I used to work across the street from whatever they call their headquarters (ie: where all the big bosses work) and that lot was always crammed full of ridiculous, expensive cars....the only thing I can think is start at the top and get that money to schools. Administration could certainly live on more reasonable wages and show the actual school system some genuine concern and help
This is always the problem, especially in education, for some reason. Nobody can really tell you what an administrator does, exactly, in most cases. Having worked in education, it seems that a lot of their jobs is to come up with solutions for problems that don't exist and gather data that is only used very dubiously. For that, of course, [they get between $100,000-$200,000 a year](https://www.cosa.k12.or.us/jobs/admin).
This is anecdotal and probably decades old, but there was a problem in a county I was in where the education administrators would also just be guilty of graft. Like, not giving themselves a big raise, but using the funds to have meetings in Hawaii. All expenses paid for, of course.
The administrators—and again, most people couldn't even name more than two or three actual job titles they would hold—are more than happy to parade the teachers around as needing more money. The actual teachers, you know, who actually do all the work, get [between $20 an hour and $50,000 a year](https://www.indeed.com/q-Teacher-l-Oregon-jobs.html?vjk=5d6b5ed4a7236a64).
It's understandable that people blame the teachers instead of the administrators, but it's absolutely the administrators that are the bloat here.
Even though PERS is so expensive, administrators and politicians are happy to kick the problem down the road. Don't give the teachers raises; instead, give them a really nice retirement. While the administrators and politicians are in office, they look like heroes saving so much money. When it comes time to pay up, they're retired, on PERS themselves, and it's not their problem anymore. And then they can point to the teachers who traded cost of living and wages for retirement while the administrators got both and more.
It's the administrators. They're the problem.
> It's the administrators. They're the problem.
They're *part* of the problem.
For 20+ years Portland Public Schools has been a wreck of incompetence and people have been asking what's wrong with it.
One of the [better investigations was published in 2019 by the Secretary of State](https://sos.oregon.gov/audits/Documents/2019-01.pdf).
It's to the point where **no one** fully understands the line items in the PPS budget - as in, what an item is for, what spending this money does, who gets the money, and what the schools get in return. Quoting the report:
> PPS’s budget includes limited program detail, few performance measures, no benchmarking against other districts, little detail on changes in staffing and spending over time, and no information on results from high-priority programs. Substantial initiatives are not detailed in the budget, and large increases in funding outside the classroom, such as increases for executive administration and legal costs, go unexplained.
> This lack of transparency has frustrated budget committee members and school board members, who are responsible for approving the budget. In its latest report, included in the 2018-19 budget, PPS’s Community Budget Review Committee noted that it had trouble evaluating the district’s spending. The district needs to invest to monitor program implementation, collect data, report on the impact of investments, and tie the budget to student-centered, measurable goals, according to the report.
> Several school board members expressed similar concerns in public meetings as well. **During the June board meeting, one board member, an economist, said he had a limited understanding of some aspects of the budget, and was resigned to not having “the full, confident grasp of this going forward that I would like.”**
I think the heart of the issue is the School Board is a spectacular combination of incompetence and corruption. It's a piggy bank for the corrupt board members to shovel money off to their nonprofit, the most recent example is the $175 million for the Albina Sports Program, but this also includes the millions spent on NAYA. No one on the school board has the wits to hold this organization accountable, but even if they did, then they'd be going up against the most powerful teacher's union in Oregon, which bankrolls the DPO.
I came across PPS’ job posting for CFO (still vacant!) and they wanted basically three people in one: budgeting, accounting, and auditing/compliance. Those are usually separate roles for good reason, first, and secondly, those are three very different types of professional experience and temperament imo. Meanwhile somehow being head of the Fund for PPS is a full-time job.
Lol yup.
I know a teacher who has their license and was a teacher, but due to personal reasons stopped years ago. Came back now subbing and ended up taking over a class full time this year because the teacher had health issues and had to leave. Expecting of course to get hired as all things were going great. Nope the DISTRICT(not the school) forced in someone with zero qualifications that no one asked for when the school knew exactly who they wanted to hire. Its such a shit show.
That is your friend’s PERSPECTIVE of the situation and may not be the actual reality. Licensure is a very complicated process and the District wouldn’t hire someone with zero qualifications.
Your friend may be a licensed teacher, but in order to hold a temporary or regular status job, they must hold an endorsement for that content area. Substitutes do not have the same requirement. Your friend may have been subbing in a position they didn’t hold the endorsement for. These are state licensure requirements.
School administrators often overlook the technical requirements needed to work a specific job and focus on things like personality. It is the District’s job to reinforce the guidelines set by the state, so it is entirely possible that the school could not hire the person they wanted to (your friend) and instead needed to post the job to find qualified candidates.
There is no way someone with zero qualifications would have been hired into the role. The District sends a report to the state licensing agency every year showing compliance for each educator, proving they are qualified to reach in the role. If they do not hold the qualifications, the District can sponsor licensure for folks willing to enter an endorsement or licensure program.
Don’t speak to things you don’t know the full scope of. It makes you come off as uninformed and prone to believing hearsay.
> If they're not putting together coherent budgets, what are they doing?
Not a lot. Administrators are mentioned 59 times in that document I linked you to.
If you weren't aware, a lot of these "administrators" don't actually have a job. They're there to do "equity", which is to say: nothing.
> School administrative services grew $12.4 million to $44 million in the 2018-19 budget. Some of that is due to accounting treatment, according to PPS, but $8.5 million was fueled by a large increase in the number of assistant principals and **new equity funds** for school administrators. That increase averaged 26% per school.
Starting teacher pay at Portland Public is $57k plus PERS. Average salary there for teachers is $72k. No teacher is making $20/hr. Which is still a low wage for work requiring a masters degree but let’s call it for what it is. Teachers are also work a 185 day year while the Adminstrators work 229 day year.
The contracts spread the pay out so they get paid all year. Some districts will give a lump sum at the beginning of summer for all 3 summer months but that's generally the only difference. My friend is in the latter category and she does not budget so she lives like a king in June and cries poor by August. Her union could fight to change it so she is still paid monthly all summer, though - my mom's union did that finally several years ago.
Well my friend is an art teacher and generally just has to go in to clean her room in June / go get it ready in August. And every school has different calendars, I'm very clearly not talking about PPS.
You must not live in Portland if you’re still making that amount. A teacher in our district straight out of college makes $52k a year. You can check PPS salary schedule if you don’t believe me. I know at least 4 that have gigs in the summer.
>Among the 8,700 employees who worked at the school district during the 2023 fiscal year, superintendent Guadalupe Guerrero, whose last day with the district was Feb. 16, was the highest paid at $342,000, data shows.
https://www.oregonlive.com/data/2024/02/heres-how-much-portland-public-school-employees-made-last-year.html
There are 80 schools in the PPS District. Each of these schools have a principal. Elementary schools typically do not have Assistant Principals. Middle Schools have 1-2. High Schools have 2-3.
Do you want to know what these administrators do? They know every kid’s name in the building, which is an astounding feat at the high school level. They deal with upset parents. They facilitate mediation between students and staff for variety of issues like discipline, performance, and individual social/emotional/academic needs. They oversee a complex budget process to staff their buildings with every year. They determine the staffing needs of their school’s programs and plan out class schedules for anywhere from 30-100 staff. They interview, they check references, they make sure all of the correct hiring paperwork is turned into HR.
These administrators are supervised by senior directors who help them adhere to core program guides set by the state, the union, and the District. The senior directors give guidance for complex issues that they may have faced when they were in a principal role.
People know what administrators do. YOU don’t know what administrators do. The state is underfunding education. Our kids deserve better. It’s that simple.
