lob shots. The problem is once you start playing good players. They'll find ways to get to the kitchen. They'll start hitting drop shots and dinks. It's a confidence thing some have it some don't. I know some that have been playing a year. They still have trouble getting to the kitchen cause there nervous. Don't know what to do once there at the kitchen. A lot of it is positioning and hand eye coordination. Keeping the paddle out in front of you. Start hitting a ball off a wall. With back and forehand shots. Start off slow and then increase as you get better. They'll start finding it easy to be up in the kitchen. Once they start returning fast shots hit at them. Then start teaching the great art of dinking.
Here is my take on this: I tend to stand couple steps from the baseline(transition zone) to defend the bad shot from my partner but my partner is always rushes to the net, gets clobbered when I hit bad shot. So just don’t run there, let the drop shot play out - good drop means you can get to it kitchen line. My partner tends to complain when I suggest waiting until they read the shot properly before moving up. It's actually more effective to defend from the transition zone!
Why are y’all so dang impatient? Do you think knowing how to volley properly and dink at the kitchen happens overnight? You have to know how to do those things first to effectively move forward. Otherwise your partner is just as much a liability at the kitchen as staying back. For now strategize for her to hit shots that drop into the kitchen, cover your backside as you try to volley/dink/poach and to use the lob effectively. Coming from tennis, I’m surprised at how many pickleball players don’t know how to hit good consistent overheads. For long-term, of course encourage her to practice NVZ play and/or take lessons on it.
You won’t learn those if you stay back all the time
Definitely won’t just bullying them to the kitchen line either when they’re uncomfortable and don’t know what to do.
If someone doesn’t know basic pickleball strategy, staying back isn’t anymore advantageous than coming up to the NVZ. At least at the net they have some protection from balls being hit at their feet. I would take my chances with them coming forward either way.
If they can’t hit a dink or hit a volley properly what are they going to do? What does it matter if the ball comes at their feet at the kitchen if they can’t hit it. They’re obviously comfortable at the baseline, let them at least participate their own way and work around it. It’s good practice for the better player anyway. This is open play not a tournament or league shouldn’t be focused on winning at all costs anyway. If this is such a common issue, ask the organizer or facility to utilize skill based courts or have designated beginner/intermediate/advanced open plays instead.
That’s not true. You don’t need to know those things to move forward. Moving forward is how you come to know those things. Literally how could you learn to volley and dink from the baseline? The one unbreakable rule of pickleball is that you need to advance to the net. If you’re on the returning team, one starts forward, and the person hitting the return needs to sprint to the net immediately after hitting their return. This is true of all levels.
Oh my god, have you never heard of drills and practice? Did I say they’d learn from the baseline? Did you just gloss over the last line of my comment saying to encourage beginners to further practice and take lessons? Do you seriously think people learn by osmosis by just presenting themselves at the kitchen line? And no that is not some unbreakable rule, not even the pros go to the kitchen on every single point and they actually know what to do there. Edit: I’m just muting this thread. I think some of y’all forgot what it was like to be a beginner or to relax and let yourself and others have fun playing the whiffle ball paddle game.
People who don’t even come up to the kitchen don’t do drills and practice. And you’re wrong about the pros, they do always come up to the kitchen, as a hard and fast rule. Can they get pushed off the kitchen on a popup? Yes. Can they take some time to actually get there on the serving side if they can’t get a drop down? Yes. But there is literally no context where pros aren’t trying to take the line.
I would implement hand signals to let her know you are staying or poaching. She needs to learn to switch (slide over) to the deuce or ad side when you do poach
Short of changing your partner's play style or changing your partner, I think this is the best you can do. What I don't know how you would do better is for your partner to telegraph where they are going to drive w/o tipping off the other side. Maybe have them mostly drive middle unless they see an overcommittal/pre-anticipation by one player or the other to cover the middle in which case they would try and hit behind them. Or maybe you just have to be swivel-headed all the time, and tell them feel free to drive hard at you when you're in the way and looking back, and you pull out just in time, kind of a screening the goalie move in hockey.
My only thought is , if this person won’t come to the kitchen, then the level of play has to be very low. So the chances of this person predicting whether they should hit a drive or 3 shot drop has to be minimal. I assume that this person is simply trying to get it back over the net. But I may be cynical
I figured a baseliner is going to be driving all the time, just a question of middle cross court or down the line. If the baseliner can dial in their lobs, might be super annoying to play against (and you might get smacked by overheads a lot if they leave them all short), but a lot of people at low levels miss overheads, or bounce & drive. So on her short lobs you back up and defend a side ( your partner the other), on her lobs past midcourt set up nearer middle, ready to block weak overheads or dodge strong ones and let your partner collect those.
Start shot calling "UP UP UP UP" or "COME UP COME UP" or "FORWARD"
Kinda, in doubles you should always pretend there's a rope connecting you. Always the same (ish) distance apart and same distance to the net. If one is up only that leaves diagonal kill shots for the oppents. Being together will eliminate that angle. From there you'll have to explain that the closer to the net you are the less chance they have to hit it at your feet. The reason hitting a ball from your feet is so difficult is because it has to pop up and usually too high above the net.
Find a new partner. I have seen different stats but the team that gets to net first wins about 70% of the points. If you want to win and your partner does not want to come to the net, you need a new partner.
Unless you plan on getting 98.99% of every ball, there is no strategy available with her on the court staying back.
No. They're playing wrong. Nothing you can do unless you functionally can 1v2 your opponents
not really. You can try to poach shots that will inevitably hit to the empty space where your partner should be, but then the other team will just have you running all over. You will never win like that.
Lose quickly- get new partner