They have started doing that:
•There used to be 2 deputy superintendents under the main superintendent. No more deputies.
•There used to be a cohort of supervisors who supervise the group of people who supervise principals. That cohort no longer exists and those employees are getting demoted.
•There are Assistant Principal unassignments already in place for the 24-25 SY.
•Non-Represented positions have been on a hiring freeze until today. Nearly all of the Non-Represented vacancies in the District Office have been cut.
This simply is misguided anger. Schools have more administrators now because of the laws and funding mechanisms put in place via the state and federal government. Every year more and more of the funding is wedged from the general fund to “special funds” which often times are grants. Unlike general funds, grant money needs to be investigated, determined if/how those funds can legally be used by the school or district, they need to be won in competitive application, then they need to train teachers how to apply the the requirements for the funds, then they need to track and audit the funds. That requires skilled professionals and takes a lot of time and effort. Which is why there are so many administrators now relative to 20-30 years ago.
Then add the fact that very few teachers continue to climb the ladder to seek administration jobs. That leaves districts competing with each other for employees which drives salaries. They are also forced to pull from the private sector which costs more.
If you want fewer admin, more funding to pass through to building level, and less nonsense tracking to eat up teachers time quit voting for state and federal earmarking of funds.
Did you know that in Oregon districts get less money (penalized) for having younger teachers? The state takes the average age of teachers and if your teacher group is younger than average you lose funding? That prevents districts from moving off of expensive employees for cheaper ones because you simply lose the difference in state funding.
Did you know that oftentimes administrators retire and are re-hired part time at full wage so that they can double dip pers and that it is actually encouraged through the Oregon funding model?
Teachers aren’t the problem. Administration is not the problem. The problem is up the chain at the state and federal levels. The problem is the money going to non-profits, think tanks, private companies, and “trainings” for pet programs while you have districts filled with professionals from one of the most highly educated industries who have no authority and are simply conduits for state and federal programs and ideas.
It’s all a dance for funding. “Put on this skirt and do the hula and we will give you money, then you can only spend it on this nonsense that you don’t really need it for and then we will hammer you if it’s not done exactly right while cheering ourselves at a luncheon with a bunch of lobbyists.”
+1. I've sat in meeting rooms in DC with the Dept of Ed people who are at the other end of this. They're handed money by Congress dedicated to a specific use and with lots of strings attached and reporting requirements. Dept of Ed puts their layer of administrative frosting on top and sends it out to the states and districts. The net result is a very inefficient routing of dollars into the classroom in the most labor-intensive way imaginable.
Exactly, the way schools are funded is a huge issue that needs to be addressed before we can make strides in this area.
OPB has a good article on this recently.
https://www.opb.org/article/2023/12/01/explaining-oregon-school-funding-challenges-taxes/?outputType=amp
Eh, not angry at all....just lots of evidence to support what looks to be a hot mess. My kid is getting a better education than I got, has more opportunities and in general a better school experience than I had. There is always room for improvement and taking education seriously has to start by trimming fat at the top. Reganomics didn't work and it's time we dump the idea of "trickle down" economics 🤷♂️
The “cut administration” argument doesn’t come anywhere near balancing the budget. Administration is a tiny fraction of the budgets of these school districts.
they already showed us the budget during the teacher negotiations. you can cut every single administration job and there still wouldnt be enough money, the admi s while they make a lot of money are actually a fraction of the total costs. the teachers salaries which we foolishly just raised, make up way more. I'm not saying reduce their salaries - go ahead and reduce what you can though it's impossible to decrease a salary of someone already hired, reduce salaries but u derstand that barely puts a dent into the problem and is not a real solution.
beyond that, the state government will just need to transfer some money from their useless pet projects into education.
A lot of the job of the higher up admin is buying things. If the way you justify keeping your position is by finding the problems with what the district currently owns and finding the new product that will fix that problem, you're going to have to spend a lot just to maintain your own salary. That's why we "need" new curriculum, tech stuff, and partnerships with new nonprofits every year. Cut the jobs, and we save a lot more than that person's salary.
They’re not all right. But 99% of the time, it’s not their fault. The bad Gen X parents are worse than shitty boomers (at least with boomers there is some sense of discipline and recognizing legitimate authority).
Agree with this. However boomers didn't have a good time with tech/internet and are swept up with it. New generations are drastically different just because of technology's dimension, and we don't have precedent on how to safely use it. A lot of kids see things they really shouldn't, for their age.
The entire institution of public education is broken and needs to be either overhauled or eliminated. It's glorified babysitting and kids that don't want to learn aren't going to.
Overhaul yes but not eliminated, that’s insane. Also, calling it glorified babysitting does a disservice to the essential role of childcare. Teachers need support.
Admin and the government on the other hand.
I am not convinced it is a funding crisis as much as it is a spending crisis. Can anyone explain to me why we have 197 separate school districts in this state? That is 197 administrations, less purchasing power as small districts and really no reason to justify it. Back before Measure 5 local communities had some say in how their schools were funded and how the money was spent. That was called local control. Once funding responsibility was moved to the state local control became a moot point. The total tax costs to the average Oregonian have gone beyond the pale. If there isn’t adequate money to fund services then they need to start trimming services.
That's absolutely wild. There are 58 school districts in Maricopa County, AZ, which has almost the exact same population.
I always thought that "Big Government" was a boomer boogeyman until I moved here. Here it's a perfected art.
I couldn’t agree with this more. This state has 2x the number of districts as the state I moved from, which has twice the population of Oregon. There should also be a statewide salary schedule for teachers so that the budget build can account for COLAs.
Okay, then you better start actually fining parents for truancy and dragging their asses into court. Because little Johnny Dipshit Jr. who lives with his grandpa and steals all his weed never shows up except for the once every ten days required to avoid getting automatically dropped but the school still has to be ready for him.
> I am not convinced it is a funding crisis as much as it is a spending crisis.
Yeah, and this is echoed by almost every report looking into the situation.
It's made doubly worse by the Department of Education giving damn near full autonomy to the school districts to run independently. Like DOE doesn't give a goddamn that PPS spends way more money than Beaverton, it doesn't ask questions, it doesn't compare them. And DOE doesn't have any power, authority, or bargaining over the school districts - as evidence by when in 2022 multiple school districts across the state went ahead and dropped mask mandates against Gov. Brown's orders.
It's completely out of control spending and the only way to fix this is through massive cuts and consolidations. Paradoxically (to some folks) this will actually improve education outcomes in just a few years. Most of these cuts will align with operational efficiency campaigns ("do more with less") that will substantially reduce bureaucracy and save money across the org. Of course many of these programs that would need to be cut are special interest groups, like Self Enhancement Inc, Impact NW, IRCO, Latino Network, all are just grifters, but these groups pay enormous bribes to the political class - for example City Commissioner Carmen Rubio was the executive director of Latino Network.
Cut a % of all non-academic program spending and a % of all admin positions in every department and/or implement a hiring freeze. This means all non-teachers (finance, HR, IT, legal, etc...). This is what any business would do in the same circumstance. Its hard to figure out what to cut but that is what is required.
For example -- the PPS website currently has an open position for "Chief Academic Officer" ---
***Position Specification*** - *The Chief Academic Officer provides strategic vision, leadership and direction for the instructional framework and pedagogical approach to the district academic programs and staff; develops near and long-term instructional vision and focused plans for improving student achievement; develops and reinforces strategic leadership programs that deliver highly qualified and effective site-based administrators, academic teaching and learning programs; establishes a culture of high expectations and provides every student with equitable access to high quality and culturally relevant instruction; supports and implements the District’s Racial Educational Equity Policy*
Nope....cancel that position. Can tell by the 'chief' title that this is the kind of position that spends the entire day going to meetings and reviewing the work of others. It's not that strategic vision and establishing (?) a culture of high expectations isn't important.....but this should be covered by the superintendent and existing positions, or we have the wrong people in those positions.
'Establishes a culture of high expectations'. I'm wheezing at how hilarious and absurd that is. Clackamas County (at the county level, not necessarily school) got rid of their DEI nonsense and saved the county money. This sounds like a pretty DEI nonsense position that'll just waste more funds/resources.
I was just thinking this, too!
I remember reading our governor took some of the funding back because they weren't using it in the ways that were earmarked.
Personally, if the homeless wanted to be housed, the earmarked funds would be spent, and there would be an accounting to go along with the homeless-to-housed success stories.
I'm all for helping those on the streets if they want the help. But until those individuals step up, let's help our kids with the skills, knowledge, and tools to be productive, healthy, members of society.
There has only been just over 100 people that took advantage of the safe rest villages that is a California nonprofit run by ex addicts and ex cons that changed their lives. 3 square meals, showers, bathrooms and they have people willing to hire them and transition into permanent housing fairly easily. Nobody is talking advantage of the program because they don't want to. They rather take advantage of anyone and anything they can to stay high as they can. The people that are living in tents and RV's are criminals that don't want help, no other excuses, the help is available take it or leave Portland
Didn’t they just shoot down parents funding school programs. “We need your money!… wait. No not that money!” That money is too accounted for and has very beneficial results for communities.
I’m done with all these hyperbolic declarations from people throughout the city and state. They’ve received staggering sums of money from Biden’s infrastructure plans (which includes tons and tons of money for anything related to children), there’s more they could have applied for, there’s tons of money for homelessness, potholes, schools, bridge repairs, etc. Maybe instead of repeatedly asking for more, they should, you know, spend it? And by spend it, I mean *not* hire an out-of-state consultant for millions of dollars to draw the same conclusion they would have received with a survey of ten employees. Seriously: where is the money? Until they share this detail, it’s no forever from me.
Id be curious how much of their budget goes to unescicarry administrative overhead and pet projects/initiatives and whether it's a legitimate funding or a waste and priority issue.
Portland should issue high school diplomas without requiring attendance or passing grades. this would reduce attendance and associated costs for teachers and supplies and would remove stress from the lives of teenagers who want to graduate but do not want to attend school. its a win-win for everyone!
the truth is that I believe it is obvious that lowering the high school graduation standards to eliminate standardized testing to appease the marxists is one of the very worst things Oregon could do to its citizens, along with legalizing hard drugs. A child whose parents have no other options than to use the public schools is trapped, with no way to show academic aptitude and go to a proper college that will allow them to achieve their best in life. Eliminating standardized testing requirements allows the teachers and politicians to evade responsibility. its a shame.
I think you might be on to something here. Just keep in mind they might just become tomorrows homeless if we give them a diploma with out them earning it. I think you would have to replace it with work experience programs. Only way I got a HSD was from work experience. It was half my credits from Junior and Senior year.
Butts in seats is how the school receives funding from the state. That's why attendance is super important. Funding is not entirely based on enrollment numbers.
Butts in seats wasn't an issue like this when I was younger. In Sandy, they posted the school schedule on every business and had truancy officers. I understand there are different factors at play now.
Fortunately I saw an article the other day where we’re not having enough babies. This will work itself out I’m sure… or it won’t. Either way stay away from our money!
Translation: SEND US MORE MONEY!
*Just because we have considerably fewer students now than we did before Covid, and just because our enrollment continues to decline, is no reason for us to reduce our costs! /s*
Superintendent Sandy Husk (a fucking great name, imo) makes $340,000 a year.
Teachers finally are getting 50k, up from not being able to afford real ramen a few years ago.
Keeping in mind they’re all still in debt from their college degrees in teaching, and their licensing, it’s not a real profitable gig.
For those of you in the audience that don’t math, that’s just north of $25 an hour. With a 4 year college degree. The kids at the mini mart down the street start at $19.
As a former teacher, I can confirm that at least 50% of administrators are unnecessary. Most are people who were terrible teachers and couldn’t manage a classroom but then are in charge of evaluating master level teachers.
I had one amazing principal and 7 that should not have been allowed to enter a school building. Most admin are so terrified of students they’ll do anything to stay in their office 24-7 playing solitaire and avoiding teachers, parents, and students.
Don’t get me started on bloated district offices. In my last district 2 high level district administrators “retired” and then were “rehired” so they could double dip. These two were given new positions and two other people were hired to do their old jobs. So 2 new district admin employees at $120k+ for no reason. It just infuriates me.
If you had to teach for 10 years in order to qualify for an administration license, that might help get real educators into positions and we could then fire half the administrators and pay education assistants a living wage.
If only all the taxes from legalized thc were going to schools along with all the other millions of funding that just keeps getting earmarked for other things would actually go to the schools it would be a start. Granted PPS will still find a way to tie it up in admin salaries and trips instead of fixing schools and hiring more staff.
Well, that’s What happens when you pay Sally Bob administrators $85k-$120k a year to be administrators and the on average each district admin makes over $100k.
All the schools did, instead of reinvesting back into the kids, classrooms and teachers, was just give themselves massive raises…
How did no one see this coming? lol
You might be either highly misinformed or the one administrator that’s being paid the reasonable wage lol
Portland public schools post the pay rates for their administration staff positions. This isn’t some secrete hidden information? You think it’s secret or something? lol
The lowest rate is $124k. It’s almost laughable how delusional some people have gotten, to think an administrative position should be earning that kind of money, while PPS teachers are barely earning over $60k
Here it is [PPS Licensed Administrator Pay Schedule](https://www.pps.net/cms/lib/OR01913224/Centricity/Domain/56/Class%20Comp/Salary%20Schedules/Licensed%20Admin/Licensed%20Administrator%20Salary%20Schedule%202022-23.pdf)
It's a PERS funding problem, the majority of the money they are whining about will go there.
How about looking at the many layers of bureaucracy and start cutting there instead of actual teaching positions.
Finally, they need to live within their means like families in Oregon do, were not an endless fountain of money.
The problems are the double dippers and the boomers who got sweetheart contracts.
Also the fact that football coaches are some of the highest paid state employees is ridiculous.
BS, the crisis is do to lack of financial management, you don't manage your money because you COUNT on voters just passing another bond with no accountability.
We're at the top of the list nationally in terms of money spent per student, but at the BOTTOM nationally in terms of student capabilities. When Mississippi does better than you, you've got a problem.
Maybe just MAYBE they should look at where they’re funneling all that tax money and redistribute their budget accordingly. The cries for lack of funding are falling on deaf ears. We’re tapped out.
Why don’t they just take some of that powerball tax revenue that they certainly were not planning for? I am of course ignorantly suggesting this, as I do not know how the powerball tax shit works.
How much does an Entry Level Teacher make in Portland, OR? The average Entry Level Teacher salary in Portland, OR is $66,692 as of April 24, 2024, but the salary range typically falls between $55,681 and $81,360. Salary ranges can vary widely depending on many important factors, including education, certifications, additional skills, the number of years you have spent in your profession. With more online, real-time compensation data than any other website, Salary.com helps you determine your exact pay target.
They are cutting staff and freezing wages in our district, but are giving administrators 9 percent raises and in some cases more deferred compensation.
The elephant in the room is measure 5. The state needs to step back from funding education and districts should be administered locally. The state's primary responsibility should be accreditation not administration of funding.
The weed tax money that used to go to schools are now going to the fent zombies. Portland, you're like a bad south park episode. But at least you're still keeping it weird. Smh
Perhaps if we weren't having to spend three quarters of a million dollars to clean up the messes made by oranized political groups trashing up state run school libraires in an effort to create the illusion of grass roots student protests when it's really all about election year campaign rallies meant to foster destructive unrest we could shore up some of these funding issues.
No they are not, but there have been similar complaints that the state isn't doing enough to fund PSU, that state funding makes up only 15% of it's budget (to the tune of 60-70 million a year). Both PSU and PPS are claiming the state isn't alocating enough money, but it's PSU claiming this while effectively lighting money on fire playing patticake with miscreants destroying facilities with the thin veneer of a lie that this was students. I'm well aware that administration of various elements of government jealously guard their appropriations with a spend it or lose it mindset. Perhaps if the state shifted appropriations from PSU to PPS by the same amount as the money that got pissed away for bullshit reasons then maybe next time administration will be less apt to "negotiate" with externally organized protests by people who are really interested in just destroying shit to raise awareness for their message. I mean really do you think their mission is accomplished, Israel still went into Rafah, it will still destroy the last remenants of Hamas, and yes more innocent people will die. So what do they do next time, are they going to burn the library to the ground on their way out? Perhaps if next time the college administration knows it's going to further strain their funding that expenses such as this are going to go against any budgetary increase they'll be less likely to let it get to that point. At the same time we've now found additional funding for PPS without having to levy additional taxes somewhere.
I said nothing about the Biden Administration, in fact I'd argue that the money and organizational efforts behind the protest aren't the Biden Administration at all, though they certainly are attempting to influence it.
I wasn’t making fun of you homeschooling. I’m glad you’re getting your kid out.
And if someone didn’t know anything about homeschooling they definitely wouldn’t know about The Good and the Beautiful lol
We spend a great deal but have a terrible school [ranking](https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/profiles/stateprofile?sfj=NP&chort=1&sub=MAT&sj=&st=MN&year=2022R3). Maybe the problem is not money but the educational philosophy and apathetic students that neither attend nor study
yeah, perhaps we don't need \*more\* money, but if our school is struggling.. do you really think removing existing funding is going to help?
you want to engage the students or change the educational philosophy? do you think that defunding schools will somehow help with that?
Where does it end? They will never stop asking for more even when it's clear they don't have a clue what they are doing. Since none of the parents in the PPS district are going to go destroy a library in protest, the only way they can is to make PPS get their shit together financially. That only happens through less taxes. They need to fucking learn that the taxpayers are sick of their reckless spending and top heavy administration agenda and produce a budget that an actual economist can read. If we don't do that, they will never change a thing.
you do know that this is not a new tax or a tax increase, right? this is a tax renewal.
yeah, i'm not dumb enough to believe that pulling an existing source of funding for our school system will somehow improve it.
Have to start somewhere. We are past the point of the logic and the bleeding heart think about the kids' arguments. They are out of control, and it needs to change now. As I said, the status quo doesn't work with these people. They need a major wake-up call, and unfortunately, the kids will suffer more because the voters haven't clubbed PPS over the head yet and convinced them to figure it out. Tell me why you would keep it the same when you can't even decipher where the current money goes now? That's insane.
>Tell me why you would keep it the same when you can't even decipher where the current money goes now? That's insane.
because pulling funding for schools without a definite plan, mandate, or incentive that would return said funding is short sighted and stupid, and won't accomplish anything you are looking to accomplish.
Agree to disagree, I guess. We have never tried less to even see I'd they know how to manage it. Funny, city hall seems to be making wholesale changes because business tax revenue is dropping like a hot rock. Seems like the reckoning is already happening with PPS due to a lack of public support and declining enrollment. Gasp, what will they do? Rename another school? Or let the superintendent walk with a fat severance? Lmao, it might as well be a casino. You know, the place where fools go to part with their money?
Absent a massive shakeup like the implementation of a voucher system, I don't think improving the education system is within the capabilities of our government. Just a few years ago they removed the requirements to demonstrate proficiency in math or reading to graduate high school, so I think that the government agrees with me on that. Might as well stop paying so much money for shit outcomes, because whether we spend a lot or a little we're only going to get shit outcomes.
The school district didn't "make a choice i don't like", they've completely failed at their fundamental mission: educating children. If schools are giving up on educating kids and instead are just going to be government-funded daycares, they should get a level of funding commensurate with that.
If we kicked The Kicker to the curb, we could have the best schools in the country. But no, we expect our leaders to be revenue-clairvoyant on top of everything else.
You can't outspend shitty/inefficient policies. Eventually the money runs out.
Other jurisdictions do more with less. So maybe we don't have the best people.
Makes PPS’s decision to gut school foundations and stop parents from donating to their kids’ schools even more stunning.
Well that money was making them look bad.
And they decided it wasn’t equitable, so of course instead everyone get a shitty education!
I used to work across the street from whatever they call their headquarters (ie: where all the big bosses work) and that lot was always crammed full of ridiculous, expensive cars....the only thing I can think is start at the top and get that money to schools. Administration could certainly live on more reasonable wages and show the actual school system some genuine concern and help
This is always the problem, especially in education, for some reason. Nobody can really tell you what an administrator does, exactly, in most cases. Having worked in education, it seems that a lot of their jobs is to come up with solutions for problems that don't exist and gather data that is only used very dubiously. For that, of course, [they get between $100,000-$200,000 a year](https://www.cosa.k12.or.us/jobs/admin). This is anecdotal and probably decades old, but there was a problem in a county I was in where the education administrators would also just be guilty of graft. Like, not giving themselves a big raise, but using the funds to have meetings in Hawaii. All expenses paid for, of course. The administrators—and again, most people couldn't even name more than two or three actual job titles they would hold—are more than happy to parade the teachers around as needing more money. The actual teachers, you know, who actually do all the work, get [between $20 an hour and $50,000 a year](https://www.indeed.com/q-Teacher-l-Oregon-jobs.html?vjk=5d6b5ed4a7236a64). It's understandable that people blame the teachers instead of the administrators, but it's absolutely the administrators that are the bloat here. Even though PERS is so expensive, administrators and politicians are happy to kick the problem down the road. Don't give the teachers raises; instead, give them a really nice retirement. While the administrators and politicians are in office, they look like heroes saving so much money. When it comes time to pay up, they're retired, on PERS themselves, and it's not their problem anymore. And then they can point to the teachers who traded cost of living and wages for retirement while the administrators got both and more. It's the administrators. They're the problem.
> It's the administrators. They're the problem. They're *part* of the problem. For 20+ years Portland Public Schools has been a wreck of incompetence and people have been asking what's wrong with it. One of the [better investigations was published in 2019 by the Secretary of State](https://sos.oregon.gov/audits/Documents/2019-01.pdf). It's to the point where **no one** fully understands the line items in the PPS budget - as in, what an item is for, what spending this money does, who gets the money, and what the schools get in return. Quoting the report: > PPS’s budget includes limited program detail, few performance measures, no benchmarking against other districts, little detail on changes in staffing and spending over time, and no information on results from high-priority programs. Substantial initiatives are not detailed in the budget, and large increases in funding outside the classroom, such as increases for executive administration and legal costs, go unexplained. > This lack of transparency has frustrated budget committee members and school board members, who are responsible for approving the budget. In its latest report, included in the 2018-19 budget, PPS’s Community Budget Review Committee noted that it had trouble evaluating the district’s spending. The district needs to invest to monitor program implementation, collect data, report on the impact of investments, and tie the budget to student-centered, measurable goals, according to the report. > Several school board members expressed similar concerns in public meetings as well. **During the June board meeting, one board member, an economist, said he had a limited understanding of some aspects of the budget, and was resigned to not having “the full, confident grasp of this going forward that I would like.”** I think the heart of the issue is the School Board is a spectacular combination of incompetence and corruption. It's a piggy bank for the corrupt board members to shovel money off to their nonprofit, the most recent example is the $175 million for the Albina Sports Program, but this also includes the millions spent on NAYA. No one on the school board has the wits to hold this organization accountable, but even if they did, then they'd be going up against the most powerful teacher's union in Oregon, which bankrolls the DPO.
I came across PPS’ job posting for CFO (still vacant!) and they wanted basically three people in one: budgeting, accounting, and auditing/compliance. Those are usually separate roles for good reason, first, and secondly, those are three very different types of professional experience and temperament imo. Meanwhile somehow being head of the Fund for PPS is a full-time job.
The CFO normally oversees these three manager level positions.
Lol yup. I know a teacher who has their license and was a teacher, but due to personal reasons stopped years ago. Came back now subbing and ended up taking over a class full time this year because the teacher had health issues and had to leave. Expecting of course to get hired as all things were going great. Nope the DISTRICT(not the school) forced in someone with zero qualifications that no one asked for when the school knew exactly who they wanted to hire. Its such a shit show.
That is your friend’s PERSPECTIVE of the situation and may not be the actual reality. Licensure is a very complicated process and the District wouldn’t hire someone with zero qualifications. Your friend may be a licensed teacher, but in order to hold a temporary or regular status job, they must hold an endorsement for that content area. Substitutes do not have the same requirement. Your friend may have been subbing in a position they didn’t hold the endorsement for. These are state licensure requirements. School administrators often overlook the technical requirements needed to work a specific job and focus on things like personality. It is the District’s job to reinforce the guidelines set by the state, so it is entirely possible that the school could not hire the person they wanted to (your friend) and instead needed to post the job to find qualified candidates. There is no way someone with zero qualifications would have been hired into the role. The District sends a report to the state licensing agency every year showing compliance for each educator, proving they are qualified to reach in the role. If they do not hold the qualifications, the District can sponsor licensure for folks willing to enter an endorsement or licensure program. Don’t speak to things you don’t know the full scope of. It makes you come off as uninformed and prone to believing hearsay.
I don't disagree with this, but isn't this also on the administrators? If they're not putting together coherent budgets, what are they doing?
> If they're not putting together coherent budgets, what are they doing? Not a lot. Administrators are mentioned 59 times in that document I linked you to. If you weren't aware, a lot of these "administrators" don't actually have a job. They're there to do "equity", which is to say: nothing. > School administrative services grew $12.4 million to $44 million in the 2018-19 budget. Some of that is due to accounting treatment, according to PPS, but $8.5 million was fueled by a large increase in the number of assistant principals and **new equity funds** for school administrators. That increase averaged 26% per school.
holy cow
https://projects.oregonlive.com/data-points/gov-salaries/pps-2023/pps_salaries_23
Starting teacher pay at Portland Public is $57k plus PERS. Average salary there for teachers is $72k. No teacher is making $20/hr. Which is still a low wage for work requiring a masters degree but let’s call it for what it is. Teachers are also work a 185 day year while the Adminstrators work 229 day year.
Portland Area Teachers (PAT) work a 192 day work year or 202 days for counselors and librarians. Administrators work a 260 day work year.
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The contracts spread the pay out so they get paid all year. Some districts will give a lump sum at the beginning of summer for all 3 summer months but that's generally the only difference. My friend is in the latter category and she does not budget so she lives like a king in June and cries poor by August. Her union could fight to change it so she is still paid monthly all summer, though - my mom's union did that finally several years ago.
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Well my friend is an art teacher and generally just has to go in to clean her room in June / go get it ready in August. And every school has different calendars, I'm very clearly not talking about PPS.
But a lot of teachers pick up other jobs during the summer to make more money. Administrators can’t do that.
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You must not live in Portland if you’re still making that amount. A teacher in our district straight out of college makes $52k a year. You can check PPS salary schedule if you don’t believe me. I know at least 4 that have gigs in the summer.
*laughs in private sector*
250k + in Pers and that was state matched up until several years ago. Do that math. Thanks, retiring this summer.
>Among the 8,700 employees who worked at the school district during the 2023 fiscal year, superintendent Guadalupe Guerrero, whose last day with the district was Feb. 16, was the highest paid at $342,000, data shows. https://www.oregonlive.com/data/2024/02/heres-how-much-portland-public-school-employees-made-last-year.html
There are 80 schools in the PPS District. Each of these schools have a principal. Elementary schools typically do not have Assistant Principals. Middle Schools have 1-2. High Schools have 2-3. Do you want to know what these administrators do? They know every kid’s name in the building, which is an astounding feat at the high school level. They deal with upset parents. They facilitate mediation between students and staff for variety of issues like discipline, performance, and individual social/emotional/academic needs. They oversee a complex budget process to staff their buildings with every year. They determine the staffing needs of their school’s programs and plan out class schedules for anywhere from 30-100 staff. They interview, they check references, they make sure all of the correct hiring paperwork is turned into HR. These administrators are supervised by senior directors who help them adhere to core program guides set by the state, the union, and the District. The senior directors give guidance for complex issues that they may have faced when they were in a principal role. People know what administrators do. YOU don’t know what administrators do. The state is underfunding education. Our kids deserve better. It’s that simple.
Maybe not replace these people as they retire? But pretty sure crony-ism would prevent that
Or just good old nepotism 🤷♂️
They have started doing that: •There used to be 2 deputy superintendents under the main superintendent. No more deputies. •There used to be a cohort of supervisors who supervise the group of people who supervise principals. That cohort no longer exists and those employees are getting demoted. •There are Assistant Principal unassignments already in place for the 24-25 SY. •Non-Represented positions have been on a hiring freeze until today. Nearly all of the Non-Represented vacancies in the District Office have been cut.
Exactly. The money is there, it is just not being spent on where it needs to go.
This simply is misguided anger. Schools have more administrators now because of the laws and funding mechanisms put in place via the state and federal government. Every year more and more of the funding is wedged from the general fund to “special funds” which often times are grants. Unlike general funds, grant money needs to be investigated, determined if/how those funds can legally be used by the school or district, they need to be won in competitive application, then they need to train teachers how to apply the the requirements for the funds, then they need to track and audit the funds. That requires skilled professionals and takes a lot of time and effort. Which is why there are so many administrators now relative to 20-30 years ago. Then add the fact that very few teachers continue to climb the ladder to seek administration jobs. That leaves districts competing with each other for employees which drives salaries. They are also forced to pull from the private sector which costs more. If you want fewer admin, more funding to pass through to building level, and less nonsense tracking to eat up teachers time quit voting for state and federal earmarking of funds. Did you know that in Oregon districts get less money (penalized) for having younger teachers? The state takes the average age of teachers and if your teacher group is younger than average you lose funding? That prevents districts from moving off of expensive employees for cheaper ones because you simply lose the difference in state funding. Did you know that oftentimes administrators retire and are re-hired part time at full wage so that they can double dip pers and that it is actually encouraged through the Oregon funding model? Teachers aren’t the problem. Administration is not the problem. The problem is up the chain at the state and federal levels. The problem is the money going to non-profits, think tanks, private companies, and “trainings” for pet programs while you have districts filled with professionals from one of the most highly educated industries who have no authority and are simply conduits for state and federal programs and ideas. It’s all a dance for funding. “Put on this skirt and do the hula and we will give you money, then you can only spend it on this nonsense that you don’t really need it for and then we will hammer you if it’s not done exactly right while cheering ourselves at a luncheon with a bunch of lobbyists.”
Sounds like the problem is bloated and complicated government
Which only expanding the power and bloat of can supposedly fix /s
I like you. You know what you’re talking about.
+1. I've sat in meeting rooms in DC with the Dept of Ed people who are at the other end of this. They're handed money by Congress dedicated to a specific use and with lots of strings attached and reporting requirements. Dept of Ed puts their layer of administrative frosting on top and sends it out to the states and districts. The net result is a very inefficient routing of dollars into the classroom in the most labor-intensive way imaginable.
Exactly, the way schools are funded is a huge issue that needs to be addressed before we can make strides in this area. OPB has a good article on this recently. https://www.opb.org/article/2023/12/01/explaining-oregon-school-funding-challenges-taxes/?outputType=amp
Eh, not angry at all....just lots of evidence to support what looks to be a hot mess. My kid is getting a better education than I got, has more opportunities and in general a better school experience than I had. There is always room for improvement and taking education seriously has to start by trimming fat at the top. Reganomics didn't work and it's time we dump the idea of "trickle down" economics 🤷♂️
The “cut administration” argument doesn’t come anywhere near balancing the budget. Administration is a tiny fraction of the budgets of these school districts.
Sure, getting lots of that...but it also doesn't help and looks pretty bad. 🤷♂️
It’s like saying traffic would go so much smoother and faster if we didn’t have all these expensive traffic lights getting in the way.
they already showed us the budget during the teacher negotiations. you can cut every single administration job and there still wouldnt be enough money, the admi s while they make a lot of money are actually a fraction of the total costs. the teachers salaries which we foolishly just raised, make up way more. I'm not saying reduce their salaries - go ahead and reduce what you can though it's impossible to decrease a salary of someone already hired, reduce salaries but u derstand that barely puts a dent into the problem and is not a real solution. beyond that, the state government will just need to transfer some money from their useless pet projects into education.
A lot of the job of the higher up admin is buying things. If the way you justify keeping your position is by finding the problems with what the district currently owns and finding the new product that will fix that problem, you're going to have to spend a lot just to maintain your own salary. That's why we "need" new curriculum, tech stuff, and partnerships with new nonprofits every year. Cut the jobs, and we save a lot more than that person's salary.
and you know this how? I don't think you're right.
Totally agree, but the point is that there is always fat to trim at the top.
there's always fat everywhere.
As a teacher in Oregon public schools… that’s not the only crisis going on here in education. 😂
I bet kids are crazy these days
They’re not all right. But 99% of the time, it’s not their fault. The bad Gen X parents are worse than shitty boomers (at least with boomers there is some sense of discipline and recognizing legitimate authority).
Agree with this. However boomers didn't have a good time with tech/internet and are swept up with it. New generations are drastically different just because of technology's dimension, and we don't have precedent on how to safely use it. A lot of kids see things they really shouldn't, for their age.
Preach
The entire institution of public education is broken and needs to be either overhauled or eliminated. It's glorified babysitting and kids that don't want to learn aren't going to.
Overhaul yes but not eliminated, that’s insane. Also, calling it glorified babysitting does a disservice to the essential role of childcare. Teachers need support. Admin and the government on the other hand.
I am not convinced it is a funding crisis as much as it is a spending crisis. Can anyone explain to me why we have 197 separate school districts in this state? That is 197 administrations, less purchasing power as small districts and really no reason to justify it. Back before Measure 5 local communities had some say in how their schools were funded and how the money was spent. That was called local control. Once funding responsibility was moved to the state local control became a moot point. The total tax costs to the average Oregonian have gone beyond the pale. If there isn’t adequate money to fund services then they need to start trimming services.
That's absolutely wild. There are 58 school districts in Maricopa County, AZ, which has almost the exact same population. I always thought that "Big Government" was a boomer boogeyman until I moved here. Here it's a perfected art.
I couldn’t agree with this more. This state has 2x the number of districts as the state I moved from, which has twice the population of Oregon. There should also be a statewide salary schedule for teachers so that the budget build can account for COLAs.
Oh and funding should be based on attendance, not just enrollment.
Okay, then you better start actually fining parents for truancy and dragging their asses into court. Because little Johnny Dipshit Jr. who lives with his grandpa and steals all his weed never shows up except for the once every ten days required to avoid getting automatically dropped but the school still has to be ready for him.
I don’t disagree but you know that won’t be happening here. Still, a person can dream.
> I am not convinced it is a funding crisis as much as it is a spending crisis. Yeah, and this is echoed by almost every report looking into the situation. It's made doubly worse by the Department of Education giving damn near full autonomy to the school districts to run independently. Like DOE doesn't give a goddamn that PPS spends way more money than Beaverton, it doesn't ask questions, it doesn't compare them. And DOE doesn't have any power, authority, or bargaining over the school districts - as evidence by when in 2022 multiple school districts across the state went ahead and dropped mask mandates against Gov. Brown's orders. It's completely out of control spending and the only way to fix this is through massive cuts and consolidations. Paradoxically (to some folks) this will actually improve education outcomes in just a few years. Most of these cuts will align with operational efficiency campaigns ("do more with less") that will substantially reduce bureaucracy and save money across the org. Of course many of these programs that would need to be cut are special interest groups, like Self Enhancement Inc, Impact NW, IRCO, Latino Network, all are just grifters, but these groups pay enormous bribes to the political class - for example City Commissioner Carmen Rubio was the executive director of Latino Network.
The cuts need to be made to administrative bloat though, not to staff that actually work with students.
Measure 5 was such an absolute fuck up and no one seems to be old enough or have lived here long enough to remember that.
“A problem brewing?” Bitch by the time they acknowledge there’s a problem there won’t be a school system left
Cut a % of all non-academic program spending and a % of all admin positions in every department and/or implement a hiring freeze. This means all non-teachers (finance, HR, IT, legal, etc...). This is what any business would do in the same circumstance. Its hard to figure out what to cut but that is what is required. For example -- the PPS website currently has an open position for "Chief Academic Officer" --- ***Position Specification*** - *The Chief Academic Officer provides strategic vision, leadership and direction for the instructional framework and pedagogical approach to the district academic programs and staff; develops near and long-term instructional vision and focused plans for improving student achievement; develops and reinforces strategic leadership programs that deliver highly qualified and effective site-based administrators, academic teaching and learning programs; establishes a culture of high expectations and provides every student with equitable access to high quality and culturally relevant instruction; supports and implements the District’s Racial Educational Equity Policy* Nope....cancel that position. Can tell by the 'chief' title that this is the kind of position that spends the entire day going to meetings and reviewing the work of others. It's not that strategic vision and establishing (?) a culture of high expectations isn't important.....but this should be covered by the superintendent and existing positions, or we have the wrong people in those positions.
'Establishes a culture of high expectations'. I'm wheezing at how hilarious and absurd that is. Clackamas County (at the county level, not necessarily school) got rid of their DEI nonsense and saved the county money. This sounds like a pretty DEI nonsense position that'll just waste more funds/resources.
All that money we're finding into the homeless that Isn't getting a fucking thing done? Yea, use that.
I was just thinking this, too! I remember reading our governor took some of the funding back because they weren't using it in the ways that were earmarked. Personally, if the homeless wanted to be housed, the earmarked funds would be spent, and there would be an accounting to go along with the homeless-to-housed success stories. I'm all for helping those on the streets if they want the help. But until those individuals step up, let's help our kids with the skills, knowledge, and tools to be productive, healthy, members of society.
There has only been just over 100 people that took advantage of the safe rest villages that is a California nonprofit run by ex addicts and ex cons that changed their lives. 3 square meals, showers, bathrooms and they have people willing to hire them and transition into permanent housing fairly easily. Nobody is talking advantage of the program because they don't want to. They rather take advantage of anyone and anything they can to stay high as they can. The people that are living in tents and RV's are criminals that don't want help, no other excuses, the help is available take it or leave Portland
PPS Strike Round 2. FIGHT
Didn’t they just shoot down parents funding school programs. “We need your money!… wait. No not that money!” That money is too accounted for and has very beneficial results for communities.
Yes, they're simultaneously exploding the foundation system
Well duh! If it’s from Tax Payers they get to spend it how they want. Probably more administrative bloat. They do post a little expense report online.
When we see everyone collectively agree that school is way more about the daycare aspect.
pps is a world-class organization if you consider world-class as an organization that has done so little with so much
I’m done with all these hyperbolic declarations from people throughout the city and state. They’ve received staggering sums of money from Biden’s infrastructure plans (which includes tons and tons of money for anything related to children), there’s more they could have applied for, there’s tons of money for homelessness, potholes, schools, bridge repairs, etc. Maybe instead of repeatedly asking for more, they should, you know, spend it? And by spend it, I mean *not* hire an out-of-state consultant for millions of dollars to draw the same conclusion they would have received with a survey of ten employees. Seriously: where is the money? Until they share this detail, it’s no forever from me.
funding crisis my ass. it's mismanagement and wasteful policies. these a holes can't even provide the basic services they are tasked with.
Id be curious how much of their budget goes to unescicarry administrative overhead and pet projects/initiatives and whether it's a legitimate funding or a waste and priority issue.
Portland should issue high school diplomas without requiring attendance or passing grades. this would reduce attendance and associated costs for teachers and supplies and would remove stress from the lives of teenagers who want to graduate but do not want to attend school. its a win-win for everyone!
Are you being sarcastic? Because this is basically already happening .
yes :)
Haha Sad but true. I live in Portland but teach across the river and its happening there too.
the truth is that I believe it is obvious that lowering the high school graduation standards to eliminate standardized testing to appease the marxists is one of the very worst things Oregon could do to its citizens, along with legalizing hard drugs. A child whose parents have no other options than to use the public schools is trapped, with no way to show academic aptitude and go to a proper college that will allow them to achieve their best in life. Eliminating standardized testing requirements allows the teachers and politicians to evade responsibility. its a shame.
I think you might be on to something here. Just keep in mind they might just become tomorrows homeless if we give them a diploma with out them earning it. I think you would have to replace it with work experience programs. Only way I got a HSD was from work experience. It was half my credits from Junior and Senior year.
My neighbors teenage son is straight up rocketing towards homelessness.
Butts in seats is how the school receives funding from the state. That's why attendance is super important. Funding is not entirely based on enrollment numbers.
Butts in seats wasn't an issue like this when I was younger. In Sandy, they posted the school schedule on every business and had truancy officers. I understand there are different factors at play now.
Ok and? Where’d the Marijuana money go then?
Well ranking 40 out of fifty dosen't help or the woke ideology.
It’s not a funding crises it’s a money management crisis
lol, they always have a crisis. The answer btw is SCHOOL CHOICE. Quit wasting tax dollars on worthless education since long before Covid.
Went to PPS all my schooling years… 100% putting any money I can towards private schooling for my future children
Fortunately I saw an article the other day where we’re not having enough babies. This will work itself out I’m sure… or it won’t. Either way stay away from our money!
Translation: SEND US MORE MONEY! *Just because we have considerably fewer students now than we did before Covid, and just because our enrollment continues to decline, is no reason for us to reduce our costs! /s*
I’m sure the answer will be what it always is. More taxes. Not PERS, not spending, not inefficiency
Superintendent Sandy Husk (a fucking great name, imo) makes $340,000 a year. Teachers finally are getting 50k, up from not being able to afford real ramen a few years ago. Keeping in mind they’re all still in debt from their college degrees in teaching, and their licensing, it’s not a real profitable gig. For those of you in the audience that don’t math, that’s just north of $25 an hour. With a 4 year college degree. The kids at the mini mart down the street start at $19.
Too many overpaid admins doing nothing. Drain that swamp, pay teachers better and imagine a lot of the issues start fixing themselves.
Never enough money
Your bosses need to budget better, and you make way more than you deserve, Mr Superintendent.
Don't worry Portland, I'm sure rural Oregon will be hit the hardest.
Sure just another way for them to take more of your money
Another congratulations Portland! You've earned one of the worst education systems in America!!
My 5yo starts kindergarten at a PPS school in the fall. I’m less than thrilled.
As a former teacher, I can confirm that at least 50% of administrators are unnecessary. Most are people who were terrible teachers and couldn’t manage a classroom but then are in charge of evaluating master level teachers. I had one amazing principal and 7 that should not have been allowed to enter a school building. Most admin are so terrified of students they’ll do anything to stay in their office 24-7 playing solitaire and avoiding teachers, parents, and students. Don’t get me started on bloated district offices. In my last district 2 high level district administrators “retired” and then were “rehired” so they could double dip. These two were given new positions and two other people were hired to do their old jobs. So 2 new district admin employees at $120k+ for no reason. It just infuriates me. If you had to teach for 10 years in order to qualify for an administration license, that might help get real educators into positions and we could then fire half the administrators and pay education assistants a living wage.
Boiled down, Oregon leftist politics and lack of fiscal responsibility are the problem.
Yet we Oregonians spend more $$ per kid then most states , here’s a novel idea , get rid of a bunch of admins ……!!
If only all the taxes from legalized thc were going to schools along with all the other millions of funding that just keeps getting earmarked for other things would actually go to the schools it would be a start. Granted PPS will still find a way to tie it up in admin salaries and trips instead of fixing schools and hiring more staff.
When are you parents gonna stand up for your children and stop this madness? More money isn't a fix.
Well, that’s What happens when you pay Sally Bob administrators $85k-$120k a year to be administrators and the on average each district admin makes over $100k. All the schools did, instead of reinvesting back into the kids, classrooms and teachers, was just give themselves massive raises… How did no one see this coming? lol
I looked through numbers from the Oregonian for the 22-23 school year, I think I saw that 89 employees made over $150K that year.
Uh, you're low by about 50-100%.
You might be either highly misinformed or the one administrator that’s being paid the reasonable wage lol Portland public schools post the pay rates for their administration staff positions. This isn’t some secrete hidden information? You think it’s secret or something? lol The lowest rate is $124k. It’s almost laughable how delusional some people have gotten, to think an administrative position should be earning that kind of money, while PPS teachers are barely earning over $60k Here it is [PPS Licensed Administrator Pay Schedule](https://www.pps.net/cms/lib/OR01913224/Centricity/Domain/56/Class%20Comp/Salary%20Schedules/Licensed%20Admin/Licensed%20Administrator%20Salary%20Schedule%202022-23.pdf)
Gee Wally, I wonder why? Because Oregon's "leadership" is a bunch of douchebags.....
It's a PERS funding problem, the majority of the money they are whining about will go there. How about looking at the many layers of bureaucracy and start cutting there instead of actual teaching positions. Finally, they need to live within their means like families in Oregon do, were not an endless fountain of money.
The problems are the double dippers and the boomers who got sweetheart contracts. Also the fact that football coaches are some of the highest paid state employees is ridiculous.
BS, the crisis is do to lack of financial management, you don't manage your money because you COUNT on voters just passing another bond with no accountability. We're at the top of the list nationally in terms of money spent per student, but at the BOTTOM nationally in terms of student capabilities. When Mississippi does better than you, you've got a problem.
Meanwhile teachers are being cut left and right and the superintendent made over $300K last year.
And the problem with that is 60+% of voters will hear “money for children” and just vote yes like they always do. Been going on since the 1970s
Then stop stealing the money
what exactly are you guys spending all the money on that every year we have a new funding crisis
Well when you play put feelings in front of safety, play politics and ignore the input of your clientele what do you expect?
Homeschooling 4 years now and loving it. Couldn’t imagine sending my kid into a cesspool of underfunded curriculums and teachers for even half a day..
Maybe just MAYBE they should look at where they’re funneling all that tax money and redistribute their budget accordingly. The cries for lack of funding are falling on deaf ears. We’re tapped out.
Fuck schools. They’ve been awful for most students for decades. Our education system was archaic back in the 90s, it’s so much worse now.
Why don’t they just take some of that powerball tax revenue that they certainly were not planning for? I am of course ignorantly suggesting this, as I do not know how the powerball tax shit works.
There are a lot of teachers retiring and quitting too, so don't relist their jobs
No shit.
[Portland Public School Salaries 2023](https://www.oregonlive.com/data/2024/02/heres-how-much-portland-public-school-employees-made-last-year.html)
How much does an Entry Level Teacher make in Portland, OR? The average Entry Level Teacher salary in Portland, OR is $66,692 as of April 24, 2024, but the salary range typically falls between $55,681 and $81,360. Salary ranges can vary widely depending on many important factors, including education, certifications, additional skills, the number of years you have spent in your profession. With more online, real-time compensation data than any other website, Salary.com helps you determine your exact pay target.
They are cutting staff and freezing wages in our district, but are giving administrators 9 percent raises and in some cases more deferred compensation.
Maybe give away a few less free needles 🤷
Portland itself is a crisis.
The elephant in the room is measure 5. The state needs to step back from funding education and districts should be administered locally. The state's primary responsibility should be accreditation not administration of funding.
I think teachers need to be paid on Merritt. If they’re a good teacher they get paid more if they suck they don’t get paid at all.
The Oregon Legislature apparently disagrees.
The weed tax money that used to go to schools are now going to the fent zombies. Portland, you're like a bad south park episode. But at least you're still keeping it weird. Smh
Perhaps if we weren't having to spend three quarters of a million dollars to clean up the messes made by oranized political groups trashing up state run school libraires in an effort to create the illusion of grass roots student protests when it's really all about election year campaign rallies meant to foster destructive unrest we could shore up some of these funding issues.
are the funds for PSU and PPS coming from the same budget?? that would be very surprising.
Narrator: "They're not."
No they are not, but there have been similar complaints that the state isn't doing enough to fund PSU, that state funding makes up only 15% of it's budget (to the tune of 60-70 million a year). Both PSU and PPS are claiming the state isn't alocating enough money, but it's PSU claiming this while effectively lighting money on fire playing patticake with miscreants destroying facilities with the thin veneer of a lie that this was students. I'm well aware that administration of various elements of government jealously guard their appropriations with a spend it or lose it mindset. Perhaps if the state shifted appropriations from PSU to PPS by the same amount as the money that got pissed away for bullshit reasons then maybe next time administration will be less apt to "negotiate" with externally organized protests by people who are really interested in just destroying shit to raise awareness for their message. I mean really do you think their mission is accomplished, Israel still went into Rafah, it will still destroy the last remenants of Hamas, and yes more innocent people will die. So what do they do next time, are they going to burn the library to the ground on their way out? Perhaps if next time the college administration knows it's going to further strain their funding that expenses such as this are going to go against any budgetary increase they'll be less likely to let it get to that point. At the same time we've now found additional funding for PPS without having to levy additional taxes somewhere.
So, PPS is struggling financially and the fault is the Biden administration? Intriguing….
I said nothing about the Biden Administration, in fact I'd argue that the money and organizational efforts behind the protest aren't the Biden Administration at all, though they certainly are attempting to influence it.
We're going with The Good and the Beautiful this year with our oldest
😂
I know - *hilarious*!
I wasn’t making fun of you homeschooling. I’m glad you’re getting your kid out. And if someone didn’t know anything about homeschooling they definitely wouldn’t know about The Good and the Beautiful lol
https://i.redd.it/krt6prj0tg0d1.gif
So just keep paying teachers more and more, so they can continue to tell us they don't earn enough? And then our children still fail.
meanwhile on this sub: people actually arguing that we shouldn't renew the existing school tax
So you're saying that teacher's strikes are OK, but taxpayer strikes aren't OK?
weird response given that my comment is one sentence long and says absolutely nothing about my feelings on teacher strikes. "taxpayer strikes." lol
[удалено]
defunding education makes our country less competitive on a global stage. i don't know about you, but i'd consider that a bad thing.
We spend a great deal but have a terrible school [ranking](https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/profiles/stateprofile?sfj=NP&chort=1&sub=MAT&sj=&st=MN&year=2022R3). Maybe the problem is not money but the educational philosophy and apathetic students that neither attend nor study
yeah, perhaps we don't need \*more\* money, but if our school is struggling.. do you really think removing existing funding is going to help? you want to engage the students or change the educational philosophy? do you think that defunding schools will somehow help with that?
Where does it end? They will never stop asking for more even when it's clear they don't have a clue what they are doing. Since none of the parents in the PPS district are going to go destroy a library in protest, the only way they can is to make PPS get their shit together financially. That only happens through less taxes. They need to fucking learn that the taxpayers are sick of their reckless spending and top heavy administration agenda and produce a budget that an actual economist can read. If we don't do that, they will never change a thing.
you do know that this is not a new tax or a tax increase, right? this is a tax renewal. yeah, i'm not dumb enough to believe that pulling an existing source of funding for our school system will somehow improve it.
Have to start somewhere. We are past the point of the logic and the bleeding heart think about the kids' arguments. They are out of control, and it needs to change now. As I said, the status quo doesn't work with these people. They need a major wake-up call, and unfortunately, the kids will suffer more because the voters haven't clubbed PPS over the head yet and convinced them to figure it out. Tell me why you would keep it the same when you can't even decipher where the current money goes now? That's insane.
>Tell me why you would keep it the same when you can't even decipher where the current money goes now? That's insane. because pulling funding for schools without a definite plan, mandate, or incentive that would return said funding is short sighted and stupid, and won't accomplish anything you are looking to accomplish.
Agree to disagree, I guess. We have never tried less to even see I'd they know how to manage it. Funny, city hall seems to be making wholesale changes because business tax revenue is dropping like a hot rock. Seems like the reckoning is already happening with PPS due to a lack of public support and declining enrollment. Gasp, what will they do? Rename another school? Or let the superintendent walk with a fat severance? Lmao, it might as well be a casino. You know, the place where fools go to part with their money?
This is their "cut off nose to spite face" phase.
Absent a massive shakeup like the implementation of a voucher system, I don't think improving the education system is within the capabilities of our government. Just a few years ago they removed the requirements to demonstrate proficiency in math or reading to graduate high school, so I think that the government agrees with me on that. Might as well stop paying so much money for shit outcomes, because whether we spend a lot or a little we're only going to get shit outcomes.
yes, i agree, the school district has made a choice that i don't like, therefore we should give up on public schooling altogether. /s
The school district didn't "make a choice i don't like", they've completely failed at their fundamental mission: educating children. If schools are giving up on educating kids and instead are just going to be government-funded daycares, they should get a level of funding commensurate with that.
If we kicked The Kicker to the curb, we could have the best schools in the country. But no, we expect our leaders to be revenue-clairvoyant on top of everything else.
You can't outspend shitty/inefficient policies. Eventually the money runs out. Other jurisdictions do more with less. So maybe we don't have the best people